[governance] Re: Feb 2012 Geneva meetings [Answers]
Anriette Esterhuysen
anriette at apc.org
Mon Feb 13 07:04:30 EST 2012
My apologies for Tuesday's meeting. My flight only gets in around 10h30.
Re. the walkout/protest - I would agree that unless it is well prepared
with linked actions... but let's discuss face to face.
Anriette
On 12/02/12 14:11, Izumi AIZU wrote:
> Thank you Bill, Avri, Parminder and all who commented so far.
>
> As Bill have written, it is difficult to see any potential to
> reach consensus as IGC before the MAG open consultation
> meeting. But that does not mean the issue of funding support
> and the lack thereof. I think taking this opportunity, we need
> to come up with better-organized strategy from this meeting
> and then to May consultation, WSIS Forum, all the way to
> IGF in November.
>
> Sorry for not sparing more time for the MAG/CSTD meeting
> preparation myself, and I will try to work hard there to
> organize meetings, even with logistical constraints.
>
> In addition to the Tuedsay morning meeting, I like to
> explore more meetings during the week, say after
> the formal meetings in the (early) evenings, at least.
>
> izumi
>
>
>
> 2012/2/12 <william.drake at uzh.ch>:
>>
>> Hi
>>
>> It is clear that neither within the caucus generally nor among attendees particularly has there been a groundswell of support for a walkout. We are, once again, a group with diverse viewpoints, and confronting people to demand explanations of dared deviations from somebody's preferred norm serves no constructive purpose. The simple and most democratic solution is for people to act in accordance with their views and convictions. Anyone who feels that a walk out is a statement they want to make should act accordingly, and anyone who is unconvinced that this would look sensible or be effective should stay and try a bit of persuasion and soft power. In fact, the two approaches could work in a synergistic way to strengthen the case. Of course, retuning after an hour or whatever may undercut the seriousness of the walking half of the strategy---when governments periodically storm out of General Assembly speech I don't think they just go for a coffee and then return before
the speaker has finished. But that's for the walkers to decide.
>>
>> I also would suggest that in making the case, it might be preferable to stick to outlining the depth of the problem (aggregated numbers on CS MAG non attendance due to funding would be a plus) and its consequences for both the legitimacy of the IGF's ballyhooed MSism and governance and for meeting programs (if applicable), rather than trying to put forward particular solutions about which we've had little discussion. Or if solutions are proposed, it should be indicated that thèse are examples of thé kinds of steps peuple are thinking about, not that we have actual consensus on any one, when we don't yet.
>>
>> Two cents,
>>
>> Bill
>>
>> -----Avri Doria <avri at acm.org> wrote: -----
>>
>> =======================
>> To: governance at lists.igcaucus.org
>> From: Avri Doria <avri at acm.org>
>> Date: 02/11/2012 01:19PM
>> Subject: Re: [governance] Re: Feb 2012 Geneva meetings [Answers]
>> =======================
>> Hi,
>>
>> While I think it is important to do something about funding, I would prefer we have a more coherent plan on funding before resorting to walkouts. As far as I can tell a few letters have been sent and one or two voices have spoken. But there has been nothing in any press nor any real Internet case built. Certainly there has not been a coherent concerted effort for anyone in CS to get funding, other than the fundraising people do for their own efforts.
>>
>> I do not think the time for letters is ever over. Even if a walk out is being prepared
>>
>> And while I think there can be great value in walk out at some point, I just do not see it as being useful at this point when no one really knows what or why people would be walking out for.
>>
>> Personally, I think that if the few MAG members we have there walk out, work will proceed along it merry pace with perhaps some gratitude that the pesky CS people aren't bothering them with human rights and all the things only we want to talk about. The fact that those who walk are there, mean that these few had the means to get there. Additionally, if the observers make an issue of walking out, we can only hope they let observers back in the room the next time. I think a walk out has to be of the consultation.
>>
>>
>> If we want to plan a walk out, I beleive it should come after a several month campaign that is organized and very visible, on the point we might want to make. Doing it during the last of the consultations would make a lot more sense to me then doing it without having set the stage and being prepared with press, bloggers and other media paying attention. First I think we need a coherent approach to funding, which has demonstrations and other flash once the topic is visible, which at this point, it really isn't.
>>
>> avri
>>
>> On 11 Feb 2012, at 01:15, parminder wrote:
>>
>>> Hi All
>>>
>>> While I appreciate the problems with a 'withdrawal' strategy that some have mentioned here (I did not mean to propose a full withdrawal at this stage) we also need to do something concrete with regard to the existing situation where there is de jure participation of CS but not de facto. This is the all too familiar old debate of formal versus substantive rights or negative (merely removing constraints) versus positive (actually ensuring required results) rights. CS wants substantive participation not merely a formal right to participate.
