[governance] Re: Re [bestbits] [africs-ig] Civil Society speaker: IGF Opening ceremony - Nnenna

Walid AL-SAQAF admin at alkasir.com
Tue Oct 22 00:38:07 EDT 2013 

Hi ,

Although I didn't attend the same session you did, I noticed this in other
IGF sessions. I guess there is much more work required for more
representatives from developing countries.

Sincerely,

Walid Al-Saqaf
ISOC-Yemen
On Oct 22, 2013 12:24 PM, "parminder" <parminder at itforchange.net> wrote:

>  As I sit in the 'role of govs' main session, I see no reason really why
> three people in 'positions' here  - panel or as moderators - from civil
> society - one speaker and two moderators, should all be from developed
> countries....
>
> I did put that question at the MAG open consultations in Paris earlier
> this year - about domination of speakers from developed countries, but
> nothing much seems to change...
>
> In front of me on the panel, apart from the MAG Chair, three people from
> developed countries, one Indian who is AT & T employee, which I take to be
> his primary 'interest representation' , and just one person from developing
> countries, and two moderators from developed countries..
>
> Figure, all people from developing countries has still to do a lot of
> capacity building... I understand a lot of 'IG' money is being poured by
> developed countries into developing countires, ans so thanks very much...
>
> Maybe around 2050, we would have sufficient capacity (and dominant
> ideology) build up to be given some kind of consideration of equity in
> global spaces...
>
> Meanwhile, to all UN baiters, this would never happen in a UN meeting...
> *
>  **I will keep raising these question, which some take to be
> embarrassing, because I take it to be my political duty* *to do so*...
> and so personal apologies to all involved.
>
> parminder
>
>
> On Tuesday 22 October 2013 08:58 AM, michael gurstein wrote:
>
>  Bill,****
>
> ** **
>
> I'm sure that everyone is heartened to hear this but dare I say that your
> statement *"I made a conscious effort to stay off the focus sessions this
> year and I believe other MAG CS people did too*" is precisely the
> problem. ****
>
> ** **
>
> What sort of a governance/management process is operative in the MAG/IGF
> where the already designated 5 or so members of the "MAG crowd" have to
> "make a conscious decision" and show sufficienr personal forebearance not
> to occupy all the places in public forums.. ****
>
> ** **
>
> Surely the issue is that there should be processes in place that ensure
> that other voices are brought to the surface as a matter of course and of
> effective procedural management., not of sufferance or beneficence. ****
>
> ** **
>
> M  ****
>
> ** **
>
> *From:* William Drake [mailto:william.drake at uzh.ch <william.drake at uzh.ch>]
>
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 22, 2013 10:29 AM
> *To:* bestbits at lists.bestbits.net bestbits at lists.bestbits.net&gt
> *Cc:* michael gurstein
> *Subject:* Re [bestbits] [africs-ig] Civil Society speaker: IGF Opening
> ceremony - Nnenna****
>
> ** **
>
> Let's try this again from a subscribed account….****
>
> ** **
>
> Begin forwarded message:****
>
> ** **
>
> *From: *William Drake <wjdrake at gmail.com>****
>
> *Subject: Re: [bestbits] [africs-ig] Civil Society speaker: IGF Opening
> ceremony - Nnenna*****
>
> *Date: *October 22, 2013 9:29:28 AM GMT+08:00****
>
> *To: *michael gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com>****
>
> *Cc: *"Esterhuysen, Anriette" <anriette at apc.org>,
> bestbits at lists.bestbits.net, Nnenna <nne75 at yahoo.com>****
>
> ** **
>
> Hi Mike****
>
> ** **
>
> I'm not subscribed to the two Africa-oriented lists you copied but feel
> free to forward this if you like.****
>
> ** **
>
> On Oct 22, 2013, at 4:35 AM, michael gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com> wrote:*
> ***
>
> ** **
>
> I must say that I disagree with a public endorsement of the IGF as "THE"
> whatever… It may be "THE" something or other but only for lack of a better
> alternative. ****
>
> ** **
>
> Let's agree to disagree on this****
>
> ** **
>
> I can't do the reckoning for this IGF (the way the program is set up) but
> by my count from the last IGF the (CS and to a slightly lesser degree for
> the other stakeholders) presentations in the Workshops and particularly
