[First draft] Letter to Pres. Rousseff Re: [bestbits] [governance] Dilma Rousseff's speech at UN

Wed Sep 25 20:09:06 EDT 2013

Joana, cara mia, great work as always.

[] fraterno

--c.a.

On 09/25/2013 08:40 PM, Joana Varon wrote:
> Dear Avri et all,
> 
> By now the letter looks like this:
> 
> https://pad.riseup.net/p/IGC-Supports-Brazil
> 
> Please, bring your inputs to make it sound more international.
> 
> We haven't set a time frame to close the drafting and start to collect
> endorsements, but there is this opportunity that Carlos Afonso has
> mentioned to deliver it in person (Carlos,please, allow me to quote you
> again within these two lists):
> 
> "It would be *extremely important* to have it *ready by tomorrow late night
> *(it can be very late in the night -- I am not really sleeping these
> days)*Brazilian time
> * so I can print it and try and deliver it to the Presidenta's hands (or
> her closest advisors)." (wrote 7 hours ago).
> 
> Depending on what you think about this current draft, it might be feasible
> to have endorsements by tomorrow night.
> 
> Let's try to close the drafting process tomorrow at 09:00am (Brazilian
> time) and have the whole afternoon to collect signatures within
> Europe/Asia/Africa and the day to do so within the Americas?
> 
> Sorry for the rush. I'm just trying to follow all the suggestions received
> in different threads as coherently as possible.
> 
> best
> 
> joana
> 
> 
> 
> On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 9:27 PM, Avri Doria <avri at acm.org> wrote:
> 
>> Hi,
>>
>> While I cannot accept any plan that is dominated by States and their
>> multilateral closed club, I don't think that the letter necessarily must be
>> read that way.
>>
>> She does say:
>>
>>> 2 - Open, multilateral and democratic governance, carried out with
>> transparency by stimulating
>>> collective creativity and the participation of society, Governments and
>> the private sector.
>>
>> And while this is not quite yet an endorsement of the fully participatory
>> democracy I hope MSism leads to, it does seem to aim that way.
>>
>> Yes, is it still top down, as the governments will be stimulating the
>> people as opposed to the people simulating the government, but there are
>> other sentiments that do warrant support.
>>
>> As long as civil society does not bind itself to government leadership by
>> buying into a multilateral vision, I suppose it is possible to come up with
>> something that could get some sort of support.
>>
>> But in one day as Carlos asks?
>>
>> avri
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On 25 Sep 2013, at 13:04, McTim wrote:
>>
>>> <cc list trimmed>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Sep 25, 2013 at 12:45 PM, michael gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>> The Brazil statement is I think, an excellent including the references
>> in
>>>> the context of governance to MLism rather than to MSism given the
>> ambiguity
>>>> and bad faith which can be ascribed to many of the particular uses (and
>>>> users) of the latter terminology/methodology.
>>>>
>>>> The multilateral system has earned its spurs if nothing else through the
>>>> UNDHR and the work of such agencies as the WHO and UNICEF and in their
>> times
>>>> the UNDP and UNESCO.
>>>>
>>>> The quite evidently subverted MSism of the Internet may by my reckoning
>> at
>>>> this moment be something of a poisoned challice (if nothing else
>> through the
>>>> potentially questionable motives (and ideologies) of its most ardent
>>>> governmental and other backers) and we await its redemption through the
>>>> (possible) mounting of a suitable response post-Snowden.
>>>
>>> MSism needs no "redemption".  Just because one supporter of it got
>>> caught doing dodgy things does not somehow tar the entire structure of
>>> Internet policy making that has been built over decades.
>>>
>>> I for one would object quite strongly to the Caucus supporting MLism
>>> over MSism.  I think it was a fine speech but if we are going to write
>>> a letter of support, we should note that we have always supported
>>> MSism.
>>>
>>> If you want a global treaty to stop governments from spying on
>>> everything we do online, I think it foolish to leave it in the hands
>>> of governments only!
>>>
>>> --
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> McTim
>>> "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A
>>> route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel
>>>
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>>
>>
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> 
> 

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