From nhklein at gmx.net Fri Sep 30 22:14:49 2011 From: nhklein at gmx.net (nhklein) Date: Sat, 01 Oct 2011 09:14:49 +0700 Subject: [governance] Re: CS-EU Meeting In-Reply-To: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C5CA@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> References: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C5BE@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C5CA@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <4E867799.9080608@gmx.net> On 10/01/2011 01:26 AM, "Kleinwächter, Wolfgang" wrote: > Thanks > > yoyu are right. We should invite the Chinese government for a dialogue in 2012. > > wolfgang Very good suggestion - direct talk is good, and not only talking with assumed "friends." Norbert Klein > From: Sivasubramanian M [mailto:isolatedn at gmail.com] > Sent: Fri 9/30/2011 5:53 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Izumi AIZU > Cc: Kleinwächter, Wolfgang > Subject: Re: [governance] Re: CS-EU Meeting > > > Dear Wolfgang, > > > This initiative to reach out to Governments would further the acceptability of the multi-stakeholder model. Setting up meetings with Government Delegations, Senior Government functionaries from different parts of the world, one after another at every IGF / regional IGFs / MAG meetings would be opportunities for Government to 'see' the Civil Society face to face, which would favorably bring down the distance from Civil Society and Government. Same could be done with Business and Technical communities. > > > At ICANN at least a few members of the Business Constituency, and perhaps even one or two members of the Board were rather reluctant, if not apprehensive about working with At-Large. Meetings with the Board and more recently the meetings with the Business Constituency have favorably altered the way each see the other. > > I don't view this merely as meetings between IGC and Government, but more as the beginning of Civil Society's informal Interactions with other stakeholders, beginning with IGC meetings with the American / EU Governments. Please take this forward further. > > > > Sivasubramanian M > > ISOC India Chennai > http://isocindiachennai.org > > > facebook: http://is.gd/x8Sh > LinkedIn: http://is.gd/x8U6 > Twitter: http://is.gd/x8Vz > http://internetstudio.in/ -- A while ago, I started a new blog: ...thinking it over... after 21 years in Cambodia http://www.thinking21.org/ continuing to share reports and comments from Cambodia. Norbert Klein nhklein at gmx.net Phnom Penh / Cambodia ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From baudouin.schombe at gmail.com Thu Sep 1 04:56:04 2011 From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com (Baudouin SCHOMBE) Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2011 09:56:04 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Jeremy, good morning, I thank you for this very important information. I arrive in Nairobi on September 26 at 16.20h Go directly to the symposium for Giganet also attend this meeting. Regarding the last point, I suggest that consideration be seeking financial support to national platforms of the Internet Governance for workshops before and after IGF international. This will allow national IGF to mobilize and to prepare local actors for sub regional IGF. These are already supported by ICANN, ISOC and some partners. From experience, and in the case of the DRC, I managed to attract the interest of many technical players on the various topics discussed at sub regional and international IGF. It would be a nice connection between the national and sub regional IGF.It is not lack of human resources but a lack of political vision. For this reason, in Central Africa, we opted for rotating the workshops in each country of Central Africa as in West Africa, in East Africa and Southern Africa. Central Africa is a sub regions where we have not yet managed to bring concerted action on the ICT strategy. Baudouin 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm > Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF > meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the > evening of 26 September. > > As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our > meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will > be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in > order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining > afterwards will be able to get away on time. > > There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an > opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. > Suggested items for the agenda are: > > > - IGC's workshops at this IGF > - Next coordinator elections > - Working groups of the IGC > - Strategic direction for the IGC > - Review of the IGC charter > - Other Internet governance processes > > > If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. > > Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > *www.consumersinternational.org* > *Twitter @ConsumersInt * > > Read our email confidentiality notice. > Don't print this email unless necessary. > > -- SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ ACADEMIE DES TIC FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre At-Large Member NCSG Member email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net tél:+243998983491 skype:b.schombe wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From daniel at digsys.bg Thu Sep 1 07:48:42 2011 From: daniel at digsys.bg (Daniel Kalchev) Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2011 14:48:42 +0300 Subject: [governance] FW: [csisac-members] MEASURING the Internet Economy In-Reply-To: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175493707A@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175493707A@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <4E5F711A.8040802@digsys.bg> On 31.08.11 23:07, Milton L Mueller wrote: > If you can think of some simple way around this problem, more power to > you. You'll get the Nobel prize. But please don't trivialize the > difficulty of this problem, or attribute it to a conspiracy of evil > neoliberals. (In fact, Chinese and Soviet Marxists are famous for > putting the most emphasis on the production of physical goods and > touting such statistics as proof of the superiority of socialism). This one reserved response, although some of the other points you debated are important. Take it however you like, that will not change history. But... believe it or not "they produce more so they claim to be superior" is what that (most call it "comunist" although it never ever claimed to have reached the 'communism' level) -- is exactly what was attributed to the "other side", that is "The Imperialism". So you see, both parties in that cold war pointed fingers at each other and claimed that the other side is practicing what the other side was accusing them of. Funny world. In reality however (having lived in the last decades of that system and the 'new' system thereafter), I can definitely claim that you are wrong. That system, possibly not a motivation but as a side effect (we will never know) has assigned lower priority to greed and production/consumption - it had significantly more focus on non-monetary benefits. Such as education and social benefits. Also, production was much, much lower. I do remember well our grandparent's opinion on this --- they have lived before/during WW2 and could compare the quality of life before/during/after that system --- and their opinion was very strong on this. So strong, that for decades now we have the situation that the primary voters for the former Communist (now, Socialist) Party were the so called "red grandmothers" -- who still lived in the past and their good memories were abused. That system was far from perfect, of course. But your assertion about focus on production is plain wrong. This all however is quite off-topic. Except, by the way, we started our work on Internet in Bulgaria during that system. Without the government even knowing it. Or the next few governments. Daniel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From kerry at kdbsystems.com Thu Sep 1 11:40:35 2011 From: kerry at kdbsystems.com (Kerry Brown) Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2011 15:40:35 +0000 Subject: [governance] regulating the digital space - whose laws apply, and whose do not In-Reply-To: References: <4E5B2BF4.9090902@digsys.bg> <20110829112629.A8C2A15C0DE@quill.bollow.ch> <4E5BA94D.1080703@digsys.bg> <20110829173418.D3B0D15C0DE@quill.bollow.ch> <4E5D3B2E.4050901@digsys.bg> <4E5E4663.6080605@digsys.bg> Message-ID: Another example of trying to figure out whose laws apply and the problems that arise when the laws from different countries conflict. < http://www.zdnet.com/blog/btl/european-companies-need-confidence-over-patriot-act-concerns/56878?tag=nl.e539 > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gurstein at gmail.com Thu Sep 1 11:42:32 2011 From: gurstein at gmail.com (michael gurstein) Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2011 08:42:32 -0700 Subject: [governance] MEASURING the digital space - whose MEASURES apply, and whose do not In-Reply-To: <4E5EADF0.8030407@rkey.com> Message-ID: Good questions Craig... My use of "we" in the note was firstly refering to the folks on this elist and secondarily I guess, although that wasn't part of my thinking, CS as a whole. How the second "we" at least "constitute themselves as agents" is part, I guess of the thinking that needs to be done and is most certainly not a trivial question. Best, M -----Original Message----- From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Craig Simon Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 2:56 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: Re: [governance] MEASURING the digital space - whose MEASURES apply, and whose do not Michael, The question ultimately hinges on who makes up the "we" in your sentence, "my position was that we need to be thinking of global governance institutions and thus global measurements/measurement strategies..." How do the members of "we" constitute themselves as agents capable of voicing grievances and making demands in the first place? Who counts? Who gets counted? And so on. Of course, no practical mechanism exists to coalesce expressions of their/our grievances and demands at a massively internetworked level (despite my lonely efforts to build one). Consequently, there's lots of open ground for individuals to show up in Internet governance fora like these claiming they know what "Netizens" (or humans at an expressly global level) want, or should want. That's politics, which is fine by me. I don't think that we who participate on these discussion lists need much reminding that "we" have yet to be heard. In any case, if the makeup of "we" ever is sorted out, building a knowledgebase that draws sober and insightful attention to statistics of economic well being will be an important test of institutional legitimacy. So I applaud your efforts. Craig Simon On 8/31/11 3:56 PM, michael gurstein wrote: > Very interesting Craig... > > I understand you here as linking the question of Internet measurement > into the broader question of Internet identity i.e. as reflecting a > shift away from "national" statistics to "identity" based statistics > but understood in a global rather than a national context (to tie this > discussion back into the earlier one--where my position was that we > need to be thinking of global governance institutions and thus global > measurements/measurement strategies, rather than national ones (such > as the SNA/GDP etc. > > I'm not exactly sure where this goes from practically but I think > conceptually you are suggesting something quite valuable. > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From riaz.tayob at gmail.com Thu Sep 1 12:16:37 2011 From: riaz.tayob at gmail.com (Riaz K Tayob) Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2011 18:16:37 +0200 Subject: [governance] WIPO moves into Internet policy, seeking mandate for opening internet intermediary liability protections, and enforcement In-Reply-To: <8C2D6A70-DDFD-4EF1-8712-1AA5CFD5173D@consensus.pro> References: <8C2D6A70-DDFD-4EF1-8712-1AA5CFD5173D@consensus.pro> Message-ID: <4E5FAFE5.3070301@gmail.com> Forwarded from another list with permission. Riaz From: Nick Ashton-Hart Dear All, I thought I should acquaint you with a real problem we are having in Geneva - The Secretariat at WIPO is clearly looking to insert itself as a player in Internet governance by trying to create a broad agenda on intermediary liability in both trademark and copyright policy. On June 8th, in an interview (24thminute) at the World Copyright Summit, the Director General said that the copyright agenda at WIPO: ?? tends to be a negative one. It tends to be looking at the exceptions, the limitations, and the other ways of not having intellectual property. I?m very keen to see us coming back with a positive agenda for intellectual property.? The IFLA, WBU, eIFL and CCIA objected in writing and asked for clarification of the DG?s position on 13thJune. At a meeting with the DG he was defensive and dismissive of our concerns, noting that ?making you [NGOs] happy is not my priority.? In the same interview (about 7m20s), on the subject of Internet intermediary liability shields, he was asked if he believed reform of intermediary liability protection regimes in the Internet Treaties was necessary, he said ? ?Yes? I think it?s essential, it?s key, but I don?t think we?re in a position, anyone?s in a position to impose solutions in this area. We have to work out solutions, I think, by dialogue. It?s necessary for the intermediaries ? the telcos, the ISPs ? to come together with the content providers, we have to have that dialogue ?? When asked if WIPO would be willing to ?lead the way? in creating ?meaningful dialogue? that might ?lead to some new frameworks?? He said that this was a part of ?? bringing WIPO into the 21stcentury ? it is a terribly important thing for us to do ? we are trying to stimulate that discussion, we are trying to move the member-states ? if we are able to stimulate a discussion about the profound consequences of the digital environment for the financing of culture in the 21stcentury ? it will become evident that the intermediaries are a key to the future solution.? The DG likes what WIPO calls "stakeholder dialogues" - where key stakeholders on opposite sides of an issue meet under WIPO?s auspices, with WIPO playing an arbitration/convening role to discuss issues of disagreement in hopes of creating a breakthrough. These processes then report back to member-state diplomats (most of whom are general foreign-service people with no substantive expertise in the issues). WIPO's efforts in doing this have so far been failures which have come with a high price at times for the participants. With respect to the visually impaired and their access to books, a stakeholder dialogue was convened at the request of the member-states in the copyright committee at WIPO, composed of the visually impaired and publishers the to try and get the parties to find practical solutions for moving books around (homepage here ). This has now largely collapsed , because the blind found that the publishers were using it to sabotage attempts to get a binding solution to a big problem - less than 5% of books are available in blind-accessible versions. The Stakeholder Dialogue was being used to justify no binding norms by publishers and publisher-friendly governments. WIPO and Intermediary Liability in Copyright The Secretariat are very active in this area, quite out of the blue. They undertaken a series of panel discussions and released two new reports. Because they have no member-state mandate, they are organising these meetings in combination with the Internet Society. So far, they have or are: * Held a joint session with ISOC at the WSIS Forum 2011 where the only speaker other than WIPO and ISOC was a person from the Korean Copyright office extolling the virtues of their three-strikes laws. Many present objected to such an unbalanced panel. WIPO promised their subsequent panels would be balanced. * Held a joint side event on Wednesday 21st June where there were no intermediaries on the panel once again - but the President of HADOPI and Ted Shapiro of the film industry both were, pushing a heavy copyright enforcement agenda and endorsing WIPO work in this area. This meeting was held during the Standing Committee on Copyright and Related Rights as it undertakes a two-year process of looking into limitations and exceptions for the visually impaired, education, and libraries. Given the agenda in L&Es, you would think WIPO would spend its time helping member-states understand those issues better, rather than trying to introduce new issues. There is a report of the meeting here by Matthias Langenegger - CCIA was invited at the last minute but declined to participate because the panel was so unbalanced; WIPO then went to EFF who declined for the same reason. * Attended a 20-country intergovernmental meeting in Thailand in May where WIPO admitted they had persuaded the organisers to put Internet intermediary liability on the agenda. I have asked for more information on this meeting from WIPO, but I haven?t received any details. * Published two reports on Intermediary liability, available here . * Organising a joint event at the Internet Governance Forum in Kenya - details here . In trademarks, the Secretariat proposed (see paras 69-71, page 11) in March 2011 that the Standing Committee on Trademarks should ??develop agreed standards for the determination of the presence or absence of secondary liability of Internet intermediaries ?? This proposal was defeated , thanks in part at least to the work of CCIA and its member companies interacting with member-states but the Director-General made clear that he will not give up ? as according to him a ?public policy solution? at the international level to the ?problems to be solved? is necessary. Given these statements and activities, the interest in regulating the Internet for trademark owners and pushing the issue of Internet intermediaries in copyright cannot be anything other than an orchestrated and deliberate campaign to create a role in Internet policy for WIPO despite a the lack of member-state support for it ? or, frankly, much by way of expertise: a Director-level staff member recently asked a group of Internet intermediaries the question ?What is Web 2.0?? Bottom line: We need more NGOs attending WIPO's copyright and trademark meetings, from more countries. We need more exposure of what is going on publicly. Can any of you help? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From lehto.paul at gmail.com Thu Sep 1 12:58:07 2011 From: lehto.paul at gmail.com (Paul Lehto) Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2011 12:58:07 -0400 Subject: [governance] MEASURING the digital space - whose MEASURES apply, and whose do not In-Reply-To: <4E5EADF0.8030407@rkey.com> References: <7F90E1CB1B374D99AA4A78DCA8CE6427@userPC> <4E5EADF0.8030407@rkey.com> Message-ID: On 8/31/11, Craig Simon wrote: > Michael, > > The question ultimately hinges on who makes up the "we" in your > sentence, "my position was that we need to be thinking of global > governance institutions and thus global measurements/measurement > strategies..." How do the members of "we" constitute themselves as > agents capable of voicing grievances and making demands in the first > place? Who counts? Who gets counted? When "we" are constituted, it's called democracy - if it includes everyone. If less than all people are constituted as "we the people" it is an aristocracy or oligarchy. If certain key leaders of "stakeholder" groups get together and decide policy it's a form of aristocracy called "multi-stakeholderism." And so on. We all know global democracy including everyone has not been constituted. In the meantime, all of the arguments made against democracy are received with great skepticism on my part -- at least if the person making the argument is in any way, shape or form participating in a policy elite -- either some form of aristocracy or multi-stakeholderism. It's only human nature to come up with all kinds of reasons not to want to share power more broadly -- it dilutes one's own influence, and we all naturally desire to maximize our own personal influence. Paul Lehto, J.D. -- Paul R Lehto, J.D. P.O. Box 1 Ishpeming, MI 49849 lehto.paul at gmail.com 906-204-4026 (cell) ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From devonrb at gmail.com Thu Sep 1 16:44:58 2011 From: devonrb at gmail.com (devonrb at gmail.com) Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2011 20:44:58 +0000 Subject: [governance] regulating the digital space - whose laws apply,and whose do not In-Reply-To: References: <4E5B2BF4.9090902@digsys.bg> <20110829112629.A8C2A15C0DE@quill.bollow.ch><4E5BA94D.1080703@digsys.bg><20110829173418.D3B0D15C0DE@quill.bollow.ch><4E5D3B2E.4050901@digsys.bg> <4E5E4663.6080605@digsys.bg> Message-ID: <663351832-1314909901-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1050935143-@b11.c1.bise6.blackberry> There are some serious issues coming out here which I will enumerate: Should the internet be governed? To what extent and how? How is the internet defined? Is it the combination of infrastructure and system software? Is it the virtual space or is it the people who access it? Do we need governance structures for the infrastructure and the virtual space? Is there need for a different governance mechanism to regulate the actions of those who access the net and those other actions influenced by each action. To what extent do present legal frameworks,regulations, international laws and treaties are apllicable to the present and future of the Internet? Do we need to start from scratch or is there a solid foundation to build on? Which would be more effective; applying local laws at the point of incidence or the point of effect or should there be international legal mechanisms for cross border breaches of internet protocol? I guess there are lots more questions. As a layman I believe the anwers exist but only if we are willing to. Understand that these answers may come from a combination of the components of these and other questions. Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Digicel -----Original Message----- From: Roland Perry Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2011 19:24:06 To: Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,Roland Perry Subject: Re: [governance] regulating the digital space - whose laws apply, and whose do not In message <4E5E4663.6080605 at digsys.bg>, at 17:34:11 on Wed, 31 Aug 2011, Daniel Kalchev writes >> In the opinion of many Americans "guns don't kill people, people kill >>people", but governments (even the USA government) seek to regulate >>guns. > >You mean, like they are regulating cars? On the principle that "no car >should be produced to run faster than the police cars"? Cars are regulated (for example with regard to the quality of their brakes, lighting, air pollution, noise, crash-worthiness...), but I've not come across a regulation on top speed. Most police cars where I live are quite low-cost family saloons, they are used to transport policemen to where they need to be, rather than chasing bank robbers. >In the end however, you are prosecuted not because your car ran faster >than the Police's, but because you were trying to run away from the >Police. You'd probably be prosecuted for careless driving, or exceeding the speed limit, or running a red traffic light. >This way of thinking explains the attempts to cripple the Internet, in >order to gain easier control. The Internet is crippled more by efforts to combat spammers, than anything else. For example by blocking port 25. It all depends what you mean by "control". But having switched to port 587 to appease the ISP I'm using at the moment, I'm free to send any words I like to this mailing list. -- Roland Perry ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng Fri Sep 2 01:31:41 2011 From: sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng (Sonigitu Ekpe) Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2011 06:31:41 +0100 Subject: [governance] regulating the digital space - whose laws apply,and whose do not In-Reply-To: <663351832-1314909901-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1050935143-@b11.c1.bise6.blackberry> References: <4E5B2BF4.9090902@digsys.bg> <20110829112629.A8C2A15C0DE@quill.bollow.ch> <4E5BA94D.1080703@digsys.bg> <20110829173418.D3B0D15C0DE@quill.bollow.ch> <4E5D3B2E.4050901@digsys.bg> <4E5E4663.6080605@digsys.bg> <663351832-1314909901-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1050935143-@b11.c1.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: Dear All, Greetings from the beautiful city of Calabar, Nigeria. I feel we should be WILLING to address and answer the questions of Internet Governance in Totality. Great fellows this is the time to solidified our Visions for the Internet Governance. Remain in the BLESSING's of MOTHER NATURE. Sea On 1 Sep 2011 21:45, wrote: There are some serious issues coming out here which I will enumerate: Should the internet be governed? To what extent and how? How is the internet defined? Is it the combination of infrastructure and system software? Is it the virtual space or is it the people who access it? Do we need governance structures for the infrastructure and the virtual space? Is there need for a different governance mechanism to regulate the actions of those who access the net and those other actions influenced by each action. To what extent do present legal frameworks,regulations, international laws and treaties are apllicable to the present and future of the Internet? Do we need to start from scratch or is there a solid foundation to build on? Which would be more effective; applying local laws at the point of incidence or the point of effect or should there be international legal mechanisms for cross border breaches of internet protocol? I guess there are lots more questions. As a layman I believe the anwers exist but only if we are willing to. Understand that these answers may come from a combination of the components of these and other questions. Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Digicel -----Original Message----- From: Roland Perry Sender: governance at ... Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,Roland Perry < roland at internetpolicyagency.com> Subject: Re: [governance] regulating the digital space - whose laws apply, and whose do not In message <4E5E4663.6080605 at digsys.bg>, at 17:34:11 on Wed, 31 Aug 2011, Daniel Kalchev -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Fri Sep 2 16:29:30 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2011 15:59:30 -0430 Subject: [governance] FW: [csisac-members] MEASURING the Internet Economy In-Reply-To: <4E5F711A.8040802@digsys.bg> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175493707A@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E5F711A.8040802@digsys.bg> Message-ID: This is an interesting discussion, touching upon the limitations of knowledge and discussion themselves -- the rationality of science (or art) and measurement, (do we measure what we find, or find what we measure?) what is hard-wired, and where do emotions, biases and evolution meet rational thought, philosophy and politics? Quite a range... So I found this Blog post from Jovan Kurbalija this week, "What do black swans, CERN, Voltaire, Rousseau and Borges have in common?" (he calls it "a Geneva epistemological journey") to be an appropriate aside... I think you will enjoy it. http://deepdip.wordpress.com/2011/08/31/what-do-black-swans-cern-voltaire-rousseau-and-borges-have-in-common/ Ginger On 1 September 2011 07:18, Daniel Kalchev wrote: > > > On 31.08.11 23:07, Milton L Mueller wrote: > >> If you can think of some simple way around this problem, more power to >> you. You'll get the Nobel prize. But please don't trivialize the difficulty >> of this problem, or attribute it to a conspiracy of evil neoliberals. (In >> fact, Chinese and Soviet Marxists are famous for putting the most emphasis >> on the production of physical goods and touting such statistics as proof of >> the superiority of socialism). >> > > This one reserved response, although some of the other points you debated > are important. Take it however you like, that will not change history. > > But... believe it or not "they produce more so they claim to be superior" > is what that (most call it "comunist" although it never ever claimed to have > reached the 'communism' level) -- is exactly what was attributed to the > "other side", that is "The Imperialism". > > So you see, both parties in that cold war pointed fingers at each other and > claimed that the other side is practicing what the other side was accusing > them of. Funny world. > > In reality however (having lived in the last decades of that system and the > 'new' system thereafter), I can definitely claim that you are wrong. That > system, possibly not a motivation but as a side effect (we will never know) > has assigned lower priority to greed and production/consumption - it had > significantly more focus on non-monetary benefits. Such as education and > social benefits. Also, production was much, much lower. > I do remember well our grandparent's opinion on this --- they have lived > before/during WW2 and could compare the quality of life before/during/after > that system --- and their opinion was very strong on this. So strong, that > for decades now we have the situation that the primary voters for the former > Communist (now, Socialist) Party were the so called "red grandmothers" -- > who still lived in the past and their good memories were abused. > > That system was far from perfect, of course. But your assertion about focus > on production is plain wrong. This all however is quite off-topic. > > Except, by the way, we started our work on Internet in Bulgaria during that > system. Without the government even knowing it. Or the next few governments. > > Daniel > > ______________________________**______________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mariliamaciel at gmail.com Fri Sep 2 16:43:44 2011 From: mariliamaciel at gmail.com (Marilia Maciel) Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2011 17:43:44 -0300 Subject: [governance] Registration remote moderators workshops Message-ID: Dear all, I am sure you received this e-mail directly from the secretariat, but I thought that it was useful call the attention of our group, specially those organizing workshops, to these important information. Best, Dear Workshop Organizer, We are sending this email as an update on remote participation for your workshop. Please note that new training sessions for remote participation moderators has been scheduled at the following URL: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/trainings-2011 Please inform your remote participation moderator to register to one of the trainings in case s/he didn't register yet or have taken the training already. In order to make sure that all workshops have remote participation moderators, please make sure that your remote participation moderator register his participation to your workshop at the following URL: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/rp-moderator-registration-2011 In case you have one or more remote panellists participating at your workshop, they are required to register their participation at the following URL: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/remote-panellist-registration-2011 This registration will provide your remote panellist with all needed technical details for her/his successful remote panellist participation. Let us know if you need anything on the matter. All the best, Bernard -- Bernard Sadaka IGF Secretariat -- Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade FGV Direito Rio Center for Technology and Society Getulio Vargas Foundation Rio de Janeiro - Brazil -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gurstein at gmail.com Fri Sep 2 19:32:49 2011 From: gurstein at gmail.com (michael gurstein) Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2011 16:32:49 -0700 Subject: [governance] FW: [csisac-members] MEASURING the Internet Economy In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <4F97ED22D741497FAFE09AF4A46ED6A7@userPC> Thanks for pointing to Jovan's "journey"... And yes, there are similar signposts along his road and mine (FWIW I've put my note into a blogpost at http://gurstein.wordpress.com/2011/09/01/measuring-the-internet-economy-from -a-civil-society-perspective/ where comments/reflections/critiques are welcome. Best for the weekend to one and all, M -----Original Message----- From: Ginger Paque [mailto:gpaque at gmail.com] Sent: Friday, September 02, 2011 1:29 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Cc: michael gurstein; Milton L Mueller Subject: Re: [governance] FW: [csisac-members] MEASURING the Internet Economy This is an interesting discussion, touching upon the limitations of knowledge and discussion themselves -- the rationality of science (or art) and measurement, (do we measure what we find, or find what we measure?) what is hard-wired, and where do emotions, biases and evolution meet rational thought, philosophy and politics? Quite a range... So I found this Blog post from Jovan Kurbalija this week, "What do black swans, CERN, Voltaire, Rousseau and Borges have in common?" (he calls it "a Geneva epistemological journey") to be an appropriate aside... I think you will enjoy it. http://deepdip.wordpress.com/2011/08/31/what-do-black-swans-cern-voltaire-ro usseau-and-borges-have-in-common/ Ginger On 1 September 2011 07:18, Daniel Kalchev wrote: On 31.08.11 23:07, Milton L Mueller wrote: If you can think of some simple way around this problem, more power to you. You'll get the Nobel prize. But please don't trivialize the difficulty of this problem, or attribute it to a conspiracy of evil neoliberals. (In fact, Chinese and Soviet Marxists are famous for putting the most emphasis on the production of physical goods and touting such statistics as proof of the superiority of socialism). This one reserved response, although some of the other points you debated are important. Take it however you like, that will not change history. But... believe it or not "they produce more so they claim to be superior" is what that (most call it "comunist" although it never ever claimed to have reached the 'communism' level) -- is exactly what was attributed to the "other side", that is "The Imperialism". So you see, both parties in that cold war pointed fingers at each other and claimed that the other side is practicing what the other side was accusing them of. Funny world. In reality however (having lived in the last decades of that system and the 'new' system thereafter), I can definitely claim that you are wrong. That system, possibly not a motivation but as a side effect (we will never know) has assigned lower priority to greed and production/consumption - it had significantly more focus on non-monetary benefits. Such as education and social benefits. Also, production was much, much lower. I do remember well our grandparent's opinion on this --- they have lived before/during WW2 and could compare the quality of life before/during/after that system --- and their opinion was very strong on this. So strong, that for decades now we have the situation that the primary voters for the former Communist (now, Socialist) Party were the so called "red grandmothers" -- who still lived in the past and their good memories were abused. That system was far from perfect, of course. But your assertion about focus on production is plain wrong. This all however is quite off-topic. Except, by the way, we started our work on Internet in Bulgaria during that system. Without the government even knowing it. Or the next few governments. Daniel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/ unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/ info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/ translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From cls at rkey.com Sat Sep 3 21:06:50 2011 From: cls at rkey.com (Craig Simon) Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2011 21:06:50 -0400 Subject: [governance] MEASURING the digital space - whose MEASURES apply, and whose do not In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4E62CF2A.1040500@rkey.com> I believe that Aadhaar is a highly significant development in this context... the question of a person's digitally-mediated social agency via electronic devices and globally accessible, biometrically linked identifiers. I'm not aware if Aadhaar has ever been discussed on this list (it's not global, but exclusive to India), but it's pertinent to understanding upcoming technology-driven shifts in mechanisms of governance and social service. Some links... http://uidai.gov.in/ http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/02/world/asia/02india.html On 9/1/11 11:42 AM, michael gurstein wrote: > > Good questions Craig... My use of "we" in the note was firstly refering to > the folks on this elist and secondarily I guess, although that wasn't part > of my thinking, CS as a whole. How the second "we" at least "constitute > themselves as agents" is part, I guess of the thinking that needs to be done > and is most certainly not a trivial question. > > Best, > > M > > > -----Original Message----- > From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf > Of Craig Simon > Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 2:56 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: Re: [governance] MEASURING the digital space - whose MEASURES > apply, and whose do not > > > Michael, > > The question ultimately hinges on who makes up the "we" in your > sentence, "my position was that we need to be thinking of global > governance institutions and thus global measurements/measurement > strategies..." How do the members of "we" constitute themselves as > agents capable of voicing grievances and making demands in the first > place? Who counts? Who gets counted? And so on. > > Of course, no practical mechanism exists to coalesce expressions of > their/our grievances and demands at a massively internetworked level > (despite my lonely efforts to build one). Consequently, there's lots of > open ground for individuals to show up in Internet governance fora like > these claiming they know what "Netizens" (or humans at an expressly > global level) want, or should want. That's politics, which is fine by > me. I don't think that we who participate on these discussion lists need > much reminding that "we" have yet to be heard. > > In any case, if the makeup of "we" ever is sorted out, building a > knowledgebase that draws sober and insightful attention to statistics of > economic well being will be an important test of institutional > legitimacy. So I applaud your efforts. > > Craig Simon > > On 8/31/11 3:56 PM, michael gurstein wrote: >> Very interesting Craig... >> >> I understand you here as linking the question of Internet measurement >> into the broader question of Internet identity i.e. as reflecting a >> shift away from "national" statistics to "identity" based statistics >> but understood in a global rather than a national context (to tie this >> discussion back into the earlier one--where my position was that we >> need to be thinking of global governance institutions and thus global >> measurements/measurement strategies, rather than national ones (such >> as the SNA/GDP etc. >> >> I'm not exactly sure where this goes from practically but I think >> conceptually you are suggesting something quite valuable. >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From aizu at anr.org Sun Sep 4 09:25:32 2011 From: aizu at anr.org (Izumi AIZU) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 22:25:32 +0900 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. Looking forward to seeing you guys there! izumi 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm : > Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF > meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the > evening of 26 September. > As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our > meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will > be at around 6:30pm on 26 September.  We will try not to take too long, in > order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining > afterwards will be able to get away on time. > There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an > opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. >  Suggested items for the agenda are: > > IGC's workshops at this IGF > Next coordinator elections > Working groups of the IGC > Strategic direction for the IGC > Review of the IGC charter > Other Internet governance processes > > If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. > Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. > -- > > Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > www.consumersinternational.org > Twitter @ConsumersInt > > Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless > necessary. > --                         >> Izumi Aizu <<           Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo            Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita,                                   Japan                                  * * * * *            << Writing the Future of the History >>                                 www.anr.org ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From amedinagomez at gmail.com Sun Sep 4 09:53:58 2011 From: amedinagomez at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Antonio_Medina_G=F3mez?=) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 08:53:58 -0500 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Best regards all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus. We will be working in colombia. Hub Remote Bucaramanga. University Autonoma of Bucarmanga. UNAB. Antonio Medina Gomez FGI Colombia 2011/8/31 Jeremy Malcolm > Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF > meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the > evening of 26 September. > > As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our > meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will > be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in > order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining > afterwards will be able to get away on time. > > There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an > opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. > Suggested items for the agenda are: > > > - IGC's workshops at this IGF > - Next coordinator elections > - Working groups of the IGC > - Strategic direction for the IGC > - Review of the IGC charter > - Other Internet governance processes > > > If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. > > Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > *www.consumersinternational.org* > *Twitter @ConsumersInt * > > Read our email confidentiality notice. > Don't print this email unless necessary. > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From glaser at cgi.br Sun Sep 4 10:23:21 2011 From: glaser at cgi.br (Hartmut Glaser) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 11:23:21 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I will be there. Sent from my iPhone Hartmut Glaser On 04/09/2011, at 10:25, Izumi AIZU wrote: > Hi, > > Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if > you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. > > For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. > > Looking forward to seeing you guys there! > > izumi > > 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm : >> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF >> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the >> evening of 26 September. >> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our >> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will >> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in >> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. >> Suggested items for the agenda are: >> >> IGC's workshops at this IGF >> Next coordinator elections >> Working groups of the IGC >> Strategic direction for the IGC >> Review of the IGC charter >> Other Internet governance processes >> >> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >> -- >> >> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >> Project Coordinator >> Consumers International >> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >> Malaysia >> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and >> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations >> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help >> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >> www.consumersinternational.org >> Twitter @ConsumersInt >> >> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >> necessary. >> > > > > -- > >> Izumi Aizu << > > Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo > > Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, > Japan > * * * * * > << Writing the Future of the History >> > www.anr.org > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jeanette at wzb.eu Sun Sep 4 12:11:29 2011 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Sun, 04 Sep 2011 17:11:29 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4E63A331.9080406@wzb.eu> I will attend as well. jeanette On 04.09.2011 15:23, Hartmut Glaser wrote: > I will be there. > > Sent from my iPhone > Hartmut Glaser > > On 04/09/2011, at 10:25, Izumi AIZU wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if >> you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. >> >> For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. >> >> Looking forward to seeing you guys there! >> >> izumi >> >> 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm: >>> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF >>> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the >>> evening of 26 September. >>> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our >>> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will >>> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in >>> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >>> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >>> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >>> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. >>> Suggested items for the agenda are: >>> >>> IGC's workshops at this IGF >>> Next coordinator elections >>> Working groups of the IGC >>> Strategic direction for the IGC >>> Review of the IGC charter >>> Other Internet governance processes >>> >>> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >>> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >>> -- >>> >>> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >>> Project Coordinator >>> Consumers International >>> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >>> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >>> Malaysia >>> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >>> >>> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >>> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and >>> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations >>> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help >>> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >>> www.consumersinternational.org >>> Twitter @ConsumersInt >>> >>> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >>> necessary. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Izumi Aizu<< >> >> Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo >> >> Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, >> Japan >> * * * * * >> << Writing the Future of the History>> >> www.anr.org >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Sun Sep 4 11:23:00 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 10:53:00 -0430 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: <4E63A331.9080406@wzb.eu> References: <4E63A331.9080406@wzb.eu> Message-ID: I expect to attend too. Ginger On 4 September 2011 11:41, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > I will attend as well. > jeanette > > > On 04.09.2011 15:23, Hartmut Glaser wrote: > >> I will be there. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> Hartmut Glaser >> >> On 04/09/2011, at 10:25, Izumi AIZU wrote: >> >> Hi, >>> >>> Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate >>> if >>> you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. >>> >>> For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. >>> >>> Looking forward to seeing you guys there! >>> >>> izumi >>> >>> 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm: >>> >>>> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi >>>> IGF >>>> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in >>>> the >>>> evening of 26 September. >>>> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our >>>> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand >>>> will >>>> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, >>>> in >>>> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >>>> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >>>> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >>>> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. >>>> Suggested items for the agenda are: >>>> >>>> IGC's workshops at this IGF >>>> Next coordinator elections >>>> Working groups of the IGC >>>> Strategic direction for the IGC >>>> Review of the IGC charter >>>> Other Internet governance processes >>>> >>>> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >>>> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >>>> -- >>>> >>>> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >>>> Project Coordinator >>>> Consumers International >>>> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >>>> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >>>> Malaysia >>>> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >>>> >>>> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >>>> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent >>>> and >>>> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member >>>> organisations >>>> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to >>>> help >>>> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >>>> www.consumersinternational.org >>>> Twitter @ConsumersInt >>>> >>>> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >>>> necessary. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >> Izumi Aizu<< >>> >>> Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo >>> >>> Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, >>> Japan >>> * * * * * >>> << Writing the Future of the History>> >>> www.anr.org >>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>> >>> ______________________________**______________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >> >> ______________________________**______________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mariliamaciel at gmail.com Sun Sep 4 12:00:42 2011 From: mariliamaciel at gmail.com (Marilia Maciel) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 13:00:42 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <4E63A331.9080406@wzb.eu> Message-ID: I will be there. Looking forward to see you all On Sun, Sep 4, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > > I expect to attend too. > Ginger > > > > On 4 September 2011 11:41, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > >> I will attend as well. >> jeanette >> >> >> On 04.09.2011 15:23, Hartmut Glaser wrote: >> >>> I will be there. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> Hartmut Glaser >>> >>> On 04/09/2011, at 10:25, Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate >>>> if >>>> you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. >>>> >>>> For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. >>>> >>>> Looking forward to seeing you guys there! >>>> >>>> izumi >>>> >>>> 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm: >>>> >>>>> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi >>>>> IGF >>>>> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus >>>>> in the >>>>> evening of 26 September. >>>>> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have >>>>> our >>>>> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand >>>>> will >>>>> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, >>>>> in >>>>> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >>>>> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >>>>> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >>>>> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is >>>>> ahead. >>>>> Suggested items for the agenda are: >>>>> >>>>> IGC's workshops at this IGF >>>>> Next coordinator elections >>>>> Working groups of the IGC >>>>> Strategic direction for the IGC >>>>> Review of the IGC charter >>>>> Other Internet governance processes >>>>> >>>>> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >>>>> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >>>>> Project Coordinator >>>>> Consumers International >>>>> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >>>>> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >>>>> Malaysia >>>>> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >>>>> >>>>> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >>>>> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent >>>>> and >>>>> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member >>>>> organisations >>>>> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to >>>>> help >>>>> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >>>>> www.consumersinternational.org >>>>> Twitter @ConsumersInt >>>>> >>>>> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >>>>> necessary. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >> Izumi Aizu<< >>>> >>>> Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo >>>> >>>> Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, >>>> Japan >>>> * * * * * >>>> << Writing the Future of the History>> >>>> www.anr.org >>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>> >>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>> >>>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>> >>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>> >>> ______________________________**______________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade FGV Direito Rio Center for Technology and Society Getulio Vargas Foundation Rio de Janeiro - Brazil -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From tapani.tarvainen at effi.org Sun Sep 4 13:35:44 2011 From: tapani.tarvainen at effi.org (Tapani Tarvainen) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 20:35:44 +0300 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20110904173544.GA3898@musti> On Sun, Sep 04, 2011 at 10:25:32PM +0900, Izumi AIZU (aizu at anr.org) wrote: > Hi, > > Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if > you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. I'll be there. -- Tapani Tarvainen ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dcogburn at syr.edu Sun Sep 4 13:42:48 2011 From: dcogburn at syr.edu (Derrick L. Cogburn) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 13:42:48 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Same for me, I'll not be in Kenya, but am organizing the Washington, DC IGF Remote Hub at the American University School of International Service. Safe travels everyone. Cheers, Derrick Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn Associate Professor of International Relations International Communication Program School of International Service American University http://american.edu/ Executive Director Center for Research on Collaboratories and Technology Enhanced Learning Communities (COTELCO) American University/Syracuse University http://cotelco.net/ Executive Director Institute on Disability and Public Policy (IDPP) for the ASEAN Region http://aseanidpp.org/ On Sep 4, 2011, at 6:54 AM, "Antonio Medina Gómez" > wrote: Best regards all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus. We will be working in colombia. Hub Remote Bucaramanga. University Autonoma of Bucarmanga. UNAB. Antonio Medina Gomez FGI Colombia 2011/8/31 Jeremy Malcolm <jeremy at ciroap.org> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the evening of 26 September. As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining afterwards will be able to get away on time. There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. Suggested items for the agenda are: * IGC's workshops at this IGF * Next coordinator elections * Working groups of the IGC * Strategic direction for the IGC * Review of the IGC charter * Other Internet governance processes If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. -- Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. www.consumersinternational.org Twitter @ConsumersInt Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From sdkaaa at gmail.com Sun Sep 4 13:44:13 2011 From: sdkaaa at gmail.com (Bernard Sadaka) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 17:44:13 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <4E63A331.9080406@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <636810349-1315158255-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-158227098-@b18.c4.bise7.blackberry> I will be there if time permits :) Best, Bernard Sent via my BlackBerry® smartphone -----Original Message----- From: Marilia Maciel Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 13:00:42 To: ; Ginger Paque Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,Marilia Maciel Cc: Izumi AIZU Subject: Re: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF I will be there. Looking forward to see you all On Sun, Sep 4, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > > I expect to attend too. > Ginger > > > > On 4 September 2011 11:41, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > >> I will attend as well. >> jeanette >> >> >> On 04.09.2011 15:23, Hartmut Glaser wrote: >> >>> I will be there. >>> >>> Sent from my iPhone >>> Hartmut Glaser >>> >>> On 04/09/2011, at 10:25, Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>>> >>>> Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate >>>> if >>>> you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. >>>> >>>> For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. >>>> >>>> Looking forward to seeing you guys there! >>>> >>>> izumi >>>> >>>> 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm: >>>> >>>>> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi >>>>> IGF >>>>> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus >>>>> in the >>>>> evening of 26 September. >>>>> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have >>>>> our >>>>> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand >>>>> will >>>>> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, >>>>> in >>>>> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >>>>> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >>>>> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >>>>> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is >>>>> ahead. >>>>> Suggested items for the agenda are: >>>>> >>>>> IGC's workshops at this IGF >>>>> Next coordinator elections >>>>> Working groups of the IGC >>>>> Strategic direction for the IGC >>>>> Review of the IGC charter >>>>> Other Internet governance processes >>>>> >>>>> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >>>>> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >>>>> -- >>>>> >>>>> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >>>>> Project Coordinator >>>>> Consumers International >>>>> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >>>>> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >>>>> Malaysia >>>>> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >>>>> >>>>> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >>>>> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent >>>>> and >>>>> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member >>>>> organisations >>>>> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to >>>>> help >>>>> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >>>>> www.consumersinternational.org >>>>> Twitter @ConsumersInt >>>>> >>>>> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >>>>> necessary. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> >> Izumi Aizu<< >>>> >>>> Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo >>>> >>>> Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, >>>> Japan >>>> * * * * * >>>> << Writing the Future of the History>> >>>> www.anr.org >>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>> >>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>> >>>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>> >>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>> >>> ______________________________**______________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade FGV Direito Rio Center for Technology and Society Getulio Vargas Foundation Rio de Janeiro - Brazil -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From carolinaaguerre at gmail.com Sun Sep 4 14:20:10 2011 From: carolinaaguerre at gmail.com (Carolina Aguerre) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 15:20:10 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: <636810349-1315158255-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-158227098-@b18.c4.bise7.blackberry> References: <4E63A331.9080406@wzb.eu> <636810349-1315158255-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-158227098-@b18.c4.bise7.blackberry> Message-ID: I'll be there. See you on 26. Carolina 2011/9/4 Bernard Sadaka > **I will be there if time permits :) > Best, > Bernard > > Sent via my BlackBerry® smartphone > ------------------------------ > *From: *Marilia Maciel > *Sender: *governance at lists.cpsr.org > *Date: *Sun, 4 Sep 2011 13:00:42 -0300 > *To: *; Ginger Paque > *ReplyTo: *governance at lists.cpsr.org,Marilia Maciel < > mariliamaciel at gmail.com> > *Cc: *Izumi AIZU > *Subject: *Re: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF > > I will be there. Looking forward to see you all > > On Sun, Sep 4, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > >> >> I expect to attend too. >> Ginger >> >> >> >> On 4 September 2011 11:41, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >> >>> I will attend as well. >>> jeanette >>> >>> >>> On 04.09.2011 15:23, Hartmut Glaser wrote: >>> >>>> I will be there. >>>> >>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>> Hartmut Glaser >>>> >>>> On 04/09/2011, at 10:25, Izumi AIZU wrote: >>>> >>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate >>>>> if >>>>> you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. >>>>> >>>>> For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. >>>>> >>>>> Looking forward to seeing you guys there! >>>>> >>>>> izumi >>>>> >>>>> 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm: >>>>> >>>>>> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi >>>>>> IGF >>>>>> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus >>>>>> in the >>>>>> evening of 26 September. >>>>>> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have >>>>>> our >>>>>> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I >>>>>> understand will >>>>>> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too >>>>>> long, in >>>>>> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >>>>>> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >>>>>> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >>>>>> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is >>>>>> ahead. >>>>>> Suggested items for the agenda are: >>>>>> >>>>>> IGC's workshops at this IGF >>>>>> Next coordinator elections >>>>>> Working groups of the IGC >>>>>> Strategic direction for the IGC >>>>>> Review of the IGC charter >>>>>> Other Internet governance processes >>>>>> >>>>>> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >>>>>> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >>>>>> -- >>>>>> >>>>>> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >>>>>> Project Coordinator >>>>>> Consumers International >>>>>> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >>>>>> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >>>>>> Malaysia >>>>>> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >>>>>> >>>>>> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer >>>>>> groups >>>>>> that, working together with its members, serves as the only >>>>>> independent and >>>>>> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member >>>>>> organisations >>>>>> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to >>>>>> help >>>>>> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >>>>>> www.consumersinternational.org >>>>>> Twitter @ConsumersInt >>>>>> >>>>>> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >>>>>> necessary. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> >> Izumi Aizu<< >>>>> >>>>> Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo >>>>> >>>>> Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, >>>>> Japan >>>>> * * * * * >>>>> << Writing the Future of the History>> >>>>> www.anr.org >>>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>>> >>>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>>> >>>>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>>> >>>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>> >>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>> >>>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>> >>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>> >>> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> > > > -- > Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade > FGV Direito Rio > > Center for Technology and Society > Getulio Vargas Foundation > Rio de Janeiro - Brazil > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From devonrb at gmail.com Sun Sep 4 14:43:27 2011 From: devonrb at gmail.com (devonrb at gmail.com) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 18:43:27 +0000 Subject: [governance] Wikileaks release and its implications for cybersecurity. In-Reply-To: <4E62CF2A.1040500@rkey.com> References: <4E62CF2A.1040500@rkey.com> Message-ID: <957340686-1315161806-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-142257987-@b11.c1.bise6.blackberry> Wikileaks has released over 251,000 US State Department Cables online from all over the world and containing what can be described as sensitive information for nations, communities, families and individuals. There are various issues of cbersecurity and Human rights involved here: Are the persons named in the cables victims of a cyber attack? Is anyone endangered by the public's knowledge of these cables. Where does the public's right to know ends and the individuals right to security begins? Anyone want to comment? Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Digicel -----Original Message----- From: Craig Simon Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org Date: Sat, 03 Sep 2011 21:06:50 To: Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,Craig Simon Subject: Re: [governance] MEASURING the digital space - whose MEASURES apply, and whose do not I believe that Aadhaar is a highly significant development in this context... the question of a person's digitally-mediated social agency via electronic devices and globally accessible, biometrically linked identifiers. I'm not aware if Aadhaar has ever been discussed on this list (it's not global, but exclusive to India), but it's pertinent to understanding upcoming technology-driven shifts in mechanisms of governance and social service. Some links... http://uidai.gov.in/ http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/02/world/asia/02india.html On 9/1/11 11:42 AM, michael gurstein wrote: > > Good questions Craig... My use of "we" in the note was firstly refering to > the folks on this elist and secondarily I guess, although that wasn't part > of my thinking, CS as a whole. How the second "we" at least "constitute > themselves as agents" is part, I guess of the thinking that needs to be done > and is most certainly not a trivial question. > > Best, > > M > > > -----Original Message----- > From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf > Of Craig Simon > Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 2:56 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: Re: [governance] MEASURING the digital space - whose MEASURES > apply, and whose do not > > > Michael, > > The question ultimately hinges on who makes up the "we" in your > sentence, "my position was that we need to be thinking of global > governance institutions and thus global measurements/measurement > strategies..." How do the members of "we" constitute themselves as > agents capable of voicing grievances and making demands in the first > place? Who counts? Who gets counted? And so on. > > Of course, no practical mechanism exists to coalesce expressions of > their/our grievances and demands at a massively internetworked level > (despite my lonely efforts to build one). Consequently, there's lots of > open ground for individuals to show up in Internet governance fora like > these claiming they know what "Netizens" (or humans at an expressly > global level) want, or should want. That's politics, which is fine by > me. I don't think that we who participate on these discussion lists need > much reminding that "we" have yet to be heard. > > In any case, if the makeup of "we" ever is sorted out, building a > knowledgebase that draws sober and insightful attention to statistics of > economic well being will be an important test of institutional > legitimacy. So I applaud your efforts. > > Craig Simon > > On 8/31/11 3:56 PM, michael gurstein wrote: >> Very interesting Craig... >> >> I understand you here as linking the question of Internet measurement >> into the broader question of Internet identity i.e. as reflecting a >> shift away from "national" statistics to "identity" based statistics >> but understood in a global rather than a national context (to tie this >> discussion back into the earlier one--where my position was that we >> need to be thinking of global governance institutions and thus global >> measurements/measurement strategies, rather than national ones (such >> as the SNA/GDP etc. >> >> I'm not exactly sure where this goes from practically but I think >> conceptually you are suggesting something quite valuable. >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mueller at syr.edu Sun Sep 4 15:05:41 2011 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 15:05:41 -0400 Subject: [governance] inter-regional dialogue Message-ID: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D717549370D2@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> There is a main session on Wednesday afternoon called "Inter-regional Dialogue." Can someone tell me what that is, what will go on there, how one might participate in it? Milton L. Mueller Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies Internet Governance Project http://blog.internetgovernance.org ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From lehto.paul at gmail.com Sun Sep 4 15:37:30 2011 From: lehto.paul at gmail.com (Paul Lehto) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 15:37:30 -0400 Subject: [governance] Wikileaks release and its implications for cybersecurity. In-Reply-To: <957340686-1315161806-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-142257987-@b11.c1.bise6.blackberry> References: <4E62CF2A.1040500@rkey.com> <957340686-1315161806-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-142257987-@b11.c1.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: On 9/4/11, devonrb at gmail.com wrote: > Wikileaks has released over 251,000 US State Department Cables [...] [...] > Is anyone endangered by the public's knowledge of these cables. > Where does the public's right to know ends and the individuals right to > security begins? Wherever the public's right to know ends", is the same place where unlimited, unaccountable power begins. Where would everyone here like unlimited unacountable power to exist? If anyone would, how do you know that whatever purpose or justification you might support it for by allowing this purpose to enjoy unaccountable power is a purpose that it will remain loyal to? Do we indulge in fantasies that secretive governmental wings are self-policing, self-limiting and will blow the whistle on themselves when they enjoy unaccountable power? Or that some secret court will render secret but real justice? This original post is either based is based on, or encourages, a false assumption: Wikileaks has meticulously avoided publishing names ever since some Afghan related documents many months ago. See http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2011/09/02/wikileaks/index.html In fact, it was a writer for the Guardian in conjunction with some other non wikileaks' actions that resulted in disclosure of names of individuals. Id. (see salon link) There is no doubt whatsoever that many of the governmental actions disclosed in the cables not only "endangered" individuals but severely *damaged* or killed them - and these governmental actions have been kept secret to date. To the extent the discussion of the acts or crimes disclosed by the cables is instead replaced by this kind of discussion about the potential "security implications" of "sensitive" information being brought to light, these crimes remain unaccountable. And why would anyone want the following things to remain unaccountable? Example One: First reported by John Glaser of Antiwar.com -- this example details a "heinous war crime [by U.S forces] during a house raid in Iraq in 2006, wherein one man, four women, two children, and three infants were summarily executed" and their house thereafter blown up by a U.S. airstrike in order to destroy the evidence. Back in 2006, the incident was discussed in American papers as a mere unproven "allegation" ("Regardless of which account is correct . . "), and the U.S. military (as usual) cleared itself of any and all wrongdoing. Defenders, anyone? Example Two: Wikileaks cable: UN peacekeepers in Ivory Coast traded food for sex with underage girls. http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/africa/wikileaks-cable-un-peacekeepers-in-ivory-coast-traded-food-for-sex-with-underage-girls/2011/09/01/gIQA885PuJ_story.html?tid=sm_twitter_washingtonpost Examples Three through Thirty-three: Here is a list of 30 significant cables compiled by wikileaks itself on August 29. http://wikileaks.org/30-new-revelations-from-wlfind.html -- Paul R Lehto, J.D. P.O. Box 1 Ishpeming, MI 49849 lehto.paul at gmail.com 906-204-4026 (cell) ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Sun Sep 4 15:47:29 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 07:47:29 +1200 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <4E63A331.9080406@wzb.eu> <636810349-1315158255-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-158227098-@b18.c4.bise7.blackberry> Message-ID: Dear All, I will be in Nairobi for the IGF and look forward to seeing you guys. Best, Sala On Mon, Sep 5, 2011 at 6:20 AM, Carolina Aguerre wrote: > I'll be there. See you on 26. > Carolina > > 2011/9/4 Bernard Sadaka > >> **I will be there if time permits :) >> Best, >> Bernard >> >> Sent via my BlackBerry® smartphone >> ------------------------------ >> *From: *Marilia Maciel >> *Sender: *governance at lists.cpsr.org >> *Date: *Sun, 4 Sep 2011 13:00:42 -0300 >> *To: *; Ginger Paque >> *ReplyTo: *governance at lists.cpsr.org,Marilia Maciel < >> mariliamaciel at gmail.com> >> *Cc: *Izumi AIZU >> *Subject: *Re: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF >> >> I will be there. Looking forward to see you all >> >> On Sun, Sep 4, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: >> >>> >>> I expect to attend too. >>> Ginger >>> >>> >>> >>> On 4 September 2011 11:41, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >>> >>>> I will attend as well. >>>> jeanette >>>> >>>> >>>> On 04.09.2011 15:23, Hartmut Glaser wrote: >>>> >>>>> I will be there. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> Hartmut Glaser >>>>> >>>>> On 04/09/2011, at 10:25, Izumi AIZU wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to >>>>>> indicate if >>>>>> you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. >>>>>> >>>>>> For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. >>>>>> >>>>>> Looking forward to seeing you guys there! >>>>>> >>>>>> izumi >>>>>> >>>>>> 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi >>>>>>> IGF >>>>>>> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus >>>>>>> in the >>>>>>> evening of 26 September. >>>>>>> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have >>>>>>> our >>>>>>> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I >>>>>>> understand will >>>>>>> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too >>>>>>> long, in >>>>>>> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >>>>>>> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >>>>>>> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >>>>>>> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is >>>>>>> ahead. >>>>>>> Suggested items for the agenda are: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> IGC's workshops at this IGF >>>>>>> Next coordinator elections >>>>>>> Working groups of the IGC >>>>>>> Strategic direction for the IGC >>>>>>> Review of the IGC charter >>>>>>> Other Internet governance processes >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >>>>>>> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >>>>>>> Project Coordinator >>>>>>> Consumers International >>>>>>> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >>>>>>> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala >>>>>>> Lumpur, >>>>>>> Malaysia >>>>>>> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer >>>>>>> groups >>>>>>> that, working together with its members, serves as the only >>>>>>> independent and >>>>>>> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member >>>>>>> organisations >>>>>>> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement >>>>>>> to help >>>>>>> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >>>>>>> www.consumersinternational.org >>>>>>> Twitter @ConsumersInt >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >>>>>>> necessary. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> >> Izumi Aizu<< >>>>>> >>>>>> Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo >>>>>> >>>>>> Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, >>>>>> Japan >>>>>> * * * * * >>>>>> << Writing the Future of the History>> >>>>>> www.anr.org >>>>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>>>> >>>>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>>>> >>>>>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>>>> >>>>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>>> >>>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>>> >>>>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>>> >>>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>> >>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>> >>>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>> >>>> >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade >> FGV Direito Rio >> >> Center for Technology and Society >> Getulio Vargas Foundation >> Rio de Janeiro - Brazil >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From matthias.kettemann at uni-graz.at Sun Sep 4 16:13:48 2011 From: matthias.kettemann at uni-graz.at (Matthias C. Kettemann) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 22:13:48 +0200 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4E63DBFC.8040707@uni-graz.at> I'll be there as well. Kind regards Matthias -- Matthias C. Kettemann, Mag. iur. , LL.M. (Harvard) Teaching and Research Fellow Institute of International Law and International Relations University of Graz Universitätsstraße 15/A4, 8010 Graz, Austria T | +43 316 380 6711 (office) M | +43 676 701 7175 (mobile) F | +43 316 380 9455 E | matthias.kettemann at uni-graz.at > > 2011/8/31 Jeremy Malcolm > > > Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the > Nairobi IGF meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet > Governance Caucus in the evening of 26 September. > > As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can > have our meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up > which I understand will be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We > will try not to take too long, in order that those from the > GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining afterwards will be able > to get away on time. > > There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an > opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is > ahead. Suggested items for the agenda are: > > * IGC's workshops at this IGF > * Next coordinator elections > * Working groups of the IGC > * Strategic direction for the IGC > * Review of the IGC charter > * Other Internet governance processes > > > If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. > > Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala > Lumpur, Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer > groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only > independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With > over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a > powerful international movement to help protect and empower > consumers everywhere. > _www.consumersinternational.org > _ > _Twitter @ConsumersInt _ > > Read our email confidentiality notice > . > Don't print this email unless necessary. > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From andrespiazza at gmail.com Sun Sep 4 17:05:49 2011 From: andrespiazza at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Andr=E9s_Piazza?=) Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2011 18:05:49 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <4E63A331.9080406@wzb.eu> <636810349-1315158255-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-158227098-@b18.c4.bise7.blackberry> Message-ID: I will be there. Andrés Piazza 2011/9/4, Carolina Aguerre : > I'll be there. See you on 26. > Carolina > > 2011/9/4 Bernard Sadaka > >> **I will be there if time permits :) >> Best, >> Bernard >> >> Sent via my BlackBerry® smartphone >> ------------------------------ >> *From: *Marilia Maciel >> *Sender: *governance at lists.cpsr.org >> *Date: *Sun, 4 Sep 2011 13:00:42 -0300 >> *To: *; Ginger Paque >> *ReplyTo: *governance at lists.cpsr.org,Marilia Maciel < >> mariliamaciel at gmail.com> >> *Cc: *Izumi AIZU >> *Subject: *Re: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF >> >> I will be there. Looking forward to see you all >> >> On Sun, Sep 4, 2011 at 12:23 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: >> >>> >>> I expect to attend too. >>> Ginger >>> >>> >>> >>> On 4 September 2011 11:41, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >>> >>>> I will attend as well. >>>> jeanette >>>> >>>> >>>> On 04.09.2011 15:23, Hartmut Glaser wrote: >>>> >>>>> I will be there. >>>>> >>>>> Sent from my iPhone >>>>> Hartmut Glaser >>>>> >>>>> On 04/09/2011, at 10:25, Izumi AIZU wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>>> >>>>>> Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to >>>>>> indicate >>>>>> if >>>>>> you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. >>>>>> >>>>>> For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. >>>>>> >>>>>> Looking forward to seeing you guys there! >>>>>> >>>>>> izumi >>>>>> >>>>>> 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi >>>>>>> IGF >>>>>>> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus >>>>>>> in the >>>>>>> evening of 26 September. >>>>>>> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have >>>>>>> our >>>>>>> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I >>>>>>> understand will >>>>>>> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too >>>>>>> long, in >>>>>>> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >>>>>>> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >>>>>>> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >>>>>>> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is >>>>>>> ahead. >>>>>>> Suggested items for the agenda are: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> IGC's workshops at this IGF >>>>>>> Next coordinator elections >>>>>>> Working groups of the IGC >>>>>>> Strategic direction for the IGC >>>>>>> Review of the IGC charter >>>>>>> Other Internet governance processes >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >>>>>>> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >>>>>>> Project Coordinator >>>>>>> Consumers International >>>>>>> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >>>>>>> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala >>>>>>> Lumpur, >>>>>>> Malaysia >>>>>>> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer >>>>>>> groups >>>>>>> that, working together with its members, serves as the only >>>>>>> independent and >>>>>>> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member >>>>>>> organisations >>>>>>> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> help >>>>>>> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >>>>>>> www.consumersinternational.org >>>>>>> Twitter @ConsumersInt >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >>>>>>> necessary. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> >> Izumi Aizu<< >>>>>> >>>>>> Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo >>>>>> >>>>>> Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, >>>>>> Japan >>>>>> * * * * * >>>>>> << Writing the Future of the History>> >>>>>> www.anr.org >>>>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>>>> >>>>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>>>> >>>>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>>>> >>>>>> Translate this email: >>>>>> http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>>>> >>>>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>>> >>>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>>> >>>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>>> >>>>> Translate this email: >>>>> http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>>> >>>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>> >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>> >>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>> >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>> >>>> Translate this email: >>>> http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>> >>>> >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade >> FGV Direito Rio >> >> Center for Technology and Society >> Getulio Vargas Foundation >> Rio de Janeiro - Brazil >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> > -- Enviado desde mi dispositivo móvil *Andrés Piazza* www.andrespiazza.com ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From pwilson at apnic.net Sun Sep 4 18:01:15 2011 From: pwilson at apnic.net (Paul Wilson) Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 08:01:15 +1000 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <83D1CE82-6B2A-416A-A3A4-2F99340D3F1A@apnic.net> I will be in Nairobi and hope to attend the IGC meeting. Paul. On 04/09/2011, at 11:25 PM, Izumi AIZU wrote: > Hi, > > Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if > you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. > > For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. > > Looking forward to seeing you guys there! > > izumi > > 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm : >> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF >> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the >> evening of 26 September. >> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our >> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will >> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in >> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. >> Suggested items for the agenda are: >> >> IGC's workshops at this IGF >> Next coordinator elections >> Working groups of the IGC >> Strategic direction for the IGC >> Review of the IGC charter >> Other Internet governance processes >> >> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >> -- >> >> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >> Project Coordinator >> Consumers International >> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >> Malaysia >> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and >> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations >> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help >> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >> www.consumersinternational.org >> Twitter @ConsumersInt >> >> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >> necessary. >> > > > > -- > >> Izumi Aizu << > > Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo > > Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, > Japan > * * * * * > << Writing the Future of the History >> > www.anr.org > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 1906 bytes Desc: not available URL: From dogwallah at gmail.com Mon Sep 5 00:01:06 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 07:01:06 +0300 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: <83D1CE82-6B2A-416A-A3A4-2F99340D3F1A@apnic.net> References: <83D1CE82-6B2A-416A-A3A4-2F99340D3F1A@apnic.net> Message-ID: I plan to attend as well. Rgds, McTim On Sep 5, 2011 1:02 AM, "Paul Wilson" wrote: > I will be in Nairobi and hope to attend the IGC meeting. > > Paul. > > > On 04/09/2011, at 11:25 PM, Izumi AIZU wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if >> you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. >> >> For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. >> >> Looking forward to seeing you guys there! >> >> izumi >> >> 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm : >>> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF >>> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the >>> evening of 26 September. >>> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our >>> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will >>> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in >>> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >>> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >>> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >>> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. >>> Suggested items for the agenda are: >>> >>> IGC's workshops at this IGF >>> Next coordinator elections >>> Working groups of the IGC >>> Strategic direction for the IGC >>> Review of the IGC charter >>> Other Internet governance processes >>> >>> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >>> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >>> -- >>> >>> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >>> Project Coordinator >>> Consumers International >>> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >>> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >>> Malaysia >>> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >>> >>> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >>> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and >>> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations >>> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help >>> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >>> www.consumersinternational.org >>> Twitter @ConsumersInt >>> >>> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >>> necessary. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Izumi Aizu << >> >> Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo >> >> Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, >> Japan >> * * * * * >> << Writing the Future of the History >> >> www.anr.org >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From nb at bollow.ch Mon Sep 5 02:03:25 2011 From: nb at bollow.ch (Norbert Bollow) Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 08:03:25 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: (message from Izumi AIZU on Sun, 4 Sep 2011 22:25:32 +0900) References: Message-ID: <20110905060326.0372B15C28E@quill.bollow.ch> Izumi AIZU wrote: > Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if > you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. Alas my flight's arrival time on Monday evening will not allow me to join the IGC meeting. I'm looking forward to meeting you at the IGF though... Greetings, Norbert ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gorka.orueta at ehu.es Mon Sep 5 02:59:40 2011 From: gorka.orueta at ehu.es (Gorka Orueta) Date: Mon, 05 Sep 2011 08:59:40 +0200 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF Message-ID: I will attend too, see you all there Gorka Orueta Estibariz Irakasleen eta Erakundeekiko Harremanen Dekanordea / Vicedecano de Profesorado y Relaciones Institucionalesgorka.orueta at ehu.es 946018378688673789 GIZARTE ETA KOMUNIKAZIO ZIENTZIEN FAKULTATEA /FACULTAD DE CIENCIAS SOCIALES Y DE LA COMUNICACION UPV/EHU Barrio Sarriena,s/n | 48940 LEIOA T.: +34 946018378 | F.: +34 946013299 www.ehu.es/csc ERNE! Baliteke mezu honen zatiren bat edo mezu osoa legez babestuta egotea. Mezuak badu bere hartzailea. Okerreko helbidera heldu bada (helbidea gaizki idatzi, transmisioak huts egin) eman abisu igorleari, korreo honi erantzunda. Kontuz! Mezua ez bada zuretzat, ez erabili, ez zabaldu beste inori, ez kopiatu eta ez baliatu. ¡ATENCIÓN! Este mensaje contiene información privilegiada o confidencial a la que sólo tiene derecho a acceder el destinatario. Si usted lo recibe por error le agradeceríamos que no hiciera uso de la información y que se pusiese en contacto con el remitente. E-mail hau inprimatu baino lehen egiaztatu inprimatzeko beharra. Antes de imprimir este e-mail piense bien si es necesario hacerlo. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Name: 8CB2BB59-BDB6-45C8-A6F3-73173926A0FE[1].png Type: image/png Size: 550 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From qshatti at gmail.com Mon Sep 5 04:21:25 2011 From: qshatti at gmail.com (Qusai Al-Shatti) Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 11:21:25 +0300 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6403BC4F-C6ED-48C2-8571-C9594371AB4B@gmail.com> I am planning to be there as well. Regards, Qusai Al-Shatti Sent from my iPhone On Sep 4, 2011, at 16:25, Izumi AIZU wrote: > Hi, > > Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if > you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. > > For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. > > Looking forward to seeing you guys there! > > izumi > > 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm : >> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF >> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the >> evening of 26 September. >> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our >> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will >> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in >> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. >> Suggested items for the agenda are: >> >> IGC's workshops at this IGF >> Next coordinator elections >> Working groups of the IGC >> Strategic direction for the IGC >> Review of the IGC charter >> Other Internet governance processes >> >> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >> -- >> >> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >> Project Coordinator >> Consumers International >> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >> Malaysia >> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and >> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations >> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help >> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >> www.consumersinternational.org >> Twitter @ConsumersInt >> >> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >> necessary. >> > > > > -- > >> Izumi Aizu << > > Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo > > Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, > Japan > * * * * * > << Writing the Future of the History >> > www.anr.org > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From philippe_dam at yahoo.fr Mon Sep 5 15:13:35 2011 From: philippe_dam at yahoo.fr (Dam Philippe) Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2011 20:13:35 +0100 (BST) Subject: [governance] FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION AND NEW MEDIA - Human Rights Committee In-Reply-To: <007f01cc528b$99b15810$cd140830$@planet.tn> References: <4E37E76E.9090804@ciroap.org> <1312398790.51994.YahooMailNeo@web161906.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <4E3A0B08.7030907@ciroap.org> <007f01cc528b$99b15810$cd140830$@planet.tn> Message-ID: <1315250015.30442.YahooMailNeo@web25704.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> http://www.ohchr.org/EN/NewsEvents/Pages/FreedomExpressionandnewmedia.aspx  Freedom of expression and new media When the UN Human Rights Committee last clarified the rights to freedom of opinion and expression, use of the internet was limited and the effect it would have on the mainstream media was still the subject of speculation.   More than two decades on, the Committee seeks to give practical application to freedom of opinion and expression in the radically altered media landscape which has the internet and mobile communications centre-stage. Describing “a global network to exchange ideas and opinions that does not necessarily rely on the traditional mass media”, the Committee says “States parties should take all necessary steps to foster the independence of these new media and to ensure access”. Any restrictions that might be applied to websites, blogs or any other internet-based networks or support systems should be limited, the Committee says, to content only and should not be applied to entire sites and systems. In the context of permissible restrictions generally, the Committee recommends extreme caution and provides many examples of situations where the urge to restrict freedom of expression should be resisted.  There are no circumstances which justify limiting freedom of opinion, the Committee notes in its revised General Comment. Lawmakers, judges, prosecutors, lawyers, human rights defenders, journalists and others will turn to the General Comment for guidance on the scope and practical applications of the rights to freedom of opinion and expression.    In the  International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights which sets out the right to freedom of expression, only two situations are described which justify its limitation: respect of the rights or reputations of others and protection of national security or of public order, or of public health or morals. The Covenant also prohibits advocacy of religious hatred. Allowing for those very limited exceptions, the Committee says blasphemy laws and prohibitions on displays of disrespect for a religion or other belief systems are a contravention of the right to freedom of expression, as are laws which favour one religion over another, or religious believers over non-believers, or which prevent or punish criticism of religious leaders or commentary on religious doctrine. The Committee notes that the Convention places a particularly high value on uninhibited debate concerning political figures and public institutions.  Laws which prohibit or restrict criticism of important people and institutions are cause for concern the Committee says.  “The mere fact that forms of expression are considered to be insulting to a public figure is not sufficient to justify the imposition of penalties… all public figures, including those exercising the highest political authority such as heads of state and government, are legitimately subject to criticism and political opposition”.  The same should apply to institutions such as the army. Committee member, Michael O’Flaherty says, “The main point of the general comment and of the Committee adopting it is that freedom of expression is at the heart of the entire human rights system.”  “That means,” he says, “we have to put up with a lot of speech that we don’t like. 1 September 2011 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From iza at anr.org Mon Sep 5 22:02:33 2011 From: iza at anr.org (Izumi AIZU) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 11:02:33 +0900 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Message-ID: It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, (or any other social tool). Facebook could be a good tool to share ideas and also outreach, though it also has drawbacks, too. We can discuss this as part of our agenda in Nairobi, but I like to hear those who could unfortunately come there in advance. best, izumi ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From isolatedn at gmail.com Mon Sep 5 23:19:43 2011 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian M) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 08:49:43 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello Izumi, +1 Sivasubramanian M On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 7:32 AM, Izumi AIZU wrote: > It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open > or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > > I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > (or any other social tool). Facebook could be a good tool to share > ideas and also outreach, though it also has drawbacks, too. > > We can discuss this as part of our agenda in Nairobi, but I like to hear > those who could unfortunately come there in advance. > > best, > > izumi > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Mon Sep 5 23:23:16 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 15:23:16 +1200 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Izumi, I am on facebook and so are many on the list, perhaps if you sent us the facebook handle, we can then add the page as friend. Sala On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Sivasubramanian M wrote: > Hello Izumi, > > > +1 > > > Sivasubramanian M > > > > On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 7:32 AM, Izumi AIZU wrote: > >> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >> >> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >> (or any other social tool). Facebook could be a good tool to share >> ideas and also outreach, though it also has drawbacks, too. >> >> We can discuss this as part of our agenda in Nairobi, but I like to hear >> those who could unfortunately come there in advance. >> >> best, >> >> izumi >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From nb at bollow.ch Tue Sep 6 03:19:28 2011 From: nb at bollow.ch (Norbert Bollow) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 09:19:28 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: (message from Izumi AIZU on Tue, 6 Sep 2011 11:02:33 +0900) References: Message-ID: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> Izumi AIZU wrote: > It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open > or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > > I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > (or any other social tool). I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for this purpose, perhaps a wiki? I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track record and attitude regarding privacy matters. Greetings, Norbert ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From baudouin.schombe at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 03:37:14 2011 From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com (Baudouin SCHOMBE) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 08:37:14 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I personally think it's a good idea and it is desirable that we exchanged by Facebook. Other social networks are acceptable, but Facebook is more appropriate depending of my own experience. Skype is also very suitable for exchanges between groups. I arrive in Nairobi on 26 to 16.20 and I will be at Jacaranda Hotel. Baudouin 2011/9/6 Izumi AIZU > It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open > or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > > I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > (or any other social tool). Facebook could be a good tool to share > ideas and also outreach, though it also has drawbacks, too. > > We can discuss this as part of our agenda in Nairobi, but I like to hear > those who could unfortunately come there in advance. > > best, > > izumi > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ ACADEMIE DES TIC FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre At-Large Member NCSG Member email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net tél:+243998983491 skype:b.schombe wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jeremy at ciroap.org Tue Sep 6 03:42:41 2011 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 15:42:41 +0800 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> Message-ID: <4E65CEF1.9020801@ciroap.org> On 06/09/11 15:19, Norbert Bollow wrote: > I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > > I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > record and attitude regarding privacy matters. There is already a wiki, at http://wiki.igf-online.net; feel free to use it. Everything at http://igf-online.net runs on 100% open source software, with no reliance on proprietary software or online services. I agree that we should not make Facebook too integral to our operations, due to the privacy concerns that many have about it. However, I suppose there is no harm to have it for those who are already Facebook users. -- *Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator* Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. _www.consumersinternational.org _ _Twitter @ConsumersInt _ Read our email confidentiality notice . Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 3762 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From tracyhackshaw at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 05:06:32 2011 From: tracyhackshaw at gmail.com (Tracy F. Hackshaw @ Google) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 05:06:32 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <4E65CEF1.9020801@ciroap.org> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E65CEF1.9020801@ciroap.org> Message-ID: +1 for Jeremy's suggestion -1 for Facebook On 9/6/11, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > On 06/09/11 15:19, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > There is already a wiki, at http://wiki.igf-online.net; feel free to use > it. Everything at http://igf-online.net runs on 100% open source > software, with no reliance on proprietary software or online services. > > I agree that we should not make Facebook too integral to our operations, > due to the privacy concerns that many have about it. However, I suppose > there is no harm to have it for those who are already Facebook users. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent > and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member > organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international > movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. > _www.consumersinternational.org _ > _Twitter @ConsumersInt _ > > Read our email confidentiality notice > . Don't > print this email unless necessary. > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ca at cafonso.ca Tue Sep 6 08:56:50 2011 From: ca at cafonso.ca (Carlos A. Afonso) Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> Message-ID: <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on Facebook, and I will not change my mind. frt rgds --c.a. On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: > Izumi AIZU wrote: >> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >> >> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >> (or any other social tool). > > I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > > I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > Greetings, > Norbert > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ca at cafonso.ca Tue Sep 6 08:57:46 2011 From: ca at cafonso.ca (Carlos A. Afonso) Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:57:46 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <4E65CEF1.9020801@ciroap.org> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E65CEF1.9020801@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <4E6618CA.2040102@cafonso.ca> Why not create our own social net, using, e.g, Open Atrium? --c.a. On 09/06/2011 04:42 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > On 06/09/11 15:19, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > There is already a wiki, at http://wiki.igf-online.net; feel free to use > it. Everything at http://igf-online.net runs on 100% open source > software, with no reliance on proprietary software or online services. > > I agree that we should not make Facebook too integral to our operations, > due to the privacy concerns that many have about it. However, I suppose > there is no harm to have it for those who are already Facebook users. > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From cveraq at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 09:04:39 2011 From: cveraq at gmail.com (cveraq at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 13:04:39 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch><4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice to be or not to be there. But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools Carlos Vera Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro -----Original Message----- From: "Carlos A. Afonso" Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 To: ; Norbert Bollow Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on Facebook, and I will not change my mind. frt rgds --c.a. On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: > Izumi AIZU wrote: >> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >> >> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >> (or any other social tool). > > I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > > I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > Greetings, > Norbert > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From cveraq at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 09:07:00 2011 From: cveraq at gmail.com (cveraq at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 13:07:00 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch><4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca><692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Sorry I mean greatest Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro -----Original Message----- From: cveraq at gmail.com Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 13:04:39 To: ; Carlos A. Afonso; Norbert Bollow Reply-To: cveraq at gmail.com Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice to be or not to be there. But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools Carlos Vera Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro -----Original Message----- From: "Carlos A. Afonso" Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 To: ; Norbert Bollow Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on Facebook, and I will not change my mind. frt rgds --c.a. On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: > Izumi AIZU wrote: >> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >> >> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >> (or any other social tool). > > I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > > I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > Greetings, > Norbert > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From iza at anr.org Tue Sep 6 09:12:04 2011 From: iza at anr.org (Izumi AIZU) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 22:12:04 +0900 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: Dear all, Thank you for the comments and suggestions. All seem valid and important. I did not intend to make Facebook page or group too integral with our operations, and I don't exclude using our wiki. Yet, since there are great many people who are using the Facebook already if not IGC members but they may share our concerns and interests in a larger sense, it might be useful to try this out. That is to start the Open page. On top of that, or instead of that, say for a while, we can use more private Group function, depending on the settings we can make it secret, closed but could be seen by anyone, or just open. I like to first try this "closed group" and see how it works (or not). izumi 2011/9/6 : > Sorry I mean greatest > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: cveraq at gmail.com > Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 13:04:39 > To: ; Carlos A. Afonso; Norbert Bollow > Reply-To: cveraq at gmail.com > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice to be or not to be there. > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > Carlos Vera > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > To: ; Norbert Bollow > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >>> or both. What do you think?  I think it's worth a try, at least. >>> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >>> (or any other social tool). >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>      governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >>      http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >     governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: >     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: >     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >     http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >     governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: >     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: >     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >     http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > --                         >> Izumi Aizu <<           Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo            Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita,                                   Japan                                  * * * * *                               www.anr.org ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From froomkin at law.miami.edu Tue Sep 6 09:30:05 2011 From: froomkin at law.miami.edu (Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 09:30:05 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Some of us don't use Facebook, so while duplicating content there may be a convenience, making it a unique source of anything will have the effect of cutting us out of the conversation. I don't use Facebook for two reasons: its architecture, and the fact that I teach and neither wish to 'friend' nor offend my students. You should also be aware that some US educational institutions (wrongly in my opinion, but no one asked me) actually *forbid* instructors to be on Facebook on pain of dismissal. On Tue, 6 Sep 2011, Izumi AIZU wrote: > It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open > or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > > I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > (or any other social tool). Facebook could be a good tool to share > ideas and also outreach, though it also has drawbacks, too. > > We can discuss this as part of our agenda in Nairobi, but I like to hear > those who could unfortunately come there in advance. > > best, > > izumi > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -- A. Michael Froomkin, http://www.law.tm Blog: http://www.discourse.net Laurie Silvers & Mitchell Rubenstein Distinguished Professor of Law Editor, Jotwell: The Journal of Things We Like (Lots), jotwell.com U. Miami School of Law, P.O. Box 248087, Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA +1 (305) 284-4285 | +1 (305) 284-6506 (fax) | froomkin at law.tm -->It's hot here.<-- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From b.schombe at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 09:29:03 2011 From: b.schombe at gmail.com (Baudouin SCHOMBE) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 14:29:03 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: ok +1 go SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN Téléphone mobile:+243998983491 email : b.schombe at gmail.com skype : b.schombe blog : http://akimambo.unblog.fr Site Web : www.ticafrica.net 2011/9/6 Izumi AIZU > Dear all, > > Thank you for the comments and suggestions. All seem valid and important. > > I did not intend to make Facebook page or group too integral with our > operations, > and I don't exclude using our wiki. > > Yet, since there are great many people who are using the Facebook already > if not IGC members but they may share our concerns and interests in a > larger sense, it might be useful to try this out. That is to start the > Open page. > On top of that, or instead of that, say for a while, we can use more > private > Group function, depending on the settings we can make it secret, closed but > could be seen by anyone, or just open. > > I like to first try this "closed group" and see how it works (or not). > > izumi > > > > 2011/9/6 : > > Sorry I mean greatest > > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: cveraq at gmail.com > > Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 13:04:39 > > To: ; Carlos A. Afonso; > Norbert Bollow > > Reply-To: cveraq at gmail.com > > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > > > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your > choice to be or not to be there. > > > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means > open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is > that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's > ok for millions including me. > > > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > > > Carlos Vera > > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > > To: ; Norbert Bollow > > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" > > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > > > frt rgds > > > > --c.a. > > > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: > >> Izumi AIZU wrote: > >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or > open > >>> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > >>> > >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > >>> (or any other social tool). > >> > >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > >> > >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > >> > >> Greetings, > >> Norbert > >> ____________________________________________________________ > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> To be removed from the list, visit: > >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >> > >> For all other list information and functions, see: > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >> > >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > >> > >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > > > > -- > >> Izumi Aizu << > Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo > Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, > Japan > * * * * * > www.anr.org > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From f.cortiana at provincia.milano.it Tue Sep 6 09:45:53 2011 From: f.cortiana at provincia.milano.it (Fiorello Cortiana) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 15:45:53 +0200 Subject: R: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <4E6618CA.2040102@cafonso.ca> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E65CEF1.9020801@ciroap.org> <4E6618CA.2040102@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: <95227A668FFBB141A238AE53582A8E11011E6F30@VEXNODE2.man.provincia.mi.it> Good idea Fiorello -----Messaggio originale----- Da: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] Per conto di Carlos A. Afonso Inviato: martedì 6 settembre 2011 14.58 A: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Jeremy Malcolm Cc: Norbert Bollow Oggetto: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Why not create our own social net, using, e.g, Open Atrium? --c.a. On 09/06/2011 04:42 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > On 06/09/11 15:19, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > There is already a wiki, at http://wiki.igf-online.net; feel free to > use it. Everything at http://igf-online.net runs on 100% open source > software, with no reliance on proprietary software or online services. > > I agree that we should not make Facebook too integral to our > operations, due to the privacy concerns that many have about it. > However, I suppose there is no harm to have it for those who are already Facebook users. > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From amedinagomez at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 09:49:58 2011 From: amedinagomez at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Antonio_Medina_G=F3mez?=) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 08:49:58 -0500 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <95227A668FFBB141A238AE53582A8E11011E6F30@VEXNODE2.man.provincia.mi.it> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E65CEF1.9020801@ciroap.org> <4E6618CA.2040102@cafonso.ca> <95227A668FFBB141A238AE53582A8E11011E6F30@VEXNODE2.man.provincia.mi.it> Message-ID: Good morning. Specifically what is the option to take? Antonio medina 2011/9/6 Fiorello Cortiana > Good idea > > Fiorello > > -----Messaggio originale----- > Da: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] Per conto > di Carlos A. Afonso > Inviato: martedì 6 settembre 2011 14.58 > A: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Jeremy Malcolm > Cc: Norbert Bollow > Oggetto: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > Why not create our own social net, using, e.g, Open Atrium? > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:42 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > > On 06/09/11 15:19, Norbert Bollow wrote: > >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > >> > >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > > > There is already a wiki, at http://wiki.igf-online.net; feel free to > > use it. Everything at http://igf-online.net runs on 100% open source > > software, with no reliance on proprietary software or online services. > > > > I agree that we should not make Facebook too integral to our > > operations, due to the privacy concerns that many have about it. > > However, I suppose there is no harm to have it for those who are already > Facebook users. > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From cveraq at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 09:53:20 2011 From: cveraq at gmail.com (cveraq at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 13:53:20 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch><4E65CEF1.9020801@ciroap.org><4E6618CA.2040102@cafonso.ca><95227A668FFBB141A238AE53582A8E11011E6F30@VEXNODE2.man.provincia.mi.it> Message-ID: <2087752076-1315317201-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-939971191-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Here is a SOCIAL net created by a young ecuadorian programmer www.comunicate.hostoi.com CVQ Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro -----Original Message----- From: Antonio Medina Gómez Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 08:49:58 To: ; Fiorello Cortiana Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,Antonio Medina Gómez Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Good morning. Specifically what is the option to take? Antonio medina 2011/9/6 Fiorello Cortiana > Good idea > > Fiorello > > -----Messaggio originale----- > Da: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] Per conto > di Carlos A. Afonso > Inviato: martedì 6 settembre 2011 14.58 > A: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Jeremy Malcolm > Cc: Norbert Bollow > Oggetto: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > Why not create our own social net, using, e.g, Open Atrium? > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:42 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > > On 06/09/11 15:19, Norbert Bollow wrote: > >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > >> > >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > > > There is already a wiki, at http://wiki.igf-online.net; feel free to > > use it. Everything at http://igf-online.net runs on 100% open source > > software, with no reliance on proprietary software or online services. > > > > I agree that we should not make Facebook too integral to our > > operations, due to the privacy concerns that many have about it. > > However, I suppose there is no harm to have it for those who are already > Facebook users. > > >____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > >____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mueller at syr.edu Tue Sep 6 09:56:44 2011 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 09:56:44 -0400 Subject: [governance] The European Commission Papers on ICANN Message-ID: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754970023@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> The IGP blog is doing a series on the EC Papers on ICANN. Should be food for thought for people on this list advocating a stronger role for national governments in governing the Internet. Here are the first two: Payback time: The European Commission papers on ICANN http://blog.internetgovernance.org/blog/_archives/2011/9/2/4891821.html The second EC ICANN Paper: How low can they go? http://blog.internetgovernance.org/blog/_archives/2011/9/4/4893009.html ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From rballeste at stu.edu Tue Sep 6 10:07:02 2011 From: rballeste at stu.edu (Balleste, Roy) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 10:07:02 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I will be present. Kind Regards, Roy Balleste Law Library Director Associate Professor of Law St. Thomas University 16401 NW 37th Avenue Miami Gardens, FL 33054 USA 1-305-623-2341 -----Original Message----- From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Izumi AIZU Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2011 9:26 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Jeremy Malcolm Subject: Re: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF Hi, Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. Looking forward to seeing you guys there! izumi 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm : > Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF > meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the > evening of 26 September. > As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our > meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will > be at around 6:30pm on 26 September.  We will try not to take too long, in > order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining > afterwards will be able to get away on time. > There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an > opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. >  Suggested items for the agenda are: > > IGC's workshops at this IGF > Next coordinator elections > Working groups of the IGC > Strategic direction for the IGC > Review of the IGC charter > Other Internet governance processes > > If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. > Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. > -- > > Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > www.consumersinternational.org > Twitter @ConsumersInt > > Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless > necessary. > --                         >> Izumi Aizu <<           Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo            Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita,                                   Japan                                  * * * * *            << Writing the Future of the History >>                                 www.anr.org ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu Tue Sep 6 10:19:45 2011 From: David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu (David Allen) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 10:19:45 -0400 Subject: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: <153290E2-618E-4BA6-941E-F10AEBADA3DE@post.harvard.edu> Well, between Carlos, Michael Froomkin and myself ... that is three of the 5 or 6 Internet users not on Facebook. And all of us here, in IGC ... I echo Michael Froomkin's concern with architecture (I think). Facebook, like AoL of yore, veers toward a closed silo, trying to fill so many needs of the user that there is hardly a need to venture beyond its walled garden. The advent on a Facebook email function settled the matter. How many years did we work, to make proprietary email systems interoperate? And now another one pops up, spawned by Facebook. 'Nuff said. Human beings have been social for what? - a hundred thousand years? Yes, we can use digital tools to make that even better. But not at the expense of selling ourselves and our relationships as advertising chattel. Most certainly, not at the expense of being captured in yet another walled garden. To that end: As has already been noted, any use of Facebook by IGC for information not distributed to _all_ will exclude those who are not on Facebook. And it seems virtually impossible to use Facebook without some exchanges that unavoidably contain important information, but that are trapped behind its wall. QED. David On Sep 6, 2011, at 8:56 AM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed >>> or open >>> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >>> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >>> (or any other social tool). >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jam at jacquelinemorris.com Tue Sep 6 10:21:00 2011 From: jam at jacquelinemorris.com (Jacqueline Morris) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 10:21:00 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <2087752076-1315317201-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-939971191-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E65CEF1.9020801@ciroap.org> <4E6618CA.2040102@cafonso.ca> <95227A668FFBB141A238AE53582A8E11011E6F30@VEXNODE2.man.provincia.mi.it> <2087752076-1315317201-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-939971191-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: I thought about this a long time. Facebook is a proprietary, private website. There are many many users, and it would be a reasonable thing to put the IGC information out there so that like-minded folks can find us. However, Facebook in itself seems to be totally against the principles of the IGC, and to expect people to go there to find IGC info would not be a good thing. So, I think that as a compromise, the IGC can have a FB page for outreach to the FB users, and direct people to the other IGC online locations to truly interact with us. Our main interaction should be on the public, opensource fora we have. I don't think it's necessary to have a separate social net for us... Jacqueline A. Morris Technology should be like oxygen: Ubiquitous, Necessary, Invisible and Free. (after Chris Lehmann ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From williams.deirdre at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 10:48:46 2011 From: williams.deirdre at gmail.com (Deirdre Williams) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 10:48:46 -0400 Subject: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <153290E2-618E-4BA6-941E-F10AEBADA3DE@post.harvard.edu> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <153290E2-618E-4BA6-941E-F10AEBADA3DE@post.harvard.edu> Message-ID: 4 - I'm one too :-) And I agree with what Jacqueline has to say, except for her last sentence: I don't think it's necessary to have a separate social net for us... which I suspect may be an irony anyway? "We" (the IGC) ARE a "social net", because "social nets" are not Facebook or MySpace or Second Life but an intercommunication of people which may (or may not) be facilitated by technology. Deirdre On 6 September 2011 10:19, David Allen wrote: > Well, between Carlos, Michael Froomkin and myself ... that is three of the > 5 or 6 Internet users not on Facebook. And all of us here, in IGC ... > > I echo Michael Froomkin's concern with architecture (I think). Facebook, > like AoL of yore, veers toward a closed silo, trying to fill so many needs > of the user that there is hardly a need to venture beyond its walled garden. > The advent on a Facebook email function settled the matter. How many years > did we work, to make proprietary email systems interoperate? And now > another one pops up, spawned by Facebook. 'Nuff said. > > Human beings have been social for what? - a hundred thousand years? Yes, > we can use digital tools to make that even better. But not at the expense > of selling ourselves and our relationships as advertising chattel. Most > certainly, not at the expense of being captured in yet another walled > garden. > > To that end: As has already been noted, any use of Facebook by IGC for > information not distributed to _all_ will exclude those who are not on > Facebook. And it seems virtually impossible to use Facebook without some > exchanges that unavoidably contain important information, but that are > trapped behind its wall. QED. > > David > > > On Sep 6, 2011, at 8:56 AM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on >> Facebook, and I will not change my mind. >> >> frt rgds >> >> --c.a. >> >> On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> >>> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> >>>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or >>>> open >>>> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >>>> >>>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >>>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >>>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >>>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >>>> (or any other social tool). >>>> >>> >>> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >>> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >>> >>> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >>> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >>> >>> Greetings, >>> Norbert >>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>> >>> >>> ______________________________**______________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >> >> >> > ______________________________**______________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t > > -- “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng Tue Sep 6 11:39:54 2011 From: sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng (Sonigitu Ekpe) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 16:39:54 +0100 Subject: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <153290E2-618E-4BA6-941E-F10AEBADA3DE@post.harvard.edu> Message-ID: + or - I will follow. Sonigitu Ekpe *Project Support Officer[Agriculturist]* Cross River Farm Credit Scheme Ministry of Agriculture and Natural Resources 3 Barracks Road P.M.B. 1119 Calabar - Cross River State, Nigeria. Mobile +234 805 0232 469 Office + 234 802 751 0179 Skype: sonigitu.asibong.ekpe.aji *"LIFE is all about love and thanksgiving" * On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 3:48 PM, Deirdre Williams wrote: > 4 - I'm one too :-) > > And I agree with what Jacqueline has to say, except for her last sentence: > > I don't think it's necessary to have a separate social net for us... > > which I suspect may be an irony anyway? > > "We" (the IGC) ARE a "social net", because "social nets" are not Facebook > or MySpace or Second Life but an intercommunication of people which may (or > may not) be facilitated by technology. > > Deirdre > > > On 6 September 2011 10:19, David Allen wrote: > >> Well, between Carlos, Michael Froomkin and myself ... that is three of the >> 5 or 6 Internet users not on Facebook. And all of us here, in IGC ... >> >> I echo Michael Froomkin's concern with architecture (I think). Facebook, >> like AoL of yore, veers toward a closed silo, trying to fill so many needs >> of the user that there is hardly a need to venture beyond its walled garden. >> The advent on a Facebook email function settled the matter. How many years >> did we work, to make proprietary email systems interoperate? And now >> another one pops up, spawned by Facebook. 'Nuff said. >> >> Human beings have been social for what? - a hundred thousand years? Yes, >> we can use digital tools to make that even better. But not at the expense >> of selling ourselves and our relationships as advertising chattel. Most >> certainly, not at the expense of being captured in yet another walled >> garden. >> >> To that end: As has already been noted, any use of Facebook by IGC for >> information not distributed to _all_ will exclude those who are not on >> Facebook. And it seems virtually impossible to use Facebook without some >> exchanges that unavoidably contain important information, but that are >> trapped behind its wall. QED. >> >> David >> >> >> On Sep 6, 2011, at 8:56 AM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: >> >> It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on >>> Facebook, and I will not change my mind. >>> >>> frt rgds >>> >>> --c.a. >>> >>> On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >>> >>>> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>>> >>>>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or >>>>> open >>>>> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >>>>> >>>>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >>>>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >>>>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >>>>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >>>>> (or any other social tool). >>>>> >>>> >>>> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >>>> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >>>> >>>> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >>>> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >>>> >>>> Greetings, >>>> Norbert >>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>>> >>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>> >>>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>>> >>>> >>>> ______________________________**______________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >>> >>> >>> >> ______________________________**______________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t >> >> > > > -- > “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William > Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979 > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From pouzin at well.com Tue Sep 6 11:39:36 2011 From: pouzin at well.com (Louis Pouzin (well)) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 17:39:36 +0200 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: *+1* ** On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 14:56, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mueller at syr.edu Tue Sep 6 11:45:08 2011 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 11:45:08 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> I am not a Facebook user either. From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Louis Pouzin (well) Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 11:40 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Cc: Carlos A. Afonso Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? +1 On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 14:56, Carlos A. Afonso > wrote: It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on Facebook, and I will not change my mind. frt rgds --c.a. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From DThompson1 at GOV.NU.CA Tue Sep 6 12:13:41 2011 From: DThompson1 at GOV.NU.CA (Thompson, Darlene) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 16:13:41 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> I would like to attend remotely Darlene A. Thompson CAP Administrator N-CAP/Department of Education P.O. Box 1000, Station 910 Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0 Phone: (867) 975-5631 Fax: (867) 975-5610 dthompson at gov.nu.ca ________________________________________ From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [governance at lists.cpsr.org] on behalf of Izumi AIZU [aizu at anr.org] Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2011 9:25 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Jeremy Malcolm Subject: Re: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF Hi, Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. Looking forward to seeing you guys there! izumi 2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm : > Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF > meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the > evening of 26 September. > As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our > meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will > be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in > order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining > afterwards will be able to get away on time. > There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an > opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. > Suggested items for the agenda are: > > IGC's workshops at this IGF > Next coordinator elections > Working groups of the IGC > Strategic direction for the IGC > Review of the IGC charter > Other Internet governance processes > > If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. > Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. > -- > > Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > www.consumersinternational.org > Twitter @ConsumersInt > > Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless > necessary. > -- >> Izumi Aizu << Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, Japan * * * * * << Writing the Future of the History >> www.anr.org ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From lmcknigh at syr.edu Tue Sep 6 12:21:57 2011 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 12:21:57 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> ,<75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> imho, if the Egyptian revolutionaries were not too concerned about closed/proprietary/flawed/insecure/privacy-violating architectures to use the common tools available - to communicate - neither should we. Now on other hand our internal core operations being built 100% open as Jeremy has done I applaud. But letting folks know in Nairobi via Facebook, or Twitter, or Foursquare, or whatever, where folks are planning to meet for dinner...and/or using Facebook for PR/mass political mobilization on issues we care about...is totally fine by me. And in full disclosure, even if I am not personally a Facebook fanatic, I have wasted time there. Lee ________________________________________ From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Milton L Mueller [mueller at syr.edu] Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 11:45 AM To: 'governance at lists.cpsr.org'; 'Louis Pouzin (well)' Subject: RE: [governance] IGC on Facebook? I am not a Facebook user either. From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Louis Pouzin (well) Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 11:40 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Cc: Carlos A. Afonso Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? +1 On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 14:56, Carlos A. Afonso > wrote: It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on Facebook, and I will not change my mind. frt rgds --c.a. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From marie.georges at noos.fr Tue Sep 6 13:07:34 2011 From: marie.georges at noos.fr (Marie GEORGES) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 19:07:34 +0200 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> ,<75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <450F64D7-3342-472F-A417-013B3E3B62D5@noos.fr> How come no one is setting up a non commercial "social network" where to subscribe for this group? + one who is not on Facebook and refuse to get there, Marie Le 6 sept. 2011 à 18:21, Lee W McKnight a écrit : > imho, if the Egyptian revolutionaries were not too concerned about closed/proprietary/flawed/insecure/privacy-violating architectures to use the common tools available - to communicate - neither should we. > > Now on other hand our internal core operations being built 100% open as Jeremy has done I applaud. > > But letting folks know in Nairobi via Facebook, or Twitter, or Foursquare, or whatever, where folks are planning to meet for dinner...and/or using Facebook for PR/mass political mobilization on issues we care about...is totally fine by me. And in full disclosure, even if I am not personally a Facebook fanatic, I have wasted time there. > > Lee > ________________________________________ > From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Milton L Mueller [mueller at syr.edu] > Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 11:45 AM > To: 'governance at lists.cpsr.org'; 'Louis Pouzin (well)' > Subject: RE: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > I am not a Facebook user either. > > From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Louis Pouzin (well) > Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 11:40 AM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Cc: Carlos A. Afonso > Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > +1 > > On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 14:56, Carlos A. Afonso > wrote: > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From madeeha_24 at hotmail.com Tue Sep 6 13:18:17 2011 From: madeeha_24 at hotmail.com (madeeha rehman) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 17:18:17 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear Jeremy, I am attending IGF 2011 and would like to be a part of IGC meeting in Nairobi. Best Regards,Madeeha Rehman From: jeremy at ciroap.org Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2011 23:37:21 -0400 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the evening of 26 September. As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining afterwards will be able to get away on time. There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. Suggested items for the agenda are: IGC's workshops at this IGFNext coordinator electionsWorking groups of the IGCStrategic direction for the IGCReview of the IGC charterOther Internet governance processes If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. -- Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. www.consumersinternational.org Twitter @ConsumersInt Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From roland at internetpolicyagency.com Tue Sep 6 13:24:40 2011 From: roland at internetpolicyagency.com (Roland Perry) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 18:24:40 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> Message-ID: In message <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6 at IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local>, at 16:13:41 on Tue, 6 Sep 2011, "Thompson, Darlene" writes >I would like to attend remotely So would I. -- Roland Perry ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From roland at internetpolicyagency.com Tue Sep 6 13:26:48 2011 From: roland at internetpolicyagency.com (Roland Perry) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 18:26:48 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <$2kMIAOYflZOFAPB@internetpolicyagency.com> In message <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B at suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu>, at 12:21:57 on Tue, 6 Sep 2011, Lee W McKnight writes >letting folks know in Nairobi via Facebook, or Twitter, or >Foursquare, or whatever, where folks are planning to meet for dinner... Yes, that's completely acceptable if you assume that your presence in Nairobi isn't a secret. -- Roland Perry ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ias_pk at yahoo.com Tue Sep 6 13:56:44 2011 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com (Imran Ahmed Shah) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 10:56:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF Message-ID: <1315331804.69024.yint-ygo-j2me@web161002.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Dear Izumi, Thank you for your email. With reference to your query that who is coming to attend meeting, would you please share information about travel support options availability and procedure for IGFPAK members. We would also like to join IGC meeting remotely. With reference to your query about participation Remote Hubs, I would like to include one of the IGF 2011 Remote Hub at International Islamic University, Islamabad (Pakistan), which is being organized by IGFPAK along with parallel IGFPAK 2011 meeting. Thanking you and Best Regards Imran Ahmed Shah - Urdu Internet Society (UISoc.org) - Internet Governance of Pakistan (IGFPAK.org) On Sun, 04 Sep 2011 18:25 PKT Izumi AIZU wrote: >Hi, > >Following Jeremy's invitation, I would also like to ask you to indicate if >you are coming to this meeting (and IGF) by replying to this thread. > >For those who will join with the remote hubs, please also let us know. > >Looking forward to seeing you guys there! > >izumi > >2011/9/1 Jeremy Malcolm : >> Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF >> meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the >> evening of 26 September. >> As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our >> meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will >> be at around 6:30pm on 26 September.  We will try not to take too long, in >> order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining >> afterwards will be able to get away on time. >> There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an >> opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. >>  Suggested items for the agenda are: >> >> IGC's workshops at this IGF >> Next coordinator elections >> Working groups of the IGC >> Strategic direction for the IGC >> Review of the IGC charter >> Other Internet governance processes >> >> If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. >> Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. >> -- >> >> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >> Project Coordinator >> Consumers International >> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >> Malaysia >> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and >> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations >> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help >> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >> www.consumersinternational.org >> Twitter @ConsumersInt >> >> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless >> necessary. >> > > > >-- >                        >> Izumi Aizu << > >          Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo > >           Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, >                                  Japan >                                 * * * * * >           << Writing the Future of the History >> >                                www.anr.org >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ca at cafonso.ca Tue Sep 6 14:00:20 2011 From: ca at cafonso.ca (Carlos A. Afonso) Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 15:00:20 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch><4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: <4E665FB4.8000703@cafonso.ca> 5-6. not 3-4! :) Frankly, I am appalled by this orkut-facebook-linkedin-etc-ec awe/adoration of corporate-owned so-called "social networks". Have fun! --c.a. On 09/06/2011 10:04 AM, cveraq at gmail.com wrote: > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice to be or not to be there. > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > Carlos Vera > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > To: ; Norbert Bollow > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >>> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >>> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >>> (or any other social tool). >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Tue Sep 6 14:04:28 2011 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 03:04:28 +0900 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <$2kMIAOYflZOFAPB@internetpolicyagency.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> <$2kMIAOYflZOFAPB@internetpolicyagency.com> Message-ID: >In message ><93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B at suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu>, >at 12:21:57 on Tue, 6 Sep 2011, Lee W McKnight >writes >>letting folks know in Nairobi via Facebook, or Twitter, or >>Foursquare, or whatever, where folks are planning to meet for dinner... > >Yes, that's completely acceptable if you assume that your presence >in Nairobi isn't a secret. Oh, caught. I'll try to be there. I use facebook, but usually only to find out about my sister-in-law's dog hair allergies (quite sad, they have young kids). Anyway, enough of mixing friends, family, work, and pets... Best, Adam >-- >Roland Perry >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From isolatedn at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 14:07:23 2011 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian M) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 23:37:23 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello Jeremy, I will attend. Sivasubramanian M ISOC India Chennai facebook: http://is.gd/x8Sh LinkedIn: http://is.gd/x8U6 Twitter: http://is.gd/x8Vz On Thu, Sep 1, 2011 at 9:07 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > Izumi and I would like to invite all those who will be at the Nairobi IGF > meeting to attend a general meeting of the Internet Governance Caucus in the > evening of 26 September. > > As in recent years, GIGANET have generously offered that we can have our > meeting in their room after their symposium wraps up which I understand will > be at around 6:30pm on 26 September. We will try not to take too long, in > order that those from the GIGANET or APC meetings who will be dining > afterwards will be able to get away on time. > > There will be no decisions taken at the meeting, but it will be an > opportunity for review of the past year and discussion of what is ahead. > Suggested items for the agenda are: > > > - IGC's workshops at this IGF > - Next coordinator elections > - Working groups of the IGC > - Strategic direction for the IGC > - Review of the IGC charter > - Other Internet governance processes > > > If you have any other items to discuss, please reply to this thread. > > Thanks and we look forward to seeing you there if you can make it. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > *www.consumersinternational.org* > *Twitter @ConsumersInt * > > Read our email confidentiality notice. > Don't print this email unless necessary. > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gurstein at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 14:09:23 2011 From: gurstein at gmail.com (michael gurstein) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 11:09:23 -0700 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <4E665FB4.8000703@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: Unfortunately my kids/grandkids have forgotten how to email (or use the telephone) and Facebook seems to be the only way of keeping track of their comings and goings :( M -----Original Message----- From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Carlos A. Afonso Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 11:00 AM To: cveraq at gmail.com Cc: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Norbert Bollow Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? 5-6. not 3-4! :) Frankly, I am appalled by this orkut-facebook-linkedin-etc-ec awe/adoration of corporate-owned so-called "social networks". Have fun! --c.a. On 09/06/2011 10:04 AM, cveraq at gmail.com wrote: > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your > choice to be or not to be there. > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL > means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook > is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. > So, it's ok for millions including me. > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > Carlos Vera > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerryR de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > To: ; Norbert Bollow > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed >>> or open or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at >>> least. >>> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi to >>> share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some online >>> facility. Other than mailing list and official website, we have not >>> much, and then realized how about using Facebook, (or any other >>> social tool). >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jam at jacquelinemorris.com Tue Sep 6 14:14:20 2011 From: jam at jacquelinemorris.com (Jacqueline Morris) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 14:14:20 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <4E665FB4.8000703@cafonso.ca> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <4E665FB4.8000703@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: I don't think it's awe or adoration, but a practical idea to get information about IGC and the issues we care about to a larger audience and invite other people to participate in the IGC. If you want to market anything, you have to go where the people are... and then we can bring them here. Jacqueline A. Morris Technology should be like oxygen: Ubiquitous, Necessary, Invisible and Free. (after Chris Lehmann ) On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: > 5-6. not 3-4! :) > > Frankly, I am appalled by this orkut-facebook-linkedin-etc-ec > awe/adoration of corporate-owned so-called "social networks". > > Have fun! > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 10:04 AM, cveraq at gmail.com wrote: > > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your > choice to be or not to be there. > > > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means > open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is > that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's > ok for millions including me. > > > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > > > Carlos Vera > > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > > To: ; Norbert Bollow > > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" > > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > > > frt rgds > > > > --c.a. > > > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: > >> Izumi AIZU wrote: > >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or > open > >>> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > >>> > >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > >>> (or any other social tool). > >> > >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > >> > >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > >> > >> Greetings, > >> Norbert > >> ____________________________________________________________ > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> To be removed from the list, visit: > >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >> > >> For all other list information and functions, see: > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >> > >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > >> > >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From fatimacambronero at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 14:33:10 2011 From: fatimacambronero at gmail.com (Fatima Cambronero) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 15:33:10 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <4E665FB4.8000703@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: 2011/9/6 Jacqueline Morris > I don't think it's awe or adoration, but a practical idea to get > information about IGC and the issues we care about to a larger audience and > invite other people to participate in the IGC. > If you want to market anything, you have to go where the people are... and > then we can bring them here. > Jacqueline, I agree with you. Fatima > > Jacqueline A. Morris > Technology should be like oxygen: Ubiquitous, Necessary, Invisible and > Free. (after Chris Lehmann ) > > > > On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 2:00 PM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: > >> 5-6. not 3-4! :) >> >> Frankly, I am appalled by this orkut-facebook-linkedin-etc-ec >> awe/adoration of corporate-owned so-called "social networks". >> >> Have fun! >> >> --c.a. >> >> On 09/06/2011 10:04 AM, cveraq at gmail.com wrote: >> > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your >> choice to be or not to be there. >> > >> > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL >> means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. >> > >> > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! >> > >> > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook >> is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, >> it's ok for millions including me. >> > >> > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools >> > >> > Carlos Vera >> > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" >> > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 >> > To: ; Norbert Bollow >> > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" >> > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? >> > >> > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on >> > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. >> > >> > frt rgds >> > >> > --c.a. >> > >> > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> >> Izumi AIZU wrote: >> >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or >> open >> >>> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >> >>> >> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >> >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >> >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >> >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >> >>> (or any other social tool). >> >> >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> >> >> Greetings, >> >> Norbert >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ >> > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > To be removed from the list, visit: >> > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> > >> > For all other list information and functions, see: >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> > http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> > >> > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> > >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- *Fatima Cambronero* Abogada-Argentina Directora de Investigaciones *AGEIA DENSI Argentina* http://ar.ageiadensi.org/ *@facambronero* *Join the LACRALO/ICANN discussions:* https://atlarge-lists.icann.org/mailman/listinfo/lac-discuss-es -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mariliamaciel at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 15:55:32 2011 From: mariliamaciel at gmail.com (Marilia Maciel) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 16:55:32 -0300 Subject: [governance] Sign the declaration on public interest and intellectual property Message-ID: Dear all, I would like to invite you to read and sign the Washington declaration on Intellectual property. The declaration is a result of the discussions in the Global Congress on public interest and IP, that gathered a group of over 170 policymakers and advocates from approximately 35 countries. The Declaration provides a series of specific recommendations for action by the international intellectual property public interest community and covers topics such as: valuing openess and the public domain, strengthening limitations and exceptions and setting public interest priorities for patent reform. The document is available at: http://infojustice.org/washington-declaration# Best, Marília -- Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade FGV Direito Rio Center for Technology and Society Getulio Vargas Foundation Rio de Janeiro - Brazil -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ca at cafonso.ca Tue Sep 6 16:26:56 2011 From: ca at cafonso.ca (Carlos A. Afonso) Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 17:26:56 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> <$2kMIAOYflZOFAPB@internetpolicyagency.com> Message-ID: <4E668210.2080409@cafonso.ca> ... and secrets! :) --c.a. On 09/06/2011 03:04 PM, Adam Peake wrote: >> In message >> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B at suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu>, >> at 12:21:57 on Tue, 6 Sep 2011, Lee W McKnight writes >>> letting folks know in Nairobi via Facebook, or Twitter, or >>> Foursquare, or whatever, where folks are planning to meet for dinner... >> >> Yes, that's completely acceptable if you assume that your presence in >> Nairobi isn't a secret. > > > Oh, caught. > > I'll try to be there. I use facebook, but usually only to find out > about my sister-in-law's dog hair allergies (quite sad, they have young > kids). Anyway, enough of mixing friends, family, work, and pets... > > Best, > > Adam > > > > > >> -- >> Roland Perry >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu Tue Sep 6 16:39:55 2011 From: David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu (David Allen) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 16:39:55 -0400 Subject: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> ,<75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: > imho, if the Egyptian revolutionaries were not too concerned about > closed/proprietary/flawed/insecure/privacy-violating architectures > to use the common tools available Happily, the Arab spring had some new tools, however flawed, that helped put it / them over the top. Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a policy group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / innovating tools that are even more common - and of quality. Instead of selling ourselves to marketeers ... ... creating a piece of IGC that some members cannot see. David ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From correia.rui at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 16:49:57 2011 From: correia.rui at gmail.com (Rui Correia) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 21:49:57 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: Hey Carlos How long will you hold out? your 5-6 just got mowed down to 3-4 in three minutes! They are coming for you! ;-) Um abraço, Rui 2011/9/6 > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice > to be or not to be there. > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means > open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is > that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's > ok for millions including me. > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > Carlos Vera > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > To: ; Norbert Bollow > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: > > Izumi AIZU wrote: > >> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or > open > >> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > >> > >> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > >> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > >> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > >> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > >> (or any other social tool). > > > > I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > > this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > > > > I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > > record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > > > Greetings, > > Norbert > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant _______________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From cveraq at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 16:50:16 2011 From: cveraq at gmail.com (cveraq at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 20:50:16 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch><4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca><692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: <131598194-1315342255-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1243021030-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> :) it's internet time Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro -----Original Message----- From: Rui Correia Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 21:49:57 To: ; Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Hey Carlos How long will you hold out? your 5-6 just got mowed down to 3-4 in three minutes! They are coming for you! ;-) Um abraço, Rui 2011/9/6 > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice > to be or not to be there. > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means > open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is > that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's > ok for millions including me. > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > Carlos Vera > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > To: ; Norbert Bollow > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: > > Izumi AIZU wrote: > >> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or > open > >> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > >> > >> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > >> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > >> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > >> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > >> (or any other social tool). > > > > I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > > this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > > > > I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > > record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > > > Greetings, > > Norbert > >____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > >____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > >____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant _______________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 16:53:57 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 16:23:57 -0430 Subject: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Agree with David... On 6 September 2011 16:09, David Allen wrote: > > Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a policy > group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / innovating > tools that are even more common - and of quality. Instead of selling > ourselves to marketeers ... > > ... creating a piece of IGC that some members cannot see. > > David > > > ______________________________**______________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From shailam at yahoo.com Tue Sep 6 17:59:44 2011 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 14:59:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: <1315346384.53104.YahooMailNeo@web161911.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> I guess they are "coming for me too" shaila :):)   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: Rui Correia To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, September 6, 2011 1:49 PM Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Hey Carlos How long will you hold out? your 5-6 just got mowed down to 3-4 in three minutes! They are coming for you! ;-) Um abraço, Rui 2011/9/6 Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice to be or not to be there. > >But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > >The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > >IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. > >Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > >Carlos Vera >Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > >-----Original Message----- >From: "Carlos A. Afonso" >Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org >Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 >To: ; Norbert Bollow >Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" >Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > >It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on >Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > >frt rgds > >--c.a. > >On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >>> or both. What do you think?  I think it's worth a try, at least. >>> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >>> (or any other social tool). >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>      governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >>      http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant   _______________   ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From cveraq at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 18:02:54 2011 From: cveraq at gmail.com (cveraq at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 22:02:54 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <1315346384.53104.YahooMailNeo@web161911.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1315346384.53104.YahooMailNeo@web161911.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <612221881-1315346611-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610918866-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> If there are no problems! Then no solutions, no innovations, no internet2, no nothing. I love problems because they are always an opportunity.. In stone age, no IP problems, no privacy concerns, but I"m still happy to be here and now! Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro -----Original Message----- From: shaila mistry Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 14:59:44 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com; Rui Correia Reply-To: shaila mistry Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? I guess they are "coming for me too" shaila :):)   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: Rui Correia To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, September 6, 2011 1:49 PM Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Hey Carlos How long will you hold out? your 5-6 just got mowed down to 3-4 in three minutes! They are coming for you! ;-) Um abraço, Rui 2011/9/6 Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice to be or not to be there. > >But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > >The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > >IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. > >Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > >Carlos Vera >Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > >-----Original Message----- >From: "Carlos A. Afonso" >Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org >Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 >To: ; Norbert Bollow >Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" >Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > >It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on >Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > >frt rgds > >--c.a. > >On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >>> or both. What do you think?  I think it's worth a try, at least. >>> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >>> (or any other social tool). >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert >>____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>      governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >>      http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant   _______________   ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From amedinagomez at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 18:14:30 2011 From: amedinagomez at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Antonio_Medina_G=F3mez?=) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 17:14:30 -0500 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <612221881-1315346611-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610918866-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1315346384.53104.YahooMailNeo@web161911.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <612221881-1315346611-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610918866-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: +1 2011/9/6 > If there are no problems! Then no solutions, no innovations, no internet2, > no nothing. I love problems because they are always an opportunity.. In > stone age, no IP problems, no privacy concerns, but I"m still happy to be > here and now! > > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > ------------------------------ > *From: * shaila mistry > *Date: *Tue, 6 Sep 2011 14:59:44 -0700 (PDT) > *To: *governance at lists.cpsr.org; > cveraq at gmail.com; Rui Correia > *ReplyTo: * shaila mistry > *Subject: *Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > I guess they are "coming for me too" > shaila :):) > > *The journey begins sooner than you anticipate !* > *..................... the renaissance of composure ! > * > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Rui Correia > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 6, 2011 1:49 PM > *Subject:* Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > Hey Carlos > > How long will you hold out? your 5-6 just got mowed down to 3-4 in three > minutes! They are coming for you! ;-) > > Um abraço, > > Rui > > 2011/9/6 > > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice > to be or not to be there. > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means > open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is > that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's > ok for millions including me. > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > Carlos Vera > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > To: ; Norbert Bollow > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: > > Izumi AIZU wrote: > >> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or > open > >> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > >> > >> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > >> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > >> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > >> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > >> (or any other social tool). > > > > I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > > this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > > > > I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > > record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > > > Greetings, > > Norbert > >____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > -- > _________________________ > Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 > Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 > > I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African > numbers > Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através > dos meus números sul-africanos > > Rui Correia > Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant > Angola Liaison Consultant > > _______________ > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From shailam at yahoo.com Tue Sep 6 18:44:55 2011 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 15:44:55 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <612221881-1315346611-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610918866-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1315346384.53104.YahooMailNeo@web161911.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <612221881-1315346611-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610918866-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: <1315349095.26513.YahooMailNeo@web161912.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> The issue is we need open digital platform/space to share ideas, knowledge, network and collaborate etc  but we also want privacy protection !!! Can we have both and how good is Facebook or any other in respecting privacy ? shaila The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: "cveraq at gmail.com" To: shaila mistry ; "governance at lists.cpsr.org" ; Rui Correia Sent: Tuesday, September 6, 2011 3:02 PM Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? If there are no problems! Then no solutions, no innovations, no internet2, no nothing. I love problems because they are always an opportunity.. In stone age, no IP problems, no privacy concerns, but I"m still happy to be here and now! Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro ________________________________ From: shaila mistry Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 14:59:44 -0700 (PDT) To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com; Rui Correia ReplyTo: shaila mistry Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? I guess they are "coming for me too" shaila :):)   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: Rui Correia To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, September 6, 2011 1:49 PM Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Hey Carlos How long will you hold out? your 5-6 just got mowed down to 3-4 in three minutes! They are coming for you! ;-) Um abraço, Rui 2011/9/6 Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice to be or not to be there. > >But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > >The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > >IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. > >Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > >Carlos Vera >Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > >-----Original Message----- >From: "Carlos A. Afonso" >Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org >Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 >To: ; Norbert Bollow >Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" >Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > >It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on >Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > >frt rgds > >--c.a. > >On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >>> or both. What do you think?  I think it's worth a try, at least. >>> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >>> (or any other social tool). >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert >>____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>      governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >>      http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant   _______________   ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From cveraq at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 19:03:23 2011 From: cveraq at gmail.com (cveraq at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 23:03:23 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <1315349095.26513.YahooMailNeo@web161912.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1315346384.53104.YahooMailNeo@web161911.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <612221881-1315346611-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610918866-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry><1315349095.26513.YahooMailNeo@web161912.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <2074254519-1315350241-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-322742374-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> You have what you pay for! Facebook is free so sharing data and sending you info is about the business model for they to make money. There are other platforms and choices so it's about you to make a decision. You can open a new email account, put a code name and fake info and open a facebook account just to participate in IGF.. Or enjoy, as me, facebook and share it with friends, relatives, parents, grandma, sons and even with IGF's people! No matter what you're always nake on Internet and privacy is only a remember from a long long time ago! Isn't it? Carlos Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro -----Original Message----- From: shaila mistry Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 15:44:55 To: cveraq at gmail.com; governance at lists.cpsr.org; Rui Correia Reply-To: shaila mistry Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? The issue is we need open digital platform/space to share ideas, knowledge, network and collaborate etc  but we also want privacy protection !!! Can we have both and how good is Facebook or any other in respecting privacy ? shaila The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: "cveraq at gmail.com" To: shaila mistry ; "governance at lists.cpsr.org" ; Rui Correia Sent: Tuesday, September 6, 2011 3:02 PM Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? If there are no problems! Then no solutions, no innovations, no internet2, no nothing. I love problems because they are always an opportunity.. In stone age, no IP problems, no privacy concerns, but I"m still happy to be here and now! Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro ________________________________ From: shaila mistry Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 14:59:44 -0700 (PDT) To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com; Rui Correia ReplyTo: shaila mistry Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? I guess they are "coming for me too" shaila :):)   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: Rui Correia To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com Sent: Tuesday, September 6, 2011 1:49 PM Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Hey Carlos How long will you hold out? your 5-6 just got mowed down to 3-4 in three minutes! They are coming for you! ;-) Um abraço, Rui 2011/9/6 Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice to be or not to be there. > >But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > >The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > >IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. > >Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > >Carlos Vera >Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > >-----Original Message----- >From: "Carlos A. Afonso" >Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org >Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 >To: ; Norbert Bollow >Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" >Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > >It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on >Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > >frt rgds > >--c.a. > >On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> Izumi AIZU wrote: >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >>> or both. What do you think?  I think it's worth a try, at least. >>> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >>> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >>> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >>> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >>> (or any other social tool). >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert >>____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>      governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >>      http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>      http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant   _______________   ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From nb at bollow.ch Tue Sep 6 19:53:18 2011 From: nb at bollow.ch (Norbert Bollow) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 01:53:18 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: (message from David Allen on Tue, 6 Sep 2011 16:39:55 -0400) References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> ,<75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <20110906235318.612D015C28E@quill.bollow.ch> David Allen wrote: > Happily, the Arab spring had some new tools, however flawed, that > helped put it / them over the top. Yes. Obviously the Arab spring activists didn't worry much about what a "social networking" / marketing company would do with their data. Whether such lack of concern is justified is a different question. There's a lot of scenarios where such lack of concern could turn out to be very harmful. For example, I'd be very surprised if the secret services of all remaining oppressive governments aren't working very hard on gaining access e.g. to the internal network of Facebook, and on developing strategies for exploiting whatever architectural or other flaws of Facebook they may be able to discover. > Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a policy > group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / > innovating tools that are even more common - and of quality. Instead > of selling ourselves to marketeers ... Strongly agreed. We may not succeed in avoiding every flaw, but at least we can work towards creating communication tools etc that avoid the worst flaws, and we can avoid "selling ourselves to marketeers" in the sense of effectively requiring people to join Facebook (or any other service with similar privacy concerns and/or lock-in effects) in order to fully participate in IGC internal "who meets whom when and where while in Nairobi" coordination. Greetings, Norbert ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From isolatedn at gmail.com Tue Sep 6 20:32:18 2011 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian M) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 06:02:18 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: After all these discussions, still +1 to the idea of connecting. What would be the most acceptable or least unacceptable solution? Google +? Innovative use of Wordpress ? An skype conversation with all of IGC on the conversation ? Anything is good, despite the drawbacks. Sivasubramanian M On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 8:49 AM, Sivasubramanian M wrote: > Hello Izumi, > > > +1 > > > Sivasubramanian M > > > > On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 7:32 AM, Izumi AIZU wrote: > >> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed or open >> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >> >> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi >> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some >> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, >> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, >> (or any other social tool). Facebook could be a good tool to share >> ideas and also outreach, though it also has drawbacks, too. >> >> We can discuss this as part of our agenda in Nairobi, but I like to hear >> those who could unfortunately come there in advance. >> >> best, >> >> izumi >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From roland at internetpolicyagency.com Wed Sep 7 03:05:14 2011 From: roland at internetpolicyagency.com (Roland Perry) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 08:05:14 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: In message , at 09:30:05 on Tue, 6 Sep 2011, Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law writes >You should also be aware that some US educational institutions (wrongly >in my opinion, but no one asked me) actually *forbid* instructors to be >on Facebook on pain of dismissal. And I've heard of educational institutions which in effect require all students and instructors to be members of Facebook, because that's what is used to organise seminars etc. -- Roland Perry ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From roland at internetpolicyagency.com Wed Sep 7 03:08:48 2011 From: roland at internetpolicyagency.com (Roland Perry) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 08:08:48 +0100 Subject: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <153290E2-618E-4BA6-941E-F10AEBADA3DE@post.harvard.edu> Message-ID: In message , at 10:48:46 on Tue, 6 Sep 2011, Deirdre Williams writes >"We" (the IGC) ARE a "social net", because "social nets" are not >Facebook or MySpace or Second Life but an intercommunication of people >which may (or may not) be facilitated by technology. Exactly. This mailing list is a social network, and many similar ones have existed long before that name became popular (for interactions via a web site, but as I hope we all realise, "The Internet" is a much bigger thing than "The Web"). -- Roland Perry ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jlfullsack at orange.fr Wed Sep 7 04:19:23 2011 From: jlfullsack at orange.fr (Jean-Louis FULLSACK) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 10:19:23 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: <23917590.28330.1315383563239.JavaMail.www@wwinf1g30> +1 Jean-Louis Fullsack CSDPTT > Message du 06/09/11 17:40 > De : "Louis Pouzin (well)" > A : governance at lists.cpsr.org > Copie à : "Carlos A. Afonso" > Objet : [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > +1 > On Tue, Sep 6, 2011 at 14:56, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:      governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:      http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:      http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:      http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ias_pk at yahoo.com Wed Sep 7 06:18:01 2011 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com (Imran Ahmed Shah) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 15:18:01 +0500 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Dear Izumi Aizu, How are you? While I was reading the thread, discussion and the option you have selected, I feel it necessary to highlight the other angle (dark side). When we create a group on facebook, we go through the following option regarding features and types of groups whereas the Closed Group option is one of them. Closed Group: anyone can see the group discussion but only members can see the wall, discussion board and photos. As you have decided to start with the "Closed Group" of facebook, my concern are as follows. 1. Well, once the group is created, the discussion of the IGC-CS Members may be viewable for the public but in order to give some comments or to participate in the discussion, IGC-CS Members has to sign up the Facebook and join this closed group (with the admin's approval i.e. the coordinators' approval). 2. Now my point is this that every IGC-CS Member has to sign up the Facebook, and for this purpose we must need a full consensus to modify the charter that the IGC-CS Members may also have to become the member of the facebook group to participate in the discussion. And for this consensus, it will be necessary to provide the awareness of the side effect of the facebook type social network websites by mentioning their terms and conditions that may have conflict in privacy and data integrity. Most probably some or many of the IGC Member do not like to signup facebook network or at least through their native or primary email address to protect their data, contact and/or other information. 3. Otherwise, if the coordinators and/or any of the IGC-CS Member like to enhance the projection of the IGC activities, they may be allowed to publish final versions of related materials, reports and/or activities (but not the raw discussion), on any other public blog/forum/social networking site. 4. According to review, current voting and comments in favor of facebook are agreed on putting the IGC Activities or progress information sharing for the millions of the facebook user. And that relates to above mentioned item No.3 only. I hope that your you will review my points thoroughly before opening or publishing facebook close group. Thanking you and Best Regards Imran Ahmad Shah Executive Member UISoc.org/IGFPAK.org -----Original Message----- From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Izumi AIZU Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 06:12 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com Cc: Carlos A. Afonso; Norbert Bollow Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Dear all, Thank you for the comments and suggestions. All seem valid and important. I did not intend to make Facebook page or group too integral with our operations, and I don't exclude using our wiki. Yet, since there are great many people who are using the Facebook already if not IGC members but they may share our concerns and interests in a larger sense, it might be useful to try this out. That is to start the Open page. On top of that, or instead of that, say for a while, we can use more private Group function, depending on the settings we can make it secret, closed but could be seen by anyone, or just open. I like to first try this "closed group" and see how it works (or not). izumi 2011/9/6 < cveraq at gmail.com>: > Sorry I mean greatest > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerryR de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: cveraq at gmail.com > Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 13:04:39 > To: ; Carlos A. Afonso; > Norbert Bollow > Reply-To: cveraq at gmail.com > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your choice to be or not to be there. > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > Carlos Vera > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerryR de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > To: ; Norbert Bollow > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: >> Izumi AIZU < iza at anr.org> wrote: >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed >>> or open or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. >>> >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi to >>> share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some online >>> facility. Other than mailing list and official website, we have not >>> much, and then realized how about using Facebook, (or any other >>> social tool). >> >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki? >> >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- >> Izumi Aizu << Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita, Japan * * * * * www.anr.org ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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Name: image004.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 20423 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From amedinagomez at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 06:33:01 2011 From: amedinagomez at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Antonio_Medina_G=F3mez?=) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 05:33:01 -0500 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: This option is very valid Antonio Medina 2011/9/7 Imran Ahmed Shah > Dear Izumi Aizu, How are you? **** > > ** ** > > While I was reading the thread, discussion and the option you have > selected, I feel it necessary to highlight the other angle (dark side).*** > * > > ** ** > > When we create a group on facebook, we go through the following option > regarding features and types of groups whereas the Closed Group option is > one of them. Closed Group: anyone can see the group discussion but only > members can see the wall, discussion board and photos.**** > > ** ** > > **** > > ** ** > > As you have decided to start with the “Closed Group” of facebook, my > concern are as follows.**** > > **1. **Well, once the group is created, the discussion of the IGC-CS > Members may be viewable for the public but in order to give some comments or > to participate in the discussion, IGC-CS Members has to sign up the Facebook > and join this closed group (with the admin’s approval i.e. the coordinators’ > approval). **** > > ** ** > > **2. **Now my point is this that every IGC-CS Member has to sign up > the Facebook, and for this purpose we must need a full consensus to modify > the charter that the IGC-CS Members may also have to become the member of > the facebook group to participate in the discussion. And for this consensus, > it will be necessary to provide the awareness of the side effect of the > facebook type social network websites by mentioning their terms and > conditions that may have conflict in privacy and data integrity. Most > probably some or many of the IGC Member do not like to signup facebook > network or at least through their native or primary email address to protect > their data, contact and/or other information.**** > > ** ** > > **3. **Otherwise, if the coordinators and/or any of the IGC-CS Member > like to enhance the projection of the IGC activities, they may be allowed to > publish final versions of related materials, reports and/or activities (but > not the raw discussion), on any other public blog/forum/social networking > site.**** > > ** ** > > **4. **According to review, current voting and comments in favor of > facebook are agreed on putting the IGC Activities or progress information > sharing for the millions of the facebook user. And that relates to above > mentioned item No.3 only.**** > > ** ** > > I hope that your you will review my points thoroughly before opening or > publishing facebook close group.**** > > ** ** > > Thanking you and Best Regards**** > > ** ** > > Imran Ahmad Shah**** > > Executive Member**** > > UISoc.org/IGFPAK.org**** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > -----Original Message----- > From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On > Behalf Of Izumi AIZU > Sent: Tuesday, September 06, 2011 06:12 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com > Cc: Carlos A. Afonso; Norbert Bollow > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > ** ** > > Dear all,**** > > ** ** > > Thank you for the comments and suggestions. All seem valid and important.* > *** > > ** ** > > I did not intend to make Facebook page or group too integral with our > operations, and I don't exclude using our wiki.**** > > ** ** > > Yet, since there are great many people who are using the Facebook already > if not IGC members but they may share our concerns and interests in a larger > sense, it might be useful to try this out. That is to start the Open page. > **** > > On top of that, or instead of that, say for a while, we can use more > private Group function, depending on the settings we can make it secret, > closed but could be seen by anyone, or just open.**** > > ** ** > > I like to first try this "closed group" and see how it works (or not).**** > > ** ** > > izumi**** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > 2011/9/6 :**** > > > Sorry I mean greatest**** > > > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro**** > > >** ** > > > -----Original Message-----**** > > > From: cveraq at gmail.com**** > > > Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2011 13:04:39**** > > > To: ; Carlos A. Afonso; **** > > > Norbert Bollow**** > > > Reply-To: cveraq at gmail.com**** > > > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook?**** > > >** ** > > > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your > choice to be or not to be there.**** > > >** ** > > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL means > open, privacy not totally ensured, and more.**** > > >** ** > > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out!**** > > >** ** > > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, Facebook is > that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not have Facebook. So, it's > ok for millions including me.**** > > >** ** > > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools**** > > >** ** > > > Carlos Vera**** > > > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro**** > > >** ** > > > -----Original Message-----**** > > > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" **** > > > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org**** > > > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50**** > > > To: ; Norbert Bollow**** > > > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,"Carlos A. Afonso" ** > ** > > > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook?**** > > >** ** > > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on *** > * > > > Facebook, and I will not change my mind.**** > > >** ** > > > frt rgds**** > > >** ** > > > --c.a.**** > > >** ** > > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote:**** > > >> Izumi AIZU wrote:**** > > >>> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it closed *** > * > > >>> or open or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at > least.**** > > >>>** ** > > >>> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi to **** > > >>> share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some online **** > > >>> facility. Other than mailing list and official website, we have not ** > ** > > >>> much, and then realized how about using Facebook, (or any other **** > > >>> social tool).**** > > >>** ** > > >> I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for **** > > >> this purpose, perhaps a wiki?**** > > >>** ** > > >> I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track **** > > >> record and attitude regarding privacy matters.**** > > >>** ** > > >> Greetings,**** > > >> Norbert**** > > >> ____________________________________________________________**** > > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list:**** > > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org**** > > >> To be removed from the list, visit:**** > > >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing**** > > >>** ** > > >> For all other list information and functions, see:**** > > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance**** > > >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:**** > > >> http://www.igcaucus.org/**** > > >>** ** > > >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t**** > > >>** ** > > >>** ** > > > ____________________________________________________________**** > > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list:**** > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org**** > > > To be removed from the list, visit:**** > > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing**** > > >** ** > > > For all other list information and functions, see:**** > > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance**** > > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:**** > > > http://www.igcaucus.org/**** > > >** ** > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t**** > > >** ** > > > ____________________________________________________________**** > > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list:**** > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org**** > > > To be removed from the list, visit:**** > > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing**** > > >** ** > > > For all other list information and functions, see:**** > > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance**** > > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:**** > > > http://www.igcaucus.org/**** > > >** ** > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t**** > > >** ** > > >** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > --**** > > >> Izumi Aizu <<**** > > Institute for InfoSocionomics, Tama University, Tokyo**** > > Institute for HyperNetwork Society, Oita,**** > > Japan**** > > * * * * ***** > > www.anr.org____________________________________________________________ > **** > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list:**** > > governance at lists.cpsr.org**** > > To be removed from the list, visit:**** > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing**** > > ** ** > > For all other list information and functions, see:**** > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance**** > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:**** > > http://www.igcaucus.org/**** > > ** ** > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t**** > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image004.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 20423 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image002.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 16276 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From iza at anr.org Wed Sep 7 07:54:46 2011 From: iza at anr.org (Izumi AIZU) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 20:54:46 +0900 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Without the picture, I will respond to the points Imran raised. 2011/9/7 Imran Ahmed Shah > > While I was reading the thread, discussion and the option you have selected, I feel it necessary to highlight the other angle (dark side). > > > > When we create a group on facebook, we go through the following option regarding features and types of groups whereas the Closed Group option is one of them. Closed Group: anyone can see the group discussion but only members can see the wall, discussion board and photos. > I think as a Closed Group, only the members can see the posts. Others can see who are in it, but nothing more. Which might be a problem. > > As you have decided to start with the “Closed Group” of facebook, my concern are as follows. I have not "decided" to start with "Closed Group" on Facebook formally. I created it as an experimental page, yes, but not a substantive one. > > 1.      Well, once the group is created, the discussion of the IGC-CS Members may be viewable for the public but in order to give some comments or to participate in the discussion, IGC-CS Members has to sign up the Facebook and join this closed group (with the admin’s approval i.e. the coordinators’ approval). You can examine how this closed group works by trying to see it already there, as experimental purpose only. If you have not joined, you will not be able to see the content of the group. And I have not made this group approved only by the admin. Any member can invite and add any other friends. > 2.      Now my point is this that every IGC-CS Member has to sign up the Facebook, and for this purpose we must need a full consensus to modify the charter that the IGC-CS Members may also have to become the member of the facebook group to participate in the discussion. And for this consensus, it will be necessary to provide the awareness of the side effect of the facebook type social network websites by mentioning their terms and conditions that may have conflict in privacy and data integrity. Most probably some or many of the IGC Member do not like to signup facebook network or at least through their native or primary email address to protect their data, contact  and/or other information. ONLY if we agree to make the Facebook page as a kind of formal place for dialogue among IGC members, then yes, every CG IGC member has to sign up for Facebook. And that will require consensus of our members. I think whether we need to modify the Charter or not depends on how we propose and define the use of this group. My intention has been not to make this FB page as formal body of CS IGC, but rather a tool for outreach. And, if our members do not like this idea, and instead like to start our own social network or any other tool, I am completely open for it. But it again depends on what exactly we want to achieve. > > > > 3.      Otherwise, if the coordinators and/or any of the IGC-CS Member like to enhance the projection of the IGC activities, they may be allowed to publish final versions of related materials, reports and/or activities (but not the raw discussion), on any other public blog/forum/social networking site. > Yes, this is closer to what I am thinking. > 4.      According to review, current voting and comments in favor of facebook are agreed on putting the IGC Activities or progress information sharing for the millions of the facebook user. And that relates to above mentioned item No.3 only. OK. My suggestion remains that within agreed framework, I like to start using FB group as experimental. There is no way to make it "secret". Either "open" or "closed" could be an option. However, I like to continue the discussion here online, as well as there at Nairobi, before making any consensus call. > > > I hope that your you will review my points thoroughly before opening or publishing facebook close group. Sorry, in a way, I have opened a closed group already, but it is just experimenting the functions as I am not familiar with the use of FB. If you all really feel not comfortable even with this "experimentation", please comment so so that I may shut it down until we reach consensus. I think "seeing is believing" and at this stage there is little risk for the experimentation. But I may be wrong ;-) izumi ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From tracyhackshaw at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 08:55:31 2011 From: tracyhackshaw at gmail.com (Tracy F. Hackshaw @ Google) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 08:55:31 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Still not sure why Jeremy's suggestion is not acceptable. Agree with Jacqueline, Siva and David at the same time. And why not use not only FB, but G+, LinkedIn, Orkut, YouTube, Quora, etc etc not to discuss or "fully engage" but to EDUCATE non-IGC members about the IGC at a high level and POINT to the IGC Open Discussion Tools/Social Network/Thingamajig? On 9/7/11, Izumi AIZU wrote: > Without the picture, I will respond to the points Imran raised. > > 2011/9/7 Imran Ahmed Shah > >> >> While I was reading the thread, discussion and the option you have >> selected, I feel it necessary to highlight the other angle (dark side). >> >> >> >> When we create a group on facebook, we go through the following option >> regarding features and types of groups whereas the Closed Group option is >> one of them. Closed Group: anyone can see the group discussion but only >> members can see the wall, discussion board and photos. >> > > I think as a Closed Group, only the members can see the posts. Others > can see who are in it, but nothing more. Which might be a problem. > >> >> As you have decided to start with the “Closed Group” of facebook, my >> concern are as follows. > > I have not "decided" to start with "Closed Group" on Facebook > formally. I created it as an > experimental page, yes, but not a substantive one. > >> >> 1.      Well, once the group is created, the discussion of the IGC-CS >> Members may be viewable for the public but in order to give some comments >> or to participate in the discussion, IGC-CS Members has to sign up the >> Facebook and join this closed group (with the admin’s approval i.e. the >> coordinators’ approval). > > You can examine how this closed group works by trying to see it > already there, as experimental > purpose only. If you have not joined, you will not be able to see the > content of the group. > And I have not made this group approved only by the admin. Any member can > invite > and add any other friends. > > >> 2.      Now my point is this that every IGC-CS Member has to sign up the >> Facebook, and for this purpose we must need a full consensus to modify the >> charter that the IGC-CS Members may also have to become the member of the >> facebook group to participate in the discussion. And for this consensus, >> it will be necessary to provide the awareness of the side effect of the >> facebook type social network websites by mentioning their terms and >> conditions that may have conflict in privacy and data integrity. Most >> probably some or many of the IGC Member do not like to signup facebook >> network or at least through their native or primary email address to >> protect their data, contact  and/or other information. > > ONLY if we agree to make the Facebook page as a kind of formal place > for dialogue among > IGC members, then yes, every CG IGC member has to sign up for Facebook. And > that > will require consensus of our members. I think whether we need to > modify the Charter or not > depends on how we propose and define the use of this group. My > intention has been not to > make this FB page as formal body of CS IGC, but rather a tool for outreach. > > And, if our members do not like this idea, and instead like to start > our own social network > or any other tool, I am completely open for it. But it again depends > on what exactly we > want to achieve. >> >> >> >> 3.      Otherwise, if the coordinators and/or any of the IGC-CS Member >> like to enhance the projection of the IGC activities, they may be allowed >> to publish final versions of related materials, reports and/or activities >> (but not the raw discussion), on any other public blog/forum/social >> networking site. >> > > Yes, this is closer to what I am thinking. > >> 4.      According to review, current voting and comments in favor of >> facebook are agreed on putting the IGC Activities or progress information >> sharing for the millions of the facebook user. And that relates to above >> mentioned item No.3 only. > > OK. > > My suggestion remains that within agreed framework, I like to start > using FB group as experimental. > There is no way to make it "secret". Either "open" or "closed" could > be an option. > However, I like to continue the discussion here online, as well as > there at Nairobi, before making > any consensus call. > >> >> >> I hope that your you will review my points thoroughly before opening or >> publishing facebook close group. > > Sorry, in a way, I have opened a closed group already, but it is just > experimenting the functions > as I am not familiar with the use of FB. If you all really feel not > comfortable even with this > "experimentation", please comment so so that I may shut it down until > we reach consensus. > > I think "seeing is believing" and at this stage there is little risk > for the experimentation. > But I may be wrong ;-) > > izumi > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mueller at syr.edu Wed Sep 7 08:59:54 2011 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 08:59:54 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <4E665FB4.8000703@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937118@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Right, Jacqueline. By telling people I am not on Facebook I did not mean to imply that no one should use it. I agree with Lee's and your perspective: approach it pragmatically, don't get locked in to it in any way, but take advantage of whatever outreach and coordination possibilities it offers. From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Jacqueline Morris I don't think it's awe or adoration, but a practical idea to get information about IGC and the issues we care about to a larger audience and invite other people to participate in the IGC. If you want to market anything, you have to go where the people are... and then we can bring them here. Jacqueline A. Morris Technology should be like oxygen: Ubiquitous, Necessary, Invisible and Free. (after Chris Lehmann ) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ias_pk at yahoo.com Wed Sep 7 09:02:48 2011 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com (Imran Ahmed Shah) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 18:02:48 +0500 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <001901cc6d5e$74c717e0$5e5547a0$@yahoo.com> Dear Izumi Aizu, Thank you for your prompt reply. I have no objection on the FB group as on experimentation or to share the information originated by the coordinators. However, requested to review before publicizing the work or to open a serious discussion on the FB group. You may continue your work with full powers. I just addressed the concern about the provisioning and dependencies for the member in order to participate in the discussion on the FB group. Thanking you and Best Imran Ahmad Shah -----Original Message----- From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Izumi AIZU Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2011 04:55 PM To: ias_pk at yahoo.com Cc: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com; Carlos A. Afonso; Norbert Bollow; imran at igfpak.org Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Without the picture, I will respond to the points Imran raised. 2011/9/7 Imran Ahmed Shah > > While I was reading the thread, discussion and the option you have selected, I feel it necessary to highlight the other angle (dark side). > > > > When we create a group on facebook, we go through the following option regarding features and types of groups whereas the Closed Group option is one of them. Closed Group: anyone can see the group discussion but only members can see the wall, discussion board and photos. > I think as a Closed Group, only the members can see the posts. Others can see who are in it, but nothing more. Which might be a problem. > > As you have decided to start with the “Closed Group” of facebook, my concern are as follows. I have not "decided" to start with "Closed Group" on Facebook formally. I created it as an experimental page, yes, but not a substantive one. > > 1.      Well, once the group is created, the discussion of the IGC-CS Members may be viewable for the public but in order to give some comments or to participate in the discussion, IGC-CS Members has to sign up the Facebook and join this closed group (with the admin’s approval i.e. the coordinators’ approval). You can examine how this closed group works by trying to see it already there, as experimental purpose only. If you have not joined, you will not be able to see the content of the group. And I have not made this group approved only by the admin. Any member can invite and add any other friends. > 2.      Now my point is this that every IGC-CS Member has to sign up the Facebook, and for this purpose we must need a full consensus to modify the charter that the IGC-CS Members may also have to become the member of the facebook group to participate in the discussion. And for this consensus, it will be necessary to provide the awareness of the side effect of the facebook type social network websites by mentioning their terms and conditions that may have conflict in privacy and data integrity. Most probably some or many of the IGC Member do not like to signup facebook network or at least through their native or primary email address to protect their data, contact  and/or other information. ONLY if we agree to make the Facebook page as a kind of formal place for dialogue among IGC members, then yes, every CG IGC member has to sign up for Facebook. And that will require consensus of our members. I think whether we need to modify the Charter or not depends on how we propose and define the use of this group. My intention has been not to make this FB page as formal body of CS IGC, but rather a tool for outreach. And, if our members do not like this idea, and instead like to start our own social network or any other tool, I am completely open for it. But it again depends on what exactly we want to achieve. > > > > 3.      Otherwise, if the coordinators and/or any of the IGC-CS Member like to enhance the projection of the IGC activities, they may be allowed to publish final versions of related materials, reports and/or activities (but not the raw discussion), on any other public blog/forum/social networking site. > Yes, this is closer to what I am thinking. > 4.      According to review, current voting and comments in favor of facebook are agreed on putting the IGC Activities or progress information sharing for the millions of the facebook user. And that relates to above mentioned item No.3 only. OK. My suggestion remains that within agreed framework, I like to start using FB group as experimental. There is no way to make it "secret". Either "open" or "closed" could be an option. However, I like to continue the discussion here online, as well as there at Nairobi, before making any consensus call. > > > I hope that your you will review my points thoroughly before opening or publishing facebook close group. Sorry, in a way, I have opened a closed group already, but it is just experimenting the functions as I am not familiar with the use of FB. If you all really feel not comfortable even with this "experimentation", please comment so so that I may shut it down until we reach consensus. I think "seeing is believing" and at this stage there is little risk for the experimentation. But I may be wrong ;-) izumi ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From pouzin at well.com Wed Sep 7 09:46:56 2011 From: pouzin at well.com (Louis Pouzin (well)) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 15:46:56 +0200 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 14:55, Tracy F. Hackshaw @ Google < tracyhackshaw at gmail.com> wrote: > Still not sure why Jeremy's suggestion is not acceptable. > > Agree with Jacqueline, Siva and David at the same time. > > And why not use not only FB, but G+, LinkedIn, Orkut, YouTube, Quora, > etc etc not to discuss or "fully engage" but to EDUCATE non-IGC > members about the IGC at a high level and POINT to the IGC Open > Discussion Tools/Social Network/Thingamajig? > - - - My hunch is that would trigger much more noise than signal. Then who has enough spare time to debunk the load of misconceptions ? Good luck. - - - -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From julian at colnodo.apc.org Wed Sep 7 10:00:52 2011 From: julian at colnodo.apc.org (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Juli=E1n_Casasbuenas_G=2E=22?=) Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2011 09:00:52 -0500 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> Message-ID: <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> I'll attend remotely from a Remote Hub setup in Bogotá, Colombia, Best, -- Julian Casasbuenas G. Director Colnodo Diagonal 40A (Antigua Av. 39) No. 14-75, Bogota, Colombia Tel: 57-1-2324246, Cel. 57-315-3339099 Fax: 57-1-3380264 www.colnodo.apc.org - Uso Estratégico de Internet para el Desarrollo Miembro de la Asociacion para el Progreso de las Comunicaciones -APC- www.apc.org ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From williams.deirdre at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 10:12:13 2011 From: williams.deirdre at gmail.com (Deirdre Williams) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 10:12:13 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: I have been wondering about noise as well. Communication seems to me to work more efficiently, in terms of "these are the issues", as information emanating from a known and/or trusted individual. Rather than one large "IGC" campaign, individual initiatives by IGC members, who use Facebook and other such services, to spread information about the issues of Internet Governance might have more real effect. And this would also serve to break the language difficulties to a great extent. But one never knows how things will work until the experiment is complete - so all power to Izumi for experimenting. Deirdre On 7 September 2011 09:46, Louis Pouzin (well) wrote: > On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 14:55, Tracy F. Hackshaw @ Google < > tracyhackshaw at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Still not sure why Jeremy's suggestion is not acceptable. >> >> Agree with Jacqueline, Siva and David at the same time. >> >> And why not use not only FB, but G+, LinkedIn, Orkut, YouTube, Quora, >> etc etc not to discuss or "fully engage" but to EDUCATE non-IGC >> members about the IGC at a high level and POINT to the IGC Open >> Discussion Tools/Social Network/Thingamajig? >> > - - - > > My hunch is that would trigger much more noise than signal. Then who has > enough spare time to debunk the load of misconceptions ? > Good luck. > - - - > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From williams.deirdre at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 10:19:18 2011 From: williams.deirdre at gmail.com (Deirdre Williams) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 10:19:18 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> Message-ID: Wish I could be there in the flesh, but, technology permitting, I'm hoping to attend virtually from Saint Lucia. Deirdre On 7 September 2011 10:00, "Julián Casasbuenas G." wrote: > > I'll attend remotely from a Remote Hub setup in Bogotá, Colombia, > > Best, > > -- > > Julian Casasbuenas G. > Director Colnodo > Diagonal 40A (Antigua Av. 39) No. 14-75, Bogota, Colombia > Tel: 57-1-2324246, Cel. 57-315-3339099 Fax: 57-1-3380264 > www.colnodo.apc.org - Uso Estratégico de Internet para el Desarrollo > Miembro de la Asociacion para el Progreso de las Comunicaciones -APC- > www.apc.org > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu Wed Sep 7 10:31:18 2011 From: David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu (David Allen) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 10:31:18 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <38B16546-80ED-44E6-B1BF-5F6E6DDAE868@post.harvard.edu> On Sep 7, 2011, at 7:54 AM, Izumi AIZU wrote: > Sorry, in a way, I have opened a closed group already, but it is > just experimenting the functions as I am not familiar with the use > of FB. If you all really feel not comfortable even with this > "experimentation", please comment so so that I may shut it down > until we reach consensus. > > I think "seeing is believing" and at this stage there is little risk > for the experimentation. But I may be wrong ;-) > > > izumi Experience suggests that 'in for penny, in for a pound' (to use a British aphorism). Once the thing gets a foothold, it can grow, despite intentions. And IGC members not on Facebook will not have access to the exchanges. David -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jeanette at wzb.eu Wed Sep 7 12:36:04 2011 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2011 17:36:04 +0100 Subject: [governance] Fwd: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> Message-ID: <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. jeanette -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:03:17 +0200 From: Chengetai Masango To: igf Forum Dear All, I hope those of you in the northern hemisphere have had a good summer and those in the south the winter was not too cold. We are fast approaching the start of the IGF Nairobi meeting. The preparations are moving along well. I would be grateful if you could all remind your various stakeholder groups that the online registration ends on 9 September. Onsite registration will still be possible but it will entail additional queuing . The Host country and the IGF Secretariat are putting the final touches to the opening session speakers list. Alice and I would like to ask the MAG to nominate a speaker to represent civil society. We would be appreciative If you could send us your selection by the end of the week. Best regards Chengetai _______________________________________________ igf_members mailing list igf_members at intgovforum.org http://mail.intgovforum.org/mailman/listinfo/igf_members_intgovforum.org ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From cls at rkey.com Wed Sep 7 11:42:05 2011 From: cls at rkey.com (Craig Simon) Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2011 11:42:05 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <2074254519-1315350241-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-322742374-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1315346384.53104.YahooMailNeo@web161911.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <612221881-1315346611-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610918866-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry><1315349095.26513.YahooMailNeo@web161912.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <2074254519-1315350241-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-322742374-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> Message-ID: <4E6790CD.6030005@rkey.com> As someone who's done some Facebook app development, I'd suggest that there might be a technical solution that routes around the various problems and reservations being raised here. FYI, the The IGC exists as a closed group with about 6 members, and the Internet Governance Forum has about 2100 "likes" but doesn't see a great deal of activity. http://www.facebook.com/groups/CS.IGC/ http://www.facebook.com/IntGovForum?ref=ts My understanding is that some within the IGC would like to use Facebook in ways that can leverage all the viral goodness that Facebook may offer. That is, people who post and comment on a Page or Group wall can generally count on having that content pushed out onto many personal newsfeeds where it can easily attract new particpants. The evident problem is that non-Facebook users wouldn't be able to see that content at all. Moreover, even Facebook members may miss it as things fly by. Moreover, some folks simply don't want to be on Facebook... period. That's a perfectly reasonable position. Others may be considering violating FB's terms of service by creating a fake persona for that purpose only. I'd advise against that, since it can get confusing, and the account would always be at high risk of termination. In my own online reading habits, I tend to be far more diligent about following my various subscriptions in filtered lists via my email client than I am about following groups on Facebook. So I believe that moving this list's content to Facebook would degrade my ability to keep up with conversations. I expect others would have the same concern. Nevertheless, there's no denying that, if prominence is what you want, a stronger presence on Facebook is a good way to pursue it. I believe there may be (or soon will be) facebook apps that facilitate automatic publication of email list digests to a Facebook wall, and the simultaneous republication of wall comments back to the list. I've looked briefly, and I recommend that folks here who are advocating a pro-Facebook strategy keep their eyes open for that kind of a tool. Craig Simon On 9/6/11 7:03 PM, cveraq at gmail.com wrote: > You have what you pay for! Facebook is free so sharing data and sending > you info is about the business model for they to make money. There are > other platforms and choices so it's about you to make a decision. > > You can open a new email account, put a code name and fake info and open > a facebook account just to participate in IGF.. Or enjoy, as me, > facebook and share it with friends, relatives, parents, grandma, sons > and even with IGF's people! > > No matter what you're always nake on Internet and privacy is only a > remember from a long long time ago! Isn't it? > > Carlos > > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *From: * shaila mistry > *Date: *Tue, 6 Sep 2011 15:44:55 -0700 (PDT) > *To: *cveraq at gmail.com; > governance at lists.cpsr.org; Rui > Correia > *ReplyTo: * shaila mistry > *Subject: *Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > The issue is we need open digital platform/space to share ideas, > knowledge, network and collaborate etc but we also want privacy > protection !!! > Can we have both and how good is Facebook or any other in respecting > privacy ? > *shaila* > * > * > *The journey begins sooner than you anticipate !* > *..................... the renaissance of composure ! > * > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *From:* "cveraq at gmail.com" > *To:* shaila mistry ; "governance at lists.cpsr.org" > ; Rui Correia > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 6, 2011 3:02 PM > *Subject:* Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > If there are no problems! Then no solutions, no innovations, no > internet2, no nothing. I love problems because they are always an > opportunity.. In stone age, no IP problems, no privacy concerns, but I"m > still happy to be here and now! > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *From: * shaila mistry > *Date: *Tue, 6 Sep 2011 14:59:44 -0700 (PDT) > *To: *governance at lists.cpsr.org; > cveraq at gmail.com; Rui Correia > *ReplyTo: * shaila mistry > *Subject: *Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > I guess they are "coming for me too" > shaila :):) > *The journey begins sooner than you anticipate !* > *..................... the renaissance of composure ! > * > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > *From:* Rui Correia > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 6, 2011 1:49 PM > *Subject:* Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > Hey Carlos > > How long will you hold out? your 5-6 just got mowed down to 3-4 in three > minutes! They are coming for you! ;-) > > Um abraço, > > Rui > > 2011/9/6 > > > Facebook is the greast SOCIAL network in the whole world. It's your > choice to be or not to be there. > > But of course you do not choose something SOCIAL to be hide! SOCIAL > means open, privacy not totally ensured, and more. > > The only way to ensure you're not exposed is to keep out! > > IGF is public, open and needs and easy system to participate, > Facebook is that kind of tool except for those 3-4 that does not > have Facebook. So, it's ok for millions including me. > > Love innovation and love SOCIAL tools > > Carlos Vera > Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro > > -----Original Message----- > From: "Carlos A. Afonso" > > Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2011 09:56:50 > To: >; > Norbert Bollow> > Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > ,"Carlos A. Afonso" > > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > It seems by now I am one of those 5-6 Internet users who is *not* on > Facebook, and I will not change my mind. > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/06/2011 04:19 AM, Norbert Bollow wrote: > > Izumi AIZU > wrote: > >> It just came to my mind to have our Page on Facebook, be it > closed or open > >> or both. What do you think? I think it's worth a try, at least. > >> > >> I was thinking to ask all IGC members who is coming to Nairobi > >> to share their contact/hotel info, and thinking of using some > >> online facility. Other than mailing list and official website, > >> we have not much, and then realized how about using Facebook, > >> (or any other social tool). > > > > I agree that it would be good to use some kind of online tool for > > this purpose, perhaps a wiki? > > > > I'd suggest to rather avoid Facebook because of the abysmal track > > record and attitude regarding privacy matters. > > > > Greetings, > > Norbert > >____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > -- > _________________________ > Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 > Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 > > I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African > numbers > Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através > dos meus números sul-africanos > > Rui Correia > Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant > Angola Liaison Consultant > > _______________ > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From shailam at yahoo.com Wed Sep 7 12:45:40 2011 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 09:45:40 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> Message-ID: <1315413940.90113.YahooMailNeo@web161904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Hi All I am still trying to attend in person. Failing that I will definitely attend remotely . Can I get a list of hubs so at least I have some company. Thank you for all your good work regards  Shaila   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: Deirdre Williams To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ""Julián Casasbuenas G."" Sent: Wednesday, September 7, 2011 7:19 AM Subject: Re: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF Wish I could be there in the flesh, but, technology permitting, I'm hoping to attend virtually from Saint Lucia. Deirdre On 7 September 2011 10:00, "Julián Casasbuenas G." wrote: >I'll attend remotely from a Remote Hub setup in Bogotá, Colombia, > >Best, > >-- > >Julian Casasbuenas G. >Director Colnodo >Diagonal 40A (Antigua Av. 39) No. 14-75, Bogota, Colombia >Tel: 57-1-2324246, Cel. 57-315-3339099 Fax: 57-1-3380264 >www.colnodo.apc.org - Uso Estratégico de Internet para el Desarrollo >Miembro de la Asociacion para el Progreso de las Comunicaciones -APC- >www.apc.org > > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >    http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From shailam at yahoo.com Wed Sep 7 12:54:58 2011 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 09:54:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <001901cc6d5e$74c717e0$5e5547a0$@yahoo.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> <001901cc6d5e$74c717e0$5e5547a0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1315414498.76771.YahooMailNeo@web161917.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Hi Jeremy and Izumi and everyone  I have no objection to using FB for education and exposure to the work of IGF. However, perhaps we need to use a different platform, maybe a group on skype or google  or even a closed group on FB so that there can be more comfortable debate amongst ourselves. Much of what we say is is within the context of our own involvement with IGF and within past history and relationships with one another. Sometimes statements made in haste within this context may be misunderstood by the wider community. Also we all like the right to be forgotten. I don't think FB will let us do that ! Like all of you I use FB extensively and know some of what it does with our info :) cheers  Shaila   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: Imran Ahmed Shah To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Izumi AIZU' Cc: cveraq at gmail.com; 'Carlos A. Afonso' ; 'Norbert Bollow' ; imran at igfpak.org Sent: Wednesday, September 7, 2011 6:02 AM Subject: RE: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Dear Izumi Aizu, Thank you for your prompt reply. I have no objection on the FB group as on experimentation or to share the information originated by the coordinators. However, requested to review before publicizing the work or to open a serious discussion on the FB group. You may continue your work with full powers. I just addressed the concern about the provisioning and dependencies for the member in order to participate in the discussion on the FB group. Thanking you and Best Imran Ahmad Shah -----Original Message----- From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Izumi AIZU Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2011 04:55 PM To: ias_pk at yahoo.com Cc: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com; Carlos A. Afonso; Norbert Bollow; imran at igfpak.org Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Without the picture, I will respond to the points Imran raised. 2011/9/7 Imran Ahmed Shah > > While I was reading the thread, discussion and the option you have selected, I feel it necessary to highlight the other angle (dark side). > > > > When we create a group on facebook, we go through the following option regarding features and types of groups whereas the Closed Group option is one of them. Closed Group: anyone can see the group discussion but only members can see the wall, discussion board and photos. > I think as a Closed Group, only the members can see the posts. Others can see who are in it, but nothing more. Which might be a problem. > > As you have decided to start with the “Closed Group” of facebook, my concern are as follows. I have not "decided" to start with "Closed Group" on Facebook formally. I created it as an experimental page, yes, but not a substantive one. > > 1.      