[governance] The noose is closing on global Internet and other enabled tax dodging

[michael gurstein]

MSism is a method to ensure that all those with a "stake" (interest) in a
decision have an opportunity to participate in those decisions.

Good faith participation in these "deliberations" (quoting Riaz's excellent
discussion) requires that those involved be clear and open as to what their
stake/interest is in a particular deliberation. 

If a participant attempts to mask their interests (or the pursuit of its
interests) by, for example, developing mechanisms to have other of the
stakeholders surreptitiously articulate or promote these interests while
hiding that fact, that is what is normally understood as "astro-turfing"...
(as for example having supposedly CS participants/stakeholders pursuing
corporate interests rather than the public interest which is what one
assumes is their rationale for participation...

In an interest based deliberation there will necessarily and of course, be
shifting sets of alliances as some interests among some stakeholder groups
temporarily align/coincide for some purposes and in some contexts.  This is
different from the deliberate process of not being open about the interests
that one is pursuing or whose interests one is representing. 

If the shoe fits, wear it...

M

-----Original Message-----
From: governance-request at lists.igcaucus.org
[mailto:governance-request at lists.igcaucus.org] On Behalf Of Suresh
Ramasubramanian
Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2013 10:57 AM
To: governance at lists.igcaucus.org; Riaz K Tayob
Cc: governance at lists.igcaucus.org
Subject: Re: [governance] The noose is closing on global Internet and other
enabled tax dodging

I am sorry, please correct me if I am wrong, but there was some talk of
multistakeholderism.

If any action at all by a stakeholder group is continuously disparaged in
one term or the other, generally suggesting mens rea  - "astroturfing", say
- this argues that, while you accept that corporations are actors in the IG
field, you view their every action as negative and to be opposed.  Funnily
enough, that apparently extends even to actions where they might make common
cause with civil society.

--srs (iPad)

On 23-May-2013, at 13:20, Riaz K Tayob <riaz.tayob at gmail.com> wrote:

> 
> On 2013/05/22 03:23 PM, McTim wrote:
>> Indeed, there are some folk who think they can be the arbiter of who 
>> is in which SH group.
> 
> It is not a matter of who is an arbiter or not, imho.
> 
> It is about the practice of astro-turfing... wrapping up corporate
interest as public interest. In a representative system, this is not a
problem. In a deliberative system, it can be. A contest of interest may be a
means of social organisation, but that does not necessary imply it is
reasonable. A rational method does not guarantee a reasoned outcome. If
reason fails in the articulalation of a position or policy, then the
interest may be valid, but its ability to garner consensus is difficult if
deliberative, and depending on numbers easy if representative. Hence
compositional issues are important, if we are to avoid fallacy of
composition. Which is why some USers on this list may yawn when it comes to
the regulatory revolving door in the US and other places because the state
as a site for deliberative politics is in my view not fully understood.
> 
>> correct.  if we want to blame someone, let's blame the folk who wrote 
>> the current rules!
> As argued previously, yes the problem can be what is legal. Like ICANN/DOC
arrangments....
> 
> While general population gets the Sequester in the US (cutting even air
traffic controllers) big corporates get tax loopholes to fly through...
meanwhile the Banks get 'cash for trash'.
> 
> How does this relate to Internet Governance. Corporates are actors in the
IG field, thus understanding their role, and consequently seat at the MS
table is important. It may not meet some precision standards, but it is
hardly a matter that is irrelevant...
> 
> 
> 
> ____________________________________________________________
> You received this message as a subscriber on the list:
>     governance at lists.igcaucus.org
> To be removed from the list, visit:
>     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing
> 
> For all other list information and functions, see:
>     http://lists.igcaucus.org/info/governance
> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:
>     http://www.igcaucus.org/
> 
> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t



-------------- next part --------------
____________________________________________________________
You received this message as a subscriber on the list:
     governance at lists.igcaucus.org
To be removed from the list, visit:
     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing

For all other list information and functions, see:
     http://lists.igcaucus.org/info/governance
To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:
     http://www.igcaucus.org/

Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t