[governance] Towards an Internet Social Forum
Sean O Siochru
sean at nexus.ie
Mon Feb 2 09:11:02 EST 2015
Hi Avri and everyone
Despite the heat in these discussions, I am more hopeful than you about a
total polarisation between "those who support multistakeholder distributed
mechanisms on Internet policy issues and those who support sovereign
special rights on international Internet public policy". Its possible to
plausibly stake out a lot more common ground, which I know you too would
like to see.
My position is that all stakeholders have a full right to have their views
heard, listened to, and responded to (a right to communicate). That debate
must be structured and conducted in a manner that the public interest is to
the fore, rather than sectional interests (the public interest is
universal, by definition). It is interesting that even corporations always
argue that what they propose is good for everyone, society as a whole,
because the terms of the debate have to be set that way - everyone has to
at least pretend they are arguing for the public interest. (We all know, of
course, that corporate interest must - even legally - serve their
shareholders first, representing mainly the wealthy; and indeed NGOs and
governments harbour similar contradictions, though, I would argue, overall
not as intense.)
So representing the public interest means that sectional interests cannot
be allowed to have a significant or unfair advantage. But to assess
whether that is the case we have to look to the current alignment of
forces, and away from the 'theoretical' or 'pretend' world of all
stakeholders being equal and all interested in the public interest.
Currently (and this is a global and all-sectoral phenomenon) the corporate
sector has huge financial resources compared to everyone else; furthermore
the corporate sector has key powerful governments on its side. Especially
the US, but also many EU countries 'short circuit' debate in what is in the
public interest (in particular as it relates to international politics),
and identifies the public interest (national) with the interests of 'their'
corporations. The US is the most explicit in identifying with their
corporations (though there are in fact conflicting position within US
corporations), forced by the needs of national political consumption - but
in reality many, if not most, industrial countries do this. Then there is
the influence of the corporate sector among NGOs; both the NGOs that
explicitly represent the interests of the corporate sector and always have;
and the ones whose positions are subtly or less subtly influenced by
corporate donations and other forms of funding.
So in the current configuration of forces, it is virtually impossible to
have fair and balanced multi-stakeholders discussion and debate, because of
the huge and distorting influence of these stakeholders in the interests of
particular sets of interests. Even to enter into these arenas of supposed
multi-stakeholder debate risks given them a legitimacy they do not deserve
(though there can be tactical reasons to do so).
The WSIS was interesting, because NGOs stole a march to some extent on
corporate interests in terms of developing positions and articulating them,
and was able to influence quite a few governments. We were finding our
voice, there were fewer material interests of people tied up with the whole
area; and there were certainly fewer links between the corporate sector and
NGOs (with the explicit exceptions of corporate-supporting NGOs),
So though I support multi-stakeholderism in debate and discussion, making
it meaningful, and keeping the public interest to the fore gets more and
more difficult. This, I think, is the 'split' in civil society on that
issue: Are all stakeholders able to articulate their views of what is in
the public interest in the current structures? Or do some have too much
control? Unfortunately I believe the latter and that a serious rebalancing
is needed.
One useful direction to take, I believe, is to bring in many more 'genuine'
civil society voices, who are already active in social justice, in
development, anti-imperialism etc. so that the terms of the debate are
broadened. The Internet Social Forum, to me, might hold that potential and
breathe a bit of reality into discussions about the internet and IG.
However, in anything I said above, I did not mention decision-making - it
was about discussion and debate, and about trying to establish what is in
the public interest and trying to influence other - including the wider
public - to these points of view. This is the public sphere.
International decision-making, and the appropriate structures to take more
or less binding decisions, are not the same. And this is where government
do have a privileged role. I think this is what Avri is referring
to: "sovereign special rights on international Internet public policy
issues" i.e. governments having special rights to take decisions.
Before I say any more: I have already criticised US and EU governments -
so I am under so illusion that they uniformly represent the public
interest. And this is aside from the nasty regimes in so many countries
whose pretense at representing their citizens is far flimsier, and
maintained only by brutal force and repression.
Nevertheless, governments overall do in most cases represent one of the few
modicums of hard-won democracy (every scrap of it won through struggle -
the powerful never surrender power without a fight). And the United Nations
structures do - few will deny - offer a level of legitimacy in key respects
that is simply unavailable at the international level in any other
stakeholder forum. So I do believe that UN agencies have 'special rights'
on global issues of governance, and of course must be subject to the
'special' responsibilities of transparency, accountability etc. that goes
with those rights. Yes, these rights are regularly abused by many states;
and are very often exercises in hypocrisy; but there is still a greater
core of legitimacy there than anywhere else.
So if I believe in multi-stakeholder debate and 'special rights' for UN
governance. How are they connected?
In short, if multi-stakeholders debate works well and can generate ideas
and approaches that are demonstrably in the public interest, and can
persuade ever larger number of people of this, it can generate and sustain
a public sphere in which governments are forced to act on these and where
the room to manoeuvre for hypocrites and dictators is gradually squeezed.
This is also where civil society at the national level can influence the
global governance level. (The CRIS campaign, like so many, had a go at that.)
