From parminder at itforchange.net Mon Dec 1 00:10:32 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 10:40:32 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting, and IGF CS speakers Message-ID: <20081201051041.0A33DA6C50@smtp2.electricembers.net> Hi All Just to reconfirm that IGC members at the IGF will meet on the 2nd December. Quoting from an earlier email sent by Meryem "I can now confirm that IGC meeting will be held in the same room as GigaNet Symposium, i.e. Meeting Rooms 1.03 and 1.04 combined (HICC 1st floor). The IGF secretariat agreed that we keep this room for the IGC meeting until 20:30. This room seats 150 persons." Also, I am glad to inform that among the speakers recommended by the IGC for CS slots at the opening and closing session, Graciela and Alice have been invited to speak at the opening, and Anita at the closing. IGC members present at the IGF will try and keep others posted about the events and activities here. Thanks. Parminder -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr Mon Dec 1 04:30:48 2008 From: jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr (jlfullsack) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 10:30:48 +0100 Subject: [governance] RE: ITU and ICANN - a loveless forced marriage References: <16329BE3074F4ED280A7FBCF298C19CA@IAN> Message-ID: RE: ITU and ICANN - a loveless forced marriageThis statement of the ITU Secretary general is by far less questionable than a lot of other statements made in this long speach at the Cairo ICANN meeting. But unfortunately it is'nt complete. He forgot to mention ITU's responsibilities in that issue. At least in the time-wasting way of leading the whole post-WSISI process, of which IGF is just one part. As for me, I took my time for reading the whole stuff and found a lot of other, even more questionable statements : - Mr Touré was confusing the respective role of ITU and ICANN, and what's more, their statutes ! - "It (the ITU) is the most inclusive organization of the UN family". May I recall that I was waiting on the door before the beginning of the ITU-Unesco chaired WSIS facilitators meeting last september in Genva. I asked both chairs (Mr Khan and Mr Touré) for being allowed -as a WSIS accredited membrer of CS- to only sit in the room for listening. Whereas the Unesco chair agreed with a smile, the ITU refused firmly ! Unless to say I was angry, having been for more than twenty years an ITU senior expert (in both development and standardisation sectors). Moreover, nowhere we find a clear explanation on this "CS inclusiveness" of the ITU : who are the these "CS members" ? How much do they pay, and on which criteria are they selected ? - "But it (WSIS) was the most inclusive Summit ever". That's not true Mr Touré : the Jo'burg Earth Summit (and the following Stockholm Summit) was far more and really CS inclusicve, and the whole press, national, regional and international papers, regularly reported on it. This wasn't the case of the WSIS, despite desperate attempts of its "communicators" the fist of which the ITU. -" Our members need to be informed about those things" (Internet of things, IPv6) "And we are doing that. The resolution from the WTSA last week, taken by our 191 member states and 700 companies, private companies , is to study and encourage the implementation of IPv6. I believe this is a concern for all of us." OK but, Please, where is the CS in this process ? We need social and economic impacts to be studied in relation to new technologies as soon as at the early stage of their design and their actual impact is is to be assesed preferably before they are deployed. This applies for both developed and developing countries (even more stringently in the latter). We need a more serious and profound job to be done in this field and this isn't the scope of ITU mandate ! Where are we, the WSIS CS, in this field ? IGF is just one of these paramount issues and is therefore relevant in the open and urgent debate. Wolgang raised the question of CS inclusion in the ITU after this speach. That was fine. But once Hamadoun Touré had delivered his biased (and partly false) response, our CS fellow didn't question the ITU Head. It was Ambassador Karklins who answered him : "It was very interesting to listen to you. You are on the record, and I believe that many member states who are listening to you will bring what you have said to the council in ITU". Thank you, Janis Karklins ! This is the point the CS participating member(s) had just missed ! All the best Jean-Louis Fullsack (----- Original Message ----- From: David Allen To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Cc: gov at wsis-gov.org Sent: Sunday, November 30, 2008 4:57 AM Subject: [governance] RE: ITU and ICANN - a loveless forced marriage At 4:32 PM +1100 11/9/08, Ian Peter wrote: The telling statement from ITU being "I am personally of the opinion that the IGF is continuously going round in circles and avoiding issues - it is becoming more and more a waste of time." Interested in analysis of how we can avoid this. One suggestion: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/Contributions-Sept_2008/IGF%20multi-stakeholderism%20-%20D%20Allen.pdf My fear here is that the outcomes if IGF doesn't succeed in addressing the real issues are worse than those ... Ian Peter Sorry for the delay in responding, David ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Mon Dec 1 04:44:40 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2008 09:44:40 +0000 Subject: [governance] [Fwd: Civil society speakers] Message-ID: <4933B208.4080405@wzb.eu> Hi everyone, please find below the response to our suggestions for CS speakers for the opening and closing panels in Hyderabad. Dear Jeanette, I suppose you are on your way to Hyderabad. Many thanks for your suggestions for civil socuety speakers for the opening and closing sessions. It is my pleasure to inform you that Alice and Graciela have been invited to speak at the opening session and Anita at the closing session. I have sent an email to the three of them and ask them to prepare a short and concise address of up to five minutes - the shorter the better! Feel free to share this email with whoever you wish. Best regards Markus ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From anja at itforchange.net Mon Dec 1 21:22:06 2008 From: anja at itforchange.net (Anja Kovacs) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 07:52:06 +0530 Subject: [governance] Defending the public and egalitarian nature of the Internet Message-ID: <49349BCE.10009@itforchange.net> Dear all, Many of us tend to take the commons and the public nature of the Internet for granted. However, increasing corporatisation and control of the Internet are strongly threatening these fundamental characteristics of the Internet as we know it. In this context, six Indian civil society organisations, have proposed an open letter to the UN Internet Governance Forum which meets for its third annual meeting between 3rd and 6th December in Hyderabad. The letter exhorts urgent global action to ensure that the public and the egalitarian nature of the Internet are preserved as its essential features. The possibilities of democracy, equity and social justice in our societies will be significantly impacted by the extent to which we can achieve this objective. The proposed letter is pasted below. If you and/or your organization would be happy to endorse this letter, please indicate so in response to this email by the midnight of 4 December (India time). It would be wonderful if we could include your name in the list of signatories, and give a strong signal from civil society in India and abroad on these issues. The proposed open letter can also be accessed at http://www.itforchange.net/component/content/article/195-igf-open-letter.html Best wishes, Anja ------------------------------------------------------------ * * * An Open Letter to the UN Internet Governance Forum (IGF) * * for its 3rd Annual Meeting at Hyderabad, India, from 3rd to 6th December, 2008 * * The IGF must ACT NOW against the threat to the public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet * The undersigned wish to express their deep concern that the UN Internet Governance Forum (IGF), created by the World Summit on the Information Society in 2005 as an Internet ‘policy dialogue’ forum, is largely failing to address key public interest and policy issues in global Internet governance – including that of democratic deficit. *Who shapes the Internet, as the Internet shapes our new social context?* The Internet represents the single most important technical advance of our society in a long time, so much so that it defines a new emerging social paradigm. The basic characteristics of the Internet determine the contours of the emerging social order in many important ways. The Internet was conceived as, and still largely is, an extensive communication system which is democratizing, and has little respect for established social hierarchies. Interactions and associations built over this new ‘techno-social’ system have, therefore, held the promise of a more egalitarian society. The era of innocence of the Internet however appears to be fast approaching its end. Today, the Internet of the future – the very near future – is being shaped insidiously by dominant forces to further their interests. (See the fact-sheet on the following page for some illustrations of this.) Unfortunately, global policy forums have largely failed to articulate, much less act on, crucial Internet policy issues, which concern the democratic possibilities for our societies. *The IGF needs to act now!* As the Internet Governance Forum convenes for its third annual meeting, between 3rd and 6th December, 2008, in Hyderabad, India, it must take immediate steps to anchor and discuss important global public interest and policy issues involved in Internet governance. If it does not act now, it may get seen as a space that only provides an illusion of a public policy dialogue, and, consequently, as being co-opted in furthering the agenda of dominant forces that are shaping the Internet as per their narrow interests. *We therefore strongly urge the IGF to directly address the following key global public interest and policy issues: 1. Increasing corporatisation of the Internet 2. Increasing proprietisation of standards and code that go into building the Internet 3. Increasing points of control being embedded into the Internet in the name of security and intellectual property violations 4. Huge democratic deficit in global Internet governance * We exhort the IGF to adopt clear directions for engaging with these crucial public policy issues. The IGF should come out with a clear work plan at its forthcoming meeting in Hyderabad to address the four key areas listed above. The global community – comprising not only people who currently have access to the Internet, but also the un-connected billions who are being impacted by it nevertheless – will judge the meaningfulness and legitimacy of the IGF in terms of what progress it is able to make on these issues. * Alternative Law Forum, Bangalore Centre for Internet and Society, Bangalore Delhi Science Forum, New Delhi Free Software Foundation - India IT for Change, Bangalore Knowledge Commons, New Delhi * *For endorsements and/or more information, please contact* Anja Kovacs email: anja (at) itforchange.net, tel: +91 80 266554134, mobile: +91 9611747212 ------------------------------------------------------------ * Information Sheet How the Public-ness and Egalitarian Nature of the Internet is Threatened Some Examples Corporatisation of the Internet* Largely unsuspected by most of its users, the Internet is rapidly changing from being a vast ‘public sphere’, with a fully public ownership and a non-proprietary nature, to a set of corporatised privately-owned networks. On the one hand, telecom companies are carving out the Internet into privately-owned networks – controlling the nature of transactions over these networks. They seek to differentially charge content providers, while also building wholly private networks offering exclusive content relay services. Developments like video/TV over Internet Protocol and the provision of controlled and selective Internet services over mobiles are contributing to increasing network-operators’ control over the Internet, with a corresponding erosion of its public-ness. On the other hand, the commons of the Internet is also being overwhelmed and squeezed out by a complete domination of a few privately owned mega-applications such as Google, Facebook, Youtube etc. Proprietarisation of standards and code that build the Internet One of the main ways of appropriating the commons of the Internet is through the increasing use of proprietary and closed standards and code in building the Internet system. Such appropriation allows the extortion of illegitimate rent out of the many new forms of commons-based activities that are being made possible through the Internet. Embedding control points in the Internet A growing confluence of corporatist and statist interests has led to the embedding of more and more means of control into the Internet in a manner that greatly compromises citizens’ rights and freedoms. Whether it is the pressure on Internet Service Providers to examine Internet traffic for ‘intellectual property’ violations; or imposition of cultural and political controls on the Internet by states within their boundaries; or ITU’s work on IP trace-back mechanisms; or the tightening of US control over the global Internet infrastructure in the name of securing the root zone file and the domain name system, these new forms of controlling the Internet are being negotiated among dominant interests away from public scrutiny and wider public interest-based engagements. Democratic deficit in global Internet governance The current global Internet governance regime – a new-age privatized governance system professing allegiance mostly to a single country, the US – has proven to be an active instrument of perpetuation of dominant commercial and geo-political interests. Lately, OECD countries have begun some work on developing public policy principles that, due to the inherently global nature of the Internet, can be expected to become globally applicable. It is quite unacceptable that OECD countries shirk from discussing the same public policy issues at global public policy forums like the IGF that they discuss among themselves at OECD meetings. Apparently, developing countries are expected to focus on finding ways to reach connectivity to their people, and not burden themselves with higher-level Internet governance issues! People’s and communities’ right to self-determination and participation in governance of issues that impact their lives should underpin global Internet governance. -- Dr. Anja Kovacs Senior Research Associate IT for Change Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities Tel: (00-91-80) 2665 4134, 2653 6890 www.ITforChange.net www.IS-Watch.net http://India.IS-Watch.net ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lists at privaterra.info Mon Dec 1 23:13:42 2008 From: lists at privaterra.info (Robert Guerra) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 09:43:42 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGF Hyderabad - Interview of participants .. Message-ID: I wanted to share the URL of the bambuser.com archivewhere I am uploading short video interviews of IGF participants. The participants are asked a standard set of questions: - Name - Affiliation - Country from - Issues they see as leading issues / Topics for this year's IGF - Comments to internet users who can not attend this year's IGF. The videos are streamed live, and then archived. The comment feature is enabled - and as such, ask members of this list to comment on interviews and/or post ideas on additional questions that should be asked. Some 10 interviews are now online. My aim, if possible is to interview at least 100 participants. http://bambuser.com/node/53968 regards Robert -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Mon Dec 1 23:25:21 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 09:55:21 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF Message-ID: <20081202042540.7F10067824@smtp1.electricembers.net> Dear All As mentioned earlier, IGC members attending the IGF will meet today from 1830 to 2030, in Rooms 1.03 and 1.04 combined (HICC 1st floor), the same place where Giganet meeting is taking is place. Please let us know if you want anything in particular to be taken up at the meeting. As an IGC member I propose the following three items for the agenda 1. IGC organizational issues - elections etc. Also, whether, and if so, how, a funding proposal for the IGC has to be explored (as discussed earlier on the list) 2. Strategy to engage with ITU, especially with regard to the forthcoming ITU policy forum. 3. At IGF, Hyderabad, how to push the agenda of seeking to have 'rights and the Internet' or a 'rights based approach to IG' as the over-arching theme for IGF, Egypt. Pl add other issues you want to be taken up. Thanks. Parminder -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Mon Dec 1 23:32:10 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 10:02:10 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF In-Reply-To: <20081202042540.7F10067824@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <20081202043228.90400A6C8A@smtp2.electricembers.net> It is also customary at the IGC @ IGF meetings to discuss key issues that are likely to come up at the IGF, IGC members' engagements with these issues, and other specific activities that IGC members may be planning at the IGF. Parminder _____ From: Parminder [mailto:parminder at itforchange.net] Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 9:55 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF Dear All As mentioned earlier, IGC members attending the IGF will meet today from 1830 to 2030, in Rooms 1.03 and 1.04 combined (HICC 1st floor), the same place where Giganet meeting is taking is place. Please let us know if you want anything in particular to be taken up at the meeting. As an IGC member I propose the following three items for the agenda 1. IGC organizational issues - elections etc. Also, whether, and if so, how, a funding proposal for the IGC has to be explored (as discussed earlier on the list) 2. Strategy to engage with ITU, especially with regard to the forthcoming ITU policy forum. 3. At IGF, Hyderabad, how to push the agenda of seeking to have 'rights and the Internet' or a 'rights based approach to IG' as the over-arching theme for IGF, Egypt. Pl add other issues you want to be taken up. Thanks. Parminder -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Mon Dec 1 01:36:51 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sun, 30 Nov 2008 22:36:51 -0800 Subject: [governance] Citizen safeguards striked out in EU Council Message-ID: <49338603.F395BB18@ix.netcom.com> All, More troubles facing an Internet Bill of Rights... Some of our attending members reported and took notice that no IGC input to the EC had been recieved... See: http://www.laquadrature.net/en/citizen-safeguards-striked-out-in-EU-council Citizen safeguards striked out in EU Council ** Paris, November 27th 2008 atThe EU Council reached a political agreement on the telecommunication reform (Telecoms Package) on thursday, Nov. 27th. On one hand, crucial modifications to the text finally doom Nicolas Sarkozy's project to impose graduated response to the whole Europe. On the other hand, important safeguards to citizen's fundamental rights and freedoms were deleted. The agreed text lowers the protection of privacy in the EU, in the name of œsecurity. ** During last weeks, citizens from many European countries[1] raised awareness of their ministers representatives in Council on the Telecoms Package, by meeting them, sending letters, alerting the press, etc. This intense activity undoubtedly helped modifying critical parts of the text agreed by the ministers of the twenty-seven Member States. The dispositions imposing the graduated response scheme in the European Union (or œthree strikes and you're out) were neutralized in the Council's version. This is a striking blow at the entertainment industries who spent much effort[2] in promoting it. But the agreed text contains major problems: * An unacceptable revision has been made to Art.6, par.6 of ePrivay directive[3], allowing private operators to collect and process traffic data and exonerate from current privacy rules. This exoneration is so broad that it allows any web company to process any citizen's[4] data for broad, undefined purposes and for a potentially infinite duration. This is a frightening decline, openly ignoring the European Data Protection Supervisor (EDPS)'s recommendations[5] that were followed by the European Parliament. * The Bono/Cohn-Bendit/Roithova amendment 138 (Art.8, par.4 (ga) of the Framework directive), restating an essential principle of protection of fundamental rights and freedom in European law, has been removed. Deletion of amendment 138, on the vague pretext that the wording was too broad, is in opposition with the democratic expression of 88% of the Members of European Parliament (MEPs) and the European Commission. It clearly shows from the Council a disturbing lack of political courage in protecting citizens' fundamental rights and Freedom. * The dispositions related to œcooperation in the promotion of lawful content (Art.33 par.2a of Universal Service directive), still included in the text, must be deleted as well as the related recital (12c). These texts were pushed by the French cinema lobby to introduce the graduated response. Their vague wording could still be used by national governments to violate fundamental rights of their citizens until a European court remind them the law. This is exactly what France aims to do in few weeks with its graduated response law. It is not tolerable that the Council deleted crucial implementations of fundamental principles. The Council lets Nicolas Sarkozy free to violate French citizen's rights with his national project of 'graduated response'. The Commissioner, Viviane Reding, has been quite alone not to share this Pilate's position. The Commission even recalled today[6] that this project is a freedom-killer explained Gearald Sédrati-Dinet, analyst for La Quadrature du Net (Squaring the Net). The Council's agreement failed to protect fundamental rights by deleting two important safeguards. Let's hope the European Parliament will fight against industry lobbies during the second reading and finally clean up the whole package. No compromise must be made in preserving the right to a due process and privacy in the digital environnement.? concluded Jeremie Zimmermann, co-founder and coordinator of La Quadrature. Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From robin at ipjustice.org Tue Dec 2 02:36:13 2008 From: robin at ipjustice.org (Robin Gross) Date: Mon, 1 Dec 2008 23:36:13 -0800 Subject: [governance] =?WINDOWS-1252?Q?A2K@IGF_Dynamic_Coalition_Session:?= =?WINDOWS-1252?Q?_Fri._5_Dec._@_16:00_in_Room_4_(HICC)_=93Access_to_Knowl?= =?WINDOWS-1252?Q?edge_and_Freedom_of_Expression_Policies_for_the_Developm?= =?WINDOWS-1252?Q?ent_of_a_Global_Information_Economy=94?= Message-ID: <4070D952-2493-49C7-BB9C-E0B9EB7FC0FB@ipjustice.org> Internet Governance Forum (IGF) 2008 Hyderabad, INDIA A2K at IGF Dynamic Coalition Session Date: 5 December 2008 (Friday) Time: 16:00 – 17:30 Location: Room 4, Hyderabad International Conference Center (HICC) Panel Session Title: “Access to Knowledge and Freedom of Expression Policies for the Development of a Global Information Economy” Moderator: Ms. Lea SHAVER Yale Law School Information Society Project Panel Speakers: Mr. Richard OWENS World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO), Director Presentation Topic: WIPO Development Agenda progress update Ms. Gitanjli DUGGAL Google India, Attorney Presentation Topic: Role of limitations and exceptions to exclusive rights in information economy Mr. Bassem AWAD African Copyright and Access to Knowledge (ACA2K) Project Chief Judge, Egyptian Ministry of Justice Presentation Topic: A2K Initiatives in Africa (lessons learned) Mr. Eddan KATZ Electronic Frontier Foundation, International Affairs Director Presentation Topic: Threat to IPR Multilateralism Norm-Setting from the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement (ACTA) Mr. Jose MUILO Brazilian Ministry of Culture, Advisor Presentation Topic: The Brazilian Digital Culture Experience & Democratizing Knowledge Mr. Stuart HAMILTON International Federation of Library Associations and Institutions (IFLA), Senior Policy Advisor Presentation Topic: Needs of libraries in an electronic information society IP JUSTICE Robin Gross, Executive Director 1192 Haight Street, San Francisco, CA 94117 USA p: +1-415-553-6261 f: +1-415-462-6451 w: http://www.ipjustice.org e: robin at ipjustice.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch Tue Dec 2 03:33:09 2008 From: william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch (William Drake) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 14:03:09 +0530 Subject: [governance] Development Agenda workshop at IGF Message-ID: <840416C9-65E5-4FDA-A824-F4EC5E984611@graduateinstitute.ch> Workshop 49. A Development Agenda for Internet Governance: From Principle to Practice Friday 5 December 2008 16:00-17:30, room 6 A development agenda is a holistic program of analysis and action intended to mainstream development considerations into the procedures and policy outputs of global governance mechanisms. In recent years, many stakeholders have worked to promote such agendas in the multilateral institutions dealing with such issues as international trade and intellectual property. But in the field of global Internet governance, there has not been any debate about whether a development agenda could be functionally effective and politically feasible. To begin filling this gap, a workshop entitled, Toward a Development Agenda for Internet Governance was held at the 2nd IGF in Rio de Janeiro on 14 November 2007. Participants who spoke to the point in this lively multistakeholder session agreed that in principle, a properly configured and consensual development agenda could help to promote a more open, accessible, diverse, and secure global Internet. They also agreed that the IGF provides the right venue for further non-binding dialogue on the possible substance and modalities of a development agenda. Accordingly, the proposed workshop would provide the expected follow-up to the discussion in Rio. It would move beyond the question of whether a development agenda is desirable in principle to consider what this might actually involve in practice. Two sets of questions would be explored. The first concerns the possible substantive focus of such an agenda. This could include assessing both the policy outputs of governance mechanisms pertaining to Internet infrastructures and their use for networked information, communication, and commerce (the vertical dimension); and procedural or institutional issues, such as the transparency and inclusive participation called for by the WSIS principles on Internet governance (the horizontal dimension). In both cases, current activities could be assessed in relation to developmental objectives in order to identify potentially generalizable best practices and lessons learned that organizations could choose to consider when pursuing their respective work programs. The second set of questions to be explored concerns the operational aspects of establishing and promoting a development agenda. Given the highly distributed character of the Internet governance ecosystem, such an agenda would need to be flexibly configured so as to facilitate variable responses in accordance with the specific characteristics of the governmental, private sector and multistakeholder mechanisms involved. This and other parameters of the Internet environment would require an innovative, multistakeholder model that is informed by but different from other development agenda experiences. The workshop theme is very important, as it concerns ways to enhance the fit between Internet governance and the needs and interests of developing and transitional countries. This is of direct relevance to the IGF and its mandate, and to the overarching IG4D framing of its meetings. Moderator: William J. Drake, Senior Associate, Centre for International Governance, Graduate Institute for International and Development Studies, Geneva, Switzerland Panelists: Fiona Alexander, Associate Administrator (Head of Office) for International Affairs, National Telecommunications and Information Administration, Department of Commerce, Government of the United States Olga Cavalli, Advisor to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs, and representative to the Governmental Advisor Committee of ICANN, Government of Argentina Raul Echeberría, Executive Director, LACNIC (Internet Address Registry for Latin America and the Caribbean), Uruguay Anriette Esterhuysen, Executive Director, Association for Progressive Communications, South Africa Jose Vitor Carvalho Hansem, Deputy Head of the Division of Science and Technology, Ministry of External Relations, Government of Brazil Co-Organizers: Centre for International Governance, Graduate Institute for International and Development Studies, Geneva, Switzerland Federal Office of Communication, Government of Switzerland Association for Progressive Communications Consultative Committee on UN Information Technology, China Association for Science and Technology Diplo Foundation Internet Society of China Ian Peter and Associates Pty Ltd. Panos Institute West Africa, Cipaco Project *********************************************************** William J. Drake Senior Associate Centre for International Governance Graduate Institute of International and Development Studies Geneva, Switzerland william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch *********************************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From anita at itforchange.net Tue Dec 2 05:47:00 2008 From: anita at itforchange.net (Anita Gurumurthy) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 16:17:00 +0530 Subject: [governance] Meeting of the Gender Dynamic Coalition Message-ID: <49351224.5080109@itforchange.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From Lee.HIBBARD at coe.int Tue Dec 2 06:21:08 2008 From: Lee.HIBBARD at coe.int (HIBBARD Lee) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 12:21:08 +0100 Subject: [governance] Art 8 ECHR / Internet / anonymity Message-ID: <36E35F3FE67D164C987547AB8F3DB8EC03A95B42@OBELIX.key.coe.int> Press release issued by the Registrar CHAMBER JUDGMENT K.U. v. FINLAND The European Court of Human Rights has today notified in writing its Chamber judgment1 in the case of K.U. v. Finland (application no. 2872/02). The Court held unanimously that there had been a violation of Article 8 (right to respect for private and family life) of the European Convention on Human Rights concerning the Finnish authorities' failure to protect a child's right to respect for private life following an advertisement of a sexual nature being posted about him on an Internet dating site. Under Article 41 (just satisfaction) of the Convention, the Court awarded K.U. 3,000 euros (EUR) in respect of non-pecuniary damage. (The judgment is available only in English.) 1. Principal facts The applicant, K.U., is a Finnish national who was born in 1986. The case concerned the applicant's complaint that an advertisement of a sexual nature was posted about him on an Internet dating site and that, under Finnish legislation in place at the time, the police and the courts could not require the Internet provider to identify the person who had posted the ad. In March 1999 an unknown individual posted the ad on an Internet dating site in the name of the applicant without his knowledge. The applicant was 12 years old at the time. The ad mentioned his age and year of birth and gave a detailed description of his physical characteristics. There was also a link to the applicant's web page where his picture and telephone number, accurate save for one digit, could be found. The ad announced that he was looking for an intimate relationship with a boy of his age or older "to show him the way". The applicant became aware of that announcement when he received an e-mail from a man, offering to meet him and "to then see what he wanted". The applicant's father requested the police to identify the person who had posted the ad in order to bring charges. The service provider, however, refused as it considered itself bound by the confidentiality of telecommunications as defined under Finnish law. In a decision issued on 19 January 2001, Helsinki District Court also refused the police's request under the Criminal Investigations Act to oblige the service provider to divulge the identity of the person who had posted the ad. It found that there was no explicit legal provision in such a case, considered under domestic law to concern calumny, which could oblige the service provider to disregard professional secrecy and disclose such information. Subsequently the Court of Appeal upheld that decision and the Supreme Court refused leave to appeal. 2. Procedure and composition of the Court The application was lodged with the European Court of Human Rights on 1 January 2002 and declared admissible on 27 June 2006. Judgment was given by a Chamber of seven judges, composed as follows: Nicolas Bratza (United Kingdom), President, Lech Garlicki (Poland), Giovanni Bonello (Malta), Ljiljana Mijović (Bosnia and Herzegovina), David Thór Björgvinsson (Iceland), Ján Šikuta (Slovakia), Päivi Hirvelä (Finland), judges, and also Lawrence Early, Section Registrar. 3. Summary of the judgment2 Complaints Relying on Articles 8 (right to respect for private and family life) and 13 (right to an effective remedy), the applicant complained about the invasion of his private life and the fact that no effective remedy existed under Finnish law to reveal the identity of the person who had posted the ad about him on the Internet dating site. Decision of the Court Article 8 Although in terms of domestic law the applicant's case was considered from the point of view of calumny, the Court preferred to highlight the notion of private life, given the potential threat to the boy's physical and mental welfare and his vulnerable age. The Court considered that the posting of the Internet advertisement about the applicant had been a criminal act which had resulted in a minor having been a target for paedophiles. It recalled that such conduct called for a criminal-law response and that effective deterrence had to be reinforced through adequate investigation and prosecution. Moreover, children and other vulnerable individuals were entitled to protection by the State from such grave interferences with their private life. The incident had taken place in 1999, that is, at a time when it had been well-known that the Internet, precisely because of its anonymous character, could be used for criminal purposes. The widespread problem of child sexual abuse had also become well-known over the preceding decade. It could not therefore be argued that the Finnish Government had not had the opportunity to put in place a system to protect children from being targeted by paedophiles via the Internet. Indeed, the legislature should have provided a framework for reconciling the confidentiality of Internet services with the prevention of disorder or crime and the protection of the rights and freedoms of others. Although such a framework has subsequently been introduced under the Exercise of Freedom of Expression in Mass Media Act, it had not been in place at the relevant time, with the result that Finland had failed to protect the right to respect for the applicant's private life as the confidentiality requirement had been given precedence over his physical and moral welfare. The Court therefore found that there had been a violation of Article 8. Article 13 Given the finding under Article 8, the Court considered that there was no need to examine the complaint under Article 13. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: KU c Finlande.doc Type: application/msword Size: 78336 bytes Desc: KU c Finlande.doc URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: KU v Finland.doc Type: application/msword Size: 80896 bytes Desc: KU v Finland.doc URL: From guru at itforchange.net Tue Dec 2 07:47:55 2008 From: guru at itforchange.net (Guru) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 18:17:55 +0530 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head Message-ID: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> While we debate on 'Internet for All' at IGF .. the USG is already thinking of making it happen ... Guru http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122809560499668087.html?mod=rss_whats_news_technology Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the wireless industry and some consumer groups. At its December meeting, the FCC could also consider new rules designed to speed up consideration of disputes between independent cable programmers and cable providers such as Time Warner Cable Inc. and Comcast Corp., which either refuse to carry some channels or put them on specialty tiers of service that cost subscribers more. The agency also will ask for more feedback on its proposal to require programmers to sell their channels to cable operators individually instead of in bundles. The free Internet plan is the most controversial issue the agency will tackle in December. Mr. Martin shelved plans to consider a wider variety of sticky issues pending at the agency, including a request by the Hollywood studios to hobble TVs and set-top boxes so studios can offer copy-protected theatrical releases sooner. The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is part of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that would have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could be slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. -- Gurumurthy Kasinathan IT for Change www.ITforChange.net Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr Tue Dec 2 08:05:08 2008 From: jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr (jlfullsack) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 14:05:08 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF References: <20081202042540.7F10067824@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <15313D38C9AF4822A71B711740C0DFC5@PCbureau> Dear Parminder The second point you are proposing seems very accurate for me. The ITU "World Telecommunication Policy Forum on Telecommunications" is scheduled in April next year. The "Informal Expert Group" created by a decision of the ITU Council, hold so far two meetings (last one one week ago in Geneva) for preparing this event. It is composed of 67 member states represnttativs and of 18 sector members. Unless to say that there are NO CS members in that body (we are at ITU, folks !). It would be therefore necessary to establish contacts with this group for submitting it the most relevant conclusions of the 3rd IGF, as inputs to the World Forum, but only as far as they are supported by the CS organisations concerned. May be that an "informal CS working group" on ITU issues (i.a. reforming the ITU and CS inclusion, role of the ITU in Internet governance) will be established in the meantime and will be able for submitting some concrete proposals before this ITU event. All the best Jean-Louis fullsack ----- Original Message ----- From: Parminder To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 5:25 AM Subject: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF Dear All As mentioned earlier, IGC members attending the IGF will meet today from 1830 to 2030, in Rooms 1.03 and 1.04 combined (HICC 1st floor), the same place where Giganet meeting is taking is place. Please let us know if you want anything in particular to be taken up at the meeting. As an IGC member I propose the following three items for the agenda 1.. IGC organizational issues - elections etc. Also, whether, and if so, how, a funding proposal for the IGC has to be explored (as discussed earlier on the list) 2.. Strategy to engage with ITU, especially with regard to the forthcoming ITU policy forum. 3.. At IGF, Hyderabad, how to push the agenda of seeking to have 'rights and the Internet' or a 'rights based approach to IG' as the over-arching theme for IGF, Egypt. Pl add other issues you want to be taken up. Thanks. Parminder ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Tue Dec 2 10:36:28 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 10:36:28 -0500 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Guru, Sorry to be the voice of cynicism here, but the proposal is more about increasing Mr. Martin's post-FCC income (as consultant/lobbyist)than USG providing free Internet for all any time soon. Lee -----Original Message----- From: Guru [mailto:guru at itforchange.net] Sent: Tue 12/2/2008 7:47 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head While we debate on 'Internet for All' at IGF .. the USG is already thinking of making it happen ... Guru http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122809560499668087.html?mod=rss_whats_news_technology Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the wireless industry and some consumer groups. At its December meeting, the FCC could also consider new rules designed to speed up consideration of disputes between independent cable programmers and cable providers such as Time Warner Cable Inc. and Comcast Corp., which either refuse to carry some channels or put them on specialty tiers of service that cost subscribers more. The agency also will ask for more feedback on its proposal to require programmers to sell their channels to cable operators individually instead of in bundles. The free Internet plan is the most controversial issue the agency will tackle in December. Mr. Martin shelved plans to consider a wider variety of sticky issues pending at the agency, including a request by the Hollywood studios to hobble TVs and set-top boxes so studios can offer copy-protected theatrical releases sooner. The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is part of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that would have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could be slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. -- Gurumurthy Kasinathan IT for Change www.ITforChange.net Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From anriette at apc.org Tue Dec 2 11:33:26 2008 From: anriette at apc.org (Anriette Esterhuysen) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 18:33:26 +0200 Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night Message-ID: <1228235606.6650.8.camel@anriette-laptop> Dear all We have identified a really good venue with great food (not difficult in Hyderabad) for our customary dinner of APC people and friends and colleagues. The party will be on Friday, 5 December from 18h45 onwards. Venue: Ginger Court Restaurant (Galaxy Rooftop Bar) Madhapur, before Hi-Tech City, Hyderabad (it is in the same road as Hi-Tech City) Tel 040 23113731/32/33 Please let me and Karen (karenb at gn.apc.org) know if you are coming and more or less how many people you will bring. We will let you know what the cost will be. Please pass this around and looking forward to seeing you there. Anriette -- ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ anriette esterhuysen - executive director association for progressive communications p o box 29755 melville - south africa 2109 anriette at apc.org - tel/fax + 27 11 726 1692 http://www.apc.org ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Tue Dec 2 12:52:47 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 04:52:47 +1100 Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night In-Reply-To: <1228235606.6650.8.camel@anriette-laptop> Message-ID: <17B75DADF49E496C895B0AEB10B973AC@IAN> Count me in anriette Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Anriette Esterhuysen [mailto:anriette at apc.org] > Sent: 03 December 2008 03:33 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Cc: apc-igf at lists.apc.org > Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night > > Dear all > > We have identified a really good venue with great food (not difficult in > Hyderabad) for our customary dinner of APC people and friends and > colleagues. > > The party will be on Friday, 5 December from 18h45 onwards. > > Venue: Ginger Court Restaurant (Galaxy Rooftop Bar) > > Madhapur, before Hi-Tech City, Hyderabad (it is in the same road as > Hi-Tech City) > > Tel 040 23113731/32/33 > > Please let me and Karen (karenb at gn.apc.org) know if you are coming and > more or less how many people you will bring. > > We will let you know what the cost will be. > > Please pass this around and looking forward to seeing you there. > > Anriette > > > -- > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > anriette esterhuysen - executive director > association for progressive communications > p o box 29755 melville - south africa 2109 > anriette at apc.org - tel/fax + 27 11 726 1692 > http://www.apc.org > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Internal Virus Database is out of date. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1808 - Release Date: 11/23/2008 > 6:59 PM ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Tue Dec 2 13:28:09 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2008 23:58:09 +0530 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head In-Reply-To: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <20081202182914.2303E678DD@smtp1.electricembers.net> >Sorry to be the voice of cynicism here, but the proposal is more about increasing Mr. Martin's post-FCC income (as consultant/lobbyist)than USG providing free Internet for all any >time soon. Didn't understand this, Lee. How would his post-FCC prospects be enhanced by this announcement (other than if he planning to run for some kind of elections). Wouldn't his consultant/ lobbying chances be much better if he were giving pro-industry (pro-telecom) pronouncements. Parminder PS: Martin spoke about the same issue in a similar manner at the Seoul OECD meeting. _____ From: Lee W McKnight [mailto:lmcknigh at syr.edu] Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2008 9:06 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: RE: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head Guru, Sorry to be the voice of cynicism here, but the proposal is more about increasing Mr. Martin's post-FCC income (as consultant/lobbyist)than USG providing free Internet for all any time soon. Lee -----Original Message----- From: Guru [mailto:guru at itforchange.net] Sent: Tue 12/2/2008 7:47 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head While we debate on 'Internet for All' at IGF .. the USG is already thinking of making it happen ... Guru http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122809560499668087.html?mod=rss_whats_news_t echnology Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the wireless industry and some consumer groups. At its December meeting, the FCC could also consider new rules designed to speed up consideration of disputes between independent cable programmers and cable providers such as Time Warner Cable Inc. and Comcast Corp., which either refuse to carry some channels or put them on specialty tiers of service that cost subscribers more. The agency also will ask for more feedback on its proposal to require programmers to sell their channels to cable operators individually instead of in bundles. The free Internet plan is the most controversial issue the agency will tackle in December. Mr. Martin shelved plans to consider a wider variety of sticky issues pending at the agency, including a request by the Hollywood studios to hobble TVs and set-top boxes so studios can offer copy-protected theatrical releases sooner. The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is part of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that would have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could be slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. -- Gurumurthy Kasinathan IT for Change www.ITforChange.net Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Mon Dec 1 18:17:35 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:17:35 -0800 Subject: [governance] Re: [CRIS Info] Defending the public and egalitarian nature of theInternet References: <49311E63.6040206@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <4934708F.E9497677@ix.netcom.com> Anja and all, This is nothing new. Such corporatisation and control of the Internet has been ongoing for nearly 10 years now, and the rate of same has been increasing. If socilization or social control of the Internet is desired, than ways and means of paying for that type of control will need to be determined and than realized. So far, those factors have been less than forthcoming, as public funding is either not avaliable, or other higher priorities for those funds have already been indentified. Anja Kovacs wrote: > Dear all, > > Many people tend to take the commons and the public nature of the > Internet for granted. However, increasing corporatisation and control of > the Internet are strongly threatening these fundamental characteristics > of the Internet as we know it. In this context, six Indian civil society > organisations, have proposed an open letter to the UN Internet > Governance Forum which meets for its third annual meeting between 3rd > and 6th December in Hyderabad, and which is supposed to discuss these > very issues. The letter exhorts urgent global action to ensure that the > publicness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet are preserved as > its essential features. The possibilities of democracy, equity and > social justice in our societies will be significantly impacted by the > extent to which we can achieve this objective. > > The proposed letter is pasted below. If you and/or your organization > would be happy to endorse this letter, please indicate so by emailing to > anja at itforchange.net by the midnight of 1st December (India time). We > are eager to have as many signatories as possible to the letter, to > ensure that we give a strong civil society signal on these issues. > > The proposed open letter can also be accessed at > http://www.itforchange.net/component/content/article/195-igf-open-letter.html > > Best wishes, > Anja > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > * > * > * An Open Letter to the UN Internet Governance Forum (IGF) * > * for its 3rd Annual Meeting at Hyderabad, India, from 3rd to 6th > December, 2008 * > * > > The IGF must ACT NOW against the threat to the > public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet * > > The undersigned wish to express their deep concern that the UN Internet > Governance > Forum (IGF), created by the World Summit on the Information Society in > 2005 as an > Internet ‘policy dialogue’ forum, is largely failing to address key > public interest and > policy issues in global Internet governance – including that of > democratic deficit. > > *Who shapes the Internet, as the Internet shapes our new social context?* > The Internet represents the single most important technical advance of > our society in a > long time, so much so that it defines a new emerging social paradigm. > The basic > characteristics of the Internet determine the contours of the emerging > social order in > many important ways. The Internet was conceived as, and still largely > is, an extensive > communication system which is democratizing, and has little respect for > established > social hierarchies. Interactions and associations built over this new > ‘techno-social’ > system have, therefore, held the promise of a more egalitarian society. > > The era of innocence of the Internet however appears to be fast > approaching its end. > Today, the Internet of the future – the very near future – is being > shaped insidiously by > dominant forces to further their interests. (See the fact-sheet on the > following page for > some illustrations of this.) Unfortunately, global policy forums have > largely failed to > articulate, much less act on, crucial Internet policy issues, which > concern the > democratic possibilities for our societies. > > *The IGF needs to act now!* > As the Internet Governance Forum convenes for its third annual meeting, > between 3rd > and 6th December, 2008, in Hyderabad, India, it must take immediate > steps to anchor > and discuss important global public interest and policy issues involved > in Internet > governance. If it does not act now, it may get seen as a space that only > provides an > illusion of a public policy dialogue, and, consequently, as being > co-opted in furthering > the agenda of dominant forces that are shaping the Internet as per their > narrow > interests. *We therefore strongly urge the IGF to directly address the > following key > global public interest and policy issues: > > 1. Increasing corporatisation of the Internet > 2. Increasing proprietisation of standards and code that go into > building the > Internet > 3. Increasing points of control being embedded into the Internet in the > name > of security and intellectual property violations > 4. Huge democratic deficit in global Internet governance * > > We exhort the IGF to adopt clear directions for engaging with these > crucial public > policy issues. The IGF should come out with a clear work plan at its > forthcoming > meeting in Hyderabad to address the four key areas listed above. > > The global community – comprising not only people who currently have > access to the > Internet, but also the un-connected billions who are being impacted by > it nevertheless > – will judge the meaningfulness and legitimacy of the IGF in terms of > what progress it > is able to make on these issues. > * > Alternative Law Forum, Bangalore > Centre for Internet and Society, Bangalore > Delhi Science Forum, New Delhi > Free Software Foundation - India > IT for Change, Bangalore > Knowledge Commons, New Delhi * > > *For endorsements and/or more information, please contact* Anja Kovacs > email: anja (at) itforchange.net, tel: +91 80 266554134, mobile: +91 > 9611747212 > > ------------------------------------------------------------ > * Information Sheet > > How the Public-ness and Egalitarian Nature of the Internet is Threatened > Some Examples > > Corporatisation of the Internet* > Largely unsuspected by most of its users, the Internet is rapidly > changing from being a > vast ‘public sphere’, with a fully public ownership and a > non-proprietary nature, to a > set of corporatised privately-owned networks. > > On the one hand, telecom companies are carving out the Internet into > privately-owned > networks – controlling the nature of transactions over these networks. > They seek to > differentially charge content providers, while also building wholly > private networks > offering exclusive content relay services. Developments like video/TV > over Internet > Protocol and the provision of controlled and selective Internet services > over mobiles > are contributing to increasing network-operators’ control over the > Internet, with a > corresponding erosion of its public-ness. > > On the other hand, the commons of the Internet is also being overwhelmed > and > squeezed out by a complete domination of a few privately owned > mega-applications > such as Google, Facebook, Youtube etc. > > Proprietarisation of standards and code that build the Internet > One of the main ways of appropriating the commons of the Internet is > through the > increasing use of proprietary and closed standards and code in building > the Internet > system. Such appropriation allows the extortion of illegitimate rent out > of the many > new forms of commons-based activities that are being made possible > through the > Internet. > > Embedding control points in the Internet > A growing confluence of corporatist and statist interests has led to the > embedding of > more and more means of control into the Internet in a manner that greatly > compromises citizens’ rights and freedoms. Whether it is the pressure on > Internet > Service Providers to examine Internet traffic for ‘intellectual > property’ violations; or > imposition of cultural and political controls on the Internet by states > within their > boundaries; or ITU’s work on IP trace-back mechanisms; or the tightening > of US > control over the global Internet infrastructure in the name of securing > the root zone file > and the domain name system, these new forms of controlling the Internet > are being > negotiated among dominant interests away from public scrutiny and wider > public > interest-based engagements. > > Democratic deficit in global Internet governance > The current global Internet governance regime – a new-age privatized > governance > system professing allegiance mostly to a single country, the US – has > proven to be an > active instrument of perpetuation of dominant commercial and > geo-political interests. > Lately, OECD countries have begun some work on developing public policy > principles > that, due to the inherently global nature of the Internet, can be > expected to become > globally applicable. It is quite unacceptable that OECD countries shirk > from discussing > the same public policy issues at global public policy forums like the > IGF that they > discuss among themselves at OECD meetings. Apparently, developing > countries are > expected to focus on finding ways to reach connectivity to their people, > and not burden > themselves with higher-level Internet governance issues! > > People’s and communities’ right to self-determination and participation > in governance > of issues that impact their lives should underpin global Internet > governance. > > -- > Dr. Anja Kovacs > Senior Research Associate > > IT for Change > Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities > Tel: (00-91-80) 2665 4134, 2653 6890 > > www.ITforChange.net > www.IS-Watch.net > http://India.IS-Watch.net > > _______________________________________________ > Communication Rights in the Information Society (CRIS) > http://www.crisinfo.org/ > > Crisinfo mailing list > This list is provided courtesy of Comunica - http://comunica.org Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Mon Dec 1 18:22:37 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:22:37 -0800 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <493471BD.AEFC6DBF@ix.netcom.com> Guru and all, I hope that the USG can and will follow thru. But try to remember, the old adage "Beware of greeks baring gifts". At present, I cannot see how the USG is ever going to pay for such a plan. Ergo political rhetoric vs reality is all this is for the moment. Guru wrote: > While we debate on 'Internet for All' at IGF .. the USG is already > thinking of making it happen ... > > Guru > > > h > tp://online.wsj.com/article/SB122809560499668087.html?mod=rss_whats_news_technology > > Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is > pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, > pornography-free wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite > objections from the wireless industry and some consumer groups. > > At its December meeting, the FCC could also consider new rules > designed to speed up consideration of disputes between independent > cable programmers and cable providers such as Time Warner Cable Inc. > and Comcast Corp., which either refuse to carry some channels or put > them on specialty tiers of service that cost subscribers more. > > The agency also will ask for more feedback on its proposal to require > programmers to sell their channels to cable operators individually > instead of in bundles. > > The free Internet plan is the most controversial issue the agency will > tackle in December. Mr. Martin shelved plans to consider a wider > variety of sticky issues pending at the agency, including a request by > the Hollywood studios to hobble TVs and set-top boxes so studios can > offer copy-protected theatrical releases sooner. > > The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is > part of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning > bidder would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a > free Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that > would have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could > be slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other > material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan > offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins > Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. > > Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography > filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free > Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is > proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. > > T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom > AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and > has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result > in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC > dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although > T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. > > -- > Gurumurthy Kasinathan > IT for Change > www.ITforChange.net > Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities > http://ITforChange.net > http://India.IS-Watch.net > http://IS-Watch.net > *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United > Nations’ Economic and Social Council* > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Mon Dec 1 18:28:15 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:28:15 -0800 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <4934730E.987E63A6@ix.netcom.com> Lee, Guru, and all, Lee may very well be correct in his assumption here. I for one, cannot see how the USG can afford to provide free internet for everyone, let alone government officials given our current financial condition as a nation. We owe nearly everyone huge sums that will likely take most of the next generations lifetime to repay, and all of the current generations remaining lifetime to just make the interest payments, and that's with a tax increase, BTW. Lee W McKnight wrote: > Guru, > > Sorry to be the voice of cynicism here, but the proposal is more about > increasing Mr. Martin's post-FCC income (as consultant/lobbyist)than > USG providing free Internet for all any time soon. > > Lee > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Guru [mailto:guru at itforchange..net] > Sent: Tue 12/2/2008 7:47 AM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head > > While we debate on 'Internet for All' at IGF .. the USG is already > thinking of making it happen ... > > Guru > > > h > tp://online.wsj.com/article/SB122809560499668087..html?mod=rss_whats_news_technology > > > > Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is > pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, > pornography-free > wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from > the > wireless industry and some consumer groups. > > At its December meeting, the FCC could also consider new rules > designed > to speed up consideration of disputes between independent cable > programmers and cable providers such as Time Warner Cable Inc. and > Comcast Corp., which either refuse to carry some channels or put them > on > specialty tiers of service that cost subscribers more. > > The agency also will ask for more feedback on its proposal to require > programmers to sell their channels to cable operators individually > instead of in bundles. > > The free Internet plan is the most controversial issue the agency will > > tackle in December. Mr. Martin shelved plans to consider a wider > variety > of sticky issues pending at the agency, including a request by the > Hollywood studios to hobble TVs and set-top boxes so studios can offer > > copy-protected theatrical releases sooner. > > The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is > part > of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder > would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free > Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that would > > have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could be > slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other > material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan > offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins > Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. > > Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography > filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free > Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is > proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. > > T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom > > AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and > has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result > > in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC > dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although > T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. > > -- > Gurumurthy Kasinathan > IT for Change > www.ITforChange.net > Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities > http://ITforChange.net > http://India.IS-Watch.net > http://IS-Watch.net > *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United > Nations' Economic and Social Council* > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Mon Dec 1 18:40:39 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2008 15:40:39 -0800 Subject: [governance] UK Government Will Not Establish Breach Notification Law for Private Sector Message-ID: <493475F7.1DCFDF54@ix.netcom.com> All, Seems that if your a UK citizen and your ID is stolen, you will be on your own to make that determination as well as finding out whom were responsible. I am sure that Gmail ccTLD and Yahoo spammers will be smiling with great glee at this news! See: November 26 & December 1, 2008) Last week, the UK government announced in a report that it will allow the Information Commissioner's Office (ICO) to impose increased fines for "deliberate or reckless loss of data," but stopped short of calling for a law, instead allowing the ICO to establish rules for breach disclosure. The "Response to the Data Sharing Review Report" says that private sector organizations should disclose data breaches "as a matter of good practice," and that the Information Commissioner's office (ICO) should consider whether or not such organizations did disclose breaches when taking enforcement action against the company. Public sector organizations are already subject to requirements that they report any data security incidents to the ICO. http://news.zdnet.co.uk/itmanagement/0,1000000308,39563446,00.htm http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&articleId=330437&source=rss_topic17 Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Mon Dec 1 22:32:35 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Mon, 01 Dec 2008 19:32:35 -0800 Subject: [governance] Minutes from IETF73 uploaded Message-ID: <4934AC52.6D5F9B05@ix.netcom.com> All, This should be of critical interest to all of you... See: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/08nov/minutes/dnsext.txt Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From Yrjo.Lansipuro at formin.fi Tue Dec 2 23:17:17 2008 From: Yrjo.Lansipuro at formin.fi (Yrjo Lansipuro) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 06:17:17 +0200 (EET) Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night Message-ID: <6060138.1228277837595.JavaMail.root@helg12.mfa.uhnet.fi> I'll attend Yrjo Lansipuro > -----Original Message----- > From: Anriette Esterhuysen > Received: Tue Dec 02 18:33:54 EET 2008 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Cc: apc-igf at lists.apc.org > Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night > > Dear all > > We have identified a really good venue with great food (not difficult in > Hyderabad) for our customary dinner of APC people and friends and > colleagues. > > The party will be on Friday, 5 December from 18h45 onwards. > > Venue: Ginger Court Restaurant (Galaxy Rooftop Bar) > > Madhapur, before Hi-Tech City, Hyderabad (it is in the same road as > Hi-Tech City) > > Tel 040 23113731/32/33 > > Please let me and Karen (karenb at gn.apc.org) know if you are coming and > more or less how many people you will bring. > > We will let you know what the cost will be. > > Please pass this around and looking forward to seeing you there. > > Anriette > > > -- > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > anriette esterhuysen - executive director > association for progressive communications > p o box 29755 melville - south africa 2109 > anriette at apc.org - tel/fax + 27 11 726 1692 > http://www.apc.org > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Tue Dec 2 23:32:33 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 15:32:33 +1100 Subject: [governance] Almost Final Call for Nominations for IGC Co-coordinator Message-ID: Folks, As discussed last night at our meeting here in Hyderabad, nominations are still open for the role of IGC Co-coordinator to replace Parminder, whose extended term expires at the end of IGF Hyderabad. Nominations close at the end of the meeting and the election will be held as soon as is practical thereafter. Please give this very serious thought so we have the best field possible for the election. This will be a particularly important couple of years for us, as the new co-oordinator will see us through till the end of the IGF mandate. Candidates to date are Sivasubramanian Muthusamy Asif Kabani I will announce further candidates as they become available. Please nominate by email reply to me personally - self nominations or third party nominations are fine. We only have a couple more days before this closes - please give this serious thought and send nominations as soon as possible. Please also feel free to contact me in confidence if you would like further information. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1803 - Release Date: 11/23/2008 6:59 PM ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Wed Dec 3 01:08:05 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 11:38:05 +0530 Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night In-Reply-To: <6060138.1228277837595.JavaMail.root@helg12.mfa.uhnet.fi> References: <6060138.1228277837595.JavaMail.root@helg12.mfa.uhnet.fi> Message-ID: I will attend Sivasubramanian Muthusamy On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 9:47 AM, Yrjo Lansipuro wrote: > I'll attend > Yrjo Lansipuro > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Anriette Esterhuysen > > Received: Tue Dec 02 18:33:54 EET 2008 > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Cc: apc-igf at lists.apc.org > > Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night > > > > Dear all > > > > We have identified a really good venue with great food (not difficult in > > Hyderabad) for our customary dinner of APC people and friends and > > colleagues. > > > > The party will be on Friday, 5 December from 18h45 onwards. > > > > Venue: Ginger Court Restaurant (Galaxy Rooftop Bar) > > > > Madhapur, before Hi-Tech City, Hyderabad (it is in the same road as > > Hi-Tech City) > > > > Tel 040 23113731/32/33 > > > > Please let me and Karen (karenb at gn.apc.org) know if you are coming and > > more or less how many people you will bring. > > > > We will let you know what the cost will be. > > > > Please pass this around and looking forward to seeing you there. > > > > Anriette > > > > > > -- > > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > anriette esterhuysen - executive director > > association for progressive communications > > p o box 29755 melville - south africa 2109 > > anriette at apc.org - tel/fax + 27 11 726 1692 > > http://www.apc.org > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Tue Dec 2 03:43:15 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 00:43:15 -0800 Subject: [governance] French "Three Strikes" Law Gets New Life Message-ID: <4934F523.14F8EACD@ix.netcom.com> All, Seems yet again the EU council is finding it more difficult to come to any consensus on Internet policy and law. Typical. Just as typical, it seems that the French have yet again lead to this utter chaotic confusion. See: A little over a week ago we discussed http://tech.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/11/23/1952248&tid=95 the EU's forbidding of disconnecting users from the Internet. But even after having passed with an 88% approval in the European Parliament, and http://web20.telecomtv.com/pages/?newsid=43957&id=f387e4d7-6312-4d6a-9fdf-dceb0e8dd572&page=1 passing through the European Commission, it was all undone last week. The European Council, led by French President Nicolas Sarkozy, http://www.heise-online.co.uk/news/European-Council-agrees-on-new-version-of-the-Telecom-Package--/112095 removed the amendment before passing the Telecom package. This means that there's now nothing stopping France's controversial 'three strikes' law from going into effect. What hope is there for a 'parliament' where near-unanimous agreement can be completely undone so easily?" Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Tue Dec 2 03:47:50 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 00:47:50 -0800 Subject: [governance] European Police Plan to Remote-Search Hard Drives Message-ID: <4934F636.2F0CBF87@ix.netcom.com> All, The plot thickens? Well, not really... But as it relates to privacy issues this seems a bit over the top. See: A blandly-worded story from the BBC with scary implications, excerpting " http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7758127.stm Remote searches of suspect computers will form part of an EU plan to tackle hi-tech crime. The five-year action plan will take steps to combat the growth in cyber theft and the machines used to spread spam and other malicious programs. It will also encourage better sharing of data among European police forces to track down and prosecute criminals. \ Europol will co-ordinate the investigative work and also issue alerts about cyber crime sprees. Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Wed Dec 3 04:28:57 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 20:28:57 +1100 Subject: [governance] Almost Final Call for Nominations for IGC Co-coordinator In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <3CD11742A5C04825B12E213ECF3CEC26@IAN> I am pleased to announce a third candidate - Ginger Paque. The field is now Sivasubramanian Muthusamy Asif Kabani Ginger Paque Nominations remain open and further nominations are encouraged until the end of IGF (details below) > -----Original Message----- > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > Sent: 03 December 2008 15:33 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: [governance] Almost Final Call for Nominations for IGC Co- > coordinator > Importance: High > > Folks, > > As discussed last night at our meeting here in Hyderabad, nominations are > still open for the role of IGC Co-coordinator to replace Parminder, whose > extended term expires at the end of IGF Hyderabad. Nominations close at > the > end of the meeting and the election will be held as soon as is practical > thereafter. > > Please give this very serious thought so we have the best field possible > for > the election. This will be a particularly important couple of years for > us, > as the new co-oordinator will see us through till the end of the IGF > mandate. > > Candidates to date are > > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy > Asif Kabani > > I will announce further candidates as they become available. Please > nominate > by email reply to me personally - self nominations or third party > nominations are fine. > > We only have a couple more days before this closes - please give this > serious thought and send nominations as soon as possible. Please also feel > free to contact me in confidence if you would like further information. > > > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1803 - Release Date: 11/23/2008 > 6:59 PM > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Internal Virus Database is out of date. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1808 - Release Date: 11/23/2008 > 6:59 PM ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From iza at anr.org Wed Dec 3 04:33:54 2008 From: iza at anr.org (iza at anr.org) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 18:33:54 +0900 Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night In-Reply-To: References: <6060138.1228277837595.JavaMail.root@helg12.mfa.uhnet.fi> Message-ID: Thanks, I will also join. izumi >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Anriette Esterhuysen >> > Received: Tue Dec 02 18:33:54 EET 2008 >> > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > Cc: apc-igf at lists.apc.org >> > Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night >> > >> > Dear all >> > >> > We have identified a really good venue with great food (not difficult in >> > Hyderabad) for our customary dinner of APC people and friends and >> > colleagues. >> > >> > The party will be on Friday, 5 December from 18h45 onwards. >> > >> > Venue: Ginger Court Restaurant (Galaxy Rooftop Bar) >> > >> > Madhapur, before Hi-Tech City, Hyderabad (it is in the same road as >> > Hi-Tech City) >> > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch Wed Dec 3 04:44:51 2008 From: william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch (William Drake) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 15:14:51 +0530 Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night In-Reply-To: References: <6060138.1228277837595.JavaMail.root@helg12.mfa.uhnet.fi> Message-ID: Hi, Could people please RSVP to Anriette and Karen off list? Lighten everyone's in box....? Thanks, Bill On Dec 3, 2008, at 3:03 PM, iza at anr.org wrote: > Thanks, I will also join. > > izumi > > >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Anriette Esterhuysen >>>> Received: Tue Dec 02 18:33:54 EET 2008 >>>> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> Cc: apc-igf at lists.apc.org >>>> Subject: [governance] Dinner on Friday night >>>> >>>> Dear all >>>> >>>> We have identified a really good venue with great food (not >>>> difficult in >>>> Hyderabad) for our customary dinner of APC people and friends and >>>> colleagues. >>>> >>>> The party will be on Friday, 5 December from 18h45 onwards. >>>> >>>> Venue: Ginger Court Restaurant (Galaxy Rooftop Bar) >>>> >>>> Madhapur, before Hi-Tech City, Hyderabad (it is in the same road as >>>> Hi-Tech City) >>>> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance *********************************************************** William J. Drake Senior Associate Centre for International Governance Graduate Institute of International and Development Studies Geneva, Switzerland william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch *********************************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From mueller at syr.edu Wed Dec 3 04:54:34 2008 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 04:54:34 -0500 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head In-Reply-To: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided "internet for all." Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the wireless industry and some consumer groups. The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is part of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that would have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could be slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. -- Gurumurthy Kasinathan IT for Change www.ITforChange.net Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Tue Dec 2 07:16:24 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 04:16:24 -0800 Subject: [governance] Iran Executes IT Specialist for Spying for Israel Message-ID: <49352717.BF4ED2C0@ix.netcom.com> All, It appears that Iran's Govt. takes it's IT privacy very seriously, a bit too seriously even for my taste, and even given the circumstances! Has, or is the IGC going to offer any protest to this sort of thing? Or is it just another ho-hum sort of thing to the IGC? I also haven't seen any official condemnation from the UN on this either. Rather odd... Even more interesting I didn't notice or hear of any condemnation from the ITU, ISOC or ICANN either... Seems except for INEGroup no other civil society group is saddened or remotely concerned about poor Ali's horrible and significantly, unjustified demise. What does this say for the advancment of IT social justice? Says volumes to me, and our members... See: (November 22, 25 & 30, 2008) Last month, Iran executed an Iranian IT specialist after he confessed to working for the Israeli intelligence service, Mossad. Ali Ashtari traveled overseas to purchase equipment, including computers, necessary for Iran's nuclear program. Ashtari allegedly allowed the equipment to be altered so that Mossad could keep tabs on and even interfere with Iranian weapons development. Iran claims to have broken another Mossad spy ring and plans to seek the death penalty for those suspects as well. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/middle_east/article5258057.ece http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/26/world/middleeast/26iran.html?ref=world http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/babylonbeyond/2008/11/an-iranian-busi.html Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Tue Dec 2 07:36:18 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 04:36:18 -0800 Subject: [governance] World Bank CIO Duties Change Hands in Wake of Attacks Message-ID: <49352BC2.4D099D79@ix.netcom.com> All, As a matter of good governance, it would appear that the World Bank is for from having achieved a passing mark yet. It would also appears that the business as usual at the World Bank continues, but hopefully and perhaps not for too much longer. I have at the behest of our members, passed on to the Obama administration new UN ambasador, Susan Rice, a now former member of INEGroup to deliver a letter regarding this matter to the UN secretary or significant displeasure and disgust in the poor operational security measures and policies of the World Bank, in no uncertain terms ans soon as she officially takes on her duties there. Will the IGC be weighing in on this incident in any substancial way, or at all? Seems that the IGC should at a minimum, be communicating with the World Bank as infrastructure to poorer countires for their IT infrastructure has been and is still significantly supported with loans from the World Bank. On behalf of our members, I request that the IGC do so... It's clear that doing business with the World Bank at this juncture is not likely to be a financially safe endevor. That should not ever be, or have been the case. See: (November 26 & 27, 2008) The World Bank has made some personnel changes following attacks on the organization's computer systems last summer. World Bank Vice President and Chief Information Officer Guy-Pierre De Poerck has been relieved of duties; they are now in the hands of Head of General Services Robert Van Pulley. A World Bank spokesperson did not say if the shift in responsibilities indicated that De Poerck was being blamed for the attacks. The World Bank has also commissioned "a comprehensive external review" of its information systems. http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/f0b4e6ac-bc9e-11dd-9efc-0000779fd18c.html http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,458085,00.html Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From klohento at panos-ao.org Wed Dec 3 06:22:15 2008 From: klohento at panos-ao.org (Ken Lohento) Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2008 11:22:15 +0000 Subject: [governance] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?FGI/IGF_Inde_-_Remote_participation_?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?-_=E0_distance?= Message-ID: <49366BE7.6010307@panos-ao.org> Bonjour/Hi (ENGLISH below) a) Comme vous le savez la réunion annuelle du Forum sur la gouvernance de l'internet se déroule actuellement en Inde jusqu'à 6 décembre. Vous pouvez avoir plus d'informations ici : http://www.intgovforum.org b) Participation à distance - suivre les débats - Audio / Vidéo streaming: voir ici ce qui se passe actuellement http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/index.php/remoteparticipation/67-webcasting/301-audio-and-video-feeds - transcription en format texte (très intéressant pour ceux qui n'ont pas un bon débit) - vous pouvez également suivre ce qui se passe actuellement dans la salle principale: voir ici http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/index.php/remoteparticipation/text-streaming - Pour poser des questions sur les débats en cours : écrire à igf at unog.ch (les questions devraient porter sur les grands thèmes du programme des sessions) - IGF Youtube Channel: http://www.youtube.com/igf c) D'autres liens où vous pouvez contribuer sur les débats généraux autour du FGI ou participer à distance http://igf-online.net/?language=en http://www.igfremote.com/ (Initiative des hubs pour la participation à distance) KL -- ENGLISH a) As you may know, the IGF annual meeting is currently taking place in India till 6 December. You can have more information here http://www.intgovforum.org b) for remote participation - Audio/Video streaming : see here what's going on currently http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/index.php/remoteparticipation/67-webcasting/301-audio-and-video-feeds - Test streaming (very interesting for those who don't have good bandwidth) where you can also follow what's going on currently in the main room : see here http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/index.php/remoteparticipation/text-streaming - Watch and record messages/questions/comments for the IGF Hyderabad Meeting, an IGF YouTube channel has been created for this purpose see here http://www.youtube.com/igf - Call for questions. Please submit any questions you would like to be addressed in Hyderabad to igf at unog.ch. They should relate to the broad themes listed on the programme of the main sessions. c) Other links were you can participate remotely http://igf-online.net/?language=en http://www.igfremote.com/ (remote participation hub initiative) KL -- Ken Lohento ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeremy at ciroap.org Wed Dec 3 06:41:48 2008 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 17:11:48 +0530 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups Message-ID: <8D59D920-677C-4918-B91D-652E0E8ACB7A@ciroap.org> I just touched on this at igfwatch.org, but I felt it was worth highlighting here too in view of the debate at last night's IGC meeting about whether we should on the one hand push the IGF to achieve more, or on the other hand stay quiet to avoid giving ammunition to the IGF's enemies. As you will guess it is my view that we would be doing civil society a disservice to stay quiet for fear of damaging what we have in the IGF as it already exists. But what is more interesting than what I think is that Nitin Desai said during the opening ceremony. In his view the contention over the appropriate role of the IGF is very much a live issue. He stated: > essentially, this is a dialogue between two groups of people ... and > we must face up to that reality. On the one hand, we have a group of > people who feel that the present modalities of management of the > Internet are working, will work, even in the future, who are afraid > that any major change in the way in which these arrangements are set > up would compromise the Internet in some form. And on the other > hand, we have a lot of people who are dependent on the Internet for > their activities, for the economic, social, political, whatever, who > feel that they have to have a say in the public policy issues which > affect how the Net runs in this manner. These are essentially the > two groups who are in dialogue here. So if we were to leave this campaign half-finished and concede it to the group who are satisfied with the status quo of Internet governance, in some sense that would be the end of the dialogue that Nitin Desai describes, leaving it as a self-satisfied monologue of powerful governments and private sector actors. In that case, what purpose does the IGC see itself as serving? -- JEREMY MALCOLM Project Coordinator CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE for Asia Pacific and the Middle East Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Tue Dec 2 15:30:59 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 12:30:59 -0800 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <49359B02.4CF61C6@ix.netcom.com> Milton and all, Exactly right! Similar to the "Patriot Act". Says one thing, means something else entirely. I call it the old flim-flam myself... Milton L Mueller wrote: > And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely > what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided > “internet for all.” > > > Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is > pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, > pornography-free > wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from > the > wireless industry and some consumer groups. > > The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is > part > of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder > would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free > Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that would > > have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could be > slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other > material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan > offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins > Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. > > Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography > filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free > Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is > proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. > > T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom > > AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and > has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result > > in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC > dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although > T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. > > -- > Gurumurthy Kasinathan > IT for Change > www.ITforChange.net > Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities > http://ITforChange.net > http://India.IS-Watch.net > http://IS-Watch.net > *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United > Nations' Economic and Social Council* > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Tue Dec 2 17:37:05 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 14:37:05 -0800 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups References: <8D59D920-677C-4918-B91D-652E0E8ACB7A@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <4935B891.FF519BB7@ix.netcom.com> Jeremy and all, Seems to me that the IGF if it wishes to be effective needs to step up to the plate and seek to achieve much more. Sure such represents a certain amount of risk. Such is life! Without risk, there is no reward or achievement, only empty and meaningless words of no significant consequence. Be bold, or shuffle off to oblivion... Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > I just touched on this at igfwatch.org, but I felt it was worth > highlighting here too in view of the debate at last night's IGC > meeting about whether we should on the one hand push the IGF to > achieve more, or on the other hand stay quiet to avoid giving > ammunition to the IGF's enemies. > > As you will guess it is my view that we would be doing civil society a > disservice to stay quiet for fear of damaging what we have in the IGF > as it already exists. But what is more interesting than what I think > is that Nitin Desai said during the opening ceremony. In his view the > contention over the appropriate role of the IGF is very much a live > issue. He stated: > > > essentially, this is a dialogue between two groups of people ... and > > we must face up to that reality. On the one hand, we have a group of > > people who feel that the present modalities of management of the > > Internet are working, will work, even in the future, who are afraid > > that any major change in the way in which these arrangements are set > > up would compromise the Internet in some form. And on the other > > hand, we have a lot of people who are dependent on the Internet for > > their activities, for the economic, social, political, whatever, who > > feel that they have to have a say in the public policy issues which > > affect how the Net runs in this manner. These are essentially the > > two groups who are in dialogue here. > > So if we were to leave this campaign half-finished and concede it to > the group who are satisfied with the status quo of Internet > governance, in some sense that would be the end of the dialogue that > Nitin Desai describes, leaving it as a self-satisfied monologue of > powerful governments and private sector actors. In that case, what > purpose does the IGC see itself as serving? > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global > campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in > 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer > movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more > information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Wed Dec 3 15:48:54 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (jefsey) Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2008 21:48:54 +0100 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head In-Reply-To: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr. edu> References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <20081203205125.E1A62A6C23@smtp2.electricembers.net> At 10:54 03/12/2008, Milton L Mueller wrote: >And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely >what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided >"internet for all." Dear Milton, Please let us stop to confuse the US Data Network, which is a public/critic national infrastructure, with the Internet. The way we all and always resisted to this kind of risk is in out-smarting it. I accept that you may prefer compromises for stability, but this is IMHO more risky. BTW, as fas I know the fight for a free Internet is not at the IGF or ICANN right now. It is at the IETF 66NAT mailing list. What is the societal risk of censoring if censoring is technically made impossible as 66NATs will make it. That is, if their RFC is not censored (in technical issues, censoring results from "standardisation pollution". It leads to a confusion, making interoperability impossible except through the few left censorable channels). What is the use to fight censoring legal/business possibilities, if the network technology is ready built for every stakeholder (starting with Google) to be able to censor/control others? This is why I am more and more unatease with the current CS business when it stays alone. I would like to see it helping the emergence of a Network Aware People Society. Its is good to protest and talk, but it is also necessary to think, work, develop, test, and deploy. We quite have the technology and certainly the capacity to deploy a Secure Civil Global Network (SCGN) as a CS answer to the GNI marketing of HRs. If the Internet becomes censored in the USA we will fight to free you guys, but IMHO every project which develops people access is good? jfc . -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Tue Dec 2 20:26:43 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 17:26:43 -0800 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> <20081203205125.E1A62A6C23@smtp2.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <4935E053.4DA07B7E@ix.netcom.com> JFC and all, It's interesting that your nation, France, and now, via fiat, the EU, doesn't share your vision. Censorship, in ALL it's ugly forms is wrong. Selective Censorship is even worse in some specific and often times peculiar ways... It seems of late, via Frances leadership, the EU indeed has some peculiar ways... jefsey wrote: > At 10:54 03/12/2008, Milton L Mueller wrote: > >> And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely >> what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided >> “internet for all.” > > > Dear Milton, > Please let us stop to confuse the US Data Network, which is a > public/critic national infrastructure, with the Internet. The way we > all and always resisted to this kind of risk is in out-smarting it. I > accept that you may prefer compromises for stability, but this is IMHO > more risky. BTW, as fas I know the fight for a free Internet is not at > the IGF or ICANN right now. It is at the IETF 66NAT mailing list. > > What is the societal risk of censoring if censoring is technically > made impossible as 66NATs will make it. That is, if their RFC is not > censored (in technical issues, censoring results from "standardisation > pollution". It leads to a confusion, making interoperability > impossible except through the few left censorable channels). What is > the use to fight censoring legal/business possibilities, if the > network technology is ready built for every stakeholder (starting with > Google) to be able to censor/control others? > > This is why I am more and more unatease with the current CS business > when it stays alone. I would like to see it helping the emergence of a > Network Aware People Society. Its is good to protest and talk, but it > is also necessary to think, work, develop, test, and deploy. We quite > have the technology and certainly the capacity to deploy a Secure > Civil Global Network (SCGN) as a CS answer to the GNI marketing of > HRs. If the Internet becomes censored in the USA we will fight to free > you guys, but IMHO every project which develops people access is good? > > jfc > > > > > .. > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Wed Dec 3 19:17:38 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 11:17:38 +1100 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups In-Reply-To: <8D59D920-677C-4918-B91D-652E0E8ACB7A@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <3776619206B14E3CBEBDE13E9FAAAF87@IAN> I too though Desai's quote was excellent - but I do interpret it a bit differently, in that governments as I see it sit in the second group who want more say and/or more power. That's an interesting dynamic. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeremy Malcolm [mailto:jeremy at ciroap.org] > Sent: 03 December 2008 22:42 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups > > I just touched on this at igfwatch.org, but I felt it was worth > highlighting here too in view of the debate at last night's IGC > meeting about whether we should on the one hand push the IGF to > achieve more, or on the other hand stay quiet to avoid giving > ammunition to the IGF's enemies. > > As you will guess it is my view that we would be doing civil society a > disservice to stay quiet for fear of damaging what we have in the IGF > as it already exists. But what is more interesting than what I think > is that Nitin Desai said during the opening ceremony. In his view the > contention over the appropriate role of the IGF is very much a live > issue. He stated: > > > essentially, this is a dialogue between two groups of people ... and > > we must face up to that reality. On the one hand, we have a group of > > people who feel that the present modalities of management of the > > Internet are working, will work, even in the future, who are afraid > > that any major change in the way in which these arrangements are set > > up would compromise the Internet in some form. And on the other > > hand, we have a lot of people who are dependent on the Internet for > > their activities, for the economic, social, political, whatever, who > > feel that they have to have a say in the public policy issues which > > affect how the Net runs in this manner. These are essentially the > > two groups who are in dialogue here. > > So if we were to leave this campaign half-finished and concede it to > the group who are satisfied with the status quo of Internet > governance, in some sense that would be the end of the dialogue that > Nitin Desai describes, leaving it as a self-satisfied monologue of > powerful governments and private sector actors. In that case, what > purpose does the IGC see itself as serving? > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global > campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in > 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer > movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more > information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Internal Virus Database is out of date. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1808 - Release Date: 11/23/2008 > 6:59 PM ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeremy at ciroap.org Wed Dec 3 20:39:25 2008 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 07:09:25 +0530 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups In-Reply-To: <3776619206B14E3CBEBDE13E9FAAAF87@IAN> References: <3776619206B14E3CBEBDE13E9FAAAF87@IAN> Message-ID: <7E205A58-3C2F-47CE-B723-DE2F061EE216@ciroap.org> On 04/12/2008, at 5:47 AM, Ian Peter wrote: > I too though Desai's quote was excellent - but I do interpret it a bit > differently, in that governments as I see it sit in the second group > who > want more say and/or more power. That's an interesting dynamic. Well, it's both IMHO; largely southern governments such as Brazil and China, so yes we do have some interesting bedfellows. That leaves in the first group the technical community, private sector and the US and its close allies. All of this was obvious to us from (even before) Athens, but I don't think Desai has come out and acknowledged it until now. -- JEREMY MALCOLM Project Coordinator CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE for Asia Pacific and the Middle East Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From guru at itforchange.net Wed Dec 3 20:53:25 2008 From: guru at itforchange.net (Guru) Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2008 07:23:25 +0530 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups In-Reply-To: <3776619206B14E3CBEBDE13E9FAAAF87@IAN> References: <3776619206B14E3CBEBDE13E9FAAAF87@IAN> Message-ID: <49373815.7090800@itforchange.net> Dear Ian The second group is not only some governments ... the 'open letter to IGF' that ITfC and other organizations have written identifies 'democratic deficit' as a key IGF concern for CS as well. This letter has been endorsed by CS institutions and individuals across the world, more so from the geopolitical south. Unless we discuss/address (if not resolve) these issues that make IGF ineffective, we run the risk of playing into the hands of those who want to declare the IGF a failure As CS (including IGC) we have a strong interest and belief in IGF and should put our efforts at bridging the gap between the two groups ... which is to address the democratic deficit at IGF regards, Guru Ian Peter wrote: > I too though Desai's quote was excellent - but I do interpret it a bit > differently, in that governments as I see it sit in the second group who > want more say and/or more power. That's an interesting dynamic. > > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jeremy Malcolm [mailto:jeremy at ciroap.org] >> Sent: 03 December 2008 22:42 >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups >> >> I just touched on this at igfwatch.org, but I felt it was worth >> highlighting here too in view of the debate at last night's IGC >> meeting about whether we should on the one hand push the IGF to >> achieve more, or on the other hand stay quiet to avoid giving >> ammunition to the IGF's enemies. >> >> As you will guess it is my view that we would be doing civil society a >> disservice to stay quiet for fear of damaging what we have in the IGF >> as it already exists. But what is more interesting than what I think >> is that Nitin Desai said during the opening ceremony. In his view the >> contention over the appropriate role of the IGF is very much a live >> issue. He stated: >> >> >>> essentially, this is a dialogue between two groups of people ... and >>> we must face up to that reality. On the one hand, we have a group of >>> people who feel that the present modalities of management of the >>> Internet are working, will work, even in the future, who are afraid >>> that any major change in the way in which these arrangements are set >>> up would compromise the Internet in some form. And on the other >>> hand, we have a lot of people who are dependent on the Internet for >>> their activities, for the economic, social, political, whatever, who >>> feel that they have to have a say in the public policy issues which >>> affect how the Net runs in this manner. These are essentially the >>> two groups who are in dialogue here. >>> >> So if we were to leave this campaign half-finished and concede it to >> the group who are satisfied with the status quo of Internet >> governance, in some sense that would be the end of the dialogue that >> Nitin Desai describes, leaving it as a self-satisfied monologue of >> powerful governments and private sector actors. In that case, what >> purpose does the IGC see itself as serving? >> >> -- >> JEREMY MALCOLM >> Project Coordinator >> CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE >> for Asia Pacific and the Middle East >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global >> campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in >> 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer >> movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more >> information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> Internal Virus Database is out of date. >> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com >> Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1808 - Release Date: 11/23/2008 >> 6:59 PM >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Gurumurthy Kasinathan IT for Change www.ITforChange.net Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities Tel:98454 37730 http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Wed Dec 3 21:29:48 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 13:29:48 +1100 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups In-Reply-To: <7E205A58-3C2F-47CE-B723-DE2F061EE216@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <25C0A6F8E2564593A854144561F62D0A@IAN> Actually the more I look at this the more I don't think any of the stakeholder groups can be absolutely dumped in one camp or another. We've already explored that governments are mixed - within the technical community, there is a significant if less vocal group who would definitely seek change to varying degrees. (Robert Kahn, co-founder of TCP/IP would be one of the voices here, as would be Louis Pouzin, the great European Internet pioneer and inventor of datagrams). Within private sector, there would certainly be groups who would like to see internet governance changed in various ways and who would not be happy with the status quo. This would certainly include a lot of the innovative companies. And within civil society, while most of us would see the need for some change, the degree and nature of change we would seek differs greatly. So our allies in seeking change are likely to be everywhere, and will differ depending on the specific issue we are addressing. I think that's where multi-stakeholder is quite intriguing. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeremy Malcolm [mailto:jeremy at ciroap.org] > Sent: 04 December 2008 12:39 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: Re: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups > > On 04/12/2008, at 5:47 AM, Ian Peter wrote: > > > I too though Desai's quote was excellent - but I do interpret it a bit > > differently, in that governments as I see it sit in the second group > > who > > want more say and/or more power. That's an interesting dynamic. > > > Well, it's both IMHO; largely southern governments such as Brazil and > China, so yes we do have some interesting bedfellows. That leaves in > the first group the technical community, private sector and the US and > its close allies. All of this was obvious to us from (even before) > Athens, but I don't think Desai has come out and acknowledged it until > now. > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global > campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in > 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer > movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more > information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Tue Dec 2 23:25:34 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Tue, 02 Dec 2008 20:25:34 -0800 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups References: <3776619206B14E3CBEBDE13E9FAAAF87@IAN> <49373815.7090800@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <49360A3C.34734969@ix.netcom.com> Guru and all, The time for debate or bridging is past. The time for directed and greater good action has come. Missing these opertunities and challanges at the expense of debate and discussions of reconciliation demonstrates a lack of effective and useful leadership. The "Nevel Chamberlin" factor, need not and must not prevail. Guru wrote: > Dear Ian > > The second group is not only some governments ... the 'open letter to > IGF' that ITfC and other organizations have written identifies > 'democratic deficit' as a key IGF concern for CS as well. This letter > has been endorsed by CS institutions and individuals across the world, > more so from the geopolitical south. > > Unless we discuss/address (if not resolve) these issues that make IGF > ineffective, we run the risk of playing into the hands of those who > want to declare the IGF a failure > > As CS (including IGC) we have a strong interest and belief in IGF and > should put our efforts at bridging the gap between the two groups ... > which is to address the democratic deficit at IGF > > regards, > Guru > > Ian Peter wrote: > >> I too though Desai's quote was excellent - but I do interpret it a >> bit >> differently, in that governments as I see it sit in the second group >> who >> want more say and/or more power. That's an interesting dynamic. >> >> >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >> >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Jeremy Malcolm [mailto:jeremy at ciroap.org] >> > Sent: 03 December 2008 22:42 >> > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups >> > >> > I just touched on this at igfwatch.org, but I felt it was worth >> > highlighting here too in view of the debate at last night's IGC >> > meeting about whether we should on the one hand push the IGF to >> > achieve more, or on the other hand stay quiet to avoid giving >> > ammunition to the IGF's enemies. >> > >> > As you will guess it is my view that we would be doing civil >> > society a >> > disservice to stay quiet for fear of damaging what we have in the >> > IGF >> > as it already exists. But what is more interesting than what I >> > think >> > is that Nitin Desai said during the opening ceremony. In his view >> > the >> > contention over the appropriate role of the IGF is very much a live >> > issue. He stated: >> > >> > >> >> essentially, this is a dialogue between two groups of people ... >> >> and >> >> we must face up to that reality. On the one hand, we have a group >> >> of >> >> people who feel that the present modalities of management of the >> >> Internet are working, will work, even in the future, who are >> >> afraid >> >> that any major change in the way in which these arrangements are >> >> set >> >> up would compromise the Internet in some form. And on the other >> >> hand, we have a lot of people who are dependent on the Internet >> >> for >> >> their activities, for the economic, social, political, whatever, >> >> who >> >> feel that they have to have a say in the public policy issues >> >> which >> >> affect how the Net runs in this manner. These are essentially the >> >> two groups who are in dialogue here. >> >> >> > So if we were to leave this campaign half-finished and concede it >> > to >> > the group who are satisfied with the status quo of Internet >> > governance, in some sense that would be the end of the dialogue >> > that >> > Nitin Desai describes, leaving it as a self-satisfied monologue of >> > powerful governments and private sector actors. In that case, what >> > purpose does the IGC see itself as serving? >> > >> > -- >> > JEREMY MALCOLM >> > Project Coordinator >> > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE >> > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East >> > >> > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global >> > campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations >> > in >> > 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer >> > movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more >> > information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. >> > >> > ____________________________________________________________ >> > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > >> > For all list information and functions, see: >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > Internal Virus Database is out of date. >> > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com >> > Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1808 - Release Date: >> > 11/23/2008 >> > 6:59 PM >> > >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> > -- > Gurumurthy Kasinathan > IT for Change > www.ITforChange.net > Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities > Tel:98454 37730 > http://ITforChange.net > http://India.IS-Watch.net > http://IS-Watch.net > *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United > Nations’ Economic and Social Council* > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Wed Dec 3 23:32:00 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2008 23:32:00 -0500 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups References: <3776619206B14E3CBEBDE13E9FAAAF87@IAN> <49373815.7090800@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB9@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Hi Guru & Ian & Jeremy and everyone, Hope we can have a good attendance at the 'Role & Mandate' workshop Saturday 9 am here in Hyderabad where I will moderate a wide open discussion on these issues. My own view is that IGF's existence is itself a success in beginning to change the landscape, but yes it is imperfect and young and can evolve to do much more. Now is not the time to stay quiet while critics speak up - we can be constructuve critics ouselves eg the ITfC 'open letter.' Also, I wouldn't put the 'blocs' down as being quite as solid as Nitin might have hinted or others are interpreting; meaning key private sector actors/drivers of the technical community seem to have more than a rooting interest in IGF's survival and success too. And if they're on 'our' side that changes the balance of power, at least in so far as the IGF goes. Lee ________________________________ From: Guru [mailto:guru at itforchange.net] Sent: Wed 12/3/2008 8:53 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Cc: 'Jeremy Malcolm' Subject: Re: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups Dear Ian The second group is not only some governments ... the 'open letter to IGF' that ITfC and other organizations have written identifies 'democratic deficit' as a key IGF concern for CS as well. This letter has been endorsed by CS institutions and individuals across the world, more so from the geopolitical south. Unless we discuss/address (if not resolve) these issues that make IGF ineffective, we run the risk of playing into the hands of those who want to declare the IGF a failure As CS (including IGC) we have a strong interest and belief in IGF and should put our efforts at bridging the gap between the two groups ... which is to address the democratic deficit at IGF regards, Guru Ian Peter wrote: I too though Desai's quote was excellent - but I do interpret it a bit differently, in that governments as I see it sit in the second group who want more say and/or more power. That's an interesting dynamic. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -----Original Message----- From: Jeremy Malcolm [mailto:jeremy at ciroap.org] Sent: 03 December 2008 22:42 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups I just touched on this at igfwatch.org, but I felt it was worth highlighting here too in view of the debate at last night's IGC meeting about whether we should on the one hand push the IGF to achieve more, or on the other hand stay quiet to avoid giving ammunition to the IGF's enemies. As you will guess it is my view that we would be doing civil society a disservice to stay quiet for fear of damaging what we have in the IGF as it already exists. But what is more interesting than what I think is that Nitin Desai said during the opening ceremony. In his view the contention over the appropriate role of the IGF is very much a live issue. He stated: essentially, this is a dialogue between two groups of people ... and we must face up to that reality. On the one hand, we have a group of people who feel that the present modalities of management of the Internet are working, will work, even in the future, who are afraid that any major change in the way in which these arrangements are set up would compromise the Internet in some form. And on the other hand, we have a lot of people who are dependent on the Internet for their activities, for the economic, social, political, whatever, who feel that they have to have a say in the public policy issues which affect how the Net runs in this manner. These are essentially the two groups who are in dialogue here. So if we were to leave this campaign half-finished and concede it to the group who are satisfied with the status quo of Internet governance, in some sense that would be the end of the dialogue that Nitin Desai describes, leaving it as a self-satisfied monologue of powerful governments and private sector actors. In that case, what purpose does the IGC see itself as serving? -- JEREMY MALCOLM Project Coordinator CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE for Asia Pacific and the Middle East Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit www.consumersinternational.org . ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance Internal Virus Database is out of date. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1808 - Release Date: 11/23/2008 6:59 PM ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -- Gurumurthy Kasinathan IT for Change www.ITforChange.net Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities Tel:98454 37730 http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch Thu Dec 4 00:51:07 2008 From: william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch (William Drake) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 11:21:07 +0530 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups In-Reply-To: <25C0A6F8E2564593A854144561F62D0A@IAN> References: <25C0A6F8E2564593A854144561F62D0A@IAN> Message-ID: Hi, I agree with Ian, Nitin's quick stylized comments merely alluded to the existence of different views, he wasn't purporting to present a complete mapping of their topography. There are many different perspectives in play, and I for one wouldn't fit in ether of the two groups he posited. As I said in the meeting, there are a number of grounds on which CS people might criticize the IGF's institutional organization and performance. For some us this includes arguing that it needs to totally transformed so as to be able to adopt recommendations, while for others it entails opposition to or agnosticism on recommendations but also a desire for more structured agendas and ongoing monitoring and assessment of and catalyzing of reform within decision making bodies. Either way, the main point is to offer these and other criticisms in a constructive manner that doesn't lend credence to the claims of those forces asserting that the IGF is irredeemably broken and hence its functions should be shifted elsewhere, e.g. to a traditional intergovermental organization. Best, Bill On Dec 4, 2008, at 7:59 AM, Ian Peter wrote: > Actually the more I look at this the more I don't think any of the > stakeholder groups can be absolutely dumped in one camp or another. > We've > already explored that governments are mixed - within the technical > community, there is a significant if less vocal group who would > definitely > seek change to varying degrees. (Robert Kahn, co-founder of TCP/IP > would be > one of the voices here, as would be Louis Pouzin, the great European > Internet pioneer and inventor of datagrams). > > Within private sector, there would certainly be groups who would > like to see > internet governance changed in various ways and who would not be > happy with > the status quo. This would certainly include a lot of the innovative > companies. > > And within civil society, while most of us would see the need for some > change, the degree and nature of change we would seek differs greatly. > > So our allies in seeking change are likely to be everywhere, and > will differ > depending on the specific issue we are addressing. I think that's > where > multi-stakeholder is quite intriguing. > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Jeremy Malcolm [mailto:jeremy at ciroap.org] >> Sent: 04 December 2008 12:39 >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> Subject: Re: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups >> >> On 04/12/2008, at 5:47 AM, Ian Peter wrote: >> >>> I too though Desai's quote was excellent - but I do interpret it >>> a bit >>> differently, in that governments as I see it sit in the second group >>> who >>> want more say and/or more power. That's an interesting dynamic. >> >> >> Well, it's both IMHO; largely southern governments such as Brazil and >> China, so yes we do have some interesting bedfellows. That >> leaves in >> the first group the technical community, private sector and the US >> and >> its close allies. All of this was obvious to us from (even before) >> Athens, but I don't think Desai has come out and acknowledged it >> until >> now. >> >> -- >> JEREMY MALCOLM >> Project Coordinator >> CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE >> for Asia Pacific and the Middle East >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global >> campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member >> organisations in >> 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer >> movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more >> information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance *********************************************************** William J. Drake Senior Associate Centre for International Governance Graduate Institute of International and Development Studies Geneva, Switzerland william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch *********************************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Wed Dec 3 03:27:49 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2008 00:27:49 -0800 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups References: <25C0A6F8E2564593A854144561F62D0A@IAN> Message-ID: <49364304.BFCFD9C5@ix.netcom.com> Bill and all, Different views and level of importance of specific issues have been known to exist sense at least 1999. Nothing new or overly reveling in that fact. Much discussion, debate on same took place in ernest on the now long defunct ICANN DNSO mailing list. See:http://www.dnso.org/mailinglists.html William Drake wrote: > Hi, I agree with Ian, Nitin's quick stylized comments merely alluded > to the existence of different views, he wasn't purporting to present a > complete mapping of their topography. There are many different > perspectives in play, and I for one wouldn't fit in ether of the two > groups he posited. As I said in the meeting, there are a number of > grounds on which CS people might criticize the IGF's institutional > organization and performance. For some us this includes arguing that > it needs to totally transformed so as to be able to adopt > recommendations, while for others it entails opposition to or > agnosticism on recommendations but also a desire for more structured > agendas and ongoing monitoring and assessment of and catalyzing of > reform within decision making bodies. Either way, the main point is > to offer these and other criticisms in a constructive manner that > doesn't lend credence to the claims of those forces asserting that the > IGF is irredeemably broken and hence its functions should be shifted > elsewhere, e.g. to a traditional intergovermental > organization. Best, Bill On Dec 4, 2008, at 7:59 AM, Ian Peter wrote: > >> Actually the more I look at this the more I don't think any of the >> stakeholder groups can be absolutely dumped in one camp or another. >> We've >> already explored that governments are mixed - within the technical >> community, there is a significant if less vocal group who would >> definitely >> seek change to varying degrees. (Robert Kahn, co-founder of TCP/IP >> would be >> one of the voices here, as would be Louis Pouzin, the great European >> Internet pioneer and inventor of datagrams). >> >> Within private sector, there would certainly be groups who would >> like to see >> internet governance changed in various ways and who would not be >> happy with >> the status quo. This would certainly include a lot of the innovative >> companies. >> >> And within civil society, while most of us would see the need for >> some >> change, the degree and nature of change we would seek differs >> greatly. >> >> So our allies in seeking change are likely to be everywhere, and >> will differ >> depending on the specific issue we are addressing. I think that's >> where >> multi-stakeholder is quite intriguing. >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >> >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Jeremy Malcolm [mailto:jeremy at ciroap.org] >> > Sent: 04 December 2008 12:39 >> > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > Subject: Re: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups >> > >> > On 04/12/2008, at 5:47 AM, Ian Peter wrote: >> > >> > >> >> I too though Desai's quote was excellent - but I do interpret it >> >> a bit >> >> differently, in that governments as I see it sit in the second >> >> group >> >> who >> >> want more say and/or more power. That's an interesting dynamic. >> >> >> > >> > >> > Well, it's both IMHO; largely southern governments such as Brazil >> > and >> > China, so yes we do have some interesting bedfellows. That leaves >> > in >> > the first group the technical community, private sector and the US >> > and >> > its close allies.All of this was obvious to us from (even before) >> > Athens, but I don't think Desai has come out and acknowledged it >> > until >> > now. >> > >> > -- >> > JEREMY MALCOLM >> > Project Coordinator >> > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE >> > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East >> > >> > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global >> > campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations >> > in >> > 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer >> > movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more >> > information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. >> > >> > ____________________________________________________________ >> > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > >> > For all list information and functions, see: >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > *********************************************************** > William J. Drake > Senior Associate > Centre for International Governance > Graduate Institute of International and > Development Studies > Geneva, Switzerland > william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch > *********************************************************** > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From muguet at mdpi.net Thu Dec 4 02:18:12 2008 From: muguet at mdpi.net (Dr. Francis MUGUET) Date: Thu, 04 Dec 2008 08:18:12 +0100 Subject: [governance] Internet of Things DC meeting Message-ID: <49378434.4090507@mdpi.net> Dear IGF participants Internet of Things DC formation Meeting in Room 2.02-2.04 on the second floor. 1700-1730 on December 5, IGF, Hyderabad All the best Francis -- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Thu Dec 4 03:24:28 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 19:24:28 +1100 Subject: [governance] European Parliament Message-ID: <188DA256D9A2464AB9366FA414925EB3@IAN> (slightly humorous and partially factual) Just to confirm that this meeting took place as scheduled. The European Parliamentarians were represented by Bertrand de La Chapelle and I represented Civil Society. I explained as follows (apologies to Nitin Desai) essentially, this is a dialogue between two groups of people ... and we must face up to that reality. On the one hand, we have a group of people who feel that the present modalities of government of all things by sovereign states is working, will work, even in the future, who are afraid that any major change in the way in which these arrangements are set up would compromise governments in some form. And on the other hand, we have a lot of people who are dependent on the Internet for their activities, for the economic, social, political, whatever, who feel that they have to have a say in the public policy issues which affect how the Net runs in this manner. These are essentially the two groups who are in dialogue here. (Bertrand was delegated to act for European Parliamentarians in a last minute arrangement, and with no venue confirmed we agreed to postpone a meeting between us to a suitable social function) Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Kleinwächter, Wolfgang > > [mailto:wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de] > > Sent: 25 November 2008 03:30 > > To: Kleinwächter, Wolfgang; governance at lists.cpsr.org; jlfullsack; > > governance at lists.cpsr.org; Elisabeth.MARKOT at ec.europa.eu > > Cc: Parminder; William Drake > > Subject: [governance] European Parliament > > > > > > Dear list > > > > Elisabeth Markort from the European Commission forwarded me the > invitation > > of the European delegation which includes also a number of members of > the > > European Parliament, for a meeting with civil society in Hyderabad at 4. > > Dezember, 13:00. Room will be announced. > > > > We had such meetings in Athens and Rio and it was very useful. Please > > reserve the date in your calendar. > > > > Wolfgang > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1803 - Release Date: > 11/23/2008 > > 6:59 PM ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ldmisekfalkoff at gmail.com Thu Dec 4 04:05:01 2008 From: ldmisekfalkoff at gmail.com (linda misek-falkoff) Date: Thu, 4 Dec 2008 04:05:01 -0500 Subject: [governance] Nitin Desai's two groups In-Reply-To: <8D59D920-677C-4918-B91D-652E0E8ACB7A@ciroap.org> References: <8D59D920-677C-4918-B91D-652E0E8ACB7A@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <45ed74050812040105j5784a21ek1b0f4b7cb501030c@mail.gmail.com> Dear Jeremy and Group, Missing being there with you again - but appreciating the remote participation channels; glad to know you are there *inter alia* stressing what I will phrase "Participatory *Processes*," which from a *Respectful Interfaces* approach are themselves *Substantive* - based on key community values. Strong felt need occurring at current Information and Communication Technology related events in NY U.N. environment; more later on this... keep up the great work, with thanks, LDMF. Dr. L.D. Misek-Falkoff For I.D. here: Communications Coordination Committee for the U.N. (NGO); *Respectful Interfaces* Programme. On Wed, Dec 3, 2008 at 6:41 AM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > I just touched on this at igfwatch.org, but I felt it was worth > highlighting here too in view of the debate at last night's IGC meeting > about whether we should on the one hand push the IGF to achieve more, or on > the other hand stay quiet to avoid giving ammunition to the IGF's enemies. > > As you will guess it is my view that we would be doing civil society a > disservice to stay quiet for fear of damaging what we have in the IGF as it > already exists. But what is more interesting than what I think is that > Nitin Desai said during the opening ceremony. In his view the contention > over the appropriate role of the IGF is very much a live issue. He stated: > > essentially, this is a dialogue between two groups of people ... and we >> must face up to that reality. On the one hand, we have a group of people who >> feel that the present modalities of management of the Internet are working, >> will work, even in the future, who are afraid that any major change in the >> way in which these arrangements are set up would compromise the Internet in >> some form. And on the other hand, we have a lot of people who are dependent >> on the Internet for their activities, for the economic, social, political, >> whatever, who feel that they have to have a say in the public policy issues >> which affect how the Net runs in this manner. These are essentially the two >> groups who are in dialogue here. >> > > So if we were to leave this campaign half-finished and concede it to the > group who are satisfied with the status quo of Internet governance, in some > sense that would be the end of the dialogue that Nitin Desai describes, > leaving it as a self-satisfied monologue of powerful governments and private > sector actors. In that case, what purpose does the IGC see itself as > serving? > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning > voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we > are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and > empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit > www.consumersinternational.org. > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From anja at itforchange.net Fri Dec 5 00:02:52 2008 From: anja at itforchange.net (Anja Kovacs) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 10:32:52 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGC Workshop: Internet for all - exploring a rights-based approach Message-ID: <4938B5FC.3020809@itforchange.net> [apologies for cross-postings] Dear all, This is to invite you to the workshop titled "Internet for All - Exploring a Rights-based Approach', organised by the Internet Governance Caucus (IGC) at the Internet Governance Forum in Hyderabad. The workshop will take place tomorrow, 6 December 2008, in room number 3, from 11.30 until 13.00h. Hope to see you there. Details: Internet for All is the proposed theme for the IGF, Hyderabad and is adapted from UNESCO’s ‘Education for All’ initiative. ’Education for All’ takes a rights based approach to education and presents nuanced view the enabling conditions for providing education for all (http://portal.unesco.org/education/en/ev.php-URL_ID=47044&URL_DO=DO_TOPIC&URL_SECTION=201.html). The proposed “Internet for All—Exploring a Rights-based Approach” workshop will explore what a ‘Rights-based’ approach to Internet for All (including other related concepts such as e-Inclusion and ‘Universal Service’) would mean and whether it could provide the basis for Internet policy in this area. Universal service and universal access are widely accepted telecom policy principles. However, these are less clear in area of the Internet where the Internet involves areas of much more active ‘use’ and multi-layered types of interaction and development than the simple connection’ with the telephone. To mention only one aspect of this a draft resolution recommended for ECOSOC by the 11th session of the CSTD (http://www.unctad.org/sections/wcmu/docs//ecn162008_r004_en.pdf) recently noted that ‘a new form of digital divide is emerging in terms of difference in quality and speed of access to ICTs’ (the OECD has also been grappling with definitional issues regarding universal access in terms of the Internet (http://www.oecd.org/dataoecd/32/57/40629067.pdf ). Other issues to be explored from a ‘rights’ perspective include a determination of the enabling conditions for realizing effective use of the available ‘access’ and the characteristics of the Internet to which one has access. A rights based approach to “Internet for All’ or what may be referred to as a ‘right to the Internet’ may include issues that go beyond mere access as for example the enabling conditions such as training, capacity building and the development of the social, organizational, and managerial infrastructure that can make access meaningful and useful. The “Education for All’ movement recognizes that conditions such as these are pertinent to ensuring education for all beyond simple access to schools. This corresponds to quality and appropriateness of the substantive content and presentation of the Internet – language including use of non-Roman scripts are of particular significance here and correspond in the ‘education for all’ context to what is spoken of in a recent UNESCO document as ‘the right to learn in the mother tongue’ (http://unesdoc.unesco.org/images/0012/001297/129728e.pdf). The WSIS declaration of Principles speaks of an “information society where everyone can create, access, utilize and share information”. Does this translate into a right to do so? What would be the implications of a right on Internet policies, for instance with respect to the network neutrality debate. Similarly, issues such as online security, privacy and FoE may be possible to explore from a rights perspective in the context of the possible significance in enabling or restricting an ‘Internet for all’. A further set of issues more directly linked to an e-Inclusion definition of ‘Internet for all’ would include groups needing special consideration such as people with disabilities, whose right to access to ‘new information and communications technologies and systems, including the Internet’ as is recognized by the recently concluded ‘International Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities’. Panelists include: Ms. Radhika Lal – United Nations Development Programme (UNDP) Mr. Ravi Shankar – Ministry of Communications and Information Technology, Government of India Mr. Abdul Waheed Khan - United Nations Educationl, Scientific and Cultural Organisation (UNESCO) Dr. Michael Gurstein - Global Telecentre Alliance (GTA) & Community Informatics Research Network (CIRN) Mr. Brian Longwe – Kenya ICT Action Network Ms. Katerina Batzeli – European Union Parliament member Participant from APC to be confirmed. -- Dr. Anja Kovacs Senior Research Associate IT for Change Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities Tel: (00-91-80) 2665 4134, 2653 6890 www.ITforChange.net www.IS-Watch.net http://India.IS-Watch.net ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From muguet at mdpi.net Fri Dec 5 00:25:08 2008 From: muguet at mdpi.net (Dr. Francis MUGUET) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 06:25:08 +0100 Subject: [governance] + Internet of Things DC meeting Message-ID: <4938BB34.2070908@mdpi.net> Dear IGF participants Just a minor correction from the secretariat, not room 2.02-2.04 but 2.03 - 2.04 Meeting in Room 2.03 - 2.04 on the second floor. 