[governance] Yes! Hands off the Internet!

Suresh Ramasubramanian suresh at hserus.net
Sat Dec 29 04:15:15 EST 2012 

So you have a lot of industry and civil society showing a surprising amount of consensus so far

Which consensus does not seem to be one that you agree with, but them's the breaks.

--srs (iPad)

On 29-Dec-2012, at 14:31, "michael gurstein" <gurstein at gmail.com> wrote:

> No, I don't "expect china, Russia or the Arab states to govern in the global
> public interest" but nor do I expect that the US government, Google or
> Facebook will operate so as to promote the global public interest either. 
> 
> As I was just saying, 
>> The issue of course, for those with a sincere interest in the 
>> well-being of the Internet, is not "hands off the Internet" but rather 
>> to develop means for ensuring that the Internet is "managed" in the 
>> global public interest by all parties.
> 
> This I think is an area where civil society and the technical community
> should be demonstrating leadership (and hopefully joined by sympathetic
> governments and potentially elements of the private sector)  in defining,
> articulating and pursuing.
> 
> M
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Suresh Ramasubramanian [mailto:suresh at hserus.net] 
> Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2012 12:35 AM
> To: governance at lists.igcaucus.org; michael gurstein
> Cc: Michael Leibrandt; <governance at lists.igcaucus.org>
> Subject: Re: [governance] Yes! Hands off the Internet!
> 
> Do you expect china, Russia or the Arab states to govern in the global
> public interest?
> 
> --srs (iPad)
> 
> On 29-Dec-2012, at 13:57, "michael gurstein" <gurstein at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> Hi Michael,
>> 
>> My point in including Google in the "rogues gallery" is simply to 
>> highlight the central role that Google was playing in the recent 
>> Internet Freedom/Hands off the Internet campaign... My point conerning 
>> Facebook is linked to the fact that FB because of its very size and 
>> scope (market
>> dominance?) is taking on (for some at least) a quasi official status 
>> (the official election results in Ghana were first announced on FB for
> example).
>> 
>> But overall my intention was to point to the hypocrisy of the 
>> overwhelming campaigns from certain governments and certain elements 
>> of the private sector, civil society, and the technical community 
>> concerning "hands off the Internet" when it comes from certain 
>> directions (such as the governments of China or Russia) while the same 
>> folks choose to ignore (or at least draw no connection with) quite 
>> blatant and parallel intrusions rather closer to home.
>> 
>> The issue of course, for those with a sincere interest in the 
>> well-being of the Internet, is not "hands off the Internet" but rather 
>> to develop means for ensuring that the Internet is "managed" in the 
>> global public interest by all parties.
>> 
>> M
>> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Michael Leibrandt [mailto:michael_leibrandt at web.de]
>> Sent: Friday, December 28, 2012 11:46 PM
>> To: governance at lists.igcaucus.org; michael gurstein
>> Subject: Re: [governance] Yes! Hands off the Internet!
>> 
>> Hi Michael,
>> 
>> If your local car dealer rejects to sell you a car, or if the local 
>> night club doesn't let you in, there isn't much you can do about it. 
>> Private providers of goods and services are generally free to decide whom
> to serve.
>> At least until it becomes an act of discrimination, e. g. against 
>> blacks, gays or jews. Or if the provider has a monopoly (clearly not 
>> the case for Google or Facebook), or has such a strong market position 
>> that it can actually control the market.
>> 
>> So to compare government action and company behaviour is quite difficult. 
>> But there is already enough hypocrisy to think about with regard to 
>> stakeholders of the same category ;-)
>> 
>> Michael, Berlin
>> 
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "michael gurstein" <gurstein at gmail.com>
>> To: <governance at lists.igcaucus.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, December 29, 2012 12:17 AM
>> Subject: [governance] Yes! Hands off the Internet!
>> 
>> 
>>> (from today's various Internet news feeds....
>>> 
>>> Yes, for sure, these hands off the Internet.
>> http://www.worldcrunch.com/culture-society/china-tightens-internet-con
>> trol-b
>> ans-anonymity-allows-government-to-delete-posts/censorship-online-twit
>> ter-we
>>> ibo-xinhua-/c3s10510/#.UN2qcI7896I
>>> http://tinyurl.com/cryyx5l
>>> 
>>> And these
>> http://www.techdirt.com/articles/20121228/07170621508/fisa-is-renewed-
>> with-a
>>> ll-its-problems-still-intact.shtml
>>> http://tinyurl.com/d7trx4j
>>> 
>>> And these
>> http://torrentfreak.com/google-removed-50-million-pirate-search-result
>> s-this
>>> -year-121228/
>>> http://tinyurl.com/d7trx4j
>>> 
>>> And these
>> http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2012/12/washingtons-blog-facebook-censo
>> rs-pro
>>> minent-political-critics.html
>>> http://tinyurl.com/cn72l3v
>>> 
>>> Maybe a New Year's Resolution: Enough with the hypocrisy!
>>> 
>>> M
>> 
>> 
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> ------
>> ----
>> 
>> 
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>> 
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