[governance] Are Internet users powerless or empowered, and how?
Alejandro Pisanty
apisan at servidor.unam.mx
Sat Dec 1 22:44:13 EST 2007
Dan,
great note. I fully disagree at this stage, but it sets one of the key
points of controversy starkly so I'm glad you've sent it out.
I do not think that we (who "we" anyway?) are ready to build an overall
encompassing, overarching structure for Internet governance.
I think that we are still in an early learning stage about what the
problems are, who the people who have to come together for each and
through which representation, what mechanisms, structures, weights for
each stakeholder group, etc.
It is still the time to build problem-specific mechanisms, and if needed
structures, test them, improve them, and then begin to compare features to
see if there really emerge more general patterns.
The contrary belongs too much or too closely to the "world government"
delusion.
Yours,
Alejandro Pisanty
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
Dr. Alejandro Pisanty
Director General de Servicios de Computo Academico
UNAM, Universidad Nacional Autonoma de Mexico
Av. Universidad 3000, 04510 Mexico DF Mexico
Tel. (+52-55) 5622-8541, 5622-8542 Fax 5622-8540
http://www.dgsca.unam.mx
*
---->> Unete a ISOC Mexico, www.isoc.org
Participa en ICANN, www.icann.org
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
On Sat, 1 Dec 2007, Dan Krimm wrote:
> Date: Sat, 1 Dec 2007 19:35:12 -0800
> From: Dan Krimm <dan at musicunbound.com>
> Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, Dan Krimm <dan at musicunbound.com>
> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org
> Subject: RE: [governance] Are Internet users powerless or empowered, and how?
>
> In the greater scheme of things, even confining talk to Internet "users"
> may be too narrow, as everyone in society will eventually be affected by
> the political ramifications of Internet policy, even if they are not direct
> users themselves. Secondary effects in society can be profound (such as
> whether non-users even have the chance to become users in the future, and
> whether it might be good for society for increasing numbers of people to be
> able to register their own domain names, and thus have more power to choose
> among competing service providers in the market).
>
> It is important to understand that whatever *processes* we set up to govern
> Internet policy are not confined to any specific *topics* of governance,
> and that a structure set up to govern domain name policy, for example, may
> be applied to other policies once it has established authority to govern at
> all.
>
> So, when discussing representation of political interests (including the
> political interests of the general public at large), it may be less
> effective to break down the realm of governance into topic-oriented
> sub-realms. That could allow nefarious structures to sneak in under the
> radar because they are seemingly being applied to only narrow-interest
> topics.
>
> This is a dangerous strategy, if one is trying to protect the public
> interest, because a lot of mischief can be done beyond the realm of civil
> society attention, if CS decides not to pay attention to process as it
> applies to *all* topics of Internet governance.
>
> What we are doing here is *institution building*. Once the institution is
> in place and its authority has been firmly established, its application can
> be reapplied to other topics quite widely. This is precisely why, for
> example, gTLD policy *processes* and *authoritative structures* are of
> concern to the entire general public, and not just domain name registrants.
>
> Dan
>
>
>
> At 8:49 PM -0400 12/1/07, Jacqueline A. Morris wrote:
>> Can we separate domain name owners from internet users? As George has
>> reminded us, almost ALL users will never register a domain name. So maybe we
>> can leave the domain owners issues aside for a bit and refer to the users
>> issues?
>> For example - if we talk about easy and comfortable access to content online
>> for users (the main thing that I think users want), we'd need to definitely
>> talk about native scripts and local content issues. Pricing of access is
>> also an issue - if it is unaffordable to get online, then that is definitely
>> a user issue.
>> I think that back and forth about ICANN's structure, how it should have been
>> and why what currently obtains is worse than what should/could have been is
>> far less important than on the ground issues for users.
>>
>> Jacqueline
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Karl Auerbach [mailto:karl at cavebear.com]
>>> Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 15:20
>>> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; George Sadowsky
>>> Subject: Re: [governance] Are Internet users powerless or empowered,
>>> and how?
>>>
>>> George Sadowsky wrote:
>>>
>>>> At the risk of starting yet another questionably productive thread on
>>>> this list, I have to comment on your comment below. I found it an
>>>> amazing comment, and perhaps symptomatic of why this list is not as
>>>> productive as it could be.
>>>>
>>>> 99.999% of Internet users are not drowning in powerlessness! Instead,
>>> if
>>>> they are drowning in anything, they are drowning in a sea of
>>>> extraordinarily rich information service offerings that they couldn't
>>>> have dreamed of having access to 10 years ago.
>>>
>>> The context in which I use the world "powerless" is in the context of
>>> existing and future bodies of internet governance.
>>>
>>> For example, yes, we users have great power in the marketplace to
>>> select
>>> ISP's and the like.
>>>
>>> But we users have virtually no voice in the body that extracts over
>>> half
>>> a billion dollars (US$) out of the pockets of domain name buyers every
>>> year and, at the same, time subjects us to the kangaroo court system of
>>> the UDRP and the privacy-busting Whois.
>>>
>>> The fear and concern that I am expressing is that in bodies of internet
>>> governance - and remember a body of governance is a body that exercises
>>> a near plenary form of power - that in these bodies, current and
>>> present, internet users are denied the means to hold that body, and the
>>> decision makers within it, accountable for its actions.
>>>
>>> In other words, my intent is the word "powerless" is interpreted in the
>>> context of bodies of governance.
>>>
>>> --karl--
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