[governance] Innovation

Tue Nov 27 19:47:19 EST 2007

A la Kieren: "Ad hominem attack".
But nevermind: I'm not impressed, and I shut up when I decide to, not  
when coarse intimidation is tried.
I'm wondering why such anger? Why the mere critic of ICANN is  
provoking such extreme and insulting reactions?
Meryem
PS. When you'll run short of French caricatures, just let me know.  
I'll tell you know what's my other citizenship/culture/origin, so  
that you'll be able to find in another folklore some hopefully more  
original insults.

Le 28 nov. 07 à 00:48, Alejandro Pisanty a écrit :

> Meryem,
>
> at this level of discourse it is proper that you go back to your  
> Minitel. A nice, closed, government-controlled/guaranteed  
> environment in which you do not need to be confronted with an  
> opinion that varies from the one you hold, no need for open  
> standards, no need for people of diverse views to come together and  
> actually build something that works; just wait for the providers to  
> do it for you. A neat, Cartesian, "clean, well-lighted  
> place" (horrible things happened outside it but never mind.) Having  
> vented off:
>
> We now know the many flaws you recognize in ICANN. To the best of  
> what I can gather, many of the flaws you see derive from a lack of  
> working knowledge of the organization and its evolution and are  
> strongly tinted by prejudice. It is your privilege to say they  
> aren't. So, exercise:
>
> What do you recognize in ICANN that is positive?
>
> Yours,
>
> Alejandro Pisanty
>
> .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  . .  .  .  .  
>  .  .
>      Dr. Alejandro Pisanty
> Director General de Servicios de Computo Academico
> UNAM, Universidad Nacional Autonoma de Mexico
> Av. Universidad 3000, 04510 Mexico DF Mexico
> Tel. (+52-55) 5622-8541, 5622-8542 Fax 5622-8540
> http://www.dgsca.unam.mx
> *
> ---->> Unete a ISOC Mexico, www.isoc.org
>  Participa en ICANN, www.icann.org
> .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  . 
>   .  .
>
>
> On Wed, 28 Nov 2007, Meryem Marzouki wrote:
>
>> Date: Wed, 28 Nov 2007 00:29:56 +0100
>> From: Meryem Marzouki <marzouki at ras.eu.org>
>> Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, Meryem Marzouki  
>> <marzouki at ras.eu.org>
>> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org
>> Subject: Re: [governance] Innovation
>>
>> Le 27 nov. 07 à 20:13, Alejandro Pisanty a écrit :
>>
>>> Meryem,
>>> this:
>>>> (NB. I do understand why people/organizations that currently  
>>>> benefit from ICANN in one way or another want to keep their  
>>>> privileges. What about others?)
>>> is really the core of your argument, isn't it?
>>
>> No. I was not making an argument in this message actually. I was  
>> asking a question.
>>
>>> You do not see a benefit in increased competition, gradual  
>>> introduction of new gTLDs, increased coordination between the  
>>> gTLD and the ccTLD space, a framework for a level of cooperation  
>>> among RIRs not provided by the NRO, and between the different  
>>> subsystems for the subset of critical Internet resources in this  
>>> specific mandate, operation of the IANA function with respect to  
>>> gTLDs, ccTLDs, protocol parameters, IPv4 and IPv6 addresses, gTLD  
>>> data escrow to protect consumers from registry/ar breakdown's  
>>> fallout, IDNs in the root, presence of technical, business,  
>>> academic and civil society from the developing world which is not  
>>> mediated or impeded by their governments, etc. etc. etc.
>>
>> Wow! God bless ICANN. Without it, we cannot have all this, then?  
>> And before it was set up, we couldn't even dream of all this,  
>> right? I wont even comment on your last sentence, and what it  
>> reveals ("developing world governments can only *impede* the  
>> presence of their technical, business, academic and civil  
>> society"). Simply agree with you that the introduction of new  
>> gTLDs is *very* gradual..
>>
>>> Then your argument is that the hard-working Vittorios, Avris,  
>>> Brets, Jacquelines, and so many others involved in the ALAC, and  
>>> all others who actually make the system run, are only doing it to  
>>> defend "privileges"?
>>
>> Et voila.. I ask "what about others?", and that's the only way  
>> you've found to answer? It would probably better if you don't  
>> answer instead of the concerned persons, BTW.
>>
>>> Or do you include among "those who benefit from ICANN" the many  
>>> businesses, social organizations, and individuals who benefit  
>>> from what is described three paragraphs above? What are their  
>>> "privileges"? A stable, expanding DNS, IP allocation system,  
>>> IANA, protocol-parameter space, etc., are "privileges"?
>>
>> God bless ICANN, once again. Since everything's perfect, why are  
>> we having such discussions?
>>
>> ____________________________________________________________
>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list:
>>    governance at lists.cpsr.org
>> To be removed from the list, send any message to:
>>    governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org
>>
>> For all list information and functions, see:
>>    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance
>> ____________________________________________________________
> You received this message as a subscriber on the list:
>     governance at lists.cpsr.org
> To be removed from the list, send any message to:
>     governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org
>
> For all list information and functions, see:
>     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance

____________________________________________________________
You received this message as a subscriber on the list:
     governance at lists.cpsr.org
To be removed from the list, send any message to:
     governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org

For all list information and functions, see:
     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance