[governance] Reviving IGC: Merging Bestbits in, IGF Day zero event and other subjects

Jeanette hofmann jeanette at wzb.eu
Wed Jul 17 16:26:15 EDT 2019


I asked myself the same question. Is there more than a handful of people 
who are members of bestbits but not of the caucus?
And also, whether we vote now or in a month or two, does this really 
matter?
No issue seems trivial enough to cause yet another pointless fight on 
this list...
jeanette

Am 17.07.19 um 22:03 schrieb david_allen_ab63 at post.harvard.edu:
> What are the grounds – the evidence – for thinking there is some large 
> group of BestBits adherents who have not previously also joined IGC? 
>   Indeed, the expectation is that many came from IGC, are still here. 
>   Or, also joined iGC, because was felt important to see the IGC 
> discussions too.
> 
> And these deliberations re BestBits' denouement have been gong on for 
> months, perhaps well over half a year now.
> 
> All this would tend in the direction: That there could be a few who may 
> not have also joined IGC.  But the likelihood seems that there is 
> _unlikely_ to be a large group outstanding.
> 
> One could say:  See if there is some large number joining in the next, 
> say, week.  If not, when some joint BB member here alerts BB, then the 
> matter would seem to be moot.
> 
> And the charter could be honored for a change.
> 
> With, decidedly, more voting than supposed earlier below.
> 
> David
> 
> 
>> On Jul 17, 2019, at 3:28 PM, Bruna Martins dos Santos 
>> <bruna.mrtns at gmail.com <mailto:bruna.mrtns at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Dear David,
>>
>> Thank you very much for your reply! If at my email it sounded as if im 
>> questioning the need for elections, let me be clear: I am not against 
>> it and happen to think its past overdue. Last IGC elections were 
>> conducted in 2017 and I agree with everyone who highlighted that we 
>> should have done it already instead of allowing for one of the 
>> Co-Coordinators term to expire. But at the same time, the list was 
>> facing some other issues related to website, server and so on. So I 
>> take part of the fault for not kickstarting elections before.
>>
>> The concern here is the timing of it and if whether or not we are 
>> giving it a little time for new members to be able to vote. I think 
>> both sides have very good arguments and it would be great if we could 
>> discuss it more openly either here or at the call.
>>
>> Best,
>> Bruna Santos
>>
>> Le mer. 17 juil. 2019 à 16:18, <david_allen_ab63 at post.harvard.edu 
>> <mailto:david_allen_ab63 at post.harvard.edu>> a écrit :
>>
>>     — inline —
>>
>>>     On Jul 17, 2019, at 8:39 AM, Bruna Martins dos Santos (via
>>>     governance Mailing List) <governance at lists.riseup.net
>>>     <mailto:governance at lists.riseup.net>> wrote:
>>>
>>>     ...
>>>
>>>      I am afraid that if we open elections now there would be only
>>>     arsene, Parminder, Sheetal, Ian and Yourself voting - considering
>>>     the charter requirements to be a voting member - is that
>>>     legitimate ? 
>>
>>     Most decidedly not the case.  Whether folks post, they are out here.
>>
>>     Check the membership (listserve) list.  They are out here.
>>
>>     Need to be respected.  Via terms of the charter.  There is one.
>>
>>     David
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>     ...
>>>
>>>
>>>     Best Regards,
>>>     Bruna Santos
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>     Le mer. 17 juil. 2019 à 09:28, "Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro"
>>>     <governance at lists.riseup.net
>>>     <mailto:governance at lists.riseup.net>> a écrit :
>>>
>>>         I will not apologise for the incompetence shown by the
>>>         coordinators.
>>>         The Charter clearly states that revisions made can only be
>>>         voted on by those that participate in last held elections.
>>>         Arsene no longer is coordinator and this term ended last
>>>         January by virtue of Charter.
>>>
>>>         Get on with the elections!
>>>
>>>         On Wed, 17 Jul 2019, 11:57 am Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro,
>>>         <salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com
>>>         <mailto:salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>             What a load of rubbish!
>>>             The elections need to take place asap.
>>>             The preparations for the IGF can continue simultaneously.
>>>
>>>
>>>             Get it together!
>>>
>>>             On Wed, 17 Jul 2019, 11:37 am Sheetal Kumar,
>>>             <sheetal at gp-digital.org <mailto:sheetal at gp-digital.org>>
>>>             wrote:
>>>
>>>                 Dear all,
>>>
>>>                 I'm happy to be part of a leadership or steering
>>>                 group, if everyone is ok with that. Apart from Bruna,
>>>                 I would also suggest that Farzaneh is involved in
>>>                 such a group if she can be.
>>>
>>>                 And thank you Arsene for your help and efforts so
>>>                 far, much appreciated.
>>>
>>>                 Best
>>>                 Sheetal.
>>>
>>>                 On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 at 11:29, Arsène Tungali
>>>                 <arsenebaguma at gmail.com
>>>                 <mailto:arsenebaguma at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>                     Thanks for sharing that, Ian.
>>>
>>>                     I really don't see a point of having elections
>>>                     now in the middle of an
>>>                     important process that we all look forward to. I
>>>                     think we should aim
>>>                     at concluding this by the end of the year, at the
>>>                     latest so that
>>>                     January 2020, we have everything in place? IGF is
>>>                     in November, we
>>>                     should be sufficiently advanced by then because
>>>                     that's the only big
>>>                     physical gathering for most of us here for the
>>>                     year and then comes
>>>                     holidays in December. All major discussions (and
>>>                     decisions?) should be
>>>                     taken by Berlin?
>>>
>>>                     If the list is happy, I am stepping down (i know
>>>                     I should have done
>>>                     this long time ago but if you have been
>>>                     following, I have only been
>>>                     doing my best to help out here) and will no
>>>                     longer take an official
>>>                     position here. I remain a member and will leave
>>>                     it to Bruna who is
>>>                     still a legitimate Co-coordinator, I believe, and
>>>                     Sheetal who has been
>>>                     leading this process (merger, etc). Can we trust
>>>                     at least the two
>>>                     individuals to lead us to a new IGC in the next
>>>                     few months?
>>>
>>>                     This said, from now on, I will be acting as a
>>>                     member so please
>>>                     consider my emails not as a Co-coordinator but a
>>>                     member.
>>>
>>>                     I hope this helps.
>>>
>>>                     Regards,
>>>                     Arsene
>>>
>>>                     2019-07-17 12:18 UTC+02:00,ian.peter at ianpeter.com
>>>                     <mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com><ian.peter at ianpeter.com
>>>                     <mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com>>:
>>>                     > Thanks for that update Arsene.
>>>                     >
>>>                     > If you are adopting a new charter as well as
>>>                     everything else you
>>>                     > mention, it looks to me like a long drawn out
>>>                     process which will go well
>>>                     > into 2020. That may well be the best path
>>>                     forward, but I think in the
>>>                     > circumstances it would be appropriate for this
>>>                     list to endorse a
>>>                     > leadership group who will guide this process
>>>                     forward. I would like to
>>>                     > feel that a step has been taken to ensure the
>>>                     list is happy with the
>>>                     > directions being discussed and agreeable to a
>>>                     leadership group taking it
>>>                     > forward.
>>>                     >
>>>                     > That would add a lot of credibiity IMHO.
>>>                     >
>>>                     > I won't be joining the call, but I think it is
>>>                     very important that it
>>>                     > reports back to here, as Parminder and others
>>>                     have mentioned, and that
>>>                     > steps forward are discussed here on list and
>>>                     endorsed.
>>>                     >
>>>                     > Ian Peter
>>>                     > ------ Original Message ------
>>>                     > From: "Arsène Tungali"
>>>                     <governance at lists.riseup.net
>>>                     <mailto:governance at lists.riseup.net>>
>>>                     > To: "Sheetal Kumar" <sheetal at gp-digital.org
>>>                     <mailto:sheetal at gp-digital.org>>
>>>                     > Cc: "ian.peter at ianpeter.com
>>>                     <mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com>"
>>>                     <ian.peter at ianpeter.com
>>>                     <mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com>>; "Salanieta T.
>>>                     > Tamanikaiwaimaro"
>>>                     <salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com
>>>                     <mailto:salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com>>;
>>>                     "Parminder"
>>>                     > <parminder at itforchange.net
>>>                     <mailto:parminder at itforchange.net>>; "governance"
>>>                     <governance at lists.riseup.net
>>>                     <mailto:governance at lists.riseup.net>>
>>>                     > Sent: 17/07/2019 7:55:02 PM
>>>                     > Subject: Re: [governance] Reviving IGC: Merging
>>>                     Bestbits in, IGF Day
>>>                     > zero event and other subjects
>>>                     >
>>>                     >>Good point, Sheetal and I agree with you.
>>>                     >>
>>>                     >>I had briefly discussed the election issue with
>>>                     Bruna during the last
>>>                     >>ICANN meeting and we agreed that the best time
>>>                     to conduct co-co
>>>                     >>elections is right after the merger step is
>>>                     completed, the new charter
>>>                     >>has been adopted and we have a unified list. I
>>>                     am sure Bruna was
>>>                     >>planning to report this to the list at some
>>>                     point, but here you are.
>>>                     >>
>>>                     >>I would suggest we all plan to attend the call
>>>                     and agree on next steps.
>>>                     >>
>>>                     >>Regards,
>>>                     >>Arsene
>>>                     >>
>>>                     >>2019-07-17 11:44 UTC+02:00, Sheetal Kumar
>>>                     <sheetal at gp-digital.org
>>>                     <mailto:sheetal at gp-digital.org>>:
>>>                     >>>  Dear all,
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>>  While the closure of Bestbits is an internal
>>>                     matter for Bestbits, we
>>>                     >>> have
>>>                     >>>  agreed for it to be closed and so I'd say
>>>                     any IGC conversations need to
>>>                     >>>  take that into account. We're at that point
>>>                     where the closure has been
>>>                     >>>  agreed but there are still people on
>>>                     Bestbits who are not on IGC but
>>>                     >>> likely
>>>                     >>>  will sign up to be part of the discussions soon.
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>>  As such, shouldn't we wait for those from
>>>                     Bestbits who want to join to
>>>                     >>> join
>>>                     >>>  and we can then get the IGC coordinator
>>>                     elections going? The call to
>>>                     >>> agree
>>>                     >>>  next steps and make sure everyone is on the
>>>                     same page is going to be
>>>                     >>> w/c
>>>                     >>>  August 5.
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>>  Best
>>>                     >>>  Sheetal
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>>  On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 at
>>>                     06:29,ian.peter at ianpeter.com
>>>                     <mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com>
>>>                     >>>  <ian.peter at ianpeter.com
>>>                     <mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com>>
>>>                     >>>  wrote:
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>>>  Bruna,
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>>  On a more substantive matter -
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>>  Can you also advise us on how progress is
>>>                     going as regards getting the
>>>                     >>>>  IGC
>>>                     >>>>  Coordinator elections (which were due last
>>>                     January) underway? On June
>>>                     >>>> 26
>>>                     >>>>  you advised the list that you. would be
>>>                     talking to Arsene and would
>>>                     >>>> get
>>>                     >>>>  back to the list ASAP.  Do you have an update?
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>>  Ian Peter
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>>  ------ Original Message ------
>>>                     >>>>  From: "Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro"
>>>                     <governance at lists.riseup.net
>>>                     <mailto:governance at lists.riseup.net>>
>>>                     >>>>  To: "Parminder" <parminder at itforchange.net
>>>                     <mailto:parminder at itforchange.net>>
>>>                     >>>>  Cc: "governance"
>>>                     <governance at lists.riseup.net
>>>                     <mailto:governance at lists.riseup.net>>
>>>                     >>>>  Sent: 17/07/2019 2:14:13 PM
>>>                     >>>>  Subject: Re: [governance] Reviving IGC:
>>>                     Merging Bestbits in, IGF Day
>>>                     >>>> zero
>>>                     >>>>  event and other subjects
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>>  Agree with Parminder.
