AW: [governance] Internet G8 meeting
jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr
jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr
Mon May 9 18:05:54 EDT 2011
Dear list members
Michael Gurstein wrote :
(....)
All of which is to say, the instance that Parminder is pointing to is not isolated and it isn't accidental. Mike
This is also my opinion. My warmest thanks to Parminder !
Jean-Louis Fullsack
CSDPTT-France
> Message du 09/05/11 16:14
> De : "Michael Gurstein"
> A : governance at lists.cpsr.org, "'parminder'"
> Copie à :
> Objet : RE: AW: [governance] Internet G8 meeting
>
> Message I would like to support Parminder's comments and overall analysis here. I think this issue should be put in the larger context of the broad outsourcing of government policy making (this specific example is particularly egregious since it isn't simply "outsourcing" but rather it seems to be putting policy making in these crucial spheres "up for auction"). In the Canadian and I believe other national contexts this "outsourcing of government policy making" is a broad trend which began initially with the destruction of government's internal capacity for research and policy analysis on the basis of "cost-cutting". When this proved impossible to sustain in complex enviroments there was a broad shift to outsourcing these requirements to private agencies -- mostly privatized think tanks to provide this type of policy research and analysis. Since these agencies were directly funded by the government of the day their capacity to undertake disinterested (or rather research and policy analysis in the "public interest" or towards the general good) was of course fatally compromised. Issues of truly massive financial significance and global reach such as those involving the Internet (another example of course is the global financial system) are of particular concern here since what is required are global regulatory and policy making agencies sufficent to respond to the scale and scope of the matters at hand. In the absence of these (as has been commented on repeatedly in this context in this forum) the need doesn't disappear but the mode of response takes a typical form at this stage of global development i.e. to turn to those "with the greatest stake" -- the private corps to provide the advice and policy direction required. The instrumentalities (including research and policy analysis) which would allow governments individually or collectively to undertake the required policy making simply don't exist nor do most of our current G8 governments want them to exist for ideological reasons. Guys (and gals) its not that the French government (or the Canadian government in an earlier iteration) "forgot" to invite Civil Society to the table it is that they see no need to bring CS to the table and there are no institutions in most instances either at the naitonal level or at the global level which are structured in such a way as to require this i.e. to support "the public interest". All of which is to say, the instance that Parminder is pointing to is not isolated and it isn't accidental. Mike -----Original Message-----
> From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of parminder
> Sent: Monday, May 09, 2011 1:13 AM
> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org
> Subject: Re: AW: [governance] Internet G8 meeting
>
>
> On Monday 09 May 2011 01:19 PM, Ian Peter wrote: My only problem with the text is that it tells them what we think they should do without telling them why it would be advantageous to do it another way. So its not likely to draw a great deal of attention.
> Thanks for your comments, Ian. In general I have no problem with incorporating your additions, and I will leave it to others to decide on it. However, I must assert, with the risk of looking like trying to take the moral high-ground, that civil society's role is not just to give 'technical' advice to others, about what is good for them or not. Our basic legitimacy is moral and representational... Also it is never clear, to 'whom' is something advantageous or not - to the French President's own interest, the narrow interests of the French state, of the states of G * together, advantageous to whom?
>
> So while an instrumental logic can be used to supplement our assertions, they should not be primary, and should in any case be used with great caution. We need to invlvoe all countries and all stakeholders not because it is advantageous to the principal parties being addressed here, (which in nay case they can refute by giving counter logic) but because that is the democratic and right way to do it. Period. That is what we stand for and struggle for.
>
>
> To this end I would add another paragraph – perhaps after the “it is also pertinent” paragraph, along the lines of
>
>
> The issues we face with internet governance and internet developments are global in nature, and adequate solutions to the problems we face will need to involve all countries, as well as a wide range of business, civil society and technical interests. All of these inputs are essential to any sensible and effective developments in this area,Begs the question, sensible and effective for whom ?? Some things can be quite sensible and effective to, say large incumbent businesses, or even to narrow economic interests of a particular nation state perched at a particular place in the global digital economy chain or network. that does not diminish our right and effort to seek democratic participation in policy making. Also, I dont like the terminology of 'solutions' as if there are value- and interest- neutral solutions waiting to be found by the right application of expertise in all policy matters.
