[governance] Themes for the coming IGFs: human rights and
Meryem Marzouki
marzouki at ras.eu.org
Fri Dec 12 04:28:54 EST 2008
Hi Divina (yes, we missed you in Hyderabad!),
Regarding labor: during WSIS, the human rights caucus has constantly
worked to maintain the indivisibility and interdependence of all
human rights, including economic and social rights. UDHR art. 23 and,
most importantly, ICESC art. 6, 7 and 8, deal with labor related
issues. Having been a co-coordinator of this caucus, I can attest
that labor rights and labor standards have constantly been mentioned
in the HR caucus documents: I, among others, cared about this. We had
trade-unions as members of the caucus but I recognize that their
involvement was far beyond the level required w.r.t. to the
fundamental transformation brought by the use of ICTs. On the other
hand, I see that CS active in the field, in its vast majority,
doesn't recognize trade unions as part of it. So, yes, they are
conspicuously absent, but this absence is also conspicuously
concomittent to the rise of the individual as _the_ CS actor (at the
expense of organized actors, not only trade unions BTW).
That being said, labor couldn't and shouldn't be discussed following
the HR approach only, as the issue encompasses major transformations,
as you pointed out, resulting from other factors, starting from
globalization, outsourcing, dematerialization of procedures and
processes, etc.
Consequently, I don't find Regis Debray's criticisms that
"reactionnary, offensive and irresponsible". I'm not a fan of Debray,
but he's not stupid, to say the least. And, while being a strong
supporter of a HR approach in CS circles, I concur with him to say
that human rights don't constitute a policy and, yes, when
politicians pretends that human rights are their sole program, we're
not far from the degree zero of politics. Politics require a vision
and a program to implement this vision. Compliance to human rights is
a framework for assessing the resulting policies and, eventually,
either accept or oppose them. And this assessment is the major CS role.
Best,
Meryem
Le 12 déc. 08 à 09:07, Divina MEIGS a écrit :
>
> Hi everybody,
>
> I don’t often contribute to this list and I hope you won’t mind my
> intervention.
>
> I would like to support a “human rights” based internet governance,
> especially in view of all the infringements of such rights today,
> in all countries, France none the least. Yesterday, during the
> celebrations of the human rights declaration, one of our
> intellectuals, Regis Debray, has criticized the human rights as the
> degree zero of politics and as a tool for politicians who have no
> ideas. I find this very reactionnary, offensive and
> irresponsible... And I think we should try to prove him wrong...
>
> There is another issue that has been bothering me for several years
> of attendance at WSIS and IGF meetings: we never talk about labour.
> And yet ICTs are affecting the way we work, the way we are paid,
> the way we are evaluated, the way we can retire and all the other
> solidarity mechanisms around employment and unemployement. I can
> see it in our universities where there is also an increasing gap
> between the way we train students and the kind of jobs they get at
> the exit... So indeed, I would like to see more involvement of the
> private sector to discuss these issues, maybe with trade unions as
> guests of honor... since they are conspicuously absent !!
>
> So let’s say that my priorities for themes for the next two IGFs
> would be=
> 1) human rights based internet governance, for 2009, as we
> could make it coincide with other celebrations around the theme ...
> and as many of us have been pushing for this issue ;
> 2) labor and internet governance, for 2010, as we should come
> to grips with the territorial consequences of virtual worlds...
>
> Sorry i missed you all in Hyderabad!
>
> Best
> Divina Frau-Meigs
>
>
> Le 12/12/08 3:17, « shaila mistry » <shailam at yahoo.com> a écrit :
>
>> Hi
>> As an Internet Bill of Rights IBR advocate I support Rights based
>> theme for the next IGF conference. In addition I also suggest we
>> encourage greater involvement from private sector, particularly
>> the small and medium business. Learning from the buisness model
>> will assist us greatly . Perhaps we could make this a sub theme :
>> lessons from the private sector model.
>>
>> I am still in Chennai...will contribute more later
>>
>> Shaila Rao Mistry
>>
>> be as a well......sure and limitless....
>> but as time befits.....assume other forms ....
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Max Senges <maxsenges at gmail.com>
>> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki
>> <marzouki at ras.eu.org>; Parminder <parminder at itforchange.net>
>> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 9:32:01 PM
>> Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs
>>
>> Hello
>>
>> I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next
>> years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and
>> Principles [1] coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach
>> to Internet Governance" as main theme.
>>
>> We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to
>> coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus.
>>
>> If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to
>> Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our
>> discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights
>>
>> best
>> max
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our
>> agenda for next weeks monthly meeting.
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki
>> <marzouki at ras.eu.org> wrote:
>>> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and
>>> one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into
>>> a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context
>>> - like, here, IG - being how.
>>>
>>> Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit :
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Meryem Marzouki wrote:
>>>>> Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit :
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ralf Bendrath wrote:
>>>>>>> As I
>>>>>>> said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put
>>>>>>> human rights
>>>>>>> up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing.
>>>>>>> "Translating
>>>>>>> and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right
>>>>>>> direction.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role
>>>>>> of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main
>>>>>> session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as
>>>>>> an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support
>>>>>> this topic for a main session.
>>>>> I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything
>>>>> else) could mean.
>>>>
>>>> I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have
>>>> concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that
>>>> all participants buy into this approach.
>>>> jeanette
>>>>
>>>> Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework
>>>>> compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or
>>>>> something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep
>>>>> the issue of access on the table, although framed
>>>>> differently.______________________________________________________
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>>
>
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