1700-1730 on December 5, IGF, Hyderabad All the best Francis -- -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From muguet at mdpi.net Fri Dec 5 01:12:38 2008 From: muguet at mdpi.net (Dr. Francis MUGUET) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 07:12:38 +0100 Subject: CSU ITU interface / Re: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF In-Reply-To: <15313D38C9AF4822A71B711740C0DFC5@PCbureau> References: <20081202042540.7F10067824@smtp1.electricembers.net> <15313D38C9AF4822A71B711740C0DFC5@PCbureau> Message-ID: <4938C656.8060509@mdpi.net> Dear Jean Louis and Parminder I agree with Jean-Louis, interfacing with the ITU in an official manner is a difficult and costly operation, In my experience, it is mostly a problem orginating from the ITU member states; some representatives of which are still living a world frozen in time. With Touré, I am noticing a real effort from ITU staff however, but ITU is not like UNESCO, member states are very much involved in a very formal way. Even in supposedly enlightenned western european countries, there are some ITU delegates that are not favourable to CS involvement Therefore it is suggested to form an association based in Geneva, or in a develloping country with favourable legal regulations called the "Conference of WSIS concerned Civil Society". ( CWSISCS ) I suggest "concerned", in order to be more open than "accredited", but yet mentionning the WSIS. This association being open to NGOs, as well as to individuals. The cost of ITU-D ( even more ITU-T) being shared between members. The CWSISCS role being a purely a conduit for the content of its members, and having a say of its own only concerning procedural matters. From exploratory discussions with some ITU staff in their personnal capacity, it seems that the idea of an umbrella CS ITU-member would not be unwelcome, and would obviate the need of lengthy governemental negotiations. In general, concerning the whole WSIS process, the need for CWSISCS is all the more urgent that CONGO has been disengaging itself from the WSIS/IGF process, with the departure of Philippe. It is suggested that the role of CWSISCS be not limited to interface with ITU, but also ECOSOC, CSTD, and other agencies of the UN system: UNESCO, UNCTAD, etc.. as others International organizations such as OECD where there have been points raised by Milton raised recently about CS interface, and many other organizations upon development and work of CWSISCS All the best Francis > Dear Parminder > > The second point you are proposing seems very accurate for me. The ITU > "World Telecommunication Policy Forum on Telecommunications" is > scheduled in April next year. The "Informal Expert Group" created by a > decision of the ITU Council, hold so far two meetings (last one one > week ago in Geneva) for preparing this event. It is composed of 67 > member states represnttativs and of 18 sector members. Unless to say > that there are NO CS members in that body (we are at ITU, folks !). > > It would be therefore necessary to establish contacts with this group > for submitting it the most relevant conclusions of the 3rd IGF, as > inputs to the World Forum, but only as far as they are supported by > the CS organisations concerned. May be that an "informal CS working > group" on ITU issues (i.a. reforming the ITU and CS inclusion, role of > the ITU in Internet governance) will be established in the meantime > and will be able for submitting some concrete proposals before this > ITU event. > > All the best > Jean-Louis fullsack > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Parminder > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org > *Sent:* Tuesday, December 02, 2008 5:25 AM > *Subject:* [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF > > Dear All > > > > As mentioned earlier, IGC members attending the IGF will meet > today from 1830 to 2030, in Rooms 1.03 and 1.04 combined (HICC 1st > floor), the same place where Giganet meeting is taking is place. > > > > Please let us know if you want anything in particular to be taken > up at the meeting. > > > > As an IGC member I propose the following three items for the agenda > > > > 1. IGC organizational issues -- elections etc. Also, whether, > and if so, how, a funding proposal for the IGC has to be > explored (as discussed earlier on the list) > 2. Strategy to engage with ITU, especially with regard to the > forthcoming ITU policy forum. > 3. At IGF, Hyderabad, how to push the agenda of seeking to have > 'rights and the Internet' or a 'rights based approach to > IG' as the over-arching theme for IGF, Egypt. > > > > Pl add other issues you want to be taken up. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Parminder > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- ------------------------------------------------------ Francis F. MUGUET Ph.D MDPI Foundation Open Access Journals http://www.mdpi.org http://www.mdpi.net muguet at mdpi.org muguet at mdpi.net ENSTA/KNIS http://knis.org 32 Blvd Victor 75739 PARIS cedex FRANCE Phone: (33)1 45 52 60 19 Fax: (33)1 45 52 52 82 muguet at ensta.fr http://www.ensta.fr/~muguet PC4D : http://www.pc4d.org World Summit On the Information Society (WSIS) Civil Society Working Groups Scientific Information : http://www.wsis-si.org chair Patents & Copyrights : http://www.wsis-pct.org co-chair Financing Mechanismns : http://www.wsis-finance.org web Info. Net. Govermance : http://www.wsis-gov.org web NET4D : http://www.net4D.org UNMSP : http://www.unmsp.org WTIS : http://www.wtis.org REUSSI : http://www.reussi.org ------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Fri Dec 5 01:45:26 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 17:45:26 +1100 Subject: [governance] appeals team replacement process Message-ID: David Goldstein informed me just prior to my leaving for Hyderabad that he was having difficulty completing the work as chair of the Appeals Team Nomcom because of other commitments. I announced this at our meeting here in Hyderabad to those present and asked for a volunteer to take over. I'm very pleased that Jeremy Malcolm, who is already a member of this committee, indicated willingness to take over this task. So I happily put his name forward to the list and am pleased we have a capable nominee to complete this task who is already on the committee. This will make us easy to transition and continue to complete the work. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From muguet at mdpi.net Fri Dec 5 02:56:21 2008 From: muguet at mdpi.net (Dr. Francis MUGUET) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 08:56:21 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGF session Linguistic Diversity Coalition Message-ID: <4938DEA5.6000807@mdpi.net> Dear IGF participants Since there is no direct information about IGF dynamic coalitions' programs on the IGF website, please find below the program of the session of the Linguistic Diversity Coalition 6 December 2008 14H - 15H30 Room 5 http://wsis-gov.org/DClinguis-hyderabad08.html ( page to be transfered latter to the http://linguis.tk ) All the best Francis Linguistic Diversity Dynamic Coalition Coalition dynamique pour la diversité linguistique Third IGF meeting 3 - 6 December 2008, Hyderabad, India. Overall Schedule IGF Hyderabad 2008 * Dynamic Coalition Session* 6 December 2008 14H - 15H30 Room 5 Organizer : Dr. Francis Muguet Session Chair : Pietro Sicuro ( INTIF/Francophonie ) Rapporteur : Viola Krebs ( ICV ) * Terminologie Multilingue - Multilinguistic Terminology Louis Pouzin ( EuroLinc , France ) * Linguistic Diversity in the Cyberspace of the Russian Federation Tatiana Ershova Institute for the Information Society , Moscow, Russian Federation ) * Linguistic Diversity in the Indian Cyberspace Dr Gautam Sengupta ,University of Hyderabad, India ( cancelled for personnal reasons ) possibly to be replaced by another Indian speaker. * "Languages on the Asian and African Web" Dr. Shigeaki KODAMA (Nagaoka University of Technology) ( last minute cancellation due to Mumbai events ) * "Le Cameroun : retour d'expérience d'une Toile bi-lingue" Michel Tchnonang ( CAPDA ) -- ------------------------------------------------------ Francis F. MUGUET Ph.D World Tour of the Information Society (WTIS) muguet at wtis.org http://wtis.org http://wtis.tv REUSSI : http://reussi.org KNIS/ENSTA http://knis.org 32 Blvd Victor 75739 PARIS cedex FRANCE Phone: (33)1 45 52 60 19 Fax: (33)1 45 52 52 82 muguet at ensta.fr http://www.ensta.fr/~muguet PC4D : http://www.pc4d.org MDPI Foundation Open Access Journals http://www.mdpi.org http://www.mdpi.net muguet at mdpi.org muguet at mdpi.net World Summit On the Information Society (WSIS) Civil Society Working Groups Scientific Information : http://www.wsis-si.org chair Patents & Copyrights : http://www.wsis-pct.org co-chair Financing Mechanismns : http://www.wsis-finance.org web Info. Net. Govermance : http://www.wsis-gov.org web NET4D : http://www.net4D.org UNMSP : http://www.unmsp.org ------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: DClinguis.gif Type: image/gif Size: 2182 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de Fri Dec 5 03:06:30 2008 From: wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Kleinw=E4chter=2C_Wolfgang?=) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 09:06:30 +0100 Subject: CSU ITU interface / Re: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF References: <20081202042540.7F10067824@smtp1.electricembers.net> <15313D38C9AF4822A71B711740C0DFC5@PCbureau> <4938C656.8060509@mdpi.net> Message-ID: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A842658C@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> I fully support this idea. My conclusions from discussion with ITU people is that there is also an option to join without any costs/fee if we can proof that the group is non-commercial. This is what Toure said in Cairo. Bill, based in Geneva, could probably be very helpful and could be the 'ambassador" which would give him a higher standing in his interchasnge with ITU. The only thing I do not like is the acronym. What about this? WSIS concerned Civil Society Conference. (WSIS-CISOCON) Wolfgang ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr Fri Dec 5 04:50:48 2008 From: jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr (jlfullsack) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 10:50:48 +0100 Subject: CSU ITU interface / Re: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF References: <20081202042540.7F10067824@smtp1.electricembers.net> <15313D38C9AF4822A71B711740C0DFC5@PCbureau> <4938C656.8060509@mdpi.net> <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A842658C@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Message-ID: <4E10DA18F0E14FD1AD1515E0ABCD2FE0@PCbureau> I am not very enthousiastic about the idea of grouping the CS orgs that volunteer to WORK with the ITU (and not only for being a paying or fee free "member" of any kind). The "coalition" Francis suggests could be too heterogenous and waste too much time in "tuning their violines". And as a CS volunteer I'm fully opposed to pay any fee of any kind ! We have our expertise, our know-how, our experience in networking and/or Internet use and rules. This is a point that should be assessed for all CS candidates for an ITU membership of any kind. And these are as many treasures that are basis for discussing with the ITU, through the Council Working group or through any other ITU contact structure. This is particularly valuable when we consider the financial situation (rather a crisis) that the ITU is facing since some years due to low membership fees particularly those of its 700 or so private sector members. But once again the CS orgs or individuals interested in a profound move of the ITU towards openness and CS inclusion have to agree on some basic ideas and proposals before any formal discussion with ITU people. I'd also mention that there is something in the pipe at the European level. We Europeans have to push forwards this highly necessary initiative and therefore be careful to prevent it from being buried or put in the background. BTW Wolfgang : what is this new acronym ? Is it an acoustic ad or has it some meaning ? All the best Jean-Louis Fullsack ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kleinwächter, Wolfgang" To: ; "Dr. Francis MUGUET" ; Cc: "jlfullsack" ; "WSIS Civil Soc. WG on Information Networks Governance" Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 9:06 AM Subject: RE: CSU ITU interface / Re: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF > > I fully support this idea. > > My conclusions from discussion with ITU people is that there is also an > option to join without any costs/fee if we can proof that the group is > non-commercial. This is what Toure said in Cairo. Bill, based in Geneva, > could probably be very helpful and could be the 'ambassador" which would > give him a higher standing in his interchasnge with ITU. > > The only thing I do not like is the acronym. What about this? > > WSIS concerned Civil Society Conference. (WSIS-CISOCON) > > > Wolfgang > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From muguet at mdpi.net Fri Dec 5 05:22:32 2008 From: muguet at mdpi.net (Dr. Francis MUGUET) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 11:22:32 +0100 Subject: CSU ITU interface / Re: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF In-Reply-To: <4E10DA18F0E14FD1AD1515E0ABCD2FE0@PCbureau> References: <20081202042540.7F10067824@smtp1.electricembers.net> <15313D38C9AF4822A71B711740C0DFC5@PCbureau> <4938C656.8060509@mdpi.net> <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A842658C@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> <4E10DA18F0E14FD1AD1515E0ABCD2FE0@PCbureau> Message-ID: <493900E8.1010505@mdpi.net> Dear Jean-Louis > I am not very enthousiastic about the idea of grouping the CS orgs > that volunteer to WORK with the ITU (and not only for being a paying > or fee free "member" of any kind). The "coalition" Francis suggests > could be too heterogenous and waste too much time in "tuning their > violines". If yiu had paid a closer look into the proposal, the association would merely act as a formal channel, to convey members' opinion. No need of a consensus on any content. As for procedural issues, the association may only post a position only when there is a consensus. In matter of procedural issues, whenever it is a matter of reinforcing CS participation, the WSIS experience shows that a consensus may be easily reached. Therefore no time wasted in internal matters, just a vehicle for a diversity of expressions. > And as a CS volunteer I'm fully opposed to pay any fee of any kind ! What Wolfgang had said /My conclusions from discussion with ITU people is that there is also an option to join without any costs/fee if we can proof that the group is non-commercial. This is what Toure said in Cairo./ Touré told exactly the same thing to a few friends and me, yesterday evening. He told us that he passed some fee waivers for a few NGOs before the council without a glitch. Who are these NGOs ? I do not know. For me this something kind of new, because with Utsumi to waive fees was not an option. More recently, when I made some inquiries to regular ITU staff, all stakeholders have to pay.. So this appears to be a positive development... Concering the acronym CWSISCS or /WSIS concerned Civil Society Conference. (WSIS-CISOCON)/ to have WSIS separated out, is good idea since the acronym CISOCON rings funny in French lets try : WSIS-CSC All the best Francis > We have our expertise, our know-how, our experience in networking > and/or Internet use and rules. This is a point that should be assessed > for all CS candidates for an ITU membership of any kind. And these are > as many treasures that are basis for discussing with the ITU, through > the Council Working group or through any other ITU contact structure. > This is particularly valuable when we consider the financial situation > (rather a crisis) that the ITU is facing since some years due to low > membership fees particularly those of its 700 or so private sector > members. > But once again the CS orgs or individuals interested in a profound > move of the ITU towards openness and CS inclusion have to agree on > some basic ideas and proposals before any formal discussion with ITU > people. > I'd also mention that there is something in the pipe at the European > level. We Europeans have to push forwards this highly necessary > initiative and therefore be careful to prevent it from being buried or > put in the background. > BTW Wolfgang : what is this new acronym ? Is it an acoustic ad or has > it some meaning ? > All the best > Jean-Louis Fullsack > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kleinwächter, Wolfgang" > > To: ; "Dr. Francis MUGUET" > ; > Cc: "jlfullsack" ; "WSIS Civil Soc. WG on > Information Networks Governance" > Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 9:06 AM > Subject: RE: CSU ITU interface / Re: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF > > >> >> I fully support this idea. >> >> My conclusions from discussion with ITU people is that there is also >> an option to join without any costs/fee if we can proof that the >> group is non-commercial. This is what Toure said in Cairo. Bill, >> based in Geneva, could probably be very helpful and could be the >> 'ambassador" which would give him a higher standing in his >> interchasnge with ITU. >> >> The only thing I do not like is the acronym. What about this? >> >> WSIS concerned Civil Society Conference. (WSIS-CISOCON) >> >> >> Wolfgang >> >> > > > -- ------------------------------------------------------ Francis F. MUGUET Ph.D MDPI Foundation Open Access Journals http://www.mdpi.org http://www.mdpi.net muguet at mdpi.org muguet at mdpi.net ENSTA/KNIS http://knis.org 32 Blvd Victor 75739 PARIS cedex FRANCE Phone: (33)1 45 52 60 19 Fax: (33)1 45 52 52 82 muguet at ensta.fr http://www.ensta.fr/~muguet PC4D : http://www.pc4d.org World Summit On the Information Society (WSIS) Civil Society Working Groups Scientific Information : http://www.wsis-si.org chair Patents & Copyrights : http://www.wsis-pct.org co-chair Financing Mechanismns : http://www.wsis-finance.org web Info. Net. Govermance : http://www.wsis-gov.org web NET4D : http://www.net4D.org UNMSP : http://www.unmsp.org WTIS : http://www.wtis.org REUSSI : http://www.reussi.org ------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From muguet at mdpi.net Fri Dec 5 05:19:33 2008 From: muguet at mdpi.net (Dr. Francis MUGUET) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 11:19:33 +0100 Subject: PS Re: CSU ITU interface / Re: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF In-Reply-To: <4E10DA18F0E14FD1AD1515E0ABCD2FE0@PCbureau> References: <20081202042540.7F10067824@smtp1.electricembers.net> <15313D38C9AF4822A71B711740C0DFC5@PCbureau> <4938C656.8060509@mdpi.net> <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A842658C@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> <4E10DA18F0E14FD1AD1515E0ABCD2FE0@PCbureau> Message-ID: <49390035.8060905@mdpi.net> Dear Jean-Louis and Wolfgang As for ITU fees waiver, it is still unclear if it only for ITU-D , ( much more expansive ) this must be confirmed. ITU-R is also important. As Bill did say in Strasbourg, and I fully concur, CS participation in ITU-T is quite essential, because there are some technicians without any societal awareness, that are bringing out some potential dangerous standards. All the best Francis -- ------------------------------------------------------ Francis F. MUGUET Ph.D MDPI Foundation Open Access Journals http://www.mdpi.org http://www.mdpi.net muguet at mdpi.org muguet at mdpi.net ENSTA/KNIS http://knis.org 32 Blvd Victor 75739 PARIS cedex FRANCE Phone: (33)1 45 52 60 19 Fax: (33)1 45 52 52 82 muguet at ensta.fr http://www.ensta.fr/~muguet PC4D : http://www.pc4d.org World Summit On the Information Society (WSIS) Civil Society Working Groups Scientific Information : http://www.wsis-si.org chair Patents & Copyrights : http://www.wsis-pct.org co-chair Financing Mechanismns : http://www.wsis-finance.org web Info. Net. Govermance : http://www.wsis-gov.org web NET4D : http://www.net4D.org UNMSP : http://www.unmsp.org WTIS : http://www.wtis.org REUSSI : http://www.reussi.org ------------------------------------------------------ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From iza at anr.org Fri Dec 5 07:19:30 2008 From: iza at anr.org (Izumi AIZU) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 21:19:30 +0900 Subject: [governance] appeals team replacement process In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks Jeremy for your additional work! izumi 2008/12/5, Ian Peter : > > > > > David Goldstein informed me just prior to my leaving for Hyderabad that he > was having difficulty completing the work as chair of the Appeals Team > Nomcom because of other commitments. I announced this at our meeting here in > Hyderabad to those present and asked for a volunteer to take over. > > > > I'm very pleased that Jeremy Malcolm, who is already a member of this > committee, indicated willingness to take over this task. So I happily put > his name forward to the list and am pleased we have a capable nominee to > complete this task who is already on the committee. This will make us easy > to transition and continue to complete the work. > > > > Ian Peter > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From seiiti.lists at googlemail.com Fri Dec 5 08:19:30 2008 From: seiiti.lists at googlemail.com (Seiiti Arata) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 18:49:30 +0530 Subject: [governance] Are you in Hyderabad? Message-ID: Hi there - I'm writing to the list because I know some of you do not want to leave Hyderabad and go back home without marking your presence in the IGF 2008. Some of you already found the YouTube booth and left your messages - if you do not want to stay out of this initiative, just go to the IGF Village and the YouTube team will assist you. p.s. Does not matter if you are not in Hyderabad - just check http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGpTUCriGPk and add your video response Best, Seiiti -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dpefeva at gmail.com Fri Dec 5 10:58:48 2008 From: dpefeva at gmail.com (Dessi Greve) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 17:58:48 +0200 Subject: [governance] FYI: The Path Towards Centralization of Internet Governance Under the UN essay In-Reply-To: <6d8d3eb40812050752w5f7676efs9ed1db2766c868af@mail.gmail.com> References: <6d8d3eb40812050747m4e0bb60j9bac5cbdfe402c6c@mail.gmail.com> <6d8d3eb40812050752w5f7676efs9ed1db2766c868af@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6d8d3eb40812050758y12454b95jdaded48df1d8705f@mail.gmail.com> Interesting essay: http://isocbg.wordpress.com/2008/12/05/the-path-towards-centralization-of-internet-governance-under-the-un/ Regards, Dessi Greve ISOC - Bulgaria -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From bortzmeyer at internatif.org Fri Dec 5 11:11:18 2008 From: bortzmeyer at internatif.org (Stephane Bortzmeyer) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 17:11:18 +0100 Subject: [governance] Re: FYI: The Path Towards Centralization of Internet Governance Under the UN essay In-Reply-To: <6d8d3eb40812050758y12454b95jdaded48df1d8705f@mail.gmail.com> References: <6d8d3eb40812050747m4e0bb60j9bac5cbdfe402c6c@mail.gmail.com> <6d8d3eb40812050752w5f7676efs9ed1db2766c868af@mail.gmail.com> <6d8d3eb40812050758y12454b95jdaded48df1d8705f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20081205161118.GA12144@nic.fr> On Fri, Dec 05, 2008 at 05:58:48PM +0200, Dessi Greve wrote a message of 53 lines which said: > Interesting essay: > > http://isocbg.wordpress.com/2008/12/05/the-path-towards-centralization-of-internet-governance-under-the-un/ Extremely one-sided pro-ICANN essay. I completely agree with Brett Watson's comment: This essay is conspicuous in its omission: it speaks of the centralisation and institutionalisation of Internet governance as though it were not already centralised and institutionalised. There is a complete lack of comparison between the status quo under ICANN and the US Government and the possible future under a UN body. I submit that the "reasons for concern" cited in this essay can be applied with equal force to the status quo, but the essay lacks even a hint of comparison between the two. How can one obtain a full and proper understanding of the situation while comprehensively ignoring the current state of play? ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From Sylvia.Caras at gmail.com Fri Dec 5 12:50:27 2008 From: Sylvia.Caras at gmail.com (Sylvia Caras) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 09:50:27 -0800 Subject: [governance] Berlusconi would urge G8 to regulate internet Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20081205094651.02600ef8@peoplewho.org> "Italian president and media baron Silvio Berlusconi said today that he would use his country's imminent presidency of the G8 group to push for an international agreement to "regulate the internet". " http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/12/03/berlusconi_g8_internet/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lists at privaterra.info Fri Dec 5 14:24:57 2008 From: lists at privaterra.info (Robert Guerra) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 00:54:57 +0530 Subject: [governance] List of IGF related blogs Message-ID: Please see the following link to see if your blog is listed. If not, please list it here. http://underthebridge.ycool.com/post.3103376.html Robert -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ldmisekfalkoff at gmail.com Fri Dec 5 14:47:10 2008 From: ldmisekfalkoff at gmail.com (linda misek-falkoff) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 14:47:10 -0500 Subject: [governance] List of IGF related blogs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <45ed74050812051147k5e52a725qf710df5e5ea991a0@mail.gmail.com> Thank you very much Robert, quite an array of blogs; very useful, and very colorfully presented. LDMF. Dr. Linda D. Misek-Falkoff For i.d. in this context: Communictions Coordination Committee for the U.N. *Respectful Interfaces* Programme. On Fri, Dec 5, 2008 at 2:24 PM, Robert Guerra wrote: > Please see the following link to see if your blog is listed. If not, please > list it here. > > http://underthebridge.ycool.com/post.3103376.html > > Robert ... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dpefeva at gmail.com Fri Dec 5 15:18:05 2008 From: dpefeva at gmail.com (Dessi Greve) Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2008 22:18:05 +0200 Subject: [governance] Re: FYI: The Path Towards Centralization of Internet Governance Under the UN essay In-Reply-To: <20081205161118.GA12144@nic.fr> References: <6d8d3eb40812050747m4e0bb60j9bac5cbdfe402c6c@mail.gmail.com> <6d8d3eb40812050752w5f7676efs9ed1db2766c868af@mail.gmail.com> <6d8d3eb40812050758y12454b95jdaded48df1d8705f@mail.gmail.com> <20081205161118.GA12144@nic.fr> Message-ID: <6d8d3eb40812051218v23a5fcf1nc2a7bcfef3433944@mail.gmail.com> I am not arguing if it is pro- or anti-. It is just a very well written article, with lots of quotes, and answers to some of the questions previously raised in this mailing list, as well as in discussions where ISOC-Bulgaria has participated. Mainly - what is the IGF, why it seems so focused on ICANN, who are the driving forces behind some of the attacks on the current governance model, etc. On Fri, Dec 5, 2008 at 6:11 PM, Stephane Bortzmeyer < bortzmeyer at internatif.org> wrote: > On Fri, Dec 05, 2008 at 05:58:48PM +0200, > Dessi Greve wrote > a message of 53 lines which said: > > > Interesting essay: > > > > > http://isocbg.wordpress.com/2008/12/05/the-path-towards-centralization-of-internet-governance-under-the-un/ > > Extremely one-sided pro-ICANN essay. I completely agree with Brett > Watson's comment: > > This essay is conspicuous in its omission: it speaks of the > centralisation and institutionalisation of Internet governance as > though it were not already centralised and institutionalised. There is > a complete lack of comparison between the status quo under ICANN and > the US Government and the possible future under a UN body. I submit > that the "reasons for concern" cited in this essay can be applied with > equal force to the status quo, but the essay lacks even a hint of > comparison between the two. How can one obtain a full and proper > understanding of the situation while comprehensively ignoring the > current state of play? > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Fri Dec 5 20:32:29 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (JFC Morfin) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 02:32:29 +0100 Subject: CSU ITU interface / Re: [governance] IGC meeting at the IGF In-Reply-To: <4938C656.8060509@mdpi.net> References: <20081202042540.7F10067824@smtp1.electricembers.net> <15313D38C9AF4822A71B711740C0DFC5@PCbureau> <4938C656.8060509@mdpi.net> Message-ID: <20081206013300.634C8E1A3C@smtp3.electricembers.net> At 07:12 05/12/2008, Dr. Francis MUGUET wrote: >Dear Jean Louis and Parminder and Francis, I have worked on workable and free approach with the ITU for years (early 2003). But until recently ITU was not perceived as important to the Internet community. This approach is documented on http://i-sector.org - the text was edited by ITU staff. I reported on it on several occasions. I did not plan to revive its prep-team (bootstrap) before one month or two, in order to match the 2009 meetings with informed and trained people. jfc ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Fri Dec 5 19:25:03 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (JFC Morfin) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 01:25:03 +0100 Subject: [governance] Re: FYI: The Path Towards Centralization of In-Reply-To: <20081205161118.GA12144@nic.fr> References: <6d8d3eb40812050747m4e0bb60j9bac5cbdfe402c6c@mail.gmail.com> <6d8d3eb40812050752w5f7676efs9ed1db2766c868af@mail.gmail.com> <6d8d3eb40812050758y12454b95jdaded48df1d8705f@mail.gmail.com> <20081205161118.GA12144@nic.fr> Message-ID: <20081206013313.386386787E@smtp1.electricembers.net> +1 ! At 17:11 05/12/2008, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote: >How can one obtain a full and proper understanding of the situation >while comprehensively ignoring the current state of play? While every nearly everyone who counts about Internet+HR is Hyderabad, GNI came in Paris to convert (in English only) the French HROs: Business is the new Internet Human Right Angel! Impressive, with goodwill top hand in hand Google, Microsoft and Yahoo! brass hats. The one from Google (who hosts Vint in his office in DC, says he) even told me to use MSN if I was afraid of Google's world control. ICANN, ITU, UN, GNI. Who next ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ernesto at lacnic.net Sat Dec 6 08:09:08 2008 From: ernesto at lacnic.net (ernesto at lacnic.net) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 13:09:08 +0000 Subject: [governance] "Reality Mining" Resets the Privacy Debate In-Reply-To: <4932311C.3EBD2B8D@ix.netcom.com> References: <4932311C.3EBD2B8D@ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: <728129003-1228539121-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-132611140-@bxe208.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> A Correo enviado desde el servicio BlackBerry de Movistar -----Original Message----- From: "Jeffrey A. Williams" Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2008 22:22:20 To: Governance/IGC Subject: [governance] "Reality Mining" Resets the Privacy Debate All, Although our members are not on board with this concept or perhaps it is better called an idology, the following in respect to a Internet Bill of Rights, should be useful for background information. See: An anonymous reader sends us to the NYTimes for a sobering look at http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/30/business/30privacy.html the frontiers of "collective intelligence," also called in the article "reality mining." These techniques go several steps beyond the pedestrian version of "data mining" with which the Pentagon and/or DHS have been flirting. The article profiles projects at MIT, UCLA, Google, and elsewhere in networked sensor research and other forms of collective intelligence. "About 100 students at MIT agreed to completely give away their privacy to get a free smartphone. 'Now, when he dials another student, researchers know. When he sends an e-mail or text message, they also know. When he listens to music, they know the song. Every moment he has his Windows Mobile smartphone with him, they know where he is, and who's nearby.' ... Indeed, some collective-intelligence researchers argue that strong concerns about privacy rights are a relatively recent phenomenon in human history. ... 'For most of human history, people have lived in small tribes where everything they did was known by everyone they knew,' Dr. Malone said. 'In some sense we're becoming a global village. Privacy may turn out to have become an anomaly.'" Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ernesto at lacnic.net Sat Dec 6 08:09:20 2008 From: ernesto at lacnic.net (ernesto at lacnic.net) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 13:09:20 +0000 Subject: [governance] "Reality Mining" Resets the Privacy Debate In-Reply-To: <4932311C.3EBD2B8D@ix.netcom.com> References: <4932311C.3EBD2B8D@ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: <1397530064-1228539130-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1013091423-@bxe208.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Xz Correo enviado desde el servicio BlackBerry de Movistar -----Original Message----- From: "Jeffrey A. Williams" Date: Sat, 29 Nov 2008 22:22:20 To: Governance/IGC Subject: [governance] "Reality Mining" Resets the Privacy Debate All, Although our members are not on board with this concept or perhaps it is better called an idology, the following in respect to a Internet Bill of Rights, should be useful for background information. See: An anonymous reader sends us to the NYTimes for a sobering look at http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/30/business/30privacy.html the frontiers of "collective intelligence," also called in the article "reality mining." These techniques go several steps beyond the pedestrian version of "data mining" with which the Pentagon and/or DHS have been flirting. The article profiles projects at MIT, UCLA, Google, and elsewhere in networked sensor research and other forms of collective intelligence. "About 100 students at MIT agreed to completely give away their privacy to get a free smartphone. 'Now, when he dials another student, researchers know. When he sends an e-mail or text message, they also know. When he listens to music, they know the song. Every moment he has his Windows Mobile smartphone with him, they know where he is, and who's nearby.' ... Indeed, some collective-intelligence researchers argue that strong concerns about privacy rights are a relatively recent phenomenon in human history. ... 'For most of human history, people have lived in small tribes where everything they did was known by everyone they knew,' Dr. Malone said. 'In some sense we're becoming a global village. Privacy may turn out to have become an anomaly.'" Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Sat Dec 6 04:48:55 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 05:18:55 -0430 Subject: [governance] IGC co coordinator nomination: John Walubengo In-Reply-To: <1397530064-1228539130-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1013091423-@bxe208.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> References: <4932311C.3EBD2B8D@ix.netcom.com> <1397530064-1228539130-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1013091423-@bxe208.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Message-ID: <001401c95787$dfeb6fc0$f91b86dd@GINGERLAPTOP> Hi everyone, I am flattered to be considered for the position of IGC co coordinator. However, in the interests of a valid and lively elections process, I would like to propose another excellent candidate so that we have a range of options. I nominate John Walubengo, a Diplo colleague and experiences IG actor for the co coordinator. I have not heard back from him whether he would accept or not, but to ensure that his name is on the list before the deadline, I am proposing his name at this time. Thanks everyone! Thanks John! Saludos, Ginger ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From maxsenges at gmail.com Sat Dec 6 06:32:29 2008 From: maxsenges at gmail.com (Max Senges) Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 17:02:29 +0530 Subject: [governance] IGC co coordinator nomination: John Walubengo In-Reply-To: <001401c95787$dfeb6fc0$f91b86dd@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <4932311C.3EBD2B8D@ix.netcom.com> <1397530064-1228539130-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1013091423-@bxe208.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <001401c95787$dfeb6fc0$f91b86dd@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <4d976d8e0812060332v60176d79j9827ecb1fb53df4@mail.gmail.com> Dear Ginger, Ian, Parminder and all Is it possible to create a url (?wiki-page?) where the candidates can introduce themselves and what they see as their approach and commitment to the role they are interested to play? Thanks for considering this request Max On Sat, Dec 6, 2008 at 3:18 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > Hi everyone, > > I am flattered to be considered for the position of IGC co coordinator. > However, in the interests of a valid and lively elections process, I would > like to propose another excellent candidate so that we have a range of > options. > > I nominate John Walubengo, a Diplo colleague and experiences IG actor for > the co coordinator. I have not heard back from him whether he would accept > or not, but to ensure that his name is on the list before the deadline, I > am > proposing his name at this time. > > Thanks everyone! Thanks John! > Saludos, > Ginger > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- ------------------------------------------------- "The world of the senses is just the base camp: we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of physical reality. [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as human beings" (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. 10) ------------------------------------------------- Dr. Max Senges www.maxsenges.com www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Fri Dec 5 23:19:26 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:19:26 -0800 Subject: [governance] European Parliament References: <188DA256D9A2464AB9366FA414925EB3@IAN> Message-ID: <4939FD4E.5EB3BCB0@ix.netcom.com> Ian, Elisabeth and all, Our EU INEGroup members are largely in agreement with the two groups to which you mention. As such the modalities of EU governments seems to have recently been superseded in respect to the "Three Strikes" rule which it is clear that France was the ultimate culprit in such. Ergo, it appear that EU governments much like my own, are not willing to recognize the will of the governed in terms of IT governance, amongst a host of other areas of public interest. As such it also now appears that the EU as a political and policy determining body, has a process problems that needs addressing. Ian Peter wrote: > (slightly humorous and partially factual) > > Just to confirm that this meeting took place as scheduled. The European > Parliamentarians were represented by Bertrand de La Chapelle and I > represented Civil Society. I explained as follows (apologies to Nitin Desai) > > essentially, this is a dialogue between two groups of people ... and > we must face up to that reality. On the one hand, we have a group of > people who feel that the present modalities of government of all things by > sovereign states is working, will work, even in the future, who are afraid > that any major change in the way in which these arrangements are set > up would compromise governments in some form. And on the other > hand, we have a lot of people who are dependent on the Internet for > their activities, for the economic, social, political, whatever, who > feel that they have to have a say in the public policy issues which > affect how the Net runs in this manner. These are essentially the > two groups who are in dialogue here. > > (Bertrand was delegated to act for European Parliamentarians in a last > minute arrangement, and with no venue confirmed we agreed to postpone a > meeting between us to a suitable social function) > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Kleinwächter, Wolfgang > > > [mailto:wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de] > > > Sent: 25 November 2008 03:30 > > > To: Kleinwächter, Wolfgang; governance at lists.cpsr.org; jlfullsack; > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org; Elisabeth.MARKOT at ec.europa.eu > > > Cc: Parminder; William Drake > > > Subject: [governance] European Parliament > > > > > > > > > Dear list > > > > > > Elisabeth Markort from the European Commission forwarded me the > > invitation > > > of the European delegation which includes also a number of members of > > the > > > European Parliament, for a meeting with civil society in Hyderabad at 4. > > > Dezember, 13:00. Room will be announced. > > > > > > We had such meetings in Athens and Rio and it was very useful. Please > > > reserve the date in your calendar. > > > > > > Wolfgang > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > > Version: 8.0.169 / Virus Database: 270.9.9/1803 - Release Date: > > 11/23/2008 > > > 6:59 PM > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Fri Dec 5 23:21:23 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:21:23 -0800 Subject: [governance] Who Protects the Internet? Message-ID: <4939FDC3.46BD74EB@ix.netcom.com> All, I guess the IGF and the UN weren't even a consideration? Of course this person and article demonstrates how misinformed they really are. One thing is for sure, the ITU and ICANN are not protecting the Internet very well if at all... See: TechCrunch has an article from an interview with General Kevin Chilton, US STRATCOM commander and http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/12/02/who-protects-the-internet/ the head of all military cyber warfare. Who protects us? 'Basically no one. At most, a number of loose confederations of computer scientists and engineers who seek to devise better protocols and practices unincorporated groups like the Internet Engineering Task Force and the North American Network Operators Group. But the fact remains that no one really owns security online, which leads to gated communities with firewalls a highly unreliable and wasteful way to try to assure security. Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Fri Dec 5 23:21:40 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Fri, 05 Dec 2008 20:21:40 -0800 Subject: [governance] Berlusconi would urge G8 to regulate internet References: <7.0.1.0.2.20081205094651.02600ef8@peoplewho.org> Message-ID: <4939FDD4.2AD11456@ix.netcom.com> Sylvia and all, He's a bit behind the curve or out of touch, now isn't he?! The Internet has been for several years now become more and more regulated. Some good regulations by nation states are good, some are not, and some are a matter of opinion as to whether or not they are for the "Greater Good". None to my knowledge have been effective as to what they are suppose to address. This is not to say as to their value, but could be as to how they are enforced, and whom enforces them, and what their reach is in enforcement. Sylvia Caras wrote: > "Italian president and media baron Silvio Berlusconi said today that > he would use his country's imminent presidency of the G8 group to push > for an international agreement to "regulate the internet". " > > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/12/03/berlusconi_g8_internet/ > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Sat Dec 6 20:51:22 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 17:51:22 -0800 Subject: [governance] [Fwd: [A2k] 2009 Nomination Period Opens For ICANN Leadership Positions] Message-ID: <493B2C1A.7E9D1E05@ix.netcom.com> All, FWIW, and as an FYI. From my own personal thoughts, it would seem nearly pointless to consider, as now that the newly elected president-elect has chosen his "Internet Czar/CTO" ICANN may have become as far as the US is concerned, moot. Or has it? Yours to determine... -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [A2k] 2009 Nomination Period Opens For ICANN Leadership Positions Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 18:48:35 +0100 From: Khaled KOUBAA To: a2k at lists.essential.org References: <20081206170010.26105.33291.Mailman at lists.essential.org> This is a multi-part message in MIME format. -- [ Picked text/plain from multipart/alternative ] FYI 2009 Nomination Period Opens For ICANN Leadership Positions 2 December 2008 ICANN's Nominating Committee invites Statements of Interest and candidate recommendations from the Internet community as it seeks qualified candidates to assist in ICANN's technical and policy coordination role. Interested individuals are invited to submit a Statement of Interest to the 2009 Committee for the following positions: * Three members of the ICANN Board of Directors * Three At Large Advisory Committee (ALAC) representatives (one each from Africa, Asia/Australia/Pacific and Latin America & Caribbean regions) * Two members of the Council of the Generic Names Supporting Organization (GNSO) * One member of the Council of the Country-Code Names Supporting Organization (ccNSO) ICANN's Nominating Committee (Nom Com) is an independent committee tasked with selecting a majority of the members of ICANN's Board of Directors and other positions within ICANN's Supporting Organisations. ICANN is an internationally organised, public benefit, non-profit corporation dedicated to: preserving the operational security and stability of the Internet; promoting competition; achieving broad representation of global Internet communities; and supporting the development of policies appropriate to its mission through bottom-up, consensus-based processes. Individuals selected by the Nominating Committee will have a unique opportunity to work with accomplished colleagues from around the globe, address the Internet's intriguing technical coordination problems and policy development challenges with diverse functional, cultural, and geographic dimensions, and gain valuable insights and experience from working across boundaries of knowledge, responsibility and perspective. Those selected will gain the satisfaction of making a valuable public service contribution towards the continued function and evolution of an essential global resource. Considering the broad public interest, nominees will work to achieve the goals towards which ICANN is dedicated in order to facilitate the Internet's critically important societal functions. Current Board members who have been selected by the Nominating Committee include: Harald Tveit Alvastrand, Steve Crocker, Roberto Gaetano, Steven Goldstein, Dennis Jennings, Rajasekhar Ramaraj, Jean-Jacques Subrenat and Katim Touray (see, http://www.icann.org/en/general/board.html). Statements of Interest for the positions described above can be submitted through nomcom2009 at icann.org . More information regarding the Nominating Committee can be found at http://nomcom.icann.org. Applications will be considered confidentially and should be received by 15 April 2009 for full consideration. Selections will be announced in early September 2009. Successful candidates will take up their positions following ICANN's Annual Meeting in October 2009. Candidate recommendations, questions or comments may also be emailed to ICANN at nomcom2009 at icann.org . Background: The Nominating Committee is designed to function independently from the ICANN Board, Supporting Organisations, and Advisory Committees. Nominating Committee members act only on behalf of the interests of the global Internet community and within the scope of the ICANN mission and responsibilities assigned to it by the ICANN Bylaws. Nominating Committee members contribute understanding of the broad interests of the Internet community as a whole, and knowledge and experience of specific Internet constituencies who have appointed them. The challenge for the Nominating Committee is to integrate these perspectives and derive consensus in its selections. Although appointed by Supporting Organisations and other ICANN entities, individual Nominating Committee members are not accountable to their appointing constituencies. Members are, of course, accountable for adherence to the ICANN Bylaws and for compliance with the rules and procedures established by the Nominating Committee. Successful candidates are not remunerated, although direct expenses incurred in the course of duty will be reimbursed. These positions may involve significant international travel, including personal presence at periodic ICANN meetings, as well as regular telephone and Internet communications. Recent ICANN Meetings have been held in Canada, New Zealand, Morocco, Brazil, Portugal, Puerto Rico, the United States, India, France and Egypt. Meetings during 2009 are scheduled for Mexico City, Mexico, Sydney, Australia, Seoul, Korea. The diverse locations facilitate participation across the world's Internet community. _______________________________________________ A2k mailing list A2k at lists.essential.org http://lists.essential.org/mailman/listinfo/a2k Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Sat Dec 6 21:12:09 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 18:12:09 -0800 Subject: [governance] RIAA Vs. Web 2.0? Social Media and Litigation Message-ID: <493B30F9.592B1608@ix.netcom.com> All, This should warm your hearts! See: After learning that Professor Nesson's CyberLaw class at Harvard Law School has http://www.p2pnet.net/story/17777 set up a Facebook page to assist in its defense of Joel Tenenbaum in an RIAA case, http://recordingindustryvspeople.blogspot.com/2007/01/index-of-litigation-documents.html#SONY_v_Tenenbaum SONY BMG Music v. Tenenbaum, Wendy Davis of the Online Daily Examiner http://www.mediapost.com/publications/index.cfm?fa=Articles.showArticleHomePage&art_aid=96048 opines that 'Web 2.0,' and more particularly, the 'social media,' are playing an increasingly important role in RIAA litigation. We at Slashdot http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/12/28/0141221&tid=141 have already learned that principle, and have made http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/03/03/237211&tid=185 good use of it, http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20070302073736822 as have our friends at Groklaw. Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Sat Dec 6 21:16:07 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 18:16:07 -0800 Subject: [governance] Re: [ga] Re: [ga] ICANN presents misleading blackline c omparison document regarding pricing?] References: <20081206233112.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.9f0720eb7b.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <493B31E7.5B47A45D@ix.netcom.com> Karl and all, Thank you for expressing your views, many of which share broad agreement. Let's not forget the majority of the damage ICANN has done, such as .BIZ debacle, was under the than seeted Vint Cerf ICANN Bod. "Karl E. Peters" wrote: > Yes! When ICANN achieves its independence from the US Government > under which it has operated all these years, it also becomes just > another root systemthat gets its support only from those who like > them, a fast dwindling group! To be sure, most every root system > carries, and will continue to carry, traditionally "ICANN" TLDs, but > there will be no compelling reason to use ICANN's servers with their > often-maligned technical abilities to operate within those TLDs. > Instead, there will be more perceived freedom to choose from other > root systems that provide a much wider and "Inclusive Name Space". > The TLDA (Top-Level Domain Association, Inc.) has assembled many > experts in these matters and will soon publish a thoroughly researched > "TapRoot", a list of all active TLDs in the world with a recommended > subset for which a combination of "First Come, First Served" policy > and proper technical stability will be used to determine the widest > possible definition of the "Inclusive Name Space" that is stable and > sound. No longer will independent roots have to do all the research > themselves to include all the best of the internet, the TLDA will > regularly publish the ever evolving "TapRoot" to use as a starting > point. There will be no requirement that all the listed TLDs be > included in each root system, but it will no longer be difficult to > know which ones pass a defined set of standards, thus earning a place > in the TLDA's recommended list. Perhaps we will not have to endure > another travesty such as the virtual theft of an operational and > successful TLD like .BIZ simply because someone paid lots of money to > ICANN. When there is a basic protection of ones investments in > operating TLDs, more will be put into them and the entire internet > community will benefit, not just ICANN. It's time to get ready for > a new and inclusive internet. There have always been alternatives to > ICANN's root, but now they will be empowered to represent more and > better TLDs without re-creating the wheel to establish a workable > list. Now they will not suffer from the image that ICANN is the "real" > root of the US government, but understand it for what it is, just > another alliterative from which the internet community can choose. > Come and join our public list for more information and discussion of > these topics. We need not stay in the wilderness much longer! The > promised land is coming into view on the horizon!Sincerely yours,Karl > E. Peters, PresidentTop-Level Domain Association, Inc. > > ------ Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [ga] ICANN presents misleading blackline > comparison > document regarding pricing? > From: JFC Morfin > Date: Sat, December 06, 2008 8:13 pm > To: George Kirikos , ga at gnso.icann.org > > > Dear George, > I agree with you when you use the strong word of "outrage". > However, > are we not accustomed to this kind of behaviour? The real > question > now, is to decide if we still care about them or not, > meaning if we > adopt the position that they will not survive August 31, > 2009 as an > Internet market monopoly. If we do that, our priority is to > prepare > for 01/09/09. > jfc > ------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Public mailing list > Public at tldainc.org > http://tldainc.org/mailman/listinfo/public_tldainc.org > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Sat Dec 6 21:22:00 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sat, 06 Dec 2008 18:22:00 -0800 Subject: [governance] Re: [A2k] DCOS Agreement on Procurement in Support of Interoperability and Open Standards emerges at 3rd IGF, Hyderabad References: <79B1307A-62C7-4779-B923-C5161D2085A2@keionline.org> <200812072137.56071.philippe.aigrain@free.fr> Message-ID: <493B3348.6514A0D0@ix.netcom.com> Philippe and all, You make a very good point in your last statement/sentance. Likely what would or could be a better approach is for individuals and organizations to put forth their own statements, rather than directly endorse or not endorse the Hyderabad statement. After all, input as to what that statement was or perhaps should have been was extremely limited at best. From our members perspective, we did and so support PARTS of the Hyderabad statement, but not the statement in it's entirety. Philippe Aigrain wrote: > This is great, and entirely consistent with the standards, interoperability > and procurement provisions of the Public Policies section of the 2020 FLOSS > roadmap that was presented last week at the Open World Forum in Paris last > week. > http://www.openworldobservatory.org/download/owf_roadmap_20020.pdf > (pages 25-35) > > Just one remark, it is not very clear how other organizations and individuals > can endorse the Hyderabad statement. > > Best, > > Philippe Aigrain > > Le Saturday 06 December 2008 13:06:02 Thiru Balasubramaniam, vous avez écrit : > > http://www.keionline.org/blogs/2008/12/06/dcos-agreement-on-procurement-in- > >support-of-interoperability-and-open-standards-emerges-at-3rd-igf-hyderabad/ > > > > http://www.keionline.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=216 > > > > DCOS Agreement on Procurement in Support of Interoperability and Open > > Standards emerges at 3rd IGF, Hyderabad > > > > 6 December 2008 > > > > At the close of the final day of the 3rd Internet Governance Forum in > > Hyderabad, India, the Dynamic Coalition on Open Standards (DCOS) > > released an agreement entitled the “Dynamic Coalition on Open > > Standards (DCOS) Agreement on Procurement in Support of > > Interoperability and Open Standards.” > > > > Under the procurement agreement, governments, publicly funded and non- > > profit institutions agree to promote interoperability and > > accessibility through the use of open standards. > > > > From Hyderabad: Malini Aisola and Thiru Balasubramaniam > > > > The full text of the agreement including a list of initial signatories > > and endorsers, is available here: > > http://www.keionline.org/blogs/2008/12/06/dcos-agreement-on-procurement-in- > >support-of-interoperability-and-open-standards-emerges-at-3rd-igf-hyderabad/ > > > > Dynamic Coalition on Open Standards (DCOS) Agreement on Procurement in > > Support of Interoperability and Open Standards > > > > 3rd Internet Governance Forum (IGF) > > > > Hyderabad, India > > > > 6 December 2008 > > Preamble > > > > The Contracting Parties, > > > > Recalling the World Summit on the Information Society (WSIS) > > Declaration of Principles which states that “[i]nternational standards > > aim to create an environment where consumers can access services > > worldwide regardless of underlying technology,” > > > > Recognizing that standards are increasingly global concerns, involving > > goods and services that move in international trade across borders, > > > > Aware that current competition and legal remedies may not be enough to > > solve the inherent tensions that routinely arise in the realm of > > patents and standards, > > > > Desirous of encouraging procurement policies that require evaluation > > of multiple, competing products based on open ICT standards in order > > to ensure a level playing field for vendors, governments and consumers, > > > > Cognizant of the need for procurement policies for software programs > > that are predicated upon an open standard, > > > > Open Standards > > > > Given the multiplicity of interpretations of the term open standards, > > for the purpose of this document we endorse as an acceptable > > definition the position contained in the European Union’s draft > > European Interoperability Framework: > > > > 1) The open standard is adopted and will be maintained by a not-for- > > profit organisation, and its ongoing development occurs on the basis > > of an open decision-making procedure available to all interested > > parties (consensus or majority decision etc.). > > 2) The open standard has been published and the standard specification > > document is available either freely or at a nominal charge. It must be > > permissible to all to copy, distribute and use it for no fee or at a > > nominal fee. > > 3) The intellectual property - i.e. patents possibly present - of > > (parts of) the open standard is made irrevocably available on a > > royalty free basis. > > 4) There are no constraints on the re-use of the standard. > > > > (IDABC EIF v2 draft (http://ec.europa.eu/idabc/en/document/7728)) > > > > As noted in the European Interoperability Framework cited above, open > > standards or technical specifications must allow all interested > > parties to implement the standards and to compete on quality and > > price. The goal is to have a competitive and innovative industry, not > > to protect market shares by raising obstacles to newcomers. Thus, open > > standards or technical specifications must be possible to implement in > > software distributed under the most commonly used open source > > licences, with no limitations arising from IPR associated with the > > standard in question. > > > > In addition to the above requirements, it is recommended that there > > should be multiple independent implementations of the standard. > > > > Governments, publicly funded and non-profit institutions agree to > > implement the following policies. > > > > Governments, publicly funded and non-profit institutions > > Hereby agree to the following measures in order to promote > > interoperability and accessibility through the use of open standards. > > > > 1. To create a policy statement on interoperability and open > > standards, to be available to employees and the public. > > > > 2. By 2010, procurement of all software should be vendor neutral and > > implement open standards > > > > 3. By 2010, tender specifications for hardware (including peripherals > > and mobile devices) should require that manufacturers provide the > > driver and interface information necessary to work with a reasonable > > range of proprietary and free operating system platforms. > > > > 4. By 2010, all public facing web pages should conform to W3C > > standards for structure, presentation and accessibility. > > > > 5. By 2010, tenders for the supply of web based services (for example, > > online reservations) must specify the requirements of point 4. > > > > 6. By 2010, agencies should implement policies regarding the storage > > and archiving of government data and records to ensure that data is > > stored in open data and document formats. > > > > Signed by the following parties: > > > > Aslam Raffee, Government IT Officers’ Council, OSS Working Group, > > Republic of South Africa > > > > Association for Progressive Communications (APC) > > > > Bob Jolliffe, Freedom To Innovate, South Africa > > > > Centre for Internet and Society, India > > > > Eddan Katz, Electronic Frontier Foundation > > > > Hamid Rabiee, Sharif University of Technology, Iran > > > > Knowledge Ecology International > > > > Moving Republic, India > > > > Shuttleworth Foundation, South Africa > > > > Swathanthra Malayalam Computing, India > > > > Endorsed by the following parties: > > > > Bangladesh Friendship Education Society, Bangladesh > > > > Indian Social Action Forum (INSAF), India > > > > Foundation for Media Alternatives, Philippines > > > > OpenForum Europe > > -- > Philippe Aigrain (message personnel) > http://paigrain.debatpublic.net > _______________________________________________ > A2k mailing list > A2k at lists.essential.org > http://lists.essential.org/mailman/listinfo/a2k Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Sun Dec 7 03:23:31 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 00:23:31 -0800 Subject: [governance] Net Neutrality Opponent Calls Google a "Bandwidth Hog" Message-ID: <493B8803.A2177E99@ix.netcom.com> All, For some of us, this is not exactly news. Yet, despite Googles "Green" image, it is rather contrary to what Google is projecting and decidedly politically incorrect. But of course, Googles own marketing/propaganda blog attempts to mitigate the facts. Oh my! Vint, perhaps some more inside Google "Evangelizing" would be helpful to address this problem in light of the energy crunch as well as the financial crunch that the whole world is suffering would be far better PR, for Google as well as more in line with the upcoming Obama administration, lest President Elect Obama starts off on the wrong foot? See: "According to PC World, an analyst with ties to the telecom industry — in a baseless attack on the concept of Net Neutrality — has http://www.pcworld.com/article/155076/google_bandwidth_hog.html?tk=rss_news accused Google Inc. of being a bandwidth hog. Quoting: '"Internet connections could be more affordable for everyone, if Google paid its fair share of the Internet's cost," wrote Cleland in the report. "It is ironic that Google, the largest user of Internet capacity pays the least relatively to fund the Internet's cost; it is even more ironic that the company poised to profit more than any other from more broadband deployment, expects the American taxpayer to pick up its skyrocketing bandwidth tab."' Google http://googlepublicpolicy.blogspot.com/2008/12/response-to-phone-companies-google.html responded on their public policy blog, citing 'significant methodological and factual errors that undermine his report's conclusions.' Ars Technica http://arstechnica.com/journals/law.ars/2008/12/05/can-we-get-some-better-telecom-shills-please highlighted some of Cleland's faulty reasoning as well. Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Sun Dec 7 05:33:24 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 02:33:24 -0800 Subject: [governance] List of IGF related blogs References: Message-ID: <493BA674.56BA68DB@ix.netcom.com> Robert and all, Sorry to inform everyone but the DNS for the Domain Name for the below referenced URL is significantly miss configured and needs fixing. It's time, if not long past time that the New Ethic now finally being promoted by the newly elected Obama administration, be recognized and properly respected. See for this domain: http://private.dnsstuff.com/tools/dnsreport.ch?domain=ycool.com&token=10d026b263ca02880460438622019019 Such a configuration is not reasonably expectable. Robert Guerra wrote: > Please see the following link to see if your blog is listed. If not, > please list it here. > > http://underthebridge.ycool.com/post.3103376.html > > Robert > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de Mon Dec 8 05:55:13 2008 From: wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Kleinw=E4chter=2C_Wolfgang?=) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 11:55:13 +0100 Subject: SV: [governance] Re: [ga] Re: [ga] ICANN presents misleading blackline References: <20081206233112.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.9f0720eb7b.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <493B31E7.5B47A45D@ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A842659B@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Dear Karl could you give us also your analyze of the individual endusers perspective, in particular for the type of one billion+ endusers who want to have a simple system which offers low prices and maximum reach and are not interested into the tehcnical specification and the management "behind the wall"? With another root you propose what would be the extra value for the individual enduser and where is the guarantee that the next 4 billion users can communicate with the same easiness than the existing 1.5 billion are doing? Wolfgang "Karl E. Peters" wrote: > Yes! When ICANN achieves its independence from the US Government > under which it has operated all these years, it also becomes just > another root systemthat gets its support only from those who like > them, a fast dwindling group! To be sure, most every root system > carries, and will continue to carry, traditionally "ICANN" TLDs, but > there will be no compelling reason to use ICANN's servers with their > often-maligned technical abilities to operate within those TLDs. > Instead, there will be more perceived freedom to choose from other > root systems that provide a much wider and "Inclusive Name Space". > The TLDA (Top-Level Domain Association, Inc.) has assembled many > experts in these matters and will soon publish a thoroughly researched > "TapRoot", a list of all active TLDs in the world with a recommended > subset for which a combination of "First Come, First Served" policy > and proper technical stability will be used to determine the widest > possible definition of the "Inclusive Name Space" that is stable and > sound. No longer will independent roots have to do all the research > themselves to include all the best of the internet, the TLDA will > regularly publish the ever evolving "TapRoot" to use as a starting > point. There will be no requirement that all the listed TLDs be > included in each root system, but it will no longer be difficult to > know which ones pass a defined set of standards, thus earning a place > in the TLDA's recommended list. Perhaps we will not have to endure > another travesty such as the virtual theft of an operational and > successful TLD like .BIZ simply because someone paid lots of money to > ICANN. When there is a basic protection of ones investments in > operating TLDs, more will be put into them and the entire internet > community will benefit, not just ICANN. It's time to get ready for > a new and inclusive internet. There have always been alternatives to > ICANN's root, but now they will be empowered to represent more and > better TLDs without re-creating the wheel to establish a workable > list. Now they will not suffer from the image that ICANN is the "real" > root of the US government, but understand it for what it is, just > another alliterative from which the internet community can choose. > Come and join our public list for more information and discussion of > these topics. We need not stay in the wilderness much longer! The > promised land is coming into view on the horizon!Sincerely yours,Karl > E. Peters, PresidentTop-Level Domain Association, Inc. > > ------ Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [ga] ICANN presents misleading blackline > comparison > document regarding pricing? > From: JFC Morfin > Date: Sat, December 06, 2008 8:13 pm > To: George Kirikos , ga at gnso.icann.org > > > Dear George, > I agree with you when you use the strong word of "outrage". > However, > are we not accustomed to this kind of behaviour? The real > question > now, is to decide if we still care about them or not, > meaning if we > adopt the position that they will not survive August 31, > 2009 as an > Internet market monopoly. If we do that, our priority is to > prepare > for 01/09/09. > jfc > ------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Public mailing list > Public at tldainc.org > http://tldainc.org/mailman/listinfo/public_tldainc.org > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Mon Dec 8 08:57:49 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 06:57:49 -0700 Subject: SV: [governance] Re: [ga] Re: [ga] ICANN presents misleading blackline Message-ID: <20081208065749.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.3289523905.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Mon Dec 8 09:16:12 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 07:16:12 -0700 Subject: SV: [governance] Re: [ga] Re: [ga] ICANN presents misleading blackline Message-ID: <20081208071612.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.3dcb2077bd.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From avri at acm.org Mon Dec 8 12:52:59 2008 From: avri at acm.org (Avri Doria) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 12:52:59 -0500 Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper Message-ID: <006CC056-E4ED-4B5B-A018-1C77CDBACB9A@acm.org> Hi, For anyone interested, the draft of the Chairman's summary (not the closing summary that can be found in the transcripts) can be found at: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/hyderabad_prog/Chairman%27s%20Summary%20Dec6.pdf a. ps. update on my status - no longer under contract to IGF secretariat. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Sun Dec 7 19:15:53 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 16:15:53 -0800 Subject: SV: [governance] Re: [ga] Re: [ga] ICANN presents References: <20081208065749.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.3289523905.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <493C6739.DCFB5F64@ix.netcom.com> Karl and all, Good answer Karl. Unfortunately, as you all too well know, ICANN has decidedly for year now been against other root structures and has done whatever it could, even to the point of hijacking existing TLD's already up an running on other root structures ( .BIZ as well known and well documented example) and additionally demonstrated as well as articulated that as a public service company, is unwilling to share or inter operate with any other root structures. As such, it is or has become clear, and in my as well as your opinion that some governmental pressure or perhaps complement is needed to impress upon ICANN the error in it's various ways.... "Karl E. Peters" wrote: > (I took the liberty of joining your list discussion as I feel you are > taking on very important issues and I would like to be available to > you to address some of these issues from the TLDA perspective. -Karl > E. Peters) Dear Mr. Kleinwachter, Thank you first of all, for your > response and question. In my opinion, though others may vary, the > greatest good to come from the changes I outlined below (still > attached) is a relaxation in the minds of many ISPs and individual end > users that they must carry the "official" line, the ICANN root or > perhaps some other government's root. This opens up the possibility of > many more and varied TLDs from which to choose, or even initiate, for > their particular interests or needs. With such an opening, investors > that have been standing on the sideline with regard to other roots and > TLDs will be secure in adding infrastructure to the "up and coming" > root systems that offer the most "Inclusive NameSpace" to handle more > and more traffic. The greater traffic will enable and encourage > further investment in a diverse and free internet community. It > becomes a self-perpetuating growth environment where everyone will > gain. Already, there is a very strong registrar system tested and > ready to go online for handling the move into the new frontier. (Other > registrars wishing to join the move are welcomed, and with far fewer > strings than now exist under ICANN.) There has not generally been > any technical lacking on the part of the non-governmental roots, just > a lack of traffic and thereby, long-term investment needed to keep > them growing with the internet itself. When there is no longer the > perception that there is one superior root and many pretenders (many > users don't even know there is more than one!!!), but rather many > roots from which to choose, either on the ISP level or the end-user > level, known and interested investors will provide the funds to spread > the word and educate the public to their choices. As you must know, > but few end users know, you can change your DNS choices on the > personal computer level and not be dependant on your ISP's foresight. > Much like a battle between an original cable TV carrier in an area and > an upstart that carries more channels for the same price, the people > may not immediately see a need for the additional channels, but when > they cost no more, why not give them a try. Generally speaking, once > people get used to having more, they will always demand it. > Incidentally, the TLDA, Inc. has no plan to operate a new root, but > rather to foster a more conducive atmosphere for the operation of the > TLD operators that make up our body and for whom we advocate. We would > perform more as an internet "Chamber of Commerce" than as a competing > business. As part of our advocacy, though, we would require high > operational and ethical standards for those wishing to be listed in > our recommended list and then aggressively promote the entire industry > around the world. Thank you again for the opportunity to address > your question. Please feel free to contact me anytime with further > thoughts or concerns at kpeters at tldainc.orgor my telephone (912) > 638-1638. Ich Spreche ein bichen Deutsch, aber nicht gut. (I studied > one year when I was 15!) Mandarin Chinese is my best second language. > I used to write the English language news for Shanghai TV > station. Karl E. Peters, PresidentTop Level Domain Association, > Inc. ------ Original Message -------- > Subject: SV: [governance] Re: [ga] Re: [ga] ICANN presents misleading > blackline c omparison document regarding pricing?] > From: Kleinwächter,_Wolfgang > > Date: Mon, December 08, 2008 5:55 am > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Jeffrey A. Williams" > , "Karl E. Peters" , > > Governance/IGC > Cc: ga at gnso.icann.org > > Dear Karl > > could you give us also your analyze of the individual endusers > perspective, in particular for the type of one billion+ endusers who > want to have a simple system which offers low prices and maximum reach > and are not interested into the tehcnical specification and the > management "behind the wall"? > > With another root you propose what would be the extra value for the > individual enduser and where is the guarantee that the next 4 billion > users can communicate with the same easiness than the existing 1..5 > billion are doing? > > Wolfgang > > > "Karl E. Peters" wrote: > > > Yes! When ICANN achieves its independence from the US Government > > under which it has operated all these years, it also becomes just > > another root systemthat gets its support only from those who like > > them, a fast dwindling group! To be sure, most every root system > > carries, and will continue to carry, traditionally "ICANN" TLDs, but > > > there will be no compelling reason to use ICANN's servers with their > > > often-maligned technical abilities to operate within those TLDs. > > Instead, there will be more perceived freedom to choose from other > > root systems that provide a much wider and "Inclusive Name Space". > > The TLDA (Top-Level Domain Association, Inc.) has assembled many > > experts in these matters and will soon publish a thoroughly > researched > > "TapRoot", a list of all active TLDs in the world with a recommended > > > subset for which a combination of "First Come, First Served" policy > > and proper technical stability will be used to determine the widest > > possible definition of the "Inclusive Name Space" that is stable and > > > sound. No longer will independent roots have to do all the research > > themselves to include all the best of the internet, the TLDA will > > regularly publish the ever evolving "TapRoot" to use as a starting > > point. There will be no requirement that all the listed TLDs be > > included in each root system, but it will no longer be difficult to > > know which ones pass a defined set of standards, thus earning a > place > > in the TLDA's recommended list. Perhaps we will not have to endure > > another travesty such as the virtual theft of an operational and > > successful TLD like .BIZ simply because someone paid lots of money > to > > ICANN. When there is a basic protection of ones investments in > > operating TLDs, more will be put into them and the entire internet > > community will benefit, not just ICANN. It's time to get ready for > > a new and inclusive internet. There have always been alternatives to > > > ICANN's root, but now they will be empowered to represent more and > > better TLDs without re-creating the wheel to establish a workable > > list. Now they will not suffer from the image that ICANN is the > "real" > > root of the US government, but understand it for what it is, just > > another alliterative from which the internet community can choose. > > Come and join our public list for more information and discussion of > > > these topics. We need not stay in the wilderness much longer! The > > promised land is coming into view on the horizon!Sincerely > yours,Karl > > E. Peters, PresidentTop-Level Domain Association, Inc. > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Mon Dec 8 17:44:15 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 09:44:15 +1100 Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper In-Reply-To: <006CC056-E4ED-4B5B-A018-1C77CDBACB9A@acm.org> Message-ID: <0D592A4083AC4643A86FBAC22D02254B@IAN> Doesn't look like final version - has a "to be completed" after day 3... Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Avri Doria [mailto:avri at acm.org] > Sent: 09 December 2008 04:53 > To: Governance List > Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper > > Hi, > > For anyone interested, the draft of the Chairman's summary (not the > closing summary that can be found in the transcripts) can be found at: > > http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/hyderabad_prog/Chairman%27s%20Summary%20Dec > 6.pdf > > a. > > > ps. update on my status - no longer under contract to IGF secretariat. > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Mon Dec 8 18:55:10 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Mon, 08 Dec 2008 16:55:10 -0700 Subject: SV: [governance] Re: [ga] Re: [ga] ICANN presents misleadingblackline Message-ID: <20081208165510.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.60a246b562.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Sun Dec 7 21:48:26 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 18:48:26 -0800 Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper References: <0D592A4083AC4643A86FBAC22D02254B@IAN> Message-ID: <493C8AFA.630609A0@ix.netcom.com> Ian and all, Maybe that's why its called a "Draft", humm? >:) Still it does seem a bit odd that a draft, without soliciting comments, remarks, or potential changes to it, was published? I hope this "Draft" is not a preview to coming IGF process attractions. If so, the beginning of demonstrably demonstrated beuracratic behavior has begun and will likely get worse before it gets better... Ian Peter wrote: > Doesn't look like final version - has a "to be completed" after day 3... > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Avri Doria [mailto:avri at acm.org] > > Sent: 09 December 2008 04:53 > > To: Governance List > > Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper > > > > Hi, > > > > For anyone interested, the draft of the Chairman's summary (not the > > closing summary that can be found in the transcripts) can be found at: > > > > http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/hyderabad_prog/Chairman%27s%20Summary%20Dec > > 6.pdf > > > > a. > > > > > > ps. update on my status - no longer under contract to IGF secretariat. > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Sun Dec 7 22:03:53 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 19:03:53 -0800 Subject: SV: [governance] Re: [ga] Re: [ga] ICANN presentsmisleadingblackline References: <20081208165510.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.60a246b562.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <493C8E98.54124F36@ix.netcom.com> Karl and all, Thanks for your response. I get the time by managing my time wisely, closely, and diligently. It's difficult at times, but certainly doable, and for me in my position, necessary. I do agree that ICANN is heading down the wrong path and seemingly at times racing to the bottom as well as engendering a non-competitive closed market as well as a far less than safe, and ease of use market in the Name Space. This is of course mainly due to a poor understanding of the technical aspects which make up what we all have for decades now known as the "Internet". Yet there are also social complexities that are too often juxtaposed as reasons/excuses for some, but not all of ICANN's actions and policy decisions which have lead to significant TLD collisions, and will likely lead to more in the near future given ICANN's announcement of the introduction opening up the TLD name space. IPv6 will of course play a huge role in the success or lack there of in that policy decision as IPv4 address space is nearly exhausted. But non technical types do not, and seemingly refuse to recognize the significance as they are too focused on social issues to bother. That's unfortunate, but a symptom of how mass ignorance creates larger problems in many fields of endeavor, not just IT. Such is also a product of ICANN's significant miss management of the complexities of the MOU. As such, the legacy Internet will suffer further government intervention which ICANN doesn't desire, but has already helped to engender despite itself. An interesting dilemma... And so, the saga continues... "Karl E. Peters" wrote: > Mr. Williams, I don't know where you get the time to monitor and > respond to so much in so many places, but thanks. Were it the goal, > still, to change ICANN, you are absolutely right. It is a foregone > conclusion that their intent will remain the same. That does not mean > that anyone will necessarily care about their intent in the future, > though, when they leave the protection of mother government and try to > do things on their own popularity. I believe they are changing the > one thing we need them to change to make them irrelevant in the > future, and that is to step out from under the eaves of the government > roof and feel the rain on their heads for perhaps the first time; > people just walking away from them for greener pastures. They can make > all the determinations and policies they wish with their root and some > people, the less informed, will continue to play their game to get a > new TLD on the internet. Most, though, when the fog clears, will see a > completely viable alternative to the master / slave relationship ICANN > holds with its TLD registrants. The other roots will be ready to > handle them and help them sell their SLDs and provide quite ample > technicals to sustain them as the market edges that way. Reason has > already been tried... and failed with ICANN. We gave it our best > efforts now for years. It is time to leave them behind to manage their > empire while it lasts while we build a new multi-root system that > prevents collisions and allow freedom of choice on the root level and > then, freedom of choice for the end user to choose the root best > suited for them. ICANN is like the proverbial man trying to grasp al > the sand in one hand, and fearing loss, grip tighter and tighter, > forcing more and more of the sand from their ever smaller and > strangling grasp. The day is fast approaching when the internet can > be free again, and work!Sincerely yours,Karl E. Peters, > PresidentTop-Level Domain Association, Inc. > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: SV: [governance] Re: [ga] Re: [ga] ICANN > presents > misleadingblackline > From: "Jeffrey A. Williams" > Date: Sun, December 07, 2008 7:15 pm > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Karl E. Peters" > > Cc: "Dr. Joe Baptista" > > Karl and all, > > Good answer Karl. Unfortunately, as you all too well know, > ICANN > has decidedly for year now been against other root > structures and has > done whatever it could, even to the point of hijacking > existing TLD's > already up an running on other root structures ( .BIZ as > well known > and well documented example) and additionally demonstrated > as > well as articulated that as a public service company, is > unwilling to > share or inter operate with any other root structures. As > such, it is > or has become clear, and in my as well as your opinion that > some > governmental pressure or perhaps complement is needed to > impress > upon ICANN the error in it's various ways.... > > "Karl E. Peters" wrote: > > > (I took the liberty of joining your list discussion as I > feel you are > > taking on very important issues and I would like to be > available to > > you to address some of these issues from the TLDA > perspective. -Karl > > E.. Peters) Dear Mr. Kleinwachter, Thank you first of all, > for your > > response and question. In my opinion, though others may > vary, the > > greatest good to come from the changes I outlined below > (still > > attached) is a relaxation in the minds of many ISPs and > individual end > > users that they must carry the "official" line, the ICANN > root or > > perhaps some other government's root. This opens up the > possibility of > > many more and varied TLDs from which to choose, or even > initiate, for > > their particular interests or needs. With such an opening, > investors > > that have been standing on the sideline with regard to > other roots and > > TLDs will be secure in adding infrastructure to the "up > and coming" > > root systems that offer the most "Inclusive NameSpace" to > handle more > > and more traffic. The greater traffic will enable and > encourage > > further investment in a diverse and free internet > community. It > > becomes a self-perpetuating growth environment where > everyone will > > gain. Already, there is a very strong registrar system > tested and > > ready to go online for handling the move into the new > frontier. (Other > > registrars wishing to join the move are welcomed, and with > far fewer > > strings than now exist under ICANN.) There has not > generally been > > any technical lacking on the part of the non-governmental > roots, just > > a lack of traffic and thereby, long-term investment needed > to keep > > them growing with the internet itself. When there is no > longer the > > perception that there is one superior root and many > pretenders (many > > users don't even know there is more than one!!!), but > rather many > > roots from which to choose, either on the ISP level or the > end-user > > level, known and interested investors will provide the > funds to spread > > the word and educate the public to their choices. As you > must know, > > but few end users know, you can change your DNS choices on > the > > personal computer level and not be dependant on your ISP's > foresight. > > Much like a battle between an original cable TV carrier in > an area and > > an upstart that carries more channels for the same price, > the people > > may not immediately see a need for the additional > channels, but when > > they cost no more, why not give them a try. Generally > speaking, once > > people get used to having more, they will always demand > it. > > Incidentally, the TLDA, Inc. has no plan to operate a new > root, but > > rather to foster a more conducive atmosphere for the > operation of the > > TLD operators that make up our body and for whom we > advocate. We would > > perform more as an internet "Chamber of Commerce" than as > a competing > > business. As part of our advocacy, though, we would > require high > > operational and ethical standards for those wishing to be > listed in > > our recommended list and then aggressively promote the > entire industry > > around the world. Thank you again for the opportunity to > address > > your question. Please feel free to contact me anytime with > further > > thoughts or concerns at kpeters at tldainc..orgor my > telephone (912) > > 638-1638. Ich Spreche ein bichen Deutsch, aber nicht gut. > (I studied > > one year when I was 15!) Mandarin Chinese is my best > second language. > > I used to write the English language news for Shanghai TV > > station. Karl E. Peters, PresidentTop Level Domain > Association, > > Inc. > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From avri at acm.org Mon Dec 8 23:24:38 2008 From: avri at acm.org (Avri Doria) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 23:24:38 -0500 Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper In-Reply-To: <0D592A4083AC4643A86FBAC22D02254B@IAN> References: <0D592A4083AC4643A86FBAC22D02254B@IAN> Message-ID: hi, very true. it is the draft that was posted the last day of the meeting. it was just the the announcement of it was covered by the film from Egypt starting up a bit quickly (my fault - i gave the cue a tad ealry). the final day's synthesis will be added and another version will be released. apologies for accidentally misleading you into thinking it was a complete draft instead of an incomplete draft. a. On 8 Dec 2008, at 17:44, Ian Peter wrote: > Doesn't look like final version - has a "to be completed" after day > 3... > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Avri Doria [mailto:avri at acm.org] >> Sent: 09 December 2008 04:53 >> To: Governance List >> Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper >> >> Hi, >> >> For anyone interested, the draft of the Chairman's summary (not the >> closing summary that can be found in the transcripts) can be found >> at: >> >> http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/hyderabad_prog/Chairman%27s%20Summary%20Dec >> 6.pdf >> >> a. >> >> >> ps. update on my status - no longer under contract to IGF >> secretariat. >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From avri at psg.com Mon Dec 8 23:35:05 2008 From: avri at psg.com (Avri Doria) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 23:35:05 -0500 Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper In-Reply-To: <493C8AFA.630609A0@ix.netcom.com> References: <0D592A4083AC4643A86FBAC22D02254B@IAN> <493C8AFA.630609A0@ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: Jeffrey, I usually refrain from responding to your email. but I am living dangerously today so here goes. A chairman's report is usually not submitted for public review. If t were it would not be a chairman's report but a group report. But in case it were to be submitted for review by the body politic, which to the best of my knowledge it is not, wouldn't it have to be published as a draft first? If i have any sense i will press delete instead of send. If it was received by the list then i don't have any sense and this message can be safely ignored. cheers, avri reminder: i speak for no one On 7 Dec 2008, at 21:48, Jeffrey A. Williams wrote: > Ian and all, > > Maybe that's why its called a "Draft", humm? >:) Still it does > seem a bit odd that a draft, without soliciting comments, remarks, > or potential changes to it, was published? I hope this "Draft" is > not a preview to coming IGF process attractions. If so, the > beginning of demonstrably demonstrated beuracratic behavior > has begun and will likely get worse before it gets better... > > Ian Peter wrote: > >> Doesn't look like final version - has a "to be completed" after day >> 3... >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Avri Doria [mailto:avri at acm.org] >>> Sent: 09 December 2008 04:53 >>> To: Governance List >>> Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> For anyone interested, the draft of the Chairman's summary (not the >>> closing summary that can be found in the transcripts) can be found >>> at: >>> >>> http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/hyderabad_prog/Chairman%27s%20Summary%20Dec >>> 6.pdf >>> >>> a. >>> >>> >>> ps. update on my status - no longer under contract to IGF >>> secretariat. >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>> >>> For all list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > Regards, > > Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) > "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - > Abraham Lincoln > "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama > > "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is > very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt > > "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; > liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by > P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." > United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] > =============================================================== > Updated 1/26/04 > CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. > div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. > ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail > jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com > My Phone: 214-244-4827 > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Mon Dec 8 23:55:01 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Mon, 8 Dec 2008 23:55:01 -0500 Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper References: <0D592A4083AC4643A86FBAC22D02254B@IAN> <493C8AFA.630609A0@ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CDA@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Avri, There is an issue here which struck me especially at this 3rd IGF. You did exactly the right thing to get even a rough draft out quick, rather than waiting for it to be perfect. Thanks. Why? Well those govt reps which do make it to an IGF, are expected to report back to their own govts asap on 'what happened.' And they can;t do that very well without early draft summaries, since the IGF is too sprawling for most govt delegations to cover all the simultaneous events, well. Or even a fraction. In other words, we'd all be doing those govt folks especially a a favor if we followed your practice and got our reports/summaries out as fast as possible. Of course could help the rest of us too. Errors can be corrected later, sharing a draft is a favor. Now I just need to practice what I'm preaching, and you're doing, for the 'IGF Role and Mandate' workshop report...soon come! Lee -----Original Message----- From: Avri Doria [mailto:avri at psg.com] Sent: Mon 12/8/2008 11:35 PM To: Governance List Subject: Re: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper Jeffrey, I usually refrain from responding to your email. but I am living dangerously today so here goes. A chairman's report is usually not submitted for public review. If t were it would not be a chairman's report but a group report. But in case it were to be submitted for review by the body politic, which to the best of my knowledge it is not, wouldn't it have to be published as a draft first? If i have any sense i will press delete instead of send. If it was received by the list then i don't have any sense and this message can be safely ignored. cheers, avri reminder: i speak for no one On 7 Dec 2008, at 21:48, Jeffrey A. Williams wrote: > Ian and all, > > Maybe that's why its called a "Draft", humm? >:) Still it does > seem a bit odd that a draft, without soliciting comments, remarks, > or potential changes to it, was published? I hope this "Draft" is > not a preview to coming IGF process attractions. If so, the > beginning of demonstrably demonstrated beuracratic behavior > has begun and will likely get worse before it gets better... > > Ian Peter wrote: > >> Doesn't look like final version - has a "to be completed" after day >> 3... >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Avri Doria [mailto:avri at acm.org] >>> Sent: 09 December 2008 04:53 >>> To: Governance List >>> Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> For anyone interested, the draft of the Chairman's summary (not the >>> closing summary that can be found in the transcripts) can be found >>> at: >>> >>> http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/hyderabad_prog/Chairman%27s%20Summary%20Dec >>> 6.pdf >>> >>> a. >>> >>> >>> ps. update on my status - no longer under contract to IGF >>> secretariat. >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>> >>> For all list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > Regards, > > Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) > "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - > Abraham Lincoln > "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama > > "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is > very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt > > "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; > liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by > P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." > United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] > =============================================================== > Updated 1/26/04 > CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. > div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. > ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail > jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com > My Phone: 214-244-4827 > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: winmail.dat Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 5231 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com Mon Dec 8 02:26:02 2008 From: jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com (Jeffrey A. Williams) Date: Sun, 07 Dec 2008 23:26:02 -0800 Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper References: <0D592A4083AC4643A86FBAC22D02254B@IAN> <493C8AFA.630609A0@ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: <493CCC09.17C6E969@ix.netcom.com> Avri and all, Well sorry it was a strain for you to respond. Very unfortunate. Well as to the subject of your response, I can only say that if openness and transparency is a policy, than publishing a chairman's report would seem a normal thing to do. I already agreed indirectly that this "Draft" report is indeed just that, a "Draft". And yes of course such a chairman's report would be first published as a draft. Ignorance is of course bliss. Yet ignorance is often times as a bliss, a danger to those doing the ignoring. Sorry that you Avri have such a hateful attitude. Avri Doria wrote: > Jeffrey, > > I usually refrain from responding to your email. but I am living > dangerously today so here goes. > > A chairman's report is usually not submitted for public review. If t > were it would not be a chairman's report but a group report. > > But in case it were to be submitted for review by the body politic, > which to the best of my knowledge it is not, wouldn't it have to be > published as a draft first? > > If i have any sense i will press delete instead of send. > If it was received by the list then i don't have any sense and this > message can be safely ignored. > > cheers, > > avri > > reminder: i speak for no one > > On 7 Dec 2008, at 21:48, Jeffrey A. Williams wrote: > > > Ian and all, > > > > Maybe that's why its called a "Draft", humm? >:) Still it does > > seem a bit odd that a draft, without soliciting comments, remarks, > > or potential changes to it, was published? I hope this "Draft" is > > not a preview to coming IGF process attractions. If so, the > > beginning of demonstrably demonstrated beuracratic behavior > > has begun and will likely get worse before it gets better... > > > > Ian Peter wrote: > > > >> Doesn't look like final version - has a "to be completed" after day > >> 3... > >> > >> Ian Peter > >> PO Box 429 > >> Bangalow NSW 2479 > >> Australia > >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > >> www.ianpeter.com > >> > >> > >>> -----Original Message----- > >>> From: Avri Doria [mailto:avri at acm.org] > >>> Sent: 09 December 2008 04:53 > >>> To: Governance List > >>> Subject: [governance] Draft of Chairman's paper > >>> > >>> Hi, > >>> > >>> For anyone interested, the draft of the Chairman's summary (not the > >>> closing summary that can be found in the transcripts) can be found > >>> at: > >>> > >>> http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/hyderabad_prog/Chairman%27s%20Summary%20Dec > >>> 6.pdf > >>> > >>> a. > >>> > >>> > >>> ps. update on my status - no longer under contract to IGF > >>> secretariat. > >>> ____________________________________________________________ > >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: > >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >>> > >>> For all list information and functions, see: > >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >> > >> ____________________________________________________________ > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: > >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >> > >> For all list information and functions, see: > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > Regards, > > > > Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) > > "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - > > Abraham Lincoln > > "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama > > > > "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is > > very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt > > > > "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; > > liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by > > P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." > > United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] > > =============================================================== > > Updated 1/26/04 > > CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. > > div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. > > ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail > > jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com > > My Phone: 214-244-4827 > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance Regards, Spokesman for INEGroup LLA. - (Over 284k members/stakeholders strong!) "Obedience of the law is the greatest freedom" - Abraham Lincoln "YES WE CAN!" Barack ( Berry ) Obama "Credit should go with the performance of duty and not with what is very often the accident of glory" - Theodore Roosevelt "If the probability be called P; the injury, L; and the burden, B; liability depends upon whether B is less than L multiplied by P: i.e., whether B is less than PL." United States v. Carroll Towing (159 F.2d 169 [2d Cir. 1947] =============================================================== Updated 1/26/04 CSO/DIR. Internet Network Eng. SR. Eng. Network data security IDNS. div. of Information Network Eng. INEG. INC. ABA member in good standing member ID 01257402 E-Mail jwkckid1 at ix.netcom.com My Phone: 214-244-4827 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeremy at ciroap.org Tue Dec 9 04:35:59 2008 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 17:35:59 +0800 Subject: [governance] IGC co coordinator nomination: John Walubengo In-Reply-To: <4d976d8e0812060332v60176d79j9827ecb1fb53df4@mail.gmail.com> References: <4932311C.3EBD2B8D@ix.netcom.com> <1397530064-1228539130-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-1013091423-@bxe208.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> <001401c95787$dfeb6fc0$f91b86dd@GINGERLAPTOP> <4d976d8e0812060332v60176d79j9827ecb1fb53df4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <554961F8-79BA-4C66-A950-AAB35B1CE183@ciroap.org> On 06/12/2008, at 7:32 PM, Max Senges wrote: > Dear Ginger, Ian, Parminder and all > > Is it possible to create a url (?wiki-page?) where the candidates > can introduce themselves and what they see as their approach and > commitment to the role they are interested to play? The new IGC Web site in the works, but in the interim you can use this wiki page: http://wiki.igf-online.net/wiki/2008_coordinators_vote -- JEREMY MALCOLM Project Coordinator CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE for Asia Pacific and the Middle East Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Tue Dec 9 04:47:28 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Tue, 9 Dec 2008 20:47:28 +1100 Subject: [governance] IGC co coordinator nomination: John Walubengo In-Reply-To: <554961F8-79BA-4C66-A950-AAB35B1CE183@ciroap.org> Message-ID: Hi Jeremy, Although nominations have closed, I am still awaiting clarification on the status of one nomination which I should have within 24 hours. When I have that confirmation, I will ask the candidates to provide a statement/biography of up to 500 words. For convenience we will link this information to the ballot paper. Could we use the wiki page for that purpose? I'm reluctant for various reasons to use an open exchange between candidates rather than prepared statements in this case, so as to follow past precedent. Thanks, Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeremy Malcolm [mailto:jeremy at ciroap.org] > Sent: 09 December 2008 20:36 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: Re: [governance] IGC co coordinator nomination: John Walubengo > > On 06/12/2008, at 7:32 PM, Max Senges wrote: > > > Dear Ginger, Ian, Parminder and all > > > > Is it possible to create a url (?wiki-page?) where the candidates > > can introduce themselves and what they see as their approach and > > commitment to the role they are interested to play? > > > The new IGC Web site in the works, but in the interim you can use this > wiki page: > > http://wiki.igf-online.net/wiki/2008_coordinators_vote > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global > campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in > 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer > movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more > information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Tue Dec 9 15:41:27 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 07:41:27 +1100 Subject: [governance] JefreyA Williams suspension Message-ID: Please note that in accordance with the rules outlined in our charter, and after both private and public warnings, the co-coordinators have determined to suspend Jeffery A William's posting rights for three months until early March 2009. Jeffrey has been informed of this decision. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Tue Dec 9 15:51:19 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 07:51:19 +1100 Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator elections update Message-ID: <8688DECF385C4BA5BEE44BD8060A0AA6@IAN> Please note that unfortunately we have not been able to accept the nomination of John Walubengo as he is not a member of the mailing list currently (or subsequently a member of the mailing list of two months standing who can confirm they are a member of civil society). These are in our charter the membership conditions. I've written to John outlining this, and encouraging him to join with us. So the final list of candidates is Sivasubramanian Muthusamy Asif Kabani Ginger Paque I've now written to each candidate asking them to provide a 500 word bio/statement for publication here, and on our website and wiki. I expect that, with the kind co-operation of Derrick Cogburn, we should have the election underway in a week or so and finalized before Christmas. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Tue Dec 9 16:17:49 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Tue, 09 Dec 2008 14:17:49 -0700 Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator elections update Message-ID: <20081209141749.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.2e3405f737.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Tue Dec 9 16:27:43 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 08:27:43 +1100 Subject: [governance] JefreyA Williams suspension In-Reply-To: <20081209141202.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.20498041fc.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: Hi Karl, and welcome! The rules are in our charter, which can be accessed at http://www.igcaucus.org/charter The actions taken are not the result of one or two days of email, but rather a build up which has gone on for several months during which many members complained about the disruptive nature of the postings. As a result of this the co-coordinators wrote to Jeffrey privately outlining the concerns being expressed. After an interval of time, as the disruptive postings continued to appear, a public warning appeared on the list. Since then the co-coordinators have on many occasions considered whether a suspension was necessary. This is not something which was done lightly. This is nothing to do with freedom of expression, censoring opinions, disagreements with positions taken, or any particular posting. I do invite you to read a few months of our archives and determine for yourself what we have been dealing with. Ian Peter _____ From: Karl E. Peters [mailto:karl.peters at bridgecompanies.com] Sent: 10 December 2008 08:12 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Subject: RE: [governance] JefreyA Williams suspension As a new member of this list and having seen nothing obviously worthy of suspension from Mr. Williams in my short time here, perhaps I should find out where your rules are published and read them for myself. I manage quite a few lists where people have open disagreements on internet and education related topics, but disagreement, itself, can not be grounds for dismissal because then you have a small cheering section and not a real and vibrant discussion. There must be another reason, some other rule I need to learn about. Where are the rules, that I may read them. -Karl E. Peters, President Top-Level Domain Association, Inc. -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [governance] JefreyA Williams suspension From: "Ian Peter" Date: Tue, December 09, 2008 3:41 pm To: Please note that in accordance with the rules outlined in our charter, and after both private and public warnings, the co-coordinators have determined to suspend Jeffery A William's posting rights for three months until early March 2009. Jeffrey has been informed of this decision. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Wed Dec 10 10:21:42 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 10:21:42 -0500 Subject: [governance] FCC Investigation: 'Deception and Distrust' References: Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CE7@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> FYI, Especially for those who thought I was too cyncial on FCC Chair Martin. Lee For immediate release: Tuesday, December 9, 2008 Contact: Jodi Seth/Dingell, 202-225-5735 // Nick Choate/Stupak, 202-225-4735 Committee Releases Staff Report on Findings of FCC Investigation Washington, DC – Reps. John D. Dingell (D-MI), Chairman of the Committee on Energy and Commerce, and Bart Stupak (D-MI), Chairman of the Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations, today released a Committee on Energy and Commerce Majority Staff report detailing the findings of the Committee’s bipartisan investigation relating to the Federal Communications Commission (FCC). “Our investigation confirmed a number of troubling allegations raised by individuals in and outside the FCC,” Stupak said. “The Committee staff report details some of the most egregious abuses of power, suppression of information and manipulation of data under Chairman Martin’s leadership. It is my hope that this report will serve as a roadmap for a fair, open and efficient FCC under new leadership in the next administration.” “Any of these findings, individually, are cause for concern,” said Dingell. “Together, the findings suggest that, in recent years, the FCC has operated in a dysfunctional manner and Commission business has suffered as a result. It is my hope that the new FCC Chairman will find this report instructive and that it will prove useful in helping the Commission avoid making the same mistakes.” The report, titled “Deception and Distrust: The Federal Communications Commission Under Chairman Kevin J. Martin,” is the culmination of a bipartisan investigation into the FCC’s regulatory processes and management practices that was formally launched on January 8, 2008. Read the Report (pdf): Report: Press Release: Listen to Dec. 9th Media Conference Call with Chairman Stupak regarding the report and the investigation: RSS Feed: ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: winmail.dat Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 3877 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jeremy at ciroap.org Wed Dec 10 23:14:33 2008 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 12:14:33 +0800 Subject: [governance] Criteria for selection of Appeal Team Message-ID: <22AFE4D0-0085-44F6-80F3-0B7812958A9A@ciroap.org> As Ian recently noted, I have stepped in as Chair of the Nomcom to select a new IGC Appeals Team. The other members of the Nomcom are Gao Mosweu, Solomon Gizaw, Thomas Lowenhaupt, and Anriette Esterhuysen. Here are the criteria that we propose to apply to nominees seeking appointment to the Appeals Team. They are the same as used last year. Please provide your comments on these criteria, if any, by 18 December 2008, on around which date we will then make a call for nominees. Many thanks. --- begins --- Criteria for CS IGC Appeals Team A) Qualified IGC member Appeals team should be Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (CS IGC) members. Anyone who have subscribed to the IGC Charter and subscribed to the IGC caucus mailing list for 2 months prior to the announcement of the appeals team Nomcom process is eligible to be a candidate. (The Nomcom process started on 7 September 2008.) B) Qualifications Nomcom will primarily select persons based on their knowledge and experience of issues faced by the caucus and their neutrality. The successful candidate should be a person with thoughtful and unbiased consideration and have a stated (and demonstrated) commitment to consultation and dialogue with the community. C) Diversity and balance Appeal Team collectively should have good diversity and balance. The attributes to be considered include, but not limited to: - Geographic and cultural diversity - Gender - Age - Skill set and knowledge - Disability These will be treated as a goal, but not as the absolute requirement. D) Others To avoid capture, no more than one employee/representative of a particular organization should serve on the Appeal Team at any given time. --- ends --- -- JEREMY MALCOLM Project Coordinator CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE for Asia Pacific and the Middle East Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Thu Dec 11 05:36:07 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 10:36:07 +0000 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Message-ID: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> Hi, we had quite a good discussion at the caucus meeting in Hyderabad about possible topics for the next IGF. Parminder proposed a 'rights based approach to IG' as an over-arching theme for the next IGF. I think should continue this discussion on this list since it would be good if we could come up with proposals for topics at the next public consultation in Geneva in February 2009. I am not sure though if we should focus on the over-arching theme for the next IGF. In case you don't remember, the overall theme for this year's IGF was "Internet for all". My impression is that these over-arching themes don't matter that much, not only because they tend to be shallow but more so because the underlying topics are too diverse to reflect in any meaningful way the overall topic. We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For those who didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: * Reaching the next billion; * Promoting cyber-security and trust; * Managing critical Internet resources; * Taking stock and the way forward; * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching the next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss next year. Do others agree? What are other topics we want to see discussed? In my view, critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda. best, jeanette ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeremy at ciroap.org Thu Dec 11 06:02:36 2008 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 19:02:36 +0800 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> Message-ID: On 11/12/2008, at 6:36 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For > those who didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: > > * Reaching the next billion; > * Promoting cyber-security and trust; > * Managing critical Internet resources; > * Taking stock and the way forward; > * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow > > I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching > the next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss > next year. Do others agree? What are other topics we want to see > discussed? In my view, critical Internet resources should stay on > the agenda. I am ambivalent about the continued focus on access, but openness should definitely return. This is a diverse theme that can encompass open standards, open content, open source, open information, open governance and more all of which have drifted out of focus for the main sessions (though better represented in workshops). -- JEREMY MALCOLM Project Coordinator CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE for Asia Pacific and the Middle East Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Thu Dec 11 15:14:38 2008 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 20:14:38 +0000 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> Message-ID: Jeanette, Hi. I agree with you, critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda, I think the discussion took a good direction this year. A number of people noted the CIR debate was a sign of the IGF maturing. I was very surprised as the lack of civil society participation --particularly IGC and the bill of rights caucus-- in the open dialogue promoting cybersecurity and trust, it was the session for pushing rights. Think there were perhaps 3 or 4 CS speakers during the whole afternoon . The mics were open, what was the problem? Adam At 10:36 AM +0000 12/11/08, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >Hi, > >we had quite a good discussion at the caucus meeting in Hyderabad >about possible topics for the next IGF. Parminder proposed a 'rights >based approach to IG' as an over-arching theme for the next IGF. > >I think should continue this discussion on this list since it would >be good if we could come up with proposals for topics at the next >public consultation in Geneva in February 2009. > >I am not sure though if we should focus on the over-arching theme >for the next IGF. In case you don't remember, the overall theme for >this year's IGF was "Internet for all". My impression is that these >over-arching themes don't matter that much, not only because they >tend to be shallow but more so because the underlying topics are too >diverse to reflect in any meaningful way the overall topic. > >We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For >those who didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: > > * Reaching the next billion; > > * Promoting cyber-security and trust; > > * Managing critical Internet resources; > > * Taking stock and the way forward; > > * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow > >I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching >the next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss >next year. Do others agree? What are other topics we want to see >discussed? In my view, critical Internet resources should stay on >the agenda. > >best, jeanette >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de Thu Dec 11 06:41:32 2008 From: bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de (Ralf Bendrath) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 12:41:32 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Adam Peake schrieb: > I agree with you, critical Internet resources should stay on the > agenda, I think the discussion took a good direction this year. A > number of people noted the CIR debate was a sign of the IGF maturing. I am surprised that nobody so far has mentioned pushing for a rights-based approach to IG that was thoroughly discussed at the caucus meeting. As I said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. > I was very surprised as the lack of civil society participation > --particularly IGC and the bill of rights caucus-- in the open dialogue > promoting cybersecurity and trust, it was the session for pushing > rights. Think there were perhaps 3 or 4 CS speakers during the whole > afternoon > . > The mics were open, what was the problem? I can speak only for myself. I was at a parallel workshop for the first half or so, and when I came to the plenary, I had the impression that the whole debate had been hijacked by the "think of the children" faction. That at least discouraged me from taking the mic. A general point: If Nitin Desai sticks to his famous last words in Hyderabad ("we have to move towards consensus" or so), the /format/ of the main sessions will have to be different, too. Something in between traditional text negotiations and just open mic. Any ideas here? Best, Ralf ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Thu Dec 11 06:55:08 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 11:55:08 +0000 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Message-ID: <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> Ralf Bendrath wrote: > Adam Peake schrieb: >> I agree with you, critical Internet resources should stay on the >> agenda, I think the discussion took a good direction this year. A >> number of people noted the CIR debate was a sign of the IGF maturing. > > I am surprised that nobody so far has mentioned pushing for a rights-based > approach to IG that was thoroughly discussed at the caucus meeting. I did an hour ago or so. As I > said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights > up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating > and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a main session. > >> I was very surprised as the lack of civil society participation >> --particularly IGC and the bill of rights caucus-- in the open dialogue >> promoting cybersecurity and trust, it was the session for pushing >> rights. Think there were perhaps 3 or 4 CS speakers during the whole >> afternoon >> . >> The mics were open, what was the problem? > > I can speak only for myself. I was at a parallel workshop for the first > half or so, and when I came to the plenary, I had the impression that the > whole debate had been hijacked by the "think of the children" faction. Not my impression. I found the debate rather unstructured and shifting randomly between topics. One of the few substantial contributions came from Casper Bowden who spoke against the popular dichotomy between privacy and security. > That at least discouraged me from taking the mic. > > A general point: If Nitin Desai sticks to his famous last words in > Hyderabad ("we have to move towards consensus" or so), the /format/ of the > main sessions will have to be different, too. Something in between > traditional text negotiations and just open mic. Any ideas here? I heard many people saying that they would like to see clearer objectives for the various formats (workshops, main sessions, open dialogues, etc). I some areas where there seems to be broad consensus one could imagine specific outcomes as the aim of the event. I don't think this would work for all areas and discussion formats. We probably need an approach of specific speeds or ambitions reflecting the various degrees of antagonism that exist in each field. jeanette > > Best, Ralf > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de Thu Dec 11 07:24:39 2008 From: bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de (Ralf Bendrath) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 13:24:39 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <49410687.4060106@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Jeanette Hofmann schrieb: > Ralf Bendrath wrote: >> I am surprised that nobody so far has mentioned pushing for a >> rights-based approach to IG > I did an hour ago or so. Oops - I apologize. I must have read the first paragraph of your mail to fast. Sorry. