R: [governance] Nobel Prize for The Internet
Rui Correia
correia.rui at gmail.com
Thu Sep 16 11:30:43 EDT 2010
Dear All
I fully agree that you can't award a prize to a "thing"/ or "system"/
"media". I mean, why then has nobody awarded a prize to the telephone, the
fax machine? Or to go wider, why has there never been a prize for
refrigeration, which has enabled the preservation of food? Or paved roads
that have enabled progress to reach remote areas. or wall paint, disk
breaks, intercontinental flights?
At most, following the Time Magazine example of making "You" the "Person of
the "Year", a prize could be awarded to all "Those who contributed to make
the internet an instrument for social upliftment and progress" - or
something similar, but not merely to ALL who contributed, because many
contributed purely with a view to making money out of the process.
My ether two cents.
On 16 September 2010 15:44, Michael Gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com> wrote:
> I think emphasizing the collective nature (co-creation) of the Internet
> is rather a good thing.
>
> Also as Mawaki says demonstrating that things are created by people is also
> a good thing.
>
> And finally emphasizing (as one would hope) the developmental and
> distributive (information and capacity), emergency response and peace
> building impacts and opportunities of the Internet would overall be a good
> thing. If nothing else it would point out for those who might need it to be
> pointed out, that the Internet is not just about making billions in the stockmarket
> or wherever.
>
> It should also be pointed out that according to some reputable sources
> http://www.city.ac.uk/whatson/2009/10_oct/291009_Peter_Willetts.html the
> actual recipient of the Prize might be equally identified as being civil
> society and our very own APC (or at least some of the originating partners)
> as other more well known individuals and agencies.
> **
> Mike
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> *From:* Mawaki Chango [mailto:kichango at gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, September 16, 2010 7:20 AM
> *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org
> *Subject:* Re: R: [governance] Nobel Prize for The Internet
>
>
> I would think the humanist idea of the prize by Nobel was aimed at
> acknowledging human agency for betterment of human conditions, peace among
> nations, etc. The internet did not create itself; people created it. The
> internet does nothing, humans connected through it do (and yes, there is a
> lot of negativity taking place among some of those people, too). The IPCC
> example is not unique: it is the same concept as when the Prize is giving to
> teams of scientists (physicists, biologists, etc.) who collaborated to
> produce the outcome/output by which their merit is being recognized.
>
> So by that standard, it'd make perfect sense to advocate that the engineers
> and scientists who worked hard to bring about the internet be nolelized, but
> we must understand that advocating for the internet itself is comparable to
> nothing done before by the N. Committee --it'd be a quantum leap, so to
> speak! It might even be fundamentally against the philosophical foundations
> and views of the Nobels as I refer to above. So don't be surprised if that
> idea qualifies as nonsense in the eyes of some.
>
> A few weeks ago, in another discussion I suggested that we may try and
> offer a definition for the internet (in the context of social action). Some
> may say it is the people connected, some other the infrastructure (both
> illustrated in this discussion) yet some others the protocol stack (just
> bare specifications), etc. So this is not a given, and as I said, there are
> people on the internet saying and doing very nasty things too, including
> against fraternity among nations.
>
> Down the proposed path, next thing you might hear is that, like the King,
> the Internet has two bodies...
>
> Mawaki
>
> On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 8:35 AM, Craig Simon <cls at rkey.com> wrote:
>
>> Hello All,
>>
>> I strongly agree with Jeanette. The "Internet" does not merit a Nobel
>> Prize. It would be a shame to award it to some incorporeal entity in light
>> of the many deserving individuals and agencies who have made great
>> sacrifices in the service of peace and human liberty, and whose cause could
>> be immediately advanced by the Nobel Committee's recognition.
>>
>> Craig Simon
>>
>>
>> On 9/16/2010 8:02 AM, Brett Solomon wrote:
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> Good discussion!
