[governance] Have there been any statements re: PRISM from the "technical community"

[Suresh Ramasubramanian]

More worryingly, I have found neimoller's great words often sadly cheapened by dragging them into any debate at all about a government's actions.  Possibly in effect comparing said government to the evil regime that targeted him and everybody else in his poem?

--srs (iPad)

On 11-Jun-2013, at 0:03, Deirdre Williams <williams.deirdre at gmail.com> wrote:

> Dear Riaz,
> My response was intended to speak to Kerry's comment:
> 
> .... We are a community that is made up of communities. Many people have their fingers in many communities. There is a lot of overlap. Trying to reduce every conversation to sides is not useful and only causes division when we should be seeking unification and consensus.
> 
> "They" are real experts at divide and rule; if "we" allow ourselves to be divided, we will be ruled for sure.
> 
> You quote from Martin Niemoller http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Niem%C3%B6ller 
> In the context of your reply I find this a little strange, because I have always understood Niemoller's words to be one of the great human appeals to unity and solidarity and responsibility to one's fellow human beings.
> 
> Best wishes
> Deirdre
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 10 June 2013 12:29, Riaz K Tayob <riaz.tayob at gmail.com> wrote:
>> It is Sisyphean task. 
>> 
>> But please let us avoid revisionism. We need to test the veracity and politics of colleagues on this list and see if they have been justified in taking the positions they do.
>> 
>> Cream rises to the top, but crap also floats unfortunately. So let us not be too hasty in calls for unity. The wheat needs to be separated from the chaff. After all nothing like reality or evidence to do this job. After all, you all are anti-American by doing this by some definitions of the term on this list. And let us not forget that the people pushing these views have had inordinate play on this list so they have to reap what they have sown, and be graded by their perspicacity. On this issue in this space, slow is better.
>> 
>> 
>> First they came for the socialists,
>> and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a socialist.
>> 
>> Then they came for the trade unionists,
>> and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.
>> 
>> Then they came for the Jews,
>> and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.
>> 
>> Then they came for me,
>> and there was no one left to speak for me.
>> 
>> 
>>  
>> On 2013/06/10 06:50 PM, Deirdre Williams wrote:
>>> From a practical point of view this is a bad time to show fractures within the civil society group. 
>>> Many (most??) of us have formally identified ourselves as "civil society". If this means anything at all it means that we hold some values in common.
>>> If we all push together at the same boulder - who knows? - we might even be able to get it to the top of the hill without its rolling down and squashing us.
>>> Although since stone-rolling was the punishment for deceit this may not be the best image to use in the context. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sisyphus
>>> Or perhaps like Camus we "must imagine Sisyphus happy" and keep on struggling.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Myth_of_Sisyphus
>>> Deirdre
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On 10 June 2013 10:37, Kerry Brown <kerry at kdbsystems.com> wrote:
>>>> I don't know if this counts as the "technical community" but it does provide a plausible technical scenario.
>>>> 
>>>> As an aside I am really getting tired of the us vs. them conversations. We are a community that is made up of communities. Many people have their fingers in many communities. There is a lot of overlap. Trying to reduce every conversation to sides is not useful and only causes division when we should be seeking unification and consensus.
>>>> 
>>>> Kerry Brown
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>> 
>>> 
>>> -- 
>>> “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979
>> 
>> 
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> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979
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