> plenaries consisted to an overwhelming and truly astonishing degree of the
> same half dozen CS characters (lets call them the MAG crowd) over and over
> again to the point of exhaustion, likely of them but certainly of anyone
> wanting to hear any fresh (and/or critical) perspectives. (Is it the case
> that a world with roughly 2 billion Internet users can only turn up a half
> dozen people to speak on its behalf at one yearly gabfest after another?)*
> ***
>
> ** **
>
> Criticizing this year's  program based on last year's doesn't seem
> entirely fair.  I made a conscious effort to stay off the focus sessions
> this year and I believe other MAG CS people did too.  In consequence, the
> numbers don't seem to entirely match what you're saying.****
>
> ** **
>
> Opening Ceremony
> no MAG CS****
>
> ** **
>
> Building Bridges FS:
> no MAG CS, except the remote moderator, not a panelist****
>
> ** **
>
> IG Principles FS
> no MAG CS (I dropped out)****
>
> ** **
>
> Principles of Multistakeholder Cooperation FS          No MAG CS****
>
> ** **
>
> Legal and other Frameworks FS                                             No
> MAG CS****
>
> ** **
>
> Internet as an engine for growth FS                           No MAG CS***
> *
>
>
> Human rights, freedom of expression FS                   No MAG CS****
>
> ** **
>
> Taking Stock / Emerging Issues FS                            No MAG CS****
>
> ** **
>
> Open Microphone Session 1
> two MAG, not CS though****
>
> ** **
>
> Closing Ceremony
> no speakers listed but a CS rep TBD****
>
> ** **
>
> ** **
>
> Workshops may be different, people on the MAG have as much right to
> propose something as anyone else.  Nevertheless, I believe some of these
> were turned down in the MAG review, and given the number of events I don't
> think attendees are really left with no choice but to hear the apparently
> old stale ideas of people who happen to be on the MAG.****
>
> ** **
>
> It would of course be good to have more workshops proposed by non-usual
> suspects and I think there was a decent supply of these this year.  But if
> you think more needs to be done, please get out there and recruit newbies
> rather than criticizing previous attendees for having the temerity to want
> to do something at the event.****
>
> ** **
>
> Cheers****
>
> ** **
>
> Bill****
>
> ** **
>
>  ****
>
> There may be a "dialogue" going on, but if it is a dialogue it is one that
> is stretching now over decades rather than (for example bridging
> generations, or social or economic divides, or cultural backgrounds and
> interests) and one of the reasons that the Brazil initiative is required
> and is so challenging is that it (at least to this point) isn't confined to
> the usual cast of (unrepresentative) characters.****
>
>  ****
>
> One fervently hopes that it will not be captured by the IGF and that it
> does lead to a meaningful set of on-going processes that actually address
> significant and critical issues rather than wraps them in repetitiive (and
> dare I say deeply suspect) cotton batten and most importantly looks towards
> democratic processes as the basis for in its initiatives rather than
> "Multistakeholder" ones, upon which we are still awaiting any useful
> definition or set of norms and procedures.****
>
>  ****
>
> Let this race go to the swiftest…****
>
>  ****
>
> M****
>
>  ****
>
> *From:* bestbits-request at lists.bestbits.net [mailto:bestbits <bestbits>-
> request at lists.bestbits.net] *On Behalf Of *Anriette Esterhuysen
> *Sent:* Tuesday, October 22, 2013 1:07 AM
> *To:* AfriCS-IG
> *Cc:* <bestbits at lists.bestbits.net>; africann at afrinic.net; Nnenna Nwakanma
> *Subject:* [bestbits] Re: [africs-ig] Civil Society speaker: IGF Opening
> ceremony - Nnenna****
>
>  ****
>
> Dear NN
>
> So happy you are doing this.
>
> Just a few suggestions below, if possible. Take or leave and good luck.
> You will be fantastic!
>
> Anriette
>
>
> The centrality of human rights****
>
>
>    1. Multistakeholder participation o****
>    2. Ongoing work on enhanced cooperation****
>
>   Would be good to mention importance of civil society. Any approach to
> EC that focuses oncooperation between governments at the expense of
> cooperation among all stakeholders will not be sustainable.
>
> ****
>
>
>    1. Not losing the "development focus" of IG****
>    2. The "not-ended" battle of Internet access and affordability****