>>>
>>> If you look at the manifesto put forward by the proposers
>>> (internetforpeace.org <http://internetforpeace.org>) it's pretty clear
>>>
>>> that the award is not for the infrastructure or the person, but for the
>>> global web of users:
>>>
>>> *We have finally realized that the Internet* is much more than a network
>>> of computers. It is an endless web of people. Men and women from every
>>> corner of the globe are connecting to one another, thanks to the biggest
>>> social interface ever known to humanity.
>>> Digital culture has laid the foundations for a new kind of society. And
>>> this society is advancing dialogue, debate and consensus through
>>> communication. Because democracy has always flourished where there is
>>> openness, acceptance, discussion and participation. And contact with
>>> others has always been the most effective antidote against hatred and
>>> conflict. That's why the Internet is a tool for peace. That's why anyone
>>> who uses it can sow the seeds of non-violence. And that's why the next
>>> *Nobel Peace Prize should go to the Net. A Nobel for each and every one
>>> of us.*
>>>
>>> I understand that people who would then receive the award would be the
>>> 'founders' of the internet including Vint Cerf, Tim Berners-Lee and a
>>> few others on 'our' behalf.
>>>
>>> On balance, I would argue that many of the key drivers of conflict have
>>> been weakened as a result of the internet. Whilst it is used for violent
>>> or aggressive purposes, the internet has contributed significantly to
>>> the 'fraternity between nations' (peace prize criteria), to create
>>> political stability, to protect and promote human rights and to allow
>>> for cross border relationships.
>>>
>>> I dont feel overly strongly about this, but it is certainly a discussion
>>> starter, and waves the flag for the power of the internet to achieve
>>> peace and understanding, and serves as a warning that an open internet
>>> is worth fighting for.
>>>
>>> Brett
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Sep 16, 2010 at 2:26 PM, Jeanette Hofmann <jeanette at wzb.eu
>>> <mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> I realize I could have said a word more or two to explain why I
>>> don't support the nobel prize suggestion. One of the reasons has
>>> been brought up several times. The Internet is not a human being and
>>> therefore the wrong entity to receive this prize. The second reason
>>> is that the Internet is clearly collective achievement that can
>>> hardly be attributed to a single person. It would not be the first
>>> time that an individual gets honored for the achievements of a group
>>> of people. However, I don't understand why we would support such a
>>> practice.
>>>
>>> I apologize for my blunt statement last night. I probably thought
>>> somebody should better say no to this idea before it has a chance to
>>> catch on.
>>>
>>> jeanette
>>>
>>>
>>> On 16.09.2010 10:41, Avri Doria wrote:
>>>
>>> hi,
>>>
>>> I initially read it that way and though that Internet related
>>> sciences might be an interesting category. Not sure what the
>>> right name for the category would be.
>>>
>>> then i realized that this is probably not what the original
>>> sender meant.
>>>
>>> so I thought of the Internet in its role of bringing people
>>> together and fostering community and making the world much
>>> smaller and enabling an access to knowledge that was unthinkable
>>> for most of world history. I was not sure that this was enough
>>> to merit a Nobel prize yet because there was still so much to do
>>> and still so may warts on the Internet that needed to be fixed.
>>> but Obama got the prize for peace making before he had done
>>> anything, so I figured that maybe the Internet and the multitude
>>> of people who invested their lives into building this thing we
>>> all depend on (whether we curse it out or bless it), deserved it
>>> more than he did at the time. but i was still not convinced.
>>>
>>> then i saw the messages of this list and got very afraid of
>>> having an opinion on the topic.
>>>
>>> so please forget i said anything.
>>>
>>> a.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 16 Sep 2010, at 12:29, shaila mistry wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi all
>>> I saw it very differently. I saw the Internet as anothe
>>> category. Such as literature and science. Etc. In this
>>> context the Nobel prize would still be given to an
>>> individual. For their exceptional contributions in the field.
