[governance] Tangential (On Exceptionalism Wikileaks) America's vassal acts decisively and illegally
Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro
salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com
Sun Aug 19 13:57:03 EDT 2012
Assange is referring to this as a witchhunt, see:
http://www.newsday.com/news/world/wikileaks-founder-julian-assange-calls-on-obama-to-end-witch-hunt-1.3913652
On Mon, Aug 20, 2012 at 5:29 AM, Ginger Paque <gpaque at gmail.com> wrote:
> Excellent post, Dominique. Gracias!
>
>
> Ginger (Virginia) Paque
>
> VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu
> Diplo Foundation
> Internet Governance Capacity Building Programme
> www.diplomacy.edu/ig
> **
> **
>
>
>
> On 19 August 2012 12:25, Dominique Lacroix <dl at panamo.eu> wrote:
>
>> That story seems to be all about secret at the information age!
>> Assange got 2 love stories. In both cases, the women invited him in her
>> bed.
>> The case is about what happened there. Sex by surprise? That *should
>> stay secret*, as long as the women were not injured. Actually, they
>> never complained for that.
>>
>> At the contrary, Bradley Manning and Wikileaks revealed what *should not
>> be kept secret*:
>> - Civilians (journalists and children) murders by US soldiers in Iraq.
>>
>> http://www.reuters.com/article/2010/04/06/us-iraq-usa-journalists-idUSTRE6344FW20100406
>> - Orders given to diplomates to spy UN leaders (DNA, passwords, credit
>> card numbers etc.)
>> http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/28/us-embassy-cables-spying-un
>> - And so on.
>>
>> Nevertheless, of course I agree with Ginger and Mawaki: crime allegations
>> are displaced manipulations AND we cannot just ignore the sexual misconduct
>> allegations.
>>
>> But at this stage of the worldwide imbroglio, it's too late for having a
>> neutral trial in Sweden. Could you imagine a Swedish Court concluding: "*Much
>> ado about nothing*"? So public opinion mobilization is important. We are
>> the witnesses.
>> And at this hour, I would like to hear the two women. I'm not sure that
>> the story is still their story...
>>
>>
>> Some strange points must not be forgotten. Just some clues for new
>> readers of the case:
>>
>> - Feminist fighters should be very happy to see that *nowadays police
>> force all around the world hunt rapers* as it's done for Assange.
>> A famous feminist wrote about the case. Just search for Naomi Wolf.
>>
>> http://www.huffingtonpost.com/naomi-wolf/interpol-the-worlds-datin_b_793033.html
>>
>> - Assange *already talked *with Swedish authorities.
>> Convened because of Swedish demand, he *went spontaneously* to the
>> London police.
>>
>> - Swedish authorities aren't clear on the case,* first closed and then
>> reopened*:
>>
>> http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/rape-investigation-into-wikileaks-chief-reopens-2068162.html
>>
>> - It's well established that Assange had two love stories with fans in
>> Stockholm and then Enköping.
>> The first with the famous Anna Ardin, a feminist fighter whose blog
>> explained *how to get revenge against men*:
>>
>> http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-news/7569087-meet-anna-ardin-photos-anna-ardins-7-steps-to-legal-revenge
>>
>> And so on. It's not the good place for further analyzing that case. But
>> doubt is widely allowed.
>>
>>
>> Best regards,
>>
>> @+, Dominique
>>
>> --
>> Dominique Lacroix
>> Société européenne de l'Internet
>> http://www.ies-france.eu
>> +33 (0)6 63 24 39 14
>>
>> Le 19/08/12 16:11, Mawaki Chango a écrit :
>>
>> Completely agree with Ginger here...
>> We can't pretend to ignore the elephant in the room: at this point
>> there's no part of this story that can be clearly separated from
>> Wikileaks - if only given all the shady zones in this imbroglio. And
>> yes, it is unfortunate that the rape issue is now and then exploited
>> in ways that can undermine legitimate claims. Again a lot remains
>> unclear, unfortunately, due to the behavior of the Sweden's
>> government.
>>
>> mawaki
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 9:45 AM, Ginger Paque <gpaque at gmail.com> <gpaque at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> This may be IG related in the sense that WikiLeaks involves IG, and the
>> sexual misconduct case may (I say 'may' because I simply do not have all of
>> the facts) be a manipulation of the WikiLeaks case.
>>
>> My firmest point is that the two issues should be separated, the sexual
>> misconduct case addressed, and the central case, WikiLeaks, get back in
>> focus.
>>
>> I dislike/resent the use of women/gender/sex as a tool that undermines the
>> case for legitimate cases of sexual misconduct. If Assange/Assange's lawyers
>> would force the sexual misconduct issue (without going to Sweden--on video,
>> webinar, whatever), it would remove this distraction from the picture, and
>> force the UK to show its hand. In the meantime, we cannot just ignore the
>> sexual misconduct allegations. Women and sexual misconduct charges should
>> not be used as legal manipulations and distractions.