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>>  On Wed, 17 Jul 2019, 5:11 am parminder,
>>>                     <parminder at itforchange.net
>>>                     <mailto:parminder at itforchange.net>>
>>>                     >>>>  wrote:
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  HI Bruna/ All
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  Good morning to all!
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  Bestbits' merging into the IGC is their
>>>                     internal matter.
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  As for a day zero event at the IGF for the
>>>                     IGC, when do you plan
>>>                     >>>>> it...
>>>                     >>>>>  Just Net Coalition has an event post lunch
>>>                     on day zero, and please
>>>                     >>>>>  ensure
>>>                     >>>>>  that these do not clash. Thanks.
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  While as a secondary or adjunct method
>>>                     call based discussions can be
>>>                     >>>>>  done
>>>                     >>>>>  among however wishes to do so, the charter
>>>                     clearly says that the main
>>>                     >>>>>  and
>>>                     >>>>>  authoritative space of IGC's work will be
>>>                     this e-list, which I
>>>                     >>>>> request
>>>                     >>>>>  everyone's attention to.
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  thanks and best regards
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  parminder
>>>                     >>>>>  On 17/07/19 7:32 AM, Bruna Martins dos
>>>                     Santos (via governance Mailing
>>>                     >>>>>  List) wrote:
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  Dear IGC members,
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  As some of you might be aware, there has
>>>                     been some discussions around
>>>                     >>>>>  the
>>>                     >>>>>  merger of BestBits and IGC going on for
>>>                     the past months.
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  Back in Tunis, @RightsCon
>>>                     <rightscon at accessnow.org
>>>                     <mailto:rightscon at accessnow.org>>, some of us
>>>                     >>>>> convened
>>>                     >>>>>  to discuss further steps for Civil Society
>>>                     Coordination and that also
>>>                     >>>>>  entailed the merger debate. The summary of
>>>                     the discussion, as well as
>>>                     >>>>>  the
>>>                     >>>>>  decision on closing BestBits can all be
>>>                     found at the BestBits list
>>>                     >>>>> 
>>>                     <http://lists.bestbits.net/arc/bestbits/2019-07/msg00001.html>.
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  Past this moment, theres a need to arrange
>>>                     a call to discuss our next
>>>                     >>>>>  steps, including a Day Zero Event at the
>>>                     IGF, later in November.
>>>                     >>>>> Another
>>>                     >>>>>  agenda items are also reviving the IGC
>>>                     website, IGC co-coordinators
>>>                     >>>>>  elections and our charter. Additionally to
>>>                     IGC related subjects,
>>>                     >>>>> there
>>>                     >>>>>  is
>>>                     >>>>>  also the need to discuss a proper closure
>>>                     for BestBits, as well as
>>>                     >>>>>  proper
>>>                     >>>>>  outreach in a transparent way and the
>>>                     possibility for members to join
>>>                     >>>>>  IGC.
