No subject

interested in the NMI.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 I see it is okay if one network or list=C2=A0 or platform=C2=
=A0 decides NOT to<br>
participate but we cannot ask others not to.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Me, I am in favour of Governance and BB lists nominating peop=
le. And<br>
at the same time, saying that it is important for African S to<br>
participate.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 All for now<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Nnenna<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 On Tue, Nov 18, 2014 at 6:06 PM, Jean-Christophe NOTHIAS I Th=
e Global<br>
Journal <<a href=3D"mailto:jc.nothias at theglobaljournal.net" target=3D"_b=
lank">jc.nothias at theglobaljournal.<u></u>net</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Jeremy,<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Thanks for your email.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Looking after pathologies is certainly a noble cause, =
but as we both<br>
do not belong to the medical corpus, maybe it would simply be wise<br>
to terminate this, and cool down a bit. Even though we are in real<br>
politics.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Go after the arguments put on the table is probably of=
 better effect<br>
and impact.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 What I wanted to say using quotes from an array of obs=
ervers or<br>
participants is that the initiative has more than a troubling set of<br>
definitions, expectations and leading to an overall confusion. It<br>
looks more or less like "un ch=C3=83=C2=A8que en blanc" to illegi=
timate<br>
grouping of a wealthy elite (the three players of NMI have deep<br>
pockets, and friends with deeper pockets). I am not even trying to<br>
clarify the obvious tactics behind all their gesture. I had an<br>
intermezzo as a consultant for 10 years in my life, and can more<br>
than easily read the partition behind all of that smoking screen. In<br>
the army, you always call some troopers from the "g=C3=83=C2=A9nie&quo=
t; when you<br>
need a screen of smoke to cross a street, a bridge or a simple line.<br>
No, let's stay on what is at stake such as<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - why part of civil society in Busan accepted the fact=
 that the US<br>
refused to discuss mass surveillance?<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - why is the IGF not the best bet for civil society to=
 keep maturing<br>
and growing?<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - why is encryption, I know EFF is working hard on thi=
s topic,<br>
insufficiently at the center of the IG debate? Isn't encryption part<br>
of the mass surveillance issue? So then why to please the US, in Sao<br>
Paulo, then in Busan by refusing to really go after it? Mass<br>
surveillance has nothing to do with IG they told us.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - why civil society not more vocal on the Google Tour =
against the EU<br>
decision to protect personal data, considering rightly in my view,<br>
that search engines are touching at personal data, beyond the simple<br>
links they assembled in their result pages? This is a real good<br>
debate for CS.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - why not to discuss the IETF and its roles in the IG?=
 More<br>
important than IANA for example?<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - why CS seems deprived of imagination and innovative =
ideas when it<br>
comes to create a new coordinating body/system, as the ICANN is<br>
saying the political aspects of IG is beyond its mandate? How can we<br>
help ourselves to have these ideas popping out of CS minds? Looking<br>
at all the NGOs we are currently ranking, I am positively impressed<br>
with their innovative abilities, much more powerful than classical<br>
corps. They also create more "values".<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I am not naive, and have probably a few answers in min=
d.<br>
Nevertheless, CS should really act differently. The NMI story is<br>
relevant of the weakness that anyone can perceive among CS, and this<br>
is not to blame JNC or anyone else. A leadership crisis wrote<br>
someone today.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Remember the preparation of Net Mundial? Did the ICANN=
 handle CS in<br>
a satisfactory fashion? Haven't we seen the trailer? We had to twist<br>
their arm every minute to get info, to get principles, to simply get<br>
it not that bad. Why is it so difficult for the 'nice guys" not to=
<br>
go directly after the right ideas, proposals and suggestions when<br>
launching an open, honest, transparent debate? Instead they keep<br>
creating distrust with their committees, high level panel, advisory<br>
boards... Trust is critical. "Please energize me! should we all cry.<b=
r>
We are all losing. Terrifying, I would say.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 So why don't you and other leaders of CS decide to=
 meet, have a<br>
debate and launch a true CS initiative, calling governments,<br>
citizens and corporations to join in a effort to rebalance the<br>
growing asymmetry we live in since the mid-nineties? In the face of<br>
History, and our fellow citizens, we are failing, because CS is not<br>
united. To do that you do not need any WEF. You only need to trust,<br>
share, and confront the realities that are taking away our rights.<br>
This is what should be done, now, instead of wasting our time and<br>
little money to debate about the comfortable sofas of the WEF.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Somehow BB is a failure, as it has not delivered to it=
s own mandate.<br>
JNC is not getting more isolated, it is growing and reaching more<br>
and more people. We should not care about that. We should care about<br>
having a collective action that would oblige governments, corps and<br>
the current mandarins to take more progressive steps.<br>
Multistakeholderism when it comes to convene and consult many<br>
participants is certainly nice. This has often been done, long<br>
before we began to put in our mouth the MS narrative. When it comes<br>
to make decisions at least on the public policy level, MS simply<br>
doesn't work. If the coders had to go through MS to make decision,<br>
they would have simply gone nowhere. Only a few guys fixing better<br>
than other few guys technical issues doesn't equate a political<br>
model. It could work, but then it would lead to some social<br>
disaster, a disruption that would unleash violence.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 JNC has no monopole of ethics, but because we are poor=
 enough, our<br>
bias is somehow limited. We are paid by no government, no<br>
