[governance] today's Wash Post editorial

[McTim]

Hi Norbert,

On Fri, Jan 25, 2013 at 2:31 PM, Norbert Bollow <nb at bollow.ch> wrote:
> McTim <dogwallah at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, Jan 25, 2013 at 1:16 PM, Norbert Bollow <nb at bollow.ch> wrote:
>> > Koven Ronald <kovenronald at aol.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >> In what, precisely, does the "yoke of US's oversight" consist ? May
>> >> we have concrete examples, please, of the exercise of this yoke ?
>> >
>> > One example is the Rojadirecta case, in which U.S. Immigration and
>> > Customs Enforcement (ICE) took down, by means of a simple warrant
>> > (obtained domestically within the U.S. without any need to involve
>> > Spanish authorities), a Spanish website directed at customers in
>> > Spain even though that website had been judged, by Spanish courts,
>> > to be legal according to Spanish law.
>>
>> You are conflating 2 entirely different things.
>>
>> One is the role that NTIA has in re: rootzone authorisation.
>>
>> The other has nothing to do with ICANN.
>
> The US government has multiple roles and potential roles in relation to
> the rootzone. One is the NTIA (National Telecommunications and
> Information Administration) role in rootzone authorisation. Another
> is that both ICANN and Verisign Inc. are incorporated in the US and
> (since there is no special international statute that would exempt
> them) thereby obligated, if served the same kind of warrant that
> took Rojadirecta down, to obey the warrant. The scenario is this: "ICE
> decides that one foreign TLD registrar

I think you mean "registry"  here.


 is in the business of directing
> users to websites violating the US understanding of what copyright
> law should say, and further decides to treat that TLD registrar
> analogously to how Rojadirecta was treated". I don't pretend to know
> whether ICE would seek to serve the warrant to be served to ICANN (as
> IANA operator) or Verisign (as root zone maintainer)

neither to the IANA operator or rootzone maintainer.

As they did in the rojadirecta case, they would go to the registry
(but I think they should have gone to the registrar in that
case...well what I really think is that they shouldn't have bothered).
 Another caveat of course is that VRSN is the registry for .net and
.com.


 or both, nor
> whether NTIA might somehow intervene to stop the madness. I also don't
> pretend to know how realistic or unrealistic that kind of scenario
> might be. Furthermore, I also don't pretend to have even a guesstimate
> about how many of the root server operators would thereafter actually
> serve the modified root zone (in which the TLD is missing which is in
> this scenario the subject of that warrant).


So you are hypothesizing that if for example ICE took exception to
mega.nz (or mega.co.nz), they would go to ICANN or VRSN to take .nz
from the root?

Neither body acting alone (or in conceert with each other could
accomplish that.  They would both tell ICE (politely) to bugger off,
that what ICE wants they can't have, as it is not possible for either
party to complete the request.


>
> The only point that I was trying to make is that the concerns about
> potential actions of the US government are not mere prejudice, but are
> based, at least to some extent, on actual actions of the US government.

right, and the point I was making is that this thread has been mostly
about rootzone changes, and you brought in rojadirecta, 2 things which
really have little in common.

So to remove the US "yoke", we would not only need to remove the US
role in root changes, but remove ALL registries and registrars from US
territories AND force Google and FB, etc to relocate all of their
offices to a country where they would not be subject to any laws??  In
other words, a place that doesn't exist.

In other words, Internetistan!!

-- 
Cheers,

McTim
"A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A
route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel

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