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  For this reason, @Sheetal Kumar
>>>                     <sheetal at gp-digital.org
>>>                     <mailto:sheetal at gp-digital.org>> created this
>>>                     >>>>>  doodle for all interested members to
>>>                     indicate their availability for
>>>                     >>>>> the
>>>                     >>>>>  call:https://doodle.com/poll/fy4mgf68qehhhh26
>>>                     >>>>>  <https://doodle.com/poll/fy4mgf68qehhhh26>
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  Best Regards,
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  --
>>>                     >>>>>  *Bruna Martins dos Santos *
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  Skype ID: bruna.martinsantos
>>>                     >>>>>  @boomartins
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  ---
>>>                     >>>>>  To unsubscribe:
>>>                     <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net
>>>                     <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net>>
>>>                     >>>>>  <igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net
>>>                     <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net>>
>>>                     >>>>>  List help: <https://riseup.net/lists>
>>>                     <https://riseup.net/lists>
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>>  ---
>>>                     >>>>>  To unsubscribe:
>>>                     <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net
>>>                     <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net>>
>>>                     >>>>>  List help: <https://riseup.net/lists>
>>>                     >>>>>
>>>                     >>>>  ---
>>>                     >>>>  To unsubscribe:
>>>                     <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net
>>>                     <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net>>
>>>                     >>>>  List help: <https://riseup.net/lists>
>>>                     >>>>
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>>  --
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>>  *Sheetal Kumar*
>>>                     >>>  Programme Lead | GLOBAL PARTNERS DIGITAL
>>>                     >>>  Second Home, 68-80 Hanbury Street, London,
>>>                     E1 5JL
>>>                     >>>  T: +44 (0)20 3 818 3258| M: +44 (0)7739569514  |
>>>                     >>>  PGP ID: E592EFBBEAB1CF31  | PGP Fingerprint:
>>>                     F5D5 114D 173B E9E2 0603
>>>                     >>> DD7F
>>>                     >>>  E592 EFBB EAB1 CF31|
>>>                     >>>
>>>                     >>
>>>                     >>
>>>                     >>--
>>>                     >>------------------------
>>>                     >>**Arsène Tungali* <http://about.me/ArseneTungali>*
>>>                     >>Co-Founder & Executive Director, *Rudi
>>>                     international
>>>                     >><http://www.rudiinternational.org
>>>                     <http://www.rudiinternational.org/>>*,
>>>                     >>CEO,* Smart Services Sarl
>>>                     <https://www.smart-kitoko.com/>*,
>>>                     >>Tel: +243 993810967 (DRC)
>>>                     >>GPG: 523644A0
>>>                     >>
>>>                     >>2015 Mandela Washington Fellow
>>>                     >><
>>>                     >>http://tungali.blogspot.com/2015/06/selected-for-2015-mandela-washington.html>
>>>                     >>
>>>                     >>(YALI) - ICANN GNSO Council Member
>>>                     >><https://gnso.icann.org/en/about/gnso-council.htm>
>>>                     Member. UN IGF MAG
>>>                     >><https://www.un.org/press/en/2018/pi2247.doc.htm>
>>>                     Member
>>>
>>>
>>>                     --
>>>                     ------------------------
>>>                     **Arsène Tungali* <http://about.me/ArseneTungali>*
>>>                     Co-Founder & Executive Director, *Rudi international
>>>                     <http://www.rudiinternational.org
>>>                     <http://www.rudiinternational.org/>>*,
>>>                     CEO,* Smart Services Sarl
>>>                     <https://www.smart-kitoko.com/>*,
>>>                     Tel: +243 993810967 (DRC)
>>>                     GPG: 523644A0
>>>
>>>                     2015 Mandela Washington Fellow
>>>                     <
>>>                     http://tungali.blogspot.com/2015/06/selected-for-2015-mandela-washington.html>
>>>
>>>                     (YALI) - ICANN GNSO Council Member
>>>                     <https://gnso.icann.org/en/about/gnso-council.htm> Member.
>>>                     UN IGF MAG
>>>                     <https://www.un.org/press/en/2018/pi2247.doc.htm>
>>>                     Member
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>                 --
>>>
>>>                 **
>>>                 *
>>>                 *
>>>                 *Sheetal Kumar*
>>>                 Programme Lead | GLOBAL PARTNERS DIGITAL
>>>                 Second Home, 68-80 Hanbury Street, London, E1 5JL
>>>                 T: +44 (0)20 3 818 3258| M: +44 (0)7739569514  |
>>>                 PGP ID: E592EFBBEAB1CF31 |PGP Fingerprint: F5D5 114D
>>>                 173B E9E2 0603 DD7F E592 EFBB EAB1 CF31|
>>>
>>>         ---
>>>         To unsubscribe: <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net
>>>         <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net>>
>>>         List help: <https://riseup.net/lists>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>     --
>>>     */Bruna Martins dos Santos /*
>>>
>>>     Skype ID: bruna.martinsantos
>>>     @boomartins
>>>     ---
>>>     To unsubscribe: <mailto:igc-unsubscribe at lists.riseup.net>
>>>     List help: <https://riseup.net/lists>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> */Bruna Martins dos Santos /*
>>
>> Skype ID: bruna.martinsantos
>> @boomartins
> 
> 
> ---
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> 


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