>>>
>>> In this regard, I suggest that we adopt two strategies. One, we become more upfront and clear in our language about how we see this whole business.... We have gone too soft in our statements I think. The CS tiger should not lose its stripes becuase if it did it will neither remains a tiger nor anything else, which unfortunately seem to be happening in this MS-ist avataar of CS (MS as in multistakeholderism).
>>>
>>> Secondly, the time for letter writing is over, in my view. I was surprised how our protest about the sudden withdrawal of funding to CS participants for the WG on Improvements to the IGF was dealt with. We read out a statement in the last meeting of the WG, and the secretariat of course gave a technical response that the funder countries had recently reminded them that only LDC participants could be covered and therefore.... However the two donor countries who took this decision were in the room and chose simply to ignore the CS's statement, and the problem that their decision had caused to CS participation in WG. So much for their commitment to MSism!
>>>
>>> Therefore I understand that the official response to the CS funding issue is that funding CS participants (even for the core committees etc) is not a structural part of MSism. It is a charity which will be offered as pleases the powers-that-be, and we cannot be whining about it. In response, we must make our stand clear that funding for CS participation is a structural part of MSism, we dont accept MSism that doesnt include this.
>>>
>>> And the best way to make this message heard loud and clear, I suggest, is as follows:
>>>
>>> The CS contingent does a symbolic walk out of the MAG meeting for 1-2 hours after reading out a statement that clearly puts out our stance in this regard. And we let them know that they can well carry on their business when the CS has left the room, but they must remember that is is not multistakeholder; the most important part of non-government stakeholders being not there. With this we also tell them that if the situation continues like it is, civil society will have to reconsider their options and strategies with regard to the whole IG process.
>>>
>>> If feasible, such a symbolic walk out can also be planned in the open consultations.
>>>
>>> Then, if we do the above, at the WG on Improvements to the IGF meeting we can bring the CS protest to the notice of the group and insist that the report of the WG must include clear reference to regular UN funds (plus long term committed voluntary funds) that always covers CS participation in MAG etc, but also to the extend possible in the IGF, as a basic condition of legitimacy of these meetings. If required, we can also do a symbolic walk out in the WG meeting to stress the point.
>>>
>>> (We can also hope that such a walk out from a UN meeting can draw some press attention, and raise the heat on this issue.)
>>>
>>> Parminder
>>>
>>>
>>> On Friday 10 February 2012 07:58 PM, Miguel Alcaine wrote:
>>>> Dear All,
>>>>
>>>> I believe a letter - probably 2 - are in order. There are 2 issues: CS representation in the upcoming MAG meeting and the overall financial issue for participation in the IGF process.
>>>>
>>>> CS representation in the upcoming MAG should be addressed to the Under Secretary General and I believe asking to allow any attending CS participation regardless of being in the MAG.
>>>>
>>>> The financial issue should be addressed to SG, making a recount of the involution in the topic and remind him of the convenience for the UN system to find solutions for CS participation in the IG process. CS colleagues in NY could also help handing the letter in person to the SG.
>>>>
>>>> I would think CS should unify behind some alternatives for its financial participation in the process, including one coming from UN regular budget, and push for it in the CSTD WG as much as possible.
>>>>
>>>> I believe CS should remain in the process until 2015 because all actors will consider it has participated anyway and because it can present a better case from inside the process.
>>>>
>>>> If withdrawal remains an option, it should be done in a careful way respect to timing and gain as much visibility as CS can. And before making such movement, CS should consider which ways will be left to advocate its positions.
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>>
>>>> Miguel
>>>>
>>>> Disclaimer
>>>> My ideas are those of my own and does not represent any position of my employer or any other institution.
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Feb 10, 2012 at 3:26 AM, Roland Perry <roland at internetpolicyagency.com> wrote:
>>>> In message <CAPcSPKWiFB_N948B9oxgSC2tCqsvvCN=5VgEmfoYdV3K_nha9Q at mail.gmail.com>, at 10:03:09 on Fri, 10 Feb 2012, Baudouin Schombe <baudouin.schombe at gmail.com> writes
>>>>
>>>> Specifically, regarding the process of Internet governance, it should be
>>>> noted that civil society plays a major role in the implementation of ICT
>>>> projects and the fight against crime through virtual cyber crime.
>>>>
>>>> This is an area I'm working in at the moment. And while my "free advice" always seems welcome, there's rarely any funding even for travelling expenses. It's a big problem that doesn't include just Cybercrime or Internet Governance issues.
>>>>
>>>> Pretty much the only concession is that as a speaker at a conference you will get the entrance fee waived. But we don't currently have fees to attend any IG conference I can think of (except perhaps some of the sessions at ITU World).
>>>> --
>>>> Roland Perry
>>>>
>>>>
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>>
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>
>
>
--
------------------------------------------------------
anriette esterhuysen anriette at apc.org
executive director, association for progressive communications
www.apc.org
po box 29755, melville 2109
south africa
tel/fax +27 11 726 1692
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