Well, once the group is created, the discussion of the IGC-CS Members may be viewable for the public but in order to give some comments or to participate in the discussion, IGC-CS Members has to sign up the Facebook and join this closed group (with the admin’s approval i.e. the coordinators’ approval). You can examine how this closed group works by trying to see it already there, as experimental purpose only. If you have not joined, you will not be able to see the content of the group. And I have not made this group approved only by the admin. Any member can invite and add any other friends. > 2.      Now my point is this that every IGC-CS Member has to sign up the Facebook, and for this purpose we must need a full consensus to modify the charter that the IGC-CS Members may also have to become the member of the facebook group to participate in the discussion. And for this consensus, it will be necessary to provide the awareness of the side effect of the facebook type social network websites by mentioning their terms and conditions that may have conflict in privacy and data integrity. Most probably some or many of the IGC Member do not like to signup facebook network or at least through their native or primary email address to protect their data, contact  and/or other information. ONLY if we agree to make the Facebook page as a kind of formal place for dialogue among IGC members, then yes, every CG IGC member has to sign up for Facebook. And that will require consensus of our members. I think whether we need to modify the Charter or not depends on how we propose and define the use of this group. My intention has been not to make this FB page as formal body of CS IGC, but rather a tool for outreach. And, if our members do not like this idea, and instead like to start our own social network or any other tool, I am completely open for it. But it again depends on what exactly we want to achieve. > > > > 3.      Otherwise, if the coordinators and/or any of the IGC-CS Member like to enhance the projection of the IGC activities, they may be allowed to publish final versions of related materials, reports and/or activities (but not the raw discussion), on any other public blog/forum/social networking site. > Yes, this is closer to what I am thinking. > 4.      According to review, current voting and comments in favor of facebook are agreed on putting the IGC Activities or progress information sharing for the millions of the facebook user. And that relates to above mentioned item No.3 only. OK. My suggestion remains that within agreed framework, I like to start using FB group as experimental. There is no way to make it "secret". Either "open" or "closed" could be an option. However, I like to continue the discussion here online, as well as there at Nairobi, before making any consensus call. > > > I hope that your you will review my points thoroughly before opening or publishing facebook close group. Sorry, in a way, I have opened a closed group already, but it is just experimenting the functions as I am not familiar with the use of FB. If you all really feel not comfortable even with this "experimentation", please comment so so that I may shut it down until we reach consensus. I think "seeing is believing" and at this stage there is little risk for the experimentation. But I may be wrong ;-) izumi ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From cveraq at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 13:00:31 2011 From: cveraq at gmail.com (cveraq at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:00:31 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <1315414498.76771.YahooMailNeo@web161917.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> <001901cc6d5e$74c717e0$5e5547a0$@yahoo.com><1315414498.76771.YahooMailNeo@web161917.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1028483526-1315414832-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-857247236-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> This is a disclaimer issue. I mean "closed" does not ensure that things remain only inside the group. For example if I participate in a "closed" group I'm able to share though inside with my friends or colleagues son it's not "closed" anymore. A disclaimer saying that all exchange is not an official position or is only an academic exercise is the only necessary thing here I guess.. Carlos Mensaje enviado desde mi terminal BlackBerry® de Claro -----Original Message----- From: shaila mistry Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 09:54:58 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Izumi AIZU'; Imran Ahmed Shah Reply-To: shaila mistry Cc: cveraq at gmail.com; 'Carlos A. Afonso'; 'Norbert Bollow'; imran at igfpak.org; Jeremy Malcolm Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Hi Jeremy and Izumi and everyone  I have no objection to using FB for education and exposure to the work of IGF. However, perhaps we need to use a different platform, maybe a group on skype or google  or even a closed group on FB so that there can be more comfortable debate amongst ourselves. Much of what we say is is within the context of our own involvement with IGF and within past history and relationships with one another. Sometimes statements made in haste within this context may be misunderstood by the wider community. Also we all like the right to be forgotten. I don't think FB will let us do that ! Like all of you I use FB extensively and know some of what it does with our info :) cheers  Shaila   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: Imran Ahmed Shah To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Izumi AIZU' Cc: cveraq at gmail.com; 'Carlos A. Afonso' ; 'Norbert Bollow' ; imran at igfpak.org Sent: Wednesday, September 7, 2011 6:02 AM Subject: RE: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Dear Izumi Aizu, Thank you for your prompt reply. I have no objection on the FB group as on experimentation or to share the information originated by the coordinators. However, requested to review before publicizing the work or to open a serious discussion on the FB group. You may continue your work with full powers. I just addressed the concern about the provisioning and dependencies for the member in order to participate in the discussion on the FB group. Thanking you and Best Imran Ahmad Shah -----Original Message----- From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Izumi AIZU Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2011 04:55 PM To: ias_pk at yahoo.com Cc: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com; Carlos A. Afonso; Norbert Bollow; imran at igfpak.org Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? Without the picture, I will respond to the points Imran raised. 2011/9/7 Imran Ahmed Shah > > While I was reading the thread, discussion and the option you have selected, I feel it necessary to highlight the other angle (dark side). > > > > When we create a group on facebook, we go through the following option regarding features and types of groups whereas the Closed Group option is one of them. Closed Group: anyone can see the group discussion but only members can see the wall, discussion board and photos. > I think as a Closed Group, only the members can see the posts. Others can see who are in it, but nothing more. Which might be a problem. > > As you have decided to start with the “Closed Group” of facebook, my concern are as follows. I have not "decided" to start with "Closed Group" on Facebook formally. I created it as an experimental page, yes, but not a substantive one. > > 1.      Well, once the group is created, the discussion of the IGC-CS Members may be viewable for the public but in order to give some comments or to participate in the discussion, IGC-CS Members has to sign up the Facebook and join this closed group (with the admin’s approval i.e. the coordinators’ approval). You can examine how this closed group works by trying to see it already there, as experimental purpose only. If you have not joined, you will not be able to see the content of the group. And I have not made this group approved only by the admin. Any member can invite and add any other friends. > 2.      Now my point is this that every IGC-CS Member has to sign up the Facebook, and for this purpose we must need a full consensus to modify the charter that the IGC-CS Members may also have to become the member of the facebook group to participate in the discussion. And for this consensus, it will be necessary to provide the awareness of the side effect of the facebook type social network websites by mentioning their terms and conditions that may have conflict in privacy and data integrity. Most probably some or many of the IGC Member do not like to signup facebook network or at least through their native or primary email address to protect their data, contact  and/or other information. ONLY if we agree to make the Facebook page as a kind of formal place for dialogue among IGC members, then yes, every CG IGC member has to sign up for Facebook. And that will require consensus of our members. I think whether we need to modify the Charter or not depends on how we propose and define the use of this group. My intention has been not to make this FB page as formal body of CS IGC, but rather a tool for outreach. And, if our members do not like this idea, and instead like to start our own social network or any other tool, I am completely open for it. But it again depends on what exactly we want to achieve. > > > > 3.      Otherwise, if the coordinators and/or any of the IGC-CS Member like to enhance the projection of the IGC activities, they may be allowed to publish final versions of related materials, reports and/or activities (but not the raw discussion), on any other public blog/forum/social networking site. > Yes, this is closer to what I am thinking. > 4.      According to review, current voting and comments in favor of facebook are agreed on putting the IGC Activities or progress information sharing for the millions of the facebook user. And that relates to above mentioned item No.3 only. OK. My suggestion remains that within agreed framework, I like to start using FB group as experimental. There is no way to make it "secret". Either "open" or "closed" could be an option. However, I like to continue the discussion here online, as well as there at Nairobi, before making any consensus call. > > > I hope that your you will review my points thoroughly before opening or publishing facebook close group. Sorry, in a way, I have opened a closed group already, but it is just experimenting the functions as I am not familiar with the use of FB. If you all really feel not comfortable even with this "experimentation", please comment so so that I may shut it down until we reach consensus. I think "seeing is believing" and at this stage there is little risk for the experimentation. But I may be wrong ;-) izumi ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 13:02:30 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 12:32:30 -0430 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: <1315413940.90113.YahooMailNeo@web161904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> <1315413940.90113.YahooMailNeo@web161904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Shaila and everybody: The list of hubs is here: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/list-of-remote-hubs-2011 If you cannot find a hub near you, check out the hub instructions, and see if you would like to form a hub in your area! It's the best way to participate remotely, and benefit from local discussions at the same time. Hope to see you there. http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/hubs-instructions-2011 http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011 AND... with the remote moderators on all workshops, this will not be remote observation, but remote participation, if you want it to be... See you online? Cheers, Ginger Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu *Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org* On 7 September 2011 12:15, shaila mistry wrote: > Hi All > I am still trying to attend in person. Failing that I will definitely > attend remotely . Can I get a list of hubs so at least I have some company. > Thank you for all your good work > regards > Shaila > > *The journey begins sooner than you anticipate !* > *..................... the renaissance of composure ! > * > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Deirdre Williams > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org; ""Julián Casasbuenas G."" < > julian at colnodo.apc.org> > *Sent:* Wednesday, September 7, 2011 7:19 AM > *Subject:* Re: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF > > Wish I could be there in the flesh, but, technology permitting, I'm hoping > to attend virtually from Saint Lucia. > Deirdre > > On 7 September 2011 10:00, "Julián Casasbuenas G." > wrote: > > > I'll attend remotely from a Remote Hub setup in Bogotá, Colombia, > > Best, > > -- > > Julian Casasbuenas G. > Director Colnodo > Diagonal 40A (Antigua Av. 39) No. 14-75, Bogota, Colombia > Tel: 57-1-2324246, Cel. 57-315-3339099 Fax: 57-1-3380264 > www.colnodo.apc.org - Uso Estratégico de Internet para el Desarrollo > Miembro de la Asociacion para el Progreso de las Comunicaciones -APC- > www.apc.org > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > -- > “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William > Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979 > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dogwallah at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 13:29:02 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:29:02 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> <1315413940.90113.YahooMailNeo@web161904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi Ginger, On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 5:02 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > Hi Shaila and everybody: > The list of hubs is here: > > http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/list-of-remote-hubs-2011 > > If you cannot find a hub near you, check out the hub instructions, and see > if you would like to form a hub in your area! It's the best way to > participate remotely, and benefit from local discussions at the same time. > Hope to see you there. > > http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/hubs-instructions-2011 > > http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011 > > AND... with the remote moderators on all workshops, this will not be remote > observation, but remote participation, if you want it to be... > Just to be clear this thread is about an IGC meeting, not the main IGF. I think some folk are expecting remote participation for the IGC meeting. Will there be RP for the IGC, or just for the IGF? -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mariliamaciel at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 13:37:48 2011 From: mariliamaciel at gmail.com (Marilia Maciel) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 14:37:48 -0300 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <1315414498.76771.YahooMailNeo@web161917.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> <001901cc6d5e$74c717e0$5e5547a0$@yahoo.com> <1315414498.76771.YahooMailNeo@web161917.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I think substantive discussions should continue to take place in IGC list, as always. Facebook should be a space to showcase our activities and engage with new people. A platform for outreach efforts. Best Marília On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 1:54 PM, shaila mistry wrote: > Hi Jeremy and Izumi and everyone > I have no objection to using FB for education and exposure to the work of > IGF. However, perhaps we need to use a different platform, maybe a group on > skype or google or even a closed group on FB so that there can be more > comfortable debate amongst ourselves. Much of what we say is is within the > context of our own involvement with IGF and within past history and > relationships with one another. Sometimes statements made in haste within > this context may be misunderstood by the wider community. Also we all like > the right to be forgotten. I don't think FB will let us do that ! Like all > of you I use FB extensively and know some of what it does with our info :) > cheers > Shaila > > *The journey begins sooner than you anticipate !* > *..................... the renaissance of composure ! > * > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Imran Ahmed Shah > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Izumi AIZU' > *Cc:* cveraq at gmail.com; 'Carlos A. Afonso' ; 'Norbert > Bollow' ; imran at igfpak.org > *Sent:* Wednesday, September 7, 2011 6:02 AM > > *Subject:* RE: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > Dear Izumi Aizu, > Thank you for your prompt reply. I have no objection on the FB group as on > experimentation or to share the information originated by the coordinators. > However, requested to review before publicizing the work or to open a > serious discussion on the FB group. You may continue your work with full > powers. > > I just addressed the concern about the provisioning and dependencies for > the > member in order to participate in the discussion on the FB group. > > Thanking you and Best > > Imran Ahmad Shah > -----Original Message----- > From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On > Behalf > Of Izumi AIZU > Sent: Wednesday, September 07, 2011 04:55 PM > To: ias_pk at yahoo.com > Cc: governance at lists.cpsr.org; cveraq at gmail.com; Carlos A. Afonso; Norbert > Bollow; imran at igfpak.org > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC on Facebook? > > Without the picture, I will respond to the points Imran raised. > > 2011/9/7 Imran Ahmed Shah > > > > > While I was reading the thread, discussion and the option you have > selected, I feel it necessary to highlight the other angle (dark side). > > > > > > > > When we create a group on facebook, we go through the following option > regarding features and types of groups whereas the Closed Group option is > one of them. Closed Group: anyone can see the group discussion but only > members can see the wall, discussion board and photos. > > > > I think as a Closed Group, only the members can see the posts. Others can > see who are in it, but nothing more. Which might be a problem. > > > > > As you have decided to start with the “Closed Group” of facebook, my > concern are as follows. > > I have not "decided" to start with "Closed Group" on Facebook formally. I > created it as an experimental page, yes, but not a substantive one. > > > > > 1. Well, once the group is created, the discussion of the IGC-CS > Members may be viewable for the public but in order to give some comments > or > to participate in the discussion, IGC-CS Members has to sign up the > Facebook > and join this closed group (with the admin’s approval i.e. the > coordinators’ > approval). > > You can examine how this closed group works by trying to see it already > there, as experimental purpose only. If you have not joined, you will not > be > able to see the content of the group. > And I have not made this group approved only by the admin. Any member can > invite and add any other friends. > > > > 2. Now my point is this that every IGC-CS Member has to sign up the > Facebook, and for this purpose we must need a full consensus to modify the > charter that the IGC-CS Members may also have to become the member of the > facebook group to participate in the discussion. And for this consensus, it > will be necessary to provide the awareness of the side effect of the > facebook type social network websites by mentioning their terms and > conditions that may have conflict in privacy and data integrity. Most > probably some or many of the IGC Member do not like to signup facebook > network or at least through their native or primary email address to > protect > their data, contact and/or other information. > > ONLY if we agree to make the Facebook page as a kind of formal place for > dialogue among IGC members, then yes, every CG IGC member has to sign up > for > Facebook. And that will require consensus of our members. I think whether > we > need to modify the Charter or not depends on how we propose and define the > use of this group. My intention has been not to make this FB page as formal > body of CS IGC, but rather a tool for outreach. > > And, if our members do not like this idea, and instead like to start our > own > social network or any other tool, I am completely open for it. But it again > depends on what exactly we want to achieve. > > > > > > > > 3. Otherwise, if the coordinators and/or any of the IGC-CS Member > like to enhance the projection of the IGC activities, they may be allowed > to > publish final versions of related materials, reports and/or activities (but > not the raw discussion), on any other public blog/forum/social networking > site. > > > > Yes, this is closer to what I am thinking. > > > 4. According to review, current voting and comments in favor of > facebook are agreed on putting the IGC Activities or progress information > sharing for the millions of the facebook user. And that relates to above > mentioned item No.3 only. > > OK. > > My suggestion remains that within agreed framework, I like to start using > FB > group as experimental. > There is no way to make it "secret". Either "open" or "closed" could be an > option. > However, I like to continue the discussion here online, as well as there at > Nairobi, before making any consensus call. > > > > > > > I hope that your you will review my points thoroughly before opening or > publishing facebook close group. > > Sorry, in a way, I have opened a closed group already, but it is just > experimenting the functions as I am not familiar with the use of FB. If you > all really feel not comfortable even with this "experimentation", please > comment so so that I may shut it down until we reach consensus. > > I think "seeing is believing" and at this stage there is little risk for > the > experimentation. > But I may be wrong ;-) > > izumi > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade FGV Direito Rio Center for Technology and Society Getulio Vargas Foundation Rio de Janeiro - Brazil -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From shailam at yahoo.com Wed Sep 7 13:56:52 2011 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 10:56:52 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> <1315413940.90113.YahooMailNeo@web161904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1315418212.64013.YahooMailNeo@web161902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Hi McTim and Ginger Do you have the contact info for the hub in Washington DC . Is there a hub on the West Coast and are any others in this region interested. I have checked on the website but do not see contact info. Shaila   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: McTim To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ginger Paque Cc: shaila mistry Sent: Wednesday, September 7, 2011 10:29 AM Subject: Re: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF Hi Ginger, On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 5:02 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: Hi Shaila and everybody: >The list of hubs is here: >http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/list-of-remote-hubs-2011 >  >If you cannot find a hub near you, check out the hub instructions, and see if you would like to form a hub in your area! It's the best way to participate remotely, and benefit from local discussions at the same time. Hope to see you there. >http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/hubs-instructions-2011 >  >http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011 >  >AND... with the remote moderators on all workshops, this will not be remote observation, but remote participation, if you want it to be... Just to be clear this thread is about an IGC meeting, not the main IGF. I think some folk are expecting remote participation for the IGC meeting.  Will there be RP for the IGC, or just for the IGF? -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 14:29:34 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 13:59:34 -0430 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> <1315413940.90113.YahooMailNeo@web161904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi McTim, Thanks for clarifying... yes, I was indeed mistaken. The links I posted were for the IGF, not the IGC meeting the day before.. It seems like we should be able to set something up, if it has not been done so yet. I can bring my laptop to moderate, if we have an Internet connection, and set up a mechanism. Jeremy, what did you have in mind? Please let me know if I can help in any way. Cheers, Ginger Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu *Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org* On 7 September 2011 12:59, McTim wrote: > Hi Ginger, > > On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 5:02 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > >> Hi Shaila and everybody: >> The list of hubs is here: >> >> http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/list-of-remote-hubs-2011 >> >> If you cannot find a hub near you, check out the hub instructions, and see >> if you would like to form a hub in your area! It's the best way to >> participate remotely, and benefit from local discussions at the same time. >> Hope to see you there. >> >> http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/hubs-instructions-2011 >> >> http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011 >> >> AND... with the remote moderators on all workshops, this will not be >> remote observation, but remote participation, if you want it to be... >> > > Just to be clear this thread is about an IGC meeting, not the main IGF. > > I think some folk are expecting remote participation for the IGC meeting. > Will there be RP for the IGC, or just for the IGF? > > > -- > Cheers, > > McTim > "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route > indicates how we get there." Jon Postel > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From devonrb at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 14:30:46 2011 From: devonrb at gmail.com (Devon Blake) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 14:30:46 -0400 Subject: [governance] Fwd: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> Message-ID: I nominate Jeremy Malcolm On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 12:36 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. > > jeanette > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker > Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:03:17 +0200 > From: Chengetai Masango > To: igf Forum > > Dear All, > > I hope those of you in the northern hemisphere have had a good summer and > those in the south the winter was not too cold. > > We are fast approaching the start of the IGF Nairobi meeting. The > preparations are moving along well. > I would be grateful if you could all remind your various stakeholder groups > that the online registration ends on 9 September. > Onsite registration will still be possible but it will entail additional > queuing . > > The Host country and the IGF Secretariat are putting the final touches to > the opening session speakers list. Alice and I would like to ask the MAG to > nominate a speaker to represent civil society. > We would be appreciative If you could send us your selection by the end of > the week. > > > Best regards > > Chengetai > > > > > ______________________________**_________________ > igf_members mailing list > igf_members at intgovforum.org > http://mail.intgovforum.org/**mailman/listinfo/igf_members_** > intgovforum.org > ______________________________**______________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/**unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/**info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/**translate_t > > -- Devon Blake Special Projects Director Earthwise Solutions Limited 29 Dominica Drive Kgn 5 ,Phone: Office 876-968-4534, Mobile, 876-589-6369 To be kind, To be helpful, To network *Earthwise ... For Life!* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From katitza at eff.org Wed Sep 7 14:32:08 2011 From: katitza at eff.org (Katitza Rodriguez) Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2011 11:32:08 -0700 Subject: [governance] Fwd: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <4E67B8A8.6070000@eff.org> I second it. On 9/7/11 11:30 AM, Devon Blake wrote: > I nominate Jeremy Malcolm > > On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 12:36 PM, Jeanette Hofmann > wrote: > > Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. > > jeanette > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker > Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:03:17 +0200 > From: Chengetai Masango > > To: igf Forum > > > Dear All, > > I hope those of you in the northern hemisphere have had a good > summer and those in the south the winter was not too cold. > > We are fast approaching the start of the IGF Nairobi meeting. The > preparations are moving along well. > I would be grateful if you could all remind your various > stakeholder groups that the online registration ends on 9 September. > Onsite registration will still be possible but it will entail > additional queuing . > > The Host country and the IGF Secretariat are putting the final > touches to the opening session speakers list. Alice and I would > like to ask the MAG to nominate a speaker to represent civil society. > We would be appreciative If you could send us your selection by > the end of the week. > > > Best regards > > Chengetai > > > > > _______________________________________________ > igf_members mailing list > igf_members at intgovforum.org > http://mail.intgovforum.org/mailman/listinfo/igf_members_intgovforum.org > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > -- > Devon Blake > Special Projects Director > Earthwise Solutions Limited > 29 Dominica Drive > Kgn 5 > ,Phone: Office 876-968-4534, Mobile, 876-589-6369 > > To be kind, To be helpful, To network > */Earthwise ... For Life!/* > -- Katitza Rodriguez International Rights Director Electronic Frontier Foundation katitza at eff.org katitza at datos-personales.org (personal email) Please support EFF - Working to protect your digital rights and freedom of speech since 1990 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu Wed Sep 7 14:55:37 2011 From: David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu (David Allen) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 14:55:37 -0400 Subject: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: <4E6790CD.6030005@rkey.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610723642-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1315346384.53104.YahooMailNeo@web161911.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <612221881-1315346611-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-610918866-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry><1315349095.26513.YahooMailNeo@web161912.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <2074254519-1315350241-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-322742374-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <4E6790CD.6030005@rkey.com> Message-ID: <6BE3292B-DDAE-4F27-937A-891A23A3CACF@post.harvard.edu> In my view, this informed perspective is useful - and appreciated. Particularly, I appreciate that someone - here - has spoken up to note that falsified identities fly in the face of responsible participation. However, as to apps that may automatically carry the list discussion to Facebook, then republish comments back to the list: That effectively forks the discussion space. That of course would be most seriously disruptive to the discussion. David On Sep 7, 2011, at 11:42 AM, Craig Simon wrote: > As someone who's done some Facebook app development, I'd suggest > that there might be a technical solution that routes around the > various problems and reservations being raised here. > > FYI, the The IGC exists as a closed group with about 6 members, and > the Internet Governance Forum has about 2100 "likes" but doesn't see > a great deal of activity. > > http://www.facebook.com/groups/CS.IGC/ > http://www.facebook.com/IntGovForum?ref=ts > > My understanding is that some within the IGC would like to use > Facebook in ways that can leverage all the viral goodness that > Facebook may offer. That is, people who post and comment on a Page > or Group wall can generally count on having that content pushed out > onto many personal newsfeeds where it can easily attract new > particpants. > > The evident problem is that non-Facebook users wouldn't be able to > see that content at all. Moreover, even Facebook members may miss it > as things fly by. > > Moreover, some folks simply don't want to be on Facebook... period. > That's a perfectly reasonable position. Others may be considering > violating FB's terms of service by creating a fake persona for that > purpose only. I'd advise against that, since it can get confusing, > and the account would always be at high risk of termination. > > In my own online reading habits, I tend to be far more diligent > about following my various subscriptions in filtered lists via my > email client than I am about following groups on Facebook. So I > believe that moving this list's content to Facebook would degrade my > ability to keep up with conversations. I expect others would have > the same concern. > > Nevertheless, there's no denying that, if prominence is what you > want, a stronger presence on Facebook is a good way to pursue it. > > I believe there may be (or soon will be) facebook apps that > facilitate automatic publication of email list digests to a Facebook > wall, and the simultaneous republication of wall comments back to > the list. I've looked briefly, and I recommend that folks here who > are advocating a pro-Facebook strategy keep their eyes open for that > kind of a tool. > > Craig Simon ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From roland at internetpolicyagency.com Wed Sep 7 15:09:58 2011 From: roland at internetpolicyagency.com (Roland Perry) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 20:09:58 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: In message , at 08:55:31 on Wed, 7 Sep 2011, "Tracy F. Hackshaw @ Google" writes >And why not use not only FB, but G+, LinkedIn, Orkut, YouTube, Quora, >etc etc not to discuss or "fully engage" but to EDUCATE non-IGC >members about the IGC at a high level and POINT to the IGC Open >Discussion Tools/Social Network/Thingamajig? All good questions for someone setting a social media strategy for the IGC. Who is tasked with that? -- Roland Perry ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From tracyhackshaw at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 15:26:06 2011 From: tracyhackshaw at gmail.com (Tracy F. Hackshaw @ Google) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 15:26:06 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hello all, On another note, this discussion, or variants of same, seems to return year after year in different guises. I do find the general "reluctance" of the IGC list to seek to expand beyond its core membership base ("noise???") to be quite mystifying, especially given its mandate to, if not represent, certainly provide a forum for, the views of Civil Society in the areas surrounding IG. *The mission of the Internet Governance Caucus (IGC) is to provide a forum > for discussion, advocacy, action, and for representation of civil society > contributions in Internet governance processes. The caucus intends to > provide an open and effective forum for civil society to share opinion, > policy options and expertise on Internet governance issues, and to provide a > mechanism for coordination of advocacy to enhance the utilization and > influence of Civil Society (CS) and the IGC in relevant policy processes. > * I, for one, am all for expanding the communication channels by which the IGC seeks to effect its Mission and associated objectives, and using that opportunity to direct the "noise" to a more focussed and ultimately engaging experience facilitated by IGC "branded" tools. And, at the risk of playing firestarter, +1 for a real names policy in the IGC social toolkit as well. Best wishes, Tracy On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Deirdre Williams < williams.deirdre at gmail.com> wrote: > I have been wondering about noise as well. > Communication seems to me to work more efficiently, in terms of "these are > the issues", as information emanating from a known and/or trusted > individual. Rather than one large "IGC" campaign, individual initiatives by > IGC members, who use Facebook and other such services, to spread information > about the issues of Internet Governance might have more real effect. And > this would also serve to break the language difficulties to a great extent. > But one never knows how things will work until the experiment is complete - > so all power to Izumi for experimenting. > Deirdre > > On 7 September 2011 09:46, Louis Pouzin (well) wrote: > >> On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 14:55, Tracy F. Hackshaw @ Google < >> tracyhackshaw at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Still not sure why Jeremy's suggestion is not acceptable. >>> >>> Agree with Jacqueline, Siva and David at the same time. >>> >>> And why not use not only FB, but G+, LinkedIn, Orkut, YouTube, Quora, >>> etc etc not to discuss or "fully engage" but to EDUCATE non-IGC >>> members about the IGC at a high level and POINT to the IGC Open >>> Discussion Tools/Social Network/Thingamajig? >>> >> - - - >> >> My hunch is that would trigger much more noise than signal. Then who has >> enough spare time to debunk the load of misconceptions ? >> Good luck. >> - - - >> >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> > > > -- > “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William > Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979 > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 15:53:15 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 07:53:15 +1200 Subject: [governance] What's in a name? Cyber army or CERT Message-ID: Dear All, I was watching on Aljazeera how Syria is allegedly using Iranian Technology and that they have a *cyber army* that is trained to hunt and track down all those who have been leaking things outside Syria. It appears that Syria does not want a repeat of Egypt. There are some interesting developments happening in Syria: http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2011/09/20119785531287269.html Is the cyber army a civillian term for CERT? -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu Wed Sep 7 15:54:18 2011 From: David_Allen_AB63 at post.harvard.edu (David Allen) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 15:54:18 -0400 Subject: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <692456091-1315314280-cardhu_blackberry.rim.net-copy_sent_folder-1600780852-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <1572592586-1315314421-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-318906668-@b2.c2.bise6.blackberry> <008a01cc6d47$6f577550$4e065ff0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: No one, from this quarter, in this thread, has said anything against reaching out or spreading the word (or indeed said anything - at all - on the subject). Indeed - indeed - over long years, the call, other threads, has been to make the IGC appropriately inclusive, not centered on a few who post most of the time. That is central to the success of something that might, one day, be reasonably representative of at least one slice of civil society. Rather, the (whole) topic in this thread - from here - is about the quality of the discussion space the IGC creates. A forked discussion space certainly would degrade what is already a challenge to conduct, around the world, and suitably for many different cultures. Outreach is separate from quality of discussion space. Ultimately, one day, a wider constituency could bring front and center the sort of problem sometimes discussed re global governance, about how to facilitate exchange when a group grows really large. But for IGC that lies in the future, if ever. As to 'noise,' Louis pretty clearly points to the real problem of doing outreach well, rather than failing to have a well-thought out program. Outreach is indeed important. But not at the expense of degrading the discussion space in the first place. It is key, I suggest, not to conflate the two. David On Sep 7, 2011, at 3:26 PM, Tracy F. Hackshaw @ Google wrote: > Hello all, > > On another note, this discussion, or variants of same, seems to > return year after year in different guises. > > I do find the general "reluctance" of the IGC list to seek to expand > beyond its core membership base ("noise???") to be quite mystifying, > especially given its mandate to, if not represent, certainly provide > a forum for, the views of Civil Society in the areas surrounding IG. > > The mission of the Internet Governance Caucus (IGC) is to provide a > forum for discussion, advocacy, action, and for representation of > civil society contributions in Internet governance processes. The > caucus intends to provide an open and effective forum for civil > society to share opinion, policy options and expertise on Internet > governance issues, and to provide a mechanism for coordination of > advocacy to enhance the utilization and influence of Civil Society > (CS) and the IGC in relevant policy processes. > > I, for one, am all for expanding the communication channels by which > the IGC seeks to effect its Mission and associated objectives, and > using that opportunity to direct the "noise" to a more focussed and > ultimately engaging experience facilitated by IGC "branded" tools. > > And, at the risk of playing firestarter, +1 for a real names policy > in the IGC social toolkit as well. > > Best wishes, > > Tracy > > > > On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 10:12 AM, Deirdre Williams > wrote: > I have been wondering about noise as well. > Communication seems to me to work more efficiently, in terms of > "these are the issues", as information emanating from a known and/or > trusted individual. Rather than one large "IGC" campaign, individual > initiatives by IGC members, who use Facebook and other such > services, to spread information about the issues of Internet > Governance might have more real effect. And this would also serve to > break the language difficulties to a great extent. > But one never knows how things will work until the experiment is > complete - so all power to Izumi for experimenting. > Deirdre > > On 7 September 2011 09:46, Louis Pouzin (well) > wrote: > On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 14:55, Tracy F. Hackshaw @ Google > wrote: > Still not sure why Jeremy's suggestion is not acceptable. > > Agree with Jacqueline, Siva and David at the same time. > > And why not use not only FB, but G+, LinkedIn, Orkut, YouTube, Quora, > etc etc not to discuss or "fully engage" but to EDUCATE non-IGC > members about the IGC at a high level and POINT to the IGC Open > Discussion Tools/Social Network/Thingamajig? > - - - > > My hunch is that would trigger much more noise than signal. Then who > has enough spare time to debunk the load of misconceptions ? > Good luck. > - - - -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From anriette at apc.org Wed Sep 7 16:21:39 2011 From: anriette at apc.org (Anriette Esterhuysen) Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2011 22:21:39 +0200 Subject: [governance] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> Dear Jeanette and all I think we should propose a speaker from Kenyan civil society. I would like to nominate Grace Githaiga, a human rights advocate, researcher, and member of KictaNet (Kenyan ICT Africa Network) who is an APC member in Kenya. Grace is on this list. Here is more information about her. http://www.foeassociates.com/associates/amy-west/grace-githaiga/ Cheers Anriette On 07/09/11 18:36, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. > > jeanette > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker > Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:03:17 +0200 > From: Chengetai Masango > To: igf Forum > > Dear All, > > I hope those of you in the northern hemisphere have had a good summer > and those in the south the winter was not too cold. > > We are fast approaching the start of the IGF Nairobi meeting. The > preparations are moving along well. > I would be grateful if you could all remind your various stakeholder > groups that the online registration ends on 9 September. > Onsite registration will still be possible but it will entail additional > queuing . > > The Host country and the IGF Secretariat are putting the final touches > to the opening session speakers list. Alice and I would like to ask the > MAG to nominate a speaker to represent civil society. > We would be appreciative If you could send us your selection by the end > of the week. > > > Best regards > > Chengetai > > > > > _______________________________________________ > igf_members mailing list > igf_members at intgovforum.org > http://mail.intgovforum.org/mailman/listinfo/igf_members_intgovforum.org > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -- ------------------------------------------------------ anriette esterhuysen anriette at apc.org executive director, association for progressive communications www.apc.org po box 29755, melville 2109 south africa tel/fax +27 11 726 1692 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 16:27:04 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 08:27:04 +1200 Subject: [governance] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> Message-ID: I would like to suggest that *both* Jeremy and Grace do a tag team approach to speaking for civil society, they can share the points and it would also express the spirit of collaboration and partnership. On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 8:21 AM, Anriette Esterhuysen wrote: > Dear Jeanette and all > > I think we should propose a speaker from Kenyan civil society. > > I would like to nominate Grace Githaiga, a human rights advocate, > researcher, and member of KictaNet (Kenyan ICT Africa Network) who is an > APC member in Kenya. > > Grace is on this list. > > Here is more information about her. > http://www.foeassociates.com/associates/amy-west/grace-githaiga/ > > Cheers > > Anriette > > > > > On 07/09/11 18:36, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > > Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. > > > > jeanette > > > > -------- Original Message -------- > > Subject: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker > > Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:03:17 +0200 > > From: Chengetai Masango > > To: igf Forum > > > > Dear All, > > > > I hope those of you in the northern hemisphere have had a good summer > > and those in the south the winter was not too cold. > > > > We are fast approaching the start of the IGF Nairobi meeting. The > > preparations are moving along well. > > I would be grateful if you could all remind your various stakeholder > > groups that the online registration ends on 9 September. > > Onsite registration will still be possible but it will entail additional > > queuing . > > > > The Host country and the IGF Secretariat are putting the final touches > > to the opening session speakers list. Alice and I would like to ask the > > MAG to nominate a speaker to represent civil society. > > We would be appreciative If you could send us your selection by the end > > of the week. > > > > > > Best regards > > > > Chengetai > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > igf_members mailing list > > igf_members at intgovforum.org > > http://mail.intgovforum.org/mailman/listinfo/igf_members_intgovforum.org > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------ > anriette esterhuysen anriette at apc.org > executive director, association for progressive communications > www.apc.org > po box 29755, melville 2109 > south africa > tel/fax +27 11 726 1692 > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mail at christopherwilkinson.eu Wed Sep 7 16:35:44 2011 From: mail at christopherwilkinson.eu (CW Mail) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 22:35:44 +0200 Subject: [governance] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> Message-ID: <91B545EC-CB3B-4336-BDC8-0394938B331A@christopherwilkinson.eu> +1, CW On 07 Sep 2011, at 22:21, Anriette Esterhuysen wrote: > Dear Jeanette and all > > I think we should propose a speaker from Kenyan civil society. > > I would like to nominate Grace Githaiga, a human rights advocate, > researcher, and member of KictaNet (Kenyan ICT Africa Network) who > is an > APC member in Kenya. > > Grace is on this list. > > Here is more information about her. > http://www.foeassociates.com/associates/amy-west/grace-githaiga/ > > Cheers > > Anriette > > > > > On 07/09/11 18:36, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >> Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. >> >> jeanette >> >> -------- Original Message -------- >> Subject: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker >> Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:03:17 +0200 >> From: Chengetai Masango >> To: igf Forum >> >> Dear All, >> >> I hope those of you in the northern hemisphere have had a good summer >> and those in the south the winter was not too cold. >> >> We are fast approaching the start of the IGF Nairobi meeting. The >> preparations are moving along well. >> I would be grateful if you could all remind your various stakeholder >> groups that the online registration ends on 9 September. >> Onsite registration will still be possible but it will entail >> additional >> queuing . >> >> The Host country and the IGF Secretariat are putting the final >> touches >> to the opening session speakers list. Alice and I would like to >> ask the >> MAG to nominate a speaker to represent civil society. >> We would be appreciative If you could send us your selection by the >> end >> of the week. >> >> >> Best regards >> >> Chengetai >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> igf_members mailing list >> igf_members at intgovforum.org >> http://mail.intgovforum.org/mailman/listinfo/igf_members_intgovforum.org >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------ > anriette esterhuysen anriette at apc.org > executive director, association for progressive communications > www.apc.org > po box 29755, melville 2109 > south africa > tel/fax +27 11 726 1692 > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng Wed Sep 7 16:57:40 2011 From: sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng (Sonigitu Ekpe) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 21:57:40 +0100 Subject: [governance] FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION AND NEW MEDIA - Human Rights Committee In-Reply-To: References: <4E37E76E.9090804@ciroap.org> <1312398790.51994.YahooMailNeo@web161906.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <4E3A0B08.7030907@ciroap.org> <007f01cc528b$99b15810$cd140830$@planet.tn> <1315250015.30442.YahooMailNeo@web25704.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Dam, Yea I support you to the fullest, criticism "considered to be insulting", checkmate should "including the army", very very important. The biggest question yet unanswered is, 'why the WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION and not FOOD FOR ALL? Regards to ALL. Sea On 5 Sep 2011 20:14, "Dam Philippe" wrote: http://www.ohchr.org/EN/NewsEvents/Pages/FreedomExpressionandnewmedia.aspx Freedom of expression and new media When the UN Human Rights Committee last clarified the rights to freedom of opinion and expression, use of the internet was limited and the effect it would have on the mainstream media was still the subject of speculation. More than two decades on, the Committee seeks to give practical application to freedom of opinion and expression in the radically altered media landscape which has the internet and mobile communications centre-stage. Describing “a global network to exchange ideas and opinions that does not necessarily rely on the traditional mass media”, the Committee says “States parties should take all necessary steps to foster the independence of these new media and to ensure access”. Any restrictions that might be applied to websites, blogs or any other internet-based networks or support systems should be limited, the Committee says, to content only and should not be applied to entire sites and systems. In the context of permissible restrictions generally, the Committee recommends extreme caution and provides many examples of situations where the urge to restrict freedom of expression should be resisted. There are no circumstances which justify limiting freedom of opinion, the Committee notes in its revised General Comment. Lawmakers, judges, prosecutors, lawyers, human rights defenders, journalists and others will turn to the General Comment for guidance on the scope and practical applications of the rights to freedom of opinion and expression. In the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights which sets out the right to freedom of expression, only two situations are described which justify its limitation: respect of the rights or reputations of others and protection of national security or of public order, or of public health or morals. The Covenant also prohibits advocacy of religious hatred. Allowing for those very limited exceptions, the Committee says blasphemy laws and prohibitions on displays of disrespect for a religion or other belief systems are a contravention of the right to freedom of expression, as are laws which favour one religion over another, or religious believers over non-believers, or which prevent or punish criticism of religious leaders or commentary on religious doctrine. The Committee notes that the Convention places a particularly high value on uninhibited debate concerning political figures and public institutions. Laws which prohibit or restrict criticism of important people and institutions are cause for concern the Committee says. “The mere fact that forms of expression are considered to be insulting to a public figure is not sufficient to justify the imposition of penalties… all public figures, including those exercising the highest political authority such as heads of state and government, are legitimately subject to criticism and political opposition”. The same should apply to institutions such as the army. Committee member, Michael O’Flaherty says, “The main point of the general comment and of the Committee adopting it is that freedom of expression is at the heart of the entire human rights system.” “That means,” he says, “we have to put up with a lot of speech that we don’t like. 1 September 2011 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng Wed Sep 7 17:06:53 2011 From: sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng (Sonigitu Ekpe) Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 22:06:53 +0100 Subject: [governance] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <91B545EC-CB3B-4336-BDC8-0394938B331A@christopherwilkinson.eu> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> <91B545EC-CB3B-4336-BDC8-0394938B331A@christopherwilkinson.eu> Message-ID: Dear All, Fully in support of Sala's pairing opinion. It provides great room for team representation. Warm regards, Sea On 7 Sep 2011 21:36, "CW Mail" wrote: +1, CW On 07 Sep 2011, at 22:21, Anriette Esterhuysen wrote: > Dear Jeanette and all > > I think we sho... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jeremy at ciroap.org Wed Sep 7 20:17:47 2011 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 08:17:47 +0800 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> Message-ID: On 08/09/2011, at 12:36 AM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. Many thanks for the nomination and the +1! However, I spoke at last year's closing ceremony, and am not a woman, so I think some other nominations to consider (self or otherwise) would also be valuable. -- Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. www.consumersinternational.org Twitter @ConsumersInt Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 2212 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jeremy at ciroap.org Wed Sep 7 20:23:50 2011 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 08:23:50 +0800 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> <1315413940.90113.YahooMailNeo@web161904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <8DC3581D-363D-4CA4-9F13-229F9220B5FC@ciroap.org> On 08/09/2011, at 2:29 AM, Ginger Paque wrote: > Hi McTim, > Thanks for clarifying... yes, I was indeed mistaken. The links I posted were for the IGF, not the IGC meeting the day before.. > > It seems like we should be able to set something up, if it has not been done so yet. I can bring my laptop to moderate, if we have an Internet connection, and set up a mechanism. Jeremy, what did you have in mind? Please let me know if I can help in any way. Thanks Ginger. There is an integrated Jabber, IRC and web-based chat room available here: http://igf-online.net/chat.php Or if people prefer Skype, or Google+ Hangouts, we can use those. Let's hear what the remote participants would like to use. -- Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. www.consumersinternational.org Twitter @ConsumersInt Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 2212 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Wed Sep 7 20:30:45 2011 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2011 10:30:45 +1000 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: Message-ID: My guess is that in time we will be asked to nominate speakers for other sessions eg including closing ­ I think it is fine for Alice for Opening, but towards closing it would be good to have Jeremy or someone closer to the action sum our our responses in the light of developments during the meeting. Sorry I won¹t be there! From: Jeremy Malcolm Reply-To: , Jeremy Malcolm Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 08:17:47 +0800 To: Subject: Re: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker On 08/09/2011, at 12:36 AM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. Many thanks for the nomination and the +1! However, I spoke at last year's closing ceremony, and am not a woman, so I think some other nominations to consider (self or otherwise) would also be valuable. -- Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. www.consumersinternational.org Twitter @ConsumersInt Read our email confidentiality notice . Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 22:05:58 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 14:05:58 +1200 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Another thought is, if in the opening, Jeremy and Grace team up for the opening and Izumi can close it as co-coordinator. This way we would have gender represented, continents represented to add a bit of spice :) On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 12:30 PM, Ian Peter wrote: > My guess is that in time we will be asked to nominate speakers for other > sessions eg including closing – I think it is fine for Alice for Opening, > but towards closing it would be good to have Jeremy or someone closer to the > action sum our our responses in the light of developments during the > meeting. > > Sorry I won’t be there! > > > > > ------------------------------ > *From: *Jeremy Malcolm > *Reply-To: *, Jeremy Malcolm > > *Date: *Thu, 8 Sep 2011 08:17:47 +0800 > *To: * > *Subject: *Re: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society > speaker > > > On 08/09/2011, at 12:36 AM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > > Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. > > > Many thanks for the nomination and the +1! However, I spoke at last year's > closing ceremony, and am not a woman, so I think some other nominations to > consider (self or otherwise) would also be valuable. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator > *Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > *www.consumersinternational.org > Twitter @ConsumersInt > * > Read our email confidentiality notice < > http://www.consumersinternational.org/email-confidentiality> . Don't print > this email unless necessary. > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 22:07:15 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 14:07:15 +1200 Subject: [governance] Syria Message-ID: Dear All, Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting to hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From admin at alkasir.com Wed Sep 7 23:10:36 2011 From: admin at alkasir.com (Walid AL-SAQAF ) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 05:10:36 +0200 Subject: [governance] Syria In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello Salanieta, I'm not in Syria but I have lots of people in touch with me -anonymously- because they are using a circumvention software I developed to help them overcome web censorship. The situation is extremely dangerous for activists and protestors yet they are pushing forward. It appears that the Internet remains open though fear has been growing particularly as there were reports of phishing sites set up by regime elements to trap some facebook users from Syria. If you have some specific questions, I'd be happy to ask them. Sincerely, Walid ----------------- Walid Al-Saqaf Founder & Administrator alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship https://alkasir.com On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 4:07 AM, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro < salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear All, > > Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting to > hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. > > -- > Sala > > " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ggithaiga at hotmail.com Wed Sep 7 23:17:41 2011 From: ggithaiga at hotmail.com (Grace Githaiga) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 03:17:41 +0000 Subject: [governance] Syria In-Reply-To: References: , Message-ID: Hi Walid Remember me? We met during a PhD workshop last year. Are you still in Sweden? Kind Regards Grace ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 05:10:36 +0200 From: admin at alkasir.com To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Subject: Re: [governance] Syria Hello Salanieta, I'm not in Syria but I have lots of people in touch with me -anonymously- because they are using a circumvention software I developed to help them overcome web censorship. The situation is extremely dangerous for activists and protestors yet they are pushing forward. It appears that the Internet remains open though fear has been growing particularly as there were reports of phishing sites set up by regime elements to trap some facebook users from Syria. If you have some specific questions, I'd be happy to ask them. Sincerely, Walid ----------------- Walid Al-Saqaf Founder & Administrator alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship https://alkasir.com On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 4:07 AM, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro wrote: Dear All, Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting to hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Wed Sep 7 23:17:51 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 15:17:51 +1200 Subject: [governance] Syria In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello Walid, (1) Are they alright and are their lives threatened and is the threat (torture or imprisonment or death or any/all)? (2) How can we help? (3) How can the world help? (4)Is there a link where we can read about the history of the conflicts in Syria, so that we can get up to speed? My prayers are with them in this time. Sala On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 3:10 PM, Walid AL-SAQAF < admin at alkasir.com> wrote: > Hello Salanieta, > > I'm not in Syria but I have lots of people in touch with me -anonymously- > because they are using a circumvention software I developed to help them > overcome web censorship. The situation is extremely dangerous for activists > and protestors yet they are pushing forward. It appears that the Internet > remains open though fear has been growing particularly as there were reports > of phishing sites set up by regime elements to trap some facebook users from > Syria. If you have some specific questions, I'd be happy to ask them. > > Sincerely, > > Walid > > ----------------- > > Walid Al-Saqaf > Founder & Administrator > alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship > https://alkasir.com > > > On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 4:07 AM, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro < > salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Dear All, >> >> Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting >> to hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. >> >> -- >> Sala >> >> " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ggithaiga at hotmail.com Wed Sep 7 23:20:00 2011 From: ggithaiga at hotmail.com (Grace Githaiga) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 03:20:00 +0000 Subject: [governance] Syria/ Apologies In-Reply-To: References: ,, Message-ID: Good People My apologies. That response was meant for Walid and not for the list but...it just happened. Rgds Grace ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! From: ggithaiga at hotmail.com To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 03:17:41 +0000 Subject: RE: [governance] Syria Hi Walid Remember me? We met during a PhD workshop last year. Are you still in Sweden? Kind Regards Grace ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 05:10:36 +0200 From: admin at alkasir.com To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Subject: Re: [governance] Syria Hello Salanieta, I'm not in Syria but I have lots of people in touch with me -anonymously- because they are using a circumvention software I developed to help them overcome web censorship. The situation is extremely dangerous for activists and protestors yet they are pushing forward. It appears that the Internet remains open though fear has been growing particularly as there were reports of phishing sites set up by regime elements to trap some facebook users from Syria. If you have some specific questions, I'd be happy to ask them. Sincerely, Walid ----------------- Walid Al-Saqaf Founder & Administrator alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship https://alkasir.com On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 4:07 AM, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro wrote: Dear All, Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting to hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jeremy at ciroap.org Thu Sep 8 00:31:48 2011 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2011 12:31:48 +0800 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4E684534.8000704@ciroap.org> On 08/09/11 08:30, Ian Peter wrote: > My guess is that in time we will be asked to nominate speakers for > other sessions eg including closing -- I think it is fine for Alice > for Opening, Do you mean Grace? > but towards closing it would be good to have Jeremy or someone closer > to the action sum our our responses in the light of developments > during the meeting. I will discuss with Grace off-list, and also discuss with the Secretariat, to see what our options are (eg. can we have two speakers in the opening, and when would we each prefer to speak). The caucus can then make an informed decision. -- *Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator* Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. _www.consumersinternational.org _ _Twitter @ConsumersInt _ Read our email confidentiality notice . Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 3762 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From katitza at eff.org Thu Sep 8 00:33:50 2011 From: katitza at eff.org (Katitza Rodriguez) Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2011 21:33:50 -0700 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E684534.8000704@ciroap.org> References: <4E684534.8000704@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <4E6845AE.6080509@eff.org> Jeremie, You should inquire for the closing session too. ! Best, Katitza On 9/7/11 9:31 PM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > On 08/09/11 08:30, Ian Peter wrote: >> My guess is that in time we will be asked to nominate speakers for >> other sessions eg including closing -- I think it is fine for Alice >> for Opening, > > Do you mean Grace? > >> but towards closing it would be good to have Jeremy or someone closer >> to the action sum our our responses in the light of developments >> during the meeting. > > I will discuss with Grace off-list, and also discuss with the > Secretariat, to see what our options are (eg. can we have two speakers > in the opening, and when would we each prefer to speak). The caucus > can then make an informed decision. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer > groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only > independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over > 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful > international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. > _www.consumersinternational.org _ > _Twitter @ConsumersInt _ > > Read our email confidentiality notice > . Don't > print this email unless necessary. > -- Katitza Rodriguez International Rights Director Electronic Frontier Foundation katitza at eff.org katitza at datos-personales.org (personal email) Please support EFF - Working to protect your digital rights and freedom of speech since 1990 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From devonrb at gmail.com Thu Sep 8 00:38:14 2011 From: devonrb at gmail.com (devonrb at gmail.com) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 04:38:14 +0000 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil societyspeaker In-Reply-To: <4E6845AE.6080509@eff.org> References: <4E684534.8000704@ciroap.org><4E6845AE.6080509@eff.org> Message-ID: <1852073676-1315456695-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-672743797-@b11.c1.bise6.blackberry> Actually the closing session would be good for making sustainable recommendations. Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Digicel -----Original Message----- From: Katitza Rodriguez Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2011 21:33:50 To: Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,Katitza Rodriguez Subject: Re: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker Jeremie, You should inquire for the closing session too. ! Best, Katitza On 9/7/11 9:31 PM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > On 08/09/11 08:30, Ian Peter wrote: >> My guess is that in time we will be asked to nominate speakers for >> other sessions eg including closing -- I think it is fine for Alice >> for Opening, > > Do you mean Grace? > >> but towards closing it would be good to have Jeremy or someone closer >> to the action sum our our responses in the light of developments >> during the meeting. > > I will discuss with Grace off-list, and also discuss with the > Secretariat, to see what our options are (eg. can we have two speakers > in the opening, and when would we each prefer to speak). The caucus > can then make an informed decision. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer > groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only > independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over > 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful > international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. > _www.consumersinternational.org _ > _Twitter @ConsumersInt _ > > Read our email confidentiality notice > . Don't > print this email unless necessary. > -- Katitza Rodriguez International Rights Director Electronic Frontier Foundation katitza at eff.org katitza at datos-personales.org (personal email) Please support EFF - Working to protect your digital rights and freedom of speech since 1990 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Thu Sep 8 00:42:24 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 16:42:24 +1200 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E6845AE.6080509@eff.org> References: <4E684534.8000704@ciroap.org> <4E6845AE.6080509@eff.org> Message-ID: And throw in the "it reflects the spirit of collaboration and multistakeholderism" that civil society believes in. On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 4:33 PM, Katitza Rodriguez wrote: > Jeremie, > > You should inquire for the closing session too. ! > > Best, Katitza > > > On 9/7/11 9:31 PM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > > On 08/09/11 08:30, Ian Peter wrote: > > My guess is that in time we will be asked to nominate speakers for other > sessions eg including closing – I think it is fine for Alice for Opening, > > > Do you mean Grace? > > but towards closing it would be good to have Jeremy or someone closer to > the action sum our our responses in the light of developments during the > meeting. > > > I will discuss with Grace off-list, and also discuss with the Secretariat, > to see what our options are (eg. can we have two speakers in the opening, > and when would we each prefer to speak). The caucus can then make an > informed decision. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > *www.consumersinternational.org* > *Twitter @ConsumersInt * > > Read our email confidentiality notice. > Don't print this email unless necessary. > > > > -- > Katitza Rodriguez > International Rights Director > Electronic Frontier Foundationkatitza at eff.orgkatitza@datos-personales.org (personal email) > > Please support EFF - Working to protect your digital rights and freedom of speech since 1990 > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn Thu Sep 8 03:29:14 2011 From: tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn (tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 08:29:14 +0100 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <006501cc6df9$05c71840$115548c0$@planet.tn> Thank you very much Jeremy. You read my mind. I think it’s really fair. While I do like you to be speaking in the opening session, I believe that we need to avoid appointing the same people every year. We should appoint preferably a woman from the south, but the quality remains the main criterion. ------------------------------------------------------ TIjani BEN JEMAA Vice Chair of the CIC World Federation of Engineering Organizations Phone : + 216 70 825 231 Mobile : + 216 98 330 114 Fax : + 216 70 825 231 ------------------------------------------------------ De : governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] De la part de Jeremy Malcolm Envoyé : jeudi 8 septembre 2011 01:18 À : governance at lists.cpsr.org Objet : Re: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker On 08/09/2011, at 12:36 AM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. Many thanks for the nomination and the +1! However, I spoke at last year's closing ceremony, and am not a woman, so I think some other nominations to consider (self or otherwise) would also be valuable. -- Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. www.consumersinternational.org Twitter @ConsumersInt Read our email confidentiality notice . Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Thu Sep 8 04:02:32 2011 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 17:02:32 +0900 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <006501cc6df9$05c71840$115548c0$@planet.tn> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <006501cc6df9$05c71840$115548c0$@planet.tn> Message-ID: Grace is a very experienced researcher, and very nice (hello Grace :-)). She's one of the leading volunteers behind KICTANet, a multistakeholder network that's extremely influential in the Kenyan ICT sector (and for anyone going to the IGF well worth checking out to get a sense of what's happening in Kenya, there's a summary of mailing list discussions on their website The "Bitange for President' thread's pretty good.) I guess there will be 3-5 minutes speaking time depending on the number of speakers. Whoever's proposed, and would be best to include other CS groups in this discussion, Internet Rights and Principles for example, then provide the person with a list of points to include. Adam >Content-Type: multipart/alternative; > boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0066_01CC6E01.6792AC30" >Content-Language: fr > >Thank you very much Jeremy. You read my mind. I think it¹s really fair. >While I do like you to be speaking in the >opening session, I believe that we need to avoid >appointing the same people every year. > >We should appoint preferably a woman from the >south, but the quality remains the main >criterion. > >------------------------------------------------------ >TIjani BEN JEMAA >Vice Chair of the CIC >World Federation of Engineering Organizations >Phone : + 216 70 825 231 >Mobile : + 216 98 330 114 >Fax : + 216 70 825 231 >------------------------------------------------------ > >De : governance at lists.cpsr.org >[mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] De la part de >Jeremy Malcolm >Envoyé : jeudi 8 septembre 2011 01:18 >À : governance at lists.cpsr.org >Objet : Re: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker > >On 08/09/2011, at 12:36 AM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > > >Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. > >Many thanks for the nomination and the +1! > However, I spoke at last year's closing >ceremony, and am not a woman, so I think some >other nominations to consider (self or >otherwise) would also be valuable. > >-- >Dr Jeremy Malcolm >Project Coordinator >Consumers International >Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, >TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia >Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >Consumers International (CI) is the world >federation of consumer groups that, working >together with its members, serves as the only >independent and authoritative global voice for >consumers. With over 220 member organisations in >115 countries, we are building a powerful >international movement to help protect and >empower consumers everywhere. >www.consumersinternational.org >Twitter @ConsumersInt > >Read >our email >confidentiality notice. Don't print this email >unless necessary. > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng Thu Sep 8 04:13:55 2011 From: sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng (Sonigitu Ekpe) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 09:13:55 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: <8DC3581D-363D-4CA4-9F13-229F9220B5FC@ciroap.org> References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> <1315413940.90113.YahooMailNeo@web161904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <8DC3581D-363D-4CA4-9F13-229F9220B5FC@ciroap.org> Message-ID: Dear All, Greetings from Calabar, Nigeria. We will be participating remotely from Calabar,Hub Nigeria. I greatly buying in the use of the "*IGF Community chat platform"*. Gives a lot of uniqueness. Warm regards Sonigitu Ekpe *Project Support Officer[Agriculturist]* Cross River Farm Credit Scheme Ministry of Agriculture and Natural Resources 3 Barracks Road P.M.B. 1119 Calabar - Cross River State, Nigeria. Mobile +234 805 0232 469 Office + 234 802 751 0179 Skype: sonigitu.asibong.ekpe.aji *"LIFE is all about love and thanksgiving" * On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 1:23 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > On 08/09/2011, at 2:29 AM, Ginger Paque wrote: > > Hi McTim, > Thanks for clarifying... yes, I was indeed mistaken. The links I posted > were for the IGF, not the IGC meeting the day before.. > > It seems like we should be able to set something up, if it has not been > done so yet. I can bring my laptop to moderate, if we have an Internet > connection, and set up a mechanism. Jeremy, what did you have in mind? > Please let me know if I can help in any way. > > > Thanks Ginger. There is an integrated Jabber, IRC and web-based chat room > available here: > > http://igf-online.net/chat.php > > Or if people prefer Skype, or Google+ Hangouts, we can use those. Let's > hear what the remote participants would like to use. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > *www.consumersinternational.org* > *Twitter @ConsumersInt * > > Read our email confidentiality notice. > Don't print this email unless necessary. > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jeanette at wzb.eu Thu Sep 8 07:25:45 2011 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2011 12:25:45 +0100 Subject: [governance] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> Message-ID: <4E68A639.90906@wzb.eu> Hi Anriette, I agree with the approach and trust your recommendation :-) jeanette On 07.09.2011 21:21, Anriette Esterhuysen wrote: > Dear Jeanette and all > > I think we should propose a speaker from Kenyan civil society. > > I would like to nominate Grace Githaiga, a human rights advocate, > researcher, and member of KictaNet (Kenyan ICT Africa Network) who is an > APC member in Kenya. > > Grace is on this list. > > Here is more information about her. > http://www.foeassociates.com/associates/amy-west/grace-githaiga/ > > Cheers > > Anriette > > > > > On 07/09/11 18:36, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >> Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. >> >> jeanette >> >> -------- Original Message -------- >> Subject: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker >> Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:03:17 +0200 >> From: Chengetai Masango >> To: igf Forum >> >> Dear All, >> >> I hope those of you in the northern hemisphere have had a good summer >> and those in the south the winter was not too cold. >> >> We are fast approaching the start of the IGF Nairobi meeting. The >> preparations are moving along well. >> I would be grateful if you could all remind your various stakeholder >> groups that the online registration ends on 9 September. >> Onsite registration will still be possible but it will entail additional >> queuing . >> >> The Host country and the IGF Secretariat are putting the final touches >> to the opening session speakers list. Alice and I would like to ask the >> MAG to nominate a speaker to represent civil society. >> We would be appreciative If you could send us your selection by the end >> of the week. >> >> >> Best regards >> >> Chengetai >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> igf_members mailing list >> igf_members at intgovforum.org >> http://mail.intgovforum.org/mailman/listinfo/igf_members_intgovforum.org >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From nb at bollow.ch Thu Sep 8 07:15:03 2011 From: nb at bollow.ch (Norbert Bollow) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 13:15:03 +0200 (CEST) Subject: [governance] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: (salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com) References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> Message-ID: <20110908111503.4F23D15C376@quill.bollow.ch> Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro wrote: > I would like to suggest that *both* Jeremy and Grace do a tag team approach > to speaking for civil society, they can share the points and it would also > express the spirit of collaboration and partnership. +1 Greetings, Norbert ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From william.drake at uzh.ch Thu Sep 8 07:44:03 2011 From: william.drake at uzh.ch (William Drake) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 12:44:03 +0100 Subject: [governance] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E68A639.90906@wzb.eu> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> <4E68A639.90906@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <8159CAC1-103B-4062-A393-BD70B10BAA1D@uzh.ch> Hi Me too. Bill On Sep 8, 2011, at 12:25 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > Hi Anriette, > > I agree with the approach and trust your recommendation :-) > > jeanette > > On 07.09.2011 21:21, Anriette Esterhuysen wrote: >> Dear Jeanette and all >> >> I think we should propose a speaker from Kenyan civil society. >> >> I would like to nominate Grace Githaiga, a human rights advocate, >> researcher, and member of KictaNet (Kenyan ICT Africa Network) who is an >> APC member in Kenya. >> >> Grace is on this list. >> >> Here is more information about her. >> http://www.foeassociates.com/associates/amy-west/grace-githaiga/ >> >> Cheers >> >> Anriette >> >> >> >> >> On 07/09/11 18:36, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >>> Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. >>> >>> jeanette >>> >>> -------- Original Message -------- >>> Subject: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker >>> Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 17:03:17 +0200 >>> From: Chengetai Masango >>> To: igf Forum >>> >>> Dear All, >>> >>> I hope those of you in the northern hemisphere have had a good summer >>> and those in the south the winter was not too cold. >>> >>> We are fast approaching the start of the IGF Nairobi meeting. The >>> preparations are moving along well. >>> I would be grateful if you could all remind your various stakeholder >>> groups that the online registration ends on 9 September. >>> Onsite registration will still be possible but it will entail additional >>> queuing . >>> >>> The Host country and the IGF Secretariat are putting the final touches >>> to the opening session speakers list. Alice and I would like to ask the >>> MAG to nominate a speaker to represent civil society. >>> We would be appreciative If you could send us your selection by the end >>> of the week. >>> >>> >>> Best regards >>> >>> Chengetai >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> igf_members mailing list >>> igf_members at intgovforum.org >>> http://mail.intgovforum.org/mailman/listinfo/igf_members_intgovforum.org >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >>> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Thu Sep 8 08:16:01 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 07:46:01 -0430 Subject: [governance] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <20110908111503.4F23D15C376@quill.bollow.ch> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> <20110908111503.4F23D15C376@quill.bollow.ch> Message-ID: This is an excellent approach. Grace gives the gender balance missing in our co-coordinator team, and adds the regional perspective, as an important expert in her own right, chosen for her values and work, not to fulfill a quota. Highlighing the IGC as a 'body' by asking co-coordinators to speak when appropriate and possible, gives coherence and force to the IGC. I support this fully. Ginger Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu *Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org* On 8 September 2011 06:45, Norbert Bollow wrote: > Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro > wrote: > > I would like to suggest that *both* Jeremy and Grace do a tag team > approach > > to speaking for civil society, they can share the points and it would > also > > express the spirit of collaboration and partnership. > > +1 > > Greetings, > Norbert > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From admin at alkasir.com Thu Sep 8 09:35:55 2011 From: admin at alkasir.com (Walid AL-SAQAF ) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 15:35:55 +0200 Subject: [governance] Syria In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hello Salanieta, I sent the questions to an activist in Syria and as you can tell from his answers below, the situation is indeed quite dire. I certainly hope there could be more ways to help them in more than just providing them with tools to bypass censorship to be able to publish graphics and material to expose the awful things happening on the ground there. *Answers from an anonymous Syrian activist:* (1)There's a threat on every and each person who try to protest or use the internet for anything related to protesting or revolution in Syria. The threat may be torture , imprisonment and death in a very bad way. (2)They can help by publishing videos and pictures about the Murders and the Torture that is caused by as they call them "Assad's Shabeha" Or the Syrian Army Etc.. (3)I'm not so sure how the world can help Syria, as you know the government has forbid all journalist that can get the news of the Syrian Revolution, That's why people started to use the mobile camera for live shots and videos of the things that happening in here. (4)Lately so many websites has been released just for telling news of "Syrian Revolution" , you can check this link for some news about the Revolution : شبكة شام الإخباريةin Arabic. You can also check Alkasir Database in the Political News Websites Category (See below note) , Lots of URLs has been reported blocked cause it has a relation to the Revolution and its news. Note: You can open the map of reportedly blocked URLs by alkasir users worldwide and zoom to Syria here: http://alkasir.com/map, or more specifically, you can check those links: - For news and opinion websites: https://alkasir.com/doc/map/map.php?genre=FREEDOM - Human rights websites: https://alkasir.com/doc/map/map.php?genre=HUMAN_RIGHTS, - Social networking websites: https://alkasir.com/doc/map/map.php?genre=SOC_NETWORKING Sincerely, Walid ----------------- Walid Al-Saqaf Founder & Administrator alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship https://alkasir.com On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 5:17 AM, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro < salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com> wrote: > Hello Walid, > > (1) Are they alright and are their lives threatened and is the threat > (torture or imprisonment or death or any/all)? > (2) How can we help? > (3) How can the world help? > (4)Is there a link where we can read about the history of the conflicts in > Syria, so that we can get up to speed? > > My prayers are with them in this time. > > Sala > > > On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 3:10 PM, Walid AL-SAQAF < > admin at alkasir.com> wrote: > >> Hello Salanieta, >> >> I'm not in Syria but I have lots of people in touch with me -anonymously- >> because they are using a circumvention software I developed to help them >> overcome web censorship. The situation is extremely dangerous for activists >> and protestors yet they are pushing forward. It appears that the Internet >> remains open though fear has been growing particularly as there were reports >> of phishing sites set up by regime elements to trap some facebook users from >> Syria. If you have some specific questions, I'd be happy to ask them. >> >> Sincerely, >> >> Walid >> >> ----------------- >> >> Walid Al-Saqaf >> Founder & Administrator >> alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship >> https://alkasir.com >> >> >> On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 4:07 AM, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro < >> salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear All, >>> >>> Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting >>> to hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. >>> >>> -- >>> Sala >>> >>> " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". >>> >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >>> >>> >>> >> > > > -- > Sala > > " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From shailam at yahoo.com Thu Sep 8 13:09:45 2011 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 10:09:45 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <006501cc6df9$05c71840$115548c0$@planet.tn> Message-ID: <1315501785.58229.YahooMailNeo@web161902.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Hi All I like the idea of collaboration with host country and inclusion of gender for these speaking spots. . But like the rest of you I also feel that quality , substance and content is the main criteria for selecting a speaker or a 'duo" to represent civil society. regards  Shaila   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: Adam Peake To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Sent: Thursday, September 8, 2011 1:02 AM Subject: RE: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker Grace is a very experienced researcher, and very nice (hello Grace :-)).  She's one of the leading volunteers behind KICTANet, a multistakeholder network that's extremely influential in the Kenyan ICT sector (and for anyone going to the IGF well worth checking out to get a sense of what's happening in Kenya, there's a summary of mailing list discussions on their website The "Bitange for President' thread's pretty good.) I guess there will be 3-5 minutes speaking time depending on the number of speakers.  Whoever's proposed, and would be best to include other CS groups in this discussion, Internet Rights and Principles for example, then provide the person with a list of points to include. Adam > Content-Type: multipart/alternative; >     boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0066_01CC6E01.6792AC30" > Content-Language: fr > > Thank you very much Jeremy. You read my mind. I think it¹s really fair. > While I do like you to be speaking in the opening session, I believe that we need to avoid appointing the same people every year. > > We should appoint preferably a woman from the south, but the quality remains the main criterion. > > ------------------------------------------------------ > TIjani BEN JEMAA > Vice Chair of the CIC > World Federation of Engineering Organizations > Phone : + 216 70 825 231 > Mobile : + 216 98 330 114 > Fax    : + 216 70 825 231 > ------------------------------------------------------ > > De : governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] De la part de Jeremy Malcolm > Envoyé : jeudi 8 septembre 2011 01:18 > À : governance at lists.cpsr.org > Objet : Re: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker > > On 08/09/2011, at 12:36 AM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > > > Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. > > Many thanks for the nomination and the +1!  However, I spoke at last year's closing ceremony, and am not a woman, so I think some other nominations to consider (self or otherwise) would also be valuable. > > -- > Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. > www.consumersinternational.org > Twitter @ConsumersInt > > Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless necessary. > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >      governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: >      http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: >      http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >      http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From shailam at yahoo.com Thu Sep 8 13:13:59 2011 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 10:13:59 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <20110908111503.4F23D15C376@quill.bollow.ch> References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <4E67D253.8050300@apc.org> <20110908111503.4F23D15C376@quill.bollow.ch> Message-ID: <1315502039.85940.YahooMailNeo@web161910.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Not withstanding my prior general statements. If we have only 3-4 minutes, it might be quite tricky to convey or message and spirit in such a short time let alone in half the time !!!! shaila   The journey begins sooner than you anticipate ! ..................... the renaissance of composure ! ________________________________ From: Norbert Bollow To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Sent: Thursday, September 8, 2011 4:15 AM Subject: Re: [governance] opening session civil society speaker Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro wrote: > I would like to suggest that *both* Jeremy and Grace do a tag team approach > to speaking for civil society, they can share the points and it would also > express the spirit of collaboration and partnership. +1 Greetings, Norbert ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Thu Sep 8 15:52:52 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 07:52:52 +1200 Subject: [governance] Syria In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: This is excellent Walid. The material is very helpful. Could you also please find out whether the rule of law exists? [I am assuming it does not] I will go through the links and thank you for taking the time to get this information and thank the Syrian activists on the ground. I will also direct this to the IBA Human Rights Institute to get some traction. Best, Sala On Fri, Sep 9, 2011 at 1:35 AM, Walid AL-SAQAF < admin at alkasir.com> wrote: > Hello Salanieta, > > I sent the questions to an activist in Syria and as you can tell from his > answers below, the situation is indeed quite dire. I certainly hope there > could be more ways to help them in more than just providing them with tools > to bypass censorship to be able to publish graphics and material to expose > the awful things happening on the ground there. > > *Answers from an anonymous Syrian activist:* > (1)There's a threat on every and each person who try to protest or use the > internet for anything related to protesting or revolution in Syria. > The threat may be torture , imprisonment and death in a very bad way. > > (2)They can help by publishing videos and pictures about the Murders and > the Torture that is caused by as they call them "Assad's Shabeha" Or the > Syrian Army Etc.. > > (3)I'm not so sure how the world can help Syria, as you know the government > has forbid all journalist that can get the news of the Syrian Revolution, > That's why people started to use the mobile camera for live shots and videos > of the things that happening in here. > > (4)Lately so many websites has been released just for telling news of > "Syrian Revolution" , you can check this link for some news about the > Revolution : شبكة شام الإخباريةin Arabic. > You can also check Alkasir Database in the Political News Websites > Category (See below note) , Lots of URLs has been reported blocked cause it > has a relation to the Revolution and its news. > > Note: You can open the map of reportedly blocked URLs by alkasir users > worldwide and zoom to Syria here: http://alkasir.com/map, or more > specifically, you can check those links: > > - For news and opinion websites: > https://alkasir.com/doc/map/map.php?genre=FREEDOM > - Human rights websites: > https://alkasir.com/doc/map/map.php?genre=HUMAN_RIGHTS, > - Social networking websites: > https://alkasir.com/doc/map/map.php?genre=SOC_NETWORKING > > > Sincerely, > > Walid > > ----------------- > > Walid Al-Saqaf > Founder & Administrator > alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship > https://alkasir.com > > > On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 5:17 AM, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro < > salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com> wrote: > >> Hello Walid, >> >> (1) Are they alright and are their lives threatened and is the threat >> (torture or imprisonment or death or any/all)? >> (2) How can we help? >> (3) How can the world help? >> (4)Is there a link where we can read about the history of the conflicts in >> Syria, so that we can get up to speed? >> >> My prayers are with them in this time. >> >> Sala >> >> >> On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 3:10 PM, Walid AL-SAQAF < >> admin at alkasir.com> wrote: >> >>> Hello Salanieta, >>> >>> I'm not in Syria but I have lots of people in touch with me -anonymously- >>> because they are using a circumvention software I developed to help them >>> overcome web censorship. The situation is extremely dangerous for activists >>> and protestors yet they are pushing forward. It appears that the Internet >>> remains open though fear has been growing particularly as there were reports >>> of phishing sites set up by regime elements to trap some facebook users from >>> Syria. If you have some specific questions, I'd be happy to ask them. >>> >>> Sincerely, >>> >>> Walid >>> >>> ----------------- >>> >>> Walid Al-Saqaf >>> Founder & Administrator >>> alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship >>> https://alkasir.com >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 4:07 AM, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro < >>> salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Dear All, >>>> >>>> Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting >>>> to hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Sala >>>> >>>> " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". >>>> >>>> >>>> ____________________________________________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >>>> >>>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>>> >>>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Sala >> >> " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". >> >> > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From qshatti at gmail.com Thu Sep 8 16:17:34 2011 From: qshatti at gmail.com (Qusai AlShatti) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 23:17:34 +0300 Subject: [governance] Re: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <006501cc6df9$05c71840$115548c0$@planet.tn> Message-ID: I support Adam's recommendation to have Grace as a CS representative at the opening ceremony. I support Izuimi to be the CS representative in the closing ceremony. regards, Qsai On Thursday, September 8, 2011, Adam Peake wrote: > Grace is a very experienced researcher, and very nice (hello Grace :-)). She's one of the leading volunteers behind KICTANet, a multistakeholder network that's extremely influential in the Kenyan ICT sector (and for anyone going to the IGF well worth checking out to get a sense of what's happening in Kenya, there's a summary of mailing list discussions on their website The "Bitange for President' thread's pretty good.) > > I guess there will be 3-5 minutes speaking time depending on the number of speakers. Whoever's proposed, and would be best to include other CS groups in this discussion, Internet Rights and Principles for example, then provide the person with a list of points to include. > > Adam > > > > >> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; >> boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0066_01CC6E01.6792AC30" >> Content-Language: fr >> >> Thank you very much Jeremy. You read my mind. I think it¹s really fair. >> While I do like you to be speaking in the opening session, I believe that we need to avoid appointing the same people every year. >> >> We should appoint preferably a woman from the south, but the quality remains the main criterion. >> >> ------------------------------------------------------ >> TIjani BEN JEMAA >> Vice Chair of the CIC >> World Federation of Engineering Organizations >> Phone : + 216 70 825 231 >> Mobile : + 216 98 330 114 >> Fax : + 216 70 825 231 >> ------------------------------------------------------ >> >> De : governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] De la part de Jeremy Malcolm >> Envoyé : jeudi 8 septembre 2011 01:18 >> À : governance at lists.cpsr.org >> Objet : Re: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker >> >> On 08/09/2011, at 12:36 AM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >> >> >> Hi, we need to nominate a speaker for the opening session. see below. >> >> Many thanks for the nomination and the +1! However, I spoke at last year's closing ceremony, and am not a woman, so I think some other nominations to consider (self or otherwise) would also be valuable. >> >> -- >> Dr Jeremy Malcolm >> Project Coordinator >> Consumers International >> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia >> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. >> www.consumersinternational.org >> Twitter @ConsumersInt >> >> Read our email confidentiality notice. Don't print this email unless necessary. >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From qshatti at gmail.com Thu Sep 8 16:44:10 2011 From: qshatti at gmail.com (Qusai AlShatti) Date: Thu, 8 Sep 2011 23:44:10 +0300 Subject: [governance] Syria In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear All: The situation in Syria for all Internet activists is grief and dangerous. They are currently the only source of information about what is going on in Syria (beside government sources). Actually they are the only source of information even for world media after the restrictions imposed on journalists. They are doing a wonderful job on providing details of events and publishing photos and you tube clips which are all published and broadcasted by world media. Although they are acting with courage and without fear, they are performing their activities under severe circumstances and life threatening situation. Having someone from them talking about the situation in Syria may be too risky for them and will endanger their safety. We should avoid that although we are keen to hear from them. An alternative is to seek a Syrian activists who is outside of Syria and in contact with Internet activists inside Syria to tell us about the situation. Regards, Qusai On Thursday, September 8, 2011, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro < salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com> wrote: > Dear All, > Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting to hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. > > -- > Sala > > " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From iza at anr.org Thu Sep 8 21:18:02 2011 From: iza at anr.org (Izumi AIZU) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 10:18:02 +0900 Subject: [governance] Re: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <006501cc6df9$05c71840$115548c0$@planet.tn> Message-ID: Thank you Qusai for the suggestion. I think it is important to show CS views in the opening session and support Grace to both represent host country/continent and gender. For closing, the substance will be more important than the person, perhaps. I think Jeremy and I and any others can make a team there during IGF to prepare and discuss what we are going to say at closing session, of course with the list discussion here. Then either Jeremy or myself or whoever else best fit can read that. izumi 2011/9/9 Qusai AlShatti : > I support Adam's recommendation to have Grace as a CS representative at the > opening ceremony. I support Izuimi to be the CS representative in the > closing ceremony. > regards, > > Qsai > > On Thursday, September 8, 2011, Adam Peake wrote: >> Grace is a very experienced researcher, and very nice (hello Grace :-)). >>  She's one of the leading volunteers behind KICTANet, a multistakeholder >> network that's extremely influential in the Kenyan ICT sector (and for >> anyone going to the IGF well worth checking out to get a sense of what's >> happening in Kenya, there's a summary of mailing list discussions on their >> website The "Bitange for President' thread's >> pretty good.) >> >> I guess there will be 3-5 minutes speaking time depending on the number of >> speakers.  Whoever's proposed, and would be best to include other CS groups >> in this discussion, Internet Rights and Principles for example, then provide >> the person with a list of points to include. >> >> Adam >> >> ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Fri Sep 9 00:19:50 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 16:19:50 +1200 Subject: [governance] Social Networks and Rugby Message-ID: Dear All, Speaking of the effect that Social Networks and how it has affected country's responses to them such as the case in Syria etc. It is also interesting that the All Blacks (New Zealand) team have been banned from Tweeting. :) see: http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/all-blacks/5155515/World-Cup-Twitter-ban-for-All-Blacks For rugby lovers, NZ plays Tonga at 2030 GMT +12, see: http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/ -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From admin at alkasir.com Fri Sep 9 04:12:33 2011 From: admin at alkasir.com (Walid AL-SAQAF ) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 10:12:33 +0200 Subject: [governance] Syria In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi again, I second Qusai's view on that and I certainly believe that direct communication with them is quite risky for them unless they take extra precautionary measures (Technical Tech guide useful here). As for your last question Salanieta on the rule of law in Syria, this is the answer: Well I don't think the rule of law even exists in here or even used to > exist. > before the revolution, bribery used to change anything in the law , it > could release a murderer and set him free , what can be worse than that ? > nowadays I don't think that anyone related to the government or the > government it self follows anything related to the law by just looking at > the way of treating it's people own people. > When The President Assad started what he call "The Reform Campaign" he > canceled a law that's called "Emergency Law" and he made a new law witch > took Emergency Law's place and he called it "Anti-Terrorism Act" قانون > مكافحة الإرهاب. > That's clearly makes each and everyone who participate in protesting or > joining the revolution a "Terrorist". > On Syria news channel after they have been forced to admit that the people > are protesting in the country, whenever people protest they call them > Terrorists or Armed Terrorists On TV. > After the President canceled "The Emergency Law" it just became more worse > , They started to Arrest like 100 or more at once without any warning in > different areas in Syria. > I think its so obvious to know that the rule of law doesn't exist in here. > If you want some explanation about "The Emergency Law" you can find in here > : شرح قانون الطوارئ في سوريا > This is another link for قانون مكافحة الإرهاب > I hope that is useful. Sincerely, Walid ----------------- Walid Al-Saqaf Founder & Administrator alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship https://alkasir.com On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 10:44 PM, Qusai AlShatti wrote: > Dear All: > The situation in Syria for all Internet activists is grief and dangerous. > They are currently the only source of information about what is going on in > Syria (beside government sources). Actually they are > the only source of information even for world media after the restrictions > imposed on journalists. > > They are doing a wonderful job on providing details of events and > publishing photos and you tube clips which are all published and broadcasted > by world media. Although they are acting with courage and without fear, they > are performing their activities under severe circumstances and life > threatening situation. Having someone from them talking about the situation > in Syria may be too risky for them and will endanger their safety. We should > avoid that although we are keen to hear from them. > > An alternative is to seek a Syrian activists who is outside of Syria and in > contact with Internet activists inside Syria to tell us about the situation. > > Regards, > > Qusai > > > On Thursday, September 8, 2011, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro < > salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com> wrote: > > Dear All, > > Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting > to hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. > > > > -- > > Sala > > > > " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn Fri Sep 9 04:34:08 2011 From: tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn (tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 09:34:08 +0100 Subject: [governance] Re: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: References: <4F49A8EA-9B3D-4A42-A393-3264158013DB@unog.ch> <4E679D74.5050101@wzb.eu> <006501cc6df9$05c71840$115548c0$@planet.tn> Message-ID: <003401cc6ecb$4203e630$c60bb290$@planet.tn> Izumi, I think Grace is the best choice for the opening. For the closing, your approach of preparing the statement collectively is pretty good. I think you Izumi should present it since Jeremy spoke last year in the closing. ------------------------------------------------------ TIjani BEN JEMAA Vice Chair of the CIC World Federation of Engineering Organizations Phone : + 216 70 825 231 Mobile : + 216 98 330 114 Fax : + 216 70 825 231 ------------------------------------------------------ -----Message d'origine----- De : governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] De la part de Izumi AIZU Envoyé : vendredi 9 septembre 2011 02:18 À : governance at lists.cpsr.org; Qusai AlShatti Objet : Re: [governance] Re: [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker Thank you Qusai for the suggestion. I think it is important to show CS views in the opening session and support Grace to both represent host country/continent and gender. For closing, the substance will be more important than the person, perhaps. I think Jeremy and I and any others can make a team there during IGF to prepare and discuss what we are going to say at closing session, of course with the list discussion here. Then either Jeremy or myself or whoever else best fit can read that. izumi 2011/9/9 Qusai AlShatti : > I support Adam's recommendation to have Grace as a CS representative > at the opening ceremony. I support Izuimi to be the CS representative > in the closing ceremony. > regards, > > Qsai > > On Thursday, September 8, 2011, Adam Peake wrote: >> Grace is a very experienced researcher, and very nice (hello Grace :-)). >>  She's one of the leading volunteers behind KICTANet, a >> multistakeholder network that's extremely influential in the Kenyan >> ICT sector (and for anyone going to the IGF well worth checking out >> to get a sense of what's happening in Kenya, there's a summary of >> mailing list discussions on their website >> The "Bitange for President' thread's >> pretty good.) >> >> I guess there will be 3-5 minutes speaking time depending on the >> number of speakers.  Whoever's proposed, and would be best to include >> other CS groups in this discussion, Internet Rights and Principles >> for example, then provide the person with a list of points to include. >> >> Adam >> >> ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ----- Aucun virus trouvé dans ce message. Analyse effectuée par AVG - www.avg.fr Version: 10.0.1390 / Base de données virale: 1518/3785 - Date: 24/07/2011 La Base de données des virus a expiré. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jeremy at ciroap.org Fri Sep 9 04:42:26 2011 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2011 16:42:26 +0800 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E684534.8000704@ciroap.org> References: <4E684534.8000704@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <4E69D172.5030501@ciroap.org> On 08/09/11 12:31, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > I will discuss with Grace off-list, and also discuss with the > Secretariat, to see what our options are (eg. can we have two speakers > in the opening, and when would we each prefer to speak). The caucus > can then make an informed decision. Grace prefers to speak at the opening, and whilst she would also have been happy with a "tag team" approach, Chengatai has just confirmed to me that we can only have one speaker at the opening. So it seems to me that we have a rough consensus that Grace will speak, but she has indicated that she is happy for us to provide input into what she should say. So we'll set up a separate thread for that. For the closing, Izumi and I will discuss what to say and who will say it, reacting to developments during the course of the meeting, and endeavour to post our notes back to the list ahead of the closing ceremony. -- *Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator* Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. _www.consumersinternational.org _ _Twitter @ConsumersInt _ Read our email confidentiality notice . Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 3762 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From admin at alkasir.com Fri Sep 9 04:52:16 2011 From: admin at alkasir.com (Walid AL-SAQAF ) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 10:52:16 +0200 Subject: [governance] [igf_members] opening session civil society speaker In-Reply-To: <4E69D172.5030501@ciroap.org> References: <4E684534.8000704@ciroap.org> <4E69D172.5030501@ciroap.org> Message-ID: Hi all, Though I won't be able to attend the event, I also second the opinion of nominating Grace as the speaker. She had done considerable work in this area and can relate to things on the ground best. Sincerely, Walid ----------------- Walid Al-Saqaf Founder & Administrator alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship https://alkasir.com On Fri, Sep 9, 2011 at 10:42 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > ** > On 08/09/11 12:31, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > > I will discuss with Grace off-list, and also discuss with the Secretariat, > to see what our options are (eg. can we have two speakers in the opening, > and when would we each prefer to speak). The caucus can then make an > informed decision. > > > Grace prefers to speak at the opening, and whilst she would also have been > happy with a "tag team" approach, Chengatai has just confirmed to me that we > can only have one speaker at the opening. So it seems to me that we have a > rough consensus that Grace will speak, but she has indicated that she is > happy for us to provide input into what she should say. So we'll set up a > separate thread for that. > > For the closing, Izumi and I will discuss what to say and who will say it, > reacting to developments during the course of the meeting, and endeavour to > post our notes back to the list ahead of the closing ceremony. > > -- > > *Dr Jeremy Malcolm > Project Coordinator* > Consumers International > Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East > Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, > Malaysia > Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 > > Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups > that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and > authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. > *www.consumersinternational.org* > *Twitter @ConsumersInt * > > Read our email confidentiality notice. > Don't print this email unless necessary. > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jeremy at ciroap.org Fri Sep 9 05:09:23 2011 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2011 17:09:23 +0800 Subject: [governance] Notes for input to opening session statement Message-ID: <4E69D7C3.4030400@ciroap.org> This thread can be used for suggestions of topics to include in the opening session statement to be delivered by Grace Githaiga. Here are some of my thoughts, focussing on the theme of IGF improvements and policy messages, and also touching on accessibility and the role of civil society. This is not to suggest that these are the only areas we should cover: * During the first five year term of the IGF, it proved itself as a discussion forum. Over the next five years, rather than simply replicating the previous five, its evolution should continue. * The IGF has the potential to be a public sphere in miniature for the Internet, where otherwise disenfranchised voices can have a real impact in shaping policy decisions taken elsewhere. * Over the past year the commitment of some other institutions to the multi-stakeholder principles established at WSIS has proved weak. [Not sure if we want to point fingers, here.] * This is a challenge that the IGF can confront by proving itself up to the task of providing concrete and useful inputs into the policy development processes of those institutions. * In most other fora, the influence of the economically powerful, such as the entertainment and pharmaceutical industries, can can cloud policy-makers' view of the broader public interest. * The IGF does not suffer from that same limitation, to the extent that all participants have equal status. But we must continue to improve the IGF's accessibility, including through online means. * The involvement of civil society adds democratic legitimacy to Internet governance processes, by presenting often overlooked perspectives, including those that transcend national borders. -- *Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator* Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. _www.consumersinternational.org _ _Twitter @ConsumersInt _ Read our email confidentiality notice . Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 3762 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From ias_pk at yahoo.com Fri Sep 9 06:19:38 2011 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com (Imran Ahmed Shah) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 15:19:38 +0500 Subject: [governance] Notes for input to opening session statement In-Reply-To: <4E69D7C3.4030400@ciroap.org> References: <4E69D7C3.4030400@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <001201cc6ed9$fcc66200$f6532600$@yahoo.com> Dear Jeremy and all Members, With reference to the proposal for the "IGF improvements", I would also suggest following points / recommendations to be included in the agenda: 1. The revision of the MAG members of the IGF. As the previous members were given letter of the extension of 1 year of their MAG membership. However, the status has been changed with the passage of time, revision and expansion of the memberships is required. 2. During past meetings and consolation process regarding the governance, Civil Societies were not given appropriate privilege or at least equal level of opportunities comparing to other ones line those who have Governmental status etc. So, we should raise voices for equal opportunities and privilege for Civil Societies. 3. To formulizer some Fellowship and Travel Support program for the candidate from Developing Countries to participate in IGF Meetings. There are different sponsor organizations on the board of IGF to host and organize the IGF meetings but there is no easy and predefined process to apply to obtain support. Thanking you and Best Regards Imran Ahmad Shah From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Jeremy Malcolm Sent: Friday, September 09, 2011 02:09 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: [governance] Notes for input to opening session statement This thread can be used for suggestions of topics to include in the opening session statement to be delivered by Grace Githaiga. Here are some of my thoughts, focussing on the theme of IGF improvements and policy messages, and also touching on accessibility and the role of civil society. This is not to suggest that these are the only areas we should cover: * During the first five year term of the IGF, it proved itself as a discussion forum. Over the next five years, rather than simply replicating the previous five, its evolution should continue. * The IGF has the potential to be a public sphere in miniature for the Internet, where otherwise disenfranchised voices can have a real impact in shaping policy decisions taken elsewhere. * Over the past year the commitment of some other institutions to the multi-stakeholder principles established at WSIS has proved weak. [Not sure if we want to point fingers, here.] * This is a challenge that the IGF can confront by proving itself up to the task of providing concrete and useful inputs into the policy development processes of those institutions. * In most other fora, the influence of the economically powerful, such as the entertainment and pharmaceutical industries, can can cloud policy-makers' view of the broader public interest. * The IGF does not suffer from that same limitation, to the extent that all participants have equal status. But we must continue to improve the IGF's accessibility, including through online means. * The involvement of civil society adds democratic legitimacy to Internet governance processes, by presenting often overlooked perspectives, including those that transcend national borders. -- Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. www.consumersinternational.org Twitter @ConsumersInt Read our email confidentiality notice . Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From nkeshav42 at yahoo.com Fri Sep 9 07:12:22 2011 From: nkeshav42 at yahoo.com (Prof Keshava Nireshwalia) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 11:12:22 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [governance] Invitation to connect on LinkedIn Message-ID: <1358424839.402100.1315566742722.JavaMail.app@ela4-bed84.prod> I'd like to add you to my professional network on LinkedIn. - Prof Keshava Prof Keshava Nireshwalia Independent Higher Education Professional Mysore Area, India Confirm that you know Prof Keshava Nireshwalia: https://www.linkedin.com/e/uubeu1-gsd2gz9g-2y/isd/4145186747/6Sz2xQ12/?hs=false&tok=3iJbHjM9bwA4U1 -- You are receiving Invitation to Connect emails. Click to unsubscribe: http://www.linkedin.com/e/uubeu1-gsd2gz9g-2y/A-6z6k6QrV7RGfkQACq70iT9XpXQAYI9AlC3WRk/goo/governance%40lists%2Ecpsr%2Eorg/20061/I1430519902_1/?hs=false&tok=1u_StJca3wA4U1 (c) 2011 LinkedIn Corporation. 2029 Stierlin Ct, Mountain View, CA 94043, USA. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From briceabba at hotmail.com Fri Sep 9 08:09:58 2011 From: briceabba at hotmail.com (Brice Abba) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 12:09:58 +0000 Subject: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi In-Reply-To: <20110906235318.612D015C28E@quill.bollow.ch> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> ,<75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> ,<20110906235318.612D015C28E@quill.bollow.ch> Message-ID: Hi ALL Can we have some contact to call in case of problem according to the visa at the Nairobi airport. Kenya has not embassy in many countries... Regards, Brice ABBA Ingénieur en Sciences InformatiquesAdmin Système SAFRAN MORPHOResp. DNSsec au NIC CI et LABTIC, LARIT mob: (+225)-08-607-228 fix(home): (+225)-23-512-912 > From: nb at bollow.ch > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 01:53:18 +0200 > Subject: Re: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? > > David Allen wrote: > > Happily, the Arab spring had some new tools, however flawed, that > > helped put it / them over the top. > > Yes. > > Obviously the Arab spring activists didn't worry much about what > a "social networking" / marketing company would do with their data. > > Whether such lack of concern is justified is a different question. > > There's a lot of scenarios where such lack of concern could turn > out to be very harmful. For example, I'd be very surprised if the > secret services of all remaining oppressive governments aren't > working very hard on gaining access e.g. to the internal network > of Facebook, and on developing strategies for exploiting whatever > architectural or other flaws of Facebook they may be able to discover. > > > Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a policy > > group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / > > innovating tools that are even more common - and of quality. Instead > > of selling ourselves to marketeers ... > > Strongly agreed. We may not succeed in avoiding every flaw, but > at least we can work towards creating communication tools etc > that avoid the worst flaws, and we can avoid "selling ourselves > to marketeers" in the sense of effectively requiring people to > join Facebook (or any other service with similar privacy concerns > and/or lock-in effects) in order to fully participate in IGC internal > "who meets whom when and where while in Nairobi" coordination. > > Greetings, > Norbert > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Fri Sep 9 08:30:42 2011 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 21:30:42 +0900 Subject: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> ,<7582 2E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> ,<20110906235318.61 2D015C28E@quill.bollow.ch> Message-ID: Brice, hi. Perhaps this link on Visas useful. . If eligible for a visa on arrival it will cost US$50 and the website says cash only, US$ only. MAG might like to ask about contact numbers in case of emergency etc. Adam At 12:09 PM +0000 9/9/11, Brice Abba wrote: >Hi ALL >Can we have some contact to call in case of >problem according to the visa at the Nairobi >airport. > Kenya has not embassy in many countries... > >Regards, > > >Brice ABBA >Ingénieur en Sciences Informatiques >Admin Système SAFRAN MORPHO >Resp. DNSsec au NIC CI et LABTIC, LARIT >mob: (+225)-08-607-228 >fix(home): (+225)-23-512-912 > > > From: nb at bollow.ch >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 01:53:18 +0200 >> Subject: Re: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? >> >> David Allen wrote: >> > Happily, the Arab spring had some new tools, however flawed, that >> > helped put it / them over the top. >> >> Yes. >> >> Obviously the Arab spring activists didn't worry much about what >> a "social networking" / marketing company would do with their data. >> >> Whether such lack of concern is justified is a different question. >> >> There's a lot of scenarios where such lack of concern could turn >> out to be very harmful. For example, I'd be very surprised if the >> secret services of all remaining oppressive governments aren't >> working very hard on gaining access e.g. to the internal network >> of Facebook, and on developing strategies for exploiting whatever >> architectural or other flaws of Facebook they may be able to discover. >> >> > Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a policy >> > group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / >> > innovating tools that are even more common - and of quality. Instead >> > of selling ourselves to marketeers ... >> >> Strongly agreed. We may not succeed in avoiding every flaw, but >> at least we can work towards creating communication tools etc >> that avoid the worst flaws, and we can avoid "selling ourselves >> to marketeers" in the sense of effectively requiring people to >> join Facebook (or any other service with similar privacy concerns >> and/or lock-in effects) in order to fully participate in IGC internal >> "who meets whom when and where while in Nairobi" coordination. >> >> Greetings, >> Norbert >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> > > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From briceabba at hotmail.com Fri Sep 9 08:51:23 2011 From: briceabba at hotmail.com (Brice Abba) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 12:51:23 +0000 Subject: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi In-Reply-To: References: ,<20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch>,<4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca>,,,<7582,2E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu>,<93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu>,,<20110906235318.61,2D015C28E@quill.bollow.ch> , Message-ID: thanks Adam,Yes, contact numbers in case of emergency etc... before our venue badge.I know that on the other side of the venue badge, will have some contact for this purpose.But who are we supposed to call in case of emergency before this badge ?i'm supposed to be in Nairobi the 25th so.... Brice ABBA Ingénieur en Sciences InformatiquesAdmin Système SAFRAN MORPHOResp. DNSsec au NIC CI et LABTIC, LARIT mob: (+225)-08-607-228 fix(home): (+225)-23-512-912 > Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 21:30:42 +0900 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp > Subject: Re: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi > > Brice, hi. > > Perhaps this link on Visas useful. > . > > If eligible for a visa on arrival it will cost > US$50 and the website says cash only, US$ only. > > MAG might like to ask about contact numbers in case of emergency etc. > > Adam > > > > At 12:09 PM +0000 9/9/11, Brice Abba wrote: > >Hi ALL > >Can we have some contact to call in case of > >problem according to the visa at the Nairobi > >airport. > > Kenya has not embassy in many countries... > > > >Regards, > > > > > >Brice ABBA > >Ingénieur en Sciences Informatiques > >Admin Système SAFRAN MORPHO > >Resp. DNSsec au NIC CI et LABTIC, LARIT > >mob: (+225)-08-607-228 > >fix(home): (+225)-23-512-912 > > > > > From: nb at bollow.ch > >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 01:53:18 +0200 > >> Subject: Re: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? > >> > >> David Allen wrote: > >> > Happily, the Arab spring had some new tools, however flawed, that > >> > helped put it / them over the top. > >> > >> Yes. > >> > >> Obviously the Arab spring activists didn't worry much about what > >> a "social networking" / marketing company would do with their data. > >> > >> Whether such lack of concern is justified is a different question. > >> > >> There's a lot of scenarios where such lack of concern could turn > >> out to be very harmful. For example, I'd be very surprised if the > >> secret services of all remaining oppressive governments aren't > >> working very hard on gaining access e.g. to the internal network > >> of Facebook, and on developing strategies for exploiting whatever > >> architectural or other flaws of Facebook they may be able to discover. > >> > >> > Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a policy > >> > group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / > >> > innovating tools that are even more common - and of quality. Instead > >> > of selling ourselves to marketeers ... > >> > >> Strongly agreed. We may not succeed in avoiding every flaw, but > >> at least we can work towards creating communication tools etc > >> that avoid the worst flaws, and we can avoid "selling ourselves > >> to marketeers" in the sense of effectively requiring people to > >> join Facebook (or any other service with similar privacy concerns > >> and/or lock-in effects) in order to fully participate in IGC internal > >> "who meets whom when and where while in Nairobi" coordination. > >> > >> Greetings, > >> Norbert > >> ____________________________________________________________ > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> To be removed from the list, visit: > >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >> > >> For all other list information and functions, see: > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >> > >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > >> > > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________ > >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > >To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > >For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From qshatti at gmail.com Fri Sep 9 13:01:17 2011 From: qshatti at gmail.com (Qusai Al-Shatti) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 20:01:17 +0300 Subject: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> <20110906235318.612D015C28E@quill.bollow.ch> Message-ID: <5FD8FCAF-12D6-4452-82E8-FFDE28042B70@gmail.com> Dear all: I would strongly recommend that all of our colleagues would acquire the entry visa to Kenya from Kenyan Embassies and Consulates prior to the arrival to Nairobi. I was told that all of them were instructed to facilitate the visa process for IGF participants. Myself I acquired the Visa and the embassy staff were so helpful and friendly. The Visa application is only one page, they require a copy of the passport and two photos. It is two weeks to Nairobi and this is a plenty of time for a Visa. Looking forward to see you all there, Qusai AlShatti On Sep 9, 2011, at 15:09, Brice Abba wrote: > Hi ALL > Can we have some contact to call in case of problem according to the visa at the Nairobi airport. > Kenya has not embassy in many countries... > > Regards, > > Brice ABBA > Ingénieur en Sciences Informatiques > Admin Système SAFRAN MORPHO > Resp. DNSsec au NIC CI et LABTIC, LARIT > mob: (+225)-08-607-228 > fix(home): (+225)-23-512-912 > > > From: nb at bollow.ch > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 01:53:18 +0200 > > Subject: Re: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? > > > > David Allen wrote: > > > Happily, the Arab spring had some new tools, however flawed, that > > > helped put it / them over the top. > > > > Yes. > > > > Obviously the Arab spring activists didn't worry much about what > > a "social networking" / marketing company would do with their data. > > > > Whether such lack of concern is justified is a different question. > > > > There's a lot of scenarios where such lack of concern could turn > > out to be very harmful. For example, I'd be very surprised if the > > secret services of all remaining oppressive governments aren't > > working very hard on gaining access e.g. to the internal network > > of Facebook, and on developing strategies for exploiting whatever > > architectural or other flaws of Facebook they may be able to discover. > > > > > Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a policy > > > group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / > > > innovating tools that are even more common - and of quality. Instead > > > of selling ourselves to marketeers ... > > > > Strongly agreed. We may not succeed in avoiding every flaw, but > > at least we can work towards creating communication tools etc > > that avoid the worst flaws, and we can avoid "selling ourselves > > to marketeers" in the sense of effectively requiring people to > > join Facebook (or any other service with similar privacy concerns > > and/or lock-in effects) in order to fully participate in IGC internal > > "who meets whom when and where while in Nairobi" coordination. > > > > Greetings, > > Norbert > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From rballeste at stu.edu Fri Sep 9 13:39:19 2011 From: rballeste at stu.edu (Balleste, Roy) Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2011 13:39:19 -0400 Subject: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi In-Reply-To: <5FD8FCAF-12D6-4452-82E8-FFDE28042B70@gmail.com> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> <20110906235318.612D015C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <5FD8FCAF-12D6-4452-82E8-FFDE28042B70@gmail.com> Message-ID: Along those lines, the Kenyan embassy is the US is processing visa applications online. Some materials needed to be mailed into the embassy. I followed their instructions and the process was easy and fast. I imagine this is the same at the other worldwide locations. Roy Balleste Law Library Director Associate Professor of Law St. Thomas University 16401 NW 37th Avenue Miami Gardens, FL 33054 USA 1-305-623-2341 From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Qusai Al-Shatti Sent: Friday, September 09, 2011 1:01 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Brice Abba Subject: Re: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi Dear all: I would strongly recommend that all of our colleagues would acquire the entry visa to Kenya from Kenyan Embassies and Consulates prior to the arrival to Nairobi. I was told that all of them were instructed to facilitate the visa process for IGF participants. Myself I acquired the Visa and the embassy staff were so helpful and friendly. The Visa application is only one page, they require a copy of the passport and two photos. It is two weeks to Nairobi and this is a plenty of time for a Visa. Looking forward to see you all there, Qusai AlShatti On Sep 9, 2011, at 15:09, Brice Abba wrote: Hi ALL Can we have some contact to call in case of problem according to the visa at the Nairobi airport. Kenya has not embassy in many countries... Regards, ________________________________ Brice ABBA Ingénieur en Sciences Informatiques Admin Système SAFRAN MORPHO Resp. DNSsec au NIC CI et LABTIC, LARIT mob: (+225)-08-607-228 fix(home): (+225)-23-512-912 > From: nb at bollow.ch > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 01:53:18 +0200 > Subject: Re: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? > > David Allen wrote: > > Happily, the Arab spring had some new tools, however flawed, that > > helped put it / them over the top. > > Yes. > > Obviously the Arab spring activists didn't worry much about what > a "social networking" / marketing company would do with their data. > > Whether such lack of concern is justified is a different question. > > There's a lot of scenarios where such lack of concern could turn > out to be very harmful. For example, I'd be very surprised if the > secret services of all remaining oppressive governments aren't > working very hard on gaining access e.g. to the internal network > of Facebook, and on developing strategies for exploiting whatever > architectural or other flaws of Facebook they may be able to discover. > > > Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a policy > > group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / > > innovating tools that are even more common - and of quality. Instead > > of selling ourselves to marketeers ... > > Strongly agreed. We may not succeed in avoiding every flaw, but > at least we can work towards creating communication tools etc > that avoid the worst flaws, and we can avoid "selling ourselves > to marketeers" in the sense of effectively requiring people to > join Facebook (or any other service with similar privacy concerns > and/or lock-in effects) in order to fully participate in IGC internal > "who meets whom when and where while in Nairobi" coordination. > > Greetings, > Norbert > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From kpham26 at ucla.edu Fri Sep 9 13:41:26 2011 From: kpham26 at ucla.edu (Kim Pham) Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2011 18:41:26 +0100 Subject: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi In-Reply-To: References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> <20110906235318.612D015C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <5FD8FCAF-12D6-4452-82E8-FFDE28042B70@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4E6A4FC6.7020902@ucla.edu> Hi Roy, What was the turnaround time on the visas? Thanks, Kim On 9/9/11 6:39 PM, Balleste, Roy wrote: > > Along those lines, the Kenyan embassy is the US is processing visa > applications online. Some materials needed to be mailed into the > embassy. I followed their instructions and the process was easy and > fast. I imagine this is the same at the other worldwide locations. > > > > *Roy Balleste* > > *Law Library Director* > > *Associate Professor of Law* > > *St. Thomas University* > > *16401 NW 37th Avenue* > > *Miami Gardens, FL 33054 USA* > > *1-305-623-2341* > > > > *From:*governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] > *On Behalf Of *Qusai Al-Shatti > *Sent:* Friday, September 09, 2011 1:01 PM > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org; Brice Abba > *Subject:* Re: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi > > > > Dear all: > > I would strongly recommend that all of our colleagues would acquire > the entry visa to Kenya from Kenyan Embassies and Consulates prior to > the arrival to Nairobi. I was told that all of them were instructed > to facilitate the visa process for IGF participants. > > > > Myself I acquired the Visa and the embassy staff were so helpful and > friendly. The Visa application is only one page, they require a copy > of the passport and two photos. It is two weeks to Nairobi and this is > a plenty of time for a Visa. > > > > Looking forward to see you all there, > > > > Qusai AlShatti > > > > > > > On Sep 9, 2011, at 15:09, Brice Abba > wrote: > > Hi ALL > Can we have some contact to call in case of problem according to > the visa at the Nairobi airport. > > Kenya has not embassy in many countries... > > > > Regards, > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > */Brice ABBA/* > /Ingénieur en Sciences Informatiques > Admin Système SAFRAN MORPHO > Resp. DNSsec au NIC CI et LABTIC, LARIT/ > mob: (+225)-08-607-228 > fix(home): (+225)-23-512-912 > > > From: nb at bollow.ch > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 01:53:18 +0200 > > Subject: Re: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? > > > > David Allen > wrote: > > > Happily, the Arab spring had some new tools, however flawed, that > > > helped put it / them over the top. > > > > Yes. > > > > Obviously the Arab spring activists didn't worry much about what > > a "social networking" / marketing company would do with their data. > > > > Whether such lack of concern is justified is a different question. > > > > There's a lot of scenarios where such lack of concern could turn > > out to be very harmful. For example, I'd be very surprised if the > > secret services of all remaining oppressive governments aren't > > working very hard on gaining access e.g. to the internal network > > of Facebook, and on developing strategies for exploiting whatever > > architectural or other flaws of Facebook they may be able to > discover. > > > > > Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a > policy > > > group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / > > > innovating tools that are even more common - and of quality. > Instead > > > of selling ourselves to marketeers ... > > > > Strongly agreed. We may not succeed in avoiding every flaw, but > > at least we can work towards creating communication tools etc > > that avoid the worst flaws, and we can avoid "selling ourselves > > to marketeers" in the sense of effectively requiring people to > > join Facebook (or any other service with similar privacy concerns > > and/or lock-in effects) in order to fully participate in IGC > internal > > "who meets whom when and where while in Nairobi" coordination. > > > > Greetings, > > Norbert > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -- "This is water." - David Foster Wallace http://moreintelligentlife.com/story/david-foster-wallace-in-his-own-words ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Fri Sep 9 15:30:06 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2011 07:30:06 +1200 Subject: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi In-Reply-To: <4E6A4FC6.7020902@ucla.edu> References: <20110906071928.1E4C615C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <4E661892.1020803@cafonso.ca> <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497002B@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <93F4C2F3D19A03439EAC16D47C591DDE036410650B@suex07-mbx-08.ad.syr.edu> <20110906235318.612D015C28E@quill.bollow.ch> <5FD8FCAF-12D6-4452-82E8-FFDE28042B70@gmail.com> <4E6A4FC6.7020902@ucla.edu> Message-ID: If my country is listed as one not requiring a visa, does this mean I still have to pay the US50 on arrival? Fiji On Sat, Sep 10, 2011 at 5:41 AM, Kim Pham wrote: > Hi Roy, > > What was the turnaround time on the visas? > > Thanks, > > Kim > > On 9/9/11 6:39 PM, Balleste, Roy wrote: > > > > Along those lines, the Kenyan embassy is the US is processing visa > > applications online. Some materials needed to be mailed into the > > embassy. I followed their instructions and the process was easy and > > fast. I imagine this is the same at the other worldwide locations. > > > > > > > > *Roy Balleste* > > > > *Law Library Director* > > > > *Associate Professor of Law* > > > > *St. Thomas University* > > > > *16401 NW 37th Avenue* > > > > *Miami Gardens, FL 33054 USA* > > > > *1-305-623-2341* > > > > > > > > *From:*governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] > > *On Behalf Of *Qusai Al-Shatti > > *Sent:* Friday, September 09, 2011 1:01 PM > > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org; Brice Abba > > *Subject:* Re: [governance] Contact IGF Nairobi > > > > > > > > Dear all: > > > > I would strongly recommend that all of our colleagues would acquire > > the entry visa to Kenya from Kenyan Embassies and Consulates prior to > > the arrival to Nairobi. I was told that all of them were instructed > > to facilitate the visa process for IGF participants. > > > > > > > > Myself I acquired the Visa and the embassy staff were so helpful and > > friendly. The Visa application is only one page, they require a copy > > of the passport and two photos. It is two weeks to Nairobi and this is > > a plenty of time for a Visa. > > > > > > > > Looking forward to see you all there, > > > > > > > > Qusai AlShatti > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sep 9, 2011, at 15:09, Brice Abba > > wrote: > > > > Hi ALL > > Can we have some contact to call in case of problem according to > > the visa at the Nairobi airport. > > > > Kenya has not embassy in many countries... > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > */Brice ABBA/* > > /Ingénieur en Sciences Informatiques > > Admin Système SAFRAN MORPHO > > Resp. DNSsec au NIC CI et LABTIC, LARIT/ > > mob: (+225)-08-607-228 > > fix(home): (+225)-23-512-912 > > > > > From: nb at bollow.ch > > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2011 01:53:18 +0200 > > > Subject: Re: [governance] Re: IGC on Facebook? > > > > > > David Allen > > wrote: > > > > Happily, the Arab spring had some new tools, however flawed, that > > > > helped put it / them over the top. > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > Obviously the Arab spring activists didn't worry much about what > > > a "social networking" / marketing company would do with their data. > > > > > > Whether such lack of concern is justified is a different question. > > > > > > There's a lot of scenarios where such lack of concern could turn > > > out to be very harmful. For example, I'd be very surprised if the > > > secret services of all remaining oppressive governments aren't > > > working very hard on gaining access e.g. to the internal network > > > of Facebook, and on developing strategies for exploiting whatever > > > architectural or other flaws of Facebook they may be able to > > discover. > > > > > > > Equally happily, we can do better than flawed tools. And as a > > policy > > > > group, re global 'Net policy, hopefully we will, by advocating / > > > > innovating tools that are even more common - and of quality. > > Instead > > > > of selling ourselves to marketeers ... > > > > > > Strongly agreed. We may not succeed in avoiding every flaw, but > > > at least we can work towards creating communication tools etc > > > that avoid the worst flaws, and we can avoid "selling ourselves > > > to marketeers" in the sense of effectively requiring people to > > > join Facebook (or any other service with similar privacy concerns > > > and/or lock-in effects) in order to fully participate in IGC > > internal > > > "who meets whom when and where while in Nairobi" coordination. > > > > > > Greetings, > > > Norbert > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > -- > > "This is water." - David Foster Wallace > > http://moreintelligentlife.com/story/david-foster-wallace-in-his-own-words > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Fri Sep 9 15:55:28 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2011 07:55:28 +1200 Subject: [governance] Syria In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks Walid, this is enough information to understand the background and context of what we are seeing in the news. Sala On Fri, Sep 9, 2011 at 8:12 PM, Walid AL-SAQAF < admin at alkasir.com> wrote: > Hi again, > > I second Qusai's view on that and I certainly believe that direct > communication with them is quite risky for them unless they take extra > precautionary measures (Technical Tech guide useful here). > > As for your last question Salanieta on the rule of law in Syria, this is > the answer: > > Well I don't think the rule of law even exists in here or even used to >> exist. >> before the revolution, bribery used to change anything in the law , it >> could release a murderer and set him free , what can be worse than that ? >> nowadays I don't think that anyone related to the government or the >> government it self follows anything related to the law by just looking at >> the way of treating it's people own people. >> When The President Assad started what he call "The Reform Campaign" he >> canceled a law that's called "Emergency Law" and he made a new law witch >> took Emergency Law's place and he called it "Anti-Terrorism Act" قانون >> مكافحة الإرهاب. >> That's clearly makes each and everyone who participate in protesting or >> joining the revolution a "Terrorist". >> On Syria news channel after they have been forced to admit that the people >> are protesting in the country, whenever people protest they call them >> Terrorists or Armed Terrorists On TV. >> After the President canceled "The Emergency Law" it just became more worse >> , They started to Arrest like 100 or more at once without any warning in >> different areas in Syria. >> I think its so obvious to know that the rule of law doesn't exist in here. >> If you want some explanation about "The Emergency Law" you can find in >> here : شرح قانون الطوارئ في سوريا >> This is another link for قانون مكافحة الإرهاب >> > I hope that is useful. > > Sincerely, > > Walid > > ----------------- > > Walid Al-Saqaf > Founder & Administrator > alkasir for mapping and circumventing cyber censorship > https://alkasir.com > > > On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 10:44 PM, Qusai AlShatti wrote: > >> Dear All: >> The situation in Syria for all Internet activists is grief and dangerous. >> They are currently the only source of information about what is going on in >> Syria (beside government sources). Actually they are >> the only source of information even for world media after the restrictions >> imposed on journalists. >> >> They are doing a wonderful job on providing details of events and >> publishing photos and you tube clips which are all published and broadcasted >> by world media. Although they are acting with courage and without fear, they >> are performing their activities under severe circumstances and life >> threatening situation. Having someone from them talking about the situation >> in Syria may be too risky for them and will endanger their safety. We should >> avoid that although we are keen to hear from them. >> >> An alternative is to seek a Syrian activists who is outside of Syria and >> in contact with Internet activists inside Syria to tell us about the >> situation. >> >> Regards, >> >> Qusai >> >> >> On Thursday, September 8, 2011, Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro < >> salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com> wrote: >> > Dear All, >> > Is there anyone on this list from Syria or Iran? It would be interesting >> to hear of the situation in Syria from your perspective. >> > >> > -- >> > Sala >> > >> > " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". >> > >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From hempalshrestha at gmail.com Sat Sep 10 23:16:35 2011 From: hempalshrestha at gmail.com (Hempal Shrestha) Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2011 09:01:35 +0545 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at Nairobi IGF In-Reply-To: References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DAF7A6@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> <4E677914.9060603@colnodo.apc.org> <1315413940.90113.YahooMailNeo@web161904.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> <8DC3581D-363D-4CA4-9F13-229F9220B5FC@ciroap.org> Message-ID: Dear Jeremy, Izumi and All, I will be in the IGF6 and will be participating in the IGC meeting at given time. With best regards, Hempal Shrestha Bharatpur, Nepal On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 1:58 PM, Sonigitu Ekpe < sonigituekpe at crossriverstate.gov.ng> wrote: > Dear All, > > Greetings from Calabar, Nigeria. > > We will be participating remotely from Calabar,Hub Nigeria. > > I greatly buying in the use of the "*IGF Community chat platform"*. Gives > a lot of uniqueness. > > Warm regards > > Sonigitu Ekpe > *Project Support Officer[Agriculturist]* > Cross River Farm Credit Scheme > Ministry of Agriculture and Natural Resources > 3 Barracks Road P.M.B. 1119 > Calabar - Cross River State, Nigeria. > Mobile +234 805 0232 469 Office + 234 802 751 0179 > > Skype: sonigitu.asibong.ekpe.aji > > *"LIFE is all about love and thanksgiving" * > > > > > On Thu, Sep 8, 2011 at 1:23 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > >> On 08/09/2011, at 2:29 AM, Ginger Paque wrote: >> >> Hi McTim, >> Thanks for clarifying... yes, I was indeed mistaken. The links I posted >> were for the IGF, not the IGC meeting the day before.. >> >> It seems like we should be able to set something up, if it has not been >> done so yet. I can bring my laptop to moderate, if we have an Internet >> connection, and set up a mechanism. Jeremy, what did you have in mind? >> Please let me know if I can help in any way. >> >> >> Thanks Ginger. There is an integrated Jabber, IRC and web-based chat room >> available here: >> >> http://igf-online.net/chat.php >> >> Or if people prefer Skype, or Google+ Hangouts, we can use those. Let's >> hear what the remote participants would like to use. >> >> -- >> >> *Dr Jeremy Malcolm >> Project Coordinator* >> Consumers International >> Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East >> Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, >> Malaysia >> Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups >> that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and >> authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations >> in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help >> protect and empower consumers everywhere. >> *www.consumersinternational.org* >> *Twitter @ConsumersInt * >> >> Read our email confidentiality notice. >> Don't print this email unless necessary. >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From y.morenets at againstcybercrime.eu Tue Sep 13 03:33:44 2011 From: y.morenets at againstcybercrime.eu (Yuliya Morenets) Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2011 07:33:44 +0000 Subject: [governance] Launching of a new project_eSPRINT_ICT as a tool of better integration of migrants in EU countries In-Reply-To: <001201cc6ed9$fcc66200$f6532600$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear all, We are very happy to announce the launching of a new TaC project eSPRINT- ICT as a tool of better integration of migrants in European Union countries: for better mutual understanding and wider dissemination of EU values. Please find attached the press release describing the project. All interested parties are welcome to join the initiative and the dissemination phase of the project. We are look forward in cooperating, Best regards, Yuliya Morenets (Ms.) TaC-Together against Cybercrime Representative 28, rue d'Ypres F-67000 Strasbourg Tel.: +33 3 69 73 14 60 Follow us on Facebook ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: release_opening_sept11_EN.