>>>
>>> In a skeptical note , when I look at some tecie
>>>
>>> From: Benedek, Wolfgang (wolfgang.benedek at uni-graz.at
>>> <mailto:wolfgang.benedek at uni-graz.at>)<
>>> wolfgang.benedek at uni-graz.at
>>> <mailto:wolfgang.benedek at uni-graz.at>>;
>>>
>>> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org
>>> <mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org><governance at lists.cpsr.org
>>> <mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org>>;
>>> parminder<parminder at itforchange.net
>>> <mailto:parminder at itforchange.net>>;
>>>
>>> Subject: Re: R: [governance] Nobel Prize for The Internet
>>> Sent: Thu, Sep 16, 2010 1:49:49 AM
>>>
>>> May I endorse the thoughts of Parminder, I do not see what
>>> can really be gained by the nobel prize for the internet,
>>> different from giving it to UNHCR, AI etc to point out their
>>> good work as a model for humanity and support their concerns.
>>>
>>> Wolfgang Benedek
>>>
>>>
>>> Am 16.09.10 10:17 schrieb "parminder"
>>> unter<parminder at itforchange.net
>>> <mailto:parminder at itforchange.net>>:
>>>
>>>
>>> I am sorry, but I hate to give human status to any
>>> artifact.... even the Internet... And Nobel prize is for
>>> human beings, maybe the best among them or whatever.....
>>> Next we may hear is that 'the Internet has rights'..... not
>>> at all going in good directions if you ask me :)
>>>
>>> (At a recent conf i was given this T shirt - dont think what
>>> the Internet can do you you - think what you can do to the
>>> Internet -- this kind of expressions almost scare me, and
>>> make me feel belittled as a human being in front of a
>>> 'system'... Well if we are insistent on going down that path
>>> then lets give noble prize to the 'system' instead, the all
>>> powerful one)
>>>
>>> parmindr
>>>
>>> On Thursday 16 September 2010 01:26 PM, Fiorello Cortiana
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> We have to be pragmatic, the Nobel Prize to the net could be
>>> useful to
>>> recognize it as a commons, the wider public space in the
>>> human history, not
>>> a new infrastructure after telegraph, telephon, radio,
>>> television and PC. This is why we need an extension of the
>>> rights in
>>> a new way: multilevel and multistakeholder. I know what I
>>> say under
>>> Berlusconi's Government the freedom of expression on the
>>> net is in peril.
>>> With Stefano Rodotà and many other we gathered 400.000
>>> signatures under an
>>> appeal against an awful proposal of law and this time we
>>> won. Ready to the next one :)
>>>
>>> Fiorello
>>>
>>> -----Messaggio originale-----
>>> Da: Carlos A. Afonso [mailto:ca at cafonso.ca
>>> <mailto:ca at cafonso.ca>]
>>> Inviato: giovedì 16 settembre 2010 9.30
>>> A: governance at lists.cpsr.org
>>> <mailto:governance at lists.cpsr.org>; Jeanette Hofmann
>>>
>>> Cc: Shahzad Ahmad
>>> Oggetto: Re: [governance] Nobel Prize for The Internet
>>>
>>> I of course agree with Jean, although perhaps I would not
>>> phrase it as bluntly :)
>>>
>>> --c.a.
>>>
>>> On 09/15/2010 07:20 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I think this is a real rubbish idea and I am very much
>>> against sending
>>> any message to that effect.
>>> jeanette
>>>
>>> On 15.09.2010 16:05, Shahzad Ahmad wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I suggest that one of CS representative strongly raise the
>>> support
>>> for the Nobel Prize for the Internet either in the closing
>>> session or
>>> in regular interventions in the plenary. It will be good if
>>> IGF sends
>>> a strong message out on this.
>>>
>>> Best wishes and regards
>>>
>>> Shahzad
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Brett Solomon
>>> Executive Director
>>> Access
>>> accessnow.org <http://accessnow.org>
>>>
>>> ____________________________________________________________
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>
>
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--
_________________________
Rui Correia
Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant
Angola Liaison Consultant
2 Cutten St
Horison
Roodepoort-Johannesburg,
South Africa
Tel/ Fax (+27-11) 766-4336
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