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From natasha at apc.org Thu Dec 11 07:41:20 2008 From: natasha at apc.org (Natasha Primo) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 14:41:20 +0200 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> Message-ID: Hello, On 11 Dec 2008, at 1:02 PM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > On 11/12/2008, at 6:36 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > >> We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For >> those who didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: >> >> * Reaching the next billion; >> * Promoting cyber-security and trust; >> * Managing critical Internet resources; >> * Taking stock and the way forward; >> * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow >> >> I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching >> the next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss >> next year. Do others agree? What are other topics we want to see >> discussed? In my view, critical Internet resources should stay on >> the agenda. > > I am ambivalent about the continued focus on access, but openness > should definitely return. This is a diverse theme that can > encompass open standards, open content, open source, open > information, open governance and more all of which have drifted out > of focus for the main sessions (though better represented in > workshops). I think the organisers of the access main session would agree that the theme needs a new format. I heard a call for a mix of small "working group" sessions where stakeholders can have discussions about strategies and ways forward, as well as more open sessions where people who weren't part of the process can "get up to speed" as it were. At least that goes to the issue of "access to infrastructure." And I would agree that the openness threads should become more visible ... I agree that critical internet resources should remain as a main theme. I support the idea of focusing attention on a right-based approach ... though we should probably revisit/broaden the discussion on how to approach it strategically. Being in Egypt will also have the effect of amplifying the pertinence of the issue. Natasha > > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global > campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations > in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer > movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more > information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance //\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\ \//\\//\/ Natasha Primo National ICT Policy Advocacy Initiative Association for Progressive Communications South Africa Tel: +27118372122 Fax: +27865099147 Skype/Yahoo: natashaprimo ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From natasha at apc.org Thu Dec 11 07:52:05 2008 From: natasha at apc.org (Natasha Primo) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 14:52:05 +0200 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> Message-ID: Hi, On 11 Dec 2008, at 1:55 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > >>> I was very surprised as the lack of civil society participation -- >>> particularly IGC and the bill of rights caucus-- in the open >>> dialogue >>> promoting cybersecurity and trust, it was the session for pushing >>> rights. Think there were perhaps 3 or 4 CS speakers during the >>> whole afternoon >> >. The mics were open, what was the problem? >> I can speak only for myself. I was at a parallel workshop for the >> first >> half or so, and when I came to the plenary, I had the impression >> that the >> whole debate had been hijacked by the "think of the children" >> faction. > > Not my impression. I found the debate rather unstructured and > shifting randomly between topics. One of the few substantial > contributions came from Casper Bowden who spoke against the popular > dichotomy between privacy and security. And again it points to idea that using broadcasters - though they do come free of charge - may not be the best approach to stimulate relevant and structured debate. On Day 1 the co-moderators ended up facilitating the session because the broadcaster/chief moderator was un(der)-prepared, and on Day 2 it was unstructured and the co-moderators were stuck on a podium. In a 3rd iteration of the format - no WBA broadcaster and both moderators on the same level as the rest of the participants - Jeanette and Chris Disbain pulled off a more structured and substantive dialogue ... not that the technical community didn't manage to contradict one another :-) Natasha //\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\ \//\\//\/ Natasha Primo National ICT Policy Advocacy Initiative Association for Progressive Communications South Africa Tel: +27118372122 Fax: +27865099147 Skype/Yahoo: natashaprimo ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Thu Dec 11 08:05:58 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 13:05:58 +0000 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <49411036.5040006@wzb.eu> Hi Natasha, Natasha Primo wrote: > >> Not my impression. I found the debate rather unstructured and shifting >> randomly between topics. One of the few substantial contributions came >> from Casper Bowden who spoke against the popular dichotomy between >> privacy and security. > > And again it points to idea that using broadcasters - though they do > come free of charge - may not be the best approach to stimulate relevant > and structured debate. I fully agree. While professional broadcasters are good at keeping the crowd entertained, the usually lack the sense for the political assues at hand. Moreover, they don't want to achieve anything. The discussion on security seemed to me a debate for the sake of debating. And the two co-moderators were placed in a way that they could not interact with the broadcaster and even less intervene in the debate. From my own experience I would say that it is good to have two moderators if they cooperate (instead of monopolising the show). I also think we should try to do without journalists as moderators for the next year and see how this works out. jeanette > > On Day 1 the co-moderators ended up facilitating the session because the > broadcaster/chief moderator was un(der)-prepared, and on Day 2 it was > unstructured and the co-moderators were stuck on a podium. In a 3rd > iteration of the format - no WBA broadcaster and both moderators on the > same level as the rest of the participants - Jeanette and Chris Disbain > pulled off a more structured and substantive dialogue ... not that the > technical community didn't manage to contradict one another :-) > > Natasha > > //\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\\//\/ > > Natasha Primo > National ICT Policy Advocacy Initiative > Association for Progressive Communications > South Africa > Tel: +27118372122 > Fax: +27865099147 > Skype/Yahoo: natashaprimo > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Thu Dec 11 08:44:47 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 14:44:47 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <49411036.5040006@wzb.eu> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <49411036.5040006@wzb.eu> Message-ID: Le 11 déc. 08 à 14:05, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : > I fully agree. While professional broadcasters are good at keeping > the crowd entertained, the usually lack the sense for the political > assues at hand. Moreover, they don't want to achieve anything. It's the IGF itself that is refusing any tangible outcome. > The discussion on security seemed to me a debate for the sake of > debating. Is there any other purpose a "conversation" could have? A debate, even non conclusive, is not necessarily a waste of time, this is not my point, but one has to acknowledge that the IGF, in its current form, can't lead to anything else than a debate. Meryem____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From b.schombe at gmail.com Thu Dec 11 08:51:05 2008 From: b.schombe at gmail.com (BAUDOUIN SCHOMBE) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 14:51:05 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> Message-ID: Hi all, thanks for this briefing . In my modeste experience and to be in africa reality , I think three themes above can be maintened in topics: * Reaching the next billion; * Promoting cyber-security and trust; * Managing critical Internet resources; Baudouin 2008/12/11, Jeanette Hofmann : > > Hi, > > we had quite a good discussion at the caucus meeting in Hyderabad about > possible topics for the next IGF. Parminder proposed a 'rights based > approach to IG' as an over-arching theme for the next IGF. > > I think should continue this discussion on this list since it would be good > if we could come up with proposals for topics at the next public > consultation in Geneva in February 2009. > > I am not sure though if we should focus on the over-arching theme for the > next IGF. In case you don't remember, the overall theme for this year's IGF > was "Internet for all". My impression is that these over-arching themes > don't matter that much, not only because they tend to be shallow but more so > because the underlying topics are too diverse to reflect in any meaningful > way the overall topic. > > We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For those who > didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: > > * Reaching the next billion; > > * Promoting cyber-security and trust; > > * Managing critical Internet resources; > > * Taking stock and the way forward; > > * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow > > I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching the next > billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss next year. Do > others agree? What are other topics we want to see discussed? In my view, > critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda. > > best, jeanette > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN COORDONNATEUR NATIONAL REPRONTIC COORDONNATEUR SOUS REGIONAL ACSIS/AFRIQUE CENTRALE MEMBRE FACILITATEUR GAID AFRIQUE téléphone fixe: +243 1510 34 91 Téléphone mobile:+243998983491/+243999334571 email:b.schombe at gmail.com http://akimambo.unblog.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de Thu Dec 11 08:55:17 2008 From: bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de (Ralf Bendrath) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 14:55:17 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <49411036.5040006@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <49411BC5.5060601@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Meryem Marzouki schrieb: > It's the IGF itself that is refusing any tangible outcome. You probably have missed the closing session. See what Nitin Desai said at the very end: ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Thu Dec 11 09:07:07 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 15:07:07 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <512EC21A-5F83-4024-A102-8D05984E2F16@ras.eu.org> Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : > > Ralf Bendrath wrote: >> As I >> said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human >> rights >> up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. >> "Translating >> and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right >> direction. > > Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of > rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I > spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme > at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a main > session. I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could mean. Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the table, although framed differently.____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From valeriab at apc.org Thu Dec 11 09:08:23 2008 From: valeriab at apc.org (Valeria Betancourt) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 09:08:23 -0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> Message-ID: Hi all, Unfortunately I had to cancel my trip to India at the last minute, so I do not have the sense of the in situ participation this year. Glad to see the discussion about themes for the next edition of the IGF already started. I agree with the ones expressing the need for the return to the focus on openness and that the issue should become more visible in th next IGF. I also support the idea of exploring and discussing a right-based approach to internet governance and echo Natasha in relation to broadening the discussion on how to approach it strategically. Best, Valeria 2008/12/11 BAUDOUIN SCHOMBE > Hi all, > > thanks for this briefing . In my modeste experience and to be in africa > reality , I think three themes above can be maintened in topics: > > * Reaching the next billion; > > * Promoting cyber-security and trust; > > * Managing critical Internet resources; > > Baudouin > > 2008/12/11, Jeanette Hofmann : > >> Hi, >> >> we had quite a good discussion at the caucus meeting in Hyderabad about >> possible topics for the next IGF. Parminder proposed a 'rights based >> approach to IG' as an over-arching theme for the next IGF. >> >> I think should continue this discussion on this list since it would be >> good if we could come up with proposals for topics at the next public >> consultation in Geneva in February 2009. >> >> I am not sure though if we should focus on the over-arching theme for the >> next IGF. In case you don't remember, the overall theme for this year's IGF >> was "Internet for all". My impression is that these over-arching themes >> don't matter that much, not only because they tend to be shallow but more so >> because the underlying topics are too diverse to reflect in any meaningful >> way the overall topic. >> >> We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For those who >> didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: >> >> * Reaching the next billion; >> >> * Promoting cyber-security and trust; >> >> * Managing critical Internet resources; >> >> * Taking stock and the way forward; >> >> * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow >> >> I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching the >> next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss next year. Do >> others agree? What are other topics we want to see discussed? In my view, >> critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda. >> >> best, jeanette >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > > > > -- > SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN > COORDONNATEUR NATIONAL REPRONTIC > COORDONNATEUR SOUS REGIONAL ACSIS/AFRIQUE CENTRALE > MEMBRE FACILITATEUR GAID AFRIQUE > téléphone fixe: +243 1510 34 91 > Téléphone mobile:+243998983491/+243999334571 > email:b.schombe at gmail.com > http://akimambo.unblog.fr > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Valeria Betancourt Coordinadora / Coordinator Programa de Políticas de TIC en América Latina / Latin American ICT Policy Programme http://lac.derechos.apc.org Asociación para el Progreso de las Comunicaciones / Association for Progressive Communications, APC http://www.apc.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Thu Dec 11 09:13:31 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 15:13:31 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <49411BC5.5060601@zedat.fu-berlin.de> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <49411036.5040006@wzb.eu> <49411BC5.5060601@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Message-ID: <434A9066-6542-42A0-8B8D-44AFA2661FBF@ras.eu.org> Le 11 déc. 08 à 14:55, Ralf Bendrath a écrit : > Meryem Marzouki schrieb: >> It's the IGF itself that is refusing any tangible outcome. > > You probably have missed the closing session. See what Nitin Desai > said at > the very end: TSAWF.html> You're right, I missed this session. However, I don't feel entirely convinced when reading Nitin Desai's concluding words. We'll see, taking into account some strong statements - if not threats - made before and during the IGF, e.g. from Hamadoun Toure and from China representative. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Thu Dec 11 09:23:13 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 15:23:13 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGF 2009 Message-ID: The final version of the chairman summary has now been published. It is available at: http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/hydera/Chairman%27s%20Summary.10.12.2.pdf The dates of IGF 2009 are 14-17 November 2009 and the place will be Sharm El Sheikh, not (and far from) Cairo. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Thu Dec 11 09:27:01 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 19:57:01 +0530 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <434A9066-6542-42A0-8B8D-44AFA2661FBF@ras.eu.org> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <49411036.5040006@wzb.eu> <49411BC5.5060601@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <434A9066-6542-42A0-8B8D-44AFA2661FBF@ras.eu.org> Message-ID: Hello All, There was one suggestion by one of the participants during the last main open session that we should consider grouping workshop into issues, rather than continue with the present system of workshop topics [which leads to a situation of some issues overlappingly featured and some other issues completely missed. Whether or not such a change in approach is possible, when it comes to a proposal for a theme, we need to think of something that includes every issue. By that standard even Access is a rather narrow topic. Perhaps we should think of a theme that encompasses all issues concerning the growth and further evolution of the Internet. Such a topic could cover every issue and could get the IGF debating on ICANN governance, ITU's moves, legislative trends and every other issue around the task of preserving the open and free nature of the Internet. Sivasubramanian Muthusamy On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 7:43 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: > > Le 11 déc. 08 à 14:55, Ralf Bendrath a écrit : > > Meryem Marzouki schrieb: >> >>> It's the IGF itself that is refusing any tangible outcome. >>> >> >> You probably have missed the closing session. See what Nitin Desai said at >> the very end: >> > > You're right, I missed this session. However, I don't feel entirely > convinced when reading Nitin Desai's concluding words. We'll see, taking > into account some strong statements - if not threats - made before and > during the IGF, e.g. from Hamadoun Toure and from China representative. > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Thu Dec 11 09:53:27 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 14:53:27 +0000 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <49411BC5.5060601@zedat.fu-berlin.de> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <49411036.5040006@wzb.eu> <49411BC5.5060601@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Message-ID: <49412967.3040100@wzb.eu> The whole transcript is worth reading, not only for the content but also the structure of the debate: short introductory statements from the panelists and equally short interventions from the audience. Here are two of several highlights for those cannot be bothered to read the full transcript: Bertrand made a very good suggestion: "The IGF should allow issues to move from the mapping stage, where we explore the different dimensions, to basically the setting the goal or developing consensus on a goal, towards -- and I take Stephen Lau's expression -- synergizing action. I think what he meant, and correct me if I am wrong, by talking about the child pornography is that we have actually moved now to a sufficient consensus that this must be addressed that we can get, next year, into a more active format. And I would like here to make a suggestion of format. Some of the rooms here large square tables which can host about 15 people. Could we explore a format that would be a group discussion, a public group discussion, on this issue, for instance, picking 15 actors who have been active in the last three years in one category or the other and make them exchange on how to cooperate better later on, operationally." And Nitin wrapped up the session with the following observations: "What we have succeeded in doing so far is reducing people's apprehensions, reducing people's concerns, "Oh, my God, they're going to talk about this. This is going to mean unnecessary interference, et cetera, et cetera, unnecessary interference by governments or unnecessary interference by NGOs, or unnecessary corporatization," whatever. I think we have managed to get a little bit beyond that, and there is much greater sense of trust, if you like, cautious trust, but trust, nevertheless. I think the most important message I get from listening to all of you is a sense, to use David's phrase, that we have reached a point of inflection, where taking -- defending what we do and the value of what we do only in terms of process innovations is not enough, that people say now, "What's coming out of this?" Which is why the question, what are you going to take away from this? (...) There's been reference to products. Mr. Muguet referred to the possibility of dynamic coalitions giving recommendations as their recommendations. Everton Lucero referred to the example of the child pornography agreement which was reached in Rio. Can we design something where, at least in a few limited, well-defined areas where a process has succeeded in narrowing differences, finding consensus, we can come up with something which carries a certain legitimacy because it has come from a broader multistakeholder process in which the people who have ownership are not just governments, but governments, service providers, industry, NGOs, and many others? Yes, it doesn't have to be done for everything. It may be done only in a few areas, like the example that he gave of child pornography. Should we be thinking in these terms? And I get the sense that people feel that, look, it's time we started thinking about what do we get out of this process. We don't have to be a legislative process. All valuable products are not necessarily legislative products. In fact, sometimes the legislative products are of extremely limited value. The important thing is it must be a product which the people who have responsibility for decision take seriously. And those people may well be Internet Service Providers rather than governments. They may have to take that seriously in implementing it. So I don't think we have to think in terms of legislation in the usual sense of the term. But reflecting something which is a genuine consensus, how do we do that. People talked in terms of net-based, net groups coming together, developing things. And I think what all this is leading to is trying to look towards a richer contributory process to the global IGF, the regional, the national IGFs, net-based coalitions developing this work, the dynamic coalitions coming up with products. And creating a space where these things will be talked about, will be discussed. And I would stress once again there are very few fora where these issues are actually being discussed in the breadth and depths that we are doing here. jeanette Ralf Bendrath wrote: > Meryem Marzouki schrieb: >> It's the IGF itself that is refusing any tangible outcome. > > You probably have missed the closing session. See what Nitin Desai said at > the very end: > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Thu Dec 11 09:56:22 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 14:56:22 +0000 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <512EC21A-5F83-4024-A102-8D05984E2F16@ras.eu.org> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <512EC21A-5F83-4024-A102-8D05984E2F16@ras.eu.org> Message-ID: <49412A16.7030309@wzb.eu> Meryem Marzouki wrote: > > Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : >> >> Ralf Bendrath wrote: >>> As I >>> said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights >>> up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. >>> "Translating >>> and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. >> >> Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights >> in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against >> the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus >> meeting but I would support this topic for a main session. > > I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could > mean. I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into this approach. jeanette Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework > compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with > similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on > the table, although framed > differently.____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Thu Dec 11 10:13:12 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 16:13:12 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <49412A16.7030309@wzb.eu> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <512EC21A-5F83-4024-A102-8D05984E2F16@ras.eu.org> <49412A16.7030309@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <09A5F150-4168-4E32-A657-21F2E46BD0DB@ras.eu.org> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being how. Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : > > > Meryem Marzouki wrote: >> Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : >>> >>> Ralf Bendrath wrote: >>>> As I >>>> said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put >>>> human rights >>>> up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. >>>> "Translating >>>> and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right >>>> direction. >>> >>> Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of >>> rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I >>> spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall >>> theme at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a >>> main session. >> I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) >> could mean. > > I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have > concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all > participants buy into this approach. > jeanette > > Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework >> compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or >> something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the >> issue of access on the table, although framed >> differently._________________________________________________________ >> ___ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From maxsenges at gmail.com Thu Dec 11 11:02:01 2008 From: maxsenges at gmail.com (Max Senges) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 17:02:01 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <09A5F150-4168-4E32-A657-21F2E46BD0DB@ras.eu.org> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <512EC21A-5F83-4024-A102-8D05984E2F16@ras.eu.org> <49412A16.7030309@wzb.eu> <09A5F150-4168-4E32-A657-21F2E46BD0DB@ras.eu.org> Message-ID: <4d976d8e0812110802s3496a398ra174ef75d3afc1d8@mail.gmail.com> Hello I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1] coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main theme. We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights best max [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for next weeks monthly meeting. On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: > Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day > now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. > The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being > how. > > Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : > > > >> >> Meryem Marzouki wrote: >> >>> Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : >>> >>>> >>>> Ralf Bendrath wrote: >>>> >>>>> As I >>>>> said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human >>>>> rights >>>>> up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. >>>>> "Translating >>>>> and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. >>>>> >>>> >>>> Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights >>>> in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the >>>> 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but >>>> I would support this topic for a main session. >>>> >>> I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could >>> mean. >>> >> >> I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with >> a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into >> this approach. >> jeanette >> >> Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework >> >>> compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with >>> similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the >>> table, although framed >>> differently.____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>> For all list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- ------------------------------------------------- "The world of the senses is just the base camp: we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of physical reality. [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as human beings" (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. 10) ------------------------------------------------- Dr. Max Senges www.maxsenges.com www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Thu Dec 11 11:44:10 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 12:14:10 -0430 Subject: [governance] Co-Coordinator Nomination: short bio Virginia (Ginger) Paque In-Reply-To: <4d976d8e0812110802s3496a398ra174ef75d3afc1d8@mail.gmail.com> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <512EC21A-5F83-4024-A102-8D05984E2F16@ras.eu.org> <49412A16.7030309@wzb.eu> <09A5F150-4168-4E32-A657-21F2E46BD0DB@ras.eu.org> <4d976d8e0812110802s3496a398ra174ef75d3afc1d8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <010901c95baf$bdc812a0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Hi everybody, Just to give some basic information about myself, hoping to make the IGC co-coordinator elections an open and dynamic process as per Ian's request, I am including a short bio. Virginia (Ginger) Paque was born in the United States, but has lived in Venezuela for the past +30 years. An educator and administrator by profession, she has 25 years experience in business and manufacturing systems consulting. She is a board member of the United Nations Association of Venezuela and her work as the Venezuelan member of the World Federation of United Nations Associations Task Force on WSIS (starting in 2003) brought her into the world of Internet Governance during the PrepComs. She is a member of the Venezuela chapter of ISOC. Currently, an important priority is her work with Diplo Foundation for the Internet Governance Capacity Building Program, in particular the multilingual possibilities for digital education and the Spanish-English bilingual section of the Internet Governance Capacity Building Programmed in particular. She also coordinates and facilitates a series of online Spanish language Human Rights courses for lawyers and other professionals. Two areas of particular interest are Spanish language online educational projects and the research and monitoring of e-voting as a controversial but inevitable development. She is a member of the IGF Remote Participation Working Group, the Gender DC, the Digital Education DC, and the IBR DC. She is also interested in Net Neutrality as an IG issue. As examples of current work, she participated as a panelist in the Net Neutrality Workshop (users' viewpoint), the Digital Education Workshop (educators' viewpoint) and the Internet Governance Capacity Building Best Practices Workshop at the IGF Hyderabad. She has little formal experience as a moderator, and none as a mailing list coordinator. She has handled moderator/facilitator activities in courses and panels such as the Internet Voting debate held at the IGF Hyderabad in the Village Square. She practices tenor sax and classical piano, and plays with metalworking and cooking in her free time as well. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr Thu Dec 11 09:00:01 2008 From: jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr (jlfullsack) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 15:00:01 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <1044772E438C45C4868F47B61B0845F3@PCbureau> Dear Jeannette and all Of course, Internet critical resources should be on the agenda but, what's more, access and service providing in DCs should stay very hign on it. As far as I could read through all your messages from Hyderabad, the Internet for Developing countries was once more completely lost aside. May I recall our CS Declarations both in Geneva and in Tunis, for a "People centered Info Society" and for ICT's "unique role in socio-economic development and in promoting the fulfilment of intarnationnaly agreed development goals, including those contained in the Muillenium Declaration". There were also statements in these Declarations on the Public Good nature of some critical Internet resources. Can somebody from the CS present in Hyderabad let us know what progress in these most critical issues have been achieved there ? Thanks in advance. All the best Jean-Louis Fullsack ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeanette Hofmann" To: Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 11:36 AM Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > Hi, > > we had quite a good discussion at the caucus meeting in Hyderabad about > possible topics for the next IGF. Parminder proposed a 'rights based > approach to IG' as an over-arching theme for the next IGF. > > I think should continue this discussion on this list since it would be > good if we could come up with proposals for topics at the next public > consultation in Geneva in February 2009. > > I am not sure though if we should focus on the over-arching theme for the > next IGF. In case you don't remember, the overall theme for this year's > IGF was "Internet for all". My impression is that these over-arching > themes don't matter that much, not only because they tend to be shallow > but more so because the underlying topics are too diverse to reflect in > any meaningful way the overall topic. > > We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For those who > didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: > > * Reaching the next billion; > > * Promoting cyber-security and trust; > > * Managing critical Internet resources; > > * Taking stock and the way forward; > > * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow > > I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching the > next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss next year. > Do others agree? What are other topics we want to see discussed? In my > view, critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda. > > best, jeanette > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Thu Dec 11 14:22:17 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 06:22:17 +1100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <4d976d8e0812110802s3496a398ra174ef75d3afc1d8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2EE2D2104B2949D78C025D76856324C1@IAN> In addition to the rights theme, or perhaps in association with it, I would like to see a new theme of Public Policy and the Internet. Internet Governance bodies do not all handle public policy consistently or in some cases at all. I think there is a lot we can gain by examining this in more detail. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ From: Max Senges [mailto:maxsenges at gmail.com] Sent: 12 December 2008 03:02 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki; Parminder Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Hello I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1] coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main theme. We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights best max [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for next weeks monthly meeting. On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being how. Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Meryem Marzouki wrote: Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Ralf Bendrath wrote: As I said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a main session. I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could mean. I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into this approach. jeanette Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the table, although framed differently.____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -- ------------------------------------------------- "The world of the senses is just the base camp: we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of physical reality. [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as human beings" (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. 10) ------------------------------------------------- Dr. Max Senges www.maxsenges.com www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Thu Dec 11 14:57:54 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 14:57:54 -0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs References: <2EE2D2104B2949D78C025D76856324C1@IAN> Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D0C@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> I like 'Open and Universal Internet Access'as theme. Yeah I know you're all tired of word access but maybe I mean something different. Theme can be interpreted as about Internet rights, development, markets, policy and/or technology. Lee -----Original Message----- From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] Sent: Thu 12/11/2008 2:22 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In addition to the rights theme, or perhaps in association with it, I would like to see a new theme of Public Policy and the Internet. Internet Governance bodies do not all handle public policy consistently or in some cases at all. I think there is a lot we can gain by examining this in more detail. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ From: Max Senges [mailto:maxsenges at gmail.com] Sent: 12 December 2008 03:02 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki; Parminder Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Hello I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1] coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main theme. We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights best max [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for next weeks monthly meeting. On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being how. Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Meryem Marzouki wrote: Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Ralf Bendrath wrote: As I said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a main session. I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could mean. I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into this approach. jeanette Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the table, although framed differently.____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -- ------------------------------------------------- "The world of the senses is just the base camp: we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of physical reality. [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as human beings" (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. 10) ------------------------------------------------- Dr. Max Senges www.maxsenges.com www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Thu Dec 11 15:12:11 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 07:12:11 +1100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D0C@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: I like the concept of broadening access to include, for instance * equitable access to carriage for content providers (often discussed within the net neutrality debate) * access to content without interference (the censorship debate) * access to devices for applications (the open systems debate, the end to end debate) Add these to physical access and you have an interesting set of issues to look at. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ From: Lee W McKnight [mailto:lmcknigh at syr.edu] Sent: 12 December 2008 06:58 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter; governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs I like 'Open and Universal Internet Access'as theme. Yeah I know you're all tired of word access but maybe I mean something different. Theme can be interpreted as about Internet rights, development, markets, policy and/or technology. Lee -----Original Message----- From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] Sent: Thu 12/11/2008 2:22 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In addition to the rights theme, or perhaps in association with it, I would like to see a new theme of Public Policy and the Internet. Internet Governance bodies do not all handle public policy consistently or in some cases at all. I think there is a lot we can gain by examining this in more detail. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ From: Max Senges [mailto:maxsenges at gmail.com] Sent: 12 December 2008 03:02 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki; Parminder Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Hello I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1] coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main theme. We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights best max [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for next weeks monthly meeting. On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being how. Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Meryem Marzouki wrote: Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Ralf Bendrath wrote: As I said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a main session. I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could mean. I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into this approach. jeanette Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the table, although framed differently.____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -- ------------------------------------------------- "The world of the senses is just the base camp: we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of physical reality. [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as human beings" (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. 10) ------------------------------------------------- Dr. Max Senges www.maxsenges.com www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Thu Dec 11 15:14:58 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 07:14:58 +1100 Subject: [governance] Co-ordinator elections - Asif Kabani short bio and statement Message-ID: Here is the short bio ad statement sent to me by Asif Kabani (I will be posting all these statements to the website within a day or so) Biography and Statement Asif Kabani is an International Technical Expert on subject of Internet Governance (IG), e-governance, Information Communication Technology (ICT), Result Based Management Systems (RBMS), Project Performance Management Systems (RBMS), Small Medium Enterprise (SME), Micro credit and Socio Economic Development, Gender Mainstreaming and Gender Empowerment, Governance, Human Capital Development and Project Management. Serving as Hon. Director, Governance and ICT at International Sustainable Development - Resource Centre, Geneva, also served organizations namely Internet Governance Forum (IGF) United Nations Office Geneva, Asian Development Bank (ADB), Member Task Force on IT Policy Development, Ministry of IT and Telecom, GOP (in area of Internet Governance). Worked as Deputy Director, Decentralization Support Program, Ministry of Finance, and Project Performance Management System Specialist. Technical Advisor and Speaker at Asia's Government IT and Public Sector Technology and Management, Singapore, on Planning of e-government, Digital Divide and E-procurement. Speaker at Gulf International IT Exhibition (GITEX) and E-Government Summit, Dubai, UAE, International Speaker at 3rd International Conference of E-Governance, Publications include book & papers of Planning and Implementing e-governance with Public-Private and Civil Society Organizations. Professionally educated as Internet Governance and Policy expert from DiploFoundation, MSc degree from University of London, MBA in NGO Management and MBA in Information Technology (IT). Notable achievement in 2008 include working with Internet Governance Forum (IGF) Secretariat at UNOG. Planning the IGF Hyderbad 2008, had provided the opportunity to work with Multistakeholder (MAG), Member of Internet Governance Forum and Keys Players of IG, like ITU, ICANN, Council for Europe, ICC-Basic, Internet Governance Caucus, and Others. I am working towards sharing the knowledge of Internet Governance to masses by developing material, websites and training kits of IG in local languages with stakeholder of IG. Finally, I am looking forward to serve as IGC Co-coordinator, and work towards the development of the strategic outcomes of IGF 2008 and the community at large by promoting synergies with stakeholders. I strongly advocate forums and technologies that are promoting sustainable development and ICT for making world and cyberspace better place for people and environment. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de Thu Dec 11 20:09:23 2008 From: bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de (Ralf Bendrath) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 02:09:23 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4941B9C3.5080806@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Ian Peter schrieb: > I like the concept of broadening access to include, for instance > > * equitable access to carriage for content providers (often discussed > within the net neutrality debate) > * access to content without interference (the censorship debate) > * access to devices for applications (the open systems debate, the end > to end debate) > Add these to physical access and you have an interesting set of issues > to look at. You want to discuss Network Neutrality, without saying it? ;-) I'm all for it, but the strategic implications of opening this can of worms in Egypt at a UN conference need thorough discussion, I am afraid. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de Thu Dec 11 20:11:13 2008 From: bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de (Ralf Bendrath) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 02:11:13 +0100 Subject: [governance] Co-ordinator elections - Asif Kabani short bio and In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4941BA31.8030903@zedat.fu-berlin.de> I would like to hear from all candidates a bit more about what they think they can contribute to the IGC, and how they would do it. Generic CVs don't say very much about that, sorry. Thanks, Ralf ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Thu Dec 11 20:33:08 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 12:33:08 +1100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <4941B9C3.5080806@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Message-ID: Hi Ralf, To be very blunt about this - my personal opinion is that network neutrality is an unfortunate term which has distorted what was originally concerns about equitable access to content into endless debates about traffic shaping and carrier profitability. I'm all for dropping the term. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Ralf Bendrath [mailto:bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de] > Sent: 12 December 2008 12:09 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > Ian Peter schrieb: > > I like the concept of broadening access to include, for instance > > > > * equitable access to carriage for content providers (often discussed > > within the net neutrality debate) > > * access to content without interference (the censorship debate) > > * access to devices for applications (the open systems debate, the end > > to end debate) > > > Add these to physical access and you have an interesting set of issues > > to look at. > > You want to discuss Network Neutrality, without saying it? ;-) > > I'm all for it, but the strategic implications of opening this can of > worms in Egypt at a UN conference need thorough discussion, I am afraid. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From shailam at yahoo.com Thu Dec 11 21:17:39 2008 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 18:17:39 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <512EC21A-5F83-4024-A102-8D05984E2F16@ras.eu.org> <49412A16.7030309@wzb.eu> <09A5F150-4168-4E32-A657-21F2E46BD0DB@ras.eu.org> <4d976d8e0812110802s3496a398ra174ef75d3afc1d8@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <682603.10455.qm@web54301.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi As an Internet Bill of Rights IBR advocate I support Rights based theme for the next IGF conference. In addition I also suggest we encourage greater involvement from private sector, particularly the small and medium business. Learning from the buisness model will assist us greatly . Perhaps we could make this a sub theme : lessons from the private sector model. I am still in Chennai...will contribute more later Shaila Rao Mistry be as a well......sure and limitless.... but as time befits.....assume other forms ....     ________________________________ From: Max Senges To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki ; Parminder Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 9:32:01 PM Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Hello I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1]  coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main theme. We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009  please join our discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights best max [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for next weeks monthly meeting. On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being how. Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Meryem Marzouki wrote: Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Ralf Bendrath wrote:  As I said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a main session. I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could mean. I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into this approach. jeanette Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the table, although framed differently.____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:    governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:    governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:    governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:    governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:    governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:    governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -- ------------------------------------------------- "The world of the senses is just the base camp: we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of physical reality. [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as human beings"                                                (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. 10) ------------------------------------------------- Dr. Max Senges www.maxsenges.com www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From shailam at yahoo.com Thu Dec 11 21:40:18 2008 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 18:40:18 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs References: <2EE2D2104B2949D78C025D76856324C1@IAN> Message-ID: <255677.8813.qm@web54302.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Yes ultimately it comes down to Public Policy . This need to be given stronger billing and a greater role for the CS in this respect Shaila Rao Mistry   ________________________________ From: Ian Peter ian.peter at ianpeter.com In addition to the rights theme, or perhaps in association with it, I would like to see a new theme of Public Policy and the Internet.   Internet Governance bodies do not all handle public policy consistently or in some cases at all. I think there is a lot we can gain by examining this in more detail.       Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com     ________________________________ From:Max Senges [mailto:maxsenges at gmail.com] Sent: 12 December 2008 03:02 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki; Parminder Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs   Hello I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1]  coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main theme. We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009  please join our discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights best max [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for next weeks monthly meeting. On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being how. Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit :   Meryem Marzouki wrote: Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Ralf Bendrath wrote:  As I said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a main session. I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could mean. I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into this approach. jeanette Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the table, although framed differently.____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:    governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:    governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:    governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:    governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:    governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:    governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -- ------------------------------------------------- "The world of the senses is just the base camp: we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of physical reality. [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as human beings"                                                (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. 10) ------------------------------------------------- Dr. Max Senges www.maxsenges.com www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Thu Dec 11 23:05:41 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 21:05:41 -0700 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Message-ID: <20081211210541.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.728b3a8b68.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Thu Dec 11 23:39:00 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2008 21:39:00 -0700 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Message-ID: <20081211213900.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.030bca8069.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Fri Dec 12 01:30:58 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 17:30:58 +1100 Subject: [governance] Election Process Message-ID: Just to update everyone on the election process for a Co-coordinator to replace Parminder Singh - We are now in the process of preparing the electronic ballot paper, which will be distributed to every name on our mailing list of more than two months standing. Please note then, that if you have changed your mailing address in the last two months, and the old mailing address which was subscribed to the list is no longer operable, you should contact me personally with details of the old address and new mailing address so I can arrange for a ballot paper to be sent. Each person sent a ballot paper will be asked first to affirm whether they are a member of civil society. Only civil society members are entitled to vote. You will be given a choice of candidates to vote for, plus a "none of the above" option. If you prefer not to vote for a candidate, please fill in this option - that allows us to keep you on the updated membership list as a current member. The ballot paper and/or the covering letter will provide links to candidate bios/statements which have been received. In fairness these will all be approximately the same length and as provided by candidates. The ballot will be a secret ballot. The ballot will be open for one week. An announcement of the results will be made before Christmas. You should expect to receive a ballot paper before Tuesday next week (15th) possibly earlier. If you believe you are entitled to vote and have not received a ballot paper by then please contact me directly. I'll update everyone with additional details when we are ready to commence. Many thanks to Dr Derrick Cogburn, our Returning Officer! Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From divina.meigs at orange.fr Fri Dec 12 03:07:19 2008 From: divina.meigs at orange.fr (Divina MEIGS) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 09:07:19 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs: human rights and In-Reply-To: <682603.10455.qm@web54301.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi everybody, I don¹t often contribute to this list and I hope you won¹t mind my intervention. I would like to support a ³human rights² based internet governance, especially in view of all the infringements of such rights today, in all countries, France none the least. Yesterday, during the celebrations of the human rights declaration, one of our intellectuals, Regis Debray, has criticized the human rights as the degree zero of politics and as a tool for politicians who have no ideas. I find this very reactionnary, offensive and irresponsible... And I think we should try to prove him wrong... There is another issue that has been bothering me for several years of attendance at WSIS and IGF meetings: we never talk about labour. And yet ICTs are affecting the way we work, the way we are paid, the way we are evaluated, the way we can retire and all the other solidarity mechanisms around employment and unemployement. I can see it in our universities where there is also an increasing gap between the way we train students and the kind of jobs they get at the exit... So indeed, I would like to see more involvement of the private sector to discuss these issues, maybe with trade unions as guests of honor... since they are conspicuously absent !! So let¹s say that my priorities for themes for the next two IGFs would be= 1) human rights based internet governance, for 2009, as we could make it coincide with other celebrations around the theme ... and as many of us have been pushing for this issue ; 2) labor and internet governance, for 2010, as we should come to grips with the territorial consequences of virtual worlds... Sorry i missed you all in Hyderabad! Best Divina Frau-Meigs Le 12/12/08 3:17, « shaila mistry » a écrit : > Hi > As an Internet Bill of Rights IBR advocate I support Rights based theme for > the next IGF conference. In addition I also suggest we encourage greater > involvement from private sector, particularly the small and medium business. > Learning from the buisness model will assist us greatly . Perhaps we could > make this a sub theme : lessons from the private sector model. > > I am still in Chennai...will contribute more later > > Shaila Rao Mistry > > be as a well......sure and limitless.... > but as time befits.....assume other forms .... > > > > > > > > From: Max Senges > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki ; > Parminder > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 9:32:01 PM > Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > Hello > > I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years themes. > Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1] coalition is to > promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main theme. > > We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate and > prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. > > If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet > Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our discussion on > http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights > > best > max > > > > > [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for > next weeks monthly meeting. > > On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: >> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day now, >> there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. The >> only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being how. >> >> Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : >> >> >>> >>> >>> Meryem Marzouki wrote: >>>> Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : >>>>> >>>>> Ralf Bendrath wrote: >>>>>> As I >>>>>> said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights >>>>>> up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating >>>>>> and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. >>>>> >>>>> Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in >>>>> IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the >>>>> 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting >>>>> but I would support this topic for a main session. >>>> I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could >>>> mean. >>> >>> I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a >>> rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into >>> this approach. >>> jeanette >>> >>> Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework >>>> compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with >>>> similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the >>>> table, although framed >>>> differently.____________________________________________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>>> For all list information and functions, see: >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>> >>> For all list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Fri Dec 12 03:51:25 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 09:51:25 +0100 Subject: [governance] Co-ordinator elections - Asif Kabani short bio and In-Reply-To: <4941BA31.8030903@zedat.fu-berlin.de> References: <4941BA31.8030903@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Message-ID: Fully agree. And let me add that it would be useful that the three candidates give us some hints about their involvement so far in _CS_ activities in WSIS and IGF related context, if this doesn't appear from the bio they sent. Among the three candidates, one has been participating for years, the other has shown up recently, and the third has sent, well, 4 (four) messages since this caucus has started to discuss on its mailing list (April 2004)... if I dare to call a "message" a "thanks" or "congratulations" word. Sorry to be blunt, but the coordinator position is important for the caucus. Best, Meryem Le 12 déc. 08 à 02:11, Ralf Bendrath a écrit : > I would like to hear from all candidates a bit more about what they > think > they can contribute to the IGC, and how they would do it. > > Generic CVs don't say very much about that, sorry. > > Thanks, Ralf > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From mueller at syr.edu Fri Dec 12 03:53:04 2008 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 03:53:04 -0500 Subject: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech Message-ID: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0C@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Interesting to me that the religious right in America is characterizing criticism of their religion as "hateful" and as "bigotry." It provides an example of why many free speech advocates oppose so-called hate speech regulation, as it could easily be invoked to suppress all kinds of legitimate expression. ________________________________ From: Christian Coalition of America [mailto:noreply at cc.org] Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 2:49 PM To: Milton L Mueller Subject: Christian Coalition of America condemns Anti-Christian bigotry... Christian Coalition of America Press Release Roberta Combs, President ________________________________ Thursday, December 11, 2008 Christian Coalition of America condemns Anti-Christian bigotry on part of Governor Gregoire Washington D.C. -"There are no gods, no devils, no angels, no heaven or hell. There is only our natural world. Religion is but myth and superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds." This is what a poster in the Washington state capitol building says as it is displayed right next to a Nativity scene depicting the Christmas story and with a huge bust of George Washington between them. The President of the Christian Coalition of America, Roberta Combs said: "Governor Christine Gregoire has carried political correctness to the extreme by allowing such hateful speech against Christians and Christianity to be so prominently displayed in the Washington state capitol building. Christian Coalition of America urges her to immediately remove this abominable display." It seems each Christmas season, atheists attempt to reach new heights in antagonizing Christians and Jewish people in the case of the Hanukkah holiday. The very least that elected officials can do is to ignore these hateful attempts to mock other people's religions. Psalm 33:12 "Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord..." SUPPORT THE CHRISTIAN COALITION Click here to make a secure online donation Please do not reply to this email Christian Coalition of America P.O. Box 37030 Washington, D.C. 20013 Telephone: (202) 479-6900 Fax: (202) 479-4262 www.cc.org ________________________________ To stop receiving these emails, go to https://www.cc.org/unsubscribe.cfm . -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Fri Dec 12 04:07:40 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 20:07:40 +1100 Subject: [governance] Co-ordinator elections In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Yes, as Meryem suggests, a great way to find out about the candidates is to visit the Archives and have a look at their postings. That is a good assessment tool and I recommend it. I've thought about Ralf's posting all day. Last year Parminder specifically stated that he thought it would be best to avoid campaigning and even statements - it was strictly biographical information only - this year I thought, and Parminder agreed, that adding statements to the biographical information might be useful. I am concerned that we don’t get into campaigning and particularly candidates trying to outstage each other. I think that would be counter-productive. But I'm also reluctant to say people should not provide information that members are seeking. So I don't know. As I suggest above, a person's previous postings will tell you more about them than statements anyway, but I do not feel to either encourage or outlaw them. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Meryem Marzouki [mailto:marzouki at ras.eu.org] > Sent: 12 December 2008 19:51 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: Re: [governance] Co-ordinator elections - Asif Kabani short bio > and > > Fully agree. > And let me add that it would be useful that the three candidates give > us some hints about their involvement so far in _CS_ activities in > WSIS and IGF related context, if this doesn't appear from the bio > they sent. Among the three candidates, one has been participating for > years, the other has shown up recently, and the third has sent, well, > 4 (four) messages since this caucus has started to discuss on its > mailing list (April 2004)... if I dare to call a "message" a "thanks" > or "congratulations" word. > Sorry to be blunt, but the coordinator position is important for the > caucus. > > Best, > Meryem > > Le 12 déc. 08 à 02:11, Ralf Bendrath a écrit : > > > I would like to hear from all candidates a bit more about what they > > think > > they can contribute to the IGC, and how they would do it. > > > > Generic CVs don't say very much about that, sorry. > > > > Thanks, Ralf > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From mueller at syr.edu Fri Dec 12 04:19:33 2008 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 04:19:33 -0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <4941B9C3.5080806@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Message-ID: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0F@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Ian: I agree that the term Net Neutrality has become unfortunately confused with the issue of bandwidth management. The IGP paper on NN issued last year tried to separate the content access issues from the traffic shaping issues, with some success. I don't see any way to avoid the term NN, however. I think we need to reclaim the term and set it right. Anyway, I appreciate your perspective on this and think its worth discussing. --MM > -----Original Message----- > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 8:33 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Ralf Bendrath' > Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > Hi Ralf, > > To be very blunt about this - my personal opinion is that network > neutrality > is an unfortunate term which has distorted what was originally concerns > about equitable access to content into endless debates about traffic > shaping > and carrier profitability. I'm all for dropping the term. > > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Ralf Bendrath [mailto:bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de] > > Sent: 12 December 2008 12:09 > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > > > Ian Peter schrieb: > > > I like the concept of broadening access to include, for instance > > > > > > * equitable access to carriage for content providers (often discussed > > > within the net neutrality debate) > > > * access to content without interference (the censorship debate) > > > * access to devices for applications (the open systems debate, the end > > > to end debate) > > > > > Add these to physical access and you have an interesting set of issues > > > to look at. > > > > You want to discuss Network Neutrality, without saying it? ;-) > > > > I'm all for it, but the strategic implications of opening this can of > > worms in Egypt at a UN conference need thorough discussion, I am afraid. > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Fri Dec 12 04:28:54 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 10:28:54 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs: human rights and In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <445AD72E-D41E-47E2-ACDB-0F92E01F6037@ras.eu.org> Hi Divina (yes, we missed you in Hyderabad!), Regarding labor: during WSIS, the human rights caucus has constantly worked to maintain the indivisibility and interdependence of all human rights, including economic and social rights. UDHR art. 23 and, most importantly, ICESC art. 6, 7 and 8, deal with labor related issues. Having been a co-coordinator of this caucus, I can attest that labor rights and labor standards have constantly been mentioned in the HR caucus documents: I, among others, cared about this. We had trade-unions as members of the caucus but I recognize that their involvement was far beyond the level required w.r.t. to the fundamental transformation brought by the use of ICTs. On the other hand, I see that CS active in the field, in its vast majority, doesn't recognize trade unions as part of it. So, yes, they are conspicuously absent, but this absence is also conspicuously concomittent to the rise of the individual as _the_ CS actor (at the expense of organized actors, not only trade unions BTW). That being said, labor couldn't and shouldn't be discussed following the HR approach only, as the issue encompasses major transformations, as you pointed out, resulting from other factors, starting from globalization, outsourcing, dematerialization of procedures and processes, etc. Consequently, I don't find Regis Debray's criticisms that "reactionnary, offensive and irresponsible". I'm not a fan of Debray, but he's not stupid, to say the least. And, while being a strong supporter of a HR approach in CS circles, I concur with him to say that human rights don't constitute a policy and, yes, when politicians pretends that human rights are their sole program, we're not far from the degree zero of politics. Politics require a vision and a program to implement this vision. Compliance to human rights is a framework for assessing the resulting policies and, eventually, either accept or oppose them. And this assessment is the major CS role. Best, Meryem Le 12 déc. 08 à 09:07, Divina MEIGS a écrit : > > Hi everybody, > > I don’t often contribute to this list and I hope you won’t mind my > intervention. > > I would like to support a “human rights” based internet governance, > especially in view of all the infringements of such rights today, > in all countries, France none the least. Yesterday, during the > celebrations of the human rights declaration, one of our > intellectuals, Regis Debray, has criticized the human rights as the > degree zero of politics and as a tool for politicians who have no > ideas. I find this very reactionnary, offensive and > irresponsible... And I think we should try to prove him wrong... > > There is another issue that has been bothering me for several years > of attendance at WSIS and IGF meetings: we never talk about labour. > And yet ICTs are affecting the way we work, the way we are paid, > the way we are evaluated, the way we can retire and all the other > solidarity mechanisms around employment and unemployement. I can > see it in our universities where there is also an increasing gap > between the way we train students and the kind of jobs they get at > the exit... So indeed, I would like to see more involvement of the > private sector to discuss these issues, maybe with trade unions as > guests of honor... since they are conspicuously absent !! > > So let’s say that my priorities for themes for the next two IGFs > would be= > 1) human rights based internet governance, for 2009, as we > could make it coincide with other celebrations around the theme ... > and as many of us have been pushing for this issue ; > 2) labor and internet governance, for 2010, as we should come > to grips with the territorial consequences of virtual worlds... > > Sorry i missed you all in Hyderabad! > > Best > Divina Frau-Meigs > > > Le 12/12/08 3:17, « shaila mistry » a écrit : > >> Hi >> As an Internet Bill of Rights IBR advocate I support Rights based >> theme for the next IGF conference. In addition I also suggest we >> encourage greater involvement from private sector, particularly >> the small and medium business. Learning from the buisness model >> will assist us greatly . Perhaps we could make this a sub theme : >> lessons from the private sector model. >> >> I am still in Chennai...will contribute more later >> >> Shaila Rao Mistry >> >> be as a well......sure and limitless.... >> but as time befits.....assume other forms .... >> >> >> >> >> >> >> From: Max Senges >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki >> ; Parminder >> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 9:32:01 PM >> Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs >> >> Hello >> >> I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next >> years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and >> Principles [1] coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach >> to Internet Governance" as main theme. >> >> We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to >> coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. >> >> If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to >> Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our >> discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights >> >> best >> max >> >> >> >> >> [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our >> agenda for next weeks monthly meeting. >> >> On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki >> wrote: >>> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and >>> one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into >>> a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context >>> - like, here, IG - being how. >>> >>> Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Meryem Marzouki wrote: >>>>> Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : >>>>>> >>>>>> Ralf Bendrath wrote: >>>>>>> As I >>>>>>> said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put >>>>>>> human rights >>>>>>> up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. >>>>>>> "Translating >>>>>>> and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right >>>>>>> direction. >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role >>>>>> of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main >>>>>> session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as >>>>>> an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support >>>>>> this topic for a main session. >>>>> I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything >>>>> else) could mean. >>>> >>>> I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have >>>> concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that >>>> all participants buy into this approach. >>>> jeanette >>>> >>>> Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework >>>>> compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or >>>>> something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep >>>>> the issue of access on the table, although framed >>>>> differently.______________________________________________________ >>>>> ______ >>>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>>>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>>>> For all list information and functions, see: >>>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>>> ____________________________________________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>>> >>>> For all list information and functions, see: >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>> >>> For all list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ca at rits.org.br Fri Dec 12 04:56:02 2008 From: ca at rits.org.br (Carlos Afonso) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 07:56:02 -0200 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49423532.8040407@rits.org.br> Not so fast, mate! :) I am in a hurry, can't reply right now in detail, please do not drop anything in the meantime. --c.a. Ian Peter wrote: > Hi Ralf, > > To be very blunt about this - my personal opinion is that network neutrality > is an unfortunate term which has distorted what was originally concerns > about equitable access to content into endless debates about traffic shaping > and carrier profitability. I'm all for dropping the term. > > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Ralf Bendrath [mailto:bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de] >> Sent: 12 December 2008 12:09 >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs >> >> Ian Peter schrieb: >>> I like the concept of broadening access to include, for instance >>> >>> * equitable access to carriage for content providers (often discussed >>> within the net neutrality debate) >>> * access to content without interference (the censorship debate) >>> * access to devices for applications (the open systems debate, the end >>> to end debate) >>> Add these to physical access and you have an interesting set of issues >>> to look at. >> You want to discuss Network Neutrality, without saying it? ;-) >> >> I'm all for it, but the strategic implications of opening this can of >> worms in Egypt at a UN conference need thorough discussion, I am afraid. >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From avri at acm.org Fri Dec 12 08:03:41 2008 From: avri at acm.org (Avri Doria) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 08:03:41 -0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0F@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> References: <4941B9C3.5080806@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0F@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Hi, I think the best you can do is to use more specific parlance like 'NN in the sense of content control' a. On 12 Dec 2008, at 04:19, Milton L Mueller wrote: > Ian: > I agree that the term Net Neutrality has become unfortunately confused > with the issue of bandwidth management. The IGP paper on NN issued > last > year tried to separate the content access issues from the traffic > shaping issues, with some success. I don't see any way to avoid the > term > NN, however. I think we need to reclaim the term and set it right. > Anyway, I appreciate your perspective on this and think its worth > discussing. --MM > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] >> Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 8:33 PM >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Ralf Bendrath' >> Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs >> >> Hi Ralf, >> >> To be very blunt about this - my personal opinion is that network >> neutrality >> is an unfortunate term which has distorted what was originally > concerns >> about equitable access to content into endless debates about traffic >> shaping >> and carrier profitability. I'm all for dropping the term. >> >> >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Ralf Bendrath [mailto:bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de] >>> Sent: 12 December 2008 12:09 >>> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs >>> >>> Ian Peter schrieb: >>>> I like the concept of broadening access to include, for instance >>>> >>>> * equitable access to carriage for content providers (often > discussed >>>> within the net neutrality debate) >>>> * access to content without interference (the censorship debate) >>>> * access to devices for applications (the open systems debate, the > end >>>> to end debate) >>> >>>> Add these to physical access and you have an interesting set of > issues >>>> to look at. >>> >>> You want to discuss Network Neutrality, without saying it? ;-) >>> >>> I'm all for it, but the strategic implications of opening this can > of >>> worms in Egypt at a UN conference need thorough discussion, I am > afraid. >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>> >>> For all list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From avri at acm.org Fri Dec 12 08:11:16 2008 From: avri at acm.org (Avri Doria) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 08:11:16 -0500 Subject: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech In-Reply-To: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0C@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> References: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0C@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: hi, i used to be one of those who thought anything that resembled hate speech should be avoided. now we have gotten to the point where politically incorrect utterances (PIC Speech) have become almost acts of free speech defiance. It is really difficult to speak anymore without offending someone unless you just stop worrying about PIC speech. Funny it was the Right that first made fun of PC speech, but like most movements, they learned how to turn it to their advantage. And this is a more general trend that needs to be watched for - any movement and especially any slogan will be turned back on you sooner or later. Any term with twisted and overloaded with contradictory or spurious meanings. a. On 12 Dec 2008, at 03:53, Milton L Mueller wrote: > Interesting to me that the religious right in America is > characterizing criticism of their religion as “hateful” and as > “bigotry.” It provides an example of why many free speech advocates > oppose so-called hate speech regulation, as it could easily be > invoked to suppress all kinds of legitimate expression. > > From: Christian Coalition of America [mailto:noreply at cc.org] > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 2:49 PM > To: Milton L Mueller > Subject: Christian Coalition of America condemns Anti-Christian > bigotry... > > > > Press Release > Roberta Combs, President > > Thursday, December 11, 2008 > > Christian Coalition of America condemns Anti-Christian bigotry on > part of Governor Gregoire > > Washington D.C. –"There are no gods, no devils, no angels, no heaven > or hell. There is only our natural world. Religion is but myth and > superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds." > > This is what a poster in the Washington state capitol building says > as it is displayed right next to a Nativity scene depicting the > Christmas story and with a huge bust of George Washington between > them. > > The President of the Christian Coalition of America, Roberta Combs > said: "Governor Christine Gregoire has carried political correctness > to the extreme by allowing such hateful speech against Christians > and Christianity to be so prominently displayed in the Washington > state capitol building. Christian Coalition ofAmerica urges her to > immediately remove this abominable display." > > It seems each Christmas season, atheists attempt to reach new > heights in antagonizing Christians and Jewish people in the case of > the Hanukkah holiday. The very least that elected officials can do > is to ignore these hateful attempts to mock other people's religions. > Psalm 33:12 “Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord…” > > > > SUPPORT THE CHRISTIAN COALITION > Click here to make a secure online donation > Please do not reply to this email > > Christian Coalition of America > P.O. Box 37030 > Washington, D.C. 20013 > Telephone: (202) 479-6900 > Fax: (202) 479-4262 > www.cc.org > To stop receiving these emails, go to https://www.cc.org/unsubscribe.cfm > . > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Fri Dec 12 08:21:03 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 13:21:03 +0000 Subject: [governance] Co-ordinator elections In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4942653F.8060706@wzb.eu> Hi Ian, what's wrongt with a bit of campaigning? It would be good to gain some insight into the motives and aims of the candidates. But we, the voters, shouldn't forget that we need coordinators and we should not discourage them from volunteering for this time consuming job! jeanette Ian Peter wrote: > Yes, as Meryem suggests, a great way to find out about the candidates is to > visit the Archives and have a look at their postings. That is a good > assessment tool and I recommend it. > > I've thought about Ralf's posting all day. Last year Parminder specifically > stated that he thought it would be best to avoid campaigning and even > statements - it was strictly biographical information only - this year I > thought, and Parminder agreed, that adding statements to the biographical > information might be useful. > > I am concerned that we don’t get into campaigning and particularly > candidates trying to outstage each other. I think that would be > counter-productive. But I'm also reluctant to say people should not provide > information that members are seeking. > > So I don't know. As I suggest above, a person's previous postings will tell > you more about them than statements anyway, but I do not feel to either > encourage or outlaw them. > > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Meryem Marzouki [mailto:marzouki at ras.eu.org] >> Sent: 12 December 2008 19:51 >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> Subject: Re: [governance] Co-ordinator elections - Asif Kabani short bio >> and >> >> Fully agree. >> And let me add that it would be useful that the three candidates give >> us some hints about their involvement so far in _CS_ activities in >> WSIS and IGF related context, if this doesn't appear from the bio >> they sent. Among the three candidates, one has been participating for >> years, the other has shown up recently, and the third has sent, well, >> 4 (four) messages since this caucus has started to discuss on its >> mailing list (April 2004)... if I dare to call a "message" a "thanks" >> or "congratulations" word. >> Sorry to be blunt, but the coordinator position is important for the >> caucus. >> >> Best, >> Meryem >> >> Le 12 déc. 08 à 02:11, Ralf Bendrath a écrit : >> >>> I would like to hear from all candidates a bit more about what they >>> think >>> they can contribute to the IGC, and how they would do it. >>> >>> Generic CVs don't say very much about that, sorry. >>> >>> Thanks, Ralf >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>> >>> For all list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Fri Dec 12 08:44:48 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 06:44:48 -0700 Subject: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech Message-ID: <20081212064448.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.4941196415.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr Fri Dec 12 03:39:17 2008 From: jlfullsack at wanadoo.fr (jlfullsack) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 09:39:17 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs: human rights and References: Message-ID: <2D0C8F518D9D4F09AE8F06733EF7FD0B@PCbureau> Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs: human rights and laborThanks, Divina, for having brought in the forefront the need for CS to have -at last- trade unions as partners for discussing more holistically all issues pertaining to ICTs and Internet domains. In my opinion, this pproposal should be of higher priority for CS than "Lessons from the private model" ! We have seen at EuroDig, that Unions -in particular the German federation of Unions- can contribute actively and very purposedly to our debates (see The Declaration od Berlin), and as CS we are also for some extent Union members that means at least our proximity. Another point that is very important for me, is the solidarity between workers inside of the ICT/Internet industry, and between those in the North with their colleagues in the South. This aspect should even to be strengthened in the next future. All the best Jean-Louis Fullsack ----- Original Message ----- From: Divina MEIGS To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, shaila mistry ; governance at lists.cpsr.org ; Parminder Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 9:07 AM Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs: human rights and Hi everybody, I don't often contribute to this list and I hope you won't mind my intervention. I would like to support a "human rights" based internet governance, especially in view of all the infringements of such rights today, in all countries, France none the least. Yesterday, during the celebrations of the human rights declaration, one of our intellectuals, Regis Debray, has criticized the human rights as the degree zero of politics and as a tool for politicians who have no ideas. I find this very reactionnary, offensive and irresponsible... And I think we should try to prove him wrong... There is another issue that has been bothering me for several years of attendance at WSIS and IGF meetings: we never talk about labour. And yet ICTs are affecting the way we work, the way we are paid, the way we are evaluated, the way we can retire and all the other solidarity mechanisms around employment and unemployement. I can see it in our universities where there is also an increasing gap between the way we train students and the kind of jobs they get at the exit... So indeed, I would like to see more involvement of the private sector to discuss these issues, maybe with trade unions as guests of honor... since they are conspicuously absent !! So let's say that my priorities for themes for the next two IGFs would be= 1) human rights based internet governance, for 2009, as we could make it coincide with other celebrations around the theme ... and as many of us have been pushing for this issue ; 2) labor and internet governance, for 2010, as we should come to grips with the territorial consequences of virtual worlds... Sorry i missed you all in Hyderabad! Best Divina Frau-Meigs Le 12/12/08 3:17, « shaila mistry » a écrit : Hi As an Internet Bill of Rights IBR advocate I support Rights based theme for the next IGF conference. In addition I also suggest we encourage greater involvement from private sector, particularly the small and medium business. Learning from the buisness model will assist us greatly . Perhaps we could make this a sub theme : lessons from the private sector model. I am still in Chennai...will contribute more later Shaila Rao Mistry be as a well......sure and limitless.... but as time befits.....assume other forms .... ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From: Max Senges To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki ; Parminder Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 9:32:01 PM Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Hello I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1] coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main theme. We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights best max [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for next weeks monthly meeting. On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being how. Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Meryem Marzouki wrote: Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Ralf Bendrath wrote: As I said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a main session. I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could mean. I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into this approach. jeanette Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the table, although framed differently.____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Fri Dec 12 09:55:22 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 15:55:22 +0100 Subject: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech In-Reply-To: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0C@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> References: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0C@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Le 12 déc. 08 à 09:53, Milton L Mueller a écrit : > Interesting to me that the religious right in America is > characterizing criticism of their religion as “hateful” and as > “bigotry.” It provides an example of why many free speech advocates > oppose so-called hate speech regulation, as it could easily be > invoked to suppress all kinds of legitimate expression. > Or provides an example of why 'hate speech', without any precision and especially without specific reference to discrimination, is inadequate not only as a legal qualification but also as characterization in the political/social discourse. In countries like France where racist speech (and other kind of speech among those generally described as 'hate speech') is an offense punished by law, saying that "There are no gods, no devils, no angels, no heaven or hell. There is only our natural world. Religion is but myth and superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds." not only is not an offense, but is quite common (and well appreciated in some not so restricted circles:)) Actually, such a sentence should refer to 'blasphemy' or 'defamation of religions' (which are not considered as offenses in many countries, needless to say that "defamation of religion", as a legal concept, is pure nonsense) rather than to 'hate speech'. There is no hate directed to anyone expressed in the quoted sentence, so, in which way could this be interpreted as 'hate speech'? Right back from Hyderabad, I participed on 8-9 December to a conference organized in Paris by the EU Fundamental Rights Agency and the French presidency. It was on "Freedom of expression, a cornerstone of democracy - listening and communicating in a diverse Europe" (http://fra.europa.eu/fra/index.php? fuseaction=content.dsp_cat_content&catid=3e6c61340870c&contentid=492d3cd b312db). The former UN Special Rapporteur on contemporary forms of racism, racial discrimination, xenophobia and related intolerance, Doudou Diène, was present. According to him, it seems that, at the international level, we're going to get rid of 'defamation of religions' concept (and offense in some countries). And, indeed, in his report of September 2008 on the "manifestations of defamation of religions and in particular on the serious implications of Islamophobia on the enjoyment of all rights" (http:// daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/G08/153/97/PDF/G0815397.pdf), he recommends that "the Human Rights Council encourage a shift away from the sociological concept of the defamation of religions towards the legal norm of non-incitement to national, racial or religious hatred, on the basis of the legal provisions laid down in international human rights instruments, in particular articles 18 to 20 of the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights and article 4 of the International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Prejudice." The recommendations of the report from the UN High Commissionner for Human Rights on "combating defamation of religions", presented at the 9th session of the Human Rights Council are drawn along the same line (http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/hrcouncil/docs/9session/A.HRC. 9.7.doc). It's worth noting that this latter report is on the implementation of human rights council resolution 7/19 entitled “combating defamation of religions". Meryem ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Fri Dec 12 10:19:20 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 08:19:20 -0700 Subject: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech Message-ID: <20081212081920.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.f7fc1d807a.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Fri Dec 12 11:15:57 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 17:15:57 +0100 Subject: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech In-Reply-To: <20081212081920.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.f7fc1d807a.wbe@email.secureserver.net> References: <20081212081920.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.f7fc1d807a.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <5887CB01-20E2-4B70-9CE9-D2604B0E8572@ras.eu.org> You might object, but the purpose of this list is not to discuss religious issues or bigotry. It is rather to discuss global Internet governance policies, among them those related to content regulation and the concepts they are based upon, which was exactly what we started to do until you jumped in, with your reference to abortion as 'the killing of babies for convenience', with your considerations on 'massive influx of illegal aliens', which, under some laws against xenophobia, might be considered as offensive, and, finally, mixing all this with 'islamic terrorism', an expression which generalization could by itself fall under the laws against discrimination. The fact that you felt useful or even needed to add that you have a "a devout Muslim for a close friend and business partner" doesn't change anything to this: it's just the usual disclaimer as in the "I'm not racist/antisemit, I've a [jewish/muslim/black/whatever usual victim of racism] friend" well known discourse. I wont further comment this. It's simply that this kind of discourse has no place on this list, as it is by far out of its scope, and I'm asking the coordinators of this caucus to take due note of this remark. Regarding your precise question, let me take it as if it was a genuine one, and simply answer that it perfectly illustrates what was my point: "'hate speech', without any precision and especially without specific reference to discrimination, is inadequate not only as a legal qualification but also as characterization in the political/social discourse." Hate, as intended in 'hate speech' and its regulation, is directed against a person or a group of person, just like defamation, BTW. Not against a concept, idea or belief. Le 12 déc. 08 à 16:19, Karl E. Peters a écrit : > I must object here...How is there "no hate" in that message > compared to other "hate speech" when it is said that religion > hardens hearts and enslaves minds. We could debate the veracity of > such a statement all day, but you can not say that such a statement > is not just as hateful as MUCH of what is called hate speech today > by others. It is all a matter of perspective. As long as they don't > talk about "me", it is not hate speech. Whoever has the ear of the > major media of the day wins the battle for the definition of hate > speech for that generation, but the war will never end. -Karl E. > Peters > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech > From: Meryem Marzouki > Date: Fri, December 12, 2008 9:55 am > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Le 12 déc. 08 à 09:53, Milton L Mueller a écrit : > > > Interesting to me that the religious right in America is > > characterizing criticism of their religion as “hateful” and as > > “bigotry.” It provides an example of why many free speech advocates > > oppose so-called hate speech regulation, as it could easily be > > invoked to suppress all kinds of legitimate expression. > > > Or provides an example of why 'hate speech', without any precision > and especially without specific reference to discrimination, is > inadequate not only as a legal qualification but also as > characterization in the political/social discourse. In countries like > France where racist speech (and other kind of speech among those > generally described as 'hate speech') is an offense punished by law, > saying that "There are no gods, no devils, no angels, no heaven or > hell. There is only our natural world. Religion is but myth and > superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds." not only is not > an offense, but is quite common (and well appreciated in some not so > restricted circles:)) > > Actually, such a sentence should refer to 'blasphemy' or 'defamation > of religions' (which are not considered as offenses in many > countries, needless to say that "defamation of religion", as a legal > concept, is pure nonsense) rather than to 'hate speech'. There is no > hate directed to anyone expressed in the quoted sentence, so, in > which way could this be interpreted as 'hate speech'? > > Right back from Hyderabad, I participed on 8-9 December to a > conference organized in Paris by the EU Fundamental Rights Agency and > the French presidency. It was on "Freedom of expression, a > cornerstone of democracy - listening and communicating in a diverse > Europe" (http://fra.europa.eu/fra/index.php? > fuseaction=content.dsp_cat_content&catid=3e6c61340870c&contentid=492d3 > cd > b312db). > The former UN Special Rapporteur on contemporary forms of racism, > racial discrimination, xenophobia and related intolerance, Doudou > Diène, was present. According to him, it seems that, at the > international level, we're going to get rid of 'defamation of > religions' concept (and offense in some countries). > And, indeed, in his report of September 2008 on the "manifestations > of defamation of religions and in particular on the serious > implications of Islamophobia on the enjoyment of all rights" (http:// > daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/G08/153/97/PDF/G0815397.pdf), he > recommends that "the Human Rights Council encourage a shift away from > the sociological concept of the defamation of religions towards the > legal norm of non-incitement to national, racial or religious hatred, > on the basis of the legal provisions laid down in international human > rights instruments, in particular articles 18 to 20 of the > International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights and article 4 of > the International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of > Racial Prejudice." > The recommendations of the report from the UN High Commissionner for > Human Rights on "combating defamation of religions", presented at the > 9th session of the Human Rights Council are drawn along the same line > (http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/hrcouncil/docs/9session/A.HRC. > 9.7.doc). It's worth noting that this latter report is on the > implementation of human rights council resolution 7/19 entitled > “combating defamation of religions". > > Meryem > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Fri Dec 12 11:28:21 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 11:28:21 -0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs References: Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D11@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Ian, I agree 'Open and Universal Internet Access' as a broad theme can cover a range of topical areas. Including both Rights and Critical Internet Resources for example. Lee -----Original Message----- From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] Sent: Thu 12/11/2008 3:12 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Lee W McKnight Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs I like the concept of broadening access to include, for instance * equitable access to carriage for content providers (often discussed within the net neutrality debate) * access to content without interference (the censorship debate) * access to devices for applications (the open systems debate, the end to end debate) Add these to physical access and you have an interesting set of issues to look at. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ From: Lee W McKnight [mailto:lmcknigh at syr.edu] Sent: 12 December 2008 06:58 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter; governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs I like 'Open and Universal Internet Access'as theme. Yeah I know you're all tired of word access but maybe I mean something different. Theme can be interpreted as about Internet rights, development, markets, policy and/or technology. Lee -----Original Message----- From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] Sent: Thu 12/11/2008 2:22 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In addition to the rights theme, or perhaps in association with it, I would like to see a new theme of Public Policy and the Internet. Internet Governance bodies do not all handle public policy consistently or in some cases at all. I think there is a lot we can gain by examining this in more detail. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ From: Max Senges [mailto:maxsenges at gmail.com] Sent: 12 December 2008 03:02 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki; Parminder Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Hello I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1] coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main theme. We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our discussion on http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights best max [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for next weeks monthly meeting. On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki wrote: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being how. Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Meryem Marzouki wrote: Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : Ralf Bendrath wrote: As I said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but I would support this topic for a main session. I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could mean. I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into this approach. jeanette Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the table, although framed differently.____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -- ------------------------------------------------- "The world of the senses is just the base camp: we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of physical reality. [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as human beings" (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. 10) ------------------------------------------------- Dr. Max Senges www.maxsenges.com www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Fri Dec 12 11:41:51 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 09:41:51 -0700 Subject: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech Message-ID: <20081212094151.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.0a683881a6.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From wolfgang.benedek at uni-graz.at Fri Dec 12 11:42:36 2008 From: wolfgang.benedek at uni-graz.at (wolfgang.benedek at uni-graz.at) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 17:42:36 +0100 Subject: AW: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech In-Reply-To: <5887CB01-20E2-4B70-9CE9-D2604B0E8572@ras.eu.org> References: <20081212081920.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.f7fc1d807a.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <5887CB01-20E2-4B70-9CE9-D2604B0E8572@ras.eu.org> Message-ID: Dear all, I can well understand the cautioning of Milton re arbitrary definition of hate speech. There is always the danger of censorship by self-appointed watchdogs of the proper content. However, there is also the fact of the "poisoning of the web" by different kind of illegal content, which, like in any society, should not be tolerated. Art. 20 para.2 of the ICCPR on the prohibition of incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence through any advocacy of national, racial or religious hatred" is as relevant as is the International Convention on Racial Discrimination of 1965. Still there is a need for competent bodies to interpret such provisions as they do exist on all levels, like in particular the European Court on Human Rights for the European Convention on Human Rights or the Human Rights Committee for the ICCPR. Defamation is a different concept, more open to be abused for dominant interests, and therefore I welcome the news from Miriam that the development moves into the direction of the approach of Article 20:2 ICCPR. Still, I see a need to be vigilant against hate speech and other illegal content in order not to leave cyberspace to be misused for illegal purposes. Decentralized forms of whistle blowing (hotlines) could be possibility, but there needs to be due process how to deal with the information thus obtained, which seems to me a still not fully resolved challenge. Accordingly, I'm looking for best practice in this regard. Wolfgang Univ.-Prof. Dr. Wolfgang Benedek Institut für Völkerrecht und Internationale Beziehungen Institute for International Law and International Relations Karl-Franzens-Universität Graz Universitätsstraße 15, A4 A-8010 Graz Tel.: +43 316 380 3411 Fax.: +43 316 380 9455 -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- Von: Meryem Marzouki [mailto:marzouki at ras.eu.org] Gesendet: Freitag, 12. Dezember 2008 17:16 An: governance at lists.cpsr.org Betreff: Re: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech You might object, but the purpose of this list is not to discuss religious issues or bigotry. It is rather to discuss global Internet governance policies, among them those related to content regulation and the concepts they are based upon, which was exactly what we started to do until you jumped in, with your reference to abortion as 'the killing of babies for convenience', with your considerations on 'massive influx of illegal aliens', which, under some laws against xenophobia, might be considered as offensive, and, finally, mixing all this with 'islamic terrorism', an expression which generalization could by itself fall under the laws against discrimination. The fact that you felt useful or even needed to add that you have a "a devout Muslim for a close friend and business partner" doesn't change anything to this: it's just the usual disclaimer as in the "I'm not racist/antisemit, I've a [jewish/muslim/black/whatever usual victim of racism] friend" well known discourse. I wont further comment this. It's simply that this kind of discourse has no place on this list, as it is by far out of its scope, and I'm asking the coordinators of this caucus to take due note of this remark. Regarding your precise question, let me take it as if it was a genuine one, and simply answer that it perfectly illustrates what was my point: "'hate speech', without any precision and especially without specific reference to discrimination, is inadequate not only as a legal qualification but also as characterization in the political/social discourse." Hate, as intended in 'hate speech' and its regulation, is directed against a person or a group of person, just like defamation, BTW. Not against a concept, idea or belief. Le 12 déc. 08 à 16:19, Karl E. Peters a écrit : > I must object here...How is there "no hate" in that message > compared to other "hate speech" when it is said that religion > hardens hearts and enslaves minds. We could debate the veracity of > such a statement all day, but you can not say that such a statement > is not just as hateful as MUCH of what is called hate speech today > by others. It is all a matter of perspective. As long as they don't > talk about "me", it is not hate speech. Whoever has the ear of the > major media of the day wins the battle for the definition of hate > speech for that generation, but the war will never end. -Karl E. > Peters > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech > From: Meryem Marzouki > Date: Fri, December 12, 2008 9:55 am > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Le 12 déc. 08 à 09:53, Milton L Mueller a écrit : > > > Interesting to me that the religious right in America is > > characterizing criticism of their religion as "hateful" and as > > "bigotry." It provides an example of why many free speech advocates > > oppose so-called hate speech regulation, as it could easily be > > invoked to suppress all kinds of legitimate expression. > > > Or provides an example of why 'hate speech', without any precision > and especially without specific reference to discrimination, is > inadequate not only as a legal qualification but also as > characterization in the political/social discourse. In countries like > France where racist speech (and other kind of speech among those > generally described as 'hate speech') is an offense punished by law, > saying that "There are no gods, no devils, no angels, no heaven or > hell. There is only our natural world. Religion is but myth and > superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds." not only is not > an offense, but is quite common (and well appreciated in some not so > restricted circles:)) > > Actually, such a sentence should refer to 'blasphemy' or 'defamation > of religions' (which are not considered as offenses in many > countries, needless to say that "defamation of religion", as a legal > concept, is pure nonsense) rather than to 'hate speech'. There is no > hate directed to anyone expressed in the quoted sentence, so, in > which way could this be interpreted as 'hate speech'? > > Right back from Hyderabad, I participed on 8-9 December to a > conference organized in Paris by the EU Fundamental Rights Agency and > the French presidency. It was on "Freedom of expression, a > cornerstone of democracy - listening and communicating in a diverse > Europe" (http://fra.europa.eu/fra/index.php? > fuseaction=content.dsp_cat_content&catid=3e6c61340870c&contentid=492d3 > cd > b312db). > The former UN Special Rapporteur on contemporary forms of racism, > racial discrimination, xenophobia and related intolerance, Doudou > Diène, was present. According to him, it seems that, at the > international level, we're going to get rid of 'defamation of > religions' concept (and offense in some countries). > And, indeed, in his report of September 2008 on the "manifestations > of defamation of religions and in particular on the serious > implications of Islamophobia on the enjoyment of all rights" (http:// > daccessdds.un.org/doc/UNDOC/GEN/G08/153/97/PDF/G0815397.pdf), he > recommends that "the Human Rights Council encourage a shift away from > the sociological concept of the defamation of religions towards the > legal norm of non-incitement to national, racial or religious hatred, > on the basis of the legal provisions laid down in international human > rights instruments, in particular articles 18 to 20 of the > International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights and article 4 of > the International Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of > Racial Prejudice." > The recommendations of the report from the UN High Commissionner for > Human Rights on "combating defamation of religions", presented at the > 9th session of the Human Rights Council are drawn along the same line > (http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/hrcouncil/docs/9session/A.HRC. > 9.7.doc). It's worth noting that this latter report is on the > implementation of human rights council resolution 7/19 entitled > "combating defamation of religions". > > Meryem > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Fri Dec 12 11:44:50 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 16:44:50 +0000 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D11@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> References: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D11@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <49429502.9010800@wzb.eu> Hi, just to understand it better, is this a proposal to merge the old openness topic with the access topic and thereby create something new or more comprehensive? thanks, jeanette Lee W McKnight wrote: > Ian, > > I agree 'Open and Universal Internet Access' as a broad theme can cover > a range of topical areas. > > Including both Rights and Critical Internet Resources for example. > > Lee > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > Sent: Thu 12/11/2008 3:12 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Lee W McKnight > Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > I like the concept of broadening access to include, for instance > > > > * equitable access to carriage for content providers (often discussed within > the net neutrality debate) > > * access to content without interference (the censorship debate) > > * access to devices for applications (the open systems debate, the end to > end debate) > > > > Add these to physical access and you have an interesting set of issues to > look at. > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > _____ > > From: Lee W McKnight [mailto:lmcknigh at syr.edu] > Sent: 12 December 2008 06:58 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter; governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > > > I like 'Open and Universal Internet Access'as theme. > > Yeah I know you're all tired of word access but maybe I mean something > different. > > Theme can be interpreted as about Internet rights, development, markets, > policy and/or technology. > > Lee > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > Sent: Thu 12/11/2008 2:22 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > In addition to the rights theme, or perhaps in association with it, I would > like to see a new theme of Public Policy and the Internet. > > > > Internet Governance bodies do not all handle public policy consistently or > in some cases at all. I think there is a lot we can gain by examining this > in more detail. > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > _____ > > From: Max Senges [mailto:maxsenges at gmail.com] > Sent: 12 December 2008 03:02 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki; Parminder > Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > > > Hello > > I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years > themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1] > coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as > main theme. > > We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate > and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. > > If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet > Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our discussion on > http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights > > best > max > > > > > [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for > next weeks monthly meeting. > > On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki > wrote: > > Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day > now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. > The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being > how. > > Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : > > > > > > Meryem Marzouki wrote: > > Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : > > > Ralf Bendrath wrote: > > As I > said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights > up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating > and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. > > > Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in > IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the > 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but > I would support this topic for a main session. > > I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could > mean. > > > I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a > rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into > this approach. > jeanette > > Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework > > compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with > similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the > table, although framed > differently.____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > -- > ------------------------------------------------- > > "The world of the senses is just the base camp: > we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of > physical reality. > [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; > we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as > human beings" > (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. > 10) > > ------------------------------------------------- > Dr. Max Senges > > www.maxsenges.com > www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Fri Dec 12 11:57:14 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 11:57:14 -0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs References: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D11@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> <49429502.9010800@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D14@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> This is a proposal for 'the' main theme of IGF 2009; which could also double (if we don;t win that) as a more specific topical theme. In the latter case, we have Open and Universal Internet Access - combining open and access,possibly including Rights, etc. Rights could be addressed as a parallel core theme as well of course, I'm just throwing out some ideas. Critical Internet Resources is doing well as a separate theme but of course should be informed by principles or rights for open and universal internet access. Lee -----Original Message----- From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] Sent: Fri 12/12/2008 11:44 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Lee W McKnight Cc: Ian Peter Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Hi, just to understand it better, is this a proposal to merge the old openness topic with the access topic and thereby create something new or more comprehensive? thanks, jeanette Lee W McKnight wrote: > Ian, > > I agree 'Open and Universal Internet Access' as a broad theme can cover > a range of topical areas. > > Including both Rights and Critical Internet Resources for example. > > Lee > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > Sent: Thu 12/11/2008 3:12 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Lee W McKnight > Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > I like the concept of broadening access to include, for instance > > > > * equitable access to carriage for content providers (often discussed within > the net neutrality debate) > > * access to content without interference (the censorship debate) > > * access to devices for applications (the open systems debate, the end to > end debate) > > > > Add these to physical access and you have an interesting set of issues to > look at. > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > _____ > > From: Lee W McKnight [mailto:lmcknigh at syr.edu] > Sent: 12 December 2008 06:58 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter; governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > > > I like 'Open and Universal Internet Access'as theme. > > Yeah I know you're all tired of word access but maybe I mean something > different. > > Theme can be interpreted as about Internet rights, development, markets, > policy and/or technology. > > Lee > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > Sent: Thu 12/11/2008 2:22 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: RE: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > In addition to the rights theme, or perhaps in association with it, I would > like to see a new theme of Public Policy and the Internet. > > > > Internet Governance bodies do not all handle public policy consistently or > in some cases at all. I think there is a lot we can gain by examining this > in more detail. > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > _____ > > From: Max Senges [mailto:maxsenges at gmail.com] > Sent: 12 December 2008 03:02 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Meryem Marzouki; Parminder > Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > > > Hello > > I also want to thank Janette to start the discussion about next years > themes. Naturally the focus of the Internet Rights and Principles [1] > coalition is to promote a "Rights based approach to Internet Governance" as > main theme. > > We plan to have a mid-term meeting in Rome which we can use to coordinate > and prepare events with a Rights and Principles focus. > > If you are interested in pushing a "Rights based approach to Internet > Governance" as main IGF theme 2009 please join our discussion on > http://mailman.ipjustice.org/listinfo/bill-of-rights > > best > max > > > > > [1] we have the name change from Internet Bill of Rights on our agenda for > next weeks monthly meeting. > > On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:13 PM, Meryem Marzouki > wrote: > > Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've thought that, for 60 years and one day > now, there is no question on whether one buys or not into a right approach. > The only remaining question, in any new context - like, here, IG - being > how. > > Le 11 déc. 08 à 15:56, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : > > > > > > Meryem Marzouki wrote: > > Le 11 déc. 08 à 12:55, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : > > > Ralf Bendrath wrote: > > As I > said there, I am a bit sceptical if it's a good idea to put human rights > up for discussion, but this probably depends on the framing. "Translating > and implementing human rights for IG" would go in the right direction. > > > Yes, one could also frame it a bit broader such as 'the role of rights in > IG'. That would make certainly a good main session. I spoke against the > 'rights based approach to IG' as an overall theme at the caucus meeting but > I would support this topic for a main session. > > I don't see what "the role of rights in IG" (or in anything else) could > mean. > > > I meant to frame it in a way that integrates people who have concerns with a > rights based approach. "Towards" suggests that all participants buy into > this approach. > jeanette > > Let's frame it differently, e.g. "Towards an IG framework > > compliant with human rights and democratic principles" or something with > similar meaning. This, BTW, would allow to keep the issue of access on the > table, although framed > differently.____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > -- > ------------------------------------------------- > > "The world of the senses is just the base camp: > we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of > physical reality. > [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; > we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as > human beings" > (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. > 10) > > ------------------------------------------------- > Dr. Max Senges > > www.maxsenges.com > www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com > ------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch Fri Dec 12 12:39:56 2008 From: william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch (William Drake) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 18:39:56 +0100 Subject: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech In-Reply-To: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0C@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> References: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2B0C@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <6213B5FF-6E2F-4A60-93CE-EB54569C0B2A@graduateinstitute.ch> Milton, It's not just a domestic issue. There's a push now in the UN led by Saudi Arabia, Malaysia, and other Islamic countries for a UN instrument to ban the "defamation" of a religion, e.g. in cartoons, in line with the promotion of a "culture of peace." The concept has been endorsed by the head of the General Assembly... http://www.un.org/News/briefings/docs/2008/081111_dEscoto.doc.htm Bill On Dec 12, 2008, at 9:53 AM, Milton L Mueller wrote: > Interesting to me that the religious right in America is > characterizing criticism of their religion as “hateful” and as > “bigotry.” It provides an example of why many free speech advocates > oppose so-called hate speech regulation, as it could easily be > invoked to suppress all kinds of legitimate expression. > > > > From: Christian Coalition of America [mailto:noreply at cc.org] > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 2:49 PM > To: Milton L Mueller > Subject: Christian Coalition of America condemns Anti-Christian > bigotry... > > > > > > > > Press Release > Roberta Combs, President > > Thursday, December 11, 2008 > > > > Christian Coalition of America condemns Anti-Christian bigotry on > part of Governor Gregoire > > > > Washington D.C. –"There are no gods, no devils, no angels, no > heaven or hell. There is only our natural world. Religion is but > myth and superstition that hardens hearts and enslaves minds." > > > > This is what a poster in the Washington state capitol building says > as it is displayed right next to a Nativity scene depicting the > Christmas story and with a huge bust of George Washington between > them. > > > > The President of the Christian Coalition of America, Roberta Combs > said: "Governor Christine Gregoire has carried political > correctness to the extreme by allowing such hateful speech against > Christians and Christianity to be so prominently displayed in the > Washington state capitol building. Christian Coalition of America > urges her to immediately remove this abominable display." > > > > It seems each Christmas season, atheists attempt to reach new > heights in antagonizing Christians and Jewish people in the case of > the Hanukkah holiday. The very least that elected officials can do > is to ignore these hateful attempts to mock other people's religions. > > Psalm 33:12 “Blessed is the nation whose God is the Lord…” > > > > > > SUPPORT THE CHRISTIAN COALITION > Click here to make a secure online donation > > Please do not reply to this email > > Christian Coalition of America > P.O. Box 37030 > Washington, D.C. 20013 > Telephone: (202) 479-6900 > Fax: (202) 479-4262 > www.cc.org > > To stop receiving these emails, go to https://www.cc.org/ > unsubscribe.cfm. > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance *********************************************************** William J. Drake Senior Associate Centre for International Governance Graduate Institute of International and Development Studies Geneva, Switzerland william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch New book: Governing Global Electronic Networks, http://tinyurl.com/5mh9jj *********************************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch Fri Dec 12 13:04:34 2008 From: william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch (William Drake) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2008 19:04:34 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <1044772E438C45C4868F47B61B0845F3@PCbureau> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <1044772E438C45C4868F47B61B0845F3@PCbureau> Message-ID: <326BB0B6-F494-43C2-85CD-D1444F065CFA@graduateinstitute.ch> Hi, I share Jean-Louis' concern about the general lack of serious attention to development issues in the IGF, which is part of why I organized workshops on the notion of a development agenda at Rio and Hyderabad. That IGF has basically given lip service to "IG4D" is rather odd given that it a UN-based process launched as a compromise solution to WSIS deadlocks. It also is of significant concern to many developing country governments, and reinforces the not uncommon view that the ITU is a better and more useful forum for them. Development is the sort of cross-cutting, horizontal issue set that the IGF ought to have a comparative advantage in addressing, and despite its breadth it could be modularized and tackled in successive meetings. Hence, I'd like to see a main session in Egypt like, "Taking IG4D Seriously." I'd also like to see a main session on another cross-cutting, horizontal issue set, which like development was originally envisioned as central to the IGF, and was included in the Tunis mandate: "“Promote and assess, on an ongoing basis, the embodiment of WSIS principles in Internet Governance processes.” The APC-UNECE-COE initiative would be relevant here. Two cents, Bill On Dec 11, 2008, at 3:00 PM, jlfullsack wrote: > Dear Jeannette and all > > Of course, Internet critical resources should be on the agenda but, > what's more, access and service providing in DCs should stay very > hign on it. > > As far as I could read through all your messages from Hyderabad, > the Internet for Developing countries was once more completely lost > aside. > May I recall our CS Declarations both in Geneva and in Tunis, for a > "People centered Info Society" and for ICT's "unique role in socio- > economic development and in promoting the fulfilment of > intarnationnaly agreed development goals, including those contained > in the Muillenium Declaration". > There were also statements in these Declarations on the Public Good > nature of some critical Internet resources. > Can somebody from the CS present in Hyderabad let us know what > progress in these most critical issues have been achieved there ? > Thanks in advance. > > All the best > Jean-Louis Fullsack > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeanette Hofmann" > > To: > Sent: Thursday, December 11, 2008 11:36 AM > Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > >> >> Hi, >> >> we had quite a good discussion at the caucus meeting in Hyderabad >> about possible topics for the next IGF. Parminder proposed a >> 'rights based approach to IG' as an over-arching theme for the >> next IGF. >> >> I think should continue this discussion on this list since it >> would be good if we could come up with proposals for topics at the >> next public consultation in Geneva in February 2009. >> >> I am not sure though if we should focus on the over-arching theme >> for the next IGF. In case you don't remember, the overall theme >> for this year's IGF was "Internet for all". My impression is that >> these over-arching themes don't matter that much, not only because >> they tend to be shallow but more so because the underlying topics >> are too diverse to reflect in any meaningful way the overall topic. >> >> We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For >> those who didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: >> >> * Reaching the next billion; >> >> * Promoting cyber-security and trust; >> >> * Managing critical Internet resources; >> >> * Taking stock and the way forward; >> >> * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow >> >> I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching >> the next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss >> next year. Do others agree? What are other topics we want to see >> discussed? In my view, critical Internet resources should stay on >> the agenda. >> >> best, jeanette >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance *********************************************************** William J. Drake Senior Associate Centre for International Governance Graduate Institute of International and Development Studies Geneva, Switzerland william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch New book: Governing Global Electronic Networks, http://tinyurl.com/5mh9jj *********************************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Fri Dec 12 14:17:42 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 06:17:42 +1100 Subject: [governance] RE: sivasubramanian Muthusamy - brief biography In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Here is the third candidate statement from Sivasubramanian Muthusamy. Sivasubramanian Muthusamy immensely values the fundamental principles of the Internet. His interest in the growth and evolution of the Internet stems from an innate desire to contribute very significantly to the world at large on a macro level. It began in 1991 when he was one of the four delegates from India to the International Model United Nations organized by the Junior Chambers International and held at the UN General Assembly Hall in New York where he introduced a spiritedly debated draft resolution to strengthen the United Nations. One of his early papers on the Internet Architecture issues sent as a mail to W3C proposed "Costume Party Model" for "Reconciling Society's Concerns for Privacy with the imperative of Authentication" - an idea that he now considers imperfect. His interest in "universal prosperity" remained latent as his career path occupied him in business as an entrepreneur, but he became involved in the Internet after he became a member of the Internet Society. He started the ISOC India Chennai chapter which was chartered in June 2007, the chapter became an at-Large structure as well. He has taken part in the OECD Ministerial Meeting on the Future of Internet Economy at Seoul, Korea, and took part at the APNIC 24 and SANOG events in New Delhi and more recently at the Internet Governance Forum at Hyderabad. As a person who believes in a well balanced system of Governance in its minimal form , he became involved in the Internet Governance Caucus to contribute to the Civil Society's role in the evolution and governance of the Internet. As a member of the Civil Society he believes that in essence the Civil Society is in agreement within on most issues, and that differences tend to arise largely in expression and interpretation. He also believes that this unity of purpose is true in the larger arena where all stakeholders, with the exception of a few interests, are in agreement that the Internet is valuable, that it needs to evolve further as a free and open medium. He believes that there would be greater agreement among stakeholders with greater receptiveness to the concerns of one another. He believes that there can be a solution acceptable to all stakeholders who have conflicting interests. He is working on concepts that would further the Internet Model as the world moves towards the next billions of Internet Users and a richer Internet. His focus is on contributing to the policy sphere, and with this purpose he is learning more and more about the Internet issues so as to constantly correct himself and to gain a clear and fair perspective on all issues. He has taken part in a Diplo Foundation's Internet Governance Capacity Building program and wishes to advance further on this learning path with a view to gain an in-depth of knowledge on Internet issues and to take part in the Internet Governance process with the right understanding. . He has taken part in the Rotary Group Study Exchange program to Argentina and Paraguay in 1994 and earlier in a short term exchange program to Germany. He has traveled widely in India and have traveled to Argentina, Brazil, Trinidad & Tobago, South Africa, Zimbabwe, Kenya and Tanzania, visited the United States, Canada, Germany, United Kingdom, Nederland, France, Switzerland, Italy, Nepal, Singapore, Bangkok, Sri Lanka, Taiwan and Korea. He took the initiative to form the India Chennai chapter of the Internet Society. He serves as the President of ISOC India Chennai which is recently approved as an at-Large structure. He also serves as the at-Large Advisory Committee's (ALAC) IDN liaison. Within ISOC , apart from his attention to local programs and events, he takes part in one or two of ISOC's global task groups. He is associated with One Web Day and has volunteered to handle the Stories task. He is a graduate in Business (MBA) from India with 19 years of cross functional business experience, now giving shape to Turiya, a Start Up with some limitations in its pre-funding stage, to make Desktop, Mobile PCs and Mobile Internet Devices around an UNIX operating system. He is a Strategic planner with vivid conceptual traits, comfortable with technology, especially on a macro scale. He is an effective communicator & team leader combined with the ability to interact effectively with people of diverse nationalities worldwide. Some of his blogs are http://isocmadras.blogspot.com and wealthy world He has published articles at a Citizen Journalism portal on the Internet Model which experienced a censorship issue and other articles that were well read. He has also published a comment CircleID on the ITU Secretary General's speech at the ICANN, Cairo His contact phone numbers are +91 99524 03099 and +91 424 4030334. He lives in India and can be reached at isolatedn at gmail.com and at isocindiachennai at gmail.