[governance] IGF Review Question 6 start
Eric Dierker
cogitoergosum at sbcglobal.net
Sun Jul 12 00:00:45 EDT 2009
Hmm,
My issue is with expanding the scope to "doing good works" as opposed to creating an open forum for sound expressions of ideas for the governance of the Internet.
--- On Sat, 7/11/09, Jeffrey A. Williams <jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com> wrote:
From: Jeffrey A. Williams <jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: [governance] IGF Review Question 6 start
To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Michael Gurstein" <gurstein at gmail.com>, "Ian Peter" <ian.peter at ianpeter.com>
Cc: "'Eric Dierker'" <cogitoergosum at sbcglobal.net>, "'Sylvia Caras'" <sylvia.caras at gmail.com>, "'Ginger Paque'" <gpaque at gmail.com>, "Milton L Mueller" <mueller at syr.edu>, "Jeanette Hofmann" <jeanette at wzb.eu>
Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 1:27 AM
Michael and all,
Aptly and rightly ask? Perhaps there will be an answer from
our fellow user and "Dotcommoner", Eric. ?? My guess is however,
that the "We" is ALL users and future users. I hope that my guess
was what Eric meant by "We".
This said and ask, let me further digress on Eric's other utterances.
I and all of our members amongst many others, perhaps a majority
believe that international "do gooders" are not only welcome, but
very beneficial as they, myself included, seek to do good works for
all and by all. To seek otherwise is of course inherently wrong
headed and fundamentally harmful as well as far less then useful
or helpful. The key is what is or defines "Good works" and what
only benifits a few.
Michael Gurstein wrote:
> Who is "we"...M
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Eric Dierker [mailto:cogitoergosum at sbcglobal.net]
> Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 8:04 AM
> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Michael Gurstein; 'Sylvia
> Caras'; 'Ginger Paque'
> Subject: RE: [governance] IGF Review Question 6 start
>
>
Very insghtful (incitefull) and humrous. But yes governance is
only for those who are governed. I do not think we call this
freedomance. We do not and should not create governing principles
or principals and then go out and see who we can catch in our
net. Somehow international do gooders constantly interlope into
what is basically intended as a system of setting up norms and
co-opt them into international aid programs in order to garner
publicity and further other agendas. To be governed is to be
restricted. We do not need to restrict activity of extremely poor
people. We need to govern activity of those in power.
--- On Fri, 7/10/09, Michael Gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com> wrote:
From: Michael Gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com>
Subject: RE: [governance] IGF Review Question 6 start
To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "'Eric Dierker'"
<cogitoergosum at sbcglobal.net>, "'Sylvia Caras'"
<sylvia.caras at gmail.com>, "'Ginger Paque'"
<gpaque at gmail.com>
Date: Friday, July 10, 2009, 11:50 AM
Hmmm... so governance is just for the governors...
Interesting concept... Not sure what you do with the
notions of democracy and citizenship built up over the
last 1000 years or so, but maybe governance of the
Internet is a special case...M
-----Original Message-----
From: Eric Dierker
[mailto:cogitoergosum at sbcglobal.net]
Sent: Friday, July 10, 2009 7:35 AM
To: Sylvia Caras; governance at lists.cpsr.org;
Ginger Paque
Cc: governance at lists.cpsr.org
Subject: Re: [governance] IGF Review Question
6 start
Yes indeed. Leave the below out of any
suggestions. Great for goals and
cheerleading but very destructive to building
foundations. People must get the fact that
caring for the needy via the internet is not
grassroots, it is empathy, not work limiting
accomodation. At best teh below approach will
lead us to form general policy based on
isolated non-representative experience and at
norm lead us moribound into more worry about
an individual or inclusiveness than results.
"Governance" is not the idea of developing,
it is the idea of working with what we have,
or what comes into it, not what will make us
feel good. In short - you do not form a
governance model and then say "Now let us go
out and find folks to govern". Townhall
meeting concepts are for pr and politics.
--- On Thu, 7/9/09, Ginger Paque
<gpaque at gmail.com> wrote:
Sylvia and Erik, thanks for your
comments.
Erik, did you have any specific
requests, or just positive feedback
for Jeremy's addition? If there was
a change implied, I did not get it.
And here we include for example,
Indigenous peoples worldwide,
people with disabilities, rural
people and particularly those who
are the poorest of the poor and
often landless or migrants, those
concerned with promoting peer to
peer and open access governance
structures built on an electronic
platform, those looking to
alternative modes of Internet
governance as ways of responding to
specific localized opportunities
and limitations, and those working
as practitioners and activists in
implementing the Internet as a
primary resource in support of
broad based economic and social
development.
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Regards,
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