[governance] Tangential (On Exceptionalism Wikileaks) America's vassal acts decisively and illegally

Koven Ronald kovenronald at aol.com
Sun Aug 19 17:57:54 EDT 2012


Dear All --


Dear All --


I've been very reluctant to get into this discussion about Assange, which really does have little or nothing to do with Internet governance (as others on the list have noted), but the standard conspiracy theories that seem to be favored by many on the list -- and which Assange also encourages -- really don't seem to hold up to close scrutiny


Swedish sources who know what they are talking about say that the Swedish government is deeply embarassed by the whole mess, created by an uncontrollable, overzealous prosecutor who really sees this as an important feminist issue. Ironically, Assange is now being defended by a former Spanish investigating magistrate whose zeal was equally embarassing to the Spanish government.


Quite aside from that, from my perspective and that of many of my most thoughtful American journalistic colleagues, it is clear that Assange is motivated by a very strong streak of political anti-Americanism -- that he means to embarass the US government as much as possible. That may be a perfectly legitimate for a political activist. But it undercuts any claim to be a journalist, Professional journalists aren't supposed to follow political agendas.


Best regards, Rony Koven



-----Original Message-----
From: Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro <salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com>
To: governance <governance at lists.igcaucus.org>; Ginger Paque <gpaque at gmail.com>
Cc: Dominique Lacroix <dl at panamo.eu>
Sent: Sun, Aug 19, 2012 7:57 pm
Subject: Re: [governance] Tangential (On Exceptionalism Wikileaks) America's vassal acts decisively and illegally


Assange is referring to this as a witchhunt, see: http://www.newsday.com/news/world/wikileaks-founder-julian-assange-calls-on-obama-to-end-witch-hunt-1.3913652 


On Mon, Aug 20, 2012 at 5:29 AM, Ginger Paque <gpaque at gmail.com> wrote:

Excellent post, Dominique. Gracias!


Ginger (Virginia) Paque


VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu
Diplo Foundation
Internet Governance Capacity Building Programme
www.diplomacy.edu/ig








On 19 August 2012 12:25, Dominique Lacroix <dl at panamo.eu> wrote:

          
    
That story seems to be all about secret      at the information age!
      Assange got 2 love stories. In both cases, the women invited him      in her bed.
      The case is about what happened there. Sex by surprise? That should        stay secret, as long as the women were not injured.      Actually, they never complained for that.
      
      At the contrary, Bradley Manning and Wikileaks revealed what should        not be kept secret: 
      - Civilians (journalists and children) murders by US soldiers in      Iraq. 
http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/04/06/us-iraq-usa-journalists-idUSTRE6344FW20100406
      - Orders given to diplomates to spy UN leaders (DNA, passwords,      credit card numbers etc.)
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/28/us-embassy-cables-spying-un
      - And so on.
      
      Nevertheless, of course I agree with Ginger and Mawaki: crime      allegations are displaced manipulations AND we cannot just ignore      the      sexual misconduct allegations. 
      
      But at this stage of the worldwide imbroglio, it's too late for      having a neutral trial in Sweden. Could you imagine a Swedish      Court concluding: "Much ado about nothing"? So public      opinion mobilization is important. We are the witnesses.
      And at this hour, I would like to hear the two women. I'm not sure      that the story is still their story...
      
      
      Some strange points must not be forgotten. Just some clues for new      readers of the case:
      
      - Feminist fighters should be very happy to see that nowadays        police force all around the world hunt rapers as it's done      for Assange.
      A famous feminist wrote about the case. Just search for Naomi      Wolf.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/naomi-wolf/interpol-the-worlds-datin_b_793033.html
      
      - Assange already talked with Swedish authorities. 
      Convened because of Swedish demand, he went spontaneously      to the London police. 
      
      - Swedish authorities aren't clear on the case, first closed        and then reopened:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/rape-investigation-into-wikileaks-chief-reopens-2068162.html
      
      - It's well established that Assange had two love stories with      fans in Stockholm and then Enköping.
      The first with the famous Anna Ardin, a feminist fighter whose      blog explained how to get revenge against men:
http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-news/7569087-meet-anna-ardin-photos-anna-ardins-7-steps-to-legal-revenge
      
      And so on. It's not the good place for further analyzing that      case. But doubt is widely allowed.
      
      
      Best regards,      
      
      @+, Dominique
      
      -- 
      Dominique Lacroix      
      Société européenne de l'Internet      
      http://www.ies-france.eu      
      +33 (0)6 63 24 39 14      
      
      Le 19/08/12 16:11, Mawaki Chango a écrit :
    
    
      
Completely agree with Ginger here...
We can't pretend to ignore the elephant in the room: at this point
there's no part of this story that can be clearly separated from
Wikileaks - if only given all the shady zones in this imbroglio. And
yes, it is unfortunate that the rape issue is now and then exploited
in ways that can undermine legitimate claims. Again a lot remains
unclear, unfortunately, due to the behavior of the Sweden's
government.

mawaki

On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 9:45 AM, Ginger Paque <gpaque at gmail.com> wrote:

      
        
This may be IG related in the sense that WikiLeaks involves IG, and the
sexual misconduct case may (I say 'may' because I simply do not have all of
the facts) be a manipulation of the WikiLeaks case.

My firmest point is that the two issues should be separated, the sexual
misconduct case addressed, and the central case, WikiLeaks, get back in
focus.

I dislike/resent the use of women/gender/sex as a tool that undermines the
case for legitimate cases of sexual misconduct. If Assange/Assange's lawyers
would force the sexual misconduct issue (without going to Sweden--on video,
webinar, whatever), it would remove this distraction from the picture, and
force the UK to show its hand. In the meantime, we cannot just ignore the
sexual misconduct allegations. Women and sexual misconduct charges should
not be used as legal manipulations and distractions.
Ginger


Ginger (Virginia) Paque

VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu
Diplo Foundation
Internet Governance Capacity Building Programme
www.diplomacy.edu/ig




On 19 August 2012 08:48, Adam Peake <ajp at glocom.ac.jp> wrote:

        
          
          
            
You know that the 5 biggest financial institutions Bank of America, Visa,
mastercard, wester union and paypal decided to block donations to wikileaks
reducing it in 95%? Censorship? Have here an IG issue as requested for some
people here?

          
          
Yes, but what have the 5 banks to do with Assange's alleged assaults?

Don't get me wrong, wikileaks is incredibly important, but I do not see
the connection between the issues in this thread and Internet governance.
If you want to change the subject, fine :-)

Pussy Riot more relevant, part of their "crime" being posting their
protest on the Internet.

Adam




          
            
you can still send donations using https://flattr.com/

Carlos Vera


Enviado desde mi iPhone

El 19/08/2012, a las 6:42, Adam Peake <ajp at glocom.ac.jp> escribió:


            
              
 Dominique, hi.


 On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 8:15 PM, Dominique Lacroix <dl at panamo.eu>
wrote:

              
                
 Rape? Charged?


              
              
 Assange's lawyer's say accused.  But the european arrest warrant the
 UK believes it must enforce says he is wanted for prosecution.  I'm
 not a lawyer, not clue about the difference.



              
                
 1. Assange is not (yet) charged. The judge only wants to ask him some
 questions. Telecom provide some means, indeed...
 2. Rape? Perhaps some of us on this list, men AND women, are rapers at
a
 Swedish sense:


              
              
 I very much hope not.

 Indecent assault isn't that common, is it?   As you note the offense
 carries a maximum 4 year sentence.  Not trivial.



              
                
 "Under Swedish law, there are legal gradations of the definition of
rape.
 There is the most serious kind, involving major violence.
 But below that there is the concept of 'regular rape', still involving
 violence but not violence of the utmost horror.
 And below that there is the idea of 'unlawful coercion'. Talking
generally,
 and not about the Assange case, this might involve putting emotional
 pressure on someone.

 The three categories involve prison sentences of 10, six and four
years
 respectively.
 The lawyer for the two women who have complained against Mr Assange
will not
 spell out the details because he says that would give too much away to
the
 accused man. But he does indicate that it is a four-year sentence that
Mr
 Assange could expect, indicating that he is suspected of this third,
less
 serious category."

 And the great conclusion is:

 "The attitude towards rape in Sweden - informed by a strong sense of
women's
 rights - means that it is more likely to be reported to police.
 Some 53 rape offences are reported per 100,000 people, the highest
rate in
 Europe.
 The figures may reflect a higher number of actual rapes committed but
it
 seems more likely that tough attitudes and a broader definition of the
crime
 are more significant factors."

 See: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11946652

 Isn't it a bit unbalanced, facing whistleblowers issue?

 Yes, Adam, CIA or not CIA, this case seems to me two Internet
Governance
 issues.
 - Lawful here, unlawful there.
 - Whistleblowers right at the Digital age.

 How would you deal with these questions?


              
              
 Sorry, don't get it, what has Assange's situation to do with Internet
 governance, even in its broadest sense? He didn't do anything online
 or on the Internet, he is accused of assaulting two women.  And those
 two people seem to be being very much overlooked at the moment.

 Adam



              
                
 @+, Dominique

 Dominique Lacroix
 Société européenne de l'Internet
 http://www.ies-france.eu
 +33 (0)6 63 24 39 14





 Le 19/08/12 12:28, Fahd A. Batayneh a écrit :

 On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 1:24 AM, Ginger Paque <ginger at paque.net>
wrote:

                
                  
 I admire Assange. I am glad he has the courage to carry out his
WikiLeaks
 work. I don't think he should be persecuted, or face politically
motivated
 harassment or charge.

                
              
            
            
 >>> I don't think being a legitimate social hero allows him to avoid
facing

            
              
                
                  
 charges of rape if the are legitimate.

 Ginger

                
                
 That makes us 2 Ginger. ROCK ON!

 Fahd



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