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 499579 bytes Desc: not available URL: From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Wed Sep 14 18:28:50 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2011 10:28:50 +1200 Subject: [governance] Double Jeopardy reforms??? Message-ID: Dear All, As I sluggishly prepared to come to work this morning [not feeling well], possibly lacking in having a healthy dose of good old "moli karo" (lemon juice), my ears pricked up during breakfast this morning, the television was blaring behind me as I heard that the State of Victoria in Australia is creating a Proposal to reform this age old procedural defense. For the link to see development and scope of DJ, see: http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/data/constitution/amendment05/02.html To see more of the reform in Victoria: http ://www.doublejeopardyreform.org/ To access the State of Victoria's laws and reforms, see: http://www.vic.gov.au/law-justice/law-legislation/law-reform.html Is the reform justified? For those who would ask what the relevance is to Internet Governance - I would peg it under "cyber crimes" etc. -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From parminder at itforchange.net Thu Sep 15 00:59:21 2011 From: parminder at itforchange.net (parminder) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2011 10:29:21 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGC workshop on a framework for global net neutrality Message-ID: <4E718629.1070403@itforchange.net> Hi All As you know one of the workshops that IGC is organising in Nairobi is on exploring a possible framework for global net neutrality. We need someone to volunteer as a remote participation moderator for the same. Basically,ne has to watch out on a laptop screen for those who are seeking to provide comments remotely when the workshop is on, and intermittently drawing the attention of the workshop to these comments. Anyone volunteering to do so may pl contact me offline. And we need the volunteer's name asap to be forwarded to the IGF secretariat. Thanks, parminder -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Thu Sep 15 07:22:28 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2011 06:52:28 -0430 Subject: [governance] IGC workshop on a framework for global net neutrality In-Reply-To: <4E718629.1070403@itforchange.net> References: <4E718629.1070403@itforchange.net> Message-ID: The IGC workshop on a framework for NN is IG4D WS 183 on Sept. 29th, Day 3 at 16:30 - 18:00. The remote moderator is an important person on this panel, as remote participation will allow views from around the world to be heard. You do not need to be a 'techie'. You don't need to be an expert on NN. You need common sense, and the ability to get around a computer. I am sure one of you not only are able to collaborate, but will very much enjoy the experience. It is a way to be very 'involved' in the issue, in a supporting role. I wish I could do it :) but I am busy at that time. Cheers, Ginger Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu *Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org* On 15 September 2011 00:29, parminder wrote: > ** > Hi All > > As you know one of the workshops that IGC is organising in Nairobi is on > exploring a possible framework for global net neutrality. We need someone to > volunteer as a remote participation moderator for the same. Basically,ne has > to watch out on a laptop screen for those who are seeking to provide > comments remotely when the workshop is on, and intermittently drawing the > attention of the workshop to these comments. Anyone volunteering to do so > may pl contact me offline. And we need the volunteer's name asap to be > forwarded to the IGF secretariat. Thanks, parminder > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From andersj at elon.edu Thu Sep 15 10:50:05 2011 From: andersj at elon.edu (Janna Anderson) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2011 10:50:05 -0400 Subject: [governance] Input sought for IGF survey questions from Imagining the Internet In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hi All, The Imagining the Internet project at Elon University will have a team of documentary journalists in Nairobi Sept. 26-30 at the Global IGF. Dr. Rich Landesberg of Elon will lead a video survey team that includes five young people. We are extremely thankful for your participation in our past surveys and we are looking forward to seeing you in Kenya. We are shaping up a question set right now and we'd like your input. I have included the questions below. You will note that some of our questions are repeats from previous years - this is required to get longitudinal data. Feel free to answer them in new ways if you have participated in the past - that's the point, to see how things evolve. Several of the questions are new. As always, we will be conducting our survey in our booth at the IGF Village and in the hallways of the conference and wherever we can find you. Thinking about the questions in advance helps you form your likely response into a tight, informative soundbite. Here's the link to the IGF-Vilnius survey, FYI: http://www.elon.edu/e-web/predictions/igf_2010/survey.xhtml If you have a good question you'd like us to consider adding or if you would like to suggest edits to the questions, please reply as soon as possible. The 2011 Global IGF questions, as proposed at this point: - Access is a primary goal of IGF. How will doubling the number of people online from 2 billion to 4 billion change the world? - With mobile connectivity many of us are living a life that is ³always on² or ³hyperconnected.² Some people even say the Internet is an extension of our brains and we are becoming cyborgs ­ human-computer beings. How does being connected online all the time change us as humans? - In 2015 will most people generally go directly to the World Wide Web to do their work, shopping, socializing and other online activities - as they have the past 20 years - OR will most people generally be using apps or social networks as their gateways for doing everything? Which will dominate most people¹s lives - the open Web or apps and social networks? - What responsibilities do technology innovators and designers and the organizations that produce our tools and access have to ethically serving the global public, and are they living up to them? - Will IGF survive and still be relevant in 2015? Explain. - What is your greatest hope for the future of the Internet? - What is your greatest fear or concern for the future of the Internet? - Describe the future of the Internet in one word. -- Janna Quitney Anderson Director of Imagining the Internet www.imaginingtheinternet.org Associate Professor of Communications Director of Internet Projects School of Communications Elon University andersj at elon.edu (336) 278-5733 (o) ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From devonrb at gmail.com Thu Sep 15 13:47:52 2011 From: devonrb at gmail.com (devonrb at gmail.com) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2011 17:47:52 +0000 Subject: [governance] Input sought for IGF survey questions fromImagining the Internet In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <51875944-1316108872-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-469569611-@b11.c1.bise6.blackberry> How will the present crime, violence and terror affect the viability and integrity of the Internet? Sent from my BlackBerry® device from Digicel -----Original Message----- From: Janna Anderson Sender: governance at lists.cpsr.org Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2011 10:50:05 To: Reply-To: governance at lists.cpsr.org,Janna Anderson Subject: Re: [governance] Input sought for IGF survey questions from Imagining the Internet Hi All, The Imagining the Internet project at Elon University will have a team of documentary journalists in Nairobi Sept. 26-30 at the Global IGF. Dr. Rich Landesberg of Elon will lead a video survey team that includes five young people. We are extremely thankful for your participation in our past surveys and we are looking forward to seeing you in Kenya. We are shaping up a question set right now and we'd like your input. I have included the questions below. You will note that some of our questions are repeats from previous years - this is required to get longitudinal data. Feel free to answer them in new ways if you have participated in the past - that's the point, to see how things evolve. Several of the questions are new. As always, we will be conducting our survey in our booth at the IGF Village and in the hallways of the conference and wherever we can find you. Thinking about the questions in advance helps you form your likely response into a tight, informative soundbite. Here's the link to the IGF-Vilnius survey, FYI: http://www.elon.edu/e-web/predictions/igf_2010/survey.xhtml If you have a good question you'd like us to consider adding or if you would like to suggest edits to the questions, please reply as soon as possible. The 2011 Global IGF questions, as proposed at this point: - Access is a primary goal of IGF. How will doubling the number of people online from 2 billion to 4 billion change the world? - With mobile connectivity many of us are living a life that is ³always on² or ³hyperconnected.² Some people even say the Internet is an extension of our brains and we are becoming cyborgs ­ human-computer beings. How does being connected online all the time change us as humans? - In 2015 will most people generally go directly to the World Wide Web to do their work, shopping, socializing and other online activities - as they have the past 20 years - OR will most people generally be using apps or social networks as their gateways for doing everything? Which will dominate most people¹s lives - the open Web or apps and social networks? - What responsibilities do technology innovators and designers and the organizations that produce our tools and access have to ethically serving the global public, and are they living up to them? - Will IGF survive and still be relevant in 2015? Explain. - What is your greatest hope for the future of the Internet? - What is your greatest fear or concern for the future of the Internet? - Describe the future of the Internet in one word. -- Janna Quitney Anderson Director of Imagining the Internet www.imaginingtheinternet.org Associate Professor of Communications Director of Internet Projects School of Communications Elon University andersj at elon.edu (336) 278-5733 (o) ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mariliamaciel at gmail.com Thu Sep 15 19:14:56 2011 From: mariliamaciel at gmail.com (Marilia Maciel) Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2011 20:14:56 -0300 Subject: [governance] Does your workshop have a remote moderator? Message-ID: Dear all, If you are organizing a workshop, please make sure that you have registered your remote moderator (person physically present at the workshop who will receive and forward questions from remote participants). Check if you have registered a remote moderator here: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/w2011/list-of-workshops-2011 If you are missing a moderator, you can register it here: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/rp-moderator-registration-2011 In case you have one or more remote panellists participating at your workshop, they are required to register their participation at the following URL: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/remote-participation-2011/remote-panellist-registration-2011 This registration will provide your remote panellist with all needed technical details for her/his successful remote panellist participation. Best wishes -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mariliamaciel at gmail.com Fri Sep 16 16:10:52 2011 From: mariliamaciel at gmail.com (Marilia Maciel) Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2011 17:10:52 -0300 Subject: [governance] Preliminary summary of the IBSA seminar on global Internet Governance Message-ID: Hello everybody, I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on global Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in the beginning of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have prevented me to report the discussions with the depth and length I would like to, but I have written a blog post about it to the site of the Brazilian Observatory of Digital policies, which has been circulating on Twitter recently: http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if time allows) or in Nairobi. Best wishes, Marília -- Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade FGV Direito Rio Center for Technology and Society Getulio Vargas Foundation Rio de Janeiro - Brazil -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From parminder at itforchange.net Fri Sep 16 21:08:22 2011 From: parminder at itforchange.net (parminder) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 06:38:22 +0530 Subject: [governance] Preliminary summary of the IBSA seminar on global Internet Governance In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> Apropos below, the link has an input paper by IT for Change for the IBSA Seminar, of which an improved version is enclosed... thanks. parminder On Saturday 17 September 2011 01:40 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: > Hello everybody, > > I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on > global Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in > the beginning of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have > prevented me to report the discussions with the depth and length I > would like to, but I have written a blog post about it to the site of > the Brazilian Observatory of Digital policies, which has been > circulating on Twitter recently: > http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance > > I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if > time allows) or in Nairobi. > > Best wishes, > Marília > > > -- > Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade > FGV Direito Rio > > Center for Technology and Society > Getulio Vargas Foundation > Rio de Janeiro - Brazil -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Dev agenda in IG.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 224083 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ggithaiga at hotmail.com Sat Sep 17 13:23:48 2011 From: ggithaiga at hotmail.com (Grace Githaiga) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 17:23:48 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? In-Reply-To: <4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> References: ,<4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> Message-ID: Colleagues Greetings. This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the immigrations officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like the IGF secretariat in Kenya to compile a list of those who have not gotten a visa (if you belong to a country that requires this) and would need facilitation. I am compiling a list for them and would request that anyone who thinks they need this facilitation to kindly email me the following details: 1. Name as it appears on passport 2. Passport number 3 Nationality. We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing facilitation to provide me with their details latest monday evening. Rgds Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mueller at syr.edu Sat Sep 17 14:22:00 2011 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 14:22:00 -0400 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal Message-ID: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly unlikely, the proposal would be very destructive. One notable and surprising thing: IBSA has bypassed the IGF. By putting forward this proposal in the way it has, IBSA has openly declared that it does not put any credibility or legitimacy in the IGF as a forum for multistakeholder Internet policy development or discussion. This is true because the IBSA proposal was developed outside of IGF in an exclusive club of countries, and will not be put forward formally at the IGF. Rather, it will be developed at the closed IBSA summit, and then taken directly to the UN General Assembly. This is unacceptable to civil society. It excludes us from the entire process. IBSA needs to be asked why it has chosen not to use a MS forum, a forum its members helped to create, to gain agreement for this proposal. The IBSA report says that "the models proposed by the WGIG provided useful guidelines" for a new global Internet governance body. This is a strange statement. There were four different models proposed in the WGIG report, and most of them were inconsistent with each other. One of the WGIG proposals explicitly stated that no new global body was needed. So perhaps IBSA is trying to pretend that its proposal has some kind of imprimatur from the WGIG or the WSIS. It doesn't. WGIG couldn't agree on any of those models, that was the point of listing 4 of them. The specific duties of the new global body make up an interesting list. It will be "tasked to develop and establish international public policies." So it makes the same stupid mistake that governments have been making all along: it is law, i.e. rules, not "policy" that is needed. Policy just means that a gang of governments attempts to dictate outcomes, or alter outcomes whenever something happens that they don't like. Law on the other hand provides a framework of clear rules that allows individual actors guidelines and which also protects freedom. And here's my favorite. IBSA proposes to "integrate and oversee the bodies responsible for technical and operational functioning of the internet, including global standards setting." So IBSA is not only proposing to take over regulation of all the world's internet service providers, hosting providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it proposes to "integrate and oversee" the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, too. No rationale for such a dramatic change is put forward. This proposal will fail to gain support from most of the internet-using civil society, it will be adamantly opposed by the technical community, and it will have very little support from the academic community. Needless to say, all Internet businesses will oppose it, and so will most governments outside the IBSA orbit. Milton L. Mueller Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies Internet Governance Project http://blog.internetgovernance.org On Saturday 17 September 2011 01:40 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: Hello everybody, I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on global Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in the beginning of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have prevented me to report the discussions with the depth and length I would like to, but I have written a blog post about it to the site of the Brazilian Observatory of Digital policies, which has been circulating on Twitter recently: http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if time allows) or in Nairobi. Best wishes, Marília -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dogwallah at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 15:27:19 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 22:27:19 +0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 9:22 PM, Milton L Mueller wrote: > Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any > applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and > authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly unlikely, > the proposal would be very destructive. I agree with Milton. > over regulation of all the world’s internet service providers, hosting > providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it > proposes to “integrate and oversee” the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, too. and if IT for Change has it's way, ICANN monies would be funnelled to support this new Internet Overlord. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 15:34:35 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 07:34:35 +1200 Subject: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? In-Reply-To: References: <4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> Message-ID: Thank you Grace. This is extremely kind and helpful of you. Warm Regards, Sala On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 5:23 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: > Colleagues > > Greetings. > > This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the immigrations > officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like the IGF secretariat in > Kenya to compile a list of those who have not gotten a visa (if you belong > to a country that requires this) and would need facilitation. I am compiling > a list for them and would request that anyone who thinks they need this > facilitation to kindly email me the following details: > > 1. Name as it appears on passport > 2. Passport number > 3 Nationality. > > We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of > Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing facilitation to > provide me with their details latest monday evening. > > Rgds > Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is > all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth > and rule the World! > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ggithaiga at hotmail.com Sat Sep 17 16:23:38 2011 From: ggithaiga at hotmail.com (Grace Githaiga) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 20:23:38 +0000 Subject: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? In-Reply-To: References: ,<4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net>,, Message-ID: You are welcome. We just want to facilitate where we can cause immigration rules can at times lock out well meaning participation. Rgds Grace ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 07:34:35 +1200 Subject: Re: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ggithaiga at hotmail.com Thank you Grace. This is extremely kind and helpful of you. Warm Regards, Sala On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 5:23 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: Colleagues Greetings. This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the immigrations officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like the IGF secretariat in Kenya to compile a list of those who have not gotten a visa (if you belong to a country that requires this) and would need facilitation. I am compiling a list for them and would request that anyone who thinks they need this facilitation to kindly email me the following details: 1. Name as it appears on passport 2. Passport number 3 Nationality. We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing facilitation to provide me with their details latest monday evening. Rgds Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ivarhartmann at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 16:56:13 2011 From: ivarhartmann at gmail.com (Ivar A. M. Hartmann) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 16:56:13 -0400 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Because I'm Brazilian and I'm fully aware of how government (both Executive and Legislative branches) deals with freedom of expression and telco regulation there, I would by default oppose a global body of IG run by gov representatives which is either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by it in any way. Just as an example, Brazilian law prohibited people from making jokes about politicians running for office during election periods. This was in force up until a year ago until the Supreme Court (not Congress, mind you) decided to put an end to it. Best, Ivar On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 15:27, McTim wrote: > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 9:22 PM, Milton L Mueller wrote: > > Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any > > applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and > > authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly unlikely, > > the proposal would be very destructive. > > I agree with Milton. > > > > > > over regulation of all the world’s internet service providers, hosting > > providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it > > proposes to “integrate and oversee” the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, > too. > > and if IT for Change has it's way, ICANN monies would be funnelled to > support this new Internet Overlord. > > > > -- > Cheers, > > McTim > "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A > route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From correia.rui at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 17:59:17 2011 From: correia.rui at gmail.com (Rui Correia) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 22:59:17 +0100 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Hi Just in case anybody is wondering what IBSA is, it stands for India-Brasil-SouthAfrica, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India-Brazil-South_Africa_Dialogue_Forum(English) http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/F%C3%B3rum_de_Di%C3%A1logo_%C3%8Dndia-Brasil-%C3%81frica_do_Sul(Portuguese) Not to be confused with the better known BRIC - Brasil-Russia-India-China; or BRICS - Brasil-Russia-India-China-SouthAfrica http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRIC (English) http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRIC (Portuguese) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRICS (English) http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRICS (Portuguese) Regards, great weekend Um abraço, bom fim de semana Rui 2011/9/17 Milton L Mueller > Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any > applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and > authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly unlikely, > the proposal would be very destructive. **** > > ** ** > > One notable and surprising thing: IBSA has bypassed the IGF. By putting > forward this proposal in the way it has, IBSA has openly declared that it > does not put any credibility or legitimacy in the IGF as a forum for > multistakeholder Internet policy development or discussion. This is true > because the IBSA proposal was developed outside of IGF in an exclusive club > of countries, and will not be put forward formally at the IGF. Rather, it > will be developed at the closed IBSA summit, and then taken directly to the > UN General Assembly. **** > > ** ** > > This is unacceptable to civil society. It excludes us from the entire > process. IBSA needs to be asked why it has chosen not to use a MS forum, a > forum its members helped to create, to gain agreement for this proposal.** > ** > > ** ** > > The IBSA report says that “the models proposed by the WGIG provided useful > guidelines” for a new global Internet governance body. This is a strange > statement. There were four different models proposed in the WGIG report, and > most of them were inconsistent with each other. One of the WGIG proposals > explicitly stated that no new global body was needed. So perhaps IBSA is > trying to pretend that its proposal has some kind of imprimatur from the > WGIG or the WSIS. It doesn’t. WGIG couldn’t agree on any of those models, > that was the point of listing 4 of them.**** > > ** ** > > The specific duties of the new global body make up an interesting list. It > will be “tasked to develop and establish international public policies.” So > it makes the same stupid mistake that governments have been making all > along: it is law, i.e. rules, not “policy” that is needed. Policy just means > that a gang of governments attempts to dictate outcomes, or alter outcomes > whenever something happens that they don’t like. Law on the other hand > provides a framework of clear rules that allows individual actors guidelines > and which also protects freedom. **** > > ** ** > > And here’s my favorite. IBSA proposes to “integrate and oversee the bodies > responsible for technical and operational functioning of the internet, > including global standards setting.” So IBSA is not only proposing to take > over regulation of all the world’s internet service providers, hosting > providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it > proposes to “integrate and oversee” the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, too. > No rationale for such a dramatic change is put forward. **** > > ** ** > > This proposal will fail to gain support from most of the internet-using > civil society, it will be adamantly opposed by the technical community, and > it will have very little support from the academic community. Needless to > say, all Internet businesses will oppose it, and so will most governments > outside the IBSA orbit.**** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > Milton L. Mueller**** > > Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies**** > > Internet Governance Project**** > > http://blog.internetgovernance.org **** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > On Saturday 17 September 2011 01:40 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: **** > > Hello everybody, > > I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on global > Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in the beginning > of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have prevented me to report the > discussions with the depth and length I would like to, but I have written a > blog post about it to the site of the Brazilian Observatory of Digital > policies, which has been circulating on Twitter recently: > > http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance > > I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if time > allows) or in Nairobi. > > Best wishes, > Marília > > **** > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant _______________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From correia.rui at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 18:33:51 2011 From: correia.rui at gmail.com (Rui Correia) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 23:33:51 +0100 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Ivar I am not quite sure I agree with what you are saying. It is quite a vague hanging in the air statement. I especially disagree with what you say about about making jokes about politicians - I have watched Brazilian television for 10 years and the level to which they mock politicians would be enough o be jailed in two thirds of the countries of this world. I am saying Brazil is a beacon of freedom of expression. As for telco regulation, it is even a murky, shady affair in quite a few of the so-called first world, government-hands-off countries. And you living in the US, should well know what the FCC gets up to - granted, it has kept its stance on net neutrality, but otherwise I would not rate it any better than its Brazilian counterparts. Rui 2011/9/17 Ivar A. M. Hartmann > Because I'm Brazilian and I'm fully aware of how government (both Executive > and Legislative branches) deals with freedom of expression and telco > regulation there, I would by default oppose a global body of IG run by gov > representatives which is either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by > it in any way. > Just as an example, Brazilian law prohibited people from making jokes about > politicians running for office during election periods. This was in force up > until a year ago until the Supreme Court (not Congress, mind you) decided to > put an end to it. > Best, > Ivar > > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 15:27, McTim wrote: > >> On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 9:22 PM, Milton L Mueller >> wrote: >> > Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any >> > applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and >> > authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly >> unlikely, >> > the proposal would be very destructive. >> >> I agree with Milton. >> >> >> >> >> > over regulation of all the world’s internet service providers, hosting >> > providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it >> > proposes to “integrate and oversee” the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, >> too. >> >> and if IT for Change has it's way, ICANN monies would be funnelled to >> support this new Internet Overlord. >> >> >> >> -- >> Cheers, >> >> McTim >> "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A >> route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant _______________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ca at cafonso.ca Sat Sep 17 19:15:25 2011 From: ca at cafonso.ca (Carlos A. Afonso) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 20:15:25 -0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <4E752A0D.9010409@cafonso.ca> While I wonder if I should delve my spoon into this complicated soup, here is the official IBAS/IBSA site URL: http://www.ibsa-trilateral.org/ A Southern Trilateral, how about that? :) frt rgds --c.a. On 09/17/2011 06:59 PM, Rui Correia wrote: > Hi > > Just in case anybody is wondering what IBSA is, it stands for > India-Brasil-SouthAfrica, > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India-Brazil-South_Africa_Dialogue_Forum(English) > http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/F%C3%B3rum_de_Di%C3%A1logo_%C3%8Dndia-Brasil-%C3%81frica_do_Sul(Portuguese) > > Not to be confused with the better known BRIC - Brasil-Russia-India-China; > or > BRICS - Brasil-Russia-India-China-SouthAfrica > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRIC (English) > http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRIC (Portuguese) > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRICS (English) > http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRICS (Portuguese) > > Regards, great weekend > Um abraço, bom fim de semana > > Rui > > 2011/9/17 Milton L Mueller > >> Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any >> applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and >> authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly unlikely, >> the proposal would be very destructive. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> One notable and surprising thing: IBSA has bypassed the IGF. By putting >> forward this proposal in the way it has, IBSA has openly declared that it >> does not put any credibility or legitimacy in the IGF as a forum for >> multistakeholder Internet policy development or discussion. This is true >> because the IBSA proposal was developed outside of IGF in an exclusive club >> of countries, and will not be put forward formally at the IGF. Rather, it >> will be developed at the closed IBSA summit, and then taken directly to the >> UN General Assembly. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> This is unacceptable to civil society. It excludes us from the entire >> process. IBSA needs to be asked why it has chosen not to use a MS forum, a >> forum its members helped to create, to gain agreement for this proposal.** >> ** >> >> ** ** >> >> The IBSA report says that “the models proposed by the WGIG provided useful >> guidelines” for a new global Internet governance body. This is a strange >> statement. There were four different models proposed in the WGIG report, and >> most of them were inconsistent with each other. One of the WGIG proposals >> explicitly stated that no new global body was needed. So perhaps IBSA is >> trying to pretend that its proposal has some kind of imprimatur from the >> WGIG or the WSIS. It doesn’t. WGIG couldn’t agree on any of those models, >> that was the point of listing 4 of them.**** >> >> ** ** >> >> The specific duties of the new global body make up an interesting list. It >> will be “tasked to develop and establish international public policies.” So >> it makes the same stupid mistake that governments have been making all >> along: it is law, i.e. rules, not “policy” that is needed. Policy just means >> that a gang of governments attempts to dictate outcomes, or alter outcomes >> whenever something happens that they don’t like. Law on the other hand >> provides a framework of clear rules that allows individual actors guidelines >> and which also protects freedom. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> And here’s my favorite. IBSA proposes to “integrate and oversee the bodies >> responsible for technical and operational functioning of the internet, >> including global standards setting.” So IBSA is not only proposing to take >> over regulation of all the world’s internet service providers, hosting >> providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it >> proposes to “integrate and oversee” the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, too. >> No rationale for such a dramatic change is put forward. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> This proposal will fail to gain support from most of the internet-using >> civil society, it will be adamantly opposed by the technical community, and >> it will have very little support from the academic community. Needless to >> say, all Internet businesses will oppose it, and so will most governments >> outside the IBSA orbit.**** >> >> ** ** >> >> ** ** >> >> Milton L. Mueller**** >> >> Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies**** >> >> Internet Governance Project**** >> >> http://blog.internetgovernance.org **** >> >> ** ** >> >> ** ** >> >> ** ** >> >> On Saturday 17 September 2011 01:40 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: **** >> >> Hello everybody, >> >> I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on global >> Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in the beginning >> of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have prevented me to report the >> discussions with the depth and length I would like to, but I have written a >> blog post about it to the site of the Brazilian Observatory of Digital >> policies, which has been circulating on Twitter recently: >> >> http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance >> >> I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if time >> allows) or in Nairobi. >> >> Best wishes, >> Marília >> >> **** >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From lehto.paul at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 20:51:56 2011 From: lehto.paul at gmail.com (Paul Lehto) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 20:51:56 -0400 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Ivar A. M. Hartmann wrote: > I would by default oppose a global body of IG run by gov representatives > which is either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by it in any way. > Just as an example, Brazilian law prohibited people from making jokes about > politicians running for office during election periods. This was in force up > until a year ago until the Supreme Court (not Congress, mind you) decided to > put an end to it. > In the public sector (government), at least a Supreme Court, as in the Brazilian example above, can correct a policy. But, in the private sector there will be no such correction, *ever, and they too have "no joking" rules.* Using employment as an example, private sector bosses often have rules of "no joking about the boss or the boss's interests or you will be fired". In every country I know of, such private sector "no joking" rules are enforceable law. Not only that, but there isn't even a reasonable chance that the power of the private sector boss to prohibit satire and joking will be open for *debate* anytime soon, much less that the ban on private sector joking would change. But *in Brazil's government, the no joking policy changed, *thanks to the Brazilian Supreme C*ourt.** Even internet providers terms of service will have non-disparagement clauses and the like. So, if you are effective enough ridiculing something important to the private sector internet provider, you can have your connectivity terminated. If your anti-telcom humor is ineffective or no one listens, I grant that you may have an illusion of "freedom" and you might not be terminated. (That's just the freedom to be irrelevant, not the freedom to joke about or satirize the telcom.) To oppose all government involvement is not only completely anti-democratic, but in the case of the "freedom to joke" it is like going out of the frying pan and into the fire. *-- Paul R Lehto, J.D. P.O. Box 1 Ishpeming, MI 49849 lehto.paul at gmail.com 906-204-4026 (cell) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From correia.rui at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 22:52:13 2011 From: correia.rui at gmail.com (Rui Correia) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 03:52:13 +0100 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Paul, Ivar There NEVER was ANY law in Brazil that prohibited making fun of candidates. What there was, was a prohibition - in terms of Pagraph 2 of Article 45 of the Election Law - against manipulation, montage or other, of video clips or sound bites so as to degrade or humiliate candidates or political parties. Such a clause is (was) still a restriction on freedom of expression, but was by no means a prohibition on making fun of candidates. On the contrary, they were fair game with programmes such as Casseta Planeta, Jo Soares and many others taking the mickey out of them. I concur with Milton that this is a regrettable development and not to be applauded. And I was at WSIS throughout and saw that Brazil was at times/ often on the wrong side of the moral divide. And whether this document has Brazil's name on it or not, as Milton says, IBSA will put it to the UN General Assembly. As far as I know, Brazil has a historic protocol 'privilege' of being the first to speak, that is all - not to ram through proposals for a "global body of IG run by gov representatives which is either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by it in any way". It is a short-sighted proposal, a non-starter and we should concentrate on fighting it, not where it is coming from - play the ball, not the man. Rui 2011/9/18 Paul Lehto > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Ivar A. M. Hartmann < > ivarhartmann at gmail.com> wrote: > >> I would by default oppose a global body of IG run by gov representatives >> which is either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by it in any way. >> Just as an example, Brazilian law prohibited people from making jokes >> about politicians running for office during election periods. This was in >> force up until a year ago until the Supreme Court (not Congress, mind you) >> decided to put an end to it. >> > > In the public sector (government), at least a Supreme Court, as in the > Brazilian example above, can correct a policy. > > But, in the private sector there will be no such correction, *ever, and > they too have "no joking" rules.* > > Using employment as an example, private sector bosses often have rules of > "no joking about the boss or the boss's interests or you will be fired". In > every country I know of, such private sector "no joking" rules are > enforceable law. Not only that, but there isn't even a reasonable chance > that the power of the private sector boss to prohibit satire and joking will > be open for *debate* anytime soon, much less that the ban on private sector > joking would change. But *in Brazil's government, the no joking policy > changed, *thanks to the Brazilian Supreme C*ourt.** > > Even internet providers terms of service will have non-disparagement > clauses and the like. So, if you are effective enough ridiculing something > important to the private sector internet provider, you can have your > connectivity terminated. If your anti-telcom humor is ineffective or no one > listens, I grant that you may have an illusion of "freedom" and you might > not be terminated. (That's just the freedom to be irrelevant, not the > freedom to joke about or satirize the telcom.) > > To oppose all government involvement is not only completely > anti-democratic, but in the case of the "freedom to joke" it is like going > out of the frying pan and into the fire. > > *-- > Paul R Lehto, J.D. > P.O. Box 1 > Ishpeming, MI 49849 > lehto.paul at gmail.com > 906-204-4026 (cell) > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant _______________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From lehto.paul at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 23:05:01 2011 From: lehto.paul at gmail.com (Paul Lehto) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 23:05:01 -0400 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 10:52 PM, Rui Correia wrote: > Paul, Ivar > > There NEVER was ANY law in Brazil that prohibited making fun of > candidates. > > What there was, was a prohibition - in terms of Pagraph 2 of Article 45 of > the Election Law - against manipulation, montage or other, of video clips or > sound bites so as to degrade or humiliate candidates or political parties. > "Degrade" or "humiliate" -- that means being on the *receiving* end of political critique, political satire, and biting political humor, and finding it to be "not funny." So, the speech being prohibited is either the satire or political cartooning I was referring to, or in any case it is political speech that a politician finds degrading or humiliating. There is an even stronger case for rights protection whenever something is political speech and *not* having the lightness of also being entertaining or funny. But here again it is out of the frying pan and into the fire if we are to dispense with government. Try degrading or humiliating the private sector boss in employment. And, it is easier for laws to be passed outlawing the "degradation" or "humiliation" of powerful folks in the private sector than it is for politicians, because in every country I'm familiar with, constitutional protections either don't apply in the private sector or are greatly diminished. Public sector: Perhaps corrupt, often misguided, but changeable contrary to the will of politicians, even if that change is frequently quite hard to accomplish. Private sector: Perhaps corrupt, often misguided, and not changeable against the will of the owners. Paul Lehto, J.D. > > > > 2011/9/18 Paul Lehto > >> >> On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Ivar A. M. Hartmann < >> ivarhartmann at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> I would by default oppose a global body of IG run by gov representatives >>> which is either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by it in any way. >>> Just as an example, Brazilian law prohibited people from making jokes >>> about politicians running for office during election periods. This was in >>> force up until a year ago until the Supreme Court (not Congress, mind you) >>> decided to put an end to it. >>> >> >> In the public sector (government), at least a Supreme Court, as in the >> Brazilian example above, can correct a policy. >> >> But, in the private sector there will be no such correction, *ever, and >> they too have "no joking" rules.* >> >> Using employment as an example, private sector bosses often have rules of >> "no joking about the boss or the boss's interests or you will be fired". In >> every country I know of, such private sector "no joking" rules are >> enforceable law. Not only that, but there isn't even a reasonable chance >> that the power of the private sector boss to prohibit satire and joking will >> be open for *debate* anytime soon, much less that the ban on private sector >> joking would change. But *in Brazil's government, the no joking policy >> changed, *thanks to the Brazilian Supreme C*ourt.** >> >> Even internet providers terms of service will have non-disparagement >> clauses and the like. So, if you are effective enough ridiculing something >> important to the private sector internet provider, you can have your >> connectivity terminated. If your anti-telcom humor is ineffective or no one >> listens, I grant that you may have an illusion of "freedom" and you might >> not be terminated. (That's just the freedom to be irrelevant, not the >> freedom to joke about or satirize the telcom.) >> >> To oppose all government involvement is not only completely >> anti-democratic, but in the case of the "freedom to joke" it is like going >> out of the frying pan and into the fire. >> >> *-- >> Paul R Lehto, J.D. >> P.O. Box 1 >> Ishpeming, MI 49849 >> lehto.paul at gmail.com >> 906-204-4026 (cell) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> > > > -- > _________________________ > Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 > Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 > > I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African > numbers > Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através > dos meus números sul-africanos > > Rui Correia > Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant > Angola Liaison Consultant > > _______________ > > > -- Paul R Lehto, J.D. P.O. Box 1 Ishpeming, MI 49849 lehto.paul at gmail.com 906-204-4026 (cell) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ivarhartmann at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 23:05:56 2011 From: ivarhartmann at gmail.com (Ivar A. M. Hartmann) Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2011 23:05:56 -0400 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: I think you misunderstood me Paul. I don't oppose gov involvement, I oppose a push away from whatever we have now to exclusive gov involvement. I'm obviously pointing to multistakeholderism (this message shouldn't be that hard to understand in a group like this, where this concept has been exhaustively discussed). Plus, as someone who has been doing research on and teaching fundamental rights theory for a few years, I certainly acknowledge the role played by the Judiciary in curtailing temporary, abusive, majority interests. With regards to Brazil, private parties, not just the state, are bound by fundamental rights (an influence from German constitutional law that the US is sadly light-years away from). Therefore the employee-making-boss-jokes example wouldn't play out quite the same there! Rui, as you probably know legal interpretation is not an exact science, so we'll have to agree to disagree on what precisely was forbidden by that section. But the fact is that the Supreme Court did bother to suspend it and the press and mass media were concerned about - whenever you have a restriction on speech that is highly likely to be interpreted as an outright ban, people will engage in self-censorship in order to avoid litigation costs. This can be considered *de facto* prohibition and the fact that you have come up with a different interpretation to that section in the law will do little to change this situation. Best, Ivar On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 20:51, Paul Lehto wrote: > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Ivar A. M. Hartmann < > ivarhartmann at gmail.com> wrote: > >> I would by default oppose a global body of IG run by gov representatives >> which is either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by it in any way. >> Just as an example, Brazilian law prohibited people from making jokes >> about politicians running for office during election periods. This was in >> force up until a year ago until the Supreme Court (not Congress, mind you) >> decided to put an end to it. >> > > In the public sector (government), at least a Supreme Court, as in the > Brazilian example above, can correct a policy. > > But, in the private sector there will be no such correction, *ever, and > they too have "no joking" rules.* > > Using employment as an example, private sector bosses often have rules of > "no joking about the boss or the boss's interests or you will be fired". In > every country I know of, such private sector "no joking" rules are > enforceable law. Not only that, but there isn't even a reasonable chance > that the power of the private sector boss to prohibit satire and joking will > be open for *debate* anytime soon, much less that the ban on private sector > joking would change. But *in Brazil's government, the no joking policy > changed, *thanks to the Brazilian Supreme C*ourt.** > > Even internet providers terms of service will have non-disparagement > clauses and the like. So, if you are effective enough ridiculing something > important to the private sector internet provider, you can have your > connectivity terminated. If your anti-telcom humor is ineffective or no one > listens, I grant that you may have an illusion of "freedom" and you might > not be terminated. (That's just the freedom to be irrelevant, not the > freedom to joke about or satirize the telcom.) > > To oppose all government involvement is not only completely > anti-democratic, but in the case of the "freedom to joke" it is like going > out of the frying pan and into the fire. > > *-- > Paul R Lehto, J.D. > P.O. Box 1 > Ishpeming, MI 49849 > lehto.paul at gmail.com > 906-204-4026 (cell) > > > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From correia.rui at gmail.com Sat Sep 17 23:19:34 2011 From: correia.rui at gmail.com (Rui Correia) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 04:19:34 +0100 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Ivar I did not bother to interpret anything - I merely provided a quick translation of what the paragraph in the law said. Paul interpreted it and frankly I don't know what he is on about. My initial post was about not creating wrong impressions that might sidetrack attention, but now this is also becoming a distraction, so - as the Brazilians say - I am getting off the bus now! Best regards to all, use the Sunday to recharge, Um grande abraço, Rui 2011/9/18 Ivar A. M. Hartmann > > the fact that you have come up with a different interpretation to that > section in the law will do little to change this situation. > Best, > Ivar > > > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 20:51, Paul Lehto wrote: > >> >> On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Ivar A. M. Hartmann < >> ivarhartmann at gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> I would by default oppose a global body of IG run by gov representatives >>> which is either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by it in any way. >>> Just as an example, Brazilian law prohibited people from making jokes >>> about politicians running for office during election periods. This was in >>> force up until a year ago until the Supreme Court (not Congress, mind you) >>> decided to put an end to it. >>> >> >> In the public sector (government), at least a Supreme Court, as in the >> Brazilian example above, can correct a policy. >> >> But, in the private sector there will be no such correction, *ever, and >> they too have "no joking" rules.* >> >> Using employment as an example, private sector bosses often have rules of >> "no joking about the boss or the boss's interests or you will be fired". In >> every country I know of, such private sector "no joking" rules are >> enforceable law. Not only that, but there isn't even a reasonable chance >> that the power of the private sector boss to prohibit satire and joking will >> be open for *debate* anytime soon, much less that the ban on private sector >> joking would change. But *in Brazil's government, the no joking policy >> changed, *thanks to the Brazilian Supreme C*ourt.** >> >> Even internet providers terms of service will have non-disparagement >> clauses and the like. So, if you are effective enough ridiculing something >> important to the private sector internet provider, you can have your >> connectivity terminated. If your anti-telcom humor is ineffective or no one >> listens, I grant that you may have an illusion of "freedom" and you might >> not be terminated. (That's just the freedom to be irrelevant, not the >> freedom to joke about or satirize the telcom.) >> >> To oppose all government involvement is not only completely >> anti-democratic, but in the case of the "freedom to joke" it is like going >> out of the frying pan and into the fire. >> >> *-- >> Paul R Lehto, J.D. >> P.O. Box 1 >> Ishpeming, MI 49849 >> lehto.paul at gmail.com >> 906-204-4026 (cell) >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- _________________________ Mobile Number in Namibia +264 81 445 1308 Número de Telemóvel na Namíbia +264 81 445 1308 I am away from Johannesburg - you cannot contact me on my South African numbers Estou fora de Joanesburgo - não poderá entrar em contacto comigo através dos meus números sul-africanos Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant Angola Liaison Consultant _______________ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mariliamaciel at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 00:27:25 2011 From: mariliamaciel at gmail.com (Marilia Maciel) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 01:27:25 -0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Dear Milton, I would like to comment some of your observations, as someone who participated on the seminar and who organized it in FGV. On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 3:22 PM, Milton L Mueller wrote: > Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any > applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and > authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly unlikely, > the proposal would be very destructive. > First of all, some background information is important. The idea to organize the meeting was firstly raised by Brazil during the CSTD meeting in May (although funding was only secured in July), in a conversation with the governments of India and South Africa, and with civil society from Brazil and India who were there. The main goals of the meeting were to identify main policy and regulatory issues that should be seen as priority by the actors from the three countries and to discuss institutional changes, especially enhanced cooperation. The evaluation back then was that if IBSA countries would like to discuss EC in CSTD and elsewhere, then some clear proposal would have to be advanced, so it can be properly debated. Nowadays people are either ignoring the topic (despite the clear mandate from Tunis) or advocating it vaguely, and this is leading discussions nowhere. The seminar was very useful to air positions and to understand expectations. With the help of these exchanges, I personally hope that a clear proposal on EC will emerge by September, so it can be discussed by all those interested. The statement summarizes general ideas so I don't think we could possibly have enough information to judge the future proposal from IBSA right now. > **** > > ** ** > > One notable and surprising thing: IBSA has bypassed the IGF. By putting > forward this proposal in the way it has, IBSA has openly declared that it > does not put any credibility or legitimacy in the IGF as a forum for > multistakeholder Internet policy development or discussion. > I don't think this analysis is accurate because: 1) India and Brazil have supported the IGF, not only being host countries and active participants in subsequent meetings, but also by making suggestions for strengthening the IGF in CSTD WG. You are certainly aware that the more comprehensive proposal to enhance the IGF has been advanced by India, reason why the IGC is organizing a workshop to discuss IGF improvement based on the Indian proposal. And you also know that US was against the continuation of the working group on IGF improvements, according their letter, published in CSTD website, and we all know that IGF's improvements are very important to strengthen its role and legitimacy. 2) During the next IGF, government representatives have accepted to take part in several workshops organized by CS that are discussing IGF improvement, when they will certainly be able to talk about IBSA's aims. So the discussion will not bypass the IGF as you said. I hope you will be there to raise your issues. 3) I can speak only for the context in Brazil, but I believe it is fair to mention that some civil society, business and academic organizations has been consulted and involved in policy development by the Ministry of External relations. Periodic meetings took place to listen to non-governemental actors before the government adopted their positions in ICANN and IGF. Naturally, this does not mean positions will always coincide and when disagreements emerge we deal with them. But this shows the level of transparency and the good dialogue that we have achieved internally. I hope that you have the same opportunity to approach the US government on IG matters, and that others on this list have the same opportunity to approach the european commission. Maybe we would have less secret documents and negotiations, which were certainly not multistakehoder. This is true because the IBSA proposal was developed outside of IGF in an > exclusive club of countries, and will not be put forward formally at the > IGF. Rather, it will be developed at the closed IBSA summit, and then taken > directly to the UN General Assembly. > Here I dont really understand your point. IBSA proposal has to be developed by IBSA actors, as the EU proposal needs to be developed by EU, etc. The important thing if that it is done is an open and participatory way. > **** > > ** ** > > This is unacceptable to civil society. It excludes us from the entire > process. IBSA needs to be asked why it has chosen not to use a MS forum, a > forum its members helped to create, to gain agreement for this proposal. > Here maybe some background information is missing. In the case of IBSA seminar, the governments were the first ones to say they wanted a multistakeholder meeting, back in CSTD. And although governments and civil society were the predominant participants, the meeting was open to all those who wished to participate. Some CS participants from South Africa and India were sponsored to come. So IBSA sent a message they would like to create a multistakeholder dialogue between non-governmental actors from the three countries, although the mobilization of stakeholders needs to be improved. > **** > > ** ** > > The IBSA report says that “the models proposed by the WGIG provided useful > guidelines” for a new global Internet governance body. This is a strange > statement. There were four different models proposed in the WGIG report, and > most of them were inconsistent with each other. One of the WGIG proposals > explicitly stated that no new global body was needed. So perhaps IBSA is > trying to pretend that its proposal has some kind of imprimatur from the > WGIG or the WSIS. It doesn’t. WGIG couldn’t agree on any of those models, > that was the point of listing 4 of them. > I am not aware of discussions during the drafting of this statement, but what was said during the seminar was that 3 out of 4 models advanced by WGIG mention a new body and some of them get into details about it, so any proposal on EC should not start from zero, bur review the models discussed during WGIG. > **** > > ** ** > > The specific duties of the new global body make up an interesting list. It > will be “tasked to develop and establish international public policies.” So > it makes the same stupid mistake that governments have been making all > along: it is law, i.e. rules, not “policy” that is needed. Policy just means > that a gang of governments attempts to dictate outcomes, or alter outcomes > whenever something happens that they don’t like. Law on the other hand > provides a framework of clear rules that allows individual actors guidelines > and which also protects freedom. **** > > ** > Again, all I can say was that during the seminar the need to develop policy and regulation were mentioned and the need to protect rights was also raised. And there was predominant support for a multistakeholder mechanism of enhanced cooperation, although we need to see very carefully if and how MS participation will be put on paper when their proposal is advanced. > ** > > And here’s my favorite. IBSA proposes to “integrate and oversee the bodies > responsible for technical and operational functioning of the internet, > including global standards setting.” So IBSA is not only proposing to take > over regulation of all the world’s internet service providers, hosting > providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it > proposes to “integrate and oversee” the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, too. > No rationale for such a dramatic change is put forward. > Just a small comment, for the sake of clarity: the oversight would be performed by the new body, not by IBSA. And during seminar discussions, most of these organizations were not mentioned. It had nothing to do with oversight of content providers and mobile. I understand if you disagree with the proposal of oversight or if you believe that any new body should be created. People on the list have advanced arguments on both sides. But you cannot say that the reasons have not been advanced by them. Just read the statements IBSA produced so far. > **** > > ** ** > > This proposal will fail to gain support from most of the internet-using > civil society, it will be adamantly opposed by the technical community, and > it will have very little support from the academic community. Needless to > say, all Internet businesses will oppose it, and so will most governments > outside the IBSA orbit.**** > > ** > I think that it is very positive to discuss sensitive topics in a mulstistakeholder and transparent way, and was the case in the seminar. This is different from the bahavior that has been adopted elsewhere, we should acknowledge that. And applause or rejection usually comes after the idea is fully presented, when things are made clear, and not before. Best wishes, Marília Milton L. Mueller**** > > Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies**** > > Internet Governance Project**** > > http://blog.internetgovernance.org **** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > ** ** > > On Saturday 17 September 2011 01:40 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: **** > > Hello everybody, > > I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on global > Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in the beginning > of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have prevented me to report the > discussions with the depth and length I would like to, but I have written a > blog post about it to the site of the Brazilian Observatory of Digital > policies, which has been circulating on Twitter recently: > > http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance > > I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if time > allows) or in Nairobi. > > Best wishes, > Marília > > **** > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade FGV Direito Rio Center for Technology and Society Getulio Vargas Foundation Rio de Janeiro - Brazil -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From lehto.paul at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 00:50:39 2011 From: lehto.paul at gmail.com (Paul Lehto) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 00:50:39 -0400 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 11:05 PM, Ivar A. M. Hartmann < ivarhartmann at gmail.com> wrote: > I think you misunderstood me Paul. I don't oppose gov involvement, I oppose > a push away from whatever we have now to exclusive gov involvement. I'm > obviously pointing to multistakeholderism (this message shouldn't be that > hard to understand in a group like this, where this concept has been > exhaustively discussed). OK, thanks for clarifying. I reacted to what still seems a relatively clear statement on your part, when you wrote: "I would by default oppose a global body of IG run by gov representatives which is *either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by it in any way." (emphasis added) *It seems you mean to add the word "exclusively" in there somewhere.* *You are correct, multistakeholderism has been discussed at length. Your motivations for supporting that are quite understandable, but I would only say this:* The solution to the corruptions of democracy is not to move away from democracy *(i.e. to multistakeholderism, where democratic governmental representation is diminished). Perhaps there are some anecdotal examples of multi-stakeholder entities being more sensitive to fundamental rights compared to governments, but I can see no really good reasons *why they should be* better. * This strikes me as switching horses out of disgust or frustration, using another horse with some shiny bells and whistles, but yet nothing fundamentally that indicates the new horse is built to give loyal service. *At least with politicians the people can kick them out of office.* *Have a nice weekend, Ivar. Paul Lehto, J.D. On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 20:51, Paul Lehto wrote: > > On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 4:56 PM, Ivar A. M. Hartmann < > ivarhartmann at gmail.com> wrote: > >> I would by default oppose a global body of IG run by gov representatives >> which is either suggested by Brazilian gov or influenced by it in any way. >> Just as an example, Brazilian law prohibited people from making jokes >> about politicians running for office during election periods. This was in >> force up until a year ago until the Supreme Court (not Congress, mind you) >> decided to put an end to it. >> > > In the public sector (government), at least a Supreme Court, as in the > Brazilian example above, can correct a policy. > > But, in the private sector there will be no such correction, *ever, and > they too have "no joking" rules.* > > Using employment as an example, private sector bosses often have rules of > "no joking about the boss or the boss's interests or you will be fired". In > every country I know of, such private sector "no joking" rules are > enforceable law. Not only that, but there isn't even a reasonable chance > that the power of the private sector boss to prohibit satire and joking will > be open for *debate* anytime soon, much less that the ban on private sector > joking would change. But *in Brazil's government, the no joking policy > changed, *thanks to the Brazilian Supreme C*ourt.** > > Even internet providers terms of service will have non-disparagement > clauses and the like. So, if you are effective enough ridiculing something > important to the private sector internet provider, you can have your > connectivity terminated. If your anti-telcom humor is ineffective or no one > listens, I grant that you may have an illusion of "freedom" and you might > not be terminated. (That's just the freedom to be irrelevant, not the > freedom to joke about or satirize the telcom.) > > To oppose all government involvement is not only completely > anti-democratic, but in the case of the "freedom to joke" it is like going > out of the frying pan and into the fire. > > *-- > Paul R Lehto, J.D. > P.O. Box 1 > Ishpeming, MI 49849 > lehto.paul at gmail.com > 906-204-4026 (cell) > > > > > > > -- Paul R Lehto, J.D. P.O. Box 1 Ishpeming, MI 49849 lehto.paul at gmail.com 906-204-4026 (cell) -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dogwallah at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 01:29:37 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 08:29:37 +0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Paul, On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 3:51 AM, Paul Lehto wrote: > > But, in the private sector there will be no such correction, ever, and they > too have "no joking" rules. The so called "private sector led" (which I contend are more correctly MS) Internet Governance organisations change policies quite frequently. See the new gTLD policy as an example which you may be familiar with. There are dozens of others I could cite as well. Currently, I am co-chair of the AfriNIC Policy Development Working Group. If there was no chance of having new policies or changing old policies, there would be no such WG. It is much easier to change these policies than to get even one African government to change a law, let alone ALL African countries to enact the same law. BTW, Several of the RIRs have "Secret WGs" whose sole purpose is to make jokes. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de Sun Sep 18 04:42:21 2011 From: wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=22Kleinw=E4chter=2C_Wolfgang=22?=) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 10:42:21 +0200 Subject: AW: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E752A0D.9010409@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C527@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Hi everybody the IBSA initiative is a good case to broaden the ongoing discussion about global Internet Governance policy making and the development of frameworks as it has been triggered in 2011 by the G8, OECD, Council of Europe, the US government and the EU (with its neboulos Internet Compact and the confusing six secret ICANN papers). Now the picture gets more comprehensive and the only thing we are missing in this concert is a Chinese proposal. Anybody can explain why China is silent? Do they plan to propose something during the forthcoming G 20 summit in Cannes? Or during the 66th UN General Assembly? Who represents the Chinese government at the forthcoming IGF? Anyhow, the IBSA approach is interesting and I share Miltons point that it would have been much better to involve the IGF. Unfortunately the IBSA countries used the same approach as the G 8 (which was widely critisized as arrogant and ignorant) and excluded non-governmental stakeholders from the discussion. But it is still in the early stage and there will be - hopefully - chances to correct this. For me it is unclear how the IBSA countries position themselves to the principle of multistakeholderism (which is singled out as a key principle in similar final documents of G 8, OECD, Council of Europe etc.). It seems that this is at the moment a purely inter-governmental thing. However the IBSA Rio Recommendation (September 2, 2011) includes in its 4th paragraph the formuation that the IBSA meeting stressed "to ensure that Internet Governance is transparent, democratic, multistakeholder and multilateral as mandated by the Tunis Agenda." This is interesting. The original text of the Tunis Agenda (para. 48) is "The international management of the Internet should be multilateral, transparent and democratic, with the full involvement of governments, the private sector, civil society and international organizations." Some people will remember the hot dispute among the words "multilateral" (inter-state) and "multistakeholder" (governments and non-governmental groups). If I compare the two formulations than I see that the IBSA countries goe beyond the Tunis agenda by putting "multistakeholder" before "multilateral" and giving "Transparency" and "Democracy" first priority. This is good. And this reflects also a discussion we had during the IGF workshop in San Francisco where I got a question (from a Brazilian friend) how I see the future of the intergovernmental treaty system (under international law) in the future of Internet regulation. My answer was that intergovernmental treaties will not disappear and will play an even greater role, but they will be and has to be "embedded" into a multistakeholder environment. One could conclude form here, that "policies" has to be developed in a multistakeholder transparent bottom up way but if it comes to binding decision, than governments have to take the lead and have to translate policies into law (which are legally binding treaties). This seems for me a rational approach. What I miss in the IBSA project is that they do not make clear to distinction between multistakeholder policy development and multilateral treaty (law) making. I hope that the IBSA countries will open the discussuion on this issue on October 18, 2011 in Durban to non-governmental stakeholders (at best from all over the world /as the Council of Europe did in April 2011 in Strasbourg/ and at least from their own countries). It remains to be seen how far we can come with Internet treaties, taking into account also the Russian initiative in the 1st Committee of the UN General Assembly. Nevertheless I remain sceptical with regard to intergovernmental treaties (hard law). It will eat away years to reach a very general consensus among 190+ nation states and probably another decade until a relevant number of national parliaments have ratified such a treaty to become binding law. Soft Law in form of policy guidelines are probably more efficient (and flexible, as McTim has pointed out), but such policies should be developed bottom up with the inclusion of all stakeholders (and not top down behind closed doors by one stakeholder group alone). BTW another point I miss in the IBSA declaration is a reference to human rights. For the 47 member states of the Council of Europe the protection of Human Rights has the first priority in Internet policy making. It would be good if the IBSA countries could fully support the report of the the Human Rights Rapporteur Frank La Reau with regard to Internet Freedoms, as discussed in the UN Human Rights Council. Anyhow, interesting phase of Internet Governance Policies. Wolfgang ________________________________ Von: governance at lists.cpsr.org im Auftrag von Carlos A. Afonso Gesendet: So 18.09.2011 01:15 An: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Rui Correia Betreff: Re: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal While I wonder if I should delve my spoon into this complicated soup, here is the official IBAS/IBSA site URL: http://www.ibsa-trilateral.org/ A Southern Trilateral, how about that? :) frt rgds --c.a. On 09/17/2011 06:59 PM, Rui Correia wrote: > Hi > > Just in case anybody is wondering what IBSA is, it stands for > India-Brasil-SouthAfrica, > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India-Brazil-South_Africa_Dialogue_Forum(English) > http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/F%C3%B3rum_de_Di%C3%A1logo_%C3%8Dndia-Brasil-%C3%81frica_do_Sul(Portuguese) > > Not to be confused with the better known BRIC - Brasil-Russia-India-China; > or > BRICS - Brasil-Russia-India-China-SouthAfrica > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRIC (English) > http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRIC (Portuguese) > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRICS (English) > http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRICS (Portuguese) > > Regards, great weekend > Um abraço, bom fim de semana > > Rui > > 2011/9/17 Milton L Mueller > >> Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any >> applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and >> authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly unlikely, >> the proposal would be very destructive. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> One notable and surprising thing: IBSA has bypassed the IGF. By putting >> forward this proposal in the way it has, IBSA has openly declared that it >> does not put any credibility or legitimacy in the IGF as a forum for >> multistakeholder Internet policy development or discussion. This is true >> because the IBSA proposal was developed outside of IGF in an exclusive club >> of countries, and will not be put forward formally at the IGF. Rather, it >> will be developed at the closed IBSA summit, and then taken directly to the >> UN General Assembly. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> This is unacceptable to civil society. It excludes us from the entire >> process. IBSA needs to be asked why it has chosen not to use a MS forum, a >> forum its members helped to create, to gain agreement for this proposal.** >> ** >> >> ** ** >> >> The IBSA report says that "the models proposed by the WGIG provided useful >> guidelines" for a new global Internet governance body. This is a strange >> statement. There were four different models proposed in the WGIG report, and >> most of them were inconsistent with each other. One of the WGIG proposals >> explicitly stated that no new global body was needed. So perhaps IBSA is >> trying to pretend that its proposal has some kind of imprimatur from the >> WGIG or the WSIS. It doesn't. WGIG couldn't agree on any of those models, >> that was the point of listing 4 of them.**** >> >> ** ** >> >> The specific duties of the new global body make up an interesting list. It >> will be "tasked to develop and establish international public policies." So >> it makes the same stupid mistake that governments have been making all >> along: it is law, i.e. rules, not "policy" that is needed. Policy just means >> that a gang of governments attempts to dictate outcomes, or alter outcomes >> whenever something happens that they don't like. Law on the other hand >> provides a framework of clear rules that allows individual actors guidelines >> and which also protects freedom. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> And here's my favorite. IBSA proposes to "integrate and oversee the bodies >> responsible for technical and operational functioning of the internet, >> including global standards setting." So IBSA is not only proposing to take >> over regulation of all the world's internet service providers, hosting >> providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it >> proposes to "integrate and oversee" the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, too. >> No rationale for such a dramatic change is put forward. **** >> >> ** ** >> >> This proposal will fail to gain support from most of the internet-using >> civil society, it will be adamantly opposed by the technical community, and >> it will have very little support from the academic community. Needless to >> say, all Internet businesses will oppose it, and so will most governments >> outside the IBSA orbit.