>    3. The urgent need to reinforce teh capacity and efficiency of MS IG
>    processes at national levels****
>
>   Would be good to mention the IGF. It has become THE most importance
> milestone along the road to more transparent and consistent dialogue among
> stakeholders. It is a bit like the tortoise and the hare story.. perhaps
> ICANN/Brazil's initiative is working fast, and thinks it will win the
> race.. but that is also what the hare thought. The IGF process is like the
> tortoise.. yes, it is slow, but it is consistent, reliable, not fully
> inclusive but more inclusive than most processes. The hare should not
> underestimate it.
>
> BUT - IGF needs capacity - at leadership and secretariat level. It would
> be very short sighted if resources are spent on new processes that could be
> spent on the IGF's improvement,, continuity and sustainability.
>
> ****
>
>
>    1. Brazil 2014?****
>
>
> Sort of covered above.  But there are many points from other CS
> discussions on this. I think we should say we look forward to it being
> strategic rather than just opportunistic: 1) strategic in its agenda
> setting and 2) in how it facilitates participation and 3) in how it
> positions itself in relation to other processes like the IGF, and the UN
> CSTD EC working group, and the WSIS +10 process. it would be a pity the
> Brazil 2014 efforts did not achieve its potential because of either lack of
> legitimacy, or not being focused enough in its agenda setting.
>
>
> ****
>
>
>    1. Surveillance?****
>
>   From the APC 2013 IGF brief:
>
> Revelations about mass surveillance and data collection by the US National
> Security
> Agency (NSA) has shaken the internet community and undermined the
> legitimacy of
> actors from government and business who had positioned themselves as
> leaders of the
> “internet freedom” movement.  [snip]
> The most positive – and challenging – outcomes of these disturbing
> revelations can be
> built on by the IGF. Firstly, awareness of how internet policy and
> regulation affects all
> users is now much more widespread and talked about in global media.
> Secondly, it cannot
> be ignored that while public debate is flourishing at the IGF and internet
> freedom events
> around the world, there is, in the shadows, another internet governance
> universe: one that
> is secret, that follows the rule of law very selectively, or not at all. A
> universe in which
> powerful governments can ask powerful internet companies to comply with
> rules that are
> not public, not known, not even to the elected representatives of those
> governments, not
> to mention the shareholders of those companies, or the staff members of
> those
> administrations working hard to promote human rights on the internet,
> transparency and
> multi-stakeholder participation in global internet governance.
> The IGF is a space where the internet community can let off steam,
> confront one another
> (surely that is why we come together in multi-stakeholder spaces?), and
> identify how to
> move forward to restore trust in internet governance as a process, and an
> ecosystem
> made up of institutions, actors, analysts and activists. Complacency is
> not an option."
>
>
> ****
>
>
>    1. Best Bits?****
>
>     All for now****
>
>  ****
>
> Nnenna****
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
>
>
> --
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> Coordinator
> The Gambia YMCAs Computer Training Centre & Digital Studio
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> P. O. Box 421 Banjul
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>
>
>
> *****
>
>
>
>
> ****
>
> _______________________________________________****
>
> AfriCS-IG mailing list****
>
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>
> To unsubscribe, email africs-ig-unsubscribe at lists.apc.org****
>
>
>
> ****
>
> -- ****
>
> ------------------------------------------------------****
>
> anriette esterhuysen anriette at apc.org****
>
> executive director, association for progressive communications****
>
> www.apc.org****
>
> po box 29755, melville 2109****
>
> south africa****
>
> tel/fax +27 11 726 1692****
>
> ____________________________________________________________
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> ** **
>
> ** **
>
>
>
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