[bestbits] Delivery of International civil society letter to Congress to follow up from HRC statement
parminder
parminder at itforchange.net
Thu Jun 13 12:14:18 EDT 2013
I am happy to accept Gene's amendment, but Kevin's goes too far. will
justify my comment in a short while... parminder
Kevin, If you ask me, I believe that the collection of
On Thursday 13 June 2013 09:34 PM, Kevin Bankston wrote:
> I strongly support the general sentiment that Parminder is seeking to
> add. For what it's worth, here's a post that I and my colleague Emily
> wrote yesterday on the same point, urging our domestic audience and
> policymakers to pay more attention to the international/human rights
> implications, entitled "It's not just about US: How the NSA Threatens
> Human Rights Internationally":
>
> https://www.cdt.org/blogs/1206it%E2%80%99s-not-just-about-us-how-nsa-threatens-human-rights-internationally
>
> However, I think it's worth noting at this point that because of the
> various company denials (some of them quite strenuous and clear),
> because of the Washington Post stepping back from some of its
> reporting, and because of conflicting reports in other major news
> outlets like the New York Times and Wired, we actually *do not know*
> how broad the data collection being done via "PRISM" under the FISA
> Amendments Act actually is; in other words, we have no idea whether or
> how proportionate it is. It very well might be incredibly broad,
> which is certainly my fear; it may also be more targeted than we
> suspect. Meanwhile, the other conduct that's been exposed--the
> disclosure of phone records--was in regard to calls made to or from or
> inside the US. So, for that reason, I agree with Gene that it would
> be preferable that we have a little wiggle room--we actually *don't
> know* that there has been "large scale" access to non-US persons
> content at this point, even if we strongly suspect it. Furthermore,
> no one has said there was "no access obtained to content related to US
> citizens"; they've simply said (which is BS) "no one's listening to
> your calls", in reference to the PATRIOT 215 order for phone records.
> So, I'd suggest editing Parminder's suggestion into something like...
>
> "We are extremely disappointed that, in the wake of the latest
> disclosures, statements by the US government have focused solely on
> assuring the American people that their privacy rights have been
> respected. The right to privacy against overreaching government
> surveillance is a human right. Human rights are universal, belonging
> to all people regardless of nationality, and every government must
> refrain from violating them for all people, and not merely for its
> citizens. The US government's current and future surveillance law and
> practice must reflect this reality and respect everyone's human rights."
> ____________________________________
> Kevin S. Bankston
> Senior Counsel and Free Expression Director
> Center for Democracy & Technology
> 1634 I St NW, Suite 1100
> Washington, DC 20006
> 202.407.8834 direct
> 202.637.0968 fax
> kbankston at cdt.org
>
> Follow CDT on Twitter at @cendemtech
>
> On Jun 13, 2013, at 11:16 AM, Anja Kovacs <anja at internetdemocracy.in>
> wrote:
>
>> +1 on Parminder's additional suggested paragraph, though in its
>> original form (certainly many of us feel our rights have been
>> violated, not sure we should leave it up to the US government to
>> decide whehter or not that has indeed happened...).
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Anja
>>
>>
>> On 13 June 2013 20:02, michael gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com
>> <mailto:gurstein at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> I can take a look for style and grammar… Just alert me when there
>> is a "finalized" text… I'm out and about all day today so won't
>> likely get to in until tonight (East coast Canada time) or
>> tomorrow morning.
>>
>> M
>>
>> *From:*bestbits-request at lists.bestbits.net
>> <mailto:bestbits-request at lists.bestbits.net>
>> [mailto:bestbits-request at lists.bestbits.net
>> <mailto:bestbits-request at lists.bestbits.net>] *On Behalf Of
>> *Carolina Rossini
>> *Sent:* Thursday, June 13, 2013 10:16 AM
>> *To:* parminder
>> *Cc:* bestbits at lists.bestbits.net
>> <mailto:bestbits at lists.bestbits.net>
>>
>>
>> *Subject:* Re: [bestbits] Delivery of International civil society
>> letter to Congress to follow up from HRC statement
>>
>> I like parminder suggestions on non-US citizens.
>>
>> I also agree with suggestion on delivering this on Monday.
>>
>> Who could take a final look for style and grammar? Much of it was
>> lost during the editing process. I can try, but it would be
>> better if a native english speaker take the lead on the final round.
>>
>> Carol
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 10:08 AM, parminder
>> <parminder at itforchange.net <mailto:parminder at itforchange.net>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> The statement has turned out well. However, I remain concerned
>> about the fact that the issue of non citizens related content
>> surveillance has not at all been addressed by the US authorities.
>> They havent bothered to say a word on it (not that it is easily
>> defensible). I would like the group to consider adding the
>> following paragraph somewhere......
>>
>> "We are extremely disappointed that, in all the post
>> 'disclosures' statements, US authorities have only insisted that
>> there was no access obtained to content related to /US citizens/,
>> and just their communication meta-data was collected. There has
>> not been a word on the issue of large-scale access to content
>> related to non US citizens, which is a violation of their human
>> rights. The focussing of the US authorities on the difference
>> between treatment of US citizens and non-citizens on an issue
>> which essentially relates to violation of human rights is very
>> problematic. Human rights are universal, and every government
>> must refrain from violating them for all people, and not merely
>> for its citizens. The current and future US law and practices on
>> this matter should take note of this. "
>>
>>
>> I still have issues with the role of the involved companies,
>> which I will address in a separate email. I am fine though to
>> address them separately, through a possible second statement.
>>
>> Meanwhile the second sentence in the following somehow looks not
>> quite right.
>>
>> "The introduction ofuntargeted surveillance mechanisms at the
>> heart of global digital communications severely threatens human
>> rights in the digital age. */These new forms of decentralized
>> power reflect fundamental shifts in the structure of information
>> systems in modern societies./* [3] and aAny step in this
>> direction needs to be scrutinized through ample, deep and
>> transparent debate. Interference with the human rights of
>> citizens by any government, their own or foreign, is unacceptable."
>>
>> What is being referred to as a 'form of decentralised power'?
>> From the reference I take it, it is about 'arab spring' kind of
>> people's power, but that doesnt look clear from the way the
>> sentence is wedged between the other two sentences...
>>
>>
>> parminder
>>
>> On Thursday 13 June 2013 05:11 PM, Anja Kovacs wrote:
>>
>> Also, in response to Parminder's questions: while we had
>> agreed from the beginning that the focus of this particular
>> statement would be the US Congress, I feel (and I just reread
>> it to check) that it does foreground the concerns of non-US
>> citizens/resident (as it was meant to do in my reading as
>> well). Parminder, do you really feel that doesn't come out at
>> all? In that case, we do have some more work to do....
>>
>> On 13 June 2013 16:28, Anja Kovacs <anja at internetdemocracy.in
>> <mailto:anja at internetdemocracy.in>> wrote:
>>
>> Anriette, is there a strong reason why you feel we should
>> release this tomorrow already? My inclination would be to
>> agree with Nnenna and others and to wait until Monday, but
>> would be keen to know why you feel tomorrow is a better idea.
>>
>> On 13 June 2013 14:37, Nnenna Nwakanma <nnenna75 at gmail.com
>> <mailto:nnenna75 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi people
>>
>> I will say submit on Monday. When you kick off the week
>> with it, you will have ample time to rave up media attention
>> on it..
>>
>> I am hoping Mandela does not give up the fight.. because that
>> will overshadow any other Internet news...
>>
>> I am booked for the very first Africa Internet Summit in
>> Lusaka next week. I do hope to be able to draw attention to
>> the statement, as well as some that have been made by Best Bits.
>>
>> Best of the day..
>>
>> Nnenna
>>
>> On Thu, Jun 13, 2013 at 8:51 AM, Anriette Esterhuysen
>> <anriette at apc.org <mailto:anriette at apc.org>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> Hash: SHA1
>>
>> Greetings everyone
>>
>> Content is coming along well.
>>
>> Jeremy, in response to your question, what about giving
>> people until
>> 21h00 GMT/UTC today, Thursday. Then you can close the text,
>> finalise it,
>> and release for sign-ons and give people until 16h00 GMT/UTC
>> Friday for
>> sign ons and then we can send it off before the end of the
>> business day
>> in Washington DC (will be 12h00 in DC).
>>
>> That will accommodate Parminder's request, but still enable
>> us to get
>> enough sign ons and get the letter to Washington DC on
>> Friday. Only
>> region that will have a shortish period for sign ons will be
>> the Americas.
>>
>> Will this work?
>>
>> Anriette
>>
>>
>> On 13/06/2013 08:13, Jeremy Malcolm wrote:
>>
>>
>> - --
>> - ------------------------------------------------------
>> anriette esterhuysen anriette at apc.org <mailto:anriette at apc.org>
>> executive director, association for progressive communications
>> www.apc.org <http://www.apc.org/>
>> po box 29755, melville 2109
>> south africa
>> tel/fax +27 11 726 1692 <tel:%2B27%2011%20726%201692>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Dr. Anja Kovacs
>> The Internet Democracy Project
>>
>> +91 9899028053 <tel:%2B91%209899028053> | @anjakovacs
>> www.internetdemocracy.in <http://www.internetdemocracy.in/>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Dr. Anja Kovacs
>> The Internet Democracy Project
>>
>> +91 9899028053 <tel:%2B91%209899028053> | @anjakovacs
>> www.internetdemocracy.in <http://www.internetdemocracy.in/>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> *Carolina Rossini*
>>
>> http://carolinarossini.net/
>>
>> + 1 6176979389
>> *carolina.rossini at gmail.com <mailto:carolina.rossini at gmail.com>*
>>
>> skype: carolrossini
>>
>> @carolinarossini
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Dr. Anja Kovacs
>> The Internet Democracy Project
>>
>> +91 9899028053 | @anjakovacs
>> www.internetdemocracy.in <http://www.internetdemocracy.in/>
>
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