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Sat Dec 13 07:12:04 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 17:42:04 +0530 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20081213121219.9B67067889@smtp1.electricembers.net> Hi All Thanks Jeanette for starting a discussion on the next year's themes. The caucus has never been so pro-active before :- ) . To give a background to those who may not have kept track, some civil society actors including the IGC had started to propose 'rights based approach to IG' as 2009 IGF's main themes a couple of months back. These actors also made 'official' contributions to the IGF process on this issue. IGC's contributions to the September consultations and to the IGF 2008 synthesis paper ( see http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/sec_papers_08/IGF.SynthesisPaper.Final.30.10. 2008.pdf ) speaks of this issue. Some other contributions to the synthesis paper also raise this issue. Consequently, a 'rights based approach to IG' figures prominently in the IGF 2008's synthesis paper, which is supposed to be the official conference paper. Unfortunately, neither do the organizers give much prominence to the paper, nor, it appears, most participants take real note of it. However, it remains a fact that this paper is an important part of official proceedings of the IGF. Many civil society actors spoke about a 'rights based approach to IG' during the 2008 IGF, a few of them specifically calling it to be made as the theme for IGF 2009. One of the two opening session statement by civil society participant mentions this issue, as does the sole civil society statement at the closing session. The dynamic coalition on gender read out a statement asking for the main theme of the next IGF to be 'a rights based approach to IG'. This issue was also raised by many interventions in the main sessions and at a couple of dynamic coalition meetings and other workshops. As you would have noticed from an email sent out before the IGC @ IGF meeting, and as pointed out by Jeanette and Ralf, the IGC members meeting at the IGF also discussed this issue and there was wide support for this to be the central theme for the IGF 2009. In this context, I will like to draw the members attention to Council of Europe's submission to the IGF Hyderabad - 'Internet - a critical resource for all' ( see http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/index.php/contributions and also enclosed ) which I quote: "The Council of Europe provides state and non-state actors with co-operation platforms, legal standards and public policy and practical tools which fit well the current transition towards a more definite rights and people-centred Internet governance approach." So, we have other actors speaking about a 'rights centered approach to IG'. As Natasha says, supported by Valeria, we must now take a strategic approach to pushing for this theme to be adopted for IGF 2009. A strategic approach, in my view, will perhaps require both a tactical campaign like approach mixed with tactical caution on some aspects, with a view of maximizing the chance of getting the proposed as the main theme for IGF 2009 . Most importantly, it will require building connections with some key actors who could be brought over to support this proposal. As per the above CoE document some European governments may do so. But we will need to broaden support to include some key Southern actors as well. Parminder -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Internet a critical resource for all - IGF 2008 - CoE.doc Type: application/msword Size: 147456 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Sat Dec 13 08:56:34 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 06:56:34 -0700 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Message-ID: <20081213065634.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.c5aefb65be.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Sat Dec 13 09:23:56 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 19:53:56 +0530 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <20081213121219.9B67067889@smtp1.electricembers.net> References: <20081213121219.9B67067889@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: Hello Parminder and All, Yes, the IGC has done consideable work on preparing the proposal on the Rights based approach as the theme for the next IGF, it has become a part of the Synthesis paper and there are other coalitions endorsing this as the theme for the next IGF, but could we still go ahead and explore various themes? In the process participants of this caucus would find an opportunity to offer further comments on this proposed theme as also propose alternate themes. So much work has been done on the Rights theme but should we stop because we have all spent a lot of time on this theme? I feel that we can continue discussing and propose alternate themes in addition to what has already been proposed, and out of the various themes that the Caucus proposes we can choose one theme to focus on to push for. Sivasubramanian Muthusamy India. On 12/13/08, Parminder wrote: > > > > Hi All > > Thanks Jeanette for starting a discussion on the next year's themes. The > caucus has never been so pro-active before :- ) . > > To give a background to those who may not have kept track, some civil > society actors including the IGC had started to propose 'rights based > approach to IG' as 2009 IGF's main themes a couple of months back. These > actors also made 'official' contributions to the IGF process on this issue. > IGC's contributions to the September consultations and to the IGF 2008 > synthesis paper ( see > http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/sec_papers_08/IGF.SynthesisPaper.Final.30.10.2008.pdf) speaks of this issue. Some other contributions to the synthesis paper > also raise this issue. Consequently, a 'rights based approach to IG' figures > prominently in the IGF 2008's synthesis paper, which is supposed to be the > official conference paper. Unfortunately, neither do the organizers give > much prominence to the paper, nor, it appears, most participants take real > note of it. However, it remains a fact that this paper is an important part > of official proceedings of the IGF. > > Many civil society actors spoke about a 'rights based approach to IG' > during the 2008 IGF, a few of them specifically calling it to be made as the > theme for IGF 2009. One of the two opening session statement by civil > society participant mentions this issue, as does the sole civil society > statement at the closing session. > > > > The dynamic coalition on gender read out a statement asking for the main > theme of the next IGF to be 'a rights based approach to IG'. This issue was > also raised by many interventions in the main sessions and at a couple of > dynamic coalition meetings and other workshops. As you would have noticed > from an email sent out before the IGC @ IGF meeting, and as pointed out by > Jeanette and Ralf, the IGC members meeting at the IGF also discussed this > issue and there was wide support for this to be the central theme for the > IGF 2009. > > > > In this context, I will like to draw the members attention to Council of > Europe's submission to the IGF Hyderabad – 'Internet - a critical resource > for all' ( see http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/index.php/contributions and > also enclosed ) which I quote: > > > > "The Council of Europe provides state and non-state actors with > co-operation platforms, legal standards and public policy and practical > tools which fit well the current transition towards a more definite rights > and people-centred Internet governance approach." > > > > So, we have other actors speaking about a 'rights centered approach to IG'. > > > > > As Natasha says, supported by Valeria, we must now take a strategic > approach to pushing for this theme to be adopted for IGF 2009. A strategic > approach, in my view, will perhaps require both a tactical campaign like > approach mixed with tactical caution on some aspects, with a view of > maximizing the chance of getting the proposed as the main theme for IGF 2009 > . Most importantly, it will require building connections with some key > actors who could be brought over to support this proposal. As per the above > CoE document some European governments may do so. But we will need to > broaden support to include some key Southern actors as well. > > > > Parminder > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From sylvia.caras at gmail.com Sat Dec 13 13:14:23 2008 From: sylvia.caras at gmail.com (Sylvia Caras) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 10:14:23 -0800 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <20081213121219.9B67067889@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: I like to see rights coupled with responsibilities. Is there a way to include themes about end-user, ISP, State Parties responsibilities as well as rights? Yes, these issues come up under other themes - openness, access, security, ... - - still I'm more supportive when I see what I get and what I give on the same page. Sylvia Sylvia Caras People Who Because of the date and site change, I didn't come to this year's meeting, and the travel options for me from Santa Cruz to Sharm are difficult, and I'm still researching an easy way to get to Vilnius. It's a big help to have the dates and locations in advance. Thanks for the reporting everyone has done. S. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Sat Dec 13 19:23:17 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 11:23:17 +1100 Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun Message-ID: Please note that the Co-coordinator ballot papers went out a short time ago - please note that these will carry a FROM address of Dr Derrick L Cogburn, so you may need to adjust your filter settings to be sure you have received the ballot. The election closes 2400GMT on Sunday, December 21 2008. Results will be announced shortly thereafter. The email gives you all details. You also have an option to vote "none of the above". Even if you do not have a preferred candidate, please if you are an IGC member fill in the ballot paper so that we can update our list of members. If you do not receive a ballot paper within 24 hours and believe you are entitled to vote, please let me know. Good luck and many thanks to the three candidates who have offered their services! Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Sat Dec 13 21:07:21 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 19:07:21 -0700 Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun Message-ID: <20081213190721.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.e276f91b04.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From shailam at yahoo.com Sat Dec 13 21:28:42 2008 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Sat, 13 Dec 2008 18:28:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun References: Message-ID: <433815.80203.qm@web54302.mail.re2.yahoo.com> HI Ian  I dont think I receievd the Ballot. Can you resend please  Still in Chennai !! Shaila   be as a well......sure and limitless.... but as time befits.....assume other forms ....     ________________________________ From: Ian Peter To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Sent: Sunday, December 14, 2008 5:53:17 AM Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun Please note that the Co-coordinator ballot papers went out a short time ago – please note that these will carry a FROM address of Dr Derrick L Cogburn, so you may need to adjust your filter settings to be sure you have received the ballot.   The election closes 2400GMT on Sunday, December 21 2008. Results will be announced shortly thereafter.   The email gives you all details. You also have an option to vote “none of the above”. Even if you do not have a preferred candidate, please if you are an IGC member fill in the ballot paper so that we can update our list of members.   If you do not receive a ballot paper within 24 hours and believe you are entitled to vote, please let me know.   Good luck and many thanks to the three candidates who have offered their services!       Ian Peter PO Box  429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Sat Dec 13 22:35:13 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:35:13 +1100 Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun In-Reply-To: <20081213190721.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.e276f91b04.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <8B458E7EB3844C7DB8005309C6BCDE40@IAN> Karl, the ballot papers from Derrick Cogburn only went to people who have been on the list for two months, so I would be very surprised if you received one. (your name wasn't on the list supplied to him). But we do look forward to your further participation in the future! Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ From: Karl E. Peters [mailto:kpeters at tldainc.org] Sent: 14 December 2008 13:07 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Subject: RE: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun Greetings, While I do appreciate the opportunity of participation in this forum, being such a new member, I did not think it appropriate for me to vote in your poll just yet, as many groups would require a bit of time between joining and voting participation. Please count me as an interested member and understand that I will avidly vote when I am more familiar with the meaning of such votes to the organization. Thank you for including me, none-the-less! -Karl E. Peters -------- Original Message -------- Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun From: "Ian Peter" Date: Sat, December 13, 2008 7:23 pm To: Please note that the Co-coordinator ballot papers went out a short time ago - please note that these will carry a FROM address of Dr Derrick L Cogburn, so you may need to adjust your filter settings to be sure you have received the ballot. The election closes 2400GMT on Sunday, December 21 2008. Results will be announced shortly thereafter. The email gives you all details. You also have an option to vote "none of the above". Even if you do not have a preferred candidate, please if you are an IGC member fill in the ballot paper so that we can update our list of members. If you do not receive a ballot paper within 24 hours and believe you are entitled to vote, please let me know. Good luck and many thanks to the three candidates who have offered their services! Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From marzouki at ras.eu.org Sun Dec 14 06:34:01 2008 From: marzouki at ras.eu.org (Meryem Marzouki) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 12:34:01 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <20081213121219.9B67067889@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <8ECE38C2-0501-4B18-BA7E-EBD2F7C5E83F@ras.eu.org> Dear Sylvia and all, Responsibilities are, and have always been, consubstantial to rights. Your rights are my responsibilities, and my rights are your responsibilities. This is because one's rights are necessarily limited by others' rights. By simply enouncing rights, as they are in the UDHR, and, more than two centuries ago, in the 1789 Declaration after the French revolution (as well as in any and all Declaration of rights), responsibilities are encompassed. The suggested 'rights based approach' implies a holistic vision of all rights, and this ensures to consider and find a fair balance between rights of the individual and their limits, which derive from the social contract linking the community. Themes about end-user, ISP, State Parties responsibilities, that you are calling for, cannot be included _in addition to_ rights: they are necessarily the consequences of a right based approach, as they will be translated in the practical context of Internet governance. Best, Meryem Le 13 déc. 08 à 19:14, Sylvia Caras a écrit : > I like to see rights coupled with responsibilities. Is there a way to > include themes about end-user, ISP, State Parties responsibilities as > well as rights? Yes, these issues come up under other themes - > openness, access, security, ... - - still I'm more supportive when I > see what I get and what I give on the same page. > > Sylvia > > Sylvia Caras > People Who > > Because of the date and site change, I didn't come to this year's > meeting, and the travel options for me from Santa Cruz to Sharm are > difficult, and I'm still researching an easy way to get to Vilnius. > It's a big help to have the dates and locations in advance. Thanks > for the reporting everyone has done. > > S. > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Sun Dec 14 07:26:39 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (JFC Morfin) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 13:26:39 +0100 Subject: AW: [governance] Watch out for that hate speech In-Reply-To: References: <20081212081920.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.f7fc1d807a.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <5887CB01-20E2-4B70-9CE9-D2604B0E8572@ras.eu.org> Message-ID: <20081214122803.6CE2FA6C19@smtp2.electricembers.net> Dear Wolfgang, there are two distinct problemes we have to be aware of. There is a free speech issue which is general to every semiotic exchange. There is an open network standard issue which is much more preoccupying because it engages our future and the practical survival of our liberties because ity will be cast in standard, practices; software, machines, technical cultures, education. We have to remind ourselves what modern communications are: assisted relations tools. Typing is mechanic assisted, telephone is energy assisted, Internet is logical network assisted, the next layer to come (Intersem, Multilingual and Semantic Internet of thoughts) is semantic networked facilitation assisted. Today we still do not much feel that new relational revolution because this is mostly part of the JTC1/SG32/WG2 work on metadata registries (ISO 11179) etc. and also work on brain. Actually it is a complete new paradigm in the way Khun means it: a different manner of thinking by scientists, engineers, and therefore users, politicians, lawyers, and already kids. There is since the early 80s a great top level research freeze we see in the Internet (the deployment of the global 1983 system), in fundamental science (the Strings "failure"), litterature, etc. This results from the change identified by Von Bertalanffy in the mid-XX: instead of thinking analytically, we more and more need to think systemically. Something we observe through the example of the International Data Network since the mide 70s, changing from a dialog localized society to a polylog global diversity. This can lead to the vision of three great paradigms we are now familiar with: - Greeks - qualitative thinking - logic thruth is what we see and what is necessary - Copernic, Keppler, Newton, Dirac, Eistein - quantitative thinking - mathematics - truth is what we deduce and verify - now - significative thinking - semantics - truth is undelilmited coherence. The major image change is that Greeks considered the earth as the center of the world, Keppler the sun, and we each and every of us, every being (geocentric, heliocentric, ontocentric). This is what the WSIS has documented. The Information Society is not defined as such (what is information is still nebulous for many), but it has been established that it is to be "people centric, à caractère humain, centrada en la persona". This deeply differes from the gread current thinking like ISOC "user centric", ICANN "money centric", IETF "network centric", or even of the scientific fashionable "anthropy" (the universe we live in is the one which permits Man to exist). The way the Internet is designed and governed today is harmfull. Not necessarily for a few stakeholders, but as a whole for the Mankind and for the Environment. Same as for other pollutions. Except that the pollution here is semantic and scientific (norms and standards). Up to now we were protected and constrained by fences and walls, then by rules and laws. Today we are protected and constrained by the complexity of what we develop to match the complexity of our virtualized world. Caring about the way China respects the HR is a point (and I care more myself about the way the US industry tries to unstabilize my personal HR [through GNI] in France). But the more important issue is how the IETF, due to those who sponsors it and its R&D, is unprotecting these HR in the coming world. IAB raised the issue in RFC 3869, in clear and bold terms. I am afraid no one really paid attention, with Unicode and GNI consortia as results (i.e. no ML-DNS and Google, MCN, Yahoo! signing sales protection agreements in China). Trying to use more or less ethically the existing technology is one thing. I think that developping an ethical technology is a more efficient other thing. Please read RFC 3935 which defines the IETF mission. It expressly says that IETF does not develop the technology that could be, but the one which corresponds to its core values. Has anyone but me in the civil society considered what are the IETF core values? and if they match or not the HR core values? I challenged the IETF on that grounds: the IESG officially published (response to an appeal) that the IETF has nothing to do with HRs. I think we may have a solution to make IETF change their way in the future. It called for work and time. We will see in the coming weeks. Just to remind that an open Internet technology is an absolute prerequiste to a free usage of the Internet. jfc At 17:42 12/12/2008, wolfgang.benedek at uni-graz.at wrote: >Dear all, >I can well understand the cautioning of Milton re arbitrary >definition of hate speech. There is always the danger of censorship >by self-appointed watchdogs of the proper content. > >However, there is also the fact of the "poisoning of the web" by >different kind of illegal content, which, like in any society, >should not be tolerated. Art. 20 para.2 of the ICCPR on the >prohibition of incitement to discrimination, hostility or violence >through any advocacy of national, racial or religious hatred" is as >relevant as is the International Convention on Racial Discrimination >of 1965. Still there is a need for competent bodies to interpret >such provisions as they do exist on all levels, like in particular >the European Court on Human Rights for the European Convention on >Human Rights or the Human Rights Committee for the ICCPR. Defamation >is a different concept, more open to be abused for dominant >interests, and therefore I welcome the news from Miriam that the >development moves into the direction of the approach of Article 20:2 ICCPR. > >Still, I see a need to be vigilant against hate speech and other >illegal content in order not to leave cyberspace to be misused for >illegal purposes. Decentralized forms of whistle blowing (hotlines) >could be possibility, but there needs to be due process how to deal >with the information thus obtained, which seems to me a still not >fully resolved challenge. Accordingly, I'm looking for best practice >in this regard. > >Wolfgang > >Univ.-Prof. Dr. Wolfgang Benedek >Institut für Völkerrecht und Internationale Beziehungen >Institute for International Law and International Relations >Karl-Franzens-Universität Graz >Universitätsstraße 15, A4 >A-8010 Graz >Tel.: +43 316 380 3411 >Fax.: +43 316 380 9455 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Sun Dec 14 13:23:57 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 05:23:57 +1100 Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <896047129BAA4B498B78E9FA5A22F668@IAN> A few people who voted very early may have experienced an issue where they got a page telling them they had already "completed the survey", but inviting you to resubmit. This problem is now fixed, but I can confirm that if you did resubmit, your vote was counted - and if you chose not to, if you go back now the problem is no longer there. Also - information submitted by candidates can be found at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/23. Please look for the ballot paper sent by Dr Derrick L Cogburn and remember to vote. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com _____ From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] Sent: 14 December 2008 11:23 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun Please note that the Co-coordinator ballot papers went out a short time ago - please note that these will carry a FROM address of Dr Derrick L Cogburn, so you may need to adjust your filter settings to be sure you have received the ballot. The election closes 2400GMT on Sunday, December 21 2008. Results will be announced shortly thereafter. The email gives you all details. You also have an option to vote "none of the above". Even if you do not have a preferred candidate, please if you are an IGC member fill in the ballot paper so that we can update our list of members. If you do not receive a ballot paper within 24 hours and believe you are entitled to vote, please let me know. Good luck and many thanks to the three candidates who have offered their services! Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ca at rits.org.br Sun Dec 14 17:55:56 2008 From: ca at rits.org.br (Carlos Afonso) Date: Sun, 14 Dec 2008 20:55:56 -0200 Subject: [governance] Co-coordinator ballot has begun In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49458EFC.8020008@rits.org.br> Thanks, mate. Received OK. [] fraterno --c.a. Ian Peter wrote: > Please note that the Co-coordinator ballot papers went out a short time ago > - please note that these will carry a FROM address of Dr Derrick L Cogburn, > so you may need to adjust your filter settings to be sure you have received > the ballot. > > > > The election closes 2400GMT on Sunday, December 21 2008. Results will be > announced shortly thereafter. > > > > The email gives you all details. You also have an option to vote "none of > the above". Even if you do not have a preferred candidate, please if you are > an IGC member fill in the ballot paper so that we can update our list of > members. > > > > If you do not receive a ballot paper within 24 hours and believe you are > entitled to vote, please let me know. > > > > Good luck and many thanks to the three candidates who have offered their > services! > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Mon Dec 15 06:25:38 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 11:25:38 +0000 Subject: [governance] new date for next IGF Message-ID: <49463EB2.8050207@wzb.eu> Hello everyone, due to time conflicts with an earlier scheduled IETF meeting, the next IGF meeting has been postponed by one day. The new dates are are 15-18 November 2009. Keep in mind though that several events such as GIGANET or the IGC caucus meeting might take place on the day before the formal opening of the IGF. jeanette ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From b.schombe at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 06:34:17 2008 From: b.schombe at gmail.com (BAUDOUIN SCHOMBE) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 12:34:17 +0100 Subject: [governance] new date for next IGF In-Reply-To: <49463EB2.8050207@wzb.eu> References: <49463EB2.8050207@wzb.eu> Message-ID: thank you for this information Jeanette Baudouin 2008/12/15 Jeanette Hofmann > Hello everyone, > > due to time conflicts with an earlier scheduled IETF meeting, the next IGF > meeting has been postponed by one day. The new dates are are 15-18 November > 2009. > Keep in mind though that several events such as GIGANET or the IGC caucus > meeting might take place on the day before the formal opening of the IGF. > > jeanette > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN COORDONNATEUR NATIONAL REPRONTIC COORDONNATEUR SOUS REGIONAL ACSIS/AFRIQUE CENTRALE MEMBRE FACILITATEUR GAID AFRIQUE téléphone fixe: +243 1510 34 91 Téléphone mobile:+243998983491/+243999334571 email:b.schombe at gmail.com http://akimambo.unblog.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ca at rits.org.br Mon Dec 15 06:33:48 2008 From: ca at rits.org.br (Carlos Afonso) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 09:33:48 -0200 Subject: [governance] new date for next IGF In-Reply-To: <49463EB2.8050207@wzb.eu> References: <49463EB2.8050207@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <4946409C.70301@rits.org.br> Good news, Jeanette. --c.a. Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > Hello everyone, > > due to time conflicts with an earlier scheduled IETF meeting, the next > IGF meeting has been postponed by one day. The new dates are are 15-18 > November 2009. > Keep in mind though that several events such as GIGANET or the IGC > caucus meeting might take place on the day before the formal opening of > the IGF. > > jeanette > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Mon Dec 15 07:40:13 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 18:10:13 +0530 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head In-Reply-To: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <20081215124022.C4ACE67905@smtp1.electricembers.net> > And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided "internet for all." (Milton) There is no necessary connection between publicly provided net and a censored net. The analogy often applied earlier comparing a 'right to the Internet' with the right to education is useful here. Public education has mostly meant some kind of a public curriculum. States and communities have dealt with the issue of inappropriate kinds of control over 'public curriculum' in a nuanced and dynamic manner. No one has ever proposed scrapping public education provisions to deal with the problems associated with state's role in determining/ influencing curriculum. The comparison with right to education and state's role in curriculum/content development however ends here. There perhaps was (is) a structural and also a social requirement for state's involvement in curriculum decisions in terms of public education. Internet however is entirely different. Any amount of different content, of any number of different types, *can* be accommodated *equally* on the Internet. However, public support is still required to provide 'equalizing' conditions for production of all, and different, kinds of content. (Canada recently has announced some such provisions to ensure there is sufficient "Canadian" content on the Internet, as the government used to do to ensure enough Canadian content on TV and Film media.) IT for Change just now concluded an international workshop on 'ICTs for participatory local development' where the combination of - as well as nuances and dynamics of - 'public provisioning' along with 'local community decision making' was emphasized to deal with equity and social justice aspects of the emerging information society. The two are not exclusive, in fact they need to complement one another, and public provisioning has to be done in a manner that strengthens rather than weakens 'local community decision making'. The same extends to the issue of expanding individual's freedoms through public action, something which underpins Sen's capability rights approach and UNDP's Human Development approach to development policy based on Sen's work. As for some members skepticism about public provisioning on the Internet; who proposes what solution depends of where one is placed. Societies where markets are in a good position to deal with the dynamics of an emerging information (or Internet-based) society would have a different take on this issue than societies where these dynamics are furthering inequalities, both within the societies and vis a vis the Northern societies. To the extent that we are speaking in terms that are sought to be applied across the world, we need to be sensitive to social and political realities of the whole world. Parminder _____ From: Milton L Mueller [mailto:mueller at syr.edu] Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 3:25 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Lee W McKnight Subject: RE: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided "internet for all." Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the wireless industry and some consumer groups. The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is part of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that would have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could be slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. -- Gurumurthy Kasinathan IT for Change www.ITforChange.net Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de Mon Dec 15 08:07:38 2008 From: bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de (Ralf Bendrath) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 14:07:38 +0100 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head In-Reply-To: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <4946569A.8050106@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Milton L Mueller schrieb: > And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely > what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided “internet > for all.” >> Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is >> pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free >> wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the >> wireless industry and some consumer groups. The plan seems to be dead, at least for the moment: DECEMBER 12, 2008, 11:48 P.M. ET FCC Head Cancels Vote on Free Internet Plan By FAWN JOHNSON WASHINGTON -- Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin on Friday evening canceled next week's meeting at which the commission was scheduled to vote on a free Internet plan, after receiving a letter from key U.S. lawmakers asking him to hold off. Sen. John Rockefeller, (D-W.Va.), and Rep. Henry Waxman, (D-Calif.), who will chair the Senate and House committees overseeing the FCC next year, earlier Friday sent a letter to Mr. Martin asking him to cease actions on controversial policy proposals. (...) "We received the letter from Senator Rockefeller and Congressman Waxman today and spoke with other offices," said FCC Spokesman Robert Kenny. "In light of the letter, it does not appear that there is consensus to move forward and the agenda meeting has been canceled." ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 08:47:05 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 19:17:05 +0530 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head In-Reply-To: <4946569A.8050106@zedat.fu-berlin.de> References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> <4946569A.8050106@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Message-ID: Hello All, The new US Administration is likely to have the an FCC that might think at least a bit differently about censorship, tiered Internet and on other related central issues of concerns to the Internet users. The Obama FCC transition team is led by Susan Crawford of One Web Day and Kevin Warbach of the Supernova group and there is nothing to indicate that these two leaders would bring in a new team that is insensitive to users. http://www.circleid.com/posts/susan_crawford_kevin_werbach_obama_fcc_review_team_leads/ We don't have to be very concerned about the plan proposed by the outgoing FCC chief especially after reading the news item by Rauf Bendrath. These are changing times and lets wait and watch... Sivasubramanian Muthusamy India. On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 6:37 PM, Ralf Bendrath wrote: > Milton L Mueller schrieb: > > And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely > > what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided "internet > > for all." > > >> Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is > >> pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free > >> wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the > >> wireless industry and some consumer groups. > > The plan seems to be dead, at least for the moment: > > > > DECEMBER 12, 2008, 11:48 P.M. ET > > FCC Head Cancels Vote on Free Internet Plan > > By FAWN JOHNSON > > WASHINGTON -- Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin on > Friday evening canceled next week's meeting at which the commission was > scheduled to vote on a free Internet plan, after receiving a letter from > key U.S. lawmakers asking him to hold off. > > Sen. John Rockefeller, (D-W.Va.), and Rep. Henry Waxman, (D-Calif.), who > will chair the Senate and House committees overseeing the FCC next year, > earlier Friday sent a letter to Mr. Martin asking him to cease actions on > controversial policy proposals. > > (...) > > "We received the letter from Senator Rockefeller and Congressman Waxman > today and spoke with other offices," said FCC Spokesman Robert Kenny. "In > light of the letter, it does not appear that there is consensus to move > forward and the agenda meeting has been canceled." > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From pimienta at funredes.org Mon Dec 15 08:44:27 2008 From: pimienta at funredes.org (Daniel Pimienta) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 09:44:27 -0400 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Message-ID: <200812151348.mBFDm5PU009031@funredes.org> Saludos todas y todos, First of all, sorry I had to cancel last minute my participation in Hyderabad's IGF Diversity session for a health situation which is over now. This is my first contribution to the list which I joined last March, but it was not easy to catch up with the permanent and intense flow :-). I did read carefully all the contributions in the "themes for the coming IGFs" thread and I would like to share with you my concern for a theme which is too often underlooked and was not mentionned in spite of the numerous contributions. I am refering to "digital and information literacy" ... which directly refers to "info-ethics" and indirectly to "diversity". What use of the Internet would make the next billion connected users if they are not Internauts (in the ethymological sense of the term, a person who is in capacity to make a meaninfgul use of the Net)? How to improve the level of ethics of netusers (which we all witness is in the drop with important consequences for the Internaut communities) without appropriate education? If we want people to get ownership and empowered by the Internet, shall not we make provision and organize digital literacy for them? We were told by Aymarta Sen that Human Development, which is what I suppose we aim at by connecting people, requires capacities. It is not enough to connect hardware and software, we need to "connect the brains" for people being in real capacity to transform information into knowledge and contribute to the public domain of knowledge. I don't mean to be long, so I will refer to a paper which tries to demonstrate the link between digital divide and digital literacy and where my arguments for considering digital literacy a still deeper challenge than access are organized (by the way the argument that literacy is included in access is barely acceptable to me as it feeds the dangerous confusion beetween real literacy, a complex and long task, and simple training in Windows plus Office Suite a perverse approach as it does not open the way!). "Digital Divide, Socisal Divide, Paradigmatic Divide": http://funredes.org/mistica/english/cyberlibrary/thematic/Paradigmatic_Divide.pdf As far as I know there is a group of profesionals who generally shares with Funredes this vision that digital and information literacy is a top priority issue for the Information Societies to emerge: the librarians. I am not myself a librarian and I wonder if this group is well enough represented in IGF: I am convinced that librarians are the oldest skilled information profesionals in history and shall take a more active stand in IGF (I also think that times where librarians were slow to understand the impact of the Net are over now). FUNREDES will come back within few weeks with a worldwide campaign linking digital literacy, info-ethics ... and Global Warming (!) and will share it in this forum. Cordialmente, Daniel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ldmisekfalkoff at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 09:00:30 2008 From: ldmisekfalkoff at gmail.com (linda misek-falkoff) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 09:00:30 -0500 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head In-Reply-To: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <45ed74050812150600k239f5c06i6912fb4bbe8425ed@mail.gmail.com> Greetings and more information insight and interpretation please? "Free" sounds good, increasing access (4 all or at least many).. Then, speculating down-stream, Query: are there prospects or possibilities that a limiting or limited content access will become familiar and customary (payment free too, which is really good marketing and in many many ways a great idea overall) so that people become accustomed to restricted content .. then is it possible later it won't be free anymore but all that is available? Any *free speech* implications - pprominent or implied? Any discernible 'intended or unintended social or otherwise *conditioning-effects* up for debate or discussion? Just asking, your enlightening posts much appreciated, Linda Dr. L.D.Misek-Falkoff. Individual e-post. For I.D. here: *Respectful Interfaces* Communications Coordination Committee for the U.N. On Tue, Dec 2, 2008 at 7:47 AM, Guru wrote: > While we debate on 'Internet for All' at IGF .. the USG is already thinking > of making it happen ... > > Guru > > > > http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122809560499668087.html?mod=rss_whats_news_technology > > Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is pushing > for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free wireless > Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the wireless > industry and some consumer groups. > > At its December meeting, the FCC could also consider new rules designed to > speed up consideration of disputes between independent cable programmers and > cable providers such as Time Warner Cable Inc. and Comcast Corp., which > either refuse to carry some channels or put them on specialty tiers of > service that cost subscribers more. > > The agency also will ask for more feedback on its proposal to require > programmers to sell their channels to cable operators individually instead > of in bundles. > > The free Internet plan is the most controversial issue the agency will > tackle in December. Mr. Martin shelved plans to consider a wider variety of > sticky issues pending at the agency, including a request by the Hollywood > studios to hobble TVs and set-top boxes so studios can offer copy-protected > theatrical releases sooner. > > The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is part of > a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder would be > required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free Internet service. > The winner could establish a paid service that would have a fast wireless > Internet connection. The free service could be slower and would be required > to filter out pornography and other material not suitable for children. The > FCC's proposal mirrors a plan offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up > backed by Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. > > Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography filter, > while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free Internet plan. > To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is proposing that adults could > opt out and access all Internet sites. > > T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom AG > unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and has > complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result in > interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC dismissed > the company's interference concerns this fall, although T-Mobile disagreed > with that finding. > > -- > Gurumurthy Kasinathan > IT for Change > www.ITforChange.net > Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities > http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net > http://IS-Watch.net > *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United > Nations' Economic and Social Council* > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From Stuart.Hamilton at ifla.org Mon Dec 15 09:07:25 2008 From: Stuart.Hamilton at ifla.org (Stuart Hamilton) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 15:07:25 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <200812151348.mBFDm5PU009031@funredes.org> References: <200812151348.mBFDm5PU009031@funredes.org> Message-ID: <54A34818249DE34CB1697E94F0553F37376D9B@mfp01.IFLA.lan> Hello everyone I've been lurking on this last for the past few months but it now seems I have been outed by Daniel's spot-on email :) I represent IFLA (The International Federation of Library Associations) and I am pleased to say that we have finally started engaging with the IGF. Until recently we did not have the capacity at IFLA HQ for regular representation at all global forums of interest to librarians, and we had concentrated our efforts on the action lines of the WSIS follow-up process. Happily, we have recently increased capacity and this year we were able to represent in Hyderabad where we had a team of seven librarians covering the meeting. I represented IFLA on two panels, on Access to Knowledge (organised by IP Justice) and also on the well-attended panel on Filtering and Censorship organised by UNESCO. Ardi Prassad, an Indian librarian, represented IFLA on the panel about Access to Public Held Information from a Development Perspective. I would like to agree with Daniel's comment that the times where librarians were slow to understand the impact of the Net are over now :) More seriously, I'd like to agree with him that the topic of information literacy, or digital literacy, should be of great importance at the IGF. We find that our activities in this area (please see: http://www.infolitglobal.info/) are ravenously consumed by librarians and library users, and we would be very pleased to work with anyone who wishes to see this topic represented at IGF 2009. Kind regards, Stuart Stuart Hamilton Senior Policy Advisor International Federation of Library Associations and Institutions P.O. Box 95312 2509 CH The Hague Netherlands 00 31 70 314 0884 http://blogs.prodigio.nl/stuart/ -----Original Message----- From: Daniel Pimienta [mailto:pimienta at funredes.org] Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 2:44 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Saludos todas y todos, First of all, sorry I had to cancel last minute my participation in Hyderabad's IGF Diversity session for a health situation which is over now. This is my first contribution to the list which I joined last March, but it was not easy to catch up with the permanent and intense flow :-). I did read carefully all the contributions in the "themes for the coming IGFs" thread and I would like to share with you my concern for a theme which is too often underlooked and was not mentionned in spite of the numerous contributions. I am refering to "digital and information literacy" ... which directly refers to "info-ethics" and indirectly to "diversity". What use of the Internet would make the next billion connected users if they are not Internauts (in the ethymological sense of the term, a person who is in capacity to make a meaninfgul use of the Net)? How to improve the level of ethics of netusers (which we all witness is in the drop with important consequences for the Internaut communities) without appropriate education? If we want people to get ownership and empowered by the Internet, shall not we make provision and organize digital literacy for them? We were told by Aymarta Sen that Human Development, which is what I suppose we aim at by connecting people, requires capacities. It is not enough to connect hardware and software, we need to "connect the brains" for people being in real capacity to transform information into knowledge and contribute to the public domain of knowledge. I don't mean to be long, so I will refer to a paper which tries to demonstrate the link between digital divide and digital literacy and where my arguments for considering digital literacy a still deeper challenge than access are organized (by the way the argument that literacy is included in access is barely acceptable to me as it feeds the dangerous confusion beetween real literacy, a complex and long task, and simple training in Windows plus Office Suite a perverse approach as it does not open the way!). "Digital Divide, Socisal Divide, Paradigmatic Divide": http://funredes.org/mistica/english/cyberlibrary/thematic/Paradigmatic_D ivide.pdf As far as I know there is a group of profesionals who generally shares with Funredes this vision that digital and information literacy is a top priority issue for the Information Societies to emerge: the librarians. I am not myself a librarian and I wonder if this group is well enough represented in IGF: I am convinced that librarians are the oldest skilled information profesionals in history and shall take a more active stand in IGF (I also think that times where librarians were slow to understand the impact of the Net are over now). FUNREDES will come back within few weeks with a worldwide campaign linking digital literacy, info-ethics ... and Global Warming (!) and will share it in this forum. Cordialmente, Daniel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From a.beccalli at unesco.org Mon Dec 15 09:14:19 2008 From: a.beccalli at unesco.org (Andrea Beccalli) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 15:14:19 +0100 Subject: [governance] google and net neutrality Message-ID: <1229350459.21592.4.camel@andrea-laptop> interesting article on net-neutrality, http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122929270127905065.html Best, ---------------------------------------------- Andrea Beccalli Associate Expert Information Society Division - UNESCO tel +33(0)145684287 mobile +33(0)678642315 email a.beccalli at unesco.org 1, rue Miollis 75732 Paris ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de Mon Dec 15 09:24:10 2008 From: wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Kleinw=E4chter=2C_Wolfgang?=) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 15:24:10 +0100 Subject: AW: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head References: <20081215124022.C4ACE67905@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A84265C7@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Good point, but who can provide a universal definition of "censorship"? In all legal documents - both internationally and nationally - there are legally justifications for the restriction of freedom of expression as long as these restrictions are justified by law and are aimed to protect other human values. Prohibition of advertisement for tobacco in TV commercials is seen by the tobacco industry as "censorship" and as a violation of article 19 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights (1948), guaranteeing freedom of expression. But governments refer to Article19, para 3 of the International Covenant of Poltical and Civil Rights (1966) where it is stated that the right to freedom of expression can be restricted to protect - inter alia - public health. If there is a conflict between two universal rights and public values - here freedom of expression versus public health - in a democratic society an independent court should look into the arguments of both sides, balance the conflicting value and come with a case based decision. In my eyes censorshop starts if there is no neutral third party in place like inb China where the Communist Party - and not an independent court - defines when freedom of expression can be restricted to protect "public order". The problem with the Internet is that we have different understandings and priorities if it comes to the balance of conflicting human values. And there is no Universal Court of Human Rights. This is one of the issues which should be further discussed by the Dynamic Coalition of the Internet Bill of Rights. In my eyes such an Universal Court on Human Rights- which would deal with this kind of conflicts - should be on our agenda and the caucus should be a driving force. Today a little bit utopian, tomorrow probably a realistic perspective. Wolfgang ________________________________ Von: Parminder [mailto:parminder at itforchange.net] Gesendet: Mo 15.12.2008 13:40 An: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Milton L Mueller'; 'Lee W McKnight' Betreff: RE: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head > And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided "internet for all." (Milton) There is no necessary connection between publicly provided net and a censored net. The analogy often applied earlier comparing a 'right to the Internet' with the right to education is useful here. Public education has mostly meant some kind of a public curriculum. States and communities have dealt with the issue of inappropriate kinds of control over 'public curriculum' in a nuanced and dynamic manner. No one has ever proposed scrapping public education provisions to deal with the problems associated with state's role in determining/ influencing curriculum. The comparison with right to education and state's role in curriculum/content development however ends here. There perhaps was (is) a structural and also a social requirement for state's involvement in curriculum decisions in terms of public education. Internet however is entirely different. Any amount of different content, of any number of different types, *can* be accommodated *equally* on the Internet. However, public support is still required to provide 'equalizing' conditions for production of all, and different, kinds of content. (Canada recently has announced some such provisions to ensure there is sufficient "Canadian" content on the Internet, as the government used to do to ensure enough Canadian content on TV and Film media.) IT for Change just now concluded an international workshop on 'ICTs for participatory local development' where the combination of - as well as nuances and dynamics of - 'public provisioning' along with 'local community decision making' was emphasized to deal with equity and social justice aspects of the emerging information society. The two are not exclusive, in fact they need to complement one another, and public provisioning has to be done in a manner that strengthens rather than weakens 'local community decision making'. The same extends to the issue of expanding individual's freedoms through public action, something which underpins Sen's capability rights approach and UNDP's Human Development approach to development policy based on Sen's work. As for some members skepticism about public provisioning on the Internet; who proposes what solution depends of where one is placed. Societies where markets are in a good position to deal with the dynamics of an emerging information (or Internet-based) society would have a different take on this issue than societies where these dynamics are furthering inequalities, both within the societies and vis a vis the Northern societies. To the extent that we are speaking in terms that are sought to be applied across the world, we need to be sensitive to social and political realities of the whole world. Parminder ________________________________ From: Milton L Mueller [mailto:mueller at syr.edu] Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 3:25 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Lee W McKnight Subject: RE: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided "internet for all." Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the wireless industry and some consumer groups. The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is part of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that would have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could be slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. -- Gurumurthy Kasinathan IT for Change www.ITforChange.net Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Mon Dec 15 09:30:06 2008 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 23:30:06 +0900 Subject: [governance] google and net neutrality In-Reply-To: <1229350459.21592.4.camel@andrea-laptop> References: <1229350459.21592.4.camel@andrea-laptop> Message-ID: >interesting article on net-neutrality, > >http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122929270127905065.html Google and Lessig have responded to say WSJ got it wrong: see and BoingBoing on Lessig's response: Adam >Best, > > >---------------------------------------------- >Andrea Beccalli >Associate Expert >Information Society Division - UNESCO >tel +33(0)145684287 >mobile +33(0)678642315 >email a.beccalli at unesco.org >1, rue Miollis 75732 Paris > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From gurstein at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 09:57:49 2008 From: gurstein at gmail.com (Michael Gurstein) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 16:57:49 +0200 Subject: [governance] FW: [IP] Google Wants Its Own Fast Track on the Web - WSJ.comGoogles response -- Message-ID: <481345BF68FE4E0D8BC56081234A1E89@userPC> Evidently the WSJ has been doing some "creative reporting" around the NN issue and trying to find some movement in various positions concerning the issue which the principals involved are asserting were never there... MG -----Original Message----- From: David Farber [mailto:dave at farber.net] Sent: December-15-08 2:49 PM To: ip Subject: [IP] Google Wants Its Own Fast Track on the Web - WSJ.comGoogles response -- I am surprised at the sloppy reporting of the WSJ in hyping what , at least from what I can find out, a "simple" step. Any comments djf Begin forwarded message: From: "Nick Johnson" Date: December 15, 2008 6:19:14 AM EST To: dave at farber.net Subject: Re: [IP] Google Wants Its Own Fast Track on the Web - WSJ.com Dave, For IP, if you wish. This article has been pretty thoroughly debunked - colocating caching machines at ISPs has little to do with network neutrality, and certainly doesn't encourage discrimination. Here's Google's official response: http://googlepublicpolicy.blogspot.com/2008/12/net-neutrality-and-benefits-o f-caching.html And Lawrence Lessig has written a rebuttal, too: http://www.boingboing.net/2008/12/15/wsj-invents-fictiona.html (linked to BoingBoing, since Lessig's site seems to be down right now). Full Disclosure: I work for Google, though not in any capacity impinging upon this. My opinions are entirely my own. -Nick Johnson On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 2:32 AM, David Farber wrote: So much for the competition and Net Neu djf http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122929270127905065.html By VISHESH KUMAR and CHRISTOPHER RHOADS The celebrated openness of the Internet -- network providers are not supposed to give preferential treatment to any traffic -- is quietly losing powerful defenders. Google Inc. has approached major cable and phone companies that carry Internet traffic with a proposal to create a fast lane for its own content, according to documents reviewed by The Wall Street Journal. Google has traditionally been one of the loudest advocates of equal network access for all content providers. _____ Archives _____ Archives -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Mon Dec 15 10:51:49 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 10:51:49 -0500 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head References: <49352E7B.80402@itforchange.net><63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740CB2@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu><7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu><4946569A.8050106@zedat.fu-berlin.de> Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D27@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> There is a 3rd FCC transition team leader, Dale Hatfield. Dale is ex-FCC chief technologist, UC Boulder prof emeritus and veteran good guy. I could say I told ya so that nothing would happen with Martin's proposal. But instead I will say to Parminder, point taken, a variety of approaches for open Internet access,worldwide should be encouraged and explored. Lee -----Original Message----- From: Sivasubramanian Muthusamy [mailto:isolatedn at gmail.com] Sent: Mon 12/15/2008 8:47 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ralf Bendrath Subject: Re: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head Hello All, The new US Administration is likely to have the an FCC that might think at least a bit differently about censorship, tiered Internet and on other related central issues of concerns to the Internet users. The Obama FCC transition team is led by Susan Crawford of One Web Day and Kevin Warbach of the Supernova group and there is nothing to indicate that these two leaders would bring in a new team that is insensitive to users. http://www.circleid.com/posts/susan_crawford_kevin_werbach_obama_fcc_review_team_leads/ We don't have to be very concerned about the plan proposed by the outgoing FCC chief especially after reading the news item by Rauf Bendrath. These are changing times and lets wait and watch... Sivasubramanian Muthusamy India. On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 6:37 PM, Ralf Bendrath wrote: > Milton L Mueller schrieb: > > And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely > > what some of us fear will be the price of government-provided "internet > > for all." > > >> Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is > >> pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free > >> wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the > >> wireless industry and some consumer groups. > > The plan seems to be dead, at least for the moment: > > > > DECEMBER 12, 2008, 11:48 P.M. ET > > FCC Head Cancels Vote on Free Internet Plan > > By FAWN JOHNSON > > WASHINGTON -- Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin on > Friday evening canceled next week's meeting at which the commission was > scheduled to vote on a free Internet plan, after receiving a letter from > key U.S. lawmakers asking him to hold off. > > Sen. John Rockefeller, (D-W.Va.), and Rep. Henry Waxman, (D-Calif.), who > will chair the Senate and House committees overseeing the FCC next year, > earlier Friday sent a letter to Mr. Martin asking him to cease actions on > controversial policy proposals. > > (...) > > "We received the letter from Senator Rockefeller and Congressman Waxman > today and spoke with other offices," said FCC Spokesman Robert Kenny. "In > light of the letter, it does not appear that there is consensus to move > forward and the agenda meeting has been canceled." > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ldmisekfalkoff at gmail.com Mon Dec 15 11:10:46 2008 From: ldmisekfalkoff at gmail.com (linda misek-falkoff) Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2008 11:10:46 -0500 Subject: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head In-Reply-To: <20081215124022.C4ACE67905@smtp1.electricembers.net> References: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9023CA40E@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> <20081215124022.C4ACE67905@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <45ed74050812150810l3575075ale4ee73aed05f4d11@mail.gmail.com> Hi Parminder et al, and well yes, but still possibly linking managed-access to potential censorship, in different guise, and a surely attractive one because on its face free of charge - there is still the matter of potentially conditioning people to a subset. I am not saying that is operative here, again, just asking what y'all think. Consider for instance writings on Newspeak (narrower) versus Oldspeak (fuller) and other restricted / restrictive / restricting linguistic domains, as illustrative. We may want to consider that *Discourse* can condition *thought* as well as the other way around. So in Orwellion visions of limited vocabularies, or "Basic English" e.g. a population can be conditioned under the operation of excluded matter. Subset Educational infusions, etc. And "after a while" a more expanded set can become 'unthinkable'. Untaught, unsought, unthoiught about And a non-small by-the-way (btw) this is a pretty good forum* for discussing various senses of accessibility, overt paths to "knowledge" and more subtle routes, and whether widely open or blocked one way or t'other. . * Thanks for it, With best wishes, and *Respectfully Interfacing,* Linda. On Mon, Dec 15, 2008 at 7:40 AM, Parminder wrote: > > And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely what > some of us fear will be the price of government-provided "internet for > all." > (Milton) > > > > > > There is no necessary connection between publicly provided net and a > censored net. The analogy often applied earlier comparing a 'right to the > Internet' with the right to education is useful here. Public education has > mostly meant some kind of a public curriculum. States and communities have > dealt with the issue of inappropriate kinds of control over 'public > curriculum' in a nuanced and dynamic manner. No one has ever proposed > scrapping public education provisions to deal with the problems associated > with state's role in determining/ influencing curriculum. > > > > The comparison with right to education and state's role in > curriculum/content development however ends here. There perhaps was (is) a > structural and also a social requirement for state's involvement in > curriculum decisions in terms of public education. Internet however is > entirely different. Any amount of different content, of any number of > different types, *can* be accommodated *equally* on the Internet. However, > public support is still required to provide 'equalizing' conditions for > production of all, and different, kinds of content. (Canada recently has > announced some such provisions to ensure there is sufficient "Canadian" > content on the Internet, as the government used to do to ensure enough > Canadian content on TV and Film media.) > > > > IT for Change just now concluded an international workshop on 'ICTs for > participatory local development' where the combination of - as well as > nuances and dynamics of - 'public provisioning' along with 'local community > decision making' was emphasized to deal with equity and social justice > aspects of the emerging information society. The two are not exclusive, in > fact they need to complement one another, and public provisioning has to be > done in a manner that strengthens rather than weakens 'local community > decision making'. The same extends to the issue of expanding individual's > freedoms through public action, something which underpins Sen's capability > rights approach and UNDP's Human Development approach to development policy > based on Sen's work. > > > > As for some members skepticism about public provisioning on the Internet; > who proposes what solution depends of where one is placed. Societies where > markets are in a good position to deal with the dynamics of an emerging > information (or Internet-based) society would have a different take on this > issue than societies where these dynamics are furthering inequalities, both > within the societies and vis a vis the Northern societies. To the extent > that we are speaking in terms that are sought to be applied across the > world, we need to be sensitive to social and political realities of the > whole world. > > > > > > Parminder > > > > _____ > > From: Milton L Mueller [mailto:mueller at syr.edu] > Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 3:25 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Lee W McKnight > Subject: RE: [governance] Free Web Plan Being Pushed by FCC Head > > > > And PLEASE note that this is a CENSORED internet, which is precisely what > some of us fear will be the price of government-provided "internet for > all." > > > > > > Outgoing Federal Communications Commission Chairman Kevin Martin is > pushing for action in December on a plan to offer free, pornography-free > wireless Internet service to all Americans, despite objections from the > wireless industry and some consumer groups. > > The proposal to allow a no-smut, free wireless Internet service is part > of a proposal to auction off a chunk of airwaves. The winning bidder > would be required to set aside a quarter of the airwaves for a free > Internet service. The winner could establish a paid service that would > have a fast wireless Internet connection. The free service could be > slower and would be required to filter out pornography and other > material not suitable for children. The FCC's proposal mirrors a plan > offered by M2Z Networks Inc., a start-up backed by Kleiner Perkins > Caufield & Byers partner John Doerr. > > Consumer advocates have objected to the FCC's proposed pornography > filter, while the wireless industry has objected to the entire free > Internet plan. To address concerns about the filter, the FCC is > proposing that adults could opt out and access all Internet sites. > > T-Mobile USA, in particular, has raised concerns. The Deutsche Telekom > AG unit paid about $4 billion a few years ago for nearby airwaves and > has complained that the free wireless Internet plan will likely result > in interference for consumers of its new 3G wireless network. The FCC > dismissed the company's interference concerns this fall, although > T-Mobile disagreed with that finding. > > -- > Gurumurthy Kasinathan > IT for Change > www.ITforChange.net > Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities > > http://ITforChange.net > > > http://India.IS-Watch.net > > http://IS-Watch.net > *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United > Nations' > Economic and Social Council* > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From gurstein at gmail.com Tue Dec 16 02:46:14 2008 From: gurstein at gmail.com (Michael Gurstein) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 09:46:14 +0200 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <200812151348.mBFDm5PU009031@funredes.org> Message-ID: <0D83268641D741B280C969C7B5770D82@userPC> Since we are doing some brainstorming here could I suggest that we consider the theme of "digital inclusion" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Digital_inclusion which I understand to be a "positive" in comparison to the negative cast of the mirror notion of the "digital divide". As well, the notion of "digital inclusion" adds a normative element to the discussion which moves things way beyond the somewhat neutral (tending towards "marketing") connotation of the current theme of "access" (which seems to deliberately ignore the obvious question(s) of "access for what/why/who/how/when/where". My prefered theme of course would be "effective use" i.e. how to make the Internet useful/usable to the both the current and next 5 billion but that's I guess for a later time. "Digital literacy" of course, is closely related and probably can be cast as a pre-condition for effective "digital inclusion" although of course not all elements of "digital literacy" would (or could) be included within "digital inclusion" (or v.v.). MG -----Original Message----- From: Daniel Pimienta [mailto:pimienta at funredes.org] Sent: December-15-08 3:44 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Saludos todas y todos, First of all, sorry I had to cancel last minute my participation in Hyderabad's IGF Diversity session for a health situation which is over now. This is my first contribution to the list which I joined last March, but it was not easy to catch up with the permanent and intense flow :-). I did read carefully all the contributions in the "themes for the coming IGFs" thread and I would like to share with you my concern for a theme which is too often underlooked and was not mentionned in spite of the numerous contributions. I am refering to "digital and information literacy" ... which directly refers to "info-ethics" and indirectly to "diversity". What use of the Internet would make the next billion connected users if they are not Internauts (in the ethymological sense of the term, a person who is in capacity to make a meaninfgul use of the Net)? How to improve the level of ethics of netusers (which we all witness is in the drop with important consequences for the Internaut communities) without appropriate education? If we want people to get ownership and empowered by the Internet, shall not we make provision and organize digital literacy for them? We were told by Aymarta Sen that Human Development, which is what I suppose we aim at by connecting people, requires capacities. It is not enough to connect hardware and software, we need to "connect the brains" for people being in real capacity to transform information into knowledge and contribute to the public domain of knowledge. I don't mean to be long, so I will refer to a paper which tries to demonstrate the link between digital divide and digital literacy and where my arguments for considering digital literacy a still deeper challenge than access are organized (by the way the argument that literacy is included in access is barely acceptable to me as it feeds the dangerous confusion beetween real literacy, a complex and long task, and simple training in Windows plus Office Suite a perverse approach as it does not open the way!). "Digital Divide, Socisal Divide, Paradigmatic Divide": http://funredes.org/mistica/english/cyberlibrary/thematic/Paradigmatic_Divid e.pdf As far as I know there is a group of profesionals who generally shares with Funredes this vision that digital and information literacy is a top priority issue for the Information Societies to emerge: the librarians. I am not myself a librarian and I wonder if this group is well enough represented in IGF: I am convinced that librarians are the oldest skilled information profesionals in history and shall take a more active stand in IGF (I also think that times where librarians were slow to understand the impact of the Net are over now). FUNREDES will come back within few weeks with a worldwide campaign linking digital literacy, info-ethics ... and Global Warming (!) and will share it in this forum. Cordialmente, Daniel ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Tue Dec 16 03:29:14 2008 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 17:29:14 +0900 Subject: [governance] IGF meeting, Geneva, 23-24 February 2009 Message-ID: From the IGF website Consultations open to all stakeholders will be held in Geneva on 23-24 February. Two main items will be on the agenda: * Taking stock of the Hyderabad Meeting and suggest improvements for the 2009 Meeting to be held in Sharm El Sheikh * Preparing the IGF Review process. Written contributions are welcome and will be posted on this Web site. To facilitate the discussions, a questionnaire will be made available in due course. - - - - On the first, it's time to suggest new themes, how to deal with old, possible new formats, what worked well and less well in Hyderabad (this may seem trivial, but please remember to say how much the lunch was appreciated!) On themes, I hope some time will be given over to discussion from national and regional IGF meetings. Nitin Desai's comments during the taking stock are well worth reading. On the second issue, the IGF review, Markus Kummer gave an outline of the expected time line and some background of the review process during the taking stock session in Hyderabad, he said: "The mandate is, shall we say, relatively clear. It has to be -- it has to take place within five years of its creation. And this generally assumed that the creation dates back to Tunis 2005. So the Secretary-General will have to make a recommendation to member states, as it is stated in the Tunis agenda, and make recommendations so that a decision can be taken within these five years. This brings us to the General Assembly of 2009 -- 2010. Sorry. That is two years from now. And in order to get there, we will have to get started soon. In order for the General Assembly to take a decision, the report from the Secretary-General needs to be ready in early 2010. It will then go to the CSTD in May 2010, from there to ECOSOC in July 2010, and from ECOSOC to the General Assembly, which then has the last word on whether or not to continue the forum in December 2010. In other words, we will have to get started early next year, and we will prepare that with a day set aside at the meetings in February. We have the dates already for the open consultations. That is 23rd and 24th of February. And one day of these two days will be set aside for the discussion on how to prepare this review process. And, of course, we invite all stakeholders to post their ideas and comments. And we'll post it on our Web site. And we will, as usual, prepare a paper as an input into the discussions. The process will then be conducted on the basis of these discussions in February and brought to fruition at the meeting in Egypt sometime in late fall. And I am given to understand that our Egyptian hosts may be able to announce us the dates later today. [15-18 November] But it is also, I think, understood and also not the desire of our Egyptian hosts to turn the meeting in Egypt into an inward-looking meeting where we discuss the future of the IGF. This will be one item on the agenda of the meeting, like we have today, the taking stock and the way forward. We would then discuss the review. But the actual review will have to take place at the meeting itself. The mandate says the Secretary-General will have to consult -- informal consultations with forum participants. And that can only be the annual meeting of the IGF. So we will have to come to consensus in this area. We do say the IGF is not a decision-making body. But we will have to find some way of reaching a consensus on what will then go into the report of the Secretary-General. But the final decision will be with the member states in the various instances, CSTD, ECOSOC, and, finally, General Assembly." Worth seeing the complete quote, then there shouldn't be any (many) questions. Adam ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Tue Dec 16 03:31:30 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 13:31:30 +0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <701af9f70812160031gf19a71cid88a48e6cd59a830@mail.gmail.com> I second Jeremy on open standards, open systems, open content, free and open source, open information sharing and open ICT governance and ecosystems. I would also like to hand in myself for conducting a workshop focused on these issues and would like to get together with like minded people and develop a charter for such a workshop! On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > On 11/12/2008, at 6:36 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > >> We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For those who >> didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: >> >> * Reaching the next billion; >> * Promoting cyber-security and trust; >> * Managing critical Internet resources; >> * Taking stock and the way forward; >> * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow >> >> I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching the >> next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss next year. Do >> others agree? What are other topics we want to see discussed? In my view, >> critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda. > > I am ambivalent about the continued focus on access, but openness should > definitely return. This is a diverse theme that can encompass open > standards, open content, open source, open information, open governance and > more all of which have drifted out of focus for the main sessions (though > better represented in workshops). > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning > voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we > are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and > empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit > www.consumersinternational.org. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From asif at kabani.co.uk Tue Dec 16 04:08:46 2008 From: asif at kabani.co.uk (Kabani) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 14:08:46 +0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <701af9f70812160031gf19a71cid88a48e6cd59a830@mail.gmail.com> References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <701af9f70812160031gf19a71cid88a48e6cd59a830@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8017791e0812160108u21d806b6k868c4990b1765564@mail.gmail.com> Greetings, I agree with Jeremy & Fouad that we need now to focus on the open standards, open systems, open content, free and open source, open information sharing and open ICT governance and sustainable Development. With Best Regards Sincerely Asif Kabani Hon. Director, Governane and ICT Int. Sustainable Development Resource Centre Geneva 2008/12/16 Fouad Bajwa : > I second Jeremy on open standards, open systems, open content, free > and open source, open information sharing and open ICT governance and > ecosystems. I would also like to hand in myself for conducting a > workshop focused on these issues and would like to get together with > like minded people and develop a charter for such a workshop! > > > > > On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: >> On 11/12/2008, at 6:36 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >> >>> We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For those who >>> didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: >>> >>> * Reaching the next billion; >>> * Promoting cyber-security and trust; >>> * Managing critical Internet resources; >>> * Taking stock and the way forward; >>> * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow >>> >>> I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching the >>> next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss next year. Do >>> others agree? What are other topics we want to see discussed? In my view, >>> critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda. >> >> I am ambivalent about the continued focus on access, but openness should >> definitely return. This is a diverse theme that can encompass open >> standards, open content, open source, open information, open governance and >> more all of which have drifted out of focus for the main sessions (though >> better represented in workshops). >> >> -- >> JEREMY MALCOLM >> Project Coordinator >> CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE >> for Asia Pacific and the Middle East >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning >> voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we >> are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and >> empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit >> www.consumersinternational.org. >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > > > > -- > > Regards. > -------------------------- > Fouad Bajwa > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Tue Dec 16 04:56:01 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 15:26:01 +0530 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <8017791e0812160108u21d806b6k868c4990b1765564@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20081216095612.E814667857@smtp1.electricembers.net> >open standards, open systems, open content, free > > and open source, open information sharing and open ICT governance and > > ecosystems Hi All, The listed themes are important to discuss in a coherent and purposeful manner. We perhaps need to put a proposed rights-based approach in a clear framework of application in different IG areas, for it not to remain a mere empty slogan (as Jeanette fears it may become as in case of "Internet for all', the overall theme for IGF Hyderabad) While different ways of 'operationalizing' a possible rights-based approach (RBA) in IG may be possible, I suggest the following in an attempt to reconcile some of the suggested themes discussed on this list in the last few days with a RBA. - ( Internet related rights at the user end) Access and diversity etc related rights (more ?) - (Internet related rights vis a vis Internet's open architecture) - elements of open eco-system listed above, FoE, privacy etc (Network neutrality should be one theme out of the two themes within this thematic area if we continue to follow the Hyderabad IGF scheme, because NN represents an important and basic openness principles which is most strongly under immediate threat) - (Internet related rights in Internet's global governance) - CIRs governance should be an important element here (it is not the actual issues about CIRs that are so much contested as much the nature and principles of its governance), but also global Internet public policy frameworks and the democratic deficit therein (read Brazil's statement on the 'enhanced cooperation' panel, on how clubs of few countries are negotiating treaties behind closed doors, and then asking other countries to sign on fait accompli documents, which is very undemocratic, and denial of people's right of self-determination) Parminder > -----Original Message----- > From: kabani.asif at gmail.com [mailto:kabani.asif at gmail.com] On Behalf Of > Kabani > Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 2:39 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Fouad Bajwa > Cc: Jeremy Malcolm; Jeanette Hofmann > Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > > Greetings, > > I agree with Jeremy & Fouad that we need now to focus on the open > standards, open systems, open content, free and open source, open > information sharing and open ICT governance and sustainable > Development. > > > With Best Regards > > > Sincerely > > > > Asif Kabani > Hon. Director, Governane and ICT > Int. Sustainable Development Resource Centre > Geneva > 2008/12/16 Fouad Bajwa : > > I second Jeremy on open standards, open systems, open content, free > > and open source, open information sharing and open ICT governance and > > ecosystems. I would also like to hand in myself for conducting a > > workshop focused on these issues and would like to get together with > > like minded people and develop a charter for such a workshop! > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Jeremy Malcolm > wrote: > >> On 11/12/2008, at 6:36 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > >> > >>> We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For those > who > >>> didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: > >>> > >>> * Reaching the next billion; > >>> * Promoting cyber-security and trust; > >>> * Managing critical Internet resources; > >>> * Taking stock and the way forward; > >>> * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow > >>> > >>> I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching the > >>> next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss next > year. Do > >>> others agree? What are other topics we want to see discussed? In my > view, > >>> critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda. > >> > >> I am ambivalent about the continued focus on access, but openness > should > >> definitely return. This is a diverse theme that can encompass open > >> standards, open content, open source, open information, open governance > and > >> more all of which have drifted out of focus for the main sessions > (though > >> better represented in workshops). > >> > >> -- > >> JEREMY MALCOLM > >> Project Coordinator > >> CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > >> for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > >> > >> Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning > >> voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 > countries, we > >> are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect > and > >> empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit > >> www.consumersinternational.org. > >> > >> ____________________________________________________________ > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: > >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >> > >> For all list information and functions, see: > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Regards. > > -------------------------- > > Fouad Bajwa > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > > > -- > Visit: www.kabani.co.uk > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Tue Dec 16 05:05:03 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 15:05:03 +0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: <20081216095612.E814667857@smtp1.electricembers.net> References: <8017791e0812160108u21d806b6k868c4990b1765564@mail.gmail.com> <20081216095612.E814667857@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <701af9f70812160205m158a1d8bnbd13f4c3243293bb@mail.gmail.com> Can we collectively organize a workshop at IGF Cairo and create a coalition that can affectively lead this effort on a long term basis because I believe it is about time to have the advocates take the caps others have been wearing and contribute in detail deliberations on the issues and bring in as many CS representatives from across the world. I am sure that no one can deny what Jeremy and Parminder have shared and its about time things got some structure here. My motion is for a workshop next year! On Tue, Dec 16, 2008 at 2:56 PM, Parminder wrote: >>open standards, open systems, open content, free > >> > and open source, open information sharing and open ICT governance and > >> > ecosystems > > > > Hi All, > > > > The listed themes are important to discuss in a coherent and purposeful > manner. > > > > We perhaps need to put a proposed rights-based approach in a clear framework > of application in different IG areas, for it not to remain a mere empty > slogan (as Jeanette fears it may become as in case of "Internet for all', > the overall theme for IGF Hyderabad) > > > > While different ways of 'operationalizing' a possible rights-based approach > (RBA) in IG may be possible, I suggest the following in an attempt to > reconcile some of the suggested themes discussed on this list in the last > few days with a RBA. > > > > - ( Internet related rights at the user end) Access and diversity > etc related rights (more ?) > > > > - (Internet related rights vis a vis Internet's open architecture) – > elements of open eco-system listed above, FoE, privacy etc (Network > neutrality should be one theme out of the two themes within this thematic > area if we continue to follow the Hyderabad IGF scheme, because NN > represents an important and basic openness principles which is most strongly > under immediate threat) > > > > - (Internet related rights in Internet's global governance) – CIRs > governance should be an important element here (it is not the actual issues > about CIRs that are so much contested as much the nature and principles of > its governance), but also global Internet public policy frameworks and the > democratic deficit therein (read Brazil's statement on the 'enhanced > cooperation' panel, on how clubs of few countries are negotiating treaties > behind closed doors, and then asking other countries to sign on fait > accompli documents, which is very undemocratic, and denial of people's right > of self-determination) > > > > Parminder > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: kabani.asif at gmail.com [mailto:kabani.asif at gmail.com] On Behalf Of > >> Kabani > >> Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 2:39 PM > >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Fouad Bajwa > >> Cc: Jeremy Malcolm; Jeanette Hofmann > >> Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs > >> > >> Greetings, > >> > >> I agree with Jeremy & Fouad that we need now to focus on the open > >> standards, open systems, open content, free and open source, open > >> information sharing and open ICT governance and sustainable > >> Development. > >> > >> > >> With Best Regards > >> > >> > >> Sincerely > >> > >> > >> > >> Asif Kabani > >> Hon. Director, Governane and ICT > >> Int. Sustainable Development Resource Centre > >> Geneva > >> 2008/12/16 Fouad Bajwa : > >> > I second Jeremy on open standards, open systems, open content, free > >> > and open source, open information sharing and open ICT governance and > >> > ecosystems. I would also like to hand in myself for conducting a > >> > workshop focused on these issues and would like to get together with > >> > like minded people and develop a charter for such a workshop! > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Jeremy Malcolm > >> wrote: > >> >> On 11/12/2008, at 6:36 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > >> >> > >> >>> We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For those > >> who > >> >>> didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: > >> >>> > >> >>> * Reaching the next billion; > >> >>> * Promoting cyber-security and trust; > >> >>> * Managing critical Internet resources; > >> >>> * Taking stock and the way forward; > >> >>> * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow > >> >>> > >> >>> I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching the > >> >>> next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss next > >> year. Do > >> >>> others agree? What are other topics we want to see discussed? In my > >> view, > >> >>> critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda. > >> >> > >> >> I am ambivalent about the continued focus on access, but openness > >> should > >> >> definitely return. This is a diverse theme that can encompass open > >> >> standards, open content, open source, open information, open governance > >> and > >> >> more all of which have drifted out of focus for the main sessions > >> (though > >> >> better represented in workshops). > >> >> > >> >> -- > >> >> JEREMY MALCOLM > >> >> Project Coordinator > >> >> CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > >> >> for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > >> >> > >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning > >> >> voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 > >> countries, we > >> >> are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect > >> and > >> >> empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit > >> >> www.consumersinternational.org. > >> >> > >> >> ____________________________________________________________ > >> >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >> >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: > >> >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >> >> > >> >> For all list information and functions, see: > >> >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >> >> > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > -- > >> > > >> > Regards. > >> > -------------------------- > >> > Fouad Bajwa > >> > ____________________________________________________________ > >> > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >> > > >> > For all list information and functions, see: > >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Visit: www.kabani.co.uk > >> ____________________________________________________________ > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: > >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >> > >> For all list information and functions, see: > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Tue Dec 16 05:24:49 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 15:24:49 +0500 Subject: [governance] IGF meeting, Geneva, 23-24 February 2009 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <701af9f70812160224x629d32e4i9dfe5c138cf29c7@mail.gmail.com> Hi Adam and all, >From what I see here, the need is for practical directions then just the same people sitting in the IGF changing hats and declaring dynamic coalitions. I say this because I participated with a number of our members at the OECD Ministerial on the Future of the Internet Economy and what came forward as the CS Seoul Declaration set forth some what a practical path for atleast the CS groups to intervene with the OECD even though it is a slow process and evolved over the past 10 years. We have to realize that Governments cannot achieve their policies without partnering with CS groups and that CS groups act as the catalyst but are the right CS groups participating or is it just more or less the same faces representing countries and their CS groups over and over again without attaining certain progress. I would say this because the IGF has been very weak to address the issues of Openness even though people may throw a load of documents in my face, but still, I would be determined this year to invite and group up with the REAL openness advocates that have shown such worth and deliberations in their work as well as activism to be the ones to saddle this horse and intervene with a well prepared and solution focused workshop that would not be just one day but would continue during the duration of the IGF in Egypt and come out with practical direction for the IGF. We tend to ignore many issues that Parminder today has put back into focus and as Asif Kabani has shared on certain occasions that our pursuit should be now very practical. We don't have to rant the same issues over and over again, instead, we have to bring the right set of people to the table. I would like to show you an example of the situation through this contribution by our side to the Global Information Society Watch Report for the years 2007 and 2008: GISW Pakistan 2007 Report: http://www.giswatch.org/files/pdf/GISW_Pakistan.pdf GISW Pakistan 2008 Report: http://www.giswatch.org/gisw2008/country/pdf/Pakistan.pdf Once you go through these reports, you will see that we as CS Caucus members have contributed key issues and then have been advocating the development of a new IT/ICT Policy in the country taking action to convince the government to include actions in their policies to overcome these. Starting from my participation in the WSIS process to this is a regional achievement but again there is no opportunity for us to go to the IGF and take forward action. I want us to realize that practical action is happening but is not being fed into the IGF, why, the wrong people are participating that have more or less no share in the practical policy change and environment change activities of the various developing countries challenged by the digital divide. Once again I want everyone to realize, it is time to put the efforts done on the table post WSIS, take stock, determine direction, associate them to the IGF process and determine the future of the IGF country wise and CS effort wise. If you dont present your examples there will be no recognition by the governments and you will see IGF sinking. Once again, on behalf of the CS Caucus, I give a call for the Openness Committee formulation that will lead actionable deliberations and interventions at IGF Egypt and feed a practical report to the Chairman's notes and document on the future of IGF! I need your buyin! On Tue, Dec 16, 2008 at 1:29 PM, Adam Peake wrote: > From the IGF website > > > > > Consultations open to all stakeholders will be held in Geneva on 23-24 > February. > > Two main items will be on the agenda: > > * Taking stock of the Hyderabad Meeting and suggest improvements for the > 2009 Meeting to be held in Sharm El Sheikh > > * Preparing the IGF Review process. > > Written contributions are welcome and will be posted on this Web site. To > facilitate the discussions, a questionnaire will be made available in due > course. > > - - - - > > On the first, it's time to suggest new themes, how to deal with old, > possible new formats, what worked well and less well in Hyderabad (this may > seem trivial, but please remember to say how much the lunch was > appreciated!) > > On themes, I hope some time will be given over to discussion from national > and regional IGF meetings. > > Nitin Desai's comments during the taking stock are well worth reading. > > On the second issue, the IGF review, Markus Kummer gave an outline of the > expected time line and some background of the review process during the > taking stock session in Hyderabad, he said: > > "The mandate is, shall we say, relatively clear. It has to be -- it has to > take place within five years of its creation. And this generally assumed > that the creation dates back to Tunis 2005. So the Secretary-General will > have to make a recommendation to member states, as it is stated in the Tunis > agenda, and make recommendations so that a decision can be taken within > these five years. > > This brings us to the General Assembly of 2009 -- 2010. Sorry. That is two > years from now. > > And in order to get there, we will have to get started soon. In order for > the General Assembly to take a decision, the report from the > Secretary-General needs to be ready in early 2010. It will then go to the > CSTD in May 2010, from there to ECOSOC in July 2010, and from ECOSOC to the > General Assembly, which then has the last word on whether or not to continue > the forum in December 2010. > > In other words, we will have to get started early next year, and we will > prepare that with a day set aside at the meetings in February. We have the > dates already for the open consultations. That is 23rd and 24th of > February. And one day of these two days will be set aside for the > discussion on how to prepare this review process. > > And, of course, we invite all stakeholders to post their ideas and comments. > And we'll post it on our Web site. And we will, as usual, prepare a paper > as an input into the discussions. > > The process will then be conducted on the basis of these discussions in > February and brought to fruition at the meeting in Egypt sometime in late > fall. And I am given to understand that our Egyptian hosts may be able to > announce us the dates later today. [15-18 November] > > But it is also, I think, understood and also not the desire of our Egyptian > hosts to turn the meeting in Egypt into an inward-looking meeting where we > discuss the future of the IGF. This will be one item on the agenda of the > meeting, like we have today, the taking stock and the way forward. We would > then discuss the review. > > But the actual review will have to take place at the meeting itself. The > mandate says the Secretary-General will have to consult -- informal > consultations with forum participants. And that can only be the annual > meeting of the IGF. > > So we will have to come to consensus in this area. We do say the IGF is not > a decision-making body. But we will have to find some way of reaching a > consensus on what will then go into the report of the Secretary-General. > But the final decision will be with the member states in the various > instances, CSTD, ECOSOC, and, finally, General Assembly." > > > > Worth seeing the complete quote, then there shouldn't be any (many) > questions. > > Adam > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Tue Dec 16 05:54:48 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 15:54:48 +0500 Subject: [governance] The Future of the IGF Message-ID: <701af9f70812160254j18e58645o600d05c3bf675184@mail.gmail.com> Dear Members, I would like to contribute to initiating a process here on the CS Caucus leading to our inputs on the subject of The Future of the IGF. I would also like to request you to view the document contribution titled "Appraising the Success of the Internet Governance Forum" by Jeremy Malcolm at http://internetgovernance.org/pdf/MalcolmIGFReview.pdf to formulate a basis to address The Future of IGF. There may also be a need for a practical CS Charter on the issues so that CS can continue to take its route of interventions even when the IGF process is dormant in its review stage. The future of determining and decentralizing Internet Control will continue whether lead by the IGF or any other movement. Starting from this point onwards, the intended direction of this discussion is to record your inputs on the following key issues that can formulate the basis of forming a CS Caucus workshop as mentioned in my earlier message. This cannot be done in a silo, we need to take stock of various enquiry questions and my contribution is below and I would like to request you all to either add more questions to the list below or initiate answering them and then from taking stock of the answers we can initiate the process of designing a paper that can help us develop the workshop for the IGF in Egypt as well as an initial paper to share with the Chairman. An example theme and session of the workshop can take into account Parminder's contribution to recognize and intervene on the possible rights-based approach (RBA) in IG: - Internet related rights at the user end - Access and diversity etc related rights (more ?) - Internet related rights vis a vis Internet's open architecture – elements of open eco-system listed above, FoE, privacy etc - Internet related rights in Internet's global governance Similarly you may contribute and add more questions to the following: 1. What was the original intention of the IGF? 2. What has the IGF originally achieved until now? 3. Has the IGF evolved meaningful actions that are bearing results? 4. Has the world become more defensive against the IGF process? 5. Have governments resorted to more unlawful and hidden tactics that are against the spirit of the IGF process? 6. Has the CS meaningfully participated and contributed to the IGF process, if yes what results have been produced and achieved, if no, what have been the hurdles? 7. Has the issues of Openness of the Internet been positively or negatively affected during these years and have governments become more aware and restricted the Openness? 8. The years 2007-2008 have witnessed a great deal of Internet Filtering, Censoring, Physical Harassment of Bloggers, Content Producers and Groups, have these issues been taken into account at the IGF with respect to the UN Universal Declaration on Human Rights? -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From goldstein_david at yahoo.com.au Tue Dec 16 06:40:42 2008 From: goldstein_david at yahoo.com.au (David Goldstein) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 03:40:42 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] =?UTF-8?Q?Editorial:_Mr._Obama=E2=80=99s_Internet_A?= =?UTF-8?Q?genda?= Message-ID: <584270.47024.qm@web54101.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi all, This New York Times editorial might be of interest. Cheers David Editorial: Mr. Obama’s Internet Agenda President-elect Barack Obama recently announced an ambitious plan to build up the nation’s Internet infrastructure as part of his proposed economic stimulus package. Upgrading the Internet is a particularly smart kind of stimulus, one that would spread knowledge, promote entrepreneurship and make this country more competitive globally. The United States has long been the world leader in technology, but when it comes to the Internet, it is fast falling behind. America now ranks 15th in the world in access to high-speed Internet connections. A cornerstone of Mr. Obama’s agenda is promoting universal, affordable high-speed Internet. http://nytimes.com/2008/12/16/opinion/16tue3.html --------- David Goldstein address: 4/3 Abbott Street COOGEE NSW 2034 AUSTRALIA email: Goldstein_David @yahoo.com.au phone: +61 418 228 605 (mobile); +61 2 9665 5773 (home) "Every time you use fossil fuels, you're adding to the problem. Every time you forgo fossil fuels, you're being part of the solution" - Dr Tim Flannery Start your day with Yahoo!7 and win a Sony Bravia TV. Enter now http://au.docs.yahoo.com/homepageset/?p1=other&p2=au&p3=tagline ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From nyangkweagien at gmail.com Tue Dec 16 07:35:51 2008 From: nyangkweagien at gmail.com (Nyangkwe Agien Aaron) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 13:35:51 +0100 Subject: [governance] =?WINDOWS-1252?Q?Editorial:_Mr._Obama=92s_Inter?= =?WINDOWS-1252?Q?net_Agenda?= In-Reply-To: <584270.47024.qm@web54101.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <584270.47024.qm@web54101.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi David Thank for the link when one considers this in the editorial: "Children trapped on the wrong side of the digital divide are deprived of a fair chance to educate themselves and to compete for high-skill, high-paying jobs". and: "Net neutrality laws are necessary to ensure that Internet service providers do not block content they disagree with or give financial breaks to big tech companies, squeezing out smaller competitors and stifling innovation". All the best Aaron On Tue, Dec 16, 2008 at 12:40 PM, David Goldstein < goldstein_david at yahoo.com.au> wrote: > Hi all, > > This New York Times editorial might be of interest. > > Cheers > David > > Editorial: Mr. Obama's Internet Agenda > President-elect Barack Obama recently announced an ambitious plan to build > up the nation's Internet infrastructure as part of his proposed economic > stimulus package. Upgrading the Internet is a particularly smart kind of > stimulus, one that would spread knowledge, promote entrepreneurship and make > this country more competitive globally. > > The United States has long been the world leader in technology, but when it > comes to the Internet, it is fast falling behind. America now ranks 15th in > the world in access to high-speed Internet connections. A cornerstone of Mr. > Obama's agenda is promoting universal, affordable high-speed Internet. > http://nytimes.com/2008/12/16/opinion/16tue3.html > > --------- > > > David Goldstein > address: 4/3 Abbott Street > COOGEE NSW 2034 > AUSTRALIA > email: Goldstein_David @yahoo.com.au > phone: +61 418 228 605 (mobile); +61 2 9665 5773 (home) > > > "Every time you use fossil fuels, you're adding to the problem. Every time > you forgo fossil fuels, you're being part of the solution" - Dr Tim Flannery > > > > Start your day with Yahoo!7 and win a Sony Bravia TV. Enter now > http://au.docs.yahoo.com/homepageset/?p1=other&p2=au&p3=tagline > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jam at jacquelinemorris.com Tue Dec 16 07:39:21 2008 From: jam at jacquelinemorris.com (Jacqueline A. Morris) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 08:39:21 -0400 Subject: [governance] IGF meeting, Geneva, 23-24 February 2009 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4947A179.3060706@jacquelinemorris.com> That's Carnival Monday and Tuesday! (Mardi Gras for the NOLA crowd) I guess Carnival isn't important in Geneva? Jacqueline Adam Peake wrote: > From the IGF website > > > > > Consultations open to all stakeholders will be held in Geneva on 23-24 > February. > > Two main items will be on the agenda: > > * Taking stock of the Hyderabad Meeting and suggest improvements for > the 2009 Meeting to be held in Sharm El Sheikh > > * Preparing the IGF Review process. > > Written contributions are welcome and will be posted on this Web site. > To facilitate the discussions, a questionnaire will be made available > in due course. > > - - - - > > On the first, it's time to suggest new themes, how to deal with old, > possible new formats, what worked well and less well in Hyderabad > (this may seem trivial, but please remember to say how much the lunch > was appreciated!) > > On themes, I hope some time will be given over to discussion from > national and regional IGF meetings. > > Nitin Desai's comments during the taking stock are well worth reading. > > On the second issue, the IGF review, Markus Kummer gave an outline of > the expected time line and some background of the review process > during the taking stock session in Hyderabad, he said: > > "The mandate is, shall we say, relatively clear. It has to be -- it > has to take place within five years of its creation. And this > generally assumed that the creation dates back to Tunis 2005. So the > Secretary-General will have to make a recommendation to member states, > as it is stated in the Tunis agenda, and make recommendations so that > a decision can be taken within these five years. > > This brings us to the General Assembly of 2009 -- 2010. Sorry. That > is two years from now. > > And in order to get there, we will have to get started soon. In order > for the General Assembly to take a decision, the report from the > Secretary-General needs to be ready in early 2010. It will then go to > the CSTD in May 2010, from there to ECOSOC in July 2010, and from > ECOSOC to the General Assembly, which then has the last word on > whether or not to continue the forum in December 2010. > > In other words, we will have to get started early next year, and we > will prepare that with a day set aside at the meetings in February. We > have the dates already for the open consultations. That is 23rd and > 24th of February. And one day of these two days will be set aside for > the discussion on how to prepare this review process. > > And, of course, we invite all stakeholders to post their ideas and > comments. And we'll post it on our Web site. And we will, as usual, > prepare a paper as an input into the discussions. > > The process will then be conducted on the basis of these discussions > in February and brought to fruition at the meeting in Egypt sometime > in late fall. And I am given to understand that our Egyptian hosts > may be able to announce us the dates later today. [15-18 November] > > But it is also, I think, understood and also not the desire of our > Egyptian hosts to turn the meeting in Egypt into an inward-looking > meeting where we discuss the future of the IGF. This will be one item > on the agenda of the meeting, like we have today, the taking stock and > the way forward. We would then discuss the review. > > But the actual review will have to take place at the meeting itself. > The mandate says the Secretary-General will have to consult -- > informal consultations with forum participants. And that can only be > the annual meeting of the IGF. > > So we will have to come to consensus in this area. We do say the IGF > is not a decision-making body. But we will have to find some way of > reaching a consensus on what will then go into the report of the > Secretary-General. But the final decision will be with the member > states in the various instances, CSTD, ECOSOC, and, finally, General > Assembly." > > > > Worth seeing the complete quote, then there shouldn't be any (many) > questions. > > Adam > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From goldstein_david at yahoo.com.au Tue Dec 16 07:41:58 2008 From: goldstein_david at yahoo.com.au (David Goldstein) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 04:41:58 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] IGF meeting, Geneva, 23-24 February 2009 References: <4947A179.3060706@jacquelinemorris.com> Message-ID: <317996.66711.qm@web54110.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Maybe not in Geneva, I'm not sure, but most definitely in Germany and Austria, at least... but it's a different celebration to what you are thinking of Jacqueline, and bloody good fun! David ----- Original Message ---- From: Jacqueline A. Morris To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Adam Peake Sent: Tuesday, 16 December, 2008 11:39:21 PM Subject: Re: [governance] IGF meeting, Geneva, 23-24 February 2009 That's Carnival Monday and Tuesday! (Mardi Gras for the NOLA crowd) I guess Carnival isn't important in Geneva? Jacqueline Adam Peake wrote: > From the IGF website > > > Consultations open to all stakeholders will be held in Geneva on 23-24 February. > > Two main items will be on the agenda: > > * Taking stock of the Hyderabad Meeting and suggest improvements for the 2009 Meeting to be held in Sharm El Sheikh > > * Preparing the IGF Review process. > > Written contributions are welcome and will be posted on this Web site. To facilitate the discussions, a questionnaire will be made available in due course. > > - - - - > > On the first, it's time to suggest new themes, how to deal with old, possible new formats, what worked well and less well in Hyderabad (this may seem trivial, but please remember to say how much the lunch was appreciated!) > > On themes, I hope some time will be given over to discussion from national and regional IGF meetings. > > Nitin Desai's comments during the taking stock are well worth reading. > > On the second issue, the IGF review, Markus Kummer gave an outline of the expected time line and some background of the review process during the taking stock session in Hyderabad, he said: > > "The mandate is, shall we say, relatively clear. It has to be -- it has to take place within five years of its creation. And this generally assumed that the creation dates back to Tunis 2005. So the Secretary-General will have to make a recommendation to member states, as it is stated in the Tunis agenda, and make recommendations so that a decision can be taken within these five years. > > This brings us to the General Assembly of 2009 -- 2010. Sorry. That is two years from now. > > And in order to get there, we will have to get started soon. In order for the General Assembly to take a decision, the report from the Secretary-General needs to be ready in early 2010. It will then go to the CSTD in May 2010, from there to ECOSOC in July 2010, and from ECOSOC to the General Assembly, which then has the last word on whether or not to continue the forum in December 2010. > > In other words, we will have to get started early next year, and we will prepare that with a day set aside at the meetings in February. We have the dates already for the open consultations. That is 23rd and 24th of February. And one day of these two days will be set aside for the discussion on how to prepare this review process. > > And, of course, we invite all stakeholders to post their ideas and comments. And we'll post it on our Web site. And we will, as usual, prepare a paper as an input into the discussions. > > The process will then be conducted on the basis of these discussions in February and brought to fruition at the meeting in Egypt sometime in late fall. And I am given to understand that our Egyptian hosts may be able to announce us the dates later today. [15-18 November] > > But it is also, I think, understood and also not the desire of our Egyptian hosts to turn the meeting in Egypt into an inward-looking meeting where we discuss the future of the IGF. This will be one item on the agenda of the meeting, like we have today, the taking stock and the way forward. We would then discuss the review. > > But the actual review will have to take place at the meeting itself. The mandate says the Secretary-General will have to consult -- informal consultations with forum participants. And that can only be the annual meeting of the IGF. > > So we will have to come to consensus in this area. We do say the IGF is not a decision-making body. But we will have to find some way of reaching a consensus on what will then go into the report of the Secretary-General. But the final decision will be with the member states in the various instances, CSTD, ECOSOC, and, finally, General Assembly." > > > > Worth seeing the complete quote, then there shouldn't be any (many) questions. > > Adam > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance Start your day with Yahoo!7 and win a Sony Bravia TV. Enter now http://au.docs.yahoo.com/homepageset/?p1=other&p2=au&p3=tagline ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From nyangkweagien at gmail.com Tue Dec 16 08:00:40 2008 From: nyangkweagien at gmail.com (Nyangkwe Agien Aaron) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 14:00:40 +0100 Subject: [governance] =?WINDOWS-1252?Q?Editorial:_Mr._Obama=92s_Inter?= =?WINDOWS-1252?Q?net_Agenda?= In-Reply-To: <584270.47024.qm@web54101.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <584270.47024.qm@web54101.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hi David Thank for the link when one considers this in the editorial: "Children trapped on the wrong side of the digital divide are deprived of a fair chance to educate themselves and to compete for high-skill, high-paying jobs". and: "Net neutrality laws are necessary to ensure that Internet service providers do not block content they disagree with or give financial breaks to big tech companies, squeezing out smaller competitors and stifling innovation". All the best Aaron On Tue, Dec 16, 2008 at 12:40 PM, David Goldstein < goldstein_david at yahoo.com.au> wrote: > Hi all, > > This New York Times editorial might be of interest. > > Cheers > David > > Editorial: Mr. Obama's Internet Agenda > President-elect Barack Obama recently announced an ambitious plan to build > up the nation's Internet infrastructure as part of his proposed economic > stimulus package. Upgrading the Internet is a particularly smart kind of > stimulus, one that would spread knowledge, promote entrepreneurship and make > this country more competitive globally. > > The United States has long been the world leader in technology, but when it > comes to the Internet, it is fast falling behind. America now ranks 15th in > the world in access to high-speed Internet connections. A cornerstone of Mr. > Obama's agenda is promoting universal, affordable high-speed Internet. > http://nytimes.com/2008/12/16/opinion/16tue3.html > > --------- > > > David Goldstein > address: 4/3 Abbott Street > COOGEE NSW 2034 > AUSTRALIA > email: Goldstein_David @yahoo.com.au > phone: +61 418 228 605 (mobile); +61 2 9665 5773 (home) > > > "Every time you use fossil fuels, you're adding to the problem. Every time > you forgo fossil fuels, you're being part of the solution" - Dr Tim Flannery > > > > Start your day with Yahoo!7 and win a Sony Bravia TV. Enter now > http://au.docs.yahoo.com/homepageset/?p1=other&p2=au&p3=tagline > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch Tue Dec 16 08:23:26 2008 From: william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch (William Drake) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 14:23:26 +0100 Subject: [governance] IGF meeting, Geneva, 23-24 February 2009 In-Reply-To: <4947A179.3060706@jacquelinemorris.com> References: <4947A179.3060706@jacquelinemorris.com> Message-ID: <82B6D736-2CE3-4338-A92A-3B0F3C694056@graduateinstitute.ch> Hi, It exists www.carnaval-geneve.ch but is near the bottom of the local festival calendar in terms of size etc. Might provide an amusing distraction after the usual CS+ dinner though. Bill On Dec 16, 2008, at 1:39 PM, Jacqueline A. Morris wrote: > That's Carnival Monday and Tuesday! (Mardi Gras for the NOLA crowd) > I guess Carnival isn't important in Geneva? > Jacqueline > Adam Peake wrote: >> From the IGF website > component/content/article/42-igf-meetings/313-taking-stock-of-the- >> hyderabad-meeting-preparing-the-igf-review-process > >> >> >> Consultations open to all stakeholders will be held in Geneva on >> 23-24 February. >> >> Two main items will be on the agenda: >> >> * Taking stock of the Hyderabad Meeting and suggest improvements >> for the 2009 Meeting to be held in Sharm El Sheikh >> >> * Preparing the IGF Review process. >> >> Written contributions are welcome and will be posted on this Web >> site. To facilitate the discussions, a questionnaire will be made >> available in due course. >> >> - - - - >> >> On the first, it's time to suggest new themes, how to deal with >> old, possible new formats, what worked well and less well in >> Hyderabad (this may seem trivial, but please remember to say how >> much the lunch was appreciated!) >> >> On themes, I hope some time will be given over to discussion from >> national and regional IGF meetings. >> >> Nitin Desai's comments during the taking stock are well worth >> reading. >> >> On the second issue, the IGF review, Markus Kummer gave an outline >> of the expected time line and some background of the review >> process during the taking stock session in Hyderabad, he said: >> >> "The mandate is, shall we say, relatively clear. It has to be -- >> it has to take place within five years of its creation. And this >> generally assumed that the creation dates back to Tunis 2005. So >> the Secretary-General will have to make a recommendation to member >> states, as it is stated in the Tunis agenda, and make >> recommendations so that a decision can be taken within these five >> years. >> >> This brings us to the General Assembly of 2009 -- 2010. Sorry. >> That is two years from now. >> >> And in order to get there, we will have to get started soon. In >> order for the General Assembly to take a decision, the report from >> the Secretary-General needs to be ready in early 2010. It will >> then go to the CSTD in May 2010, from there to ECOSOC in July >> 2010, and from ECOSOC to the General Assembly, which then has the >> last word on whether or not to continue the forum in December 2010. >> >> In other words, we will have to get started early next year, and >> we will prepare that with a day set aside at the meetings in >> February. We have the dates already for the open consultations. >> That is 23rd and 24th of February. And one day of these two days >> will be set aside for the discussion on how to prepare this review >> process. >> >> And, of course, we invite all stakeholders to post their ideas and >> comments. And we'll post it on our Web site. And we will, as >> usual, prepare a paper as an input into the discussions. >> >> The process will then be conducted on the basis of these >> discussions in February and brought to fruition at the meeting in >> Egypt sometime in late fall. And I am given to understand that >> our Egyptian hosts may be able to announce us the dates later >> today. [15-18 November] >> >> But it is also, I think, understood and also not the desire of our >> Egyptian hosts to turn the meeting in Egypt into an inward-looking >> meeting where we discuss the future of the IGF. This will be one >> item on the agenda of the meeting, like we have today, the taking >> stock and the way forward. We would then discuss the review. >> >> But the actual review will have to take place at the meeting >> itself. The mandate says the Secretary-General will have to >> consult -- informal consultations with forum participants. And >> that can only be the annual meeting of the IGF. >> >> So we will have to come to consensus in this area. We do say the >> IGF is not a decision-making body. But we will have to find some >> way of reaching a consensus on what will then go into the report >> of the Secretary-General. But the final decision will be with the >> member states in the various instances, CSTD, ECOSOC, and, >> finally, General Assembly." >> >> >> >> Worth seeing the complete quote, then there shouldn't be any >> (many) questions. >> >> Adam >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance *********************************************************** William J. Drake Senior Associate Centre for International Governance Graduate Institute of International and Development Studies Geneva, Switzerland william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch New book: Governing Global Electronic Networks, http://tinyurl.com/5mh9jj *********************************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Tue Dec 16 14:14:56 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 12:14:56 -0700 Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! Message-ID: <20081216121456.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.1c254db76d.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dannyyounger at yahoo.com Tue Dec 16 14:53:26 2008 From: dannyyounger at yahoo.com (Danny Younger) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 11:53:26 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! In-Reply-To: <20081216121456.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.1c254db76d.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <46955.71968.qm@web52211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> For an unbiased review of the "success" of .biz at the Atlantic Root Network see Ben Edelman's analysis at http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/archived_content/people/edelman/dotbiz/ An example: "As of November 15, 2000, only 5 registrants had registered any SLDs at all in ARNI's .BIZ TLD." --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Karl E. Peters wrote: > From: Karl E. Peters > Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 2:14 PM >
style="font-family:Verdana;color:#000000;font-size:10pt;"> style="background-color:rgb(102, 255, > 255);">
Quoted on and from the Governance > list:
"Net neutrality > laws are necessary to ensure that Internet service > providers do not > block content they disagree with or give financial breaks > to big tech > companies, squeezing out smaller competitors and stifling > innovation".

