[governance] News from this week's MAG call?

Thu Aug 8 05:04:49 EDT 2013

Suresh Ramasubramanian <suresh at hserus.net> wrote:

> The point is moot given that the ITU has little or no presence in
> cybersecurity,

As far as I can see, neither Parminder nor the Indonesian statement
is talking about the ITU or about “cybersecurity” at all.

> and "ethics" .. well, it is going to be an excellent
> talk shop with a champagne and salmon reception but that is about all
> it is going to achieve.

Well clearly the plan here is not to have an inclusive deliberative
discourse as demanded by Habermas and Ulrich for this kind of thing.

But IMO we shouldn't so quickly dismiss the possibility that the
objectives here might really go beyond having a good meal and enjoying 
some intellectual entertainment.

They explicitly state that they want to “discuss the Global
Multi-Stakeholder Cyber Ethics Principles”.

Ethics can be a very dangerous tool in unscrupulous hands. For example,
medieval history is full of crimes against humanity that were fully
justified from the perspective of the kind of ethics that were en
vogue at the time, a sort of ethics that contained a lot of good
insights but also subtle aspects designed to protect the power and the
riches of those who were rich and powerful.

Greetings,
Norbert

> If civil society insists on parity there - well, a proportionate
> number of civil society reps are guaranteed an excellent meal and
> drinks, to compensate for all the hot air expended.
> 
> --srs (iPad)
> 
> On 08-Aug-2013, at 13:44, parminder <parminder at itforchange.net> wrote:
> 
> > 
> > 
> > Great news that Bali IGF is on! Very much look forward...
> > 
> > Troubled to hear there is a pre-event high level leaders meeting of
> > ICT minsters and CEOs to discuss Multi-stakeholder cyber-ethics
> > principles...... The thing appears corporate dominated if not
> > exclusively for them, apart from ministers...
> > 
> > Till last year, the pre event used to be a ministerial event....
> > now we have a ministers plus CEO event, and that too deciding on
> > cyber ethics principles..
> > 
> > (BTW, it was this high level meeting to which invitations were
> > being sought to be sold as a fund raising strategy described in the
> > problematic document ...... So really, if a big corporation is
> > afraid that cyber ethics may tend towards, say open standards, or
> > strict privacy principles, one could just quickly buy up some seats
> > at the table where the discussion and perhaps finalisation of
> > principles will take place.  Fact is, I really still do not know
> > how much funding has actually been generated against those
> > promises, and if those promised quid pro quos still hold. We were
> > told that this question will be raised and an answer obtained in
> > the MAG meeting, but i dont see anything about it in the MAG
> > meeting minutes . )
> > 
> > This is not acceptable... CS groups must write to the organisers
> > against this... When Sarkozy announced an e- G8 forum that was to
> > be  a pre-event to the G 8 meeting on important Internet issues,
> > and he invited just business CEOs along with government delegates,
> > CS, including the IGC, wrote against this
> > ( http://igcaucus.org/open-letter-president-sarkozy-eg8-meeting-plan
> > )..... (This was widely covered in the French press, and as a
> > result, I think they did invite some civil society persons)
> > 
> > Civil society deserves a place at policy deliberation tables much
> > before big corporates do.....
> > 
> > BTW, in the latter part the statement says " For the time being, I
> > have received already the list of name, position, organization,
> > contact number, and location/email address of around 40 CEOs of
> > various Internet Business/Civil Society organizations to joint the
> > HLLM, proposed and sent by ICC Basis officials (Ms. Ayesha Hassan
> > and her staffs). "
> > 
> > Well, it speaks of CEOs of CS (civil society) organisations, but
> > then in a list that has been sent to them by ICC? Has any civil
> > society organisation/ network also been approached?
> > 
> > Lets tell them, we dont believe in the CEO thing, and we believe in
> > CS reps selected by CS networks for such meetings etc...
> > 
> > And if indeed CS persons will be there, we need parity with other
> > groups in terms of numbers - although, sorry, we cannot donate...
> > 
> > parminder
> > 
> > PS: Looks like confirming the suspicion that when push comes to
> > shove, MSism tends to become corporate biggies sharing power with
> > governments, and the rest is basically a charade of minions playing
> > the MS cheering game...
> > 
> > 
> > On Wednesday 07 August 2013 08:40 PM, Adam Peake wrote:
> >> See
> >> 
> >> http://mail.intgovforum.org/pipermail/igfmaglist_intgovforum.org/2013-August/000171.html
> >> 
> >> you know the MAG list archive is now open?
