[governance] Re: [discuss] Comcast undertakes 9 year IETF cosponsorship!?
Suresh Ramasubramanian
suresh at hserus.net
Sun Mar 23 09:52:40 EDT 2014
Fully agree. Which is why I am glad that parminders views are still a tiny
minority not shared by civil society in general.
On 23 March 2014 7:02:44 pm Ken Stubbs <kstubbs at afilias.info> wrote:
> Alex's response here is "spot on"
>
> Ken Stubbs
>
> On 3/23/2014 3:22 AM, Alejandro Pisanty wrote:
> > Parminder,
> >
> > this statement puts in a nutshell what never ceases to amaze me: civil
> society has gained the most among all sectors from the multistakeholder
> component of governance, be it Internet, finance, or the environment. We
> from civil society have broken silos and gained a global voice and
> unparallelled global influence, often paired with influence inside our
> countries.
> >
> > Yet the position you present reverts power to governments only - e.g.
> through the demand of public funding and the exclusion of private funding;
> the same governments most civil society is at odds with (admittedly in very
> different ways and levels.)
> >
> > I continue to find it incredibly paradoxal to have civil society leading
> the effort to braid the rope with which governments would gladly hang us.
> >
> > Another perplexing element of this discourse is calling the effective,
> open, evolvable, broadly participatory and open multistakeholder processes
> undemocratic and the multilateral and governmental "democratic", when maybe
> two thirds of the world population do not consider their condition democratic.
> >
> > The remedy to the thick suspicionism of yours and colleagues - after
> stating lack of knowledge of the organizations and matters beign spoken of
> - is not doing away with the multistakeholder component in favor of the
> governmental or multilateral, but optimizing the combined contributions
> they can make. ICANN-as-a-laboratory provides a lot of learning in this
> respect, wasted by not being studied enough. And the whole framework is
> vital for the NTIA functional substitution problem to hand, which these
> discussions have long drifted away from.
> >
> > Alejandro Pisanty
> >
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 23, 2014 at 12:59 AM, parminder <parminder at itforchange.net
> <mailto:parminder at itforchange.net>> wrote:
> >
> > This is what IETF's own RFC 3869 says
> >
> > "The principal thesis of this document is that if commercial funding
> is the main source of funding for future Internet research, the future
> of the Internet infrastructure could be in trouble.
> > In addition to issues about which projects are funded, the
> funding source can also affect the content of the research, for example,
> towards or against the development of open standards, or taking
> > varying degrees of care about the effect of the developed
> protocols on the other traffic on the Internet."
> >
> >
> > It is important to recognise that research is not a monopoly
> > function, but governance definitionally is. So, if commercial
> > funding can distort Internet research, it is but obviously that it
> > has to be an absolute no no for governance functions (standards
> > making for something as socially important today as the Internet,
> > in absence of any further neutral public oversight constitutes a
> > governance function).
> >
> > parminder
> >
> > On Sunday 23 March 2014 07:04 AM, Stephen Farrell wrote:
> >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> >> Hash: SHA1
> >>
> >>
> >> Michael,
> >>
> >> On 03/23/2014 01:23 AM, michael gurstein wrote:
> >>> I personally have no idea whether what you folks and your compadres
> >>> do/come up with is as pure as todays snowfall up on Grouse
> >>> Mountain--or not. But the absence of a recognition of what is
> >>> expected of you in terms of (at least formal) accountability and
> >>> transparency and what those expectations imply is, as I said to
> >>> John, I think a rather significant problem.
> >> Actually you said you didn't know how the IETF works.
> >>
> >> And I said that the sponsorship stuff is public. And
> >> all the mailing list traffic is public and open to all.
> >> I really think you're in the arena of FUD in terms of
> >> how your concern absolutely does not apply in the IETF
> >> context.
> >>
> >> But yet again - if you or someone is concerned go look
> >> at the facts in the public record and then come back.
> >> I am entirely sure that if something interesting were
> >> found there the IETF would discuss it to death in the
> >> same manner we do with almost everything. But I'm also
> >> pretty confident that such an examination of the IETF
> >> if done fairly would actually not show up such a problem.
> >>
> >> So the situation is that you don't know how the IETF works.
> >> And the IETF does (I claim, knowing something about it, but
> >> anyone can verify) act transparently with accountability.
> >> The problem it seems to me is with the first sentence in
> >> this paragraph.
> >>
> >> S.
> >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
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> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> discuss mailing list
> >> discuss at 1net.org <mailto:discuss at 1net.org>
> >> http://1net-mail.1net.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> >>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
> > Dr. Alejandro Pisanty
> > Facultad de Química UNAM
> > Av. Universidad 3000, 04510 Mexico DF Mexico
> > +52-1-5541444475 FROM ABROAD
> > +525541444475 DESDE MÉXICO SMS +525541444475
> > Blog: http://pisanty.blogspot.com
> > LinkedIn: http://www.linkedin.com/in/pisanty
> > Unete al grupo UNAM en LinkedIn,
> http://www.linkedin.com/e/gis/22285/4A106C0C8614
> > Twitter: http://twitter.com/apisanty
> > ---->> Unete a ISOC Mexico, http://www.isoc.org
> > . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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> > discuss at 1net.org
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>
>
>
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