    > I must agree with the author of the above quote!!! style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">(And > may it begin at home, with ICANN!!!)
style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">
    > ICANN is the world's largest and grandest offender of > these very net neutrality ideals when it ignored (and > continues to ignore) the original plan that the > "alternate roots" would serve as a testbed for the > introduction of new TLDs into the "legacy root", > now administered by ICANN.  ICANN then goes with the > big spenders it hopes to gain benefit from in awarding > ".biz" away from its successful operator of that > day, the Atlantic Root Network. (There is more than adequate > proof of the existance of this .biz in carefully kept > archives, if anyone cares to challenge!) >
   
    > While ICANN may claim it was unaware of our .biz, surely > they heard of Leah Gallegos' testimony before the U.S. > Congress on the matter! Surely they knew they were creating > a monstrous internet naming collision by proposing a second > registry for the same TLD! They simply did not care, because > they were expecting big income from the new .biz just as > they expect and recieve from the carefully protected Network > Solutuions and a few other of their friends. Leah finally > curtailed the orgininal .biz in the interest of internet > stability, sacrificing her successful business for the > smooth operation of the very internet ICANN is charged with > protecting!

    Perhaps > ICANN lacked the technical ability to search the internet to > see what TLDs were already in operation when they went to > create new ones? Was it technical ignorance or simple > financial greed that led to that horrible precedent in > internet piracy? It had to be one or the other! Which was > it?