**** >> >> ** ** >> >> ** ** >> >> Milton L. Mueller**** >> >> Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies**** >> >> Internet Governance Project**** >> >> http://blog.internetgovernance.org **** >> >> ** ** >> >> ** ** >> >> ** ** >> >> On Saturday 17 September 2011 01:40 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: **** >> >> Hello everybody, >> >> I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on global >> Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in the beginning >> of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have prevented me to report the >> discussions with the depth and length I would like to, but I have written a >> blog post about it to the site of the Brazilian Observatory of Digital >> policies, which has been circulating on Twitter recently: >> >> http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance >> >> I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if time >> allows) or in Nairobi. >> >> Best wishes, >> Marília >> >> **** >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Sun Sep 18 07:20:47 2011 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 20:20:47 +0900 Subject: [governance] Kenya: ICT policy, visa and Nairobi weather Message-ID: Kenya ICT Action Network (KICTAnet), "a multi-stakeholder platform for people and institutions interested and involved in ICT policy and regulation..." Very interesting, an influential bunch of people. Mailing list discussions are archived on the website and a good source of information about what's happening here, what people are thinking/doing. I've just arrived in Nairobi: Visa on arrival (if your country's listed ) is simple. Costs US$50 (also seem to take Euro, cost is 40, and UK pounds, cost 30, but dollars a more useful currency to have.) I got a visa application form here , paper might also be available on your flight. Saves a bit of time to complete before standing in line. And there is a second yellow or blue form you will need to complete, those seem not available online (get from the airline or at immigration.) Any doubts, trust Grace (earlier email about visa assistance) not me. A bit of luck and you'll be through immigration before your bags get to the belt. It's quite chilly, 20-21 degrees Celsius today. I don't know the long term forecast, but anyone planning to come, think mid 20s, cooler in the evening. Adam ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Sun Sep 18 07:21:28 2011 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 20:21:28 +0900 Subject: [governance] Preliminary summary of the IBSA seminar on global Internet Governance In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Dear Marilia, How was enhanced cooperation defined? It's always been such a vague and I think confusing term. And is there a summary of session five (Institutional arrangements), presentations, anything? Otherwise, from what I've read so far I agree with Milton. See civil society losing out badly in these arrangements. Also find the CSDT relationship confusing and a bit troubling -- seems to be a kind of CSDT IGF improvements working group IBSA adjunct session. Is that a wrong characterization? Thanks, Adam >Hello everybody, > >I would like to share with you some news about >the IBSA seminar on global Internet governance >that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in the >beginning of this month. Tight schedule and >deadlines have prevented me to report the >discussions with the depth and length I would >like to, but I have written a blog post about it >to the site of the Brazilian Observatory of >Digital policies, which has been circulating on >Twitter recently: >http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance > >I will be happy to talk more about it and share >impressions here (if time allows) or in Nairobi. > >Best wishes, >Marília > > >-- >Centro de Tecnologia e Sociedade >FGV Direito Rio > >Center for Technology and Society >Getulio Vargas Foundation >Rio de Janeiro - Brazil > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 07:33:03 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 23:33:03 +1200 Subject: [governance] Press Release: Pacific participation Message-ID: Dear All, Press Release attached. See you in Nairobi soon :) Best, -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Press Release for IGF 2011 FINAL.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 11500 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From william.drake at uzh.ch Sun Sep 18 07:35:31 2011 From: william.drake at uzh.ch (William Drake) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 13:35:31 +0200 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <460E128A-D91B-436B-986C-6092064651E2@uzh.ch> Hi Marilia I'm glad to see this initiative finally coming out into the sunlight, as there hasn't been much publicly accessible information on what you folks have been up to. I've raised it at several events, including a WSIS Forum workshop I organized (which included Alvaro from the Brazilian government), but have been unable to elicit much discussion from any side. While I don't favor UN-based intergovernmental control, the idea's been floating in the wind and configuring perceptions and dialogue for so long that it would be useful to finally hear the proponents get up in public and make their case about what problems require such a solution, how it could possibly work, why the benefits would outweigh the costs, how consensus could be achieved and how you'd proceed if it cannot, and so on. That certainly did not happen within the WGIG with respect to the three "oversight" models some of the government reps put on the table (which, BTW, the caucus strongly opposed at the time). It would be better to finally have an open multistakeholder debate on the merits than for the IBSA governments to take it to their summit and into the UN GA without the benefit of this reality check. On Sep 18, 2011, at 6:27 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: > > 2) During the next IGF, government representatives have accepted to take part in several workshops organized by CS that are discussing IGF improvement, when they will certainly be able to talk about IBSA's aims. So the discussion will not bypass the IGF as you said. I hope you will be there to raise your issues. There will be more opportunities than this. For example, I intend to raise it again in the main session on CIR, which I'm co-moderating with Emily Taylor, and in my workshop on institutional choice in GIG http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/component/chronocontact/?chronoformname=WSProposals2011View&wspid=178, which is a feeder for the CIR session. Tulika from the Indian government will be speaking on both, as will Alice, Anriette, and Fiona (plus others here who are on or the other, e.g. Avri, Jeanette, Patrik..). So let's get it out in the open and hear what people have to say either way. While such a debate will be divisive, a UN GA proposal that hasn't been openly debated would be much more so. Cheers, Bill *************************************************** William J. Drake International Fellow Media Change & Innovation Division, IPMZ University of Zurich, Switzerland william.drake at uzh.ch www.mediachange.ch/people/william-j-drake www.williamdrake.org **************************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From william.drake at uzh.ch Sun Sep 18 07:37:58 2011 From: william.drake at uzh.ch (William Drake) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 13:37:58 +0200 Subject: [governance] Kenya: ICT policy, visa and Nairobi weather In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3D7EED1A-78AF-42B7-B101-B6D010C1FCF0@uzh.ch> Adam, On Sep 18, 2011, at 1:20 PM, Adam Peake wrote: > I've just arrived in Nairobi: Visa on arrival (if your country's listed ) is simple. Costs US$50 (also seem to take Euro, cost is 40, and UK pounds, cost 30, but dollars a more useful currency to have.) I paid 70 CHF ($80). Think I can get them to refund the difference? :-) BD -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dogwallah at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 07:59:52 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 14:59:52 +0300 Subject: [governance] Kenya: ICT policy, visa and Nairobi weather In-Reply-To: References: <3D7EED1A-78AF-42B7-B101-B6D010C1FCF0@uzh.ch> Message-ID: I meant "This" house (the one I live in). -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dogwallah at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 07:55:25 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 14:55:25 +0300 Subject: [governance] Kenya: ICT policy, visa and Nairobi weather In-Reply-To: <3D7EED1A-78AF-42B7-B101-B6D010C1FCF0@uzh.ch> References: <3D7EED1A-78AF-42B7-B101-B6D010C1FCF0@uzh.ch> Message-ID: On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 2:37 PM, William Drake wrote: > Adam, > > On Sep 18, 2011, at 1:20 PM, Adam Peake wrote: > > I've just arrived in Nairobi:  Visa on arrival (if your country's listed > ) > is simple.  Costs US$50 (also seem to take Euro, cost is 40, and UK pounds, > cost 30, but dollars a more useful currency to have.) > > I paid 70 CHF ($80).  Think I can get them to refund the difference? :-) The house (mansion really) was built by a Kenyan diplomat...I suspect it was mostly built using visa fees ;-/ Adam, are you at the Jacaranda? Drinks this week? -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dogwallah at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 08:19:33 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 15:19:33 +0300 Subject: [governance] Kenya: ICT policy, visa and Nairobi weather In-Reply-To: References: <3D7EED1A-78AF-42B7-B101-B6D010C1FCF0@uzh.ch> Message-ID: Apologies for spam, that was meant to be offlist. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ias_pk at yahoo.com Sun Sep 18 08:41:12 2011 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com (Imran Ahmed Shah) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 17:41:12 +0500 Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE Message-ID: <011b01cc7600$424e3140$c6ea93c0$@yahoo.com> Dear IGC Members, With reference to NN Policies Development for Global Internet Governance, I would like to draw your kind attention for your comments to a recently uploaded on Diplo Internet Governance Community Forum and accessible through this url: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net -neutrality-issue Thanks Imran Ahmad Shah +92 300 4130617 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From zads911 at msn.com Sun Sep 18 08:43:34 2011 From: zads911 at msn.com (Mohamed zahran) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 12:43:34 +0000 Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE In-Reply-To: <011b01cc7600$424e3140$c6ea93c0$@yahoo.com> References: <011b01cc7600$424e3140$c6ea93c0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear Imran thier is somthing woth the url it go to (page not found) Regards, Mohamed Zahran Business Systems Analyst Cell: +20129614467 > From: ias_pk at yahoo.com > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > CC: imran at igfpak.org > Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 17:41:12 +0500 > Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE > > Dear IGC Members, > With reference to NN Policies Development for Global Internet Governance, I > would like to draw your kind attention for your comments to a recently > uploaded on Diplo Internet Governance Community Forum and accessible through > this url: > http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net > -neutrality-issue > > Thanks > > Imran Ahmad Shah > +92 300 4130617 > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ias_pk at yahoo.com Sun Sep 18 09:10:21 2011 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com (Imran Ahmed Shah) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 18:10:21 +0500 Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE In-Reply-To: References: <011b01cc7600$424e3140$c6ea93c0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <012501cc7604$562df160$0289d420$@yahoo.com> Dear Zahran It might be the problem of the Hosting Server, ISP or the Client Machine at some time, Mobile phone or the Network Operator. Blackberry also returned gateway problem. But in my experience and testing, I kept many the options before me and carefully monitored. In one case the tracert returned the requesting server on 27th hope while on other testing same url was accessible on 15th hope. Thanking you and Best Regards Imran Ahmad Shah +92 300 4130617 From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Mohamed zahran Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2011 05:44 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Cc: imran at igfpak.org Subject: RE: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE Dear Imran thier is somthing woth the url it go to (page not found) Regards, Mohamed Zahran Business Systems Analyst Cell: +20129614467 > From: ias_pk at yahoo.com > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > CC: imran at igfpak.org > Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 17:41:12 +0500 > Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE > > Dear IGC Members, > With reference to NN Policies Development for Global Internet Governance, I > would like to draw your kind attention for your comments to a recently > uploaded on Diplo Internet Governance Community Forum and accessible through > this url: > http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net > -neutrality-issue > > Thanks > > Imran Ahmad Shah > +92 300 4130617 > > > ____________________________________________________________< br>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From Lorena.Jaume-Palasi at gsi.uni-muenchen.de Sun Sep 18 09:13:04 2011 From: Lorena.Jaume-Palasi at gsi.uni-muenchen.de (Lorena Jaume-Palasi) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 15:13:04 +0200 Subject: AW: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE In-Reply-To: References: <011b01cc7600$424e3140$c6ea93c0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: <010b01cc7604$b52ddbd0$1f899370$@gsi.uni-muenchen.de> Dear Mohamed, try again: www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net-neutra lity-issue part of the url direction was “unlinked”, it should work now. Regards, Lorena Jaume-Palasí ___________________________________________ Wiss. Mitarbeiterin Lehrstuhl für Politische Theorie Geschwister Scholl Institut für Politikwissenschaft. LMU www.gsi.uni-muenchen.de/personen/wiss_mitarbeiter/jaume-palasi Von: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] Im Auftrag von Mohamed zahran Gesendet: Sonntag, 18. September 2011 14:44 An: governance at lists.cpsr.org Cc: imran at igfpak.org Betreff: RE: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE Dear Imran thier is somthing woth the url it go to (page not found) Regards, Mohamed Zahran Business Systems Analyst Cell: +20129614467 > From: ias_pk at yahoo.com > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > CC: imran at igfpak.org > Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 17:41:12 +0500 > Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE > > Dear IGC Members, > With reference to NN Policies Development for Global Internet Governance, I > would like to draw your kind attention for your comments to a recently > uploaded on Diplo Internet Governance Community Forum and accessible through > this url: > http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net > -neutrality-issue > > Thanks > > Imran Ahmad Shah > +92 300 4130617 > > > ____________________________________________________________< br>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From zads911 at msn.com Sun Sep 18 09:13:14 2011 From: zads911 at msn.com (Mohamed zahran) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 13:13:14 +0000 Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE In-Reply-To: <012501cc7604$562df160$0289d420$@yahoo.com> References: <011b01cc7600$424e3140$c6ea93c0$@yahoo.com> ,<012501cc7604$562df160$0289d420$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net-neutrality-issue Regards, Mohamed Zahran Business Systems Analyst Cell: +20129614467 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; zads911 at msn.com CC: imran at igfpak.org Subject: RE: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 18:10:21 +0500 Dear Zahran It might be the problem of the Hosting Server, ISP or the Client Machine at some time, Mobile phone or the Network Operator. Blackberry also returned gateway problem. But in my experience and testing, I kept many the options before me and carefully monitored. In one case the tracert returned the requesting server on 27th hope while on other testing same url was accessible on 15th hope. Thanking you and Best RegardsImran Ahmad Shah+92 300 4130617From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Mohamed zahran Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2011 05:44 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Cc: imran at igfpak.org Subject: RE: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE Dear Imran thier is somthing woth the url it go to (page not found) Regards,Mohamed ZahranBusiness Systems AnalystCell: +20129614467 > From: ias_pk at yahoo.com > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > CC: imran at igfpak.org > Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 17:41:12 +0500 > Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE > > Dear IGC Members, > With reference to NN Policies Development for Global Internet Governance, I > would like to draw your kind attention for your comments to a recently > uploaded on Diplo Internet Governance Community Forum and accessible through > this url: > http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net > -neutrality-issue > > Thanks > > Imran Ahmad Shah > +92 300 4130617 > > > ____________________________________________________________< br>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ias_pk at yahoo.com Sun Sep 18 10:01:06 2011 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com (Imran Ahmed Shah) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 07:01:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE Message-ID: <1316354466.58435.yint-ygo-j2me@web161006.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Thanks Lorena and Muhammad Zahran Oh, I see. I missed to read the url correctly. I thought that you have read the note and given your argument/findings in reply. All other will also be facing same problem. Thanks again for correction. Regards Imran Ahmed Shah On Sun, 18 Sep 2011 18:13 PKT Mohamed zahran wrote: > >http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net-neutrality-issue > > >Regards, >Mohamed Zahran >Business Systems Analyst >Cell: +20129614467 > From: ias_pk at yahoo.com >To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; zads911 at msn.com >CC: imran at igfpak.org >Subject: RE: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE >Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 18:10:21 +0500 > > > >Dear Zahran It might be the problem of the Hosting Server, ISP or the Client Machine at some time, Mobile phone or the Network Operator. Blackberry also returned gateway problem. But in my experience and testing, I kept many the options before me and carefully monitored. In one case the tracert returned the requesting server on 27th hope while on other testing same url was accessible on 15th hope. Thanking you and Best RegardsImran Ahmad Shah+92 300 4130617From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Mohamed zahran >Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2011 05:44 PM >To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >Cc: imran at igfpak.org >Subject: RE: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE Dear Imran >thier is somthing woth the url it go to (page not found) > > Regards,Mohamed ZahranBusiness Systems AnalystCell: +20129614467 > > From: ias_pk at yahoo.com >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> CC: imran at igfpak.org >> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 17:41:12 +0500 >> Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE >> >> Dear IGC Members, >> With reference to NN Policies Development for Global Internet Governance, I >> would like to draw your kind attention for your comments to a recently >> uploaded on Diplo Internet Governance Community Forum and accessible through >> this url: >> http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net >> -neutrality-issue >> >> Thanks >> >> Imran Ahmad Shah >> +92 300 4130617 >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________< br>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ca at cafonso.ca Sun Sep 18 10:06:39 2011 From: ca at cafonso.ca (Carlos A. Afonso) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 11:06:39 -0300 Subject: AW: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C527@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E752A0D.9010409@cafonso.ca> <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C527@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <4E75FAEF.7010001@cafonso.ca> Dear Wolf, OK, just brief comments, as I think Marilia has already taken care of Milton's reaction. On 09/18/2011 05:42 AM, "Kleinwächter, Wolfgang" wrote: > Hi everybody > > the IBSA initiative is a good case to broaden the ongoing discussion > about global Internet Governance policy making and the development of > frameworks as it has been triggered in 2011 by the G8, OECD, Council > of Europe, the US government and the EU (with its neboulos Internet > Compact and the confusing six secret ICANN papers). Now the picture > gets more comprehensive and the only thing we are missing in this > concert is a Chinese proposal. Anybody can explain why China is > silent? Do they plan to propose something during the forthcoming G 20 > summit in Cannes? Or during the 66th UN General Assembly? Who > represents the Chinese government at the forthcoming IGF? The Chinese can explain it :) > Anyhow, the IBSA approach is interesting and I share Miltons point > that it would have been much better to involve the IGF. Unfortunately > the IBSA countries used the same approach as the G 8 (which was > widely critisized as arrogant and ignorant) and excluded > non-governmental stakeholders from the discussion. But it is still in > the early stage and there will be - hopefully - chances to correct > this. Interesting, Wolf, but I have to disagree here on two counts at least in the case of Brazil: our gov actors have been present in the IGF process, including the regional preIGFs we have been promoting (organized by CS and the so-called "technical community" by the way), and the civil society actors who are participating are in many cases long-time participants of that process (including representation in the MAG). We have here a regular dialogue with them who in several cases take the initiative to call us for meetings and dialogues -- and when they do not, we can act and receive reasonable feedback. Regarding, for example, the Latin American and Caribbean intergovernmental e-strategy called e-LAC (facilitated by ECLAC), CS has been called to participate in all of its working groups. If the initiative does not work as expected, is not only the governments' fault in this case. > For me it is unclear how the IBSA countries position themselves to > the principle of multistakeholderism (which is singled out as a key > principle in similar final documents of G 8, OECD, Council of Europe > etc.). It seems that this is at the moment a purely > inter-governmental thing. As Marilia said, there was consensus among all participants in the Rio IBSA meeting that pluralism (or multistakeholderism) is the way to go. How this will be expressed in the final statement remains to be seen, as Marilia pointed out, but it is too early to dismiss something we did not see yet. frt rgds --c.a. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 10:20:59 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 09:50:59 -0430 Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE In-Reply-To: <012501cc7604$562df160$0289d420$@yahoo.com> References: <011b01cc7600$424e3140$c6ea93c0$@yahoo.com> <012501cc7604$562df160$0289d420$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: The site Imran has suggested for discussion is hosted by ning, works best with Chrome or Firefox, and is problematical with IE, in my experience. Good luck and happy discussions! http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net-neutrality-issue Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu *Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org* On 18 September 2011 08:40, Imran Ahmed Shah wrote: > Dear Zahran **** > > It might be the problem of the Hosting Server, ISP or the Client Machine at > some time, Mobile phone or the Network Operator. Blackberry also returned > gateway problem. **** > > But in my experience and testing, I kept many the options before me and > carefully monitored. In one case the tracert returned the requesting server > on 27th hope while on other testing same url was accessible on 15th hope. > **** > > Thanking you and Best Regards**** > > Imran Ahmad Shah**** > > +92 300 4130617**** > > *From:* governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] *On > Behalf Of *Mohamed zahran > *Sent:* Sunday, September 18, 2011 05:44 PM > > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org > *Cc:* imran at igfpak.org > *Subject:* RE: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE**** > > ** ** > > Dear Imran > thier is somthing woth the url it go to (page not found) > > **** > > **** > > *Regards,***** > > Mohamed Zahran**** > > Business Systems Analyst**** > > Cell: +20129614467**** > > > **** > > > From: ias_pk at yahoo.com > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > CC: imran at igfpak.org > > Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 17:41:12 +0500 > > Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE > > > > Dear IGC Members, > > With reference to NN Policies Development for Global Internet Governance, > I > > would like to draw your kind attention for your comments to a recently > > uploaded on Diplo Internet Governance Community Forum and accessible > through > > this url: > > > http://www.diplointernetgovernance.org/profiles/blogs/a-report-on-global-net > > -neutrality-issue > > > > Thanks > > > > Imran Ahmad Shah > > +92 300 4130617 > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________< br>> You > received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > **** > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dogwallah at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 11:15:56 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 18:15:56 +0300 Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE In-Reply-To: <011b01cc7600$424e3140$c6ea93c0$@yahoo.com> References: <011b01cc7600$424e3140$c6ea93c0$@yahoo.com> Message-ID: HI Ping and traceroute are your best tools here. For example, I have different routes to yahoo and Google. For Google, my packets go to Mumbai first before they find a Google server, but my traffic to yahoo goes to London directly before NY, then Palo Alto. This is normal and not at all a NN violation. If you suspect your ISPs is a NN violator andwant to collect evidence of same, use http://www.nnsquad.org/agent. Other tools being developed by Google to detect NN violations coming soon. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ias_pk at yahoo.com Sun Sep 18 12:50:20 2011 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com (Imran Ahmed Shah) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 09:50:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE Message-ID: <1316364620.55457.yint-ygo-j2me@web161003.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Well, McTim >...my packets go to Mumbai first before they find a Google server, but my traffic to yahoo goes to London directly before NY, then Palo Alto. If your yahoo request resolved to Palo Alto Server in 15 hops normally but after some time, it starts returning the answer of same query through 27 or 30 hopes? While an other ISP still providing you the same previous reply? Thanks Imran On Sun, 18 Sep 2011 20:15 PKT McTim wrote: >HI > >Ping and traceroute are your best tools here. For example, I have >different routes to yahoo and Google. For Google, my packets go to >Mumbai first before they find a Google server, but my traffic to yahoo >goes to London directly before NY, then Palo Alto. > >This is normal and not at all a NN violation. > >If you suspect your ISPs is a NN violator andwant to collect evidence >of same, use http://www.nnsquad.org/agent. > >Other tools being developed by Google to detect NN violations coming soon. > >-- >Cheers, > >McTim >"A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A >route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From parminder at itforchange.net Sun Sep 18 12:54:11 2011 From: parminder at itforchange.net (parminder) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 22:24:11 +0530 Subject: [governance] Re: critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> Dear Milton, This will be a long (though very welcome) discussion and it catches me at a particular bad time, but let me jump in.... On Saturday 17 September 2011 11:52 PM, Milton L Mueller wrote: > > Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any > applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and > authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly > unlikely, the proposal would be very destructive. > > One notable and surprising thing: IBSA has bypassed the IGF. By > putting forward this proposal in the way it has, IBSA has openly > declared that it does not put any credibility or legitimacy in the IGF > as a forum for multistakeholder Internet policy development or > discussion. This is true because the IBSA proposal was developed > outside of IGF in an exclusive club of countries, and will not be put > forward formally at the IGF. Rather, it will be developed at the > closed IBSA summit, and then taken directly to the UN General Assembly. > Marilia and Carlos have said thing in this regard. But let me put forward some facts to you. Discussion on 'enhanced cooperation' was blocked by the MAG, its most powerful constituencies of business sector, technical sector, Northern govs et al, and not by developing countries. In the run up to the Rio IGF, during the May open consultations, it was declared by the chair of the MAG that EC disucssion neither belonged in the MAG nor in the IGF, and the two tracks are to kept seperate. (This was backed by the above mentioned groups, though it is entirely a different matter that after two years when EC actually got discussed in the IGF they changed their strategy and suddenly discovered that instead of being seperate tracks they were in fact the 'same thing'.) When ITfC proposed a workshop on EC for Hyderabad IGF, it was officially refused and we were told that EC shouldnt be discussed in the IGF. We approached Brazil and they ensured that instead of a workshop EC was discussed in a plenary session. I remember clearly the coldness towards an EC discussion at the IGF of so many civil society actors that are now wondering about why EC was not discussed at the IGF. Surprise. Surprise. Earlier Brazil made some 'bold' statements in the Rio IGF opening ceremony about looking for new directions in global IGF, for which it was almost universally made to look like an 'untouchable'. So, it is very very interesting that now Brazil and other countries are being told that they ignore the IGF, especially in terms of discussing global public policy mechanisms. Isnt it diffuct to discuss thing with people who refuse to discuss things. And that now some of them can turn back and say; why did you not discuss these things, is a testimony to the hegemonic control that is exercised on the whole arena, and rules, of discourse. On the other hand, Milton why does it not surprise you when US comes out with the International strategy for cyberspace without raising it first at the IGF, ditto for OECD (shaping a bold new extra legal and extra territorial IP enforcement regime), and for EU etc. The background paper of ITfC for the Rio meeting describes all the global IG policy making that is going on in and among the countires of the North. It is the policies made by these countries and forums that run the Internet today, these pronouncements are all about global IG, and the IBSA effort is just to seek a democratic seat at the table... So your surprise, i must say, is rather politically well informed. > > This is unacceptable to civil society. It excludes us from the entire > process. IBSA needs to be asked why it has chosen not to use a MS > forum, a forum its members helped to create, to gain agreement for > this proposal. > I understand that they will be happy to seek views. The current IBSA statement says it will take in multistakeholder views. Marilia's and my organisation are holding a workshop on insituional gaps in global IG. All are welcome. IBSA sought a global Internet related policy forum in December 2010 at EC consultations, then reiterated the call in their statement to annual ECOSOC meeting in July 2010. So the thing has been in the public domain for quite a while. IGC is welcome to discuss it. Has been welcome > The IBSA report says that "the models proposed by the WGIG provided > useful guidelines" for a new global Internet governance body. This is > a strange statement. There were four different models proposed in the > WGIG report, and most of them were inconsistent with each other. One > of the WGIG proposals explicitly stated that no new global body was > needed. So perhaps IBSA is trying to pretend that its proposal has > some kind of imprimatur from the WGIG or the WSIS. It doesn't. WGIG > couldn't agree on any of those models, that was the point of listing 4 > of them. > The statement just say the models provide useful guidelines... I do see them providing useful guidelines, for those who may want to go down one path or the other. > > The specific duties of the new global body make up an interesting > list. It will be "tasked to develop and establish international public > policies." So it makes the same stupid mistake that governments have > been making all along: it is law, i.e. rules, not "policy" that is needed. > OECD's Committee for ICCP makes Internet related policies, and I have witnessed your enthusiastic participation in the process, and never heard you badmouth the process. Milton, can you be a littlemore fair to the less powerful, > > Policy just means that a gang of governments attempts to dictate > outcomes, or alter outcomes whenever something happens that they don't > like. Law on the other hand provides a framework of clear rules that > allows individual actors guidelines and which also protects freedom. > So, then shd we together seek a global framework convention on the Internet, an idea which did interest you once? > And here's my favorite. IBSA proposes to "integrate and oversee the > bodies responsible for technical and operational functioning of the > internet, including global standards setting." So IBSA is not only > proposing to take over regulation of all the world's internet service > providers, hosting providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even > equipment suppliers, it proposes to "integrate and oversee" the IETF > as well. Presumably ICANN, too. No rationale for such a dramatic > change is put forward. > I already judged that there was a unfortunate drafting here. I know that it is not the intention to seek any overhaul of theexisting system. The Dec 2010 IBSA statement says so much and I think also 2011 ECOSOC one. What was meant, in my understanding, where the word 'integrate' is used was something like map and overview..... with a view to provide pubic interest oversight wherever necessary and required (as US gov provides in many cases at present). But I think it is a good feedback to give that the term 'integrate' simply doesnt sound too good here. > This proposal will fail to gain support from most of the > internet-using civil society, > You dont seem to have a good idea of how politically conscious and active civil society in developing countries see the democratic deficit issue vis a vis global governance. And, another minor point, we seek to represent interests of both internet using and non user groups. > it will be adamantly opposed by the technical community, and it will > have very little support from the academic community. > again, a presumption. > > Needless to say, all Internet businesses will oppose it, > they oppose your proposal to strengthen IGF into a soft power body as well. So? > and so will most governments outside the IBSA orbit. > You think so. Are you ready for a vote in the General assembly? :) . I see you chickening out of your statement already. Or perhaps when you think governments you think just the powerful northern ones, parminder > > Milton L. Mueller > > Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies > > Internet Governance Project > > http://blog.internetgovernance.org > > On Saturday 17 September 2011 01:40 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: > > Hello everybody, > > I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on > global Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in > the beginning of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have > prevented me to report the discussions with the depth and length I > would like to, but I have written a blog post about it to the site of > the Brazilian Observatory of Digital policies, which has been > circulating on Twitter recently: > http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance > > I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if > time allows) or in Nairobi. > > Best wishes, > Marília > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From parminder at itforchange.net Sun Sep 18 12:58:34 2011 From: parminder at itforchange.net (parminder) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 22:28:34 +0530 Subject: AW: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C527@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E752A0D.9010409@cafonso.ca> <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C527@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <4E76233A.9050600@itforchange.net> Hi Wolfgang, Thanks for your view below. Just two points for the present. First, about your preference for multistakeholder policy development and the embedding of treaty devleopment into a multistakeholder environment, and your wondering about IBSA's position on this. I think IBSA position is clear when it has repeatedly stated that enhanced cooperation and IGF are distinct but complementary processes. This to me look almost excat translation of the principle you state into a practical mechanism. Dont you think so? I think you need to wonder more abut the position of Northen governments on this issue and that of the business community, and of course many CS participants in and outside IGC. I can see that anyone who would go by the principles you lay above would like to strengthen IGFs output making capacity, and the only real way that a global multistakeholder process can substantively impact global IG policy making. IBSA countries have been advocating strong improvements in the IGF in this regard. You know who has bene opposing. And unfortunately many of the CS sit on the fence in this regard. I will like your clarification on this point. Second, about >It would be good if the IBSA countries could fully support the report of the the Human Rights Rapporteur Frank La Reau with regard to>Internet Freedoms, as discussed in the UN Human Rights Council. All the three IBSA countries are among the 40 who endorsed Frank's report Also want to talk about why Northern governments look for soft (or non) laws in IG areas and extra hard laws in IP and trade areas (in IP, the issue of border seizures, in trade, the new requirement that Northen companies should be able to sue developing country governments if they apply a social policy that impacted the companies' business etc). When it is the 'regime shaping' stage, as in IG, they want to keep things to themselves and are not too eager about international laws. When regimes mature and are largely unchangeable from their dominant mode, it shifts to 'regime enforcement' stage, and Northern governments want strong international laws, including as many countries as possible. We cant put our head in the sand and speak the dominant discourse of IG, led and shaped by the most powerful, unmindful of where the rest of the world is going.... I think we need to take a more nuanced view of global governance and its real politiks, and in this regard, as a generic civil society value, be on the side of the less powerful than of the more powerful, in most situations. Parminder On Sunday 18 September 2011 02:12 PM, "Kleinwächter, Wolfgang" wrote: > Hi everybody > > the IBSA initiative is a good case to broaden the ongoing discussion about global Internet Governance policy making and the development of frameworks as it has been triggered in 2011 by the G8, OECD, Council of Europe, the US government and the EU (with its neboulos Internet Compact and the confusing six secret ICANN papers). Now the picture gets more comprehensive and the only thing we are missing in this concert is a Chinese proposal. Anybody can explain why China is silent? Do they plan to propose something during the forthcoming G 20 summit in Cannes? Or during the 66th UN General Assembly? Who represents the Chinese government at the forthcoming IGF? > > Anyhow, the IBSA approach is interesting and I share Miltons point that it would have been much better to involve the IGF. Unfortunately the IBSA countries used the same approach as the G 8 (which was widely critisized as arrogant and ignorant) and excluded non-governmental stakeholders from the discussion. But it is still in the early stage and there will be - hopefully - chances to correct this. > > For me it is unclear how the IBSA countries position themselves to the principle of multistakeholderism (which is singled out as a key principle in similar final documents of G 8, OECD, Council of Europe etc.). It seems that this is at the moment a purely inter-governmental thing. > > However the IBSA Rio Recommendation (September 2, 2011) includes in its 4th paragraph the formuation that the IBSA meeting stressed "to ensure that Internet Governance is transparent, democratic, multistakeholder and multilateral as mandated by the Tunis Agenda." This is interesting. The original text of the Tunis Agenda (para. 48) is "The international management of the Internet should be multilateral, transparent and democratic, with the full involvement of governments, the private sector, civil society and international organizations." Some people will remember the hot dispute among the words "multilateral" (inter-state) and "multistakeholder" (governments and non-governmental groups). > > If I compare the two formulations than I see that the IBSA countries goe beyond the Tunis agenda by putting "multistakeholder" before "multilateral" and giving "Transparency" and "Democracy" first priority. This is good. And this reflects also a discussion we had during the IGF workshop in San Francisco where I got a question (from a Brazilian friend) how I see the future of the intergovernmental treaty system (under international law) in the future of Internet regulation. My answer was that intergovernmental treaties will not disappear and will play an even greater role, but they will be and has to be "embedded" into a multistakeholder environment. One could conclude form here, that "policies" has to be developed in a multistakeholder transparent bottom up way but if it comes to binding decision, than governments have to take the lead and have to translate policies into law (which are legally binding treaties). > > This seems for me a rational approach. What I miss in the IBSA project is that they do not make clear to distinction between multistakeholder policy development and multilateral treaty (law) making. I hope that the IBSA countries will open the discussuion on this issue on October 18, 2011 in Durban to non-governmental stakeholders (at best from all over the world /as the Council of Europe did in April 2011 in Strasbourg/ and at least from their own countries). > > It remains to be seen how far we can come with Internet treaties, taking into account also the Russian initiative in the 1st Committee of the UN General Assembly. Nevertheless I remain sceptical with regard to intergovernmental treaties (hard law). It will eat away years to reach a very general consensus among 190+ nation states and probably another decade until a relevant number of national parliaments have ratified such a treaty to become binding law. Soft Law in form of policy guidelines are probably more efficient (and flexible, as McTim has pointed out), but such policies should be developed bottom up with the inclusion of all stakeholders (and not top down behind closed doors by one stakeholder group alone). > > BTW another point I miss in the IBSA declaration is a reference to human rights. For the 47 member states of the Council of Europe the protection of Human Rights has the first priority in Internet policy making. It would be good if the IBSA countries could fully support the report of the the Human Rights Rapporteur Frank La Reau with regard to Internet Freedoms, as discussed in the UN Human Rights Council. > > Anyhow, interesting phase of Internet Governance Policies. > > Wolfgang > ________________________________ > > Von: governance at lists.cpsr.org im Auftrag von Carlos A. Afonso > Gesendet: So 18.09.2011 01:15 > An: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Rui Correia > Betreff: Re: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal > > > > While I wonder if I should delve my spoon into this complicated soup, > here is the official IBAS/IBSA site URL: > > http://www.ibsa-trilateral.org/ > > A Southern Trilateral, how about that? :) > > frt rgds > > --c.a. > > On 09/17/2011 06:59 PM, Rui Correia wrote: > >> Hi >> >> Just in case anybody is wondering what IBSA is, it stands for >> India-Brasil-SouthAfrica, >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India-Brazil-South_Africa_Dialogue_Forum(English) >> http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/F%C3%B3rum_de_Di%C3%A1logo_%C3%8Dndia-Brasil-%C3%81frica_do_Sul(Portuguese) >> >> Not to be confused with the better known BRIC - Brasil-Russia-India-China; >> or >> BRICS - Brasil-Russia-India-China-SouthAfrica >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRIC (English) >> http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRIC (Portuguese) >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRICS (English) >> http://pt.wikipedia.org/wiki/BRICS (Portuguese) >> >> Regards, great weekend >> Um abraço, bom fim de semana >> >> Rui >> >> 2011/9/17 Milton L Mueller >> >> >>> Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any >>> applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and >>> authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly unlikely, >>> the proposal would be very destructive. **** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> One notable and surprising thing: IBSA has bypassed the IGF. By putting >>> forward this proposal in the way it has, IBSA has openly declared that it >>> does not put any credibility or legitimacy in the IGF as a forum for >>> multistakeholder Internet policy development or discussion. This is true >>> because the IBSA proposal was developed outside of IGF in an exclusive club >>> of countries, and will not be put forward formally at the IGF. Rather, it >>> will be developed at the closed IBSA summit, and then taken directly to the >>> UN General Assembly. **** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> This is unacceptable to civil society. It excludes us from the entire >>> process. IBSA needs to be asked why it has chosen not to use a MS forum, a >>> forum its members helped to create, to gain agreement for this proposal.** >>> ** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> The IBSA report says that "the models proposed by the WGIG provided useful >>> guidelines" for a new global Internet governance body. This is a strange >>> statement. There were four different models proposed in the WGIG report, and >>> most of them were inconsistent with each other. One of the WGIG proposals >>> explicitly stated that no new global body was needed. So perhaps IBSA is >>> trying to pretend that its proposal has some kind of imprimatur from the >>> WGIG or the WSIS. It doesn't. WGIG couldn't agree on any of those models, >>> that was the point of listing 4 of them.**** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> The specific duties of the new global body make up an interesting list. It >>> will be "tasked to develop and establish international public policies." So >>> it makes the same stupid mistake that governments have been making all >>> along: it is law, i.e. rules, not "policy" that is needed. Policy just means >>> that a gang of governments attempts to dictate outcomes, or alter outcomes >>> whenever something happens that they don't like. Law on the other hand >>> provides a framework of clear rules that allows individual actors guidelines >>> and which also protects freedom. **** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> And here's my favorite. IBSA proposes to "integrate and oversee the bodies >>> responsible for technical and operational functioning of the internet, >>> including global standards setting." So IBSA is not only proposing to take >>> over regulation of all the world's internet service providers, hosting >>> providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it >>> proposes to "integrate and oversee" the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, too. >>> No rationale for such a dramatic change is put forward. **** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> This proposal will fail to gain support from most of the internet-using >>> civil society, it will be adamantly opposed by the technical community, and >>> it will have very little support from the academic community. Needless to >>> say, all Internet businesses will oppose it, and so will most governments >>> outside the IBSA orbit.**** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> Milton L. Mueller**** >>> >>> Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies**** >>> >>> Internet Governance Project**** >>> >>> http://blog.internetgovernance.org **** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> ** ** >>> >>> On Saturday 17 September 2011 01:40 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: **** >>> >>> Hello everybody, >>> >>> I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on global >>> Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in the beginning >>> of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have prevented me to report the >>> discussions with the depth and length I would like to, but I have written a >>> blog post about it to the site of the Brazilian Observatory of Digital >>> policies, which has been circulating on Twitter recently: >>> >>> http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance >>> >>> I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if time >>> allows) or in Nairobi. >>> >>> Best wishes, >>> Marília >>> >>> **** >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dogwallah at gmail.com Sun Sep 18 13:14:25 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 20:14:25 +0300 Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE In-Reply-To: <1316364620.55457.yint-ygo-j2me@web161003.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> References: <1316364620.55457.yint-ygo-j2me@web161003.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 7:50 PM, Imran Ahmed Shah wrote: > Well, McTim >>...my packets go to > Mumbai first before they find a Google server, but my traffic to yahoo > goes to London directly before NY, then Palo Alto. > > If your yahoo request resolved to Palo Alto Server in 15 hops normally but > after some time, it starts returning the answer of same query through 27 or 30 hopes? Your upstream doesn't control this (unless the extra hops are in their own network). Normally your ISP will have at least 2 connections to the Internet (transit providers). Sounds like the the 15 hop route is done by one of their transit providers and the 27 hop route is done by the second. > While an other ISP still providing you the same previous reply? They are using a different transit provider. Doesn't sound like a NN violation to me. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From roland at internetpolicyagency.com Sun Sep 18 13:22:26 2011 From: roland at internetpolicyagency.com (Roland Perry) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 18:22:26 +0100 Subject: [governance] Re: critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> Message-ID: In message <4E762233.9020601 at itforchange.net>, at 22:24:11 on Sun, 18 Sep 2011, parminder writes >On the other hand, Milton why does it not surprise you when US comes >out with the International strategy for cyberspace without raising it >first at the IGF, ditto for OECD (shaping a bold new extra legal and >extra territorial IP enforcement regime) Actually, OECD had a workshop on that exact topic (if you mean the Liability of Intermediaries) at IGF last year. And of course civil society has their own representation at the table (CSISAC), even if they didn't agree with the communique issued by OECD earlier this year. -- Roland Perry ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From katitza at eff.org Sun Sep 18 13:26:56 2011 From: katitza at eff.org (Katitza Rodriguez) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 10:26:56 -0700 Subject: [governance] Re: critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <4E7629E0.4040204@eff.org> Hi Parminder, We have shout loudly when we do not agree with issues at the OECD. Here is a summary of other post other NGOs have written about. http://csisac.org/2011/06/csisac_declines_to_support_oec.php Copyright is also one of the issues at stake in this overall mess. :) Best, Katitza On 9/18/11 10:22 AM, Roland Perry wrote: > In message <4E762233.9020601 at itforchange.net>, at 22:24:11 on Sun, 18 > Sep 2011, parminder writes >> On the other hand, Milton why does it not surprise you when US comes >> out with the International strategy for cyberspace without raising it >> first at the IGF, ditto for OECD (shaping a bold new extra legal and >> extra territorial IP enforcement regime) > > Actually, OECD had a workshop on that exact topic (if you mean the > Liability of Intermediaries) at IGF last year. And of course civil > society has their own representation at the table (CSISAC), even if > they didn't agree with the communique issued by OECD earlier this year. -- Katitza Rodriguez International Rights Director Electronic Frontier Foundation katitza at eff.org katitza at datos-personales.org (personal email) Please support EFF - Working to protect your digital rights and freedom of speech since 1990 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ias_pk at yahoo.com Sun Sep 18 13:41:54 2011 From: ias_pk at yahoo.com (Imran Ahmed Shah) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 10:41:54 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [governance] A REPORT ON GLOBAL NET NEUTRALITY ISSUE Message-ID: <1316367714.4965.yint-ygo-j2me@web161007.mail.bf1.yahoo.com> Well, But if your http request to diplointernetgovernance.org is permanently blocked for your ISP' IP, and only successful when you change the client's IP or the ISP? On Sun, 18 Sep 2011 22:14 PKT McTim wrote: >On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 7:50 PM, Imran Ahmed Shah wrote: >> Well, McTim >>>...my packets go to >> Mumbai first before they find a Google server, but my traffic to yahoo >> goes to London directly before NY, then Palo Alto. >> >> If your yahoo request resolved to Palo Alto Server in 15 hops normally but >> after some time, it starts returning the answer of same query through 27 or 30 hopes? > > >Your upstream doesn't control this (unless the extra hops are in their >own network). Normally your ISP will have at least 2 connections to >the Internet (transit providers). Sounds like the the 15 hop route is >done by one of their transit providers and the 27 hop route is done by >the second. > > >> While an other ISP still providing you the same previous reply? > >They are using a different transit provider. Doesn't sound like a NN >violation to me. > >-- >Cheers, > >McTim >"A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A >route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > >For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > >Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de Sun Sep 18 14:31:21 2011 From: wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=22Kleinw=E4chter=2C_Wolfgang=22?=) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 20:31:21 +0200 Subject: AW: AW: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E752A0D.9010409@cafonso.ca> <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C527@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> <4E75FAEF.7010001@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A8D2C528@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Thanks Carlos this is a helpful clarification and give the (regional) civil society engagement, as described in your mail, gives the whole üprocess certainly a hiogher degree of credibility. Good stuff for the Nairobi discussions. w ________________________________ Von: governance at lists.cpsr.org im Auftrag von Carlos A. Afonso Gesendet: So 18.09.2011 16:06 An: Kleinwächter, Wolfgang Cc: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Rui Correia Betreff: Re: AW: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal Dear Wolf, OK, just brief comments, as I think Marilia has already taken care of Milton's reaction. On 09/18/2011 05:42 AM, "Kleinwächter, Wolfgang" wrote: > Hi everybody > > the IBSA initiative is a good case to broaden the ongoing discussion > about global Internet Governance policy making and the development of > frameworks as it has been triggered in 2011 by the G8, OECD, Council > of Europe, the US government and the EU (with its neboulos Internet > Compact and the confusing six secret ICANN papers). Now the picture > gets more comprehensive and the only thing we are missing in this > concert is a Chinese proposal. Anybody can explain why China is > silent? Do they plan to propose something during the forthcoming G 20 > summit in Cannes? Or during the 66th UN General Assembly? Who > represents the Chinese government at the forthcoming IGF? The Chinese can explain it :) > Anyhow, the IBSA approach is interesting and I share Miltons point > that it would have been much better to involve the IGF. Unfortunately > the IBSA countries used the same approach as the G 8 (which was > widely critisized as arrogant and ignorant) and excluded > non-governmental stakeholders from the discussion. But it is still in > the early stage and there will be - hopefully - chances to correct > this. Interesting, Wolf, but I have to disagree here on two counts at least in the case of Brazil: our gov actors have been present in the IGF process, including the regional preIGFs we have been promoting (organized by CS and the so-called "technical community" by the way), and the civil society actors who are participating are in many cases long-time participants of that process (including representation in the MAG). We have here a regular dialogue with them who in several cases take the initiative to call us for meetings and dialogues -- and when they do not, we can act and receive reasonable feedback. Regarding, for example, the Latin American and Caribbean intergovernmental e-strategy called e-LAC (facilitated by ECLAC), CS has been called to participate in all of its working groups. If the initiative does not work as expected, is not only the governments' fault in this case. > For me it is unclear how the IBSA countries position themselves to > the principle of multistakeholderism (which is singled out as a key > principle in similar final documents of G 8, OECD, Council of Europe > etc.). It seems that this is at the moment a purely > inter-governmental thing. As Marilia said, there was consensus among all participants in the Rio IBSA meeting that pluralism (or multistakeholderism) is the way to go. How this will be expressed in the final statement remains to be seen, as Marilia pointed out, but it is too early to dismiss something we did not see yet. frt rgds --c.a. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ggithaiga at hotmail.com Sun Sep 18 18:37:51 2011 From: ggithaiga at hotmail.com (Grace Githaiga) Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 22:37:51 +0000 Subject: [governance] Kenya: ICT policy, visa and Nairobi weather In-Reply-To: <3D7EED1A-78AF-42B7-B101-B6D010C1FCF0@uzh.ch> References: ,<3D7EED1A-78AF-42B7-B101-B6D010C1FCF0@uzh.ch> Message-ID: William The cost is US 50 on arrival. But if you applied elsewhere, they may have factored admin costs :)... Rgds Grace ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! From: william.drake at uzh.ch Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 13:37:58 +0200 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ajp at glocom.ac.jp Subject: Re: [governance] Kenya: ICT policy, visa and Nairobi weather Adam, On Sep 18, 2011, at 1:20 PM, Adam Peake wrote: I've just arrived in Nairobi: Visa on arrival (if your country's listed ) is simple. Costs US$50 (also seem to take Euro, cost is 40, and UK pounds, cost 30, but dollars a more useful currency to have.) I paid 70 CHF ($80). Think I can get them to refund the difference? :-) BD -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From vinsolo15 at yahoo.co.uk Mon Sep 19 01:31:12 2011 From: vinsolo15 at yahoo.co.uk (vincent solomon) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 06:31:12 +0100 (BST) Subject: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? In-Reply-To: References: ,<4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <1316410272.57777.YahooMailNeo@web29004.mail.ird.yahoo.com> 1. Name that appears on the passport : ALIAMA VINCENT SOLOMON 2. Passport number : B07977992 3. Nationality : Ugandan Your help is welcome . Thanks . “Limitations live only in our minds. But if we use our imaginations, our possibilities become limitless” NAME: VINCENT SOLOMON ALIAMA CONTACT: +256 773307045 / +256 713307045 / +256 753307045 EMAIL:aliama.vincent at cit.mak.ac.ug / vinsolo15 at yahoo.co.uk /vinsoloster at gmail.com Skype : vinsolo2 ________________________________ From: Grace Githaiga To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Sent: Saturday, 17 September 2011, 20:23 Subject: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? Colleagues   Greetings.   This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the immigrations officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like the IGF secretariat in Kenya to compile a list of those who have not gotten a visa (if you belong to a country that requires this) and would need facilitation. I am compiling a list for them and would request that anyone who thinks they need this facilitation to kindly email me the following details:   1. Name as it appears on passport 2. Passport number 3 Nationality.   We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing facilitation to provide me with their details latest monday evening.   Rgds Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee.     ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World!   ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit:     http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see:     http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From william.drake at uzh.ch Mon Sep 19 02:11:24 2011 From: william.drake at uzh.ch (William Drake) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 08:11:24 +0200 Subject: [governance] Kenya: ICT policy, visa and Nairobi weather In-Reply-To: References: ,<3D7EED1A-78AF-42B7-B101-B6D010C1FCF0@uzh.ch> Message-ID: Hi Grace Sorry, I was just grumbling. It's Geneva… Cheers, Bill On Sep 19, 2011, at 12:37 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: > > William > The cost is US 50 on arrival. But if you applied elsewhere, they may have factored admin costs :)... > Rgds > Grace > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! > > > From: william.drake at uzh.ch > Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2011 13:37:58 +0200 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ajp at glocom.ac.jp > Subject: Re: [governance] Kenya: ICT policy, visa and Nairobi weather > > Adam, > > On Sep 18, 2011, at 1:20 PM, Adam Peake wrote: > > I've just arrived in Nairobi: Visa on arrival (if your country's listed ) is simple. Costs US$50 (also seem to take Euro, cost is 40, and UK pounds, cost 30, but dollars a more useful currency to have.) > > I paid 70 CHF ($80). Think I can get them to refund the difference? :-) > > BD > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From raul at lacnic.net Mon Sep 19 11:12:16 2011 From: raul at lacnic.net (Raul Echeberria) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 12:12:16 -0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <60809A11-1920-477D-A675-03E862C17114@lacnic.net> Parminder: I have been member of the IGF MAG since the beginning and It is not true that the Internet technical community has opposed to discuss about the concept of Enhanced Cooperation. I myself have participated in many discussion in the IGF in workshops and also in the plenary sessions about EC, and the NRO has never opposed neither we oppose to have such discussion in IGF. Raúl El 18/09/2011, a las 13:54, parminder escribió: > Dear Milton, > > This will be a long (though very welcome) discussion and it catches me at a particular bad time, but let me jump in.... > > On Saturday 17 September 2011 11:52 PM, Milton L Mueller wrote: >> >> Some first reactions to the IBSA proposal. You will not be hearing any applause from me. The proposal is unimaginative, backward-looking, and authoritarian. If it were actually implemented, which is highly unlikely, the proposal would be very destructive. >> >> One notable and surprising thing: IBSA has bypassed the IGF. By putting forward this proposal in the way it has, IBSA has openly declared that it does not put any credibility or legitimacy in the IGF as a forum for multistakeholder Internet policy development or discussion. This is true because the IBSA proposal was developed outside of IGF in an exclusive club of countries, and will not be put forward formally at the IGF. Rather, it will be developed at the closed IBSA summit, and then taken directly to the UN General Assembly. > Marilia and Carlos have said thing in this regard. But let me put forward some facts to you. Discussion on 'enhanced cooperation' was blocked by the MAG, its most powerful constituencies of business sector, technical sector, Northern govs et al, and not by developing countries. In the run up to the Rio IGF, during the May open consultations, it was declared by the chair of the MAG that EC disucssion neither belonged in the MAG nor in the IGF, and the two tracks are to kept seperate. (This was backed by the above mentioned groups, though it is entirely a different matter that after two years when EC actually got discussed in the IGF they changed their strategy and suddenly discovered that instead of being seperate tracks they were in fact the 'same thing'.) When ITfC proposed a workshop on EC for Hyderabad IGF, it was officially refused and we were told that EC shouldnt be discussed in the IGF. We approached Brazil and they ensured that instead of a workshop EC was discussed in a plenary session. I remember clearly the coldness towards an EC discussion at the IGF of so many civil society actors that are now wondering about why EC was not discussed at the IGF. Surprise. Surprise. Earlier Brazil made some 'bold' statements in the Rio IGF opening ceremony about looking for new directions in global IGF, for which it was almost universally made to look like an 'untouchable'. So, it is very very interesting that now Brazil and other countries are being told that they ignore the IGF, especially in terms of discussing global public policy mechanisms. Isnt it diffuct to discuss thing with people who refuse to discuss things. And that now some of them can turn back and say; why did you not discuss these things, is a testimony to the hegemonic control that is exercised on the whole arena, and rules, of discourse. > > On the other hand, Milton why does it not surprise you when US comes out with the International strategy for cyberspace without raising it first at the IGF, ditto for OECD (shaping a bold new extra legal and extra territorial IP enforcement regime), and for EU etc. The background paper of ITfC for the Rio meeting describes all the global IG policy making that is going on in and among the countires of the North. > > It is the policies made by these countries and forums that run the Internet today, these pronouncements are all about global IG, and the IBSA effort is just to seek a democratic seat at the table... So your surprise, i must say, is rather politically well informed. >> >> This is unacceptable to civil society. It excludes us from the entire process. IBSA needs to be asked why it has chosen not to use a MS forum, a forum its members helped to create, to gain agreement for this proposal. > I understand that they will be happy to seek views. The current IBSA statement says it will take in multistakeholder views. Marilia's and my organisation are holding a workshop on insituional gaps in global IG. All are welcome. IBSA sought a global Internet related policy forum in December 2010 at EC consultations, then reiterated the call in their statement to annual ECOSOC meeting in July 2010. So the thing has been in the public domain for quite a while. IGC is welcome to discuss it. Has been welcome > >> >> The IBSA report says that “the models proposed by the WGIG provided useful guidelines” for a new global Internet governance body. This is a strange statement. There were four different models proposed in the WGIG report, and most of them were inconsistent with each other. One of the WGIG proposals explicitly stated that no new global body was needed. So perhaps IBSA is trying to pretend that its proposal has some kind of imprimatur from the WGIG or the WSIS. It doesn’t. WGIG couldn’t agree on any of those models, that was the point of listing 4 of them. > > The statement just say the models provide useful guidelines... I do see them providing useful guidelines, for those who may want to go down one path or the other. >> >> The specific duties of the new global body make up an interesting list. It will be “tasked to develop and establish international public policies.” So it makes the same stupid mistake that governments have been making all along: it is law, i.e. rules, not “policy” that is needed. > > OECD's Committee for ICCP makes Internet related policies, and I have witnessed your enthusiastic participation in the process, and never heard you badmouth the process. Milton, can you be a littlemore fair to the less powerful, >> Policy just means that a gang of governments attempts to dictate outcomes, or alter outcomes whenever something happens that they don’t like. Law on the other hand provides a framework of clear rules that allows individual actors guidelines and which also protects freedom. > So, then shd we together seek a global framework convention on the Internet, an idea which did interest you once? > >> >> And here’s my favorite. IBSA proposes to “integrate and oversee the bodies responsible for technical and operational functioning of the internet, including global standards setting.” So IBSA is not only proposing to take over regulation of all the world’s internet service providers, hosting providers, mobile networks, and perhaps even equipment suppliers, it proposes to “integrate and oversee” the IETF as well. Presumably ICANN, too. No rationale for such a dramatic change is put forward. > I already judged that there was a unfortunate drafting here. I know that it is not the intention to seek any overhaul of theexisting system. The Dec 2010 IBSA statement says so much and I think also 2011 ECOSOC one. What was meant, in my understanding, where the word 'integrate' is used was something like map and overview..... with a view to provide pubic interest oversight wherever necessary and required (as US gov provides in many cases at present). But I think it is a good feedback to give that the term 'integrate' simply doesnt sound too good here. > >> >> This proposal will fail to gain support from most of the internet-using civil society, > You dont seem to have a good idea of how politically conscious and active civil society in developing countries see the democratic deficit issue vis a vis global governance. And, another minor point, we seek to represent interests of both internet using and non user groups. > >> it will be adamantly opposed by the technical community, and it will have very little support from the academic community. > > again, a presumption. >> Needless to say, all Internet businesses will oppose it, > > they oppose your proposal to strengthen IGF into a soft power body as well. So? > > > >> and so will most governments outside the IBSA orbit. > > You think so. Are you ready for a vote in the General assembly? :) . I see you chickening out of your statement already. Or perhaps when you think governments you think just the powerful northern ones, > > parminder >> >> >> Milton L. Mueller >> Professor, Syracuse University School of Information Studies >> Internet Governance Project >> http://blog.internetgovernance.org >> >> >> >> On Saturday 17 September 2011 01:40 AM, Marilia Maciel wrote: >> Hello everybody, >> >> I would like to share with you some news about the IBSA seminar on global Internet governance that took place in FGV-Rio de Janeiro in the beginning of this month. Tight schedule and deadlines have prevented me to report the discussions with the depth and length I would like to, but I have written a blog post about it to the site of the Brazilian Observatory of Digital policies, which has been circulating on Twitter recently: >> http://observatoriodainternet.br/discussions-and-recommendations-from-the-ibsa-seminar-on-internet-governance >> >> I will be happy to talk more about it and share impressions here (if time allows) or in Nairobi. >> >> Best wishes, >> Marília >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > Raul Twitter @raulecheberria -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From dogwallah at gmail.com Mon Sep 19 11:46:25 2011 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 18:46:25 +0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <60809A11-1920-477D-A675-03E862C17114@lacnic.net> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> <60809A11-1920-477D-A675-03E862C17114@lacnic.net> Message-ID: Hi Raul, Thanks for the clarification. I suspect Parminder et. al., who do not (or cannot) see EC going on understand EC as something totally different from the way you and I define it (our definitions may also be divergent). As Adam has pointed out, it's not well defined. Those of us who pay attention know how many resources the NRO and it's members put into EC activities, to wit: AfWG- AfriNIC Government Working Group, RIPE NCC Government roundtables, AGWG- ARIN Government Working Group, LACNIC has a whole list of them here: http://lacnic.net/en/acuerdos/index.html, AfriNIC signs a Memorandum of Understanding with the Commonwealth Telecommunications Organisation: http://www.afrinic.net/press_release_cto_mou_25082011.htm and NRO participated at OECD High Level Meeting, 27-28 June http://www.nro.net/news/nro-participated-at-oecd-high-level-meeting-27-28-june etc, etc If you are interested there is a wealth of EC activity going on, one just has to want to recognise it. In any case, I look forward to seeing you next week and many thanks for your extraordinary efforts as NRO Chair. -- Cheers, McTim "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A route indicates how we get there."  Jon Postel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From raul at lacnic.net Mon Sep 19 12:04:41 2011 From: raul at lacnic.net (Raul Echeberria) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 13:04:41 -0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> <60809A11-1920-477D-A675-03E862C17114@lacnic.net> Message-ID: Mc. Tim You are right, there is not a single view about EC. As a signal of my willingness to discuss the topic, I wrote this article in 2008. http://raul.echeberria.org/2008/12/enhanced-cooperation-its-meaning-and-progress/ It is a bit outdated, but the essence remains the same. So you can see what is my view about Enhanced Cooperation. Best, Raúl El 19/09/2011, a las 12:46, McTim escribió: > Hi Raul, > > Thanks for the clarification. > > I suspect Parminder et. al., who do not (or cannot) see EC going on > understand EC as something totally different from the way you and I > define it (our definitions may also be divergent). As Adam has > pointed out, it's not well defined. > > Those of us who pay attention know how many resources the NRO and it's > members put into EC activities, to wit: > > AfWG- AfriNIC Government Working Group, RIPE NCC Government > roundtables, AGWG- ARIN Government Working Group, LACNIC has a whole > list of them here: > http://lacnic.net/en/acuerdos/index.html, > > AfriNIC signs a Memorandum of Understanding with the Commonwealth > Telecommunications Organisation: > http://www.afrinic.net/press_release_cto_mou_25082011.htm > > and > NRO participated at OECD High Level Meeting, 27-28 June > http://www.nro.net/news/nro-participated-at-oecd-high-level-meeting-27-28-june > > etc, etc > > If you are interested there is a wealth of EC activity going on, one > just has to want to recognise it. > > In any case, I look forward to seeing you next week and many thanks > for your extraordinary efforts as NRO Chair. > > > -- > Cheers, > > McTim > "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A > route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t Raul Twitter @raulecheberria ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ca at cafonso.ca Mon Sep 19 14:31:43 2011 From: ca at cafonso.ca (Carlos A. Afonso) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 15:31:43 -0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> <60809A11-1920-477D-A675-03E862C17114@lacnic.net> Message-ID: <4E778A8F.9@cafonso.ca> Nor about the so-called "technical community", bu the way... --c.a. On 09/19/2011 01:04 PM, Raul Echeberria wrote: > > Mc. Tim > > You are right, there is not a single view about EC. > As a signal of my willingness to discuss the topic, I wrote this article in 2008. > > http://raul.echeberria.org/2008/12/enhanced-cooperation-its-meaning-and-progress/ > > It is a bit outdated, but the essence remains the same. So you can see what is my view about Enhanced Cooperation. > > Best, > > Raúl > > > > El 19/09/2011, a las 12:46, McTim escribió: > >> Hi Raul, >> >> Thanks for the clarification. >> >> I suspect Parminder et. al., who do not (or cannot) see EC going on >> understand EC as something totally different from the way you and I >> define it (our definitions may also be divergent). As Adam has >> pointed out, it's not well defined. >> >> Those of us who pay attention know how many resources the NRO and it's >> members put into EC activities, to wit: >> >> AfWG- AfriNIC Government Working Group, RIPE NCC Government >> roundtables, AGWG- ARIN Government Working Group, LACNIC has a whole >> list of them here: >> http://lacnic.net/en/acuerdos/index.html, >> >> AfriNIC signs a Memorandum of Understanding with the Commonwealth >> Telecommunications Organisation: >> http://www.afrinic.net/press_release_cto_mou_25082011.htm >> >> and >> NRO participated at OECD High Level Meeting, 27-28 June >> http://www.nro.net/news/nro-participated-at-oecd-high-level-meeting-27-28-june >> >> etc, etc >> >> If you are interested there is a wealth of EC activity going on, one >> just has to want to recognise it. >> >> In any case, I look forward to seeing you next week and many thanks >> for your extraordinary efforts as NRO Chair. >> >> >> -- >> Cheers, >> >> McTim >> "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A >> route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > Raul > Twitter @raulecheberria > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ca at cafonso.ca Mon Sep 19 14:31:58 2011 From: ca at cafonso.ca (Carlos A. Afonso) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 15:31:58 -0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> <60809A11-1920-477D-A675-03E862C17114@lacnic.net> Message-ID: <4E778A9E.5030000@cafonso.ca> Nor about the so-called "technical community", by the way... --c.a. On 09/19/2011 01:04 PM, Raul Echeberria wrote: > > Mc. Tim > > You are right, there is not a single view about EC. > As a signal of my willingness to discuss the topic, I wrote this article in 2008. > > http://raul.echeberria.org/2008/12/enhanced-cooperation-its-meaning-and-progress/ > > It is a bit outdated, but the essence remains the same. So you can see what is my view about Enhanced Cooperation. > > Best, > > Raúl > > > > El 19/09/2011, a las 12:46, McTim escribió: > >> Hi Raul, >> >> Thanks for the clarification. >> >> I suspect Parminder et. al., who do not (or cannot) see EC going on >> understand EC as something totally different from the way you and I >> define it (our definitions may also be divergent). As Adam has >> pointed out, it's not well defined. >> >> Those of us who pay attention know how many resources the NRO and it's >> members put into EC activities, to wit: >> >> AfWG- AfriNIC Government Working Group, RIPE NCC Government >> roundtables, AGWG- ARIN Government Working Group, LACNIC has a whole >> list of them here: >> http://lacnic.net/en/acuerdos/index.html, >> >> AfriNIC signs a Memorandum of Understanding with the Commonwealth >> Telecommunications Organisation: >> http://www.afrinic.net/press_release_cto_mou_25082011.htm >> >> and >> NRO participated at OECD High Level Meeting, 27-28 June >> http://www.nro.net/news/nro-participated-at-oecd-high-level-meeting-27-28-june >> >> etc, etc >> >> If you are interested there is a wealth of EC activity going on, one >> just has to want to recognise it. >> >> In any case, I look forward to seeing you next week and many thanks >> for your extraordinary efforts as NRO Chair. >> >> >> -- >> Cheers, >> >> McTim >> "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A >> route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > Raul > Twitter @raulecheberria > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From raul at lacnic.net Mon Sep 19 14:36:36 2011 From: raul at lacnic.net (Raul Echeberria) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 15:36:36 -0300 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <4E778A9E.5030000@cafonso.ca> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> <60809A11-1920-477D-A675-03E862C17114@lacnic.net> <4E778A9E.5030000@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: <9661E268-F8FC-4666-91BE-1ABF3DDF2C3F@lacnic.net> Carlos: I don't understand what you mean. Raúl El 19/09/2011, a las 15:31, Carlos A. Afonso escribió: > Nor about the so-called "technical community", by the way... > > --c.a. > > On 09/19/2011 01:04 PM, Raul Echeberria wrote: >> >> Mc. Tim >> >> You are right, there is not a single view about EC. >> As a signal of my willingness to discuss the topic, I wrote this article in 2008. >> >> http://raul.echeberria.org/2008/12/enhanced-cooperation-its-meaning-and-progress/ >> >> It is a bit outdated, but the essence remains the same. So you can see what is my view about Enhanced Cooperation. >> >> Best, >> >> Raúl >> >> >> >> El 19/09/2011, a las 12:46, McTim escribió: >> >>> Hi Raul, >>> >>> Thanks for the clarification. >>> >>> I suspect Parminder et. al., who do not (or cannot) see EC going on >>> understand EC as something totally different from the way you and I >>> define it (our definitions may also be divergent). As Adam has >>> pointed out, it's not well defined. >>> >>> Those of us who pay attention know how many resources the NRO and it's >>> members put into EC activities, to wit: >>> >>> AfWG- AfriNIC Government Working Group, RIPE NCC Government >>> roundtables, AGWG- ARIN Government Working Group, LACNIC has a whole >>> list of them here: >>> http://lacnic.net/en/acuerdos/index.html, >>> >>> AfriNIC signs a Memorandum of Understanding with the Commonwealth >>> Telecommunications Organisation: >>> http://www.afrinic.net/press_release_cto_mou_25082011.htm >>> >>> and >>> NRO participated at OECD High Level Meeting, 27-28 June >>> http://www.nro.net/news/nro-participated-at-oecd-high-level-meeting-27-28-june >>> >>> etc, etc >>> >>> If you are interested there is a wealth of EC activity going on, one >>> just has to want to recognise it. >>> >>> In any case, I look forward to seeing you next week and many thanks >>> for your extraordinary efforts as NRO Chair. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Cheers, >>> >>> McTim >>> "A name indicates what we seek. An address indicates where it is. A >>> route indicates how we get there." Jon Postel >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, visit: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >>> >>> For all other list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >>> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >>> >>> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> Raul >> Twitter @raulecheberria >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, visit: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing >> >> For all other list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: >> http://www.igcaucus.org/ >> >> Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t Raul Twitter @raulecheberria ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mueller at syr.edu Mon Sep 19 14:45:52 2011 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 14:45:52 -0400 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754970068@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> Marilia, Thanks for this careful response, it is very informative. I reply below: The idea to organize the meeting was firstly raised by Brazil during the CSTD meeting in May (although funding was only secured in July), in a conversation with the governments of India and South Africa, and with civil society from Brazil and India who were there. The main goals of the meeting were to identify main policy and regulatory issues that should be seen as priority by the actors from the three countries and to discuss institutional changes, especially enhanced cooperation. The evaluation back then was that if IBSA countries would like to discuss EC in CSTD and elsewhere, then some clear proposal would have to be advanced, so it can be properly debated. Nowadays people are either ignoring the topic (despite the clear mandate from Tunis) or advocating it vaguely, and this is leading discussions nowhere. I agree that EC topic has been short-circuited within IGF. In my longer post on IGP blog I identified this as one of the key motives for the IBSA proposal. The problem is that the substantive proposals coming from IBSA always seem to involve hierarchical control and inter-governmental processes. It is a very traditionalist approach which is why I characterized it as "backward looking." The seminar was very useful to air positions and to understand expectations. With the help of these exchanges, I personally hope that a clear proposal on EC will emerge by September, so it can be discussed by all those interested. The statement summarizes general ideas so I don't think we could possibly have enough information to judge the future proposal from IBSA right now. Well, it was IBSA itself that put forward the basic outlines: "new body," "based in UN," "develops and established global public policy," "integrates and oversees" all agencies responsible for "technical and operational" aspects of the internet, as well as "dispute resolution." With that as a starting point, it would be hard to go from that to something I or others who favor a more distributed, networked and multistakeholder environment will like. I don't think this analysis is accurate because: India and Brazil have supported the IGF, not only being host countries and active participants in subsequent meetings, but also by making suggestions for strengthening the IGF in CSTD WG. You are certainly aware that the more comprehensive proposal to enhance the IGF has been advanced by India, Yes, I praised that proposal reason why the IGC is organizing a workshop to discuss IGF improvement based on the Indian proposal. That's good, but this proposal is "big", it's about the internet as a whole and not just the IGF. A workshop? Bah. Why not try to get an IGF main session on this topic, why not announce the IBSA recommendations for the first time at the IGF for public release? Etc., etc. If IBSA took IGF seriously as a place to advance global internet governance they would do this a lot differently. And you also know that US was against the continuation of the working group on IGF improvements Yes, I know. I hope you don't think that I and the US have much in common on these issues. 3) I can speak only for the context in Brazil, but I believe it is fair to mention that some civil society, business and academic organizations has been consulted and involved in policy development by the Ministry of External relations. Periodic meetings took place to listen to non-governemental actors before the government adopted their positions in ICANN and IGF. Naturally, this does not mean positions will always coincide and when disagreements emerge we deal with them. But this shows the level of transparency and the good dialogue that we have achieved internally. Yes, it is fair to mention this. I have to say that many people in civil society who are on the liberal-denationalized end of the IG spectrum are always a bit confused by the behavior of the Brazilian govt. On the one hand they talk - and inside Brazil, act - a good multi-stakeholder game, develop good principles, etc. On the other hand, in international organizations they consistently push for a governmental takeover of the process and continue to promote the logically fallacious, dangerously arbitrary concept of "global public policy" defined by states in isolation. So we are confused. I don't think the confusion comes from the fact that I and the others are ignorant and not paying attention to what they do. I think Brazil's Ministry of External Relations is holding contradictory opinions and has not thought these things through. Or perhaps they are seduced by the prospect of being a "world leader" and hope to appeal to other states in the UN context. I hope that you have the same opportunity to approach the US government on IG matters, and that others on this list have the same opportunity to approach the european commission. Maybe we would have less secret documents and negotiations, which were certainly not multistakehoder. I approach the US government all the time. Mostly they run away... Here I dont really understand your point. IBSA proposal has to be developed by IBSA actors, as the EU proposal needs to be developed by EU, etc. The important thing if that it is done is an open and participatory way. Why do you assume that the process must be led by states? Here maybe some background information is missing. In the case of IBSA seminar, the governments were the first ones to say they wanted a multistakeholder meeting, back in CSTD. And although governments and civil society were the predominant participants, the meeting was open to all those who wished to participate. Some CS participants from South Africa and India were sponsored to come. So IBSA sent a message they would like to create a multistakeholder dialogue between non-governmental actors from the three countries, although the mobilization of stakeholders needs to be improved. Sure, one model of multi-stakeholderism is for governments to invite people into consultations where they define the agenda, and then after the consultation they go off in a room by themselves and decide. I favor a much stronger, more innovative model in which the decision making power is distributed and not just the consultation. I think that it is very positive to discuss sensitive topics in a mulstistakeholder and transparent way, and was the case in the seminar. This is different from the bahavior that has been adopted elsewhere, we should acknowledge that. And applause or rejection usually comes after the idea is fully presented, when things are made clear, and not before. I am not attacking the seminar, or the role of Brazilian CS in contributing to it. I just think the IBSA recommendations that came out of it, and their plans for taking it to the UN General Assembly, show that the political direction that will be taken by this initiative is unlikely to be one that is good for the Internet. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mueller at syr.edu Mon Sep 19 15:08:41 2011 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 15:08:41 -0400 Subject: [governance] RE: critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D7175497006A@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> But let me put forward some facts to you. Discussion on 'enhanced cooperation' was blocked by the MAG, its most powerful constituencies of business sector, technical sector, Northern govs et al, and not by developing countries. In the run up to the Rio IGF, during the May open consultations, it was declared by the chair of the MAG that EC disucssion neither belonged in the MAG nor in the IGF, and the two tracks are to kept seperate. Why are you telling me this? I was at that Rio IGF preparatory meeting and spoke out most vigorously against the attempt by the Australians, Canadians and Europeans to keep Enhanced Cooperation out of the IGF. Look it up on the transcript. If I recall properly, at the time you didn't even know what was happening, we had to explain it to you. (This was backed by the above mentioned groups, though it is entirely a different matter that after two years when EC actually got discussed in the IGF they changed their strategy and suddenly discovered that instead of being seperate tracks they were in fact the 'same thing'.) Indeed, and you are repeating my own arguments to me in a lecturing tone, which is more than a little annoying. But I guess when you put everyone from the wrong side of the "North-South" divide in the same box such errors are inevitable. When ITfC proposed a workshop on EC for Hyderabad IGF, it was officially refused and we were told that EC shouldnt be discussed in the IGF. We approached Brazil and they ensured that instead of a workshop EC was discussed in a plenary session. I remember clearly the coldness towards an EC discussion at the IGF of so many civil society actors that are now wondering about why EC was not discussed at the IGF. Um, do you recall my own interventions in that process? Or my support for that effort? Or did that go down the memory hole, as inconsistent with your ideological worldview? On the other hand, Milton why does it not surprise you when US comes out with the International strategy for cyberspace without raising it first at the IGF, ditto for OECD (shaping a bold new extra legal and extra territorial IP enforcement regime), and for EU etc. It doesn't surprise me in the least, because I know how and why states behave in this context. Here again, you reveal how your thinking grasp of facts is stultified by your tendency to stereotype people based on the country they come from. No one has been more critical of US hypocrisy on this topic than me. I understand that they will be happy to seek views. The current IBSA statement says it will take in multistakeholder views. Yeah, and the NTIA Commerce Department will "take in MS views" also. Does that make you happy? ICANN says it will listen to anyone. Satisfied with that? Insofar as MS is interesting at all, it involves a redistribution of power, not simple pluralism in which government decision makers promise to listen to us. Maybe you can be bought off by attaching yourself to a state or two. Some of us are more principled. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From roland at internetpolicyagency.com Mon Sep 19 15:08:31 2011 From: roland at internetpolicyagency.com (Roland Perry) Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2011 20:08:31 +0100 Subject: [governance] critique of the IBSA proposal In-Reply-To: References: <75822E125BCB994F8446858C4B19F0D71754937255@SUEX07-MBX-04.ad.syr.edu> <4E762233.9020601@itforchange.net> <60809A11-1920-477D-A675-03E862C17114@lacnic.net> Message-ID: <5H9HTucvM5dOFAMs@internetpolicyagency.com> The UN (CSTD's) 2009 report on Enhanced CoOperation is here: http://www.unctad.org/en/docs/e2009d92_en.pdf Including contributions from some invited respondents. There's also this room document from 2010, which has an updated set of responses from all ten: http://www.unctad.org/en/docs/e2009d92crp1_en.pdf This should be essential reading for anyone interested in Enhanced CoOperation. -- Roland Perry ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From jeremy at ciroap.org Mon Sep 19 22:52:15 2011 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 10:52:15 +0800 Subject: [governance] Reminder: decorum on the list Message-ID: <4E77FFDF.2020005@ciroap.org> The discussion around the IBSA proposal is a crucial one, and the contributions being made are all excellent and useful, but I would like to remind everyone (without pointing fingers) about the following paragraphs of our charter: The messages must observe a minimum of decorum, including: * refrain from personal attacks, insults or slander * refrain from offensive or discriminating language * refrain from threats , including threats of legal action, on list or off list * refrain from excessive and repetitive posting Inappropriate postings to the IGC list include * Unsolicited bulk e-mail * Discussion of subjects unrelated to the IGC mission and objectives * Unprofessional or discourteous commentary, regardless of the general subject * Sequences of messages by one or more participants that cause an IGC list to become a hostile environment Thank you! :-) -- *Dr Jeremy Malcolm Project Coordinator* Consumers International Kuala Lumpur Office for Asia-Pacific and the Middle East Lot 5-1 Wisma WIM, 7 Jalan Abang Haji Openg, TTDI, 60000 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia Tel: +60 3 7726 1599 Consumers International (CI) is the world federation of consumer groups that, working together with its members, serves as the only independent and authoritative global voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. _www.consumersinternational.org _ _Twitter @ConsumersInt _ Read our email confidentiality notice . Don't print this email unless necessary. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/pkcs7-signature Size: 3762 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From baudouin.schombe at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 04:45:54 2011 From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com (Baudouin SCHOMBE) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 09:45:54 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? In-Reply-To: References: <4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> Message-ID: 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE 2. Passport number: OB0093228 3 Nationality: congolese 2011/9/17 Grace Githaiga > Colleagues > > Greetings. > > This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the immigrations > officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like the IGF secretariat in > Kenya to compile a list of those who have not gotten a visa (if you belong > to a country that requires this) and would need facilitation. I am compiling > a list for them and would request that anyone who thinks they need this > facilitation to kindly email me the following details: > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > 3 Nationality: congolese > > We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of > Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing facilitation to > provide me with their details latest monday evening. > > Rgds > Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is > all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth > and rule the World! > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ ACADEMIE DES TIC FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre At-Large Member NCSG Member email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net tél:+243998983491 skype:b.schombe wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ggithaiga at hotmail.com Tue Sep 20 04:59:04 2011 From: ggithaiga at hotmail.com (Grace Githaiga) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 08:59:04 +0000 Subject: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted In-Reply-To: References: ,<4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> , Message-ID: All I finally got over 30 names needing visa facilitation. Those of you coming from the US and Europe will secure your visas on arrival. There are no hussles whatsoever. There are also others who can secure the visas on arrival....But if you are from Afganistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Cameroun,Democratic Peoples of Korea, Iraq, Jordan, Kosovo, Lebanon, Mali, Palestine, Senegal, Somali, Syria and Tajikistan, then you may have to go through a more rigorous process. If you are from any of these and have given me your name, then it will be okay because we have requested the Immigration to facilitate this process. I hope to have feedback for you either tomorrow evening or thursday. Thanks for your cooperation. Pls note that if you send your name after today, I might not be able to follow up. That is why I had requested that you give me your names by yesterday evening. Kind Regards Grace ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 09:45:54 +0100 Subject: Re: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ggithaiga at hotmail.com 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE 2. Passport number: OB0093228 3 Nationality: congolese 2011/9/17 Grace Githaiga Colleagues Greetings. This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the immigrations officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like the IGF secretariat in Kenya to compile a list of those who have not gotten a visa (if you belong to a country that requires this) and would need facilitation. I am compiling a list for them and would request that anyone who thinks they need this facilitation to kindly email me the following details: 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE 2. Passport number: OB0093228 3 Nationality: congolese We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing facilitation to provide me with their details latest monday evening. Rgds Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -- SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ ACADEMIE DES TIC FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre At-Large Member NCSG Member email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net tél:+243998983491 skype:b.schombe wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From baudouin.schombe at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 05:26:08 2011 From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com (Baudouin SCHOMBE) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 10:26:08 +0100 Subject: [governance] Re: List for visa assistance submitted In-Reply-To: References: <4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> Message-ID: Hi Grace, Thanks for visa assistance. Document received very well Baudouin 2011/9/20 Grace Githaiga > All > I finally got over 30 names needing visa facilitation. Those of you coming > from the US and Europe will secure your visas on arrival. There are no > hussles whatsoever. > > There are also others who can secure the visas on arrival....But if you are > from Afganistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Cameroun,Democratic Peoples of Korea, > Iraq, Jordan, Kosovo, Lebanon, Mali, Palestine, Senegal, Somali, Syria > and Tajikistan, then you may have to go through a more rigorous process. > > If you are from any of these and have given me your name, then it will be > okay because we have requested the Immigration to facilitate this process. I > hope to have feedback for you either tomorrow evening or thursday. > > Thanks for your cooperation. Pls note that if you send your name after > today, I might not be able to follow up. That is why I had requested that > you give me your names by yesterday evening. > > Kind Regards > Grace > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is > all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth > and rule the World! > > > ------------------------------ > From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 09:45:54 +0100 > Subject: Re: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ggithaiga at hotmail.com > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > 3 Nationality: congolese > > > 2011/9/17 Grace Githaiga > > Colleagues > > Greetings. > > This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the immigrations > officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like the IGF secretariat in > Kenya to compile a list of those who have not gotten a visa (if you belong > to a country that requires this) and would need facilitation. I am compiling > a list for them and would request that anyone who thinks they need this > facilitation to kindly email me the following details: > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > 3 Nationality: congolese > > We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of > Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing facilitation to > provide me with their details latest monday evening. > > Rgds > Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is > all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth > and rule the World! > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > > -- > SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN > CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ > ACADEMIE DES TIC > FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre > At-Large Member > NCSG Member > > email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net > tél:+243998983491 > skype:b.schombe > wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net > blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr > > -- SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ ACADEMIE DES TIC FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre At-Large Member NCSG Member email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net tél:+243998983491 skype:b.schombe wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From nyangkweagien at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 06:36:05 2011 From: nyangkweagien at gmail.com (Nyangkwe Agien Aaron) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 12:36:05 +0200 Subject: [governance] Thanks to all of You for Your show of Love during my recent agony Message-ID: Thanks to all of You for Your show of Love during my recent agony Love and real solidarity can make wonders as a lot of you have made me to realize during the couple of weeks that I almost quit this world after a motorcycle knocked me down and the deadly Tetanus took on its own to wipe me away from the list of the Cameroon’s population. Many of you showed your love for me materially and through prayers. Without you, there was no way I could have afforded the at least 25000 FCFA that was needed daily for my treatment. A treatment that was described by Dr Nkeng, the Specialist that took care of me (more on this later) at Laquintine Hospital. It was around 8:20 PM (Cameroon time) on August 13th, that I was returning home when a motorcycle without lights stroke me as I engaged to cross the road. No vehicle was circulating at that moment, I had ascertained, else one would have crushed me and possibly the motorcycle rider to dead. I sustained a big wound my head near my left ear. As I struggled to look for some piece of tissue to tie the wounded portion to stop the oozing blood, The Bike rider profited and escaped thus abandoning me to my fate. A Good Samaritan (bike rider co-incidentally) carried to a nearby hospital. The first question that the nurse asked me was “do you have money?” I turned and pointed to my right back pocket of my trousers. She pulled out a note of FCFA 10 000. And she responded in French that “he has money”. Before then, I tried to reach my children and family members to inform them of what happened to me. But the Cameroon mobile telephone network failed woefully that evening. Some Nurses offered to take the numbers and try the calls to no avail. I was conveyed into a room where about four injections were carried out around the wounded portion of my head. Thirteen stitches were later carried out and some drugs that will last for 5 days were given to me to taking. I was told to eat before taking the drugs and then advised to retire home. The Samaritan bike rider had not left the hospital. “Pa I wanted to be certain that some treatment was done to your wound before I could leave”. He asked me where I lived and it was just some two kilometres away. He offered to carry me home. When I arrived home with a shirt soaked with blood, my first son fumed with anger as to why did not call. Thank God, the Bike rider was there to tell him that his Dad and even nurses at the hospital tried to reach all them but none of the numbers were responding. But my son added “my girl friend just called me not up to three minutes ago how comes it that my Dad who is almost dying could not reach me” as he led me to my room but I offered to lie on the suffer in the parlour. Before I could wake up the next morning, my left side of the head has swollen and my left eye was almost closed. I ran back to hospital and the Nurses told me no to worry because what happened was the effect of the shock and that all will be fine in the next couple of days. I returned home and continued taking the drugs and truly to what the nurses said things started becoming normal. I went to see my boss and good friend at an NGO where I was volunteering to inform her that I should be in the office in a couple of days. When I returned home I discovered I had difficulties opening my mouth normally and was frequently biting my tongue. I took a piece of paper and succinctly described what happened to a friend Doctor who prescribed some drugs. My Daughter who went there with the letter bought but one of the drug and we needed FCFA 20000 to buy the remaining drugs. It was there that I sent her to my boss to raise the money so that I could buy the drugs. My daughter presented the letter I wrote to the Doctor. My boss seized the letter and told my daughter that “your father that I know is a journalist, what does he know in medicine to be sitting in his room and writing thinks to Doctors. Is he a medical laboratory technician?” My boss instead pulled out FCFA 5000 and gave it to my daughter, gave her cell phone number and told her to go and take me to the hospital immediately and then call her to inform her in which hospital they were. Before my daughter returned, I had gone to have a bath the little water I dropped on my head so as to soap it cause me to loose breath immediately. I ran out of the bath room naked, knocked at the door of my second son furiously but he had left. I ran into the parlour naked and fell on the ground in front of my last son who in confusion stood and was watching at what was happening to his dad. The three children of my sister that came holidaying watched the scene in awe. I could neither breath through the mouth nor the nose. My world was coming to and end but something told me to take the table cloth and wipe my head, which I did. I then started breathing again. I asked my son to go to the bath room and bring my towel which I used inn cleansing my body. As I laid to rest, my daughter returned and said that my boss has instructed that I should be taken to the hospital. I told her that I needed money for drugs not the hospital, my first son who followed the discussion from his room swooped in. I read see anger on his face when he told me that “Papa wake and let us take you to the hospital as instructed” I was taken to the Military Hospital (noted for the hospitality and less avaricious nature of its staff). When we arrived, the female Doctor placed her working instrument and tested my two nerve centres. I saw her carry her hands on her head and screamed that I had Tetanus. She ordered that two anti-tetanus drugs should be administered on me immediately. This was done and I was told that I’ll be hospitalized and certain laboratory exams were prescribed. My daughter returned to my boss and came back with money for the test that could be carried out at sites out of the military hospital. We went for the exams and when we returned I was assigned into a room that was a mosquito abbot. My son screamed that my dad cannot sleep with mosquitoes. He invited my daughters and my niece out for consultation. A few minutes later he came back and told me that “we have decided that you are not going to sleep here under theses mosquitoes we’ll get back home and reach for another hospital”. The y went to see the Doctor or my medical card and the lady refused saying that I had slept on the bed for more thirty minutes and must pay for that time. My kids abandoned the document with her and came along with the test reports. They did not a priori inform my boss of their action as my boss was making contacts with military hierarchy so that I am lodged comfortably. Before I could warm a seat at my home, my boss swooped in accompanied by a colleague and ordered me to stand up and enter her vehicle and she drove me to a very comfortable private clinic. The Doctor said over the phone that I should lie and he will take care of me in the morning when he arrives but that if things appeared abnormal, he could be called. I laid down inn the room and started to read a book while my son was at the waiting room iterneting on his lap top. My bathroom incident came back but this time more violently. I had bitten my tongue and blood was oozing out. I could not breathe again and jumped to the waiting room where my son (Emmanuel) was. When he saw he jumped and held me below my arms (just by mere intuition). If he had folded my arms, I would have been no more on this earth. This lasted for almost 7 to 9 minutes. In the main time, I walked in dream toward a crowd of people, some were playing draughts, some eating and others playing music while some were playing some other games. As I moved towards that crowd, an old tall and bulky old mum asked where I was going to and I told her that I was going to join the group. She told me that “nobody wants you here”. I stubbornly continued walking towards the crow and she raised and big walking can and tried to hit me with it. It was then that I ran back and started breathing again. I sat down and discovered that I was constantly biting my tongue. I decided to take a spoon and the sound of the bite scared my son and even the nurses. It is then that my boss friend called the special services of the Laquintine Hospital to come with a specialized vehicle to that hospital that was more equipped to handle my case. Surprisingly, when we arrived at Laquintine Hospital, the medics there instead gave credits to the nurses of my former clinic for have the smart idea of putting a spoon in my mouth not knowing that it was done by me. Dr Nkeng examined me and said that my situation was worse than people were seeing. I over heard him telling a nurses that if I survived the next two hours then I should consider myself lucky. Then I saw my boss-friend crying and asking me where I was going to. “Do you know that we have a lot to do together in next coming days?” She did not only do that, but did inform my professional colleagues of my situation and aroused prayer groups of Christian Scientists around the world. Honestly, I wasn’t a member of the Christian Science but I have decided to become one. Why? Dr Nkeng called me into his office a day before I was discharged to inquire where I was from and how old I really was. When I gave my Identity card, he told me “big brother, I am certain that you 56 (my real age) or more years” And to add, or the numbers of years that I have been heading this service, I have never received some one of your sickness status survived” He said that he was going to use my medical file (he also took samples of my urine) and carry out a study to determine how my body resisted such an attack.” He pulled a note of FCFA 2000 and gave me (a rare case from Doctors who are fun of receiving only). As I was leaving his office he told me that what happened to me was like say some one throw a bomb, the bomb explodes at you and you remain intact I replied that “I was saved by prayers made by many people around the world and the good services provided by his staff” I was administered 73 drips and 63 anti-tetanus were injected on my buttocks not counting other drinkables.. All this was possible thanks to your generosity and prayers from Cameroon, Canada, US, Kenya and South Africa. When I returned to my house, people were coming and looking at me not to sympathize, for many I was like an object in a zoo as news has gone that ‘Nyangkwe is gone” What happened to me is God’s love to all of you. With Love from Aaron . -- Aaron Agien Nyangkwe Journalist-OutCome Mapper C/o P.O.Box 5213 Douala-Cameroon ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From anriette at apc.org Tue Sep 20 07:53:06 2011 From: anriette at apc.org (Anriette Esterhuysen) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 13:53:06 +0200 Subject: [governance] China wants international code of conduct on internet, etc. (Letter to SG) Message-ID: <4E787EA2.8020901@apc.org> See attached letter. Anriette ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: A-66-359 China Russia Tajik Uzbek letter to SG on info security.pdf Type: application/octet-stream Size: 38253 bytes Desc: not available URL: From ca at cafonso.ca Tue Sep 20 08:47:01 2011 From: ca at cafonso.ca (Carlos A. Afonso) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 09:47:01 -0300 Subject: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted In-Reply-To: References: ,<4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> , Message-ID: <4E788B45.8070906@cafonso.ca> Dear Grace, in addition, let me suggest that people write directly to you and not to the list when sending their personal data. fraternal regards --c.a. On 09/20/2011 05:59 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: > All > I finally got over 30 names needing visa facilitation. Those of you > coming from the US and Europe will secure your visas on arrival. There > are no hussles whatsoever. > > There are also others who can secure the visas on arrival....But if you > are from Afganistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Cameroun,Democratic Peoples of > Korea, Iraq, Jordan, Kosovo, Lebanon, Mali, Palestine, Senegal, Somali, > Syria and Tajikistan, then you may have to go through a more rigorous > process. > > If you are from any of these and have given me your name, then it > will be okay because we have requested the Immigration to facilitate > this process. I hope to have feedback for you either tomorrow evening or > thursday. > > Thanks for your cooperation. Pls note that if you send your name after > today, I might not be able to follow up. That is why I had requested > that you give me your names by yesterday evening. > > Kind Regards > Grace > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life > is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go > forth and rule the World! > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 09:45:54 +0100 > Subject: Re: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ggithaiga at hotmail.com > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > 3 Nationality: congolese > > > 2011/9/17 Grace Githaiga > > > Colleagues > > Greetings. > > This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the > immigrations officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like > the IGF secretariat in Kenya to compile a list of those who have not > gotten a visa (if you belong to a country that requires this) and > would need facilitation. I am compiling a list for them and would > request that anyone who thinks they need this facilitation to kindly > email me the following details: > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > 3 Nationality: congolese > > We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of > Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing > facilitation to provide me with their details latest monday evening. > > Rgds > Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. > Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we > are in. Go forth and rule the World! > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > > -- > SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN > CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ > ACADEMIE DES TIC > FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre > At-Large Member > NCSG Member > > email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net > > tél:+243998983491 > skype:b.schombe > wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net > blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 10:53:14 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 10:23:14 -0430 Subject: [governance] Are we meeting the challenges of bringing content and access to the world? WS 101 Sept. 27 Message-ID: ACCESS WORKSHOP #101 SEPTEMBER 27, 9:00AM to 10:30AM, WORKSHOP ROOM 4 BACKGROUND PAPER “*Are we meeting the challenges of bringing content and access to the world?”* - *Ambassador Philip Verveer will open the workshop* - *Vladimir Radunovic, DiploFoundation will Moderate the workshop* *WE WILL EXPLORE THE DRIVERS OF ACCESS…* - *We will hear from leading “in the field” experts on; Mobile Medicine/Remote Health Care over the internet* - *We will highlight Education as a key driver of Access and have a Senior global broadband industry official discuss their company’s ongoing commitment to this important Access Driver* - *We will have front line experts, Senior Officials, focusing on: Mobile Banking/Mobile Payments and their importance as drives of Access* - *We will have a Senior Official global infrastructure expert discussing the explosion in demand for broadband * - *We will have a Senior Official from one of the global leaders in content creation and distribution on hand to discuss how content drives access* - *We will have infrastructure build out experts discussing the real time challenges of building out connectivity in developing countries, in developing adaptive business models, and discussing what barriers their companies have encounter* - *Finally, we will hear success stories from ISPs around the world as they continue to grow and provide valuable services to their communities. * *Panel Participants:* Pankaj Gupta, Principal Consultant and Global Head of Sales and Delivery, TCS Bright Simons, Strategy Consultant, mPedigree, Kristin Peterson, Co-Founder and CEO, inveneo Virat Bhatia, President, External Affairs South Asia, AT&T (remote participant) Robert Pepper, Vice President Global Technology Policy, Cisco Snehar Shah, Head Orange Money, Orange Mobile, TelkomKenya Betty Mwangi-Thuo, General Manager, Financial Services, Safaricom Bevil Wooding, Chief Knowledge Officer of Congress WBN Dorothy Attwood, Senior VP Global Public Policy, The Walt Disney Company Jacquelynn Ruff, Vice President International Public Policy and Regulatory Affairs, Verizon Christoph Steck, Director Public Policy, Telefonica Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu *Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 11:31:17 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 11:01:17 -0430 Subject: [governance] Remote and e-participation: we must make it happen Message-ID: If we could do just one thing that would make a difference to our communication problems, to our understanding of the world, to the conflict we live in – what should it be? We could bridge the digital divide – dedicate more tools and resources to facilitate increased participation and inclusion in national, regional and global policy processes. One of the strongest resources we have for bridging that divide is e-participation. E-participation brings people into the processes that govern the world, ensuring that the diversity and complexity of voices are heard. Real problems are addressed and citizens are involved in the ownership of the solutions. Since its inception at the World Summit on the Information Society (WSIS), the Internet Governance Forum (IGF) process has made frequent mention of the digital divide. As the IGF matures, we have learned that the divides are various and go beyond the traditional one of Internet access. One of the divides is between those who can impact Internet policy and those who cannot. Even at the most successful IGFs we do not have more than 2000 participants. What about the remaining billions who will be impacted by Internet policy but have no input into the process? This is where e-participation and its potential fit in. E-participation can be as simple as broadcasting/webcasting (remote observation). However the IGF has made concrete steps towards moving from remote observation to actual remote participation. Workshop, and even main session presentations are now delivered remotely, as are audience interventions in main sessions and workshops. E-participation is used from the beginning of the IGF work year for open consultations by e-mail, mailing lists, and websites, to encourage input into the planning and organisation of the agenda each year. This year, over 35 remote hubs around the world will meet in parallel and connect to the IGF main meeting in Nairobi, in addition to hundreds of individual remote participants. Now that we have tested and proven the basic concept and technical structures of e-participation, it is time to study the principles that should guide this important tool. So Diplo is organizing Workshop 67 to be held on 29 September at 9 a.m. Nairobi, (EAT UTC/GMT +3) where participants and panellists will analyse and propose basic principles for e-participation in global policy processes, as well as noting guidelines for e-participation that emerge during the workshop. The output of this roundtable will be a draft list of principles for later discussion. These principles will not simply be guidelines, such as: 'all panels should have a remote moderator to interact with remote participants and facilitate their interventions in the sessions', although we expect to hear and note such guidelines as well. Rather, the objective of the workshop is to gather input for principles such as (informal draft possibility) 'E-participation, and specifically remote participation should be offered to ensure inclusion of unheard voices in global policy process meetings.' Your ideas and input are important to this process. If you will not be in Nairobi for the IGF, please try to join us remotely, following the links that will be available at *www.intgovforum.org* during the IGF, from 27-30 September. You are also invited to post your ideas here for inclusion in the discussion. How can and should e-participation be used to reduce the digital divide? What should be the standard e-participation framework for international policy conferences and policy processes? Your voice is important. Let us know! Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu *Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From mail at christopherwilkinson.eu Tue Sep 20 12:06:18 2011 From: mail at christopherwilkinson.eu (CW Mail) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 18:06:18 +0200 Subject: [governance] China wants international code of conduct on internet, etc. (Letter to SG) In-Reply-To: <4E787EA2.8020901@apc.org> References: <4E787EA2.8020901@apc.org> Message-ID: <497E7BBC-590F-4FC1-A110-FECFF54310EF@christopherwilkinson.eu> http://www.itu.int/wsis/docs/background/resolutions/57-53.pdf http://www.unidir.org/pdf/activites/pdf2-act82.pdf Good evening: It would appear that these matters have been under discussion in the UN context for at least the past decade. What conclusions might one draw . . . CW On 20 Sep 2011, at 13:53, Anriette Esterhuysen wrote: > See attached letter. > > Anriette > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: A-66-359 China Russia Tajik Uzbek letter to SG on info security.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 38253 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 14:29:36 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 06:29:36 +1200 Subject: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted In-Reply-To: <4E788B45.8070906@cafonso.ca> References: <4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> <4E788B45.8070906@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: I agree. Issues are: 1. Privacy; 2. Identity theft possibilities - you never know.... 3. It is administrative/logistics and can be done off list I am also grateful that the offer to help is on the table, I suppose it has expired now? Sala On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 12:47 AM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: > Dear Grace, in addition, let me suggest that people write directly to > you and not to the list when sending their personal data. > > fraternal regards > > --c.a. > > On 09/20/2011 05:59 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: > > All > > I finally got over 30 names needing visa facilitation. Those of you > > coming from the US and Europe will secure your visas on arrival. There > > are no hussles whatsoever. > > > > There are also others who can secure the visas on arrival....But if you > > are from Afganistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Cameroun,Democratic Peoples of > > Korea, Iraq, Jordan, Kosovo, Lebanon, Mali, Palestine, Senegal, Somali, > > Syria and Tajikistan, then you may have to go through a more rigorous > > process. > > > > If you are from any of these and have given me your name, then it > > will be okay because we have requested the Immigration to facilitate > > this process. I hope to have feedback for you either tomorrow evening or > > thursday. > > > > Thanks for your cooperation. Pls note that if you send your name after > > today, I might not be able to follow up. That is why I had requested > > that you give me your names by yesterday evening. > > > > Kind Regards > > Grace > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life > > is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go > > forth and rule the World! > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > > Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 09:45:54 +0100 > > Subject: Re: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ggithaiga at hotmail.com > > > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > > 3 Nationality: congolese > > > > > > 2011/9/17 Grace Githaiga > > > > > > Colleagues > > > > Greetings. > > > > This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the > > immigrations officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like > > the IGF secretariat in Kenya to compile a list of those who have not > > gotten a visa (if you belong to a country that requires this) and > > would need facilitation. I am compiling a list for them and would > > request that anyone who thinks they need this facilitation to kindly > > email me the following details: > > > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > > 3 Nationality: congolese > > > > We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of > > Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing > > facilitation to provide me with their details latest monday evening. > > > > Rgds > > Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. > > Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we > > are in. Go forth and rule the World! > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN > > CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ > > ACADEMIE DES TIC > > FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre > > At-Large Member > > NCSG Member > > > > email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com email%3Abaudouin.schombe at gmail.com> > > baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net > > > > tél:+243998983491 > > skype:b.schombe > > wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net > > blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From briceabba at hotmail.com Tue Sep 20 14:45:34 2011 From: briceabba at hotmail.com (Brice Abba) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 18:45:34 +0000 Subject: [governance] Remote and e-participation: we must make it happen In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi Ginger, Is this workshop open for all, or we need to register somewhere first ? regards Brice ABBA Ingénieur en Sciences InformatiquesAdmin Système SAFRAN MORPHOResp. DNSsec au NIC CI et LABTIC, LARIT mob: (+225)-08-607-228 fix(home): (+225)-23-512-912 From: gpaque at gmail.com Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 11:01:17 -0430 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: [governance] Remote and e-participation: we must make it happen If we could do just one thing that would make a difference to our communication problems, to our understanding of the world, to the conflict we live in – what should it be? We could bridge the digital divide – dedicate more tools and resources to facilitate increased participation and inclusion in national, regional and global policy processes. One of the strongest resources we have for bridging that divide is e-participation. E-participation brings people into the processes that govern the world, ensuring that the diversity and complexity of voices are heard. Real problems are addressed and citizens are involved in the ownership of the solutions. Since its inception at the World Summit on the Information Society (WSIS), the Internet Governance Forum (IGF) process has made frequent mention of the digital divide. As the IGF matures, we have learned that the divides are various and go beyond the traditional one of Internet access. One of the divides is between those who can impact Internet policy and those who cannot. Even at the most successful IGFs we do not have more than 2000 participants. What about the remaining billions who will be impacted by Internet policy but have no input into the process? This is where e-participation and its potential fit in. E-participation can be as simple as broadcasting/webcasting (remote observation). However the IGF has made concrete steps towards moving from remote observation to actual remote participation. Workshop, and even main session presentations are now delivered remotely, as are audience interventions in main sessions and workshops. E-participation is used from the beginning of the IGF work year for open consultations by e-mail, mailing lists, and websites, to encourage input into the planning and organisation of the agenda each year. This year, over 35 remote hubs around the world will meet in parallel and connect to the IGF main meeting in Nairobi, in addition to hundreds of individual remote participants. Now that we have tested and proven the basic concept and technical structures of e-participation, it is time to study the principles that should guide this important tool. So Diplo is organizing Workshop 67 to be held on 29 September at 9 a.m. Nairobi, (EAT UTC/GMT +3) where participants and panellists will analyse and propose basic principles for e-participation in global policy processes, as well as noting guidelines for e-participation that emerge during the workshop. The output of this roundtable will be a draft list of principles for later discussion. These principles will not simply be guidelines, such as: 'all panels should have a remote moderator to interact with remote participants and facilitate their interventions in the sessions', although we expect to hear and note such guidelines as well. Rather, the objective of the workshop is to gather input for principles such as (informal draft possibility) 'E-participation, and specifically remote participation should be offered to ensure inclusion of unheard voices in global policy process meetings.' Your ideas and input are important to this process. If you will not be in Nairobi for the IGF, please try to join us remotely, following the links that will be available at www.intgovforum.org during the IGF, from 27-30 September. You are also invited to post your ideas here for inclusion in the discussion. How can and should e-participation be used to reduce the digital divide? What should be the standard e-participation framework for international policy conferences and policy processes? Your voice is important. Let us know! Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ggithaiga at hotmail.com Tue Sep 20 15:19:44 2011 From: ggithaiga at hotmail.com (Grace Githaiga) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 19:19:44 +0000 Subject: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted In-Reply-To: References: ,<4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net>,,,,<4E788B45.8070906@cafonso.ca>, Message-ID: No problem but when the clearance is done, they might generate one list with all the names. In that case I will post it on this list. I know it is not convinient but please bear with me. Rgds Grace ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 06:29:36 +1200 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ca at cafonso.ca CC: ggithaiga at hotmail.com; baudouin.schombe at gmail.com; david at kenic.or.ke Subject: Re: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted I agree. Issues are: Privacy; Identity theft possibilities - you never know.... It is administrative/logistics and can be done off list I am also grateful that the offer to help is on the table, I suppose it has expired now? Sala On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 12:47 AM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: Dear Grace, in addition, let me suggest that people write directly to you and not to the list when sending their personal data. fraternal regards --c.a. On 09/20/2011 05:59 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: > All > I finally got over 30 names needing visa facilitation. Those of you > coming from the US and Europe will secure your visas on arrival. There > are no hussles whatsoever. > > There are also others who can secure the visas on arrival....But if you > are from Afganistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Cameroun,Democratic Peoples of > Korea, Iraq, Jordan, Kosovo, Lebanon, Mali, Palestine, Senegal, Somali, > Syria and Tajikistan, then you may have to go through a more rigorous > process. > > If you are from any of these and have given me your name, then it > will be okay because we have requested the Immigration to facilitate > this process. I hope to have feedback for you either tomorrow evening or > thursday. > > Thanks for your cooperation. Pls note that if you send your name after > today, I might not be able to follow up. That is why I had requested > that you give me your names by yesterday evening. > > Kind Regards > Grace > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life > is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go > forth and rule the World! > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 09:45:54 +0100 > Subject: Re: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ggithaiga at hotmail.com > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > 3 Nationality: congolese > > > 2011/9/17 Grace Githaiga > > > Colleagues > > Greetings. > > This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the > immigrations officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like > the IGF secretariat in Kenya to compile a list of those who have not > gotten a visa (if you belong to a country that requires this) and > would need facilitation. I am compiling a list for them and would > request that anyone who thinks they need this facilitation to kindly > email me the following details: > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > 3 Nationality: congolese > > We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of > Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing > facilitation to provide me with their details latest monday evening. > > Rgds > Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. > Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we > are in. Go forth and rule the World! > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > > -- > SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN > CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ > ACADEMIE DES TIC > FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre > At-Large Member > NCSG Member > > email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net > > tél:+243998983491 > skype:b.schombe > wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net > blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 15:22:02 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 07:22:02 +1200 Subject: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted In-Reply-To: References: <4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> <4E788B45.8070906@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: Thanks Grace, as long as you keep our passport numbers aware from this list. Just names and countries should be fine. Sala On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 7:19 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: > No problem but when the clearance is done, they might generate one list > with all the names. In that case I will post it on this list. I know it is > not convinient but please bear with me. > > Rgds > > Grace > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is > all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth > and rule the World! > > > ------------------------------ > Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 06:29:36 +1200 > From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ca at cafonso.ca > CC: ggithaiga at hotmail.com; baudouin.schombe at gmail.com; david at kenic.or.ke > Subject: Re: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted > > > I agree. Issues are: > > > 1. Privacy; > 2. Identity theft possibilities - you never know.... > 3. It is administrative/logistics and can be done off list > > I am also grateful that the offer to help is on the table, I suppose it has > expired now? > > Sala > > On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 12:47 AM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: > > Dear Grace, in addition, let me suggest that people write directly to > you and not to the list when sending their personal data. > > fraternal regards > > --c.a. > > On 09/20/2011 05:59 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: > > All > > I finally got over 30 names needing visa facilitation. Those of you > > coming from the US and Europe will secure your visas on arrival. There > > are no hussles whatsoever. > > > > There are also others who can secure the visas on arrival....But if you > > are from Afganistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Cameroun,Democratic Peoples of > > Korea, Iraq, Jordan, Kosovo, Lebanon, Mali, Palestine, Senegal, Somali, > > Syria and Tajikistan, then you may have to go through a more rigorous > > process. > > > > If you are from any of these and have given me your name, then it > > will be okay because we have requested the Immigration to facilitate > > this process. I hope to have feedback for you either tomorrow evening or > > thursday. > > > > Thanks for your cooperation. Pls note that if you send your name after > > today, I might not be able to follow up. That is why I had requested > > that you give me your names by yesterday evening. > > > > Kind Regards > > Grace > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life > > is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go > > forth and rule the World! > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > > Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 09:45:54 +0100 > > Subject: Re: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ggithaiga at hotmail.com > > > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > > 3 Nationality: congolese > > > > > > 2011/9/17 Grace Githaiga > > > > > > Colleagues > > > > Greetings. > > > > This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the > > immigrations officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like > > the IGF secretariat in Kenya to compile a list of those who have not > > gotten a visa (if you belong to a country that requires this) and > > would need facilitation. I am compiling a list for them and would > > request that anyone who thinks they need this facilitation to kindly > > email me the following details: > > > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > > 3 Nationality: congolese > > > > We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of > > Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing > > facilitation to provide me with their details latest monday evening. > > > > Rgds > > Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. > > Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we > > are in. Go forth and rule the World! > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, visit: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > > > For all other list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN > > CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ > > ACADEMIE DES TIC > > FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre > > At-Large Member > > NCSG Member > > > > email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com email%3Abaudouin.schombe at gmail.com> > > baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net > > > > tél:+243998983491 > > skype:b.schombe > > wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net > > blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > -- > Sala > > " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From DThompson1 at GOV.NU.CA Tue Sep 20 15:22:40 2011 From: DThompson1 at GOV.NU.CA (Thompson, Darlene) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 19:22:40 +0000 Subject: [governance] Remote and e-participation: we must make it happen In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DB4247@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> Will all of the sessions be available for remote participation? Thanks, D Darlene A. Thompson Community Access Program Administrator Nunavut Dept. of Education / N-CAP P.O. Box 1000, Station 910 Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0 Phone: (867) 975-5631 Fax: (867) 975-5610 E-mail: dthompson at gov.nu.ca From: governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Ginger Paque Sent: Tuesday, September 20, 2011 11:31 AM To: I G List Subject: [governance] Remote and e-participation: we must make it happen If we could do just one thing that would make a difference to our communication problems, to our understanding of the world, to the conflict we live in - what should it be? We could bridge the digital divide - dedicate more tools and resources to facilitate increased participation and inclusion in national, regional and global policy processes. One of the strongest resources we have for bridging that divide is e-participation. E-participation brings people into the processes that govern the world, ensuring that the diversity and complexity of voices are heard. Real problems are addressed and citizens are involved in the ownership of the solutions. Since its inception at the World Summit on the Information Society (WSIS), the Internet Governance Forum (IGF) process has made frequent mention of the digital divide. As the IGF matures, we have learned that the divides are various and go beyond the traditional one of Internet access. One of the divides is between those who can impact Internet policy and those who cannot. Even at the most successful IGFs we do not have more than 2000 participants. What about the remaining billions who will be impacted by Internet policy but have no input into the process? This is where e-participation and its potential fit in. E-participation can be as simple as broadcasting/webcasting (remote observation). However the IGF has made concrete steps towards moving from remote observation to actual remote participation. Workshop, and even main session presentations are now delivered remotely, as are audience interventions in main sessions and workshops. E-participation is used from the beginning of the IGF work year for open consultations by e-mail, mailing lists, and websites, to encourage input into the planning and organisation of the agenda each year. This year, over 35 remote hubs around the world will meet in parallel and connect to the IGF main meeting in Nairobi, in addition to hundreds of individual remote participants. Now that we have tested and proven the basic concept and technical structures of e-participation, it is time to study the principles that should guide this important tool. So Diplo is organizing Workshop 67 to be held on 29 September at 9 a.m. Nairobi, (EAT UTC/GMT +3) where participants and panellists will analyse and propose basic principles for e-participation in global policy processes, as well as noting guidelines for e-participation that emerge during the workshop. The output of this roundtable will be a draft list of principles for later discussion. These principles will not simply be guidelines, such as: 'all panels should have a remote moderator to interact with remote participants and facilitate their interventions in the sessions', although we expect to hear and note such guidelines as well. Rather, the objective of the workshop is to gather input for principles such as (informal draft possibility) 'E-participation, and specifically remote participation should be offered to ensure inclusion of unheard voices in global policy process meetings.' Your ideas and input are important to this process. If you will not be in Nairobi for the IGF, please try to join us remotely, following the links that will be available at www.intgovforum.org during the IGF, from 27-30 September. You are also invited to post your ideas here for inclusion in the discussion. How can and should e-participation be used to reduce the digital divide? What should be the standard e-participation framework for international policy conferences and policy processes? Your voice is important. Let us know! Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From ggithaiga at hotmail.com Tue Sep 20 15:34:39 2011 From: ggithaiga at hotmail.com (Grace Githaiga) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 19:34:39 +0000 Subject: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted In-Reply-To: References: ,<4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net>,,,,<4E788B45.8070906@cafonso.ca>,,, Message-ID: Sala That might be a tall order because Immigrations generates one letter with all the names and passport numbers but not nationality. We have already cleared a group that is here for Pre-IGF event. I have to scan the letter as it is. Please understand that I am not able to remove your numbers if the letter comes that way. Rgds Grace ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 07:22:02 +1200 Subject: Re: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ggithaiga at hotmail.com CC: ca at cafonso.ca; baudouin.schombe at gmail.com; david at kenic.or.ke Thanks Grace, as long as you keep our passport numbers aware from this list. Just names and countries should be fine. Sala On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 7:19 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: No problem but when the clearance is done, they might generate one list with all the names. In that case I will post it on this list. I know it is not convinient but please bear with me. Rgds Grace ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go forth and rule the World! Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 06:29:36 +1200 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ca at cafonso.ca CC: ggithaiga at hotmail.com; baudouin.schombe at gmail.com; david at kenic.or.ke Subject: Re: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted I agree. Issues are: Privacy; Identity theft possibilities - you never know.... It is administrative/logistics and can be done off list I am also grateful that the offer to help is on the table, I suppose it has expired now? Sala On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 12:47 AM, Carlos A. Afonso wrote: Dear Grace, in addition, let me suggest that people write directly to you and not to the list when sending their personal data. fraternal regards --c.a. On 09/20/2011 05:59 AM, Grace Githaiga wrote: > All > I finally got over 30 names needing visa facilitation. Those of you > coming from the US and Europe will secure your visas on arrival. There > are no hussles whatsoever. > > There are also others who can secure the visas on arrival....But if you > are from Afganistan, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Cameroun,Democratic Peoples of > Korea, Iraq, Jordan, Kosovo, Lebanon, Mali, Palestine, Senegal, Somali, > Syria and Tajikistan, then you may have to go through a more rigorous > process. > > If you are from any of these and have given me your name, then it > will be okay because we have requested the Immigration to facilitate > this process. I hope to have feedback for you either tomorrow evening or > thursday. > > Thanks for your cooperation. Pls note that if you send your name after > today, I might not be able to follow up. That is why I had requested > that you give me your names by yesterday evening. > > Kind Regards > Grace > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. Life > is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we are in. Go > forth and rule the World! > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > From: baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 09:45:54 +0100 > Subject: Re: [governance] IGF in Nairobi. Do you need visa assistance? > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ggithaiga at hotmail.com > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > 3 Nationality: congolese > > > 2011/9/17 Grace Githaiga > > > Colleagues > > Greetings. > > This is to let you know that we are now in touch with the > immigrations officials in Kenya on the visa issue. They would like > the IGF secretariat in Kenya to compile a list of those who have not > gotten a visa (if you belong to a country that requires this) and > would need facilitation. I am compiling a list for them and would > request that anyone who thinks they need this facilitation to kindly > email me the following details: > > 1. Name as it appears on passport: Baudouin SCHOMBE > 2. Passport number: OB0093228 > 3 Nationality: congolese > > We will submit this list on tuesday morning to the department of > Immigration. I therefore would like to request those needing > facilitation to provide me with their details latest monday evening. > > Rgds > Grace on behalf of Kenya IGF steering committee. > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > If you have the strength to survive, you have the power to succeed. > Life is all about choices we make depending upon the situation we > are in. Go forth and rule the World! > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, visit: > http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing > > For all other list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: > http://www.igcaucus.org/ > > Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t > > > > > > -- > SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN > CENTRE AFRICAIN D'ECHANGE CULTUREL/ > ACADEMIE DES TIC > FACILITATEUR GAID/AFRIQUE Membre > At-Large Member > NCSG Member > > email:baudouin.schombe at gmail.com > baudouin.schombe at ticafrica.net > > tél:+243998983491 > skype:b.schombe > wite web:http://webmail.ticafrica.net > blog:http://akimambo.unblog.fr > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t -- Sala " Perfect Stillness in the midst of the noise". -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From gpaque at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 15:42:13 2011 From: gpaque at gmail.com (Ginger Paque) Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2011 15:12:13 -0430 Subject: [governance] Remote and e-participation: we must make it happen In-Reply-To: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DB4247@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> References: <97657EF9087F754BBF54D3D0322DAD0F03DB4247@IQALUITMX05.nunavut.local> Message-ID: All of the sessions on the programme should have RP. If you have any difficulties, just ping me on Skype, we can work it out! Cheers... see you online! Ginger Ginger (Virginia) Paque Diplo Foundation www.diplomacy.edu/ig VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu *Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org* On 20 September 2011 14:52, Thompson, Darlene wrote: > Will all of the sessions be available for remote participation?**** > > ** ** > > Thanks,**** > > ** ** > > D**** > > ** ** > > Darlene A. Thompson**** > > Community Access Program Administrator**** > > Nunavut Dept. of Education / N-CAP**** > > P.O. Box 1000, Station 910**** > > Iqaluit, NU X0A 0H0**** > > Phone: (867) 975-5631**** > > Fax: (867) 975-5610**** > > E-mail: dthompson at gov.nu.ca**** > > ** ** > > *From:* governance at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org] *On > Behalf Of *Ginger Paque > *Sent:* Tuesday, September 20, 2011 11:31 AM > *To:* I G List > > *Subject:* [governance] Remote and e-participation: we must make it happen > **** > > ** ** > > **** > > If we could do just one thing that would make a difference to our > communication problems, to our understanding of the world, to the conflict > we live in – what should it be? We could bridge the digital divide – > dedicate more tools and resources to facilitate increased participation and > inclusion in national, regional and global policy processes. One of the > strongest resources we have for bridging that divide is e-participation. > E-participation brings people into the processes that govern the world, > ensuring that the diversity and complexity of voices are heard. Real > problems are addressed and citizens are involved in the ownership of the > solutions. **** > > Since its inception at the World Summit on the Information Society (WSIS), > the Internet Governance Forum (IGF) process has made frequent mention of the > digital divide. As the IGF matures, we have learned that the divides are > various and go beyond the traditional one of Internet access. One of the > divides is between those who can impact Internet policy and those who > cannot. Even at the most successful IGFs we do not have more than 2000 > participants. What about the remaining billions who will be impacted by > Internet policy but have no input into the process? This is where > e-participation and its potential fit in. E-participation can be as simple > as broadcasting/webcasting (remote observation). However the IGF has made > concrete steps towards moving from remote observation to actual remote > participation. Workshop, and even main session presentations are now > delivered remotely, as are audience interventions in main sessions and > workshops. E-participation is used from the beginning of the IGF work year > for open consultations by e-mail, mailing lists, and websites, to encourage > input into the planning and organisation of the agenda each year. This year, > over 35 remote hubs around the world will meet in parallel and connect to > the IGF main meeting in Nairobi, in addition to hundreds of individual > remote participants.**** > > Now that we have tested and proven the basic concept and technical > structures of e-participation, it is time to study the principles that > should guide this important tool. So Diplo is organizing Workshop 67 to be > held on 29 September at 9 a.m. Nairobi, (EAT UTC/GMT +3) where participants > and panellists will analyse and propose basic principles for e-participation > in global policy processes, as well as noting guidelines for e-participation > that emerge during the workshop.**** > > The output of this roundtable will be a draft list of principles for later > discussion. These principles will not simply be guidelines, such as: 'all > panels should have a remote moderator to interact with remote participants > and facilitate their interventions in the sessions', although we expect to > hear and note such guidelines as well. Rather, the objective of the workshop > is to gather input for principles such as (informal draft possibility) > 'E-participation, and specifically remote participation should be offered to > ensure inclusion of unheard voices in global policy process meetings.'**** > > Your ideas and input are important to this process. If you will not be in > Nairobi for the IGF, please try to join us remotely, following the links > that will be available at *www.intgovforum.org* during the IGF, from 27-30 > September. You are also invited to post your ideas here for inclusion in the > discussion. How can and should e-participation be used to reduce the digital > divide? What should be the standard e-participation framework for > international policy conferences and policy processes? Your voice is > important. Let us know!**** > > **** > > > Ginger (Virginia) Paque**** > > Diplo Foundation > www.diplomacy.edu/ig **** > > VirginiaP at diplomacy.edu > > *Join the Diplo community IG discussions: www.diplointernetgovernance.org* > **** > > ** ** > > ** ** > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, visit: http://www.igcaucus.org/unsubscribing For all other list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance To edit your profile and to find the IGC's charter, see: http://www.igcaucus.org/ Translate this email: http://translate.google.com/translate_t From salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com Tue Sep 20 15:42:39 2011 From: salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro at gmail.com (Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro) Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2011 07:42:39 +1200 Subject: [governance] List for visa assistance submitted In-Reply-To: References: <4E73F306.9080602@itforchange.net> <4E788B45.8070906@cafonso.ca> Message-ID: