[governance] Re: Telecom TV on Google and Taxes
Riaz K Tayob
riaz.tayob at gmail.com
Sun Dec 16 05:06:10 EST 2012
Thanks for this. +1
On 2012/12/16 02:05 AM, Jean-Louis FULLSACK wrote:
>
> + 1
>
> When I'm reading the mails on this list I'm wondering about the actual
> status of a certain number of its correspondants/members ...
>
> In "historic times", I mean dusring the WSIS process and more
> specifically its second phase, we -the CS folks- have been invaded by
> a batalion of tunesian "not really non-governemental orgs" that
> happened to sabotage our work and debates. At present there is just
> another brand of those "NR-ONG", namely those who deny state
> sovereignty and multilateralism in international governance.
>
> Best CS regards
>
> Jean-Louis Fullsack
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Message du 13/12/12 05:33
> > De : "parminder"
> > A : governance at lists.igcaucus.org
> > Copie à :
> > Objet : Re: [governance] Re: Telecom TV on Google and Taxes
> >
> >
> > Rather shameful that google paid 3 percent tax on its overseas
> profit!! It surely leaves it with a lot of money to spend in
> lobbying and advocacy efforts to keep global markets free for its
> unlettered operations... Like organising campaigns against ITU,
> German legislature, and so on.
> >
> > Would IGC write an open letter to Google that its tax evasion
> policy is anti people, and it should pays its taxes where it makes
> its profit. (Or is it that the IG civil society does not go into
> such re-distributional questions ) It is not rhetorical but a
> real question to the list, and its coordinator.
> >
> > parminder
> >
> >
> >
> On Wednesday 12 December 2012 09:37 PM, Salanieta T.
> Tamanikaiwaimaro wrote:
> >
>
> More on Bloomberg:
> http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-10/google-revenues-sheltered-in-no-tax-bermuda-soar-to-10-billion.html
> >
> >
> On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 4:48 AM, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro
> <salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com
> <mailto:salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
>
>
> >
> Somehow it feels that there is a targeted media campaign
> out against the likes of Google and other mncs - the
> timing of the release is almost impeccable with the WCIT.
>
> >
> Source:
> http://www.telecomtv.com/comspace_newsDetail.aspx?n=49763&id=e9381817-0593-417a-8639-c4c53e2a2a10
>
> >
>
>
> Google “can make money without doing evil” (as it evades
> $2bn in taxes)
>
> Posted By TelecomTV One
> <http://www.telecomtv.com/go/?ct=9&id=e9381817-0593-417a-8639-c4c53e2a2a10> ,
> 12 December 2012 | 1 Comments
> <http://www.telecomtv.com/comspace_newsDetail.aspx?n=49763&id=e9381817-0593-417a-8639-c4c53e2a2a10#comments> |
> (0)
> Tags: /Google
> <http://www.telecomtv.com/results.aspx?tag=122&tagname=Google>/
> /corporate
> <http://www.telecomtv.com/results.aspx?tag=6972&tagname=corporate>/
> /tax
> <http://www.telecomtv.com/results.aspx?tag=434&tagname=tax>/
> /Finance
> <http://www.telecomtv.com/results.aspx?tag=365&tagname=Finance>/
>
> As the net closes around the multinationals that avoid
> paying corporation taxes, Google is accused of saving $2bn
> by routing income through a “Double Irish Dutch Sandwich”,
> paying tax of just 3.2 per cent on its overseas profits.
> Guy Daniels reports.
>
> Three questions. One; where do you stand on the subject of
> tax avoidance? We at TelecomTV believe that individuals
> and corporations have a duty to pay their fair share of
> tax. By fair, we mean whatever respective governments rule
> to be the legal requirement (after all, in most countries,
> we voted the politicians in to office). By all means try
> and mitigate the amount of tax you have to pay, using
> whatever accepted mechanisms are available. But avoidance?
> That just means somebody else (with far less access to
> expensive and clever advisors) has to contribute to your
> share as well.
>
> Second question: how do you define evil? The Oxford
> English Dictionary defines evil as “profoundly immoral and
> wicked” or “something which is harmful or undesirable”. In
> my book, that means tax avoidance is evil, simple as that.
>
> Third and final question: Is Google evil? If you believe
> that avoiding tax is wrong (especially through aggressive
> and mind-boggling complicated avoidance schemes) and if
> you believe that depriving society of tax revenues is
> wrong (and so reducing the level of available State
> support for the most needy) and could be described as an
> evil act, then surely you must conclude that Google is
> acting in an evil manner.