    Since the TLDA, > in conjuction with the Public-Root, is set to publish its > first TapRoot, a listing of all operational TLDs on any > root, anywhere in the world on practically zero budget, I > dare say it must have been pure greed alone. Had they put > out the question for existing TLDs, a chorus of > confirmations would have been returned. No nquestions would > have remained. Deals could have been struck with existing > TLD managers to include them in ICANN's root; but ICANN > never even asked.

    > ICANN wanted no proof for which to feel guilty. They just > wanted another revenue stream from someone who would owe > them a favor, and they got it. The Atlantic Root > Nework's TLDs were perfectly operational on at least one > root server system and often more than one (through > something called cooperation) and had style="font-weight:bold;">many > happy SLD holders through a perfectly functional Registry > system. The only difference: . . . we didn't owe them > anything, and were proving that what ICANN does is very > easily and cheaply duplicated. Such a model was dangerous to > the big money schemes that US Government nods kept allowing > ICANN to get away with, appearing to have some special > ability the rest of the world lacked to run an > internet. 

    Now > ICANN is pulling away from the US Government auspices > entirely and can be tried more easily for their offenses. > Perhaps the splintering of today's ICANN will finally > allow for true Net Neutrality after all these > years!

    Internet > governance will become a little more work and a little less > rubber-stamping, but the world will benefit greatly. We, the > TLDA stand ready to do our part to assist in the > transition.

Sincerely > yours,
Karl E. Peters, President
Top-Level > Domain Association, Inc.
USA  (912) 638-1638 >

P.S. I will make the first draft of the > TapRoot available on our webiste very soon and a copy may be > had by anyone requesting it at no charge, even ICANN! Write > me if you would like to see what is going on outside the > gates.
 >
____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Tue Dec 16 15:39:18 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 15:39:18 -0500 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu><701af9f70812160031gf19a71cid88a48e6cd59a830@mail.gmail.com> <8017791e0812160108u21d806b6k868c4990b1765564@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D32@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> I definitely support 'Open Internet' either as the overall headline or one of the main themes. Folks can debate what other words come before or after those 2... Lee -----Original Message----- From: kabani.asif at gmail.com on behalf of Kabani Sent: Tue 12/16/2008 4:08 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Fouad Bajwa Cc: Jeremy Malcolm; Jeanette Hofmann Subject: Re: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs Greetings, I agree with Jeremy & Fouad that we need now to focus on the open standards, open systems, open content, free and open source, open information sharing and open ICT governance and sustainable Development. With Best Regards Sincerely Asif Kabani Hon. Director, Governane and ICT Int. Sustainable Development Resource Centre Geneva 2008/12/16 Fouad Bajwa : > I second Jeremy on open standards, open systems, open content, free > and open source, open information sharing and open ICT governance and > ecosystems. I would also like to hand in myself for conducting a > workshop focused on these issues and would like to get together with > like minded people and develop a charter for such a workshop! > > > > > On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 4:02 PM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: >> On 11/12/2008, at 6:36 PM, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: >> >>> We should focus on the themes for the main session instead. For those who >>> didn't follow closely, this year's themes were: >>> >>> * Reaching the next billion; >>> * Promoting cyber-security and trust; >>> * Managing critical Internet resources; >>> * Taking stock and the way forward; >>> * Emerging issues - the Internet of tomorrow >>> >>> I heard several people saying that access related topics (reaching the >>> next billion) need a break as there is nothing new to discuss next year. Do >>> others agree? What are other topics we want to see discussed? In my view, >>> critical Internet resources should stay on the agenda. >> >> I am ambivalent about the continued focus on access, but openness should >> definitely return. This is a diverse theme that can encompass open >> standards, open content, open source, open information, open governance and >> more all of which have drifted out of focus for the main sessions (though >> better represented in workshops). >> >> -- >> JEREMY MALCOLM >> Project Coordinator >> CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE >> for Asia Pacific and the Middle East >> >> Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning >> voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we >> are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and >> empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit >> www.consumersinternational.org. >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > > > > -- > > Regards. > -------------------------- > Fouad Bajwa > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Tue Dec 16 16:00:26 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 14:00:26 -0700 Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! Message-ID: <20081216140026.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.062813dca2.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dannyyounger at yahoo.com Tue Dec 16 16:26:40 2008 From: dannyyounger at yahoo.com (Danny Younger) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 13:26:40 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! In-Reply-To: <20081216140026.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.062813dca2.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <951717.38926.qm@web52211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Karl, You have an interest in promoting a useless product (alt. root TLDs) that can't be found by the common Internet user utilizing any of the standard search engines. As a businessman, you are pushing what amounts to defective merchandise. OK. I get that. Your motive is clear. Good luck with your endeavor. --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Karl E. Peters wrote: > From: Karl E. Peters > Subject: RE: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Danny Younger" > Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 4:00 PM > Mr. Younger, > As of the first month of .com, it is unlikely it made > its full complement either! For a real record of the > ultimate success of the original .biz, contact Leah Gallegos > at jandl at jandl.com and ask her to release her final numbers. > I don't think it was more than a few thousand, but that > was more than enough to sustain the business model as > profitable. That it made less with no publicity than the new > one did for ICANN justify its theft? Does that not make you > wonder how much money is wasted in running the ICANN root, > when she was making money at that level? > Furthermore, does it justify creating colliders in the > internet without even discussing the possibility of a > peaceful negotiated settlement before awarding what they did > not own to someone who promised them a good return and paid > ridiculous fees just to get it? Your argument is a good try, > but falls flat on the underlying problem of net neutrality > as it relates to ICANN. > > -Karl E. Peters, President > Top Level Domain Association, Inc. > > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a > hope! > From: Danny Younger > Date: Tue, December 16, 2008 2:53 pm > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > For an unbiased review of the "success" of .biz > at the Atlantic Root Network see Ben Edelman's analysis > at > http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/archived_content/people/edelman/dotbiz/ > > An example: "As of November 15, 2000, only 5 > registrants had registered any SLDs at all in ARNI's > .BIZ TLD." > > > --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Karl E. Peters > wrote: > > > From: Karl E. Peters > > Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a > hope! > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 2:14 PM > >
> > style="font-family:Verdana;color:#000000;font-size:10pt;"> > style="background-color:rgb(102, 255, > > 255);">
Quoted on and from the > Governance > > list:
"Net neutrality > > laws are necessary to ensure that Internet service > > providers do not > > block content they disagree with or give financial > breaks > > to big tech > > companies, squeezing out smaller competitors and > stifling > > innovation".

> > I must agree with the author of the above quote!!! > > > style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">(And > > may it begin at home, with > ICANN!!!)
> > style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">
> > > ICANN is the world's largest and grandest > offender of > > these very net neutrality ideals when it ignored (and > > continues to ignore) the original plan that the > > "alternate roots" would serve as a testbed > for the > > introduction of new TLDs into the "legacy > root", > > now administered by ICANN. ICANN then goes with the > > big spenders it hopes to gain benefit from in > awarding > > ".biz" away from its successful operator of > that > > day, the Atlantic Root Network. (There is more than > adequate > > proof of the existance of this .biz in carefully kept > > archives, if anyone cares to challenge!) > >

> > While ICANN may claim it was unaware of our .biz, > surely > > they heard of Leah Gallegos' testimony before the > U.S. > > Congress on the matter! Surely they knew they were > creating > > a monstrous internet naming collision by proposing a > second > > registry for the same TLD! They simply did not care, > because > > they were expecting big income from the new .biz just > as > > they expect and recieve from the carefully protected > Network > > Solutuions and a few other of their friends. Leah > finally > > curtailed the orgininal .biz in the interest of > internet > > stability, sacrificing her successful business for > the > > smooth operation of the very internet ICANN is > charged with > > protecting!

Perhaps > > ICANN lacked the technical ability to search the > internet to > > see what TLDs were already in operation when they > went to > > create new ones? Was it technical ignorance or simple > > financial greed that led to that horrible precedent > in > > internet piracy? It had to be one or the other! Which > was > > it?

Since the TLDA, > > in conjuction with the Public-Root, is set to publish > its > > first TapRoot, a listing of all operational TLDs on > any > > root, anywhere in the world on practically zero > budget, I > > dare say it must have been pure greed alone. Had they > put > > out the question for existing TLDs, a chorus of > > confirmations would have been returned. No nquestions > would > > have remained. Deals could have been struck with > existing > > TLD managers to include them in ICANN's root; but > ICANN > > never even asked.

> > ICANN wanted no proof for which to feel guilty. They > just > > wanted another revenue stream from someone who would > owe > > them a favor, and they got it. The Atlantic Root > > Nework's TLDs were perfectly operational on at > least one > > root server system and often more than one (through > > something called cooperation) and had > > style="font-weight:bold;">many > > happy SLD holders through a perfectly functional > Registry > > system. The only difference: . . . we didn't owe > them > > anything, and were proving that what ICANN does is > very > > easily and cheaply duplicated. Such a model was > dangerous to > > the big money schemes that US Government nods kept > allowing > > ICANN to get away with, appearing to have some > special > > ability the rest of the world lacked to run an > > internet.

Now > > ICANN is pulling away from the US Government auspices > > entirely and can be tried more easily for their > offenses. > > Perhaps the splintering of today's ICANN will > finally > > allow for true Net Neutrality after all these > > years!

Internet > > governance will become a little more work and a > little less > > rubber-stamping, but the world will benefit greatly. > We, the > > TLDA stand ready to do our part to assist in the > > transition.

Sincerely > > yours,
Karl E. Peters, > President
Top-Level > > Domain Association, Inc.
USA (912) 638-1638 > >

P.S. I will make the first draft > of the > > TapRoot available on our webiste very soon and a copy > may be > > had by anyone requesting it at no charge, even ICANN! > Write > > me if you would like to see what is going on outside > the > > gates.
 > > >
____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the > list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Tue Dec 16 16:41:44 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 14:41:44 -0700 Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! Message-ID: <20081216144144.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.025d629627.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Tue Dec 16 19:09:17 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (JFC Morfin) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 01:09:17 +0100 Subject: [governance] Themes for the coming IGFs In-Reply-To: References: <4940ED17.8010706@wzb.eu> <4940FC6C.3040603@zedat.fu-berlin.de> <4940FF9C.1090509@wzb.eu> <49411036.5040006@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <20081217000918.36FAAA6CCB@smtp2.electricembers.net> Dear Meryem, Jeannette, the main question is not so much what to debate, but what the goal. As long as there is no intent for the debate to result into something concrete. As long as there is no intent to conduct it to obtain a concrete result, I am afraid this is just organizing the next Top Hotel yearly virtual sitting in Cairo, after Athens, Rio, Hyderabad. Another Net-Set event to make us waste the money and time we could have used more "dangerously" for the "Intermonet" stability. With the budget of the CS Hyderabad attendees we could have designed a new FLOSS Internet technology many of us (the real users of the digital ecosystem) could have benefited from. If the IGF is not a place for lobbies (dynamic coalitions) to forge (or meet with) governing operatives (enhanced cooperations) it will stay a yearly school for politician ignorami and a fashionable activist melting place. I am sorry but only Cairo Net-BBQ participants are concerned by this thread. Where in all this are the users, the consumers, the people. Now, what is of interest are the areas of responsibility to be covered by the enhanced cooperations (if any) that will be formed in Cairo; their concrete targets, their organization, their budget, their constitutive document to be signed by their regalian, private, civil, international and technical working and authoritative partners; the level of mutual involvement permitted to these participants. Why to debate points most of us have not the slightest capacity to influence? The true question is what experience, expertise, authority, or representativeness can some of us put on the table that might be of real use to others when organizing concrete actions/lobbying/cooperations. IGF is not a place for collective decisions to be voted, but for collective decisions to be imagined, activated, and embodied. I must say I am dismayed that we discuss of "themes", without having organised among ourselves, in three years, any professional Observatory and Think-Tank on these themes, so we could report and propose concrete projects we could lobby for, or act upon. I can only fear (infer?) that the Civil Society has been trapped at the IGF in much the same way as @larges have been by ALAC? jfc At 14:44 11/12/2008, Meryem Marzouki wrote: >Le 11 déc. 08 à 14:05, Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : >>I fully agree. While professional broadcasters are good at keeping >>the crowd entertained, the usually lack the sense for the political >>assues at hand. Moreover, they don't want to achieve anything. > >It's the IGF itself that is refusing any tangible outcome. > >>The discussion on security seemed to me a debate for the sake of >>debating. > >Is there any other purpose a "conversation" could have? A debate, >even non conclusive, is not necessarily a waste of time, this is not >my point, but one has to acknowledge that the IGF, in its current >form, can't lead to anything else than a debate. >Meryem ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Tue Dec 16 21:27:42 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 13:27:42 +1100 Subject: [governance] Thank you to Parminder Message-ID: Everyone, In a few days we will have a new Co-coordinator to congratulate. Please don't forget to vote! All of which means that this is the last few days of Parminder's term as Co-coordinator. I have had the please of working with Parminder in this role over the last six months, and in working closely with him over this period got to appreciate what a splendid job he has done for our Caucus. Parminder has had a huge commitment to openness and transparency. He had worked very hard to help the Caucus to adopt consensual positions on policy matters. He has shown a great policy mind, a firm commitment to civil society and its advancement, and a lot of strength in dealing with difficult issues. I said a few words along these lines in Hyderabad for those who were present, but I do want to mark this milestone by thanking Parminder for his commitment to IGC. I am glad he is remaining involved and look forward to working with him in the future. All the best, Parminder, and thank you very much! Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Tue Dec 16 23:47:38 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 10:17:38 +0530 Subject: [governance] Thank you to Parminder In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20081217044745.AAD00678B0@smtp1.electricembers.net> Thanks Ian. That was generous. But we know you are always the gentleman :-) Look forward to working under your leadership and guidance. Best wishes. Parminder _____ From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 7:58 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Cc: 'Parminder' Subject: [governance] Thank you to Parminder Everyone, In a few days we will have a new Co-coordinator to congratulate. Please don't forget to vote! All of which means that this is the last few days of Parminder's term as Co-coordinator. I have had the please of working with Parminder in this role over the last six months, and in working closely with him over this period got to appreciate what a splendid job he has done for our Caucus. Parminder has had a huge commitment to openness and transparency. He had worked very hard to help the Caucus to adopt consensual positions on policy matters. He has shown a great policy mind, a firm commitment to civil society and its advancement, and a lot of strength in dealing with difficult issues. I said a few words along these lines in Hyderabad for those who were present, but I do want to mark this milestone by thanking Parminder for his commitment to IGC. I am glad he is remaining involved and look forward to working with him in the future. All the best, Parminder, and thank you very much! Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From asif at kabani.co.uk Wed Dec 17 12:48:17 2008 From: asif at kabani.co.uk (Kabani) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 22:48:17 +0500 Subject: [governance] Re: 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8017791e0812170948i7f5ab0a7k1911e78a199ca18f@mail.gmail.com> Greetings Friends Thanks for the voting me as new Coordinator, I am promise I will do my level best. With Best Regards Sincerely Asif Kabani 2008/12/14 Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn : > Dear IGC List Participant, > > This email invites you to consider voting in the elections for the new co-coordinator for the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (IGC). > > In order to vote, as per the conditions of the IGC's charter, you must specify that you subscribe to the IGC charter and thus accept/ affirm IGC membership (see http://www.igcaucus.org/charter). This can be done on the webpage that opens when you click the following link: > > http://websurvey.syr.edu//Survey.aspx?i=781f46a2f3194434b3c1a027a7f3d6e6 > > A positive response to the question will take you to the ballot where you can tick/check the candidate for whom you choose to vote. There is a link to background information supplied by the candidates on the ballot paper. > > After you have voted, you will then be taken to a page that confirms your vote has been registered. While at this page you may still go back and change your vote. However, after you click on "Finish" on the final page, your vote will be final and cannot be changed. > > You may cast your vote anytime upon receipt of this message, until 24h00 GMT on Sunday, 21 December 2008. > > We strongly encourage you to cast your vote as a sign of active engagement with the caucus. Although, voting is not compulsory for retaining membership if you are already on the IGC members list (please see this list at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/12/%253Cbr%2520/%253E), as per the charter you must vote in this election to be eligible to vote in any charter amendment process that may come up before the next election. You may choose to vote "None of the Above" on the ballot paper to maintain voting eligibility if you do not favour any of the candidates. > > You may seek any clarification by replying to this email. > > Thanks > > Ian Peter > Co-coordinator IGC > > and > > Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn > Associate Professor > Director, Cotelco > Syracuse University > > PS: Please do not vote with more than one email ID. If you receive this message more than once, please use only one of them and inform us about the multiple IDs by replying to this email. -- Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dcogburn at syr.edu Wed Dec 17 13:10:07 2008 From: dcogburn at syr.edu (Derrick L. Cogburn) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 13:10:07 -0500 Subject: [governance] Re: 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot In-Reply-To: <8017791e0812170948i7f5ab0a7k1911e78a199ca18f@mail.gmail.com> References: <8017791e0812170948i7f5ab0a7k1911e78a199ca18f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <9F5F3BAB-EA83-42E2-80F8-1F8021B6575F@syr.edu> Dear Asif, Thank you for your note. However, because your message may be misunderstood by the membership, I wanted to quickly clarify a couple of things. First, the election is obviously still ongoing, and as stated will not end until 24h00 on Sunday. Second, no information about the status of the elections has been released to anyone, except a regular update on the number of votes casts to Ian. We wish all of the candidates the best of luck in the remainder of the elections. Regards, Derrick Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn Syracuse University http://cotelco.syr.edu On Dec 17, 2008, at 12:48 PM, Kabani wrote: > Greetings Friends > > > Thanks for the voting me as new Coordinator, I am promise I will do my > level best. > > > With Best Regards > > > Sincerely > > > > Asif Kabani > > > 2008/12/14 Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn : >> Dear IGC List Participant, >> >> This email invites you to consider voting in the elections for the >> new co-coordinator for the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus >> (IGC). >> >> In order to vote, as per the conditions of the IGC's charter, you >> must specify that you subscribe to the IGC charter and thus accept/ >> affirm IGC membership (see http://www.igcaucus.org/charter). This >> can be done on the webpage that opens when you click the following >> link: >> >> http://websurvey.syr.edu//Survey.aspx?i=781f46a2f3194434b3c1a027a7f3d6e6 >> >> A positive response to the question will take you to the ballot >> where you can tick/check the candidate for whom you choose to >> vote. There is a link to background information supplied by the >> candidates on the ballot paper. >> >> After you have voted, you will then be taken to a page that >> confirms your vote has been registered. While at this page you may >> still go back and change your vote. However, after you click on >> "Finish" on the final page, your vote will be final and cannot be >> changed. >> >> You may cast your vote anytime upon receipt of this message, until >> 24h00 GMT on Sunday, 21 December 2008. >> >> We strongly encourage you to cast your vote as a sign of active >> engagement with the caucus. Although, voting is not compulsory for >> retaining membership if you are already on the IGC members list >> (please see this list at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/12/%253Cbr%2520/%253E) >> , as per the charter you must vote in this election to be eligible >> to vote in any charter amendment process that may come up before >> the next election. You may choose to vote "None of the Above" on >> the ballot paper to maintain voting eligibility if you do not >> favour any of the candidates. >> >> You may seek any clarification by replying to this email. >> >> Thanks >> >> Ian Peter >> Co-coordinator IGC >> >> and >> >> Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn >> Associate Professor >> Director, Cotelco >> Syracuse University >> >> PS: Please do not vote with more than one email ID. If you receive >> this message more than once, please use only one of them and inform >> us about the multiple IDs by replying to this email. > > > > -- > Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Wed Dec 17 13:16:12 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 05:16:12 +1100 Subject: [governance] Re: 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot In-Reply-To: <9F5F3BAB-EA83-42E2-80F8-1F8021B6575F@syr.edu> Message-ID: And further clarification - my updates from Derrick are on total number of votes cast, not votes cast for any candidate. So no-one knows the result or the progressive candidate tallies at this stage. I can see how Asif Kabani's message could be wrongly interpreted, and stress that this is one of the candidates asking you to vote for him, not some premature declaration of the election result. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Derrick L. Cogburn [mailto:dcogburn at syr.edu] > Sent: 18 December 2008 05:10 > To: Kabani > Cc: Ian Peter; governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: [governance] Re: 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot > > Dear Asif, > > Thank you for your note. However, because your message may be > misunderstood by the membership, I wanted to quickly clarify a couple > of things. First, the election is obviously still ongoing, and as > stated will not end until 24h00 on Sunday. Second, no information > about the status of the elections has been released to anyone, except > a regular update on the number of votes casts to Ian. > > We wish all of the candidates the best of luck in the remainder of the > elections. > > Regards, > Derrick > > Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn > Syracuse University > http://cotelco.syr.edu > > On Dec 17, 2008, at 12:48 PM, Kabani wrote: > > > Greetings Friends > > > > > > Thanks for the voting me as new Coordinator, I am promise I will do my > > level best. > > > > > > With Best Regards > > > > > > Sincerely > > > > > > > > Asif Kabani > > > > > > 2008/12/14 Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn : > >> Dear IGC List Participant, > >> > >> This email invites you to consider voting in the elections for the > >> new co-coordinator for the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus > >> (IGC). > >> > >> In order to vote, as per the conditions of the IGC's charter, you > >> must specify that you subscribe to the IGC charter and thus accept/ > >> affirm IGC membership (see http://www.igcaucus.org/charter). This > >> can be done on the webpage that opens when you click the following > >> link: > >> > >> > http://websurvey.syr.edu//Survey.aspx?i=781f46a2f3194434b3c1a027a7f3d6e6 > >> > >> A positive response to the question will take you to the ballot > >> where you can tick/check the candidate for whom you choose to > >> vote. There is a link to background information supplied by the > >> candidates on the ballot paper. > >> > >> After you have voted, you will then be taken to a page that > >> confirms your vote has been registered. While at this page you may > >> still go back and change your vote. However, after you click on > >> "Finish" on the final page, your vote will be final and cannot be > >> changed. > >> > >> You may cast your vote anytime upon receipt of this message, until > >> 24h00 GMT on Sunday, 21 December 2008. > >> > >> We strongly encourage you to cast your vote as a sign of active > >> engagement with the caucus. Although, voting is not compulsory for > >> retaining membership if you are already on the IGC members list > >> (please see this list at > http://www.igcaucus.org/node/12/%253Cbr%2520/%253E) > >> , as per the charter you must vote in this election to be eligible > >> to vote in any charter amendment process that may come up before > >> the next election. You may choose to vote "None of the Above" on > >> the ballot paper to maintain voting eligibility if you do not > >> favour any of the candidates. > >> > >> You may seek any clarification by replying to this email. > >> > >> Thanks > >> > >> Ian Peter > >> Co-coordinator IGC > >> > >> and > >> > >> Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn > >> Associate Professor > >> Director, Cotelco > >> Syracuse University > >> > >> PS: Please do not vote with more than one email ID. If you receive > >> this message more than once, please use only one of them and inform > >> us about the multiple IDs by replying to this email. > > > > > > > > -- > > Visit: www.kabani.co.uk > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From peter at peter-dambier.de Wed Dec 17 07:14:32 2008 From: peter at peter-dambier.de (Peter Dambier) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 13:14:32 +0100 Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! In-Reply-To: <951717.38926.qm@web52211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <951717.38926.qm@web52211.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4948ED28.3060003@peter-dambier.de> Hello Danny, whout root do you suggest? My clients need the "XN--55QX5D", "XN--FIQS8S" and "XN--IO0A7I" TLDs because they don't know the us-subset of the the roman letters. Apropos Karl does not sell a root - so what is he selling that is broken? On the other hand I have seen that the californian golf club - a nonprofit? is making a lot of money. Whom do they obey? Whom do they pay taxes? At least the "XN--55QX5D", "XN--FIQS8S" and "XN--IO0A7I" are run by a government you can predict and they do talk to the ITU. Kind regards Peter Danny Younger wrote: > Karl, > > You have an interest in promoting a useless product (alt. root TLDs) that can't be found by the common Internet user utilizing any of the standard search engines. As a businessman, you are pushing what amounts to defective merchandise. OK. I get that. Your motive is clear. Good luck with your endeavor. > > > > --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Karl E. Peters wrote: > >> From: Karl E. Peters >> Subject: RE: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Danny Younger" >> Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 4:00 PM >> Mr. Younger, >> As of the first month of .com, it is unlikely it made >> its full complement either! For a real record of the >> ultimate success of the original .biz, contact Leah Gallegos >> at jandl at jandl.com and ask her to release her final numbers. >> I don't think it was more than a few thousand, but that >> was more than enough to sustain the business model as >> profitable. That it made less with no publicity than the new >> one did for ICANN justify its theft? Does that not make you >> wonder how much money is wasted in running the ICANN root, >> when she was making money at that level? >> Furthermore, does it justify creating colliders in the >> internet without even discussing the possibility of a >> peaceful negotiated settlement before awarding what they did >> not own to someone who promised them a good return and paid >> ridiculous fees just to get it? Your argument is a good try, >> but falls flat on the underlying problem of net neutrality >> as it relates to ICANN. >> >> -Karl E. Peters, President >> Top Level Domain Association, Inc. >> >> >> -------- Original Message -------- >> Subject: Re: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a >> hope! >> From: Danny Younger >> Date: Tue, December 16, 2008 2:53 pm >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For an unbiased review of the "success" of .biz >> at the Atlantic Root Network see Ben Edelman's analysis >> at >> http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/archived_content/people/edelman/dotbiz/ >> >> An example: "As of November 15, 2000, only 5 >> registrants had registered any SLDs at all in ARNI's >> .BIZ TLD." >> >> >> --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Karl E. Peters >> wrote: >> >> > From: Karl E. Peters >> > Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a >> hope! >> > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 2:14 PM >> >
> > >> style="font-family:Verdana;color:#000000;font-size:10pt;">> > style="background-color:rgb(102, 255, >> > 255);">
Quoted on and from the >> Governance >> > list:
"Net neutrality >> > laws are necessary to ensure that Internet service >> > providers do not >> > block content they disagree with or give financial >> breaks >> > to big tech >> > companies, squeezing out smaller competitors and >> stifling >> > innovation".

>> > I must agree with the author of the above quote!!! >> > > >> style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">(And >> > may it begin at home, with >> ICANN!!!)
> > >> style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">
>> >> > ICANN is the world's largest and grandest >> offender of >> > these very net neutrality ideals when it ignored (and >> > continues to ignore) the original plan that the >> > "alternate roots" would serve as a testbed >> for the >> > introduction of new TLDs into the "legacy >> root", >> > now administered by ICANN. ICANN then goes with the >> > big spenders it hopes to gain benefit from in >> awarding >> > ".biz" away from its successful operator of >> that >> > day, the Atlantic Root Network. (There is more than >> adequate >> > proof of the existance of this .biz in carefully kept >> > archives, if anyone cares to challenge!) >> >

>> > While ICANN may claim it was unaware of our .biz, >> surely >> > they heard of Leah Gallegos' testimony before the >> U.S. >> > Congress on the matter! Surely they knew they were >> creating >> > a monstrous internet naming collision by proposing a >> second >> > registry for the same TLD! They simply did not care, >> because >> > they were expecting big income from the new .biz just >> as >> > they expect and recieve from the carefully protected >> Network >> > Solutuions and a few other of their friends. Leah >> finally >> > curtailed the orgininal .biz in the interest of >> internet >> > stability, sacrificing her successful business for >> the >> > smooth operation of the very internet ICANN is >> charged with >> > protecting!

Perhaps >> > ICANN lacked the technical ability to search the >> internet to >> > see what TLDs were already in operation when they >> went to >> > create new ones? Was it technical ignorance or simple >> > financial greed that led to that horrible precedent >> in >> > internet piracy? It had to be one or the other! Which >> was >> > it?

Since the TLDA, >> > in conjuction with the Public-Root, is set to publish >> its >> > first TapRoot, a listing of all operational TLDs on >> any >> > root, anywhere in the world on practically zero >> budget, I >> > dare say it must have been pure greed alone. Had they >> put >> > out the question for existing TLDs, a chorus of >> > confirmations would have been returned. No nquestions >> would >> > have remained. Deals could have been struck with >> existing >> > TLD managers to include them in ICANN's root; but >> ICANN >> > never even asked.

>> > ICANN wanted no proof for which to feel guilty. They >> just >> > wanted another revenue stream from someone who would >> owe >> > them a favor, and they got it. The Atlantic Root >> > Nework's TLDs were perfectly operational on at >> least one >> > root server system and often more than one (through >> > something called cooperation) and had > > >> style="font-weight:bold;">many >> > happy SLD holders through a perfectly functional >> Registry >> > system. The only difference: . . . we didn't owe >> them >> > anything, and were proving that what ICANN does is >> very >> > easily and cheaply duplicated. Such a model was >> dangerous to >> > the big money schemes that US Government nods kept >> allowing >> > ICANN to get away with, appearing to have some >> special >> > ability the rest of the world lacked to run an >> > internet.

Now >> > ICANN is pulling away from the US Government auspices >> > entirely and can be tried more easily for their >> offenses. >> > Perhaps the splintering of today's ICANN will >> finally >> > allow for true Net Neutrality after all these >> > years!

Internet >> > governance will become a little more work and a >> little less >> > rubber-stamping, but the world will benefit greatly. >> We, the >> > TLDA stand ready to do our part to assist in the >> > transition.

Sincerely >> > yours,
Karl E. Peters, >> President
Top-Level >> > Domain Association, Inc.
USA (912) 638-1638 >> >

P.S. I will make the first draft >> of the >> > TapRoot available on our webiste very soon and a copy >> may be >> > had by anyone requesting it at no charge, even ICANN! >> Write >> > me if you would like to see what is going on outside >> the >> > gates.
 >> > >>
____________________________________________________________ >> > You received this message as a subscriber on the >> list: >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > >> > For all list information and functions, see: >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -- Peter and Karin Dambier Cesidian Root - Radice Cesidiana Rimbacher Strasse 16 D-69509 Moerlenbach-Bonsweiher +49(6209)795-816 (Telekom) +49(6252)750-308 (VoIP: sipgate.de) mail: peter at peter-dambier.de http://www.peter-dambier.de/ http://iason.site.voila.fr/ https://sourceforge.net/projects/iason/ ULA= fd80:4ce1:c66a::/48 ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dannyyounger at yahoo.com Wed Dec 17 20:18:15 2008 From: dannyyounger at yahoo.com (Danny Younger) Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 17:18:15 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! In-Reply-To: <4948ED28.3060003@peter-dambier.de> Message-ID: <53856.10276.qm@web52208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hello Peter, I wouldn't have such a problem with alt roots if they could actually be readily found by the bulk of the populace. That said, the adage "different strokes for different folks" would seem to be appropriate. Most of the world tends to prefer TLDs that are actually visible to most of the world (which is not the case for the vast bulk of alt.root TLDs)... but apparently you and your clients have a different set of preferences (which is OK; after all, it is a big world). Yes, the non-ASCII needs that you have highlighted admittedly have not yet been fully accommodated by the legacy root, but I suspect that given the planned upcoming rollout of IDN ccTLDs and IDN gTLDs, this too will change in the near term... and when they are added to the Root, my guess is that we will indeed be able to use the Search Engines to find content in those IDN TLDs (while we still won't be able to search for content within the TLDs managed by the alternate root community). In the long run the legacy root will offer the world the utility that its citizens will require; I don't see other root communities as being able to make the same claim, but that's just my view. best regards, Danny --- On Wed, 12/17/08, Peter Dambier wrote: > From: Peter Dambier > Subject: Re: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Date: Wednesday, December 17, 2008, 7:14 AM > Hello Danny, > > whout root do you suggest? > > My clients need the "XN--55QX5D", > "XN--FIQS8S" and "XN--IO0A7I" TLDs > because they don't know the us-subset of the the roman > letters. > > Apropos Karl does not sell a root - so what is he selling > that is broken? > > On the other hand I have seen that the californian golf > club - a nonprofit? > is making a lot of money. Whom do they obey? Whom do they > pay taxes? > > At least the "XN--55QX5D", "XN--FIQS8S" > and "XN--IO0A7I" are run by a > government you can predict and they do talk to the ITU. > > Kind regards > Peter > > > Danny Younger wrote: > > Karl, > > > > You have an interest in promoting a useless product > (alt. root TLDs) that can't be found by the common > Internet user utilizing any of the standard search engines. > As a businessman, you are pushing what amounts to defective > merchandise. OK. I get that. Your motive is clear. Good > luck with your endeavor. > > > > > > > > --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Karl E. Peters > wrote: > > > >> From: Karl E. Peters > >> Subject: RE: [governance] REAL net neutrality in > now a hope! > >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Danny > Younger" > >> Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 4:00 PM > >> Mr. Younger, > >> As of the first month of .com, it is unlikely > it made > >> its full complement either! For a real record of > the > >> ultimate success of the original .biz, contact > Leah Gallegos > >> at jandl at jandl.com and ask her to release her > final numbers. > >> I don't think it was more than a few thousand, > but that > >> was more than enough to sustain the business model > as > >> profitable. That it made less with no publicity > than the new > >> one did for ICANN justify its theft? Does that not > make you > >> wonder how much money is wasted in running the > ICANN root, > >> when she was making money at that level? > >> Furthermore, does it justify creating > colliders in the > >> internet without even discussing the possibility > of a > >> peaceful negotiated settlement before awarding > what they did > >> not own to someone who promised them a good return > and paid > >> ridiculous fees just to get it? Your argument is a > good try, > >> but falls flat on the underlying problem of net > neutrality > >> as it relates to ICANN. > >> > >> -Karl E. Peters, President > >> Top Level Domain Association, Inc. > >> > >> > >> -------- Original Message -------- > >> Subject: Re: [governance] REAL net neutrality in > now a > >> hope! > >> From: Danny Younger > > >> Date: Tue, December 16, 2008 2:53 pm > >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> > >> For an unbiased review of the "success" > of .biz > >> at the Atlantic Root Network see Ben Edelman's > analysis > >> at > >> > http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/archived_content/people/edelman/dotbiz/ > >> > >> An example: "As of November 15, 2000, only 5 > >> registrants had registered any SLDs at all in > ARNI's > >> .BIZ TLD." > >> > >> > >> --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Karl E. Peters > >> wrote: > >> > >> > From: Karl E. Peters > > >> > Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in > now a > >> hope! > >> > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> > Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 2:14 PM > >> >
id=yiv1801668660> >> > > >> > style="font-family:Verdana;color:#000000;font-size:10pt;"> >> > style="background-color:rgb(102, 255, > >> > 255);">
Quoted on and from > the > >> Governance > >> > list:
"Net neutrality > >> > laws are necessary to ensure that Internet > service > >> > providers do not > >> > block content they disagree with or give > financial > >> breaks > >> > to big tech > >> > companies, squeezing out smaller competitors > and > >> stifling > >> > > innovation".