>
> For the same reason, I am not in agreement with one of Avri's edits where the call to adhere to canons or high principles of legitimate policy making is sought to be replace by best practises in policy making. This again suggests expertise and information-richness based policy models, but i think this is much more 'political' than that.
>
> Just my views, for whatever they are worth :)
>
> Parminder
>
> and we urge a more holistic involvement of this wide range of key players. Only in this way will we be able to develop adequate solutions.
>
> Ian Peter
> From: Jeremy Malcolm
> Organization: Consumers International
> Reply-To: , Jeremy Malcolm
> Date: Mon, 09 May 2011 12:29:14 +0800
> To: , Avri
> Subject: Re: AW: [governance] Internet G8 meeting
>
> Thanks Parminder and Avri. Here's a consolidated draft with Avri's edits.
>
> Basic courtesy stuff.....
>
> We understand that the French Presidency of the G8 proposes to hold a G8
> Internet meeting, immediately prior to the G8 Summit in ........,with a view
> to prepare or influence the agenda for the G8 Summit regarding key global
> Internet issues. We also understand that many heads of states of G 8
> countries are expected to attend this meeting. The meeting is especially
> important since in the past G 8 has set up the global agenda on many key
> issues, especially in the information society arena.
>
> We are very concerned about the manner in which the G 8 Internet meeting is
> being organised which is ignoring current best practice in public policy making.
> It also jettisons the principle of multistakeholder participation that has evolved
> globally, especially in the area of Internet governance. It appears that the G8
> meeting is organized by large Industry with access given only to industry and
> government actors. We have also understood that there is a linkage between
> donations and invitations.
>
> Big businesses already have a disproportionately large influence on
> government bureaucracies. For governments to sanction a dedicated meeting
> with top G8 leaders and officials to plan the global agenda for Internet related
> policies is inappropriate. What is required is a discussion that includes civil
> society actors, who will bring to the table the concerns of global public interest
> derived from a diversity of people's, of many sections of society, interests and
> concerns.
>
> It is also pertinent to state here that since the Internet is essentially a
> global phenomenon, policies framed together by the most powerful nations,
> quite likely, will become the default global norm. This is most true for
> architectural and economic issues, while the global impact on other areas
> will also be substantial. It is therefore appropriate that G 8 countries
> engage with the same, and other issues, of Internet policies at the more
> democratic global forums where all countries are present at an equal
> footing. In this connection, there is the World Summit on the Information
> Society mandated set of processes for dealing with pressing global Internet
> related issues. Multistakeholder participation is an important part of these global
> IG related processes. We see the proposed G 8 Interent meeting a significant
> step backwards both for global democracy and for multistakeholder
> participation.
>
> We therefore request you, and other G 8 leaders, to make the proposed G 8
> Internet meeting genuinely multistakeholder, following the model of the UN
> IGF. We are impressed with the solid support provided by the G 8 countries
> for upholding a multistakeholder model for the IGF. The strong support that
> many of G8 countries, including your own, have shown for full multistakeholder
> participation makes this current decision to limit discussion to vested interests
> of governments' industry partners is baffling and is unacceptable to many of
> the users of the Internet.
>
> closing and salutations.....
> --
>
>
>
> Dr Jeremy Malcolm
> Project Coordinator
> Consumers International
> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East
> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599
>
>
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> --
> P { COLOR: rgb(0,0,0) } A:link { } P { COLOR: rgb(0,0,0) } A:link { }
Parminder Jeet Singh
> Executive Director
> IT for Change
> NGO in Special Consultative Status with the United Nations ECOSOC
> www.ITforChange.net
> Tel:+91-80-2665 4134, 2653 6890. Fax:+91-80-4146 1055
>
>
>
>
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