> >> Archive<http://mail.intgovforum.org/pipermail/igfmaglist_intgovforum.org/>
> >> 
> >> In case the attachment doesn't open from the archived email, text
> >> copied below.
> >> 
> >> Adam
> >> 
> >> 
> >> STATEMENT BY SARDJOENI MOEDJIONO (MAG MEMBER) ON THE VIRTUAL MAG
> >> MEETING, ON TUESDAY, AUGUST 6TH, 2013 Mr. Markus Kummer, Mr.
> >> Chengetai Masango, and all MAG Member,
> >> 
> >> After a series of long and comprehensive discussions and
> >> preparations, including our previous virtual MAG Meeting on
> >> Wednesday, July 31st, 2013, and further discussions/ dialogs
> >> between the Global Internet Community including Mr. Chengetai
> >> Masango who joined the meeting via teleconference from Geneva and
> >> New York with Minister of Communication and Information Technology
> >> (CIT) Republic of Indonesia, Mr. Tifatul Sembiring, at his office
> >> on Monday, August 5th, 2013 – Indonesia is now confirm and
> >> pronounces ready to be the host country of the 8th Meeting of IGF
> >> 2013 in Bali as planned. We, the Indonesian Internet Governance
> >> Forum (ID-IGF) Multi-Stakeholder Organizing Committee is
> >> confidence, well-positioned and prepared to host the Global IGF
> >> 2013 in Bali, 22-25 October 2013.
> >> 
> >> In addition, there is also a pre-event High Level Leaders Meeting
> >> (HLLM) on October 21st, 2013, which invites ICT Ministers and CEOs
> >> from over the world to discuss the Global – Multi-Stakeholder
> >> Cyber Ethics Principles. The topic and agenda of the HLLM is being
> >> discussed, and we are going to send the Term of Reference (TOR) to
> >> the invitees soon.
> >> 
> >> I invite MAG Members to approach and invite their ICT Ministers in
> >> their regions to joint the HLLM on October 21st, 2013. Please send
> >> me the complete list of their name, position, country, contact
> >> number, and location/email address, so we can invite the Ministers.
> >> 
> >> For the time being, I have received already the list of name,
> >> position, organization, contact number, and location/email address
> >> of around 40 CEOs of various Internet Business/Civil Society
> >> organizations to joint the HLLM, proposed and sent by ICC Basis
> >> officials (Ms. Ayesha Hassan and her staffs).
> >> 
> >> Some aspects required to prepare the Global Internet Forum that
> >> will be held in Bali, including the funding sources availability
> >> have been thoroughly prepared.
> >> 
> >> Minister of CIT and all bodies at the Ministry of CIT will do
> >> their best and take all necessary actions so that the Host Country
> >> Agreement (HCA) can be immediately signed by Indonesia and the UN,
> >> given that it is the essential element of the IGF 2013 Bali.
> >> 
> >> Today, a letter was sent to the UNDESA from the Ministry of CIT
> >> conforming that HCA is agreed in principle and will be signed
> >> formally by August 20th, 2013, after the end of the Major
> >> Indonesian National Holiday of Idul Fitri 1434H/2013. The Global
> >> Internet Community ond organizations support the IGF 2013 Bali in
> >> a very positive and relieving. To that end, the Government of
> >> Indonesia and the ID-IGF Multi-stakeholder Organizing Committee
> >> thank the Internet Community, regional and global for their
> >> support so that the IGF 2013 Bali could be executed as planned.
> >> 
> >> We invite the global Internet leaders and all stakeholders
> >> (Government, Business/Private Sector, and Civil Society) to joint
> >> us in IGF 2013 Bali to discuss relevant issues in cyber space
> >> especially matters concerning the global-multistakeholder cyber
> >> ethical principles that we are all share to achieve a safer,
> >> peace, and harmony cyber space for all.
> >> 
> >> I thank you very much for attention and support.
> >>  END
> >> 
> >> 
> >> On Aug 7, 2013, at 11:12 PM, Norbert Bollow wrote:
> >> 
> >>> On Wed, 31 Jul 2013 06:42:50 -0700 (PDT)
> >>> Nnenna<nne75 at yahoo.com>  wrote:
> >>> 
> >>>> The next MAG call will be Tuesday next week at 13h00 UCT (GMT)
> >>>> 
> >>>> Hopefully, by then,we will begin to know:
> >>>>    1. If Indonesia is still HC
> >>>> 
> >>>>    2. If Bali is still the venue
> >>>>    3. If the dates are still maintained
> >>> Has that call taken place?
> >>> 
> >>> If so, I'd be very interested in an update, especially on the
> >>> funding situation.
> >>> 
> >>> (In particular, I'm interested in any news that allows me to
> >>> somehow get an idea about how reliable the information is that
> >>> the Bali IGF is going forward.)
> >>> 
> >>> Greetings,
> >>> Norbert
> >>> 
> >>> -- 
> >>> Recommendations for effective and constructive participation in
> >>> IGC: 1. Respond to the content of assertions and arguments, not
> >>> to the person 2. Be conservative in what you send, be liberal in
> >>> what you accept
> >>> 
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