>> Ginger
>>
>>
>> Ginger (Virginia) Paque
>> VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu
>> Diplo Foundation
>> Internet Governance Capacity Building Programmewww.diplomacy.edu/ig
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 19 August 2012 08:48, Adam Peake <ajp at glocom.ac.jp> <ajp at glocom.ac.jp> wrote:
>>
>> You know that the 5 biggest financial institutions Bank of America, Visa,
>> mastercard, wester union and paypal decided to block donations to wikileaks
>> reducing it in 95%? Censorship? Have here an IG issue as requested for some
>> people here?
>>
>> Yes, but what have the 5 banks to do with Assange's alleged assaults?
>>
>> Don't get me wrong, wikileaks is incredibly important, but I do not see
>> the connection between the issues in this thread and Internet governance.
>> If you want to change the subject, fine :-)
>>
>> Pussy Riot more relevant, part of their "crime" being posting their
>> protest on the Internet.
>>
>> Adam
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> you can still send donations using https://flattr.com/
>>
>> Carlos Vera
>>
>>
>> Enviado desde mi iPhone
>>
>> El 19/08/2012, a las 6:42, Adam Peake <ajp at glocom.ac.jp> <ajp at glocom.ac.jp> escribió:
>>
>>
>> Dominique, hi.
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 8:15 PM, Dominique Lacroix <dl at panamo.eu> <dl at panamo.eu>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Rape? Charged?
>>
>>
>> Assange's lawyer's say accused. But the european arrest warrant the
>> UK believes it must enforce says he is wanted for prosecution. I'm
>> not a lawyer, not clue about the difference.
>>
>>
>>
>> 1. Assange is not (yet) charged. The judge only wants to ask him some
>> questions. Telecom provide some means, indeed...
>> 2. Rape? Perhaps some of us on this list, men AND women, are rapers at
>> a
>> Swedish sense:
>>
>>
>> I very much hope not.
>>
>> Indecent assault isn't that common, is it? As you note the offense
>> carries a maximum 4 year sentence. Not trivial.
>>
>>
>>
>> "Under Swedish law, there are legal gradations of the definition of
>> rape.
>> There is the most serious kind, involving major violence.
>> But below that there is the concept of 'regular rape', still involving
>> violence but not violence of the utmost horror.
>> And below that there is the idea of 'unlawful coercion'. Talking
>> generally,
>> and not about the Assange case, this might involve putting emotional
>> pressure on someone.
>>
>> The three categories involve prison sentences of 10, six and four
>> years
>> respectively.
>> The lawyer for the two women who have complained against Mr Assange
>> will not
>> spell out the details because he says that would give too much away to
>> the
>> accused man. But he does indicate that it is a four-year sentence that
>> Mr
>> Assange could expect, indicating that he is suspected of this third,
>> less
>> serious category."
>>
>> And the great conclusion is:
>>
>> "The attitude towards rape in Sweden - informed by a strong sense of
>> women's
>> rights - means that it is more likely to be reported to police.
>> Some 53 rape offences are reported per 100,000 people, the highest
>> rate in
>> Europe.
>> The figures may reflect a higher number of actual rapes committed but
>> it
>> seems more likely that tough attitudes and a broader definition of the
>> crime
>> are more significant factors."
>>
>> See: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11946652
>>
>> Isn't it a bit unbalanced, facing whistleblowers issue?
>>
>> Yes, Adam, CIA or not CIA, this case seems to me two Internet
>> Governance
>> issues.
>> - Lawful here, unlawful there.
>> - Whistleblowers right at the Digital age.
>>
>> How would you deal with these questions?
>>
>>
>> Sorry, don't get it, what has Assange's situation to do with Internet
>> governance, even in its broadest sense? He didn't do anything online
>> or on the Internet, he is accused of assaulting two women. And those
>> two people seem to be being very much overlooked at the moment.
>>
>> Adam
>>
>>
>>
>> @+, Dominique
>>
>> Dominique Lacroix
>> Société européenne de l'Internet
>> http://www.ies-france.eu
>> +33 (0)6 63 24 39 14
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Le 19/08/12 12:28, Fahd A. Batayneh a écrit :
>>
>> On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 1:24 AM, Ginger Paque <ginger at paque.net> <ginger at paque.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>> I admire Assange. I am glad he has the courage to carry out his
>> WikiLeaks
>> work. I don't think he should be persecuted, or face politically
>> motivated
>> harassment or charge.
>>
>> >>> I don't think being a legitimate social hero allows him to avoid
>> facing
>>
>> charges of rape if the are legitimate.
>>
>> Ginger
>>
>> That makes us 2 Ginger. ROCK ON!
>>
>> Fahd
>>
>>
>>
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--
Salanieta Tamanikaiwaimaro aka Sala
P.O. Box 17862
Suva
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Twitter: @SalanietaT
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