> >> > I must agree with the author of the above > quote!!! > >> >> > > >> > style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">(And > >> > may it begin at home, with > >> ICANN!!!)
>> > > >> > style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">
> >> > >> > ICANN is the world's largest and > grandest > >> offender of > >> > these very net neutrality ideals when it > ignored (and > >> > continues to ignore) the original plan that > the > >> > "alternate roots" would serve as a > testbed > >> for the > >> > introduction of new TLDs into the > "legacy > >> root", > >> > now administered by ICANN. ICANN then goes > with the > >> > big spenders it hopes to gain benefit from > in > >> awarding > >> > ".biz" away from its successful > operator of > >> that > >> > day, the Atlantic Root Network. (There is > more than > >> adequate > >> > proof of the existance of this .biz in > carefully kept > >> > archives, if anyone cares to challenge!) > >> >

> >> > While ICANN may claim it was unaware of our > .biz, > >> surely > >> > they heard of Leah Gallegos' testimony > before the > >> U.S. > >> > Congress on the matter! Surely they knew > they were > >> creating > >> > a monstrous internet naming collision by > proposing a > >> second > >> > registry for the same TLD! They simply did > not care, > >> because > >> > they were expecting big income from the new > .biz just > >> as > >> > they expect and recieve from the carefully > protected > >> Network > >> > Solutuions and a few other of their friends. > Leah > >> finally > >> > curtailed the orgininal .biz in the interest > of > >> internet > >> > stability, sacrificing her successful > business for > >> the > >> > smooth operation of the very internet ICANN > is > >> charged with > >> > protecting!

Perhaps > >> > ICANN lacked the technical ability to search > the > >> internet to > >> > see what TLDs were already in operation when > they > >> went to > >> > create new ones? Was it technical ignorance > or simple > >> > financial greed that led to that horrible > precedent > >> in > >> > internet piracy? It had to be one or the > other! Which > >> was > >> > it?

Since the TLDA, > >> > in conjuction with the Public-Root, is set > to publish > >> its > >> > first TapRoot, a listing of all operational > TLDs on > >> any > >> > root, anywhere in the world on practically > zero > >> budget, I > >> > dare say it must have been pure greed alone. > Had they > >> put > >> > out the question for existing TLDs, a chorus > of > >> > confirmations would have been returned. No > nquestions > >> would > >> > have remained. Deals could have been struck > with > >> existing > >> > TLD managers to include them in ICANN's > root; but > >> ICANN > >> > never even asked.

> >> > ICANN wanted no proof for which to feel > guilty. They > >> just > >> > wanted another revenue stream from someone > who would > >> owe > >> > them a favor, and they got it. The Atlantic > Root > >> > Nework's TLDs were perfectly operational > on at > >> least one > >> > root server system and often more than one > (through > >> > something called cooperation) and had > >> > > >> > style="font-weight:bold;">many > >> > happy SLD holders through a perfectly > functional > >> Registry > >> > system. The only difference: . . . we > didn't owe > >> them > >> > anything, and were proving that what ICANN > does is > >> very > >> > easily and cheaply duplicated. Such a model > was > >> dangerous to > >> > the big money schemes that US Government > nods kept > >> allowing > >> > ICANN to get away with, appearing to have > some > >> special > >> > ability the rest of the world lacked to run > an > >> > internet.

Now > >> > ICANN is pulling away from the US Government > auspices > >> > entirely and can be tried more easily for > their > >> offenses. > >> > Perhaps the splintering of today's ICANN > will > >> finally > >> > allow for true Net Neutrality after all > these > >> > years!

Internet > >> > governance will become a little more work > and a > >> little less > >> > rubber-stamping, but the world will benefit > greatly. > >> We, the > >> > TLDA stand ready to do our part to assist in > the > >> > transition.

Sincerely > >> > yours,
Karl E. Peters, > >> President
Top-Level > >> > Domain Association, Inc.
USA (912) > 638-1638 > >> >

P.S. I will make the > first draft > >> of the > >> > TapRoot available on our webiste very soon > and a copy > >> may be > >> > had by anyone requesting it at no charge, > even ICANN! > >> Write > >> > me if you would like to see what is going on > outside > >> the > >> > gates.
 > >> > > >> >
____________________________________________________________ > >> > You received this message as a subscriber on > the > >> list: > >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> > To be removed from the list, send any > message to: > >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >> > > >> > For all list information and functions, see: > >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ____________________________________________________________ > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the > list: > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: > >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >> > >> For all list information and functions, see: > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- > Peter and Karin Dambier > Cesidian Root - Radice Cesidiana > Rimbacher Strasse 16 > D-69509 Moerlenbach-Bonsweiher > +49(6209)795-816 (Telekom) > +49(6252)750-308 (VoIP: sipgate.de) > mail: peter at peter-dambier.de > http://www.peter-dambier.de/ > http://iason.site.voila.fr/ > https://sourceforge.net/projects/iason/ > ULA= fd80:4ce1:c66a::/48 > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Wed Dec 17 23:18:53 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (JFC Morfin) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 05:18:53 +0100 Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! In-Reply-To: <53856.10276.qm@web52208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <4948ED28.3060003@peter-dambier.de> <53856.10276.qm@web52208.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20081218042003.79CF767820@smtp1.electricembers.net> Danny, I am afraid you get confused by the namespace self dynamic. Things are not carved in stone. Peter is advocating a vision. You have another one. This only means that reality is a virtual root made of the two of yours (and many other visions). Politicians and strategists can prefer one vision or another and try to politically impose it. Net architects know that reality is made of all the visions, hence a virtual root. They alos know that there are many of them in use today. Because this is of the essence of an operational network and the very nature of the DNS. This is also the reason why DNSSEC cannot fly as far too rigid. To better understand please consider two things: - an ICANN document. ICP-3. Read it carefully and think about what it says about the legitimacy of the private and open roots, and what to be done (along ICANN) to implement a multiroot DNS (BTW I am the only one who carried the suggestion, and the reason why I refer to the virtual root concept). - an analogy with Newton. ICANN's root is like Newton laws. And then Eistein came with the relativity theories (and a better understanding of Planck's quanta what lead to quantum theories and to one century of trying to unify them). Peter is like the Strings scientists. No one knows if he is right, but he certainly makes clear that the single authoritative Newton NTIA root is is not the whole solution. BTW. using the word "alt.root" instead of "open-root" only shows that either you have not understood what we are talking about (or that you do, and that you want to purposely confuse the debate). In both case there is no interest to discuss with someone referring to alt.roots. An alt.root is another version of the same root (for example yesterday's version, or is part of a deliberate attack) that will necessarilly polute the current root until the end of the TTL. An Open-Root approach does not pollute the network - but can pollute the financial results of the ICANN industry. NB.: Open-roots obviously have "alt.Open-roots". jfc At 02:18 18/12/2008, Danny Younger wrote: >Hello Peter, >I wouldn't have such a problem with alt roots if they could actually >be readily found by the bulk of the populace. > >That said, the adage "different strokes for different folks" would >seem to be appropriate. Most of the world tends to prefer TLDs that >are actually visible to most of the world (which is not the case for >the vast bulk of alt.root TLDs)... but apparently you and your >clients have a different set of preferences (which is OK; after all, >it is a big world). > >Yes, the non-ASCII needs that you have highlighted admittedly have >not yet been fully accommodated by the legacy root, but I suspect >that given the planned upcoming rollout of IDN ccTLDs and IDN gTLDs, >this too will change in the near term... and when they are added to >the Root, my guess is that we will indeed be able to use the Search >Engines to find content in those IDN TLDs (while we still won't be >able to search for content within the TLDs managed by the alternate >root community). > >In the long run the legacy root will offer the world the utility >that its citizens will require; I don't see other root communities >as being able to make the same claim, but that's just my view. >best regards, >Danny >--- On Wed, 12/17/08, Peter Dambier wrote: > > > From: Peter Dambier > > Subject: Re: [governance] REAL net neutrality in now a hope! > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Date: Wednesday, December 17, 2008, 7:14 AM > > Hello Danny, > > > > whout root do you suggest? > > > > My clients need the "XN--55QX5D", > > "XN--FIQS8S" and "XN--IO0A7I" TLDs > > because they don't know the us-subset of the the roman > > letters. > > > > Apropos Karl does not sell a root - so what is he selling > > that is broken? > > > > On the other hand I have seen that the californian golf > > club - a nonprofit? > > is making a lot of money. Whom do they obey? Whom do they > > pay taxes? > > > > At least the "XN--55QX5D", "XN--FIQS8S" > > and "XN--IO0A7I" are run by a > > government you can predict and they do talk to the ITU. > > > > Kind regards > > Peter > > > > > > Danny Younger wrote: > > > Karl, > > > > > > You have an interest in promoting a useless product > > (alt. root TLDs) that can't be found by the common > > Internet user utilizing any of the standard search engines. > > As a businessman, you are pushing what amounts to defective > > merchandise. OK. I get that. Your motive is clear. Good > > luck with your endeavor. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Karl E. Peters > > wrote: > > > > > >> From: Karl E. Peters > > >> Subject: RE: [governance] REAL net neutrality in > > now a hope! > > >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Danny > > Younger" > > >> Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 4:00 PM > > >> Mr. Younger, > > >> As of the first month of .com, it is unlikely > > it made > > >> its full complement either! For a real record of > > the > > >> ultimate success of the original .biz, contact > > Leah Gallegos > > >> at jandl at jandl.com and ask her to release her > > final numbers. > > >> I don't think it was more than a few thousand, > > but that > > >> was more than enough to sustain the business model > > as > > >> profitable. That it made less with no publicity > > than the new > > >> one did for ICANN justify its theft? Does that not > > make you > > >> wonder how much money is wasted in running the > > ICANN root, > > >> when she was making money at that level? > > >> Furthermore, does it justify creating > > colliders in the > > >> internet without even discussing the possibility > > of a > > >> peaceful negotiated settlement before awarding > > what they did > > >> not own to someone who promised them a good return > > and paid > > >> ridiculous fees just to get it? Your argument is a > > good try, > > >> but falls flat on the underlying problem of net > > neutrality > > >> as it relates to ICANN. > > >> > > >> -Karl E. Peters, President > > >> Top Level Domain Association, Inc. > > >> > > >> > > >> -------- Original Message -------- > > >> Subject: Re: [governance] REAL net neutrality in > > now a > > >> hope! > > >> From: Danny Younger > > > > >> Date: Tue, December 16, 2008 2:53 pm > > >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > >> > > >> For an unbiased review of the "success" > > of .biz > > >> at the Atlantic Root Network see Ben Edelman's > > analysis > > >> at > > >> > > http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/archived_content/people/edelman/dotbiz/ > > >> > > >> An example: "As of November 15, 2000, only 5 > > >> registrants had registered any SLDs at all in > > ARNI's > > >> .BIZ TLD." > > >> > > >> > > >> --- On Tue, 12/16/08, Karl E. Peters > > >> wrote: > > >> > > >> > From: Karl E. Peters > > > > >> > Subject: [governance] REAL net neutrality in > > now a > > >> hope! > > >> > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > >> > Date: Tuesday, December 16, 2008, 2:14 PM > > >> >
> id=yiv1801668660> > >> > > > >> > > style="font-family:Verdana;color:#000000;font-size:10pt;"> > >> > style="background-color:rgb(102, 255, > > >> > 255);">
Quoted on and from > > the > > >> Governance > > >> > list:
"Net neutrality > > >> > laws are necessary to ensure that Internet > > service > > >> > providers do not > > >> > block content they disagree with or give > > financial > > >> breaks > > >> > to big tech > > >> > companies, squeezing out smaller competitors > > and > > >> stifling > > >> > > > innovation".

> > >> > I must agree with the author of the above > > quote!!! > > >> > >> > > > >> > > style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">(And > > >> > may it begin at home, with > > >> ICANN!!!)
> >> > > > >> > > style="font-style:italic;text-decoration:underline;">
> > >> > > >> > ICANN is the world's largest and > > grandest > > >> offender of > > >> > these very net neutrality ideals when it > > ignored (and > > >> > continues to ignore) the original plan that > > the > > >> > "alternate roots" would serve as a > > testbed > > >> for the > > >> > introduction of new TLDs into the > > "legacy > > >> root", > > >> > now administered by ICANN. ICANN then goes > > with the > > >> > big spenders it hopes to gain benefit from > > in > > >> awarding > > >> > ".biz" away from its successful > > operator of > > >> that > > >> > day, the Atlantic Root Network. (There is > > more than > > >> adequate > > >> > proof of the existance of this .biz in > > carefully kept > > >> > archives, if anyone cares to challenge!) > > >> >

> > >> > While ICANN may claim it was unaware of our > > .biz, > > >> surely > > >> > they heard of Leah Gallegos' testimony > > before the > > >> U.S. > > >> > Congress on the matter! Surely they knew > > they were > > >> creating > > >> > a monstrous internet naming collision by > > proposing a > > >> second > > >> > registry for the same TLD! They simply did > > not care, > > >> because > > >> > they were expecting big income from the new > > .biz just > > >> as > > >> > they expect and recieve from the carefully > > protected > > >> Network > > >> > Solutuions and a few other of their friends. > > Leah > > >> finally > > >> > curtailed the orgininal .biz in the interest > > of > > >> internet > > >> > stability, sacrificing her successful > > business for > > >> the > > >> > smooth operation of the very internet ICANN > > is > > >> charged with > > >> > protecting!

Perhaps > > >> > ICANN lacked the technical ability to search > > the > > >> internet to > > >> > see what TLDs were already in operation when > > they > > >> went to > > >> > create new ones? Was it technical ignorance > > or simple > > >> > financial greed that led to that horrible > > precedent > > >> in > > >> > internet piracy? It had to be one or the > > other! Which > > >> was > > >> > it?

Since the TLDA, > > >> > in conjuction with the Public-Root, is set > > to publish > > >> its > > >> > first TapRoot, a listing of all operational > > TLDs on > > >> any > > >> > root, anywhere in the world on practically > > zero > > >> budget, I > > >> > dare say it must have been pure greed alone. > > Had they > > >> put > > >> > out the question for existing TLDs, a chorus > > of > > >> > confirmations would have been returned. No > > nquestions > > >> would > > >> > have remained. Deals could have been struck > > with > > >> existing > > >> > TLD managers to include them in ICANN's > > root; but > > >> ICANN > > >> > never even asked.

> > >> > ICANN wanted no proof for which to feel > > guilty. They > > >> just > > >> > wanted another revenue stream from someone > > who would > > >> owe > > >> > them a favor, and they got it. The Atlantic > > Root > > >> > Nework's TLDs were perfectly operational > > on at > > >> least one > > >> > root server system and often more than one > > (through > > >> > something called cooperation) and had > > > >> > > > >> > > style="font-weight:bold;">many > > >> > happy SLD holders through a perfectly > > functional > > >> Registry > > >> > system. The only difference: . . . we > > didn't owe > > >> them > > >> > anything, and were proving that what ICANN > > does is > > >> very > > >> > easily and cheaply duplicated. Such a model > > was > > >> dangerous to > > >> > the big money schemes that US Government > > nods kept > > >> allowing > > >> > ICANN to get away with, appearing to have > > some > > >> special > > >> > ability the rest of the world lacked to run > > an > > >> > internet.

Now > > >> > ICANN is pulling away from the US Government > > auspices > > >> > entirely and can be tried more easily for > > their > > >> offenses. > > >> > Perhaps the splintering of today's ICANN > > will > > >> finally > > >> > allow for true Net Neutrality after all > > these > > >> > years!

Internet > > >> > governance will become a little more work > > and a > > >> little less > > >> > rubber-stamping, but the world will benefit > > greatly. > > >> We, the > > >> > TLDA stand ready to do our part to assist in > > the > > >> > transition.

Sincerely > > >> > yours,
Karl E. Peters, > > >> President
Top-Level > > >> > Domain Association, Inc.
USA (912) > > 638-1638 > > >> >