>
> An investigative report by Bloomberg
> <http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-10/google-revenues-sheltered-in-no-tax-bermuda-soar-to-10-billion.html> has
> discovered that Google avoided about $2 billion in
> worldwide income taxes in 2011 by shifting $9.8 billion in
> revenues into a Bermuda shell company – almost double its
> total from three years ago. The information was disclosed
> in a November filing by a Google subsidiary in the
> Netherlands, which was discovered by reporters from Bloomberg.
>
> It appears that Google legally routed profits from
> overseas subsidiaries into Bermuda, which doesn’t have a
> corporate income tax, thereby enabling it to cut its
> overall tax rate almost in half. Bloomberg says the amount
> moved to Bermuda is equivalent to about 80 per cent of
> Google’s total pretax profit in 2011.
>
> Tax evasion and avoidance costs the European Union a
> staggering €1 trillion a year. That’s worth dwelling on
> for a moment longer…. €1 trillion. No wonder politicians
> are now acting to try and prevent this financial loss and
> branding such acts as scandalous and immoral.
>
> Bloomberg has a good quote from a UK-based tax accountant,
> which pretty much sums up the feeling in Europe at the
> moment. According to Richard Murphy of Tax Research:
>
> “The tax strategy of Google and other multinationals is a
> deep embarrassment to governments around Europe. The
> political awareness now being created in the UK, and to a
> lesser degree elsewhere in Europe, is: It’s us or them.
> People understand that if Google doesn’t pay, somebody
> else has to pay or services get cut.”
>
> Just look what happened to Starbucks. When the public
> discovered the US coffee giant paid zero taxes in the UK
> (yes, absolutely nothing at all), it started to boycott
> the chain.
>
> Advertisement
> As a result, Starbucks was forced to “volunteer” to pay
> taxes…
>
> The UK is Google’s second-biggest market, responsible for
> about 11 per cent of its sales. Of the $4 billion it
> turned over last year, it paid UK corporation tax of less
> than $10 million. Bloomberg says Google avoids tax by
> using an Irish subsidiary to collects revenues from ads
> sold in the UK, which then pays royalties to another Irish
> subsidiary whose legal residence is in Bermuda. Payments
> are then sent to yet another subsidiary in the Netherlands
> (with no employees, note) before finally reaching the tax
> haven of Bermuda.
>
> Sounds pretty ‘evil’ to me. And if so, then that’s against
> the internet company’s guiding principles. Stated clearly
> on the “Ten Things We Know to be True” page on Google
> <http://www.google.com/about/company/philosophy/>’s
> website is the following:
>
> “You can make money without doing evil.”
>
> I’m sorry, Google, but I don’t see how avoiding tax is
> anything but evil. Of course you – and all companies –
> have a duty to shareholders to maximise profits. But there
> are rules. Some of these are merely ethical, whilst some
> are legal. There is no indication or suggestion that
> Google has acted illegally, but there is every suggestion
> that it has acted unethically.
>
> And who said you can’t have ‘ethical companies’? Of course
> you can. I don’t buy the ‘extreme capitalist’ viewpoint
> that corporations will only act in self-interest and never
> “do the right thing” or pay their fair share. If their
> customers start to boycott their services, then they’ll
> change. It happened with the sudden emergence of all the
> so-called ‘corporate responsibility’ positions that all
> featured heavily in annual reports. I don’t see why it
> can’t happen with fair tax positions.
>
> Other ICT companies reported in the media to be using this
> complicated tax evasion (sorry lawyers, of course I mean
> ‘mitigation’…) structure include Apple, Facebook,
> Microsoft and Oracle. Unfortunately, Google – and all the
> others, who no doubt will soon be named and shamed – will
> continue their sharp practices until they are forced to
> make a change. If governments can’t do that through the
> legal process, then it’s up to customers to vote with
> their feet and walk away from Google services. As Richard
> Murphy said, consumers are beginning to get the message
> that it’s “us or them”, and we’re already being squeezed
> by the many austerity measures that are in effect to drag
> us out of recession.
>
> Come on Google, time to step up to the plate and show some
> leadership. Pay your fair share. And then the rest of the
> ICT industry can do likewise. Or else remove that fatuous
> and out-dated “don’t do evil” slogan from your website
> once and for all.
>
> Further reading: The Pearse Trust
> <http://www.pearse-trust.ie/blog/bid/86105/US-Companies-Their-Use-Of-The-Double-Irish-Dutch-Sandwich> blog
> has a detailed explanation of the so-called “Double Irish
> Dutch Sandwich” tax scheme. Please don’t try and implement it.
>
>
> >
>
> >
> --
> >
> Salanieta Tamanikaiwaimaro aka Sala
> P.O. Box 17862
> Suva
> Fiji
>
> >
> Twitter: @SalanietaT
> Skype:Salanieta.Tamanikaiwaimaro
> Tel: +679 3544828
> Fiji Cell: +679 998 2851
>
> >
>
> >
>
> >
>
>
> >
>
>
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