corporation, no barons. We are simple citizens, with a profound<br>
democratic concern (to avoid another asymmetric wars), and we are<br>
ready to go into rationales as long as we are not characterized as<br>
psychotics or lunatics.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 There is no way that we can really have a strong impac=
t as civil<br>
society participants if we do not go after unity. And we all agree<br>
that we should pay more respect to each others, as long as we do not<br>
have hidden agenda, and gentle philanthropes putting their money in<br>
the debate. That would be fair.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 JC<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Le 18 nov. 2014 =C3=83=C2=A0 17:55, Jeremy Malcolm a =
=C3=83=C2=A9crit :<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 On Nov 18, 2014, at 1:49 AM, Jean-Christophe NOTHIAS I=
 The Global<br>
Journal <<a href=3D"mailto:jc.nothias at theglobaljournal.net" target=3D"_b=
lank">jc.nothias at theglobaljournal.<u></u>net</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I leave to Norbert co-convenor at JNC to answer=
 your first email.<br>
On a personal note, I would appreciate you to elaborate about the<br>
"dumping on civil society colleagues" you are referring to,<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Within the next few days I=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2m go=
ing to write a separate blog post<br>
about this at <a href=3D"http://igfwatch.org" target=3D"_blank">igfwatch.or=
g</a>, because JNC=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2s pathologies are<br>
off-topic for this list.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 The WEF/ICANN/CGIbr project is not in lack of clarity.=
 If I do<br>
listen to non JNC members:<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - Wall Street Journal reporter: "The NetMundial w=
ants to spread<br>
Internet Governance more evenly across the developing world". (Ask<br>
Drew Fitzgerald about the source for that understanding of what is<br>
the WIB Initiative)<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Which is roughly opposite to what JNC is saying.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - McCarthy at The Register: "ISOC has blasted eff=
orts from some<br>
quarters to create a "UN Security Council=C3=A2=E2=82=AC <br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 A fatuous analogy, do you take it at face value?<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 - Eileen Donahoe, ... Virgilio Almeida, ... Richard Sa=
mans, ... Fadi<br>
Chehad=C3=83=C2=A9: ...<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 None of these statements support the characterisation =
of the<br>
Initiative as in your letter as =C3=A2=E2=82=AC=C5=93being =C3=A2=E2=82=AC=
=E2=84=A2the=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2 mechanism for<br>
global [Internet] governance=C3=A2=E2=82=AC .<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Based on these official and public statement, I can on=
ly read JNC<br>
statement as an interesting analysis and agree with JNC reluctance<br>
to participate or endorse such following-up (hijacking might be to<br>
blunt) of the NetMundial meeting. Nor the WEF, ICANN, or CGIbr are<br>
owners of what was stated ultimately in Sao Paulo, with all due<br>
reserves by different participants.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2ve also said, and maintain, t=
hat I regard the NETmundial<br>
Initiative (particularly the naming thereof) to be a hijacking of<br>
the NETmundial meeting. On this much we agree.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 So instead of trying to grab a comfortable seat=
 in that convoy ...<br>
should for once, Civil Society ... acknowledges the serious<br>
concerns seen in the making of, and in the diverse objectives<br>
presented by the WEF, ICANN and CGIbr.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ian has taking a more neutral position, but for my par=
t personally I<br>
certainly have<br>
(<a href=3D"http://igfwatch.org/discussion-board/netmundial-initiative-take=
s-a-top-down-approach-to-implementing-the-netmundial-principles" target=3D"=
_blank">http://igfwatch.org/<u></u>discussion-board/netmundial-<u></u>initi=
ative-takes-a-top-down-<u></u>approach-to-implementing-the-<u></u>netmundia=
l-principles</a>).<br>
=C2=A0What prompted my last email was not that JNC opposes the NETmundial<b=
r>
Initiative, but that it has to do this by impugning the motives of<br>
other civil society groups and falsely attributing them with their<br>
endorsement of the Initiative.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Also for the avoidance of doubt, nobody else endorsed =
my rant which<br>
was sent in a personal capacity (though I have subsequently<br>
received, off list, two emails in support, as well as one against).<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 By the way, could you explain us (subscribers of the B=
estBits list):<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I do not have time to respond to the rest of your mail=
 right now<br>
because I am speaking at a conference today and will be boarding a<br>
flight a few hours later.=C2=A0 But I write this brief response just<br>
because you suggested in most recent mail that I was ignoring you -<br>
I=C3=A2=E2=82=AC=E2=84=A2m not.=C2=A0 Anyway, others can respond to the bal=
ance of your<br>
questions rather than me monopolising the conversation.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 --<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Jeremy Malcolm<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Senior Global Policy Analyst<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Electronic Frontier Foundation<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"https://eff.org" target=3D"_blank">https://=
eff.org</a><br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"mailto:jmalcolm at eff.org" target=3D"_blank">=
jmalcolm at eff.org</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Tel: <a href=3D"tel:415.436.9333%20ext%20161" value=3D=
"+14154369333" target=3D"_blank">415.436.9333 ext 161</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 :: Defending Your Rights in the Digital World ::<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
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=C2=A0 =C2=A0 --<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Dr. Anja Kovacs<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 The Internet Democracy Project<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"tel:%2B91%209899028053" value=3D"+919899028053" ta=
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r>
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