P.S. I will make the > > first draft > > >> of the > > >> > TapRoot available on our webiste very soon > > and a copy > > >> may be > > >> > had by anyone requesting it at no charge, > > even ICANN! > > >> Write > > >> > me if you would like to see what is going on > > outside > > >> the > > >> > gates.
 > > >> > > > >> > >
____________________________________________________________ > > >> > You received this message as a subscriber on > > the > > >> list: > > >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > >> > To be removed from the list, send any > > message to: > > >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > >> > > > >> > For all list information and functions, see: > > >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the > > list: > > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > > >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > >> > > >> For all list information and functions, see: > > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > -- > > Peter and Karin Dambier > > Cesidian Root - Radice Cesidiana > > Rimbacher Strasse 16 > > D-69509 Moerlenbach-Bonsweiher > > +49(6209)795-816 (Telekom) > > +49(6252)750-308 (VoIP: sipgate.de) > > mail: peter at peter-dambier.de > > http://www.peter-dambier.de/ > > http://iason.site.voila.fr/ > > https://sourceforge.net/projects/iason/ > > ULA= fd80:4ce1:c66a::/48 > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From gurstein at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 03:47:44 2008 From: gurstein at gmail.com (Michael Gurstein) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 10:47:44 +0200 Subject: [governance] RE: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <28E700FDD575422DBA17EBA6799D399E@userPC> Derrick and all, Since I am subscribed to the list (for historical reasons) with two email addresses it appears that I have the opportunity to vote twice, which I haven't done. However, the option is there and probably represents a significant procedural anomaly. My suggestion is that given that the numbers aren't huge, that someone (Derrick?) do a quick visual scan of the elist and see if there are any evident anomalies such as mine which might be followed up with an email query. MG -----Original Message----- From: Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn [mailto:dcogburn at syr.edu] Sent: December-18-08 1:06 AM To: mgurst at vcn.bc.ca Subject: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot Dear IGC List Participant, This email invites you to consider voting in the elections for the new co-coordinator for the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (IGC). In order to vote, as per the conditions of the IGC's charter, you must specify that you subscribe to the IGC charter and thus accept/ affirm IGC membership (see http://www.igcaucus.org/charter). This can be done on the webpage that opens when you click the following link: http://websurvey.syr.edu//Survey.aspx?i=b95f780a4f884a92aa1e5dec765385bb A positive response to the question will take you to the ballot where you can tick/check the candidate for whom you choose to vote. There is a link to background information supplied by the candidates on the ballot paper. After you have voted, you will then be taken to a page that confirms your vote has been registered. While at this page you may still go back and change your vote. However, after you click on "Finish" on the final page, your vote will be final and cannot be changed. You may cast your vote anytime upon receipt of this message, until 24h00 GMT on Sunday, 21 December 2008. We strongly encourage you to cast your vote as a sign of active engagement with the caucus. Although, voting is not compulsory for retaining membership if you are already on the IGC members list (please see this list at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/12/%253Cbr%2520/%253E), as per the charter you must vote in this election to be eligible to vote in any charter amendment process that may come up before the next election. You may choose to vote "None of the Above" on the ballot paper to maintain voting eligibility if you do not favour any of the candidates. You may seek any clarification by replying to this email. Thanks Ian Peter Co-coordinator IGC and Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn Associate Professor Director, Cotelco Syracuse University PS: Please do not vote with more than one email ID. If you receive this message more than once, please use only one of them and inform us about the multiple IDs by replying to this email. !DSPAM:2676,494985da133779006219400! ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 04:48:15 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 14:48:15 +0500 Subject: [governance] RE: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot In-Reply-To: <28E700FDD575422DBA17EBA6799D399E@userPC> References: <28E700FDD575422DBA17EBA6799D399E@userPC> Message-ID: <701af9f70812180148g222f4e2nc80b1dc61319a201@mail.gmail.com> Lucky man! We hardly get to vote once ;) On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 1:47 PM, Michael Gurstein wrote: > > Derrick and all, > > Since I am subscribed to the list (for historical reasons) with two email > addresses it appears that I have the opportunity to vote twice, which I > haven't done. However, the option is there and probably represents a > significant procedural anomaly. > > My suggestion is that given that the numbers aren't huge, that someone > (Derrick?) do a quick visual scan of the elist and see if there are any > evident anomalies such as mine which might be followed up with an email > query. > > MG > > -----Original Message----- > From: Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn [mailto:dcogburn at syr.edu] > Sent: December-18-08 1:06 AM > To: mgurst at vcn.bc.ca > Subject: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot > > > Dear IGC List Participant, > > This email invites you to consider voting in the elections for the new > co-coordinator for the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (IGC). > > In order to vote, as per the conditions of the IGC's charter, you must > specify that you subscribe to the IGC charter and thus accept/ affirm IGC > membership (see http://www.igcaucus.org/charter). This can be done on the > webpage that opens when you click the following link: > > http://websurvey.syr.edu//Survey.aspx?i=b95f780a4f884a92aa1e5dec765385bb > > A positive response to the question will take you to the ballot where you > can tick/check the candidate for whom you choose to vote. There is a link > to background information supplied by the candidates on the ballot paper. > > After you have voted, you will then be taken to a page that confirms your > vote has been registered. While at this page you may still go back and > change your vote. However, after you click on "Finish" on the final page, > your vote will be final and cannot be changed. > > You may cast your vote anytime upon receipt of this message, until 24h00 GMT > on Sunday, 21 December 2008. > > We strongly encourage you to cast your vote as a sign of active engagement > with the caucus. Although, voting is not compulsory for retaining membership > if you are already on the IGC members list (please see this list at > http://www.igcaucus.org/node/12/%253Cbr%2520/%253E), as per the charter you > must vote in this election to be eligible to vote in any charter amendment > process that may come up before the next election. You may choose to vote > "None of the Above" on the ballot paper to maintain voting eligibility if > you do not favour any of the candidates. > > You may seek any clarification by replying to this email. > > Thanks > > Ian Peter > Co-coordinator IGC > > and > > Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn > Associate Professor > Director, Cotelco > Syracuse University > > PS: Please do not vote with more than one email ID. If you receive this > message more than once, please use only one of them and inform us about the > multiple IDs by replying to this email. > > > !DSPAM:2676,494985da133779006219400! > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dcogburn at syr.edu Thu Dec 18 05:59:23 2008 From: dcogburn at syr.edu (Derrick L. Cogburn) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 05:59:23 -0500 Subject: [governance] Re: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot In-Reply-To: <28E700FDD575422DBA17EBA6799D399E@userPC> References: <28E700FDD575422DBA17EBA6799D399E@userPC> Message-ID: Thanks Michael, You are raising an important issue, to which I have responded privately in messages to a few other people. We are well aware that some people are subscribed twice, and in some cases more, on the list. As you suggest, a more complete process would be to cull the voting list of these extra names. However, we didn't feel comfortable making the decision about which address to choose for people, and didn't have the time to go through the list, identify the duplicates, mail then to ask to preferences, then wait for responses. As such, we are relying on the ethics and integrity of our membership not to vote twice (and of course, the technology will indicate if someone voted with more than one address; though not how they voted). So summary, indeed there could be a more perfect system. Perfect opportunity for someone (not me - smile) next time. Cheers, Derrick Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn Syracuse University http://cotelco.syr.edu Sent from my iPhone On Dec 18, 2008, at 3:48 AM, "Michael Gurstein" wrote: > > Derrick and all, > > Since I am subscribed to the list (for historical reasons) with two > email > addresses it appears that I have the opportunity to vote twice, > which I > haven't done. However, the option is there and probably represents a > significant procedural anomaly. > > My suggestion is that given that the numbers aren't huge, that someone > (Derrick?) do a quick visual scan of the elist and see if there are > any > evident anomalies such as mine which might be followed up with an > email > query. > > MG > > -----Original Message----- > From: Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn [mailto:dcogburn at syr.edu] > Sent: December-18-08 1:06 AM > To: mgurst at vcn.bc.ca > Subject: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot > > > Dear IGC List Participant, > > This email invites you to consider voting in the elections for the new > co-coordinator for the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (IGC). > > In order to vote, as per the conditions of the IGC's charter, you must > specify that you subscribe to the IGC charter and thus accept/ > affirm IGC > membership (see http://www.igcaucus.org/charter). This can be done > on the > webpage that opens when you click the following link: > > http://websurvey.syr.edu//Survey.aspx?i=b95f780a4f884a92aa1e5dec765385bb > > A positive response to the question will take you to the ballot > where you > can tick/check the candidate for whom you choose to vote. There is > a link > to background information supplied by the candidates on the ballot > paper. > > After you have voted, you will then be taken to a page that confirms > your > vote has been registered. While at this page you may still go back and > change your vote. However, after you click on "Finish" on the final > page, > your vote will be final and cannot be changed. > > You may cast your vote anytime upon receipt of this message, until > 24h00 GMT > on Sunday, 21 December 2008. > > We strongly encourage you to cast your vote as a sign of active > engagement > with the caucus. Although, voting is not compulsory for retaining > membership > if you are already on the IGC members list (please see this list at > http://www.igcaucus.org/node/12/%253Cbr%2520/%253E), as per the > charter you > must vote in this election to be eligible to vote in any charter > amendment > process that may come up before the next election. You may choose > to vote > "None of the Above" on the ballot paper to maintain voting > eligibility if > you do not favour any of the candidates. > > You may seek any clarification by replying to this email. > > Thanks > > Ian Peter > Co-coordinator IGC > > and > > Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn > Associate Professor > Director, Cotelco > Syracuse University > > PS: Please do not vote with more than one email ID. If you receive > this > message more than once, please use only one of them and inform us > about the > multiple IDs by replying to this email. > > > !DSPAM:2676,494985da133779006219400! > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 08:55:31 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 18:55:31 +0500 Subject: [governance] Re: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot In-Reply-To: References: <28E700FDD575422DBA17EBA6799D399E@userPC> Message-ID: <701af9f70812180555g6ca52fc5ubb37f5c590797b68@mail.gmail.com> I could volunteer to take the next week to go through the members list, send one to one emails confirming which emails users are using to recieve messages as well as remove the bouncing and suspended accounts so that we have a clean mailing list available. On 12/18/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > Thanks Michael, > > You are raising an important issue, to which I have responded > privately in messages to a few other people. We are well aware that > some people are subscribed twice, and in some cases more, on the list. > As you suggest, a more complete process would be to cull the voting > list of these extra names. However, we didn't feel comfortable making > the decision about which address to choose for people, and didn't have > the time to go through the list, identify the duplicates, mail then to > ask to preferences, then wait for responses. As such, we are relying > on the ethics and integrity of our membership not to vote twice (and > of course, the technology will indicate if someone voted with more > than one address; though not how they voted). > > So summary, indeed there could be a more perfect system. Perfect > opportunity for someone (not me - smile) next time. > > Cheers, > Derrick > > Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn > Syracuse University > http://cotelco.syr.edu > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Dec 18, 2008, at 3:48 AM, "Michael Gurstein" > wrote: > > > > > Derrick and all, > > > > Since I am subscribed to the list (for historical reasons) with two > > email > > addresses it appears that I have the opportunity to vote twice, > > which I > > haven't done. However, the option is there and probably represents a > > significant procedural anomaly. > > > > My suggestion is that given that the numbers aren't huge, that someone > > (Derrick?) do a quick visual scan of the elist and see if there are > > any > > evident anomalies such as mine which might be followed up with an > > email > > query. > > > > MG > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn [mailto:dcogburn at syr.edu] > > Sent: December-18-08 1:06 AM > > To: mgurst at vcn.bc.ca > > Subject: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot > > > > > > Dear IGC List Participant, > > > > This email invites you to consider voting in the elections for the new > > co-coordinator for the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (IGC). > > > > In order to vote, as per the conditions of the IGC's charter, you must > > specify that you subscribe to the IGC charter and thus accept/ > > affirm IGC > > membership (see http://www.igcaucus.org/charter). This can be done > > on the > > webpage that opens when you click the following link: > > > > http://websurvey.syr.edu//Survey.aspx?i=b95f780a4f884a92aa1e5dec765385bb > > > > A positive response to the question will take you to the ballot > > where you > > can tick/check the candidate for whom you choose to vote. There is > > a link > > to background information supplied by the candidates on the ballot > > paper. > > > > After you have voted, you will then be taken to a page that confirms > > your > > vote has been registered. While at this page you may still go back and > > change your vote. However, after you click on "Finish" on the final > > page, > > your vote will be final and cannot be changed. > > > > You may cast your vote anytime upon receipt of this message, until > > 24h00 GMT > > on Sunday, 21 December 2008. > > > > We strongly encourage you to cast your vote as a sign of active > > engagement > > with the caucus. Although, voting is not compulsory for retaining > > membership > > if you are already on the IGC members list (please see this list at > > http://www.igcaucus.org/node/12/%253Cbr%2520/%253E), as per the > > charter you > > must vote in this election to be eligible to vote in any charter > > amendment > > process that may come up before the next election. You may choose > > to vote > > "None of the Above" on the ballot paper to maintain voting > > eligibility if > > you do not favour any of the candidates. > > > > You may seek any clarification by replying to this email. > > > > Thanks > > > > Ian Peter > > Co-coordinator IGC > > > > and > > > > Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn > > Associate Professor > > Director, Cotelco > > Syracuse University > > > > PS: Please do not vote with more than one email ID. If you receive > > this > > message more than once, please use only one of them and inform us > > about the > > multiple IDs by replying to this email. > > > > > > !DSPAM:2676,494985da133779006219400! > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From wcurrie at apc.org Thu Dec 18 09:11:38 2008 From: wcurrie at apc.org (Willie Currie) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 16:11:38 +0200 Subject: [governance] Thank you to Parminder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <494A5A1A.2050304@apc.org> I'd also like to thank Parminder for his commitment and hard work as IGC coordinator. Parminder has played an important role for the IGC during a difficult period of adjustment to a post-WSIS global policy space in internet governance, when a sustained attempt to deflect attention from the need for global public policy principles for managing critical internet resources was underway as a backlash to the gains made in the WSIS. It is largely to Parminder's credit that the issue of 'enhanced cooperation' could be discussed in Hyderabad without the sky falling down. Indeed a little more attention to public policy principles at an earlier stage may have helped the IPv4/6 transition as the IGF open policy dialogue on the matter demonstrated. Like the banking system, I think we have been witnessing the limits of the claims for technical expertise in the absence of suitable policy and regulation in the public interest in this area. And no one had an adequate answer to Jeanette's question as to who is in charge? Parminder suffered unjustifable attack while coordinator of the IGC when he did raise questions of public policy. And I think the shambles around the IPv4/6 transition vindicates his concerns for public policy frameworks in internet governance. There was a long stretch in which Parminder was virtually carrying the IGC coordination alone. I would like to commend his work for the IGC as beyond the call of duty and while many may have disgreed with his arguments, Parminder nevertheless ensured that there was considerable engagement on the list during his watch. All the best, Parminder! Willie Peter wrote: > > Everyone, > > > > In a few days we will have a new Co-coordinator to congratulate. > Please don't forget to vote! > > > > All of which means that this is the last few days of Parminder's term > as Co-coordinator. > > > > I have had the please of working with Parminder in this role over the > last six months, and in working closely with him over this period got > to appreciate what a splendid job he has done for our Caucus. > > > > Parminder has had a huge commitment to openness and transparency. He > had worked very hard to help the Caucus to adopt consensual positions > on policy matters. He has shown a great policy mind, a firm commitment > to civil society and its advancement, and a lot of strength in dealing > with difficult issues. > > > > I said a few words along these lines in Hyderabad for those who were > present, but I do want to mark this milestone by thanking Parminder > for his commitment to IGC. I am glad he is remaining involved and look > forward to working with him in the future. > > > > All the best, Parminder, and thank you very much! > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From b.schombe at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 09:30:54 2008 From: b.schombe at gmail.com (BAUDOUIN SCHOMBE) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 15:30:54 +0100 Subject: [governance] Thank you to Parminder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi all sisters and brothers in this caucus, let me enjoy Peter and to congratulate Parminder in my own name and also from my team. Since a long time I had wished to meet all of you. So I wish many good things to all of you for this new year and in the same time happy X mas. Baudouin 2008/12/17, Ian Peter : > > Everyone, > > > > In a few days we will have a new Co-coordinator to congratulate. Please > don't forget to vote! > > > > All of which means that this is the last few days of Parminder's term as > Co-coordinator. > > > > I have had the please of working with Parminder in this role over the last > six months, and in working closely with him over this period got to > appreciate what a splendid job he has done for our Caucus. > > > > Parminder has had a huge commitment to openness and transparency. He had > worked very hard to help the Caucus to adopt consensual positions on policy > matters. He has shown a great policy mind, a firm commitment to civil > society and its advancement, and a lot of strength in dealing with difficult > issues. > > > > I said a few words along these lines in Hyderabad for those who were > present, but I do want to mark this milestone by thanking Parminder for his > commitment to IGC. I am glad he is remaining involved and look forward to > working with him in the future. > > > > All the best, Parminder, and thank you very much! > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > -- SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN COORDONNATEUR NATIONAL REPRONTIC COORDONNATEUR SOUS REGIONAL ACSIS/AFRIQUE CENTRALE MEMBRE FACILITATEUR GAID AFRIQUE téléphone fixe: +243 1510 34 91 Téléphone mobile:+243998983491/+243999334571 email:b.schombe at gmail.com http://akimambo.unblog.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 09:44:09 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 19:44:09 +0500 Subject: [governance] Thank you to Parminder In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <701af9f70812180644i7b6c7245hdb5fe39afb312d4d@mail.gmail.com> A note of appreciation from my end to Parminder who has led the IGC in both a professional and intellectual manner contributing and managing issues with due diligence and patience. During his co-coordination the most important element that has to be recognized is his abilities to bring issues to fruitful conclusions, intervene and deliberate on issues with grand intellectual ability and direct the caucus towards appropriate action in light of the issues at hand. Peter's opportunity of working with Parminder's is definitely a great experience and we wish Parminder all the best and support him to contribute the way he has even without the coordination role as roles only recognize and direct everyone to a particular person and Parminder has played a role that has been an umbrella for the IGF. In the end, GREAT WORK PARMINDER! On 12/18/08, BAUDOUIN SCHOMBE wrote: > Hi all sisters and brothers in this caucus, > > let me enjoy Peter and to congratulate Parminder in my own name and also > from my team. Since a long time I had wished to meet all of you. > > So I wish many good things to all of you for this new year and in the same > time happy X mas. > > Baudouin > > > 2008/12/17, Ian Peter : > > > > > > > > > > > > Everyone, > > > > > > > > In a few days we will have a new Co-coordinator to congratulate. Please > don't forget to vote! > > > > > > > > All of which means that this is the last few days of Parminder's term as > Co-coordinator. > > > > > > > > I have had the please of working with Parminder in this role over the last > six months, and in working closely with him over this period got to > appreciate what a splendid job he has done for our Caucus. > > > > > > > > Parminder has had a huge commitment to openness and transparency. He had > worked very hard to help the Caucus to adopt consensual positions on policy > matters. He has shown a great policy mind, a firm commitment to civil > society and its advancement, and a lot of strength in dealing with difficult > issues. > > > > > > > > I said a few words along these lines in Hyderabad for those who were > present, but I do want to mark this milestone by thanking Parminder for his > commitment to IGC. I am glad he is remaining involved and look forward to > working with him in the future. > > > > > > > > All the best, Parminder, and thank you very much! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > > > PO Box 429 > > > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > > > Australia > > > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > > > > > -- > SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN > COORDONNATEUR NATIONAL REPRONTIC > COORDONNATEUR SOUS REGIONAL ACSIS/AFRIQUE CENTRALE > MEMBRE FACILITATEUR GAID AFRIQUE > téléphone fixe: +243 1510 34 91 > Téléphone mobile:+243998983491/+243999334571 > email:b.schombe at gmail.com > http://akimambo.unblog.fr > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeremy at ciroap.org Thu Dec 18 10:21:11 2008 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 23:21:11 +0800 Subject: [governance] Call for nominations for Appeals Team Message-ID: <5E3AEB33-1AB2-4111-95C8-417B94EFE656@ciroap.org> This is a call for nominations for membership of the Internet Governance Caucus Appeals Team for 2008-2009. The call is open from now until 31 December 2008. The purpose of the Appeals Team as stated in our charter (http://www.igcaucus.org/charter ) is as follows: "Any time 4 individual members of the IGC co-sign a statement on the main IGC mailing list they can appeal any decision of the coordinators. When a decision is appealed, the appeals team will review any discussions that occurred and will request comments from the IGC membership. Based on the information they collect and discussion, they will decide on the merit of the appeal." Five members of the Appeals Team are required. We would like to receive at least twice as many candidates for each available seat on the Appeals Team - that is, at least ten in all. Nominations may be sent to this mailing list, or to myself as chair of the Nomcom. Self- nominations are permitted (and encouraged), though a seconding member may help your application. The criteria for selection of Appeals Team members are as follows: A) Qualified IGC member Appeals team should be Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (CS IGC) members. Anyone who have subscribed to the IGC Charter and subscribed to the IGC caucus mailing list for 2 months prior to the announcement of the appeals team Nomcom process is eligible to be a candidate. (The Nomcom process started on 7 September 2008.) B) Qualifications Nomcom will primarily select persons based on their knowledge and experience of issues faced by the caucus and their neutrality. The successful candidate should be a person with thoughtful and unbiased consideration and have a stated (and demonstrated) commitment to consultation and dialogue with the community. C) Diversity and balance Appeal Team collectively should have good diversity and balance. The attributes to be considered include, but not limited to: - Geographic and cultural diversity - Gender - Age - Skill set and knowledge - Disability These will be treated as a goal, but not as the absolute requirement. D) Others To avoid capture, no more than one employee/representative of a particular organization should serve on the Appeal Team at any given time. We look forward to receiving your nominations! -- JEREMY MALCOLM Project Coordinator CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE for Asia Pacific and the Middle East Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 10:45:21 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 20:45:21 +0500 Subject: [governance] Call for nominations for Appeals Team In-Reply-To: <5E3AEB33-1AB2-4111-95C8-417B94EFE656@ciroap.org> References: <5E3AEB33-1AB2-4111-95C8-417B94EFE656@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <701af9f70812180745t1fba9636xdfa1082ac1d326fc@mail.gmail.com> I would like to self-nominate myself for the membership of the Appeals Team - Geographic and cultural diversity : Pakistan, South Asia - Gender : Male - Age : 31 - Skill set and knowledge : DiploFoundation Grad, Technology Policy and Strategic Technology Management Experience, IGC Caucus Member in Good Standing, IG Advocate and Researcher, FOSS Advocate, ICT4D Advisor, Member of Working Groups on National IT Policy Pakistan formulation, WSIS and Post-WSIS Action Lines Participant. - Disability : None On 12/18/08, Jeremy Malcolm wrote: > This is a call for nominations for membership of the Internet Governance > Caucus Appeals Team for 2008-2009. The call is open from now until 31 > December 2008. > > The purpose of the Appeals Team as stated in our charter > (http://www.igcaucus.org/charter) is as follows: "Any time > 4 individual members of the IGC co-sign a statement on the main IGC mailing > list they can appeal any decision of the coordinators. When a decision is > appealed, the appeals team will review any discussions that occurred and > will request comments from the IGC membership. Based on the information they > collect and discussion, they will decide on the merit of the appeal." > > Five members of the Appeals Team are required. We would like to receive at > least twice as many candidates for each available seat on the Appeals Team - > that is, at least ten in all. Nominations may be sent to this mailing list, > or to myself as chair of the Nomcom. Self-nominations are permitted (and > encouraged), though a seconding member may help your application. > > The criteria for selection of Appeals Team members are as follows: > > A) Qualified IGC member > Appeals team should be Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (CS IGC) > members. > > Anyone who have subscribed to the IGC Charter and subscribed to the IGC > caucus mailing list for 2 months prior to the announcement of the appeals > team Nomcom process is eligible to be a candidate. (The Nomcom process > started on 7 September 2008.) > > B) Qualifications > Nomcom will primarily select persons based on their knowledge and experience > of issues faced by the caucus and their neutrality. > > The successful candidate should be a person with thoughtful and unbiased > consideration and have a stated (and demonstrated) commitment to > consultation and dialogue with the community. > > C) Diversity and balance > Appeal Team collectively should have good diversity and balance. The > attributes to be considered include, but not limited to: > - Geographic and cultural diversity > - Gender > - Age > - Skill set and knowledge > - Disability > > These will be treated as a goal, but not as the absolute requirement. > > D) Others > To avoid capture, no more than one employee/representative of a particular > organization should serve on the Appeal Team at any given time. > > We look forward to receiving your nominations! > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning > voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we > are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and > empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit > www.consumersinternational.org. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 10:52:53 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 20:52:53 +0500 Subject: [governance] The End of the Internet in 2012? Message-ID: <701af9f70812180752r2eaaf62ct59117fd0e537983d@mail.gmail.com> An interesting article that has provoked me to even write a book on the subject. What I see here is the emergence of Local or NEO Internetworks or basically Internet NEO-Clans that will be providing pirated or hacked access to consumers that will not be able to afford the huge charges imposed by corporations?: The End of the Internet by 2012? by Todd Lemmle http://www.lammle.com/blog/news-and-announcements/22/the-end-of-the-internet-by-2012/ -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 10:59:00 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 21:29:00 +0530 Subject: [governance] Thank you to Parminder In-Reply-To: <701af9f70812180644i7b6c7245hdb5fe39afb312d4d@mail.gmail.com> References: <701af9f70812180644i7b6c7245hdb5fe39afb312d4d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hello Parminder and All, I have been fiercely opposed to some of your views and have challenged the nuances of some of your passionate pursuits in the list but in the process I was a little charmed by the way you responded to all the opposition from me and some others in the list. You never hesitated to clarify your position on and sometimes offlist even on the face of harsh adversity. What needs to be placed on record is the maturity with which you have separated issues from personalities. I always had the feeling that you were a considerably seasoned person not to take the issue based disagreements personal and with this understanding you became my favorite adversary!! At the IGF when I met you in person I felt that we had a certain degree of understanding as fellows opposed in views to each other. I am sure that most participants in the list, irrespective of whether or not they were in agreement with your proposals and debates, would share the same spirit of fellowship with you at the IGC and outside. This is not a farewell message - with the burden of the position taken away you are likely to have a lot more time to participate in the Caucus and other IGF activities, I wish you all the best and look forward to many more interesting situations to challenge you all the more fiercely. Thank you Parminder. Sivasubramanian Muthusamy On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 8:14 PM, Fouad Bajwa wrote: > A note of appreciation from my end to Parminder who has led the IGC in > both a professional and intellectual manner contributing and managing > issues with due diligence and patience. > > During his co-coordination the most important element that has to be > recognized is his abilities to bring issues to fruitful conclusions, > intervene and deliberate on issues with grand intellectual ability and > direct the caucus towards appropriate action in light of the issues at > hand. > > Peter's opportunity of working with Parminder's is definitely a great > experience and we wish Parminder all the best and support him to > contribute the way he has even without the coordination role as roles > only recognize and direct everyone to a particular person and > Parminder has played a role that has been an umbrella for the IGF. > > In the end, GREAT WORK PARMINDER! > > > On 12/18/08, BAUDOUIN SCHOMBE wrote: > > Hi all sisters and brothers in this caucus, > > > > let me enjoy Peter and to congratulate Parminder in my own name and also > > from my team. Since a long time I had wished to meet all of you. > > > > So I wish many good things to all of you for this new year and in the > same > > time happy X mas. > > > > Baudouin > > > > > > 2008/12/17, Ian Peter : > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Everyone, > > > > > > > > > > > > In a few days we will have a new Co-coordinator to congratulate. Please > > don't forget to vote! > > > > > > > > > > > > All of which means that this is the last few days of Parminder's term > as > > Co-coordinator. > > > > > > > > > > > > I have had the please of working with Parminder in this role over the > last > > six months, and in working closely with him over this period got to > > appreciate what a splendid job he has done for our Caucus. > > > > > > > > > > > > Parminder has had a huge commitment to openness and transparency. He > had > > worked very hard to help the Caucus to adopt consensual positions on > policy > > matters. He has shown a great policy mind, a firm commitment to civil > > society and its advancement, and a lot of strength in dealing with > difficult > > issues. > > > > > > > > > > > > I said a few words along these lines in Hyderabad for those who were > > present, but I do want to mark this milestone by thanking Parminder for > his > > commitment to IGC. I am glad he is remaining involved and look forward to > > working with him in the future. > > > > > > > > > > > > All the best, Parminder, and thank you very much! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > > > > > PO Box 429 > > > > > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > > > > > Australia > > > > > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > > > > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > SCHOMBE BAUDOUIN > > COORDONNATEUR NATIONAL REPRONTIC > > COORDONNATEUR SOUS REGIONAL ACSIS/AFRIQUE CENTRALE > > MEMBRE FACILITATEUR GAID AFRIQUE > > téléphone fixe: +243 1510 34 91 > > Téléphone mobile:+243998983491/+243999334571 > > email:b.schombe at gmail.com > > http://akimambo.unblog.fr > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > > > > -- > > Regards. > -------------------------- > Fouad Bajwa > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Thu Dec 18 11:19:56 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 09:19:56 -0700 Subject: [governance] Re: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot Message-ID: <20081218091956.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.8c73b95877.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 11:40:02 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 21:40:02 +0500 Subject: [governance] Re: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot In-Reply-To: <20081218091956.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.8c73b95877.wbe@email.secureserver.net> References: <20081218091956.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.8c73b95877.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <701af9f70812180840j1c52eb8ej5a532b3c743ecdee@mail.gmail.com> totally agree with you Karl, I think some systems should be in place now and provided that drupal also offers variable and useful modules to support such processes, we should make use of them. Also, we need to incorporate CiviCRM into the IGC website so that we can run some campaigns and so forth........... On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:19 PM, Karl E. Peters wrote: > Or, you might consider a free software such as (but not necessarily) > www.rsvme.com which send out ballots for you to your mailing list and > tracks them all by the IP address. It is not foolproof either, but would > protect, not only against accidental double mailings but also against people > who sign up under more than one name specifically to skew voting. (We always > hope our memberships are above that, but in a virtual world such as this, > you can not have too many free and easy checks for security and honesty. I > even had someone try to vote twice in the TLDA to test it and was able to > detect it and remove the vote. > -Karl E. Peters (TLDA) > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [governance] Re: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator > Election Ballot > From: "Fouad Bajwa" > Date: Thu, December 18, 2008 8:55 am > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Derrick L. Cogburn" > > I could volunteer to take the next week to go through the members > list, send one to one emails confirming which emails users are using > to recieve messages as well as remove the bouncing and suspended > accounts so that we have a clean mailing list available. > > On 12/18/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: >> Thanks Michael, >> >> You are raising an important issue, to which I have responded >> privately in messages to a few other people. We are well aware that >> some people are subscribed twice, and in some cases more, on the list. >> As you suggest, a more complete process would be to cull the voting >> list of these extra names. However, we didn't feel comfortable making >> the decision about which address to choose for people, and didn't have >> the time to go through the list, identify the duplicates, mail then to >> ask to preferences, then wait for responses. As such, we are relying >> on the ethics and integrity of our membership not to vote twice (and >> of course, the technology will indicate if someone voted with more >> than one address; though not how they voted). >> >> So summary, indeed there could be a more perfect system. Perfect >> opportunity for someone (not me - smile) next time. >> >> Cheers, >> Derrick >> >> Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn >> Syracuse University >> http://cotelco.syr.edu >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On Dec 18, 2008, at 3:48 AM, "Michael Gurstein" >> wrote: >> >> > >> > Derrick and all, >> > >> > Since I am subscribed to the list (for historical reasons) with two >> > email >> > addresses it appears that I have the opportunity to vote twice, >> > which I >> > haven't done. However, the option is there and probably represents a >> > significant procedural anomaly. >> > >> > My suggestion is that given that the numbers aren't huge, that someone >> > (Derrick?) do a quick visual scan of the elist and see if there are >> > any >> > evident anomalies such as mine which might be followed up with an >> > email >> > query. >> > >> > MG >> > >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn [mailto:dcogburn at syr.edu] >> > Sent: December-18-08 1:06 AM >> > To: mgurst at vcn.bc.ca >> > Subject: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot >> > >> > >> > Dear IGC List Participant, >> > >> > This email invites you to consider voting in the elections for the new >> > co-coordinator for the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (IGC). >> > >> > In order to vote, as per the conditions of the IGC's charter, you must >> > specify that you subscribe to the IGC charter and thus accept/ >> > affirm IGC >> > membership (see http://www.igcaucus.org/charter). This can be done >> > on the >> > webpage that opens when you click the following link: >> > >> > http://websurvey.syr.edu//Survey.aspx?i=b95f780a4f884a92aa1e5dec765385bb >> > >> > A positive response to the question will take you to the ballot >> > where you >> > can tick/check the candidate for whom you choose to vote. There is >> > a link >> > to background information supplied by the candidates on the ballot >> > paper. >> > >> > After you have voted, you will then be taken to a page that confirms >> > your >> > vote has been registered. While at this page you may still go back and >> > change your vote. However, after you click on "Finish" on the final >> > page, >> > your vote will be final and cannot be changed. >> > >> > You may cast your vote anytime upon receipt of this message, until >> > 24h00 GMT >> > on Sunday, 21 December 2008. >> > >> > We strongly encourage you to cast your vote as a sign of active >> > engagement >> > with the caucus. Although, voting is not compulsory for retaining >> > membership >> > if you are already on the IGC members list (please see this list at >> > http://www.igcaucus.org/node/12/%253Cbr%2520/%253E), as per the >> > charter you >> > must vote in this election to be eligible to vote in any charter >> > amendment >> > process that may come up before the next election. You may choose >> > to vote >> > "None of the Above" on the ballot paper to maintain voting >> > eligibility if >> > you do not favour any of the candidates. >> > >> > You may seek any clarification by replying to this email. >> > >> > Thanks >> > >> > Ian Peter >> > Co-coordinator IGC >> > >> > and >> > >> > Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn >> > Associate Professor >> > Director, Cotelco >> > Syracuse University >> > >> > PS: Please do not vote with more than one email ID. If you receive >> > this >> > message more than once, please use only one of them and inform us >> > about the >> > multiple IDs by replying to this email. >> > >> > >> > !DSPAM:2676,494985da133779006219400! >> > >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > > > -- > > Regards. > -------------------------- > Fouad Bajwa > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 11:52:49 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 22:22:49 +0530 Subject: [governance] The End of the Internet in 2012? In-Reply-To: <701af9f70812180752r2eaaf62ct59117fd0e537983d@mail.gmail.com> References: <701af9f70812180752r2eaaf62ct59117fd0e537983d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hello Fouad Bajwa, It is an interesting article that explains in plain language how the big bandwidth providers are taking the Internet closer to the cable subscription model. Todd Lammle draws an analogy of how the free television progressed (or commercially degenerated) to an expensive subscription model. I recall an IGF workshop where Virginia talked the commercial compulsions on the user forcing the user to subscribe to 96 unwanted channels in order to get the four channels that he or she really wants to watch. These are narrow business models, we as television viewers were bought into such models even before we realized what was happening. But on the Internet this may not really happen because we are all a little more experienced and educated now. What sets the Internet apart is the way the user is increasingly becoming a formal part of the policy making process, The user is not going to be taken in unawares any longer. There are moves by the telcos and other bandwidth providers to reshape the Internet into one with unfair business models, but I don't feel that it is going to be easy for these interests to achieve what they want. If such efforts persist and if the user is left with a sitation where there are no options or with a few unpleasant options, the user would not take it this time submissively. The unpleasant outcome for business may not manifest as NEO Internetworks providing pirated access - that may not happen given the present trends towards technologies and policies for greater security. What is likely to emerge is a user owned, alternate network(s) on social enterprise models that is (are) well inter-connected, more open, more legitimate and even more deeply rooted in the fundamental internet values. There are business models, well within the present framework for neutral and affodable access, that could keep the bandwidth providers flourishing. Instead of focusing on such broader business models, some business interests lobby and even clandestinely work towards narrower business models, but on the Internet any progress by such business interests would be suicidal. Same can be said of Government policies that are unbalanced. What happens when one Government tries to maintain some form of supremacy? Is that working with China? Beginning with China a few other nationas could fully or partially protest and that could lead to fragmentation of the Internet which would lead to a totally opposite outcome : rather than enhancing a nation's hold, it would end up totally breaking the Internet away from any possibility of any further benevolent influence. It is not in the commerical interest of business coporations to work towards a cable-like model and it is not in the interest of Governments to seek to maintain an unbalanced form of control. Sivasubramanian Muthusamy India. On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:22 PM, Fouad Bajwa wrote: > An interesting article that has provoked me to even write a book on > the subject. What I see here is the emergence of Local or NEOn e > Internetworks or basically Internet NEO-Clans that will be providing > pirated or hacked access to consumers that will not be able to afford > the huge charges imposed by corporations?: > > The End of the Internet by 2012? > > by Todd Lemmle > http://www.lammle.com/blog/news-and-announcements/22/the-end-of-the-internet-by-2012/ > C > > user is driven against a wall, the adverse outcome may not really be the emegence of NEO clans providing hacked access, but rather an On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:22 PM, Fouad Bajwa wrote: > An interesting article that has provoked me to even write a book on > the subject. What I see here is the emergence of Local or NEOn e > Internetworks or basically Internet NEO-Clans that will be providing > pirated or hacked access to consumers that will not be able to afford > the huge charges imposed by corporations?: > > The End of the Internet by 2012? > > by Todd Lemmle > http://www.lammle.com/blog/news-and-announcements/22/the-end-of-the-internet-by-2012/ > > > -- > > Regards. > -------------------------- > Fouad Bajwa > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Thu Dec 18 12:05:06 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 17:05:06 +0000 Subject: [governance] Thank you to Parminder In-Reply-To: <494A5A1A.2050304@apc.org> References: <494A5A1A.2050304@apc.org> Message-ID: <494A82C2.6020103@wzb.eu> Hi everyone, thank you, Willi, for this detailed and fair appraisal of Parminder's role as coordinator, particularly during the time when is was acting practically on his own. I also agree with what you say about Parminder's role in pushing 'enhanced cooperation' onto the agenda. I heard several people saying that they are not longer suspicious about addressing this topic in the context of the IGF. It is unlikely that we would have achieved this without Parminder's persistence. Being one of those who frequently disagree with Parminder, I am still grateful that he devoted so much time to the Caucus and I hope he won't give up on it. jeanette Willie Currie wrote: > I'd also like to thank Parminder for his commitment and hard work as IGC > coordinator. > > Parminder has played an important role for the IGC during a difficult > period of adjustment to a post-WSIS global policy space in internet > governance, when a sustained attempt to deflect attention from the need > for global public policy principles for managing critical internet > resources was underway as a backlash to the gains made in the WSIS. It > is largely to Parminder's credit that the issue of 'enhanced > cooperation' could be discussed in Hyderabad without the sky falling > down. Indeed a little more attention to public policy principles at an > earlier stage may have helped the IPv4/6 transition as the IGF open > policy dialogue on the matter demonstrated. Like the banking system, I > think we have been witnessing the limits of the claims for technical > expertise in the absence of suitable policy and regulation in the public > interest in this area. And no one had an adequate answer to Jeanette's > question as to who is in charge? Parminder suffered unjustifable attack > while coordinator of the IGC when he did raise questions of public > policy. And I think the shambles around the IPv4/6 transition vindicates > his concerns for public policy frameworks in internet governance. > > There was a long stretch in which Parminder was virtually carrying the > IGC coordination alone. I would like to commend his work for the IGC as > beyond the call of duty and while many may have disgreed with his > arguments, Parminder nevertheless ensured that there was considerable > engagement on the list during his watch. > > All the best, Parminder! > > Willie > > > Peter wrote: >> >> Everyone, >> >> >> >> In a few days we will have a new Co-coordinator to congratulate. >> Please don’t forget to vote! >> >> >> >> All of which means that this is the last few days of Parminder’s term >> as Co-coordinator. >> >> >> >> I have had the please of working with Parminder in this role over the >> last six months, and in working closely with him over this period got >> to appreciate what a splendid job he has done for our Caucus. >> >> >> >> Parminder has had a huge commitment to openness and transparency. He >> had worked very hard to help the Caucus to adopt consensual positions >> on policy matters. He has shown a great policy mind, a firm commitment >> to civil society and its advancement, and a lot of strength in dealing >> with difficult issues. >> >> >> >> I said a few words along these lines in Hyderabad for those who were >> present, but I do want to mark this milestone by thanking Parminder >> for his commitment to IGC. I am glad he is remaining involved and look >> forward to working with him in the future. >> >> >> >> All the best, Parminder, and thank you very much! >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Ian Peter >> >> PO Box 429 >> >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> >> Australia >> >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 12:07:34 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 22:37:34 +0530 Subject: [governance] Re: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot In-Reply-To: <701af9f70812180840j1c52eb8ej5a532b3c743ecdee@mail.gmail.com> References: <20081218091956.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.8c73b95877.wbe@email.secureserver.net> <701af9f70812180840j1c52eb8ej5a532b3c743ecdee@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hello Fouad Bajwa, I would rather suggest that Ian Peter encourages the caucus to undertake a task a little larger than mere de-duplication of the mailing list. The Caucus members could be encouraged to fill in a short form (with optional form fields) so as to collect essential profile information of all the members of the Caucus - Name, street address, phone numbers (optional), organizational affiliation, country of residence, email addresses, website and blog urls. Optional information could be list of publications, detailed educational background, photograph etc. The information so filled in could be integrated into a small data base for Ian Peter and other officers of the IGC to make use of for adminstrative tasks. At the same time, the IGC website could take in the profile information and feature such information as profile information of the members of the caucus. Such an exercise could facilitate the task of de-duplicating easier and at the same time more fool proof. More importantly it could help the coordinators anlayse the compostion of the IGC in various ways - for instance for gender balance, geographic balance, presence of a non-CS member passing on another stakholder's views as a Civil Society view, type of Civil Societies represented in the Caucus, distribution of members on the basis of their interest in specific issues etc. Sivasubramanian Muthusamy India. On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 10:10 PM, Fouad Bajwa wrote: > totally agree with you Karl, I think some systems should be in place > now and provided that drupal also offers variable and useful modules > to support such processes, we should make use of them. Also, we need > to incorporate CiviCRM into the IGC website so that we can run some > campaigns and so forth........... > > On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:19 PM, Karl E. Peters > wrote: > > Or, you might consider a free software such as (but not necessarily) > > www.rsvme.com which send out ballots for you to your mailing list and > > tracks them all by the IP address. It is not foolproof either, but would > > protect, not only against accidental double mailings but also against > people > > who sign up under more than one name specifically to skew voting. (We > always > > hope our memberships are above that, but in a virtual world such as this, > > you can not have too many free and easy checks for security and honesty. > I > > even had someone try to vote twice in the TLDA to test it and was able to > > detect it and remove the vote. > > -Karl E. Peters (TLDA) > > > > -------- Original Message -------- > > Subject: Re: [governance] Re: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator > > Election Ballot > > From: "Fouad Bajwa" > > Date: Thu, December 18, 2008 8:55 am > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Derrick L. Cogburn" > > > > I could volunteer to take the next week to go through the members > > list, send one to one emails confirming which emails users are using > > to recieve messages as well as remove the bouncing and suspended > > accounts so that we have a clean mailing list available. > > > > On 12/18/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > >> Thanks Michael, > >> > >> You are raising an important issue, to which I have responded > >> privately in messages to a few other people. We are well aware that > >> some people are subscribed twice, and in some cases more, on the list. > >> As you suggest, a more complete process would be to cull the voting > >> list of these extra names. However, we didn't feel comfortable making > >> the decision about which address to choose for people, and didn't have > >> the time to go through the list, identify the duplicates, mail then to > >> ask to preferences, then wait for responses. As such, we are relying > >> on the ethics and integrity of our membership not to vote twice (and > >> of course, the technology will indicate if someone voted with more > >> than one address; though not how they voted). > >> > >> So summary, indeed there could be a more perfect system. Perfect > >> opportunity for someone (not me - smile) next time. > >> > >> Cheers, > >> Derrick > >> > >> Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn > >> Syracuse University > >> http://cotelco.syr.edu > >> > >> Sent from my iPhone > >> > >> On Dec 18, 2008, at 3:48 AM, "Michael Gurstein" > >> wrote: > >> > >> > > >> > Derrick and all, > >> > > >> > Since I am subscribed to the list (for historical reasons) with two > >> > email > >> > addresses it appears that I have the opportunity to vote twice, > >> > which I > >> > haven't done. However, the option is there and probably represents a > >> > significant procedural anomaly. > >> > > >> > My suggestion is that given that the numbers aren't huge, that someone > >> > (Derrick?) do a quick visual scan of the elist and see if there are > >> > any > >> > evident anomalies such as mine which might be followed up with an > >> > email > >> > query. > >> > > >> > MG > >> > > >> > -----Original Message----- > >> > From: Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn [mailto:dcogburn at syr.edu] > >> > Sent: December-18-08 1:06 AM > >> > To: mgurst at vcn.bc.ca > >> > Subject: Reminder - 2008 IGC Co-Coordinator Election Ballot > >> > > >> > > >> > Dear IGC List Participant, > >> > > >> > This email invites you to consider voting in the elections for the new > >> > co-coordinator for the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus (IGC). > >> > > >> > In order to vote, as per the conditions of the IGC's charter, you must > >> > specify that you subscribe to the IGC charter and thus accept/ > >> > affirm IGC > >> > membership (see http://www.igcaucus.org/charter). This can be done > >> > on the > >> > webpage that opens when you click the following link: > >> > > >> > > http://websurvey.syr.edu//Survey.aspx?i=b95f780a4f884a92aa1e5dec765385bb > >> > > >> > A positive response to the question will take you to the ballot > >> > where you > >> > can tick/check the candidate for whom you choose to vote. There is > >> > a link > >> > to background information supplied by the candidates on the ballot > >> > paper. > >> > > >> > After you have voted, you will then be taken to a page that confirms > >> > your > >> > vote has been registered. While at this page you may still go back and > >> > change your vote. However, after you click on "Finish" on the final > >> > page, > >> > your vote will be final and cannot be changed. > >> > > >> > You may cast your vote anytime upon receipt of this message, until > >> > 24h00 GMT > >> > on Sunday, 21 December 2008. > >> > > >> > We strongly encourage you to cast your vote as a sign of active > >> > engagement > >> > with the caucus. Although, voting is not compulsory for retaining > >> > membership > >> > if you are already on the IGC members list (please see this list at > >> > http://www.igcaucus.org/node/12/%253Cbr%2520/%253E), as per the > >> > charter you > >> > must vote in this election to be eligible to vote in any charter > >> > amendment > >> > process that may come up before the next election. You may choose > >> > to vote > >> > "None of the Above" on the ballot paper to maintain voting > >> > eligibility if > >> > you do not favour any of the candidates. > >> > > >> > You may seek any clarification by replying to this email. > >> > > >> > Thanks > >> > > >> > Ian Peter > >> > Co-coordinator IGC > >> > > >> > and > >> > > >> > Dr. Derrick L. Cogburn > >> > Associate Professor > >> > Director, Cotelco > >> > Syracuse University > >> > > >> > PS: Please do not vote with more than one email ID. If you receive > >> > this > >> > message more than once, please use only one of them and inform us > >> > about the > >> > multiple IDs by replying to this email. > >> > > >> > > >> > !DSPAM:2676,494985da133779006219400! > >> > > >> ____________________________________________________________ > >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > >> governance at lists.cpsr.org > >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: > >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >> > >> For all list information and functions, see: > >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >> > > > > > > -- > > > > Regards. > > -------------------------- > > Fouad Bajwa > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > > > -- > > Regards. > -------------------------- > Fouad Bajwa > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Thu Dec 18 13:47:15 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Thu, 18 Dec 2008 11:47:15 -0700 Subject: [governance] The End of the Internet in 2012? Message-ID: <20081218114715.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.229b96d34f.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From gurstein at gmail.com Thu Dec 18 23:53:16 2008 From: gurstein at gmail.com (Michael Gurstein) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 06:53:16 +0200 Subject: [governance] Thank you to Parminder In-Reply-To: <494A5A1A.2050304@apc.org> Message-ID: Well said Willie! MG -----Original Message----- From: Willie Currie [mailto:wcurrie at apc.org] Sent: December-18-08 4:12 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Subject: Re: [governance] Thank you to Parminder I'd also like to thank Parminder for his commitment and hard work as IGC coordinator. Parminder has played an important role for the IGC during a difficult period of adjustment to a post-WSIS global policy space in internet governance, when a sustained attempt to deflect attention from the need for global public policy principles for managing critical internet resources was underway as a backlash to the gains made in the WSIS. It is largely to Parminder's credit that the issue of 'enhanced cooperation' could be discussed in Hyderabad without the sky falling down. Indeed a little more attention to public policy principles at an earlier stage may have helped the IPv4/6 transition as the IGF open policy dialogue on the matter demonstrated. Like the banking system, I think we have been witnessing the limits of the claims for technical expertise in the absence of suitable policy and regulation in the public interest in this area. And no one had an adequate answer to Jeanette's question as to who is in charge? Parminder suffered unjustifable attack while coordinator of the IGC when he did raise questions of public policy. And I think the shambles around the IPv4/6 transition vindicates his concerns for public policy frameworks in internet governance. There was a long stretch in which Parminder was virtually carrying the IGC coordination alone. I would like to commend his work for the IGC as beyond the call of duty and while many may have disgreed with his arguments, Parminder nevertheless ensured that there was considerable engagement on the list during his watch. All the best, Parminder! Willie Peter wrote: Everyone, In a few days we will have a new Co-coordinator to congratulate. Please don't forget to vote! All of which means that this is the last few days of Parminder's term as Co-coordinator. I have had the please of working with Parminder in this role over the last six months, and in working closely with him over this period got to appreciate what a splendid job he has done for our Caucus. Parminder has had a huge commitment to openness and transparency. He had worked very hard to help the Caucus to adopt consensual positions on policy matters. He has shown a great policy mind, a firm commitment to civil society and its advancement, and a lot of strength in dealing with difficult issues. I said a few words along these lines in Hyderabad for those who were present, but I do want to mark this milestone by thanking Parminder for his commitment to IGC. I am glad he is remaining involved and look forward to working with him in the future. All the best, Parminder, and thank you very much! Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Fri Dec 19 00:21:50 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 10:51:50 +0530 Subject: [governance] The End of the Internet in 2012? In-Reply-To: <20081218114655.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.81c4c3e60c.wbe@email.secureserver.net> References: <20081218114655.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.81c4c3e60c.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: Hello Karl Peters, On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 12:16 AM, Karl E. Peters < karl.peters at bridgecompanies.com> wrote: > Very well stated! I might just comment that in many areas very soon, > and in more later, it will not even be cable, but rather wireless providers > that carry most of the freight and are best positioned to capture their > markets. > In a brief moment of fairness to the cable TV companies though, they > brought us MANY stations we would never have had, even in major broadcast > markets, and for some more rural markets where even "local" stations were > not clear, vastly improved viewing ability and convenience. Unlike the > internet, however, what preceeded cable is still available for free if you > live where you can recieve it and are satisfied with the limited choices. > That is a fair observation. Often in presenting the Civil Society views most of us focus only on challenging the negative moves by business or government that what we write reads like an attempt to depict business or government as evil. The focus was in correcting what is wrong so the good things that needed to be said about cable companies did not feature in my comment, it is very fair on your part to have brought that up. Most participants of the Civil Society are moderate, balanced people. I haven't seen many with a "holier than thou" attitude - holier than business and holier than governments. Multistakeholderism does not work by asking all other stakeholders to stay out of the room. Cable companies have done a lot of good work, telcos have done a lot of good work, proprietary business corporations in IT and Internet have done a lot of good work, but the problem is that many of these companies still fail to see how the magic works on the Internet. At a point of time when hotmail, yahoo and several email services were running email services with rules such as log in at least once a month to keep your account alive and pay $240 a year for a premium account with TEN M E G A B I T S of storage, Google went online with most so called premium features inherently bundled in (pop access, 9 months between log ins, message forward) and threw in a Gigabit of storage for free. Why did google do something so foolish as to give away the equivallent in a tiered storage model of a possible $1000 or $2000 for free? Fools? Rather intelligent, very intelligent entrepreneurs. Just that what did not reach the minds of msn and yahoo reached the Google entrepreneurs and they had figured out that it probably cost them less than a dollar or some amount in that realm to per user to offer all this to the user. Even if it is a dollar per user it was still foregoing the 'preemium' revenues that were perfectly justifiable under the established norms of Internet business at that point of time. But those who continued to follow the yahoolike models progressed at a rate that paled in comparison with the revolutionary Google model. That is Internet's magaic business model that caused the likes of Google and Skype to climb way above the traditional enterprises with narrower models. (Here I have refrained from commenting on some finer aspects of the Google model that requires to challenged) The Civil Society isn't asking the bandwidth providers shut down shop and disappear. All that it is asking them to do is try and figure out how the magic business models work on the Internet. Thuraya, by the traditional model ought to have been the richest telco in the world today, because by far its revneue model was superficially the most lucrative model - the user had to be something in the realm of $6 per minute even if he or she was calling the person next door. What happened? A more visible example is that the phone companies progressed to much higher levels of inherenet networth and market capitalization as they slided proices from a dollar or two per minute to a cent or two per minute (India). We are pro-business in our suggestion that the business corporations move to the Internet model. The magic is intriguing but I can say that it works and works well. If you don't belive in the Internet magic and instead believe in archaic business practices and assume that you will have an internet with free access to eBay and Amazon (who will pay to you in bulk backdoor) and charge us to access anything worthwhile, the models will fail so miserably that it would hurt your own fortunes. > Bringing this analogy back to the internet, now; can you imagine a > discounted internet service that only brings you ".org" access, for example, > but for a cheaper price? Of course not! This foolishness evident in limiting > access for cheaper services in the internet is exactly the battle the TLDA > is waging for open access to bring quality-run non-legacy TLDs to a wider > audience, as well. We will provide a carefully researched "recommended root" > and the information needed to make the simple and free changes to recieve > and offer "more channels" for the same price. Just as with cable networks, > some will carry better programming or content than others. Some may well > never be "watched" by most people; but everything will be available for > those that need or desire it. The only resistance will come from those with > a vested interest in a narrow and controlled market that funnels more of the > money to fewer end profit makers. ICANN, with its relationship with NetSol > and a few others is the perfect example of this narrow approach, solely in > the interest of capturing more dollars. > Without going into the nuances, in general, it is NOT unfair on the part of ICANN to 'capture' a share of the money from names and numbers. The trade reaps revenues from names and numbers and if ICANN charges at source a dollar or two, it would help ICANN financially sustain itself in the face of a growing administrative (or co-ordinative) burden. But in the process it should exercise all the caution not to revert the Internet back to the era of DNS war and cause the Internt to be an Internet of mutliple Network Solutions. It may well be this kind of narrowness that makes the "more channels" a > feature the "renegade" providers can use as a lure to draw people from the > traditional providers. ICANN has the choice to open up to the many well-run > TLDs already operating as the initially intended "test beds" or to try to > grasp ever tighter onto what it holds. It is the exactly that very tight > grasp, though, that will force an ever increasing portion of their subjects > to escape to fulfill their needs. ICANN can either lead the way as it was > supposed to do, or get left behind with a few grains of sand in their tight > grasp and their once controlled empire scattered all around them, running > free. > > Sincerely, > Karl E. Peters, President > Top--Level Domain Association, Inc. > Thank you -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai > > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: Re: [governance] The End of the Internet in 2012? > From: "Sivasubramanian Muthusamy" > Date: Thu, December 18, 2008 11:52 am > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, "Fouad Bajwa" > > Hello Fouad Bajwa, > > > It is an interesting article that explains in plain language how the big > bandwidth providers are taking the Internet closer to the cable subscription > model. Todd Lammle draws an analogy of how the free television progressed > (or commercially degenerated) to an expensive subscription model. I recall > an IGF workshop where Virginia talked the commercial compulsions on the user > forcing the user to subscribe to 96 unwanted channels in order to get the > four channels that he or she really wants to watch. > > These are narrow business models, we as television viewers were bought into > such models even before we realized what was happening. But on the Internet > this may not really happen because we are all a little more experienced and > educated now. > > What sets the Internet apart is the way the user is increasingly becoming a > formal part of the policy making process, The user is not going to be taken > in unawares any longer. There are moves by the telcos and other bandwidth > providers to reshape the Internet into one with unfair business models, but > I don't feel that it is going to be easy for these interests to achieve what > they want. > > If such efforts persist and if the user is left with a sitation where there > are no options or with a few unpleasant options, the user would not take it > this time submissively. The unpleasant outcome for business may not manifest > as NEO Internetworks providing pirated access - that may not happen given > the present trends towards technologies and policies for greater security. > What is likely to emerge is a user owned, alternate network(s) on social > enterprise models that is (are) well inter-connected, more open, more > legitimate and even more deeply rooted in the fundamental internet values. > > There are business models, well within the present framework for neutral > and affodable access, that could keep the bandwidth providers flourishing. > Instead of focusing on such broader business models, some business interests > lobby and even clandestinely work towards narrower business models, but on > the Internet any progress by such business interests would be suicidal. > > Same can be said of Government policies that are unbalanced. What happens > when one Government tries to maintain some form of supremacy? Is that > working with China? Beginning with China a few other nationas could fully or > partially protest and that could lead to fragmentation of the Internet which > would lead to a totally opposite outcome : rather than enhancing a nation's > hold, it would end up totally breaking the Internet away from any > possibility of any further benevolent influence. > > It is not in the commerical interest of business coporations to work > towards a cable-like model and it is not in the interest of Governments to > seek to maintain an unbalanced form of control. > > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy > India. > > On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:22 PM, Fouad Bajwa wrote: > >> An interesting article that has provoked me to even write a book on >> the subject. What I see here is the emergence of Local or NEOn e >> Internetworks or basically Internet NEO-Clans that will be providing >> pirated or hacked access to consumers that will not be able to afford >> the huge charges imposed by corporations?: >> >> The End of the Internet by 2012? >> >> by Todd Lemmle >> http://www.lammle.com/blog/news-and-announcements/22/the-end-of-the-internet-by-2012/ >> C >> >> user is driven against a wall, the adverse outcome may not really be the > emegence of NEO clans providing hacked access, but rather an > > On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:22 PM, Fouad Bajwa wrote: > >> An interesting article that has provoked me to even write a book on >> the subject. What I see here is the emergence of Local or NEOn e >> Internetworks or basically Internet NEO-Clans that will be providing >> pirated or hacked access to consumers that will not be able to afford >> the huge charges imposed by corporations?: >> >> The End of the Internet by 2012? >> >> by Todd Lemmle >> http://www.lammle.com/blog/news-and-announcements/22/the-end-of-the-internet-by-2012/ >> >> >> -- >> >> Regards. >> -------------------------- >> Fouad Bajwa >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > > > > -- > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy > http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy > http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ > http://twitter.com/isocchennai > > ------------------------------ > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Fri Dec 19 09:17:16 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (JFC Morfin) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 15:17:16 +0100 Subject: [governance] The End of the Internet in 2012? In-Reply-To: References: <20081218114655.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.81c4c3e60c.wbe@email.secureserver.net> Message-ID: <20081219141724.87DA8E1F6A@smtp3.electricembers.net> Dear "Isolated", I fully agree with you. The most balanced and authoritative evaluation of the problem is what IAB writes in RFC 3869. They states: "The principal thesis of this document is that if commercial funding is the main source of funding for future Internet research, the future of the Internet infrastructure could be in trouble. In addition to issues about which projects are funded, the funding source can also affect the content of the research, for example, towards or against the development of open standards, or taking varying degrees of care about the effect of the developed protocols on the other traffic on the Internet. At the same time, many significant research contributions in networking have come from commercial funding. However, for most of the [IAB R&D priorities listed] in this document, relying solely on commercially-funded research would not be adequate." This is why after having urgently contained at IETF and ISO a set of poor commercial initiatives endangering languages and cultures in cyberspace, I: - have initiated the IUCG iucg at ietf.org mailing list, https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iucg - am concerting with IESG over the organisation and charter of the http://iucg.org site, - wait for an IAB decision, - and submitted an IETF Draft on IETF precautionary duty and the necessary participation of users and people (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-iucg-precaution-00.txt). It is necessary to take advantage from past experiences. However, history never repeats and the lesson is not only what as happened and the eventual (necessarily accidental and technical layer dependent) results, but the level where that kind of things happened and were decided. If we really want to understand the today's situation we also have at least to remember things before we were born such as: the telephone/TV/press history, most of the Cybernetics societal impact (technical and most of all political, from where date (50's) the dichotomy between "engineers" and "users", who are not the people but a new brand of the next epoch (60's) "consumers"), the Internet architecture as documented (and not documented) in RFC 1958, and the IETF Internet technology core values (RFC 3935) since the technology is not what it could be but what respect them [and we have good reasons why to disagree with their 80's vision]. Lessig is correct. The Internet (hence the virtual and part of the real world) constitution is in the code. The source code, i.e. what decides of it: the RFCs. For too long we believed we unable to write RFCs. This cannot because IETF tries to keep a consistent/coherent set of the 5.500 - to many for CS - of them. But, we can specify, in our own visions, words and languages, what the RFC framework should be. In the exact way you say it: not in opposing but in helping, guiding, cooperating with other IGF poles. This has a huge advantage for the IETF: their mission (RFC 3935) is to make the Internet work better for us. But the only way they have to know if they succeeded or not, is when we use their propositions or disregard them long after. Already 15 years for IPv6, 10 for DNSSEC; 20 for some DNS extensions. The IUCG is about us to telling them _before_ - so they can work on something more concrete, more along our need and ideas; and dialog with us, in their own way of thinking. The difficulty, where I need help now the Charter is finished http://iucg.org/wiki/IUCG_Charter - is to work-out a site, a method which can act as an interface between the civil and the engineering society. To translate our own words (in every languages) into technical contributions the IESG and IAB can understand and the IETF work on. This also call for us to determine what HR, privacy, Net neutrality, spam, names, development, access, etc. technically require. Please let us not tell we do not know: most of what we legally discuss are contractual [ICANN], legal [GAC] or application layer [IETF, ex. IDNA]) patches to a few major lacks of the Internet technology: no-built-in security, no session and presentation layers. We can decide to continue that way in better technically organizing it (this is at least necessary for any transition), to change that (this has a cost and constraints), and how to change it (there are several possible architectures and "network contracts"). This only is that we cannot continue for ever to overload a 1983 prototype academic system with everything _and_ its contrary. jfc At 06:21 19/12/2008, Sivasubramanian Muthusamy wrote: >Hello Karl Peters, > >On Fri, Dec 19, 2008 at 12:16 AM, Karl E. Peters ><karl.peters at bridgecompanies.com> >wrote: > Very well stated! I might just comment that in many areas very > soon, and in more later, it will not even be cable, but rather > wireless providers that carry most of the freight and are best > positioned to capture their markets. > In a brief moment of fairness to the cable TV companies though, > they brought us MANY stations we would never have had, even in > major broadcast markets, and for some more rural markets where even > "local" stations were not clear, vastly improved viewing ability > and convenience. Unlike the internet, however, what preceeded cable > is still available for free if you live where you can recieve it > and are satisfied with the limited choices. > > >That is a fair observation. Often in presenting the Civil Society >views most of us focus only on challenging the negative moves by >business or government that what we write reads like an attempt to >depict business or government as evil. The focus was in correcting >what is wrong so the good things that needed to be said about cable >companies did not feature in my comment, it is very fair on your >part to have brought that up. > >Most participants of the Civil Society are moderate, balanced >people. I haven't seen many with a "holier than thou" attitude - >holier than business and holier than governments. >Multistakeholderism does not work by asking all other stakeholders >to stay out of the room. Cable companies have done a lot of good >work, telcos have done a lot of good work, proprietary business >corporations in IT and Internet have done a lot of good work, but >the problem is that many of these companies still fail to see how >the magic works on the Internet. > >At a point of time when hotmail, yahoo and several email services >were running email services with rules such as log in at least once >a month to keep your account alive and pay $240 a year for a premium >account with TEN M E G A B I T S of storage, Google went online >with most so called premium features inherently bundled in (pop >access, 9 months between log ins, message forward) and threw in a >Gigabit of storage for free. Why did google do something so foolish >as to give away the equivallent in a tiered storage model of a >possible $1000 or $2000 for free? Fools? Rather intelligent, very >intelligent entrepreneurs. Just that what did not reach the minds of >msn and yahoo reached the Google entrepreneurs and they had figured >out that it probably cost them less than a dollar or some amount in >that realm to per user to offer all this to the user. Even if it is >a dollar per user it was still foregoing the 'preemium' revenues >that were perfectly justifiable under the established norms of >Internet business at that point of time. But those who continued to >follow the yahoolike models progressed at a rate that paled in >comparison with the revolutionary Google model. That is Internet's >magaic business model that caused the likes of Google and Skype to >climb way above the traditional enterprises with narrower models. >(Here I have refrained from commenting on some finer aspects of the >Google model that requires to challenged) > >The Civil Society isn't asking the bandwidth providers shut down >shop and disappear. All that it is asking them to do is try and >figure out how the magic business models work on the Internet. >Thuraya, by the traditional model ought to have been the richest >telco in the world today, because by far its revneue model was >superficially the most lucrative model - the user had to be >something in the realm of $6 per minute even if he or she was >calling the person next door. What happened? A more visible example >is that the phone companies progressed to much higher levels of >inherenet networth and market capitalization as they slided proices >from a dollar or two per minute to a cent or two per minute (India). > >We are pro-business in our suggestion that the business corporations >move to the Internet model. The magic is intriguing but I can say >that it works and works well. If you don't belive in the Internet >magic and instead believe in archaic business practices and assume >that you will have an internet with free access to eBay and Amazon >(who will pay to you in bulk backdoor) and charge us to access >anything worthwhile, the models will fail so miserably that it would >hurt your own fortunes. > > Bringing this analogy back to the internet, now; can you > imagine a discounted internet service that only brings you ".org" > access, for example, but for a cheaper price? Of course not! This > foolishness evident in limiting access for cheaper services in the > internet is exactly the battle the TLDA is waging for open access > to bring quality-run non-legacy TLDs to a wider audience, as well. > We will provide a carefully researched "recommended root" and the > information needed to make the simple and free changes to recieve > and offer "more channels" for the same price. Just as with cable > networks, some will carry better programming or content than > others. Some may well never be "watched" by most people; but > everything will be available for those that need or desire it. The > only resistance will come from those with a vested interest in a > narrow and controlled market that funnels more of the money to > fewer end profit makers. ICANN, with its relationship with NetSol > and a few others is the perfect example of this narrow approach, > solely in the interest of capturing more dollars. > > >Without going into the nuances, in general, it is NOT unfair on the >part of ICANN to 'capture' a share of the money from names and >numbers. The trade reaps revenues from names and numbers and if >ICANN charges at source a dollar or two, it would help ICANN >financially sustain itself in the face of a growing administrative >(or co-ordinative) burden. But in the process it should exercise all >the caution not to revert the Internet back to the era of DNS war >and cause the Internt to be an Internet of mutliple Network Solutions. > >It may well be this kind of narrowness that makes the "more >channels" a feature the "renegade" providers can use as a lure to >draw people from the traditional providers. ICANN has the choice to >open up to the many well-run TLDs already operating as the initially >intended "test beds" or to try to grasp ever tighter onto what it >holds. It is the exactly that very tight grasp, though, that will >force an ever increasing portion of their subjects to escape to >fulfill their needs. ICANN can either lead the way as it was >supposed to do, or get left behind with a few grains of sand in >their tight grasp and their once controlled empire scattered all >around them, running free. > >Sincerely, >Karl E. Peters, President >Top--Level Domain Association, Inc. > > >Thank you >-- >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy >http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy >http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ >http://twitter.com/isocchennai > >-------- Original Message -------- >Subject: Re: [governance] The End of the Internet in 2012? >From: "Sivasubramanian Muthusamy" ><isolatedn at gmail.com> >Date: Thu, December 18, 2008 11:52 am >To: governance at lists.cpsr.org, >"Fouad Bajwa" <fouadbajwa at gmail.com> >Hello Fouad Bajwa, > >It is an interesting article that explains in plain language how the >big bandwidth providers are taking the Internet closer to the cable >subscription model. Todd Lammle draws an analogy of how the free >television progressed (or commercially degenerated) to an expensive >subscription model. I recall an IGF workshop where Virginia talked >the commercial compulsions on the user forcing the user to subscribe >to 96 unwanted channels in order to get the four channels that he or >she really wants to watch. >These are narrow business models, we as television viewers were >bought into such models even before we realized what was happening. >But on the Internet this may not really happen because we are all a >little more experienced and educated now. >What sets the Internet apart is the way the user is increasingly >becoming a formal part of the policy making process, The user is not >going to be taken in unawares any longer. There are moves by the >telcos and other bandwidth providers to reshape the Internet into >one with unfair business models, but I don't feel that it is going >to be easy for these interests to achieve what they want. >If such efforts persist and if the user is left with a sitation >where there are no options or with a few unpleasant options, the >user would not take it this time submissively. The unpleasant >outcome for business may not manifest as NEO Internetworks providing >pirated access - that may not happen given the present trends >towards technologies and policies for greater security. What is >likely to emerge is a user owned, alternate network(s) on social >enterprise models that is (are) well inter-connected, more open, >more legitimate and even more deeply rooted in the fundamental >internet values. >There are business models, well within the present framework for >neutral and affodable access, that could keep the bandwidth >providers flourishing. Instead of focusing on such broader business >models, some business interests lobby and even clandestinely work >towards narrower business models, but on the Internet any progress >by such business interests would be suicidal. >Same can be said of Government policies that are unbalanced. What >happens when one Government tries to maintain some form of >supremacy? Is that working with China? Beginning with China a few >other nationas could fully or partially protest and that could lead >to fragmentation of the Internet which would lead to a totally >opposite outcome : rather than enhancing a nation's hold, it would >end up totally breaking the Internet away from any possibility of >any further benevolent influence. > >It is not in the commerical interest of business coporations to work >towards a cable-like model and it is not in the interest of >Governments to seek to maintain an unbalanced form of control. >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy >India. >On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:22 PM, Fouad Bajwa ><fouadbajwa at gmail.com> wrote: >An interesting article that has provoked me to even write a book on >the subject. What I see here is the emergence of Local or NEOn e >Internetworks or basically Internet NEO-Clans that will be providing >pirated or hacked access to consumers that will not be able to afford >the huge charges imposed by corporations?: >The End of the Internet by 2012? >by Todd Lemmle >http://www.lammle.com/blog/news-and-announcements/22/the-end-of-the-internet-by-2012/ > >C > >user is driven against a wall, the adverse outcome may not really be >the emegence of NEO clans providing hacked access, but rather an >On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:22 PM, Fouad Bajwa ><fouadbajwa at gmail.com> wrote: >An interesting article that has provoked me to even write a book on >the subject. What I see here is the emergence of Local or NEOn e >Internetworks or basically Internet NEO-Clans that will be providing >pirated or hacked access to consumers that will not be able to afford >the huge charges imposed by corporations?: >The End of the Internet by 2012? >by Todd Lemmle >http://www.lammle.com/blog/news-and-announcements/22/the-end-of-the-internet-by-2012/ > >-- >Regards. >-------------------------- >Fouad Bajwa >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > >governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >For all list information and functions, see: > >http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > >-- >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy >http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy > >http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ >http://twitter.com/isocchennai > > >---------- >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: >governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >For all list information and functions, see: >http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dannyyounger at yahoo.com Fri Dec 19 16:15:31 2008 From: dannyyounger at yahoo.com (Danny Younger) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 13:15:31 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] NTIA/DOC Comments on ICANN's New gTLD Process In-Reply-To: <20081219141724.87DA8E1F6A@smtp3.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <350944.53002.qm@web52202.mail.re2.yahoo.com> http://www.ntia.doc.gov/comments/2008/ICANN_081218.pdf ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From yehudakatz at mailinator.com Fri Dec 19 19:16:00 2008 From: yehudakatz at mailinator.com (Yehuda Katz) Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2008 16:16:00 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] NTIA/DOC Comments on ICANN's New gTLD Process In-Reply-To: 350944.53002.qm@web52202.mail.re2.yahoo.com Message-ID: Thanks Danny, their may be People whom would also be interested in reading ICANN's announcement: How to Apply for a New Generic Top-Level Domain Draft Applicant Guidebook Now Available for Comment http://www.icann.org/en/announcements/announcement-2-23oct08-en.htm - By the way ICANN has also implemented a: Revamped Whois Inaccuracy Reporting System Goes Live http://www.icann.org/en/announcements/announcement-19dec08-en.htm InterNIC (Live Link - via email submission) Whois Data Problem Reporting System - Single Submission Request http://wdprs.internic.net/ -- End -30- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Fri Dec 19 23:16:12 2008 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 13:16:12 +0900 Subject: [governance] Questionnaire: IGF consultation, Geneva, 23-24 February 2009 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The IGF Secretariat have prepared a questionnaire to gather information for the February consultations. 15 questions in an online form Questions below, but they should be completed online before 31 January 2009. Two main themes for the consultation and the questionnaire: * Taking stock of the Hyderabad Meeting and suggest improvements for the 2009 Meeting to be held in Sharm El Sheikh * Preparing the IGF Review process Usual style: what worked well/less well, about the new format and a question about how to conduct the review of the IGF at the Sharm El Sheikh meeting. I think it would be very helpful to also send separate comments about themes, although such comments can also be included in what worked well/less well etc. Adam See , can't be sure the questions won't change. (asked for email address, name and affiliation.) Did the meeting meet your expectations? What worked well? What worked less well? What did you think of the new format with main session panels and the open dialogue sessions? Did the other workshops and other meetings you attended meet your expectations? Was there sufficient room for interaction with participants? How did you see the linkages between the different types of meetings? Is there room for improvement? Should all the different types of events be maintained on the programme of the fourth IGF meeting in Sharm El Sheikh? Are there any other kind of meeting structures that you think would be useful to consider? Did the 'IGF Village' meet your expectations? If not, what can be improved for the next IGF? Was the discussion space in the 'IGF Village' useful? The Secretariat prepared a synthesis paper as the official meeting input document The paper summarized all contributions received and was translated in all six UN languages. Was this paper useful? Should this practice be continued? If you had one significant improvement to suggest for the next IGF, what would it be? Other suggestions for improvement in view of the Sharm El Sheikh meeting? Any other comments or suggestions? The Tunis Agenda calls on the UN Secretary-General ³to examine the desirability of the continuation of the Forum, in consultation with Forum participants, within five years of its creation, and to make recommendations to the UN membership in the regard². This consultation will have to take place at the Sharm El Sheikh meeting. How should it be prepared? ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Sat Dec 20 10:06:05 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 15:06:05 +0000 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming Message-ID: <494D09DD.10407@wzb.eu> Hi everyone, we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before we know it there is another election waiting. The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of information about the new members in August! We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start thinking about candidates. These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August 22 mail): Valeria Betancourt Graciela Selaimen Y. J. Park Natasha Primo And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. Robin Gross Jeanette Hofmann Ken Lohento Qusai Al Shatti About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the renewed members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. All the best, jeanette ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From asif at kabani.co.uk Sat Dec 20 13:24:31 2008 From: asif at kabani.co.uk (Kabani) Date: Sat, 20 Dec 2008 23:24:31 +0500 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <494D09DD.10407@wzb.eu> References: <494D09DD.10407@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <8017791e0812201024o20372af9xcdfb35cdab042995@mail.gmail.com> Jeanette, Thank you for the update. Wih Best Regrads Sincerely Asif Kabani 2008/12/20 Jeanette Hofmann : > Hi everyone, > > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before we > know it there is another election waiting. > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with the > MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new members in > time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. > > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our mail > archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of information about > the new members in August! > > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start > thinking about candidates. > > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August 22 > mail): > > Valeria Betancourt > Graciela Selaimen > Y. J. Park > Natasha Primo > > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. > > Robin Gross > Jeanette Hofmann > Ken Lohento > Qusai Al Shatti > > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the renewed > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more complicated, > we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. > > All the best, jeanette > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Sat Dec 20 14:15:56 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 06:15:56 +1100 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <494D09DD.10407@wzb.eu> Message-ID: Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite a bit of lead time to go through this. Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 candidates from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for candidates and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on this early in January. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] > Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > > Hi everyone, > > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before > we know it there is another election waiting. > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with > the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new > members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. > > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our > mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of > information about the new members in August! > > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start > thinking about candidates. > > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August > 22 mail): > > Valeria Betancourt > Graciela Selaimen > Y. J. Park > Natasha Primo > > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. > > Robin Gross > Jeanette Hofmann > Ken Lohento > Qusai Al Shatti > > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the renewed > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more > complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. > > All the best, jeanette > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Sat Dec 20 14:16:03 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 00:16:03 +0500 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <494D09DD.10407@wzb.eu> References: <494D09DD.10407@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <701af9f70812201116n4432d59i1546e52ada623798@mail.gmail.com> Thank you for sharing this information but please do share that what are the requirements for nomination. i would be interested in participating in the MAG with my permanent responsibility towards the Open Internet and actionable work towards FOSS, Openness, Alternate IP and rights. On 12/20/08, Jeanette Hofmann wrote: > Hi everyone, > > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before > we know it there is another election waiting. > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with > the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new > members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. > > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our > mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of > information about the new members in August! > > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start > thinking about candidates. > > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August > 22 mail): > > Valeria Betancourt > Graciela Selaimen > Y. J. Park > Natasha Primo > > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. > > Robin Gross > Jeanette Hofmann > Ken Lohento > Qusai Al Shatti > > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the renewed > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more > complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. > > All the best, jeanette > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Sent from my mobile device Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Sun Dec 21 04:52:09 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 20:52:09 +1100 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> I've just noticed from the IGC website that the final date for nominations for MAG renewal has just been set as February 15. I do not believe it is possible for us to carry out the procedure outlined in our charter in that time frame, ie 1. get 25 names for nomcom pool - from past experience and with a holiday season that would take us till at least January 12 2. select nomcom - till January 19 3. set criteria - till January 26 (very minimal) 4. call for nominations - close February 10 5. choose candidates - requires at least 2 weeks to do effectively. So we are out of time. And that is assuming we start today, no delays. However I believe we should come up with a quicker process and put in some nominations rather than miss out altogether. So I am interested in suggestions as to how we might proceed in a fair and reasonable manner with a shortened process. Please make suggestions. Within 48 hours there will be a new Co-cordinator announced, I would like to discuss with them our best path forward given the time and holiday season constraints, and your suggestions will be very welcome. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > Sent: 21 December 2008 06:16 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Jeanette Hofmann' > Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > > Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite a bit > of > lead time to go through this. > > Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 candidates > from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for candidates > and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on this > early in January. > > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] > > Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before > > we know it there is another election waiting. > > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with > > the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new > > members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. > > > > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our > > mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of > > information about the new members in August! > > > > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start > > thinking about candidates. > > > > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August > > 22 mail): > > > > Valeria Betancourt > > Graciela Selaimen > > Y. J. Park > > Natasha Primo > > > > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. > > > > Robin Gross > > Jeanette Hofmann > > Ken Lohento > > Qusai Al Shatti > > > > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the renewed > > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more > > complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. > > > > All the best, jeanette > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Sun Dec 21 07:22:45 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 12:22:45 +0000 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> References: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> Message-ID: <494E3515.9060802@wzb.eu> Hi Ian, I wasn't aware of the deadline when I sent the message re MAG renewal. It is true, we havn't got much time for the selection process. Shortening our own procedures is one option. Unless the charter specifically asks us to proceed in the way you described below, we could easily perform some of the tasks in parallel. If we start with the call for nominations in early January, for example, we could close the call shortly after the selection criteria have been set. Say, end of January or so. However, another option would be to ask the secretariat to give us more time. jeanette Ian Peter wrote: > I've just noticed from the IGC website that the final date for nominations > for MAG renewal has just been set as February 15. I do not believe it is > possible for us to carry out the procedure outlined in our charter in that > time frame, ie > > 1. get 25 names for nomcom pool - from past experience and with a holiday > season that would take us till at least January 12 > 2. select nomcom - till January 19 > 3. set criteria - till January 26 (very minimal) > 4. call for nominations - close February 10 > 5. choose candidates - requires at least 2 weeks to do effectively. So we > are out of time. > > And that is assuming we start today, no delays. > > However I believe we should come up with a quicker process and put in some > nominations rather than miss out altogether. So I am interested in > suggestions as to how we might proceed in a fair and reasonable manner with > a shortened process. > > Please make suggestions. Within 48 hours there will be a new Co-cordinator > announced, I would like to discuss with them our best path forward given the > time and holiday season constraints, and your suggestions will be very > welcome. > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] >> Sent: 21 December 2008 06:16 >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Jeanette Hofmann' >> Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >> >> Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite a bit >> of >> lead time to go through this. >> >> Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 candidates >> from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for candidates >> and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on this >> early in January. >> >> >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] >>> Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 >>> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >>> >>> Hi everyone, >>> >>> we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before >>> we know it there is another election waiting. >>> The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with >>> the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new >>> members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. >>> >>> This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our >>> mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of >>> information about the new members in August! >>> >>> We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start >>> thinking about candidates. >>> >>> These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August >>> 22 mail): >>> >>> Valeria Betancourt >>> Graciela Selaimen >>> Y. J. Park >>> Natasha Primo >>> >>> And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. >>> >>> Robin Gross >>> Jeanette Hofmann >>> Ken Lohento >>> Qusai Al Shatti >>> >>> About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the renewed >>> members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more >>> complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. >>> >>> All the best, jeanette >>> >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>> >>> For all list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From klohento at panos-ao.org Sun Dec 21 07:57:31 2008 From: klohento at panos-ao.org (Ken Lohento) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 13:57:31 +0100 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <494E3515.9060802@wzb.eu> References: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> <494E3515.9060802@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <494E3D3B.5020303@panos-ao.org> Hi Jeanette, Ian I suggest we see how to shorten our process. If we ask the secretariat to give us more time, we might then also be responsible of (or at least contribute to) delaying the process now that they have launched it in time. Let's start a shorter process (after election of the new coordinator) - For example call for nominations can formally take only a week, since people are already being informed that the renewal process have started officially. If afterwards it appears that we really need more time, we would then ask them that. PS : I would also like to join my voice to those who thank Parminder for his work as co-coordinator of the group : thank you! Best wishes for 2009 Ken L Jeanette Hofmann a écrit : > Hi Ian, > > I wasn't aware of the deadline when I sent the message re MAG renewal. > It is true, we havn't got much time for the selection process. > Shortening our own procedures is one option. Unless the charter > specifically asks us to proceed in the way you described below, we > could easily perform some of the tasks in parallel. If we start with > the call for nominations in early January, for example, we could close > the call shortly after the selection criteria have been set. Say, end > of January or so. > > However, another option would be to ask the secretariat to give us > more time. > > jeanette > > Ian Peter wrote: >> I've just noticed from the IGC website that the final date for >> nominations >> for MAG renewal has just been set as February 15. I do not believe it is >> possible for us to carry out the procedure outlined in our charter in >> that >> time frame, ie >> >> 1. get 25 names for nomcom pool - from past experience and with a >> holiday >> season that would take us till at least January 12 >> 2. select nomcom - till January 19 >> 3. set criteria - till January 26 (very minimal) >> 4. call for nominations - close February 10 >> 5. choose candidates - requires at least 2 weeks to do effectively. >> So we >> are out of time. >> >> And that is assuming we start today, no delays. >> However I believe we should come up with a quicker process and put in >> some >> nominations rather than miss out altogether. So I am interested in >> suggestions as to how we might proceed in a fair and reasonable >> manner with >> a shortened process. >> >> Please make suggestions. Within 48 hours there will be a new >> Co-cordinator >> announced, I would like to discuss with them our best path forward >> given the >> time and holiday season constraints, and your suggestions will be very >> welcome. >> >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] >>> Sent: 21 December 2008 06:16 >>> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Jeanette Hofmann' >>> Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >>> >>> Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite >>> a bit >>> of >>> lead time to go through this. >>> >>> Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 >>> candidates >>> from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for >>> candidates >>> and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on >>> this >>> early in January. >>> >>> >>> >>> Ian Peter >>> PO Box 429 >>> Bangalow NSW 2479 >>> Australia >>> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >>> www.ianpeter.com >>> >>> >>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>> From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] >>>> Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 >>>> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >>>> >>>> Hi everyone, >>>> >>>> we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and >>>> before >>>> we know it there is another election waiting. >>>> The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start >>>> with >>>> the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new >>>> members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. >>>> >>>> This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our >>>> mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of >>>> information about the new members in August! >>>> >>>> We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to >>>> start >>>> thinking about candidates. >>>> >>>> These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's >>>> August >>>> 22 mail): >>>> >>>> Valeria Betancourt >>>> Graciela Selaimen >>>> Y. J. Park >>>> Natasha Primo >>>> >>>> And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. >>>> >>>> Robin Gross >>>> Jeanette Hofmann >>>> Ken Lohento >>>> Qusai Al Shatti >>>> >>>> About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the >>>> renewed >>>> members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more >>>> complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. >>>> >>>> All the best, jeanette >>>> >>>> >>>> ____________________________________________________________ >>>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>>> >>>> For all list information and functions, see: >>>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >>> ____________________________________________________________ >>> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >>> governance at lists.cpsr.org >>> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >>> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >>> >>> For all list information and functions, see: >>> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From asif at kabani.co.uk Sun Dec 21 08:11:30 2008 From: asif at kabani.co.uk (Kabani) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 18:11:30 +0500 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> References: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> Message-ID: <8017791e0812210511m5daa2ce8gf8764830289c05c6@mail.gmail.com> Ian, I agree with you that the process will take some time perhaps on the other hand the nominations for MAG renewal is Feb 15, my suggestion that we may talk to Markus at IGF Secretariat and request him to find some solution to this problem by granting some extra time or other options if any. This suggestion is based on my previous experience working with IGF its worth a try. With Best Regards Sincerely Yours Asif Kabani On 21/12/2008, Ian Peter wrote: > I've just noticed from the IGC website that the final date for nominations > for MAG renewal has just been set as February 15. I do not believe it is > possible for us to carry out the procedure outlined in our charter in that > time frame, ie > > 1. get 25 names for nomcom pool - from past experience and with a holiday > season that would take us till at least January 12 > 2. select nomcom - till January 19 > 3. set criteria - till January 26 (very minimal) > 4. call for nominations - close February 10 > 5. choose candidates - requires at least 2 weeks to do effectively. So we > are out of time. > > And that is assuming we start today, no delays. > > However I believe we should come up with a quicker process and put in some > nominations rather than miss out altogether. So I am interested in > suggestions as to how we might proceed in a fair and reasonable manner with > a shortened process. > > Please make suggestions. Within 48 hours there will be a new Co-cordinator > announced, I would like to discuss with them our best path forward given the > time and holiday season constraints, and your suggestions will be very > welcome. > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > > Sent: 21 December 2008 06:16 > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Jeanette Hofmann' > > Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > > > > Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite a bit > > of > > lead time to go through this. > > > > Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 candidates > > from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for candidates > > and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on this > > early in January. > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] > > > Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 > > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before > > > we know it there is another election waiting. > > > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with > > > the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new > > > members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. > > > > > > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our > > > mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of > > > information about the new members in August! > > > > > > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start > > > thinking about candidates. > > > > > > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August > > > 22 mail): > > > > > > Valeria Betancourt > > > Graciela Selaimen > > > Y. J. Park > > > Natasha Primo > > > > > > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. > > > > > > Robin Gross > > > Jeanette Hofmann > > > Ken Lohento > > > Qusai Al Shatti > > > > > > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the renewed > > > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more > > > complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. > > > > > > All the best, jeanette > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn Sun Dec 21 08:49:27 2008 From: tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn (Tijani BEN JEMAA) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 14:49:27 +0100 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming References: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> Message-ID: <000a01c96372$f3ba8a80$4001a8c0@acerb8600603ec> Ian and all, I think we can use the criteria of last year and call for nomination immediately; we will manage to be on time with no major violation of our charter. Happy new year -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tijani BEN JEMAA Member of the Tunisian Engineers' Order Vice Chairman of CIC World Federation of Engineering Organizations Phone : + 216 98 330 114 Fax : + 216 70 860 861 -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Peter" To: ; "'Ian Peter'" ; "'Jeanette Hofmann'" Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 10:52 AM Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > I've just noticed from the IGC website that the final date for nominations > for MAG renewal has just been set as February 15. I do not believe it is > possible for us to carry out the procedure outlined in our charter in that > time frame, ie > > 1. get 25 names for nomcom pool - from past experience and with a holiday > season that would take us till at least January 12 > 2. select nomcom - till January 19 > 3. set criteria - till January 26 (very minimal) > 4. call for nominations - close February 10 > 5. choose candidates - requires at least 2 weeks to do effectively. So we > are out of time. > > And that is assuming we start today, no delays. > > However I believe we should come up with a quicker process and put in some > nominations rather than miss out altogether. So I am interested in > suggestions as to how we might proceed in a fair and reasonable manner > with > a shortened process. > > Please make suggestions. Within 48 hours there will be a new Co-cordinator > announced, I would like to discuss with them our best path forward given > the > time and holiday season constraints, and your suggestions will be very > welcome. > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] >> Sent: 21 December 2008 06:16 >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Jeanette Hofmann' >> Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >> >> Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite a bit >> of >> lead time to go through this. >> >> Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 candidates >> from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for >> candidates >> and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on this >> early in January. >> >> >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] >> > Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 >> > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >> > >> > Hi everyone, >> > >> > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before >> > we know it there is another election waiting. >> > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with >> > the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new >> > members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. >> > >> > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our >> > mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of >> > information about the new members in August! >> > >> > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start >> > thinking about candidates. >> > >> > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August >> > 22 mail): >> > >> > Valeria Betancourt >> > Graciela Selaimen >> > Y. J. Park >> > Natasha Primo >> > >> > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. >> > >> > Robin Gross >> > Jeanette Hofmann >> > Ken Lohento >> > Qusai Al Shatti >> > >> > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the >> > renewed >> > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more >> > complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. >> > >> > All the best, jeanette >> > >> > >> > ____________________________________________________________ >> > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > >> > For all list information and functions, see: >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Sun Dec 21 09:23:12 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 19:53:12 +0530 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> References: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> Message-ID: Hello Ian Peter, There is nothing wrong in opting for a quicker process, or in writing to Markus Kummer for more time, but I think we may be able to find a solution within the IGC. >From your breakup of the process time it appears that the task of setting criteria is lined up as a task dependent on the task of selection of the nomcom. Considering the time constraint, if we can proceed simultaneously on tasks 1 and 3 and simultaneously open a discussion thread in the list to arrive at a criteria for the candidates, the list can send its recommended criteria to the new nom-com on 19th, the nom-com could adopt / modfiy the criteria by the 21st. Task 4, call for nomination also need not be considered as a task dependant on selection of nom-com. The existing nom-com may call for candidates as early as tomorrow to colse it by Feb 19, allowing the new nom-com to go over the list of nominees and announce an appoved list of candidates by the 21st. If we allow 10 days for voting, we will have the list of candidates by Februay 1. I don't know about the inticacies, you as the Co-ordinator would know better. Sivasubramanian Muthusamy On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 3:22 PM, Ian Peter wrote: > I've just noticed from the IGC website that the final date for nominations > for MAG renewal has just been set as February 15. I do not believe it is > possible for us to carry out the procedure outlined in our charter in that > time frame, > 1. get 25 names for nomcom pool - from past experience and with a holiday > season that would take us till at least January 12 > 2. select nomcom - till January 19 > 3. set criteria - till January 26 (very minimal) > 4. call for nominations - close February 10 > 5. choose candidates - requires at least 2 weeks to do effectively. So we > are out of time. > > And that is assuming we start today, no delays. > > However I believe we should come up with a quicker process and put in some > nominations rather than miss out altogether. So I am interested in > suggestions as to how we might proceed in a fair and reasonable manner with > a shortened process. > > Please make suggestions. Within 48 hours there will be a new Co-cordinator > announced, I would like to discuss with them our best path forward given > the > time and holiday season constraints, and your suggestions will be very > welcome. > > > Ian Peter > PO Box 429 > Bangalow NSW 2479 > Australia > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > > Sent: 21 December 2008 06:16 > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Jeanette Hofmann' > > Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > > > > Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite a bit > > of > > lead time to go through this. > > > > Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 candidates > > from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for > candidates > > and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on this > > early in January. > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] > > > Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 > > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before > > > we know it there is another election waiting. > > > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with > > > the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new > > > members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. > > > > > > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our > > > mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of > > > information about the new members in August! > > > > > > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start > > > thinking about candidates. > > > > > > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August > > > 22 mail): > > > > > > Valeria Betancourt > > > Graciela Selaimen > > > Y. J. Park > > > Natasha Primo > > > > > > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. > > > > > > Robin Gross > > > Jeanette Hofmann > > > Ken Lohento > > > Qusai Al Shatti > > > > > > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the > renewed > > > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more > > > complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. > > > > > > All the best, jeanette > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From gurstein at gmail.com Sun Dec 21 09:24:42 2008 From: gurstein at gmail.com (Michael Gurstein) Date: Sun, 21 Dec 2008 16:24:42 +0200 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality Message-ID: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> I think this discussion may be of interest in presenting a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality (K-Net is a leading (indigenous controlled) provider of Internet and Telecom services to Canadian indigenous peoples and Steve Anderson is a leading Canadian NN advocate... MBG -----Original Message----- From: Brian Beaton [mailto:brian.beaton at knet.ca] Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 6:03 AM To: 'Steve Anderson' Cc: 'lshade at alcor.concordia.ca'; 'Adi Linden' Subject: RE: [Fwd: FW: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to the public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet] Steve ... Let's hope there are people out there who will listen to you and that you remain safe during your NN struggle [smiles]. I can accept and support your position in this complicated debate. The reason I challenge people who make reference to NN during presentations and discussions is because too often we are left with the simplistic perspective that all things are equal and a NN policy is required that will protect their existing comfortable existence. Our work at K-Net is only one step in a very complicated and complex effort to level the playing field. It is taking a long time to move things forward but I believe we are helping to get online services into places where they are most needed. I do look forward to seeing how the NN efforts work out with the CRTC. I am wondering if I might share your message with a few selected people who are on the discussion thread with me with this other fellow. BTW, he seems to have stopped writing back to me so I guess he is agreeing to disagree [smiles]. Your presentation is probably the most rational and appropriate presentation that I have seen throughout this entire debate. Thank you for taking the time to write this one. Best wishes for you and those around you during this special time of year. Brian Beaton, K-Net Coordinator Keewaytinook Okimakanak Box 1439, 115 King Street Sioux Lookout, ON, P8T 1B9 T: 807-737-1135 x1251 F: 807-737-1720 IP and ISDN video conferencing E: brianbeaton at knet.ca W: http://knet.ca -----Original Message----- From: steveinfos at gmail.com [mailto:steveinfos at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Steve Anderson Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 2:07 AM To: brian.beaton at knet.ca Cc: lshade at alcor.concordia.ca; Adi Linden Subject: Re: [Fwd: FW: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to the public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet] Hi Brain, Adi etc... thanks for passing on your perspective and that exchange. I am definitely less of a hardliner than the person you had an exchange with. I think he might come from a more libertarian perspective, whereas mine would be more political-economic. I also think NN advocates have learned that the situation is a bit more complicated than initially thought. First off I completely agree with this: > If I may, I would like to suggest that communities should be given the > opportunity to determine for themselves what their priorities and > needs are, > the same way institutions such as hospitals, colleges, universities, > etc are > provided with the resources to determine how they manage their > networks." One of the arguments I have been making to the CRTC is that community and municipal Internet provision should be supported and increased as much as possible. I think ultimately this what we need. However, right now we do have a few big telecoms controlling much of the net access, so we need to make sure they do not take control of the medium. So my work is targeted at these telecom carriers, and I do try to make this clear. And for sure I'm am flexible in my definition in that NN is about not letting telecom carriers tilt the nets level playing field by discriminating against competitors (creating a slow lane), and giving priority access to those who have deep pockets (creating a fast line). Also in the mix is that big telecom should not be throttling Independent and community ISPs services. If anyone should be shapping traffic, it should be the ISPs, not the carriers. I'm fine with prioritizing/shaping for health, VOIP, etc.. as long as it's protocal agnostic, and not anti-competitive. For health and education I'm even more flexible - this is about public service, which is fine. NN is about preventing big telecom from selling preferential service for their commercial corporate interest. The two are very different. In terms of community net service, I actually agree that when communities control their own infrastructure, they can determine themselves how the net should work. Really there is no commercial or anti-competitive issue here, and I think most of what your talking about fits into my definition of net neutrality anyway - if a rural community wants to provide priority service for a health or educational service, that is not anti-competitive - you are not discriminating between competing services, you are just prioritizing services in the public interest. If you look at the SaveOurNet.ca principles you'll see they are more than open enough to include the kinds of activities you wish to engage in. It's about protecting the open Internet, and supporting community controlled infrastructure is part of that in my view. Community controlled infrastructure and NN are not mutually exclusive in my view - far from it, I'd say they mutually reinforcing. I do think we should be pushing for more control by local communities, and I certainly support more infrastructure investment for K-Net. -and I have and will continue to have this point of view in my submissions and conversations with the CRTC. I could be wrong, but I think the biggest threat right now is that big telcom will be allowed to become the gatekeepers of the Internet. I don't think it is likely at all that the CRTC will over regulate Net Neutrality, especially as it pertains to projects like K-Net. If they do enforce NN and/or add new NN rules, I'm very confident they will be flexible, probably too flexible for my liking. I do appreciate that I am a privileged urban dweller, who likely cannot fully appreciate the resource limitations of many rural/remote communities in Canada. I do try, but acknowledge, there are limitations in terms of me not experiencing directly the conditions on the ground in these communities etc.. I do respect that you may have some different opinions based on the realities you have to deal with. With that said, I hope we can find common ground in terms of NN policies that benefit both rural/remote communities and everyone else in Canada. Ultimately I think we both want to limit the control big telcom has over the Internet, while finding ways to advance community/public control over the Internet. To me the key is 1) getting good and but reasonably flexible NN rules in place with enforcement 2) creating some kind of national broadband plan that will help close the digital divide and make broadband as ubiquitous as possible. To me this last part requires good public interest regulation, major public investment - preferably directed at community and municipal net provision/infrastructure rather than big telecoms who have shown that they cannot be trusted nice to be in touch with you, Steve On Sun, Dec 14, 2008 at 10:15 PM, Brian Beaton wrote: > Steve ... Thanks for your comments about K-Net and our work. I am including > Adi Linden who works with K-Net to help make online services available > in remote and rural First Nations across Canada. > > I appreciate your perspective that "Net Neutrality is a principle that > can be interpreted differently in differing situations". I really do > hope that the people involved in policy development understand the > complexities related to how this debate is so complex. Unfortunately, > I have very little > faith in most policy makers along with the majority of people who live > and work in urban environments where bandwidth and fibre > infrastructure exists for their use. I too would be a BIG advocate of > NN IF AND ONLY IF all things > are equal in terms of bandwidth availability AND fibre infrastructure. > Unfortunately this requirement is FAR from a reality in the distance future > so until then I think the debate for NN needs to be VERY CAREFULLY developed > so the work we are doing in remote and rural communities is not > affected by > developed policies. > > I recently got into quite the discussion / debate about the merits of > NN and > its challenges for those communities and regions with limited access > to bandwidth. The fellow writing about NN works at an urban college > with few problems concerning bandwidth and infrastructure ... I am > going to share our > exchange with you so you can understand the issues that I am trying to make > sure are part of the discussions. > > ++++++++++ > > Thanks for taking the time to write this lengthy message. I believe we share > a similar distrust of "network managers / technicians" who > unilaterally determine what is right for the rest of us. > > I believe (I hope) we are coming towards a better understanding of our > different positions concerning how this "net neutrality" issue is affecting > people and communities who unfortunately are not being included in > this debate. > > It seems to me that people, in general, are becoming very complacent > when it > comes to technology and tend to be accepting whatever the corporations > are selling them, believing that they are being "taken care of" by > these institutions and corporate agents who seem to me to be only > interested in their own bottom line. If someone is not happy with > their service, it seems > to me that they simply move to another service provider or level of service > that meets their needs. Unfortunately this just leaves a lot of people > off line or dealing with inadequate service. > > So who is this NN debate really for and what is it really all about. > If it about trying to do what is right for the people, then I guess it > will all come down to who will own the infrastructure. In Canada, this responsibility > is clearly in the hands of the private sector and it seems to me that > it will remain that way. So the only people who can influence this > debate are the regulatory bodies, ie. the CRTC and the government. But > from what I see > and read, the private sector seems to be continuing to be determining > and influencing the rules of the game so ... good luck the this NN > struggle the > way it is presently being delivered by "intellectuals" who care. > > As far as what the NN debate is all about ... your presentation seems > to be > make it a matter of who should be determining how these private > networks and > infrastructure should be managed and by whom. So unless you are > willing to pay for the infrastructure and then putting the management > of these networks > into the hands of people who you think will protect your definition of > NN, then I think there is a problem with all this discussion. > > If I may, I would like to suggest that communities should be given the > opportunity to determine for themselves what their priorities and > needs are, > the same way institutions such as hospitals, colleges, universities, > etc are > provided with the resources to determine how they manage their > networks. With this type of financial support, communities will be > able to determine the provider who can address these issues as best as > possible. > > There are several reasons I am suggesting this approach but maybe the > comments I am imbedding in your message might help to clarify some of > this ... > > -----Original Message----- > > Executive summary of my more lengthy reply (below) to Brian Beaton: > > - network management policies only apply when bandwidth is scarce > > OKAY ... this makes sense to me ... so every provider of bandwidth is > now able to demonstrate that the bandwidth they have available is > scarce and therefore must be managed in some way ... at least I would > assume that this > will be the position of those providers who are trying to support a variety > of applications on their networks. > > - scarce bandwidth must not be metered out according to the type, > origin, or destination of network packets > > NICE objective but then how is scarce bandwidth going to be managed? > In my mind and in the delivery model I am suggesting, the community > needs to determine their priorities and needs. > > - the content of the public Internet is determined by its end-users, > not by its network managers > > ANOTHER NICE objective but I am not too sure how practical this one is given > what we have seen the priorities and needs of end-users who seem to > like being sold sex, gambling and whatever other vice they can find to > escape their realities. If you are lobbying that these priorities need > to be protected then I would suggest you should be lobbying your local > drug store, > casino and other actual vice providers so everyone is able to do > whatever they wish. > > - central network management that limits an Internet network to > "approved" uses or "authorized" users stifles innovation and is > contrary to how the Internet evolved to where it is today > > MAYBE ... I guess this might be how universities, colleges, hospitals > and other public supported institutions protect their environments by > determining who is "approved" to use and participate in their > environments and "authorized" to make decisions affecting everyone > else. It seems to me that this principle, if applied to NN, then it > should be applied equally across all sectors. > > - if you need central control over the content on or who can use a > network, you aren't talking about a public Internet network > > GREAT ... so ... let's get talking about building and sustaining a "public" > Internet network because I am not aware of any such entity anywhere or > at least what I would define as such. > > On Fri, Nov 21, 2008 at 07:40:54AM -0600, Brian Beaton wrote: >> in an ideal world where all things are equal and where there is >> unlimited bandwidth (another myth) then NN would be GREAT. > > No, a net neutrality policy isn't needed if unlimited bandwidth is > available. With unlimited bandwidth, everyone gets the full net > access that > they want and no policies are needed at all. It's only when things > get tight, and you have to start denying access, that you need a > policy to decide what (and who) gets denied. > > If you don't enforce net neutrality, then what gets dropped isn't up > to the > end user, it's up to every network manager, and that kind of central control > has serious problems. Without NN, every network manager will > determine who > can use the Internet, and for what purpose. Some managers will say > "pay me > if you want access", and all the small guys get shut out. Some will > say "no > unauthorized uses", and all the network innovation will stop. This > would be > a disaster for community nets. > > The core Internet today doesn't give priority to people who pay more, > and changing to a money-talks model or authorized-uses-only model has > serious drawbacks for community networks and citizen participation. > Crowded roads in > rush hour don't give priority to those who can pay more or who earn > more; everyone is equal. That principle should extend to our core > networks, too. > > The Wikipedia article gives examples of the neutrality concept, dating back > all the way to the use of telegraph lines. They consciously chose not > to create a tiered system. > >> Everyone does the best they can but the reality is all summed in your >> concluding statement that "I doubt rural communities would be able to >> compete with concentrated urban centres in paying high prices for >> better network access." This is exactly what is happening today and >> why we have the challenges we have with getting the required >> infrastructure and bandwidth in remote and rural communities and >> regions. > > Then you should support net neutrality, not fight it. If the network > managers who run The Internet get to drop packets unless you pay them > the big bucks for access, individuals and rural communities just won't > be able to afford to get their packets online. We need rules that say > all (or at least most) traffic is treated equally, no matter what it > is or where it comes from. > > BB - Sorry if it seems that I am fighting NN but I think I am arguing > with the people who are suggesting that NN is just a simple matter of > claiming that all IP traffic needs to be treated equally. I believe we > have gotten past that point in this exchange. > > I am also thinking that this is not just about "network managers" but > it is > something much bigger that can and should involve communities who are trying > to develop and access equitable services and applications that the > folks in > the cities take for granted. > >> So people fighting for NN are only going to make it more difficult >> for the rest of us to move forward as they work their systems to give >> them more and more ... it is all about greed not about equality. > > I don't understand why you think NN people are against equality. Net > neutrality works against greed, at least the kind of greed that says > individual network managers get to decide who in a country gets > network access. NN wants a level playing field so that mom's packets > and AT&T's packets get equal treatment. > > BB - Again I am sorry if you read what I write as "NN people are > against equality" because I hope that is what they are trying to > achieve but again people need to understand the bigger picture so > everyone can avoid the "us and them" divide that continues to grow in > this country. The simplistic presentations about NN and how these > corporate "network managers" are the monsters really is getting old > IMHO ... > > What we need is adequate and equitable resources so communities can develop > and support the applications and priorities they deem to be important > to them. > >> The analogy of the public roads is an interesting one. To claim that >> they are not being carefully managed seems to me to be totally wrong. >> They have >> fast lanes, slow lanes, the rules require people to move over for >> certain vehicles, there are paved roads, there are dirt roads > > All of these roads are usable by everyone. The roads don't give > priority to > citizens depending on their salary or what they are carrying in their cars. > Everyone has the same speed limit; everyone has the same lane width to drive > in. The roads, all the different lanes and surfaces, are neutral. > > BB- Again, only those who have access to the resources to be able to > use these "neutral roads" are able to use them. And yet, the people > who use the > roads are able to lobby government to ensure they have access to the > type of > roads that they believe they need and want through the use of > everyone's taxes. Even the roads analogy can be picked a part to show > that even those regions with the larger voting population are getting > the paved roads and the rest of us are forced to use dirt road because > of greed and certain management decisions that determine who is > getting what level of service. > >> there are toll roads > > Yes, toll roads go against "road neutrality"; only people with extra > money get to use them. But there aren't many toll roads; most of the > roads are neutral and will take any car you want to drive on them, > without giving priority to any type of car or any type of content. > > Of course there are no free roads on The Internet; everything requires > a minimal fee. But once you've paid that fee, NN says your packets > should be > treated the same as everyone else's packets. Even on a toll road, > once you've paid the fee, your car is treated the same as every other > car; you can't pay more to drive faster than anyone else or have more > space. > > Imagine if you could buy a special expensive car permit that had > priority on > the roads, such that all cars with cheaper permits had to yield to > your car > with its expensive permit, even to the point of them driving off the > road if > your car needed to drive there. At rush hour, only the rich people > who paid > the premiums could ever drive to work. This kind of per-car permit > isn't practical on the public roads; but, it is easily done on the > Internet if you > don't enforce NN. Community networks need NN. I want mom's packets treated > the same as AT&T packets. > >> Your definition of the internet is inadequate and tries to make IP traffic >> all the same by oversimplifying the reality. That is probably fine >> for you >> in your environment but it sure does not work in our environment. > > It isn't my definition; it's the common definition, and my Internet is > the same as yours. All IP traffic *is* the same; that's the way the > Internet works, currently; it's a feature. It's what has made the > Internet so useful > - money doesn't buy your packets priority, and there are no > "unauthorized" or "priority" uses. (Your expensive car won't get you > to work any faster than a cheap car on the public roads, and there no > differential treatment for what you carry in your car - everyone has > equal access.) > > BB - Okay the "common definition" that you wish to use is fine for you > and everyone who takes this type of position but it sure is not my > definition of > the internet which I have tried to present to you and everyone else. > In my world, all IP traffic is NOT the same ... just as some people > would argue that a more expensive car might be more dependable to get > them work instead > of the cheap car ... it is all about perception ... I agree that you > have yours and I hope you can try to understand that I have a > different understanding and definition of what the Internet is about. > >> There are different protocols for videoconferencing and VOIP that >> make it possible to identify these packets. We are operating a >> private, managed networks with POPs in over 100 communities and we >> have to manage the traffic so patients are able to see a doctor >> during a consult. So NN will not help us in our remote and rural >> communities ... it will only make it impossible for us to continue to >> deliver the applications that the communities need and want ... > > If you want doctors or videoconferencing to have priority on your > network, you can't use the neutral, public Internet network for that. > On the public > Internet, you don't get to choose centrally who gets priority, or what gets > priority. Everyone is treated equally, and should continue to be > treated equally. You need to run your own private network if you want > to dictate who uses it and for what. > > BB - RIGHT ON ... thank you for understanding this reality but do understand > that it is this application that is also supporting these remote and > rural communities to have access to what you might consider a limited > "public internet" service. Like I said before ... everyone is doing > the best they can with the limited resources that are presently being > made available to these remote and rural communities. > > The equality of the current public Internet doesn't work for some > types of things, and it may not work if you aren't really looking for > everyone to be > treated equally. If you want to control what's on your network and > over-ride or prioritize what its users want to use it for, you aren't > providing a public Internet service. > > BB - again, everyone does the best they can to access services ... > reading between the lines in your message, it seems that you are also > suggesting this "public internet service" is something that everyone > has available somewhere ... maybe in your world but this is not the > world where I live and > work ... > > If you want to be able to drive your own car to work and never get > stuck in > traffic, you can't use public roads. On public roads, you have the > same priority as everyone else, no matter whether you're carrying beer > or babies. > Moreover, you cannot ask that all public roads be managed to > accommodate your particular private needs. The roads are neutral. > > BB - again, this definition is yours and belongs in your world from > what I see and read ... > > We must not replace the neutral, public Internet with a private, > managed network that centrally limits or prioritizes what packets get > delivered based on content, source, or destination. Network managers > should not be dictating who gets to use the public Internet and for > what purposes. > >> I thank you for your message because I believe it clearly highlights >> the effort that people are making to protect their interests. It also >> highlights, for me, just how "managed" the networks are and why they >> need to be carefully cared for by those people who are able to >> protect the public interests. > > Your "careful care" doesn't protect the public interest if it goes > against what the public is choosing to use the network for. We don't > tell people they can't drive their cars on the public roads during > rush hour unless they > are doctors or bankers; everyone is treated equally. > > The neutral, public Internet carries the traffic of the people who use > it. By definition, it delivers the applications that people, the > public, its end-users, want, not what its network managers want. If > you want to choose > "carefully" how certain traffic from your communities should have > priority over other traffic, or over what the rest of the Internet > wants, you can't use the neutral, public Internet for that. > > Central management is not how the Internet got to be where it is > today. The > only "careful" care that should apply on the public Internet is care > to enforce network neutrality, not care that tries to pick who or what > gets priority. Any central network management that tries to pick what > kinds of traffic get priority on the Internet will get it wrong. > Things that will be > important on the Internet years from now haven't even been invented > yet. They have to be able to start and grow using the same Internet as everything > else. > > Central management stifles innovation, slows progress, and inhibits > individual citizen participation when it tries to decide on "approved" uses > and "authorized" users of the Internet. We don't allow this kind of > discrimination on the public roads; we must not allow it on the public > Internet. > > BB - hopefully you understand when I write that I respectfully > disagree with > your presentation and the use of the road analogy ... it seem obvious > to me > that we are living and working in two different worlds that hopefully > will result in some useful policies that will support these different realities. > > Thanks again for taking the time to write all this. But I must add > that I am > afraid of people who are taking these entrenched positions and > defending limited definitions that only try to demonstrate that their > way is the right > way. What I am seeing and reading about is a lot of different > realities and > opportunities. > > +++++++ > > Brian Beaton, K-Net Coordinator > Keewaytinook Okimakanak > Box 1439, 115 King Street > Sioux Lookout, ON, P8T 1B9 > T: 807-737-1135 x1251 > F: 807-737-1720 > IP and ISDN video conferencing > E: brianbeaton at knet.ca > W: http://knet.ca > > > -----Original Message----- > From: steveinfos at gmail.com [mailto:steveinfos at gmail.com] On Behalf Of Steve > Anderson > Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 10:51 AM > To: lshade at alcor.concordia.ca; brian.beaton at knet.ca > Subject: Re: [Fwd: FW: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat > to the public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet] > > HI Brian, my name is Steve Anderson. I'm the coordinator of the > SaveOurNet.ca coalition. I'm a big fan of K-Net so would love if you > could elaborate on this note Leslie forwarded to me. > > How would stopping protocol/content specific throttling hurt K-Net? > > How would Net Neutrality make it so K-Net could not exist? > > My understanding is the Net Neutrality is a principle that can be > interrpreted differently in differing situations. The ultimate idea in > my mind is that the principle put into action would act to maintain > the level playing field for online services and applications, and > prevent a fast lane/slow lane version of the Internet, prevent > anti-competitive activity. Traffic shaping for other purposes like > giving priority to traffic needed for telehealth services, VOIP, video > conferencing, etc.. would be fine as long as it is not > anti-competitive - meaning source agnostic. > > Let me know your thoughts, > Steve > > > On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 11:41 AM, wrote: >> >> >> >> >> ---------------------------- Original Message ---------------------------- >> Subject: FW: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to the >> public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet >> From: "Brian Beaton" >> Date: Mon, December 1, 2008 11:35 am >> To: "Leslie Regan Shade" >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Good morning Leslie ... to follow up on this morning question, I am > sharing >> a message that Michael posted the other day that comes out of India. >> >> I struggle with the whole concept of Net Neutrality as it is being debated >> in Canada and the US for many reasons but mainly because in its >> present > form >> it would mean that K-Net could not exist and the remote and rural >> communities we serve would not have the access that they have today. >> >> Brian Beaton, K-Net Coordinator >> Keewaytinook Okimakanak >> Box 1439, 115 King Street >> Sioux Lookout, ON, P8T 1B9 >> T: 807-737-1135 x1251 >> F: 807-737-1720 >> IP and ISDN video conferencing >> E: brianbeaton at knet.ca >> W: http://knet.ca >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: advisors-admin at tc.ca [mailto:advisors-admin at tc.ca] On Behalf Of >> Michael Gurstein >> Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2008 4:00 AM >> To: 'TC Advisors' >> Subject: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to the > public-ness >> and the egalitarian nature of the Internet >> >> >> TC may wish to sign on to this note... >> >> MG >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: apc.forum-bounces at lists.apc.org >> [mailto:apc.forum-bounces at lists.apc.org] On Behalf Of Roshni >> Nuggehalli >> Sent: November-26-08 6:14 PM >> To: apc.forum at lists.apc.org >> Subject: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to the public-ness and the >> egalitarian nature of the Internet >> >> >> >> Dear All, >> >> Apologies for cross-posting. >> >> Most of us tend to take the commons and the public nature of the >> Internet for granted. However, increasing corporatisation and control >> of the Internet are strongly threatening these fundamental >> characteristics of the Internet as we know it. Therefore, six civil >> society organisations in India have proposed an open letter to the UN >> Internet Governance Forum which meets for its third annual meeting >> between 3rd and 6th December in Hyderabad. The letter exhorts urgent >> global action to ensure that the public-ness and the egalitarian >> nature of the Internet are preserved as its essential features. The >> possibilities of democracy, equity and social justice in our >> societies will be significantly impacted by the extent to which we >> can achieve this objective. >> >> The proposed letter is pasted below. If you and/or your organization >> wish to endorse this letter, please indicate so in response to this >> email by the midnight of 1st December(India time). Please respond >> offline and not to the entire mailing list. >> >> The proposed open letter can also be accessed at >> > http://www.itforchange.net/component/content/article/195-igf-open-letter.htm >> l >> >> Thanks and Regards, >> Roshni. >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> * An Open Letter to the UN Internet Governance Forum (IGF) for its >> 3rd Annual Meeting at Hyderabad, India, from 3rd to 6th December, >> 2008 >> * >> >> *The IGF must ACT NOW against the threat to the >> public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet >> * >> >> >> The undersigned wish to express their deep concern that the UN >> Internet Governance Forum (IGF), created by the World Summit on the >> Information Society in 2005 as an Internet 'policy dialogue' forum, >> is largely failing >> to address key public interest and policy issues in global Internet >> governance - including that of democratic deficit. >> >> *Who shapes the Internet, as the Internet shapes our new social >> context? >> >> The Internet represents the single most important technical advance >> of our society in a long time, so much so that it defines a new >> emerging > social >> paradigm. The basic characteristics of the Internet determine the contours >> of the emerging social order in many important ways. The Internet was >> conceived as, and still largely is, an extensive communication system > which >> is democratizing, and has little respect for established social > hierarchies. >> Interactions and associations built over this new 'techno-social' >> system have, therefore, held the promise of a more egalitarian >> society. The era > of >> innocence of the Internet however appears to be fast approaching its >> end. Today, the Internet of the future - the very near future - is >> being shaped >> insidiously by dominant forces to further their interests. (See the >> fact-sheet on the following page for some illustrations of this.) >> Unfortunately, global policy forums have largely failed to >> articulate, > much >> less act on, crucial Internet policy issues, which concern the >> democratic possibilities for our societies. >> >> *The IGF needs to act now!* >> >> As the Internet Governance Forum convenes for its third annual >> meeting, between 3rd and 6th December, 2008, in Hyderabad, India, it >> must take immediate steps to anchor and discuss important global >> public interest and >> policy issues involved in Internet governance. If it does not act >> now, it may get seen as a space that only provides an illusion of a >> public policy dialogue, and, consequently, as being co-opted in >> furthering the agenda of >> dominant forces that are shaping the Internet as per their narrow > interests. >> >> >> *We therefore strongly urge the IGF to directly address the following >> key global public interest and policy issues: >> >> 1. Increasing corporatisation of the Internet >> 2. Increasing proprietisation of standards and code that go into >> building the Internet 3. Increasing points of control being embedded >> into the Internet in the > name >> of security and intellectual property violations 4. Huge democratic > deficit >> in global Internet governance >> >> *We exhort the IGF to adopt clear directions for engaging with these >> crucial public policy issues. The IGF should come out with a clear >> work > plan >> at its forthcoming meeting in Hyderabad to address the four key areas > listed >> above. The global community - comprising not only people who >> currently > have >> access to the Internet, but also the un-connected billions who are >> being impacted by it nevertheless - will judge the meaningfulness and legitimacy >> of the IGF in terms of what progress it is able to make on these >> issues. >> >> *Alternative Law Forum, Bangalore Centre for Internet and Society, > Bangalore >> Delhi Science Forum, New Delhi >> Free Software Foundation - India >> IT for Change, Bangalore >> Knowledge Commons, New Delhi >> >> *For endorsements and/or more information, please contact Anja Kovacs >> email: anja (at) itforchange.net, tel: +91 80 266554134, mobile: +91 >> 9611747212 >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------ >> * Information Sheet >> >> How the Public-ness and Egalitarian Nature of the Internet is >> Threatened - >> Some Examples >> >> Corporatisation of the Internet* >> >> Largely unsuspected by most of its users, the Internet is rapidly changing >> from being a vast 'public sphere', with a fully public ownership and >> a non-proprietary nature, to a set of corporatised privately-owned networks. >> On the one hand, telecom companies are carving out the Internet into >> privately-owned networks - controlling the nature of transactions >> over > these >> networks. They seek to differentially charge content providers, while also >> building wholly private networks offering exclusive content relay > services. >> Developments like video/TV over Internet Protocol and the provision >> of controlled and selective Internet services over mobiles are >> contributing > to >> increasing network-operators' control over the Internet, with a >> corresponding erosion of its public-ness. >> >> On the other hand, the commons of the Internet is also being >> overwhelmed > and >> squeezed out by a complete domination of a few privately owned >> mega-applications such as Google, Facebook, Youtube etc. >> >> *Proprietarisation of standards and code that build the Internet* >> >> One of the main ways of appropriating the commons of the Internet is >> through the increasing use of proprietary and closed standards and >> code in >> building the Internet system. Such appropriation allows the extortion >> of illegitimate rent out of the many new forms of commons-based >> activities > that >> are being made possible through the Internet. >> >> *Embedding control points in the Internet* >> A growing confluence of corporatist and statist interests has led to >> the embedding of more and more means of control into the Internet in >> a manner that greatly compromises citizens' rights and freedoms. >> Whether it is the pressure on Internet Service Providers to examine >> Internet traffic for 'intellectual property' violations; or >> imposition of cultural and > political >> controls on the Internet by states within their boundaries; or ITU's >> work > on >> IP trace-back mechanisms; or the tightening of US control over the >> global Internet infrastructure in the name of securing the root zone >> file and the >> domain name system, these new forms of controlling the Internet are >> being negotiated among dominant interests away from public scrutiny >> and wider public interest-based engagements. >> >> *Democratic deficit in global Internet governance* >> The current global Internet governance regime - a new-age privatized >> governance system professing allegiance mostly to a single country, >> the US > - >> has proven to be an active instrument of perpetuation of dominant > commercial >> and geo-political interests. Lately, OECD countries have begun some >> work > on >> developing public policy principles that, due to the inherently >> global nature of the Internet, can be expected to become globally >> applicable. It > is >> quite unacceptable that OECD countries shirk from discussing the same > public >> policy issues at global public policy forums like the IGF that they > discuss >> among themselves at OECD meetings. Apparently, developing countries >> are expected to focus on finding ways to reach connectivity to their >> people, and not burden themselves with higher-level Internet >> governance issues! People's and communities' right to >> self-determination and participation in governance of issues that >> impact their lives should underpin global Internet governance. >> >> ____________________________________________ >> Roshni Nuggehalli >> >> IT for Change >> Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities >> Tel: (00-91-80) 2665 4134, 2653 6890 >> Fax: (00-91-80) 4146 1055 >> >> www.ITforChange.net >> www.IS-Watch.net >> http://India.IS-Watch.net >> >> >> >> ======================================= >> APC Forum is a meeting place for the APC community - people and >> institutions who are or have been involved in collaboration with APC, >> and share the APC vision - a world in which all people have easy, > equal >> and affordable access to the creative potential of information and >> communication technologies (ICTs) to improve their lives and create >> more democratic and egalitarian societies. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> apc.forum mailing list >> apc.forum at lists.apc.org >> http://lists.apc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/apc.forum >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Advisors mailing list >> Advisors at tc.ca http://victoria.tc.ca/mailman/listinfo/advisors >> >> >> >> > > > > -- > Find me on Facebook: > http://FacebookSteve.com > > Find me on Twitter: > http://SteveOnTwitter.com > > See my Democratic Media Blog: > http://democraticmedia.ca/blog/steve-anderson > > Canadian Media News: > http://democraticmedia.ca/news > > > -- Find me on Facebook: http://FacebookSteve.com Find me on Twitter: http://SteveOnTwitter.com See my Democratic Media Blog: http://medialinkscolumn.com Canadian Media News: http://democraticmedia.ca/news ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From asif at kabani.co.uk Mon Dec 22 03:19:09 2008 From: asif at kabani.co.uk (Kabani) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 13:19:09 +0500 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: References: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> Message-ID: <8017791e0812220019g21293292gd06bfe0d2af3b5f6@mail.gmail.com> Hello Ian, Reference to the email below the I would suggest that first we should not rush in the process, then lets be practical, I know the process of MAG selection takes time, so it is no problem for IGF to give us extra time as most of time the nominations of Govt and other also come even after February, Here I just want that people can participate in the process and this will require rationale time. With Best Regards Sincerely Yorus Asif Kabani Email: kabani.asif at gmail.com 2008/12/21 Sivasubramanian Muthusamy : > Hello Ian Peter, > > There is nothing wrong in opting for a quicker process, or in writing to > Markus Kummer for more time, but I think we may be able to find a solution > within the IGC. > > From your breakup of the process time it appears that the task of setting > criteria is lined up as a task dependent on the task of selection of the > nomcom. Considering the time constraint, if we can proceed simultaneously on > tasks 1 and 3 and simultaneously open a discussion thread in the list to > arrive at a criteria for the candidates, the list can send its recommended > criteria to the new nom-com on 19th, the nom-com could adopt / modfiy the > criteria by the 21st. Task 4, call for nomination also need not be > considered as a task dependant on selection of nom-com. The existing > nom-com may call for candidates as early as tomorrow to colse it by Feb 19, > allowing the new nom-com to go over the list of nominees and announce an > appoved list of candidates by the 21st. If we allow 10 days for voting, we > will have the list of candidates by Februay 1. > > I don't know about the inticacies, you as the Co-ordinator would know > better. > > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy > > > On Sun, Dec 21, 2008 at 3:22 PM, Ian Peter wrote: >> >> I've just noticed from the IGC website that the final date for nominations >> for MAG renewal has just been set as February 15. I do not believe it is >> possible for us to carry out the procedure outlined in our charter in that >> time frame, >> 1. get 25 names for nomcom pool - from past experience and with a holiday >> season that would take us till at least January 12 >> 2. select nomcom - till January 19 >> 3. set criteria - till January 26 (very minimal) >> 4. call for nominations - close February 10 >> 5. choose candidates - requires at least 2 weeks to do effectively. So we >> are out of time. >> >> And that is assuming we start today, no delays. >> >> However I believe we should come up with a quicker process and put in some >> nominations rather than miss out altogether. So I am interested in >> suggestions as to how we might proceed in a fair and reasonable manner >> with >> a shortened process. >> >> Please make suggestions. Within 48 hours there will be a new Co-cordinator >> announced, I would like to discuss with them our best path forward given >> the >> time and holiday season constraints, and your suggestions will be very >> welcome. >> >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] >> > Sent: 21 December 2008 06:16 >> > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Jeanette Hofmann' >> > Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >> > >> > Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite a >> > bit >> > of >> > lead time to go through this. >> > >> > Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 >> > candidates >> > from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for >> > candidates >> > and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on this >> > early in January. >> > >> > >> > >> > Ian Peter >> > PO Box