In fact I would go further than that. Because it is not at all clear when
it comes to the internet precisely which areas must be subject to binding
decisions per se, and which can be subject to simple agreements, a rough
consensus. It can reasonably be argued that the emphasis should always be
in favour of the latter, that enforceable decisions should be kept, though
design, to a minimum; and that agreements, including alternative parallel
solutions, can co-exist for instance, should be maximised.
OK, crude and simple maybe, but at least this represents a case to support
both fair and balanced multi-stakeholder debate and special - though
circumscribed and scrutinised - rights for governments.
Of course, if someone wants to argued that government should have the
exclusive right to debate and take decisions, and that the areas for
decisions must be maximised; and others argue that government should have
no special rights to decision making at all, then we are polarised. But
very few actually take such hard positions. (Just Net Coalition does not,
for instance). There in my view still a big area of overlap that we can
work on.
Sean
At 09:49 02/02/2015, Avri Doria wrote:
>Hi,
>
>While i think it would be lovely if Civil society could speak with one
>voice, given the fundamental differences between those who support
>multistakeholder distributed mechanisms on Internet policy issues and
>those who support sovereign special rights on international Internet
>public policy issues, it seems highly unlikely.
>
>On some ancillary issues we may reach a consensus, but on the most
>fundamental, that is unlikely. I think IGC should focus on those other
>issues, such as modality for open participation etc where we made indeed
>be able to speak in a common voice and perhaps able to influence things in
>a direction the various camps can all accept. While I accept using the
>IGC as a discussion place for the larger issues, I do not think we should
>expect to reach consensus on these issues.
>
>avri
>
>On 01-Feb-15 13:01, "Kleinwächter, Wolfgang" wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>Hi
>>
>>thx. for the discussion.
>>
>>The "speak with one voice" question can be easily answered: It is the
>>outcome of a process where different CS groups participate in a bottom up
>>open, transparent and inclusive drafting process and agree on common
>>languge around a number of issues. This has been possible in the past
>>from the CS WSIS 2003 declaration via numerous statements in CSTD, IGF,
>>UNESCO, ITU/WTPF and others. This was workable on the basis of a
>>principle which was inspired by Jon Postels RFC 793."Be conservative in
>>what you send, be liberal in what you accept".
>>
>>If the various CS Groups return to RFC 793, there is a good chance to
>>reach rough consensus among the various groups so that we can speak
>>seriously with "one" voice in the WSIS 10+ process, knowing that this
>>"one voice" is based on a broad variety of different nuances but is
>>united around basic values as human rights, equality , justice, access,
>>knowledge, brdiging the digital divide etc. ..
>>
>>Wolfgang
>>
>>
>>
>>-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
>>Von:
>><mailto:governance-request at lists.igcaucus.org>governance-request at lists.igcaucus.org
>>im Auftrag von Mawaki Chango
>>Gesendet: So 01.02.2015 10:24
>>An: Internet Governance; Norbert Bollow
>>Betreff: Re: [governance] Towards an Internet Social Forum
>>
>>On Sun, Feb 1, 2015 at 7:34 AM, Norbert Bollow
>><mailto:nb at bollow.ch><nb at bollow.ch> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>...
>>> WK is
>>>calling for civil society to "speak with one voice".
>>>
>>>So I find it natural to ask how it would be determined what this "one
>>>voice" says concretely!
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>I find this question one of the most critical questions we are faced with.
>>It pertains to the same problem and observation that previously led me to
>>state that IGC does not have just ONE voice. Interesting enough, you
>>(Norbert) replied the following which I don't disagree with but just wasn't
>>the issue implied by my statement.
>>
>>On Mon, Jan 26, 2015 at 3:48 PM, Norbert Bollow
>><mailto:nb at bollow.ch><nb at bollow.ch> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>On Mon, 26 Jan 2015 12:03:20 +0000
>>>Mawaki Chango <mailto:kichango at gmail.com><kichango at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>In other words, IGC which is also a CSCG member is certainly not one
>>>>voice.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>In fact, despite all its shortcomings (which include the fact that
>>>what the Charter says about enforcing the posting rules is not being
>>>done, and may in fact be impossible to do) IGC. i.e. this list, right
>>>now is still the best place to go to when desiring a broad discussion
>>>inclusive of the whole variety of civil society viewpoints.
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>So the question is How and When can IGC have a unique/common/united voice
>>(you choose your preferred adjective)?
>>Part of it is the representation-accountability dimension which seems to be
>>what you're concerned with here (and yes, while mentioning the
>>non-enforcement of posting rules in passing.) But the other big part is
>>this: What will it take for members to accept that their views, no matter
>>how strong they feel about them, may not carry the day (and they certainly
>>cannot always
>>do)
>>and still allow the group to make a decision while keeping peace and trust
>>among us? This applies to all sides of our worldview spectrum.
>>
>>In my opinion, this question cluster is the million dollars knot for IGC to
>>untie (solve) in order to be functional again.
>>
>>Mawaki
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>In particular, some kind of credible plan would be needed to prevent
>>>such a determination from being made on behalf of civil society as a
>>>whole in a way that in reality might be significantly less inclusive
>>>than it would claim to be.
>>>
>>>Greetings,
>>>Norbert
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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Seán Ó Siochrú: sean at nexus.ie tel: +353 1 272 0739 mobile: +353 87 2048150
14 Eaton Brae, Shankill, Co. Dublin, Ireland
NEXUS Research Cooperative http://www.nexus.ie/
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