[governance] For you as an Internet user, what is a "Critical Internet resource"?

Tue Oct 2 11:58:22 EDT 2007

McTim:
You're right, the TA is vague and even sloppy on this question. 

As you point out, para 58 speaks as if CIR were something other than names and addresses. That is the worst example. 

Para 70 is more coherent. That is the EU's work. It was clear from their "enhanced cooperation" proposal during WSIS that they wanted "policy principles" for the governance of names and addresses. This is documented in their proposal. 

And, during the debate over whether to include CIR in the IGF agenda, it was clear that it meant primarily names and addresses. 

As for routing tables, that was my stab at recognizing the strong relationship between address allocation and routing, particularly route aggregation, which I'm sure you understand more or less.  

> -----Original Message-----
> From: McTim [mailto:dogwallah at gmail.com]
> Sent: Monday, October 01, 2007 5:34 PM
> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Milton L Mueller
> Cc: Paul Wilson
> Subject: Re: [governance] For you as an Internet user, what is a "Critical
> Internet resource"?
> 
> Milton,
> 
> I was hoping NOT to have to jump in on this thread, but this red flag
> is just too tempting ;-)
> 
> On 10/1/07, Milton L Mueller <mueller at syr.edu> wrote:
> > Paul:
> > Critical internet resources are the virtual resources required to
> maintain the Internet's connectivity: IP addresses, domain names, routing
> tables. The term derives from the Tunis Agenda.
> 
> Reading the TA, CIR aren't defined in it (below are all instances
> where the term "critical internet resources" appear in the TA), and
> there is certainly no mention of routing tables anywhere in the TA.
> But I am curious about their inclusion in your list, if you have a
> routing table, that implies a router, so aren't routers also a CIR
> under your definition?
> 
> "58. We recognize that Internet governance includes more than Internet
> naming and addressing. It also includes other significant public
> policy issues such as, inter alia, critical Internet resources, the
> security and safety of the Internet, and developmental aspects and
> issues pertaining to the use of the Internet."
> 
> So this seems to suggest that naming and addressing AREN'T CIR
> according to the TA!! Perhaps this is an example of "sloppy thinking"?
> 
> "70. Using relevant international organizations, such cooperation
> should include the development of globally-applicable principles on
> public policy issues associated with the coordination and management
> of critical Internet resources. In this regard, we call upon the
> organizations responsible for essential tasks associated with the
> Internet to contribute to creating an environment that facilitates
> this development of public policy principles."
> 
> Again, CIRs undefined!
> 
> and of course:
> 
> 72. j. Discuss, inter alia, issues relating to critical Internet
> resources.
> 
> >
> > (Arguably, one could include bandwidth and the relevant interconnection
> arrangements, but little is to be gained by lumping bandwidth, which falls
> under a completely different business and governance regime, with
> addressing resources. imho this is a result of sloppy thinking, which the
> Tunis Agenda often contains.)
> >
> 
> One could include many things under the umbrella of CIR, as it is
> undefined by the TA.
> 
> I know that if I am doing "bushnetworking" in Africa, I'll need:
> 
> power (truck batteries, solar panels, inverters/solar chargers,
> earthing kit, etc)
> high sites (for wireless repeaters) or a VSAT dish
> network interfaces
> Outdoor cat 5 cables, jacks
> wifi routers or high-powered cards
> a truck (with diesel) to get the kit to remote sites
> physical security
> 
> Of course the networking equipment needs port assignments (IANA)
> protocols (IANA again), IP addresses (IANA again!, but not necessarily
> a RIR), a default route/gateway, an ASN (for the whole network)
> (IANA/RIR), however, once I have those things, (plus lots of other
> stuff standardized by the IETF/W3C) I still couldn't get a connection
> to a remote site without the above list of things that need to get on
> the truck!
> 
> > I must challenge your approach to this question. You are Director
> General of an organization that allocates and assigns internet resources
> (IP addresses). The commercial Internet service providers who join your
> organization and pay rather substantial membership fees to do so, no doubt
> think these resources are critical.
> >
> 
> I must challenge your challenge.
> 
> Countries and academic institutions and other folk join APNIC as
> LIR/NIRs as well as "commercial ISPs".
> 
> RIR fees are calculated on a "cost recovery" basis, so they aren't
> "substantial" for most members. Annual fees are approximately the same
> as the costs of many, (if not most) list members expenses to the IGF.
> 
> > Are you really telling us that you do not know what we mean by "critical
> internet resources"? Or are you trying to suggest that the resources you
> allocate are not critical compared to others?
> >
> 
> I suspect it's the former, not the latter.  Since TA didn't define
> them, well they are subjective, innit?
> 
> > If it is the latter, I can see no purpose to this question other than an
> attempt to divert attention away from your own policy domain and move it
> into others. And I think that's wrong.
> >
> > Certainly telecom access and electrical power, as some other messages
> have suggested, is critical to development and to the Internet, in any
> country. Neither are "critical Internet resource" of the type invoked by
> the Tunis Agenda.
> 
> Again, TA does NOT define what is a "CIR"  If you are going to invoke
> a document, you should be sure that it says what you think it says (or
> perhaps want it to say).
> 
> >
> > If you start talking about what environmental factors are important to
> the internet, then no doubt literacy would be critical. But Paul, civil
> society didn't put you on a critical internet resources panel to discuss
> power grids or literacy. You have no expertise on that, and the UN
> Internet Governance Forum is not the appropriate place to discuss policies
> related to that.
> >
> > So my advice to you is, stick to your knitting. Be prepared to discuss
> how the policies YOU make at APNIC
> 
> So, this is what made me jump in here.  RIRs DON'T MAKE ANY POLICIES!!
>  It's not the membership of the RIR itself that make the policies,
> it's the members of the RIR communities that make the policies, this
> can include end-users, CS and gov'ts as well as the boffins who work
> for "commercial ISPs" (what you really should use in this context is
> "LIRs/NIRs", not ISPs).
> 
> Take me for example, I work with several LIRs, but don't represent any
> of them on RIR mailing lists, I represent myself.  I think that this
> is the case for many if not most participants on those lists.  These
> folk have the health and growth of the network foremost in mind when
> discussing policy, not necessarily the commercial interests of their
> employers.
> 
> > affect users, and how those policies might be improved. Don't seek
> excuses from users for not addressing those issues.
> 
> I hate to abuse a late equine, but if you want to improve those
> policies, you should join those processes.  Can you help Paul with his
> knitting?  IIRC, Ray has already invited you to join his circle.
> 
> 
> --
> Cheers,
> 
> McTim
> $ whois -h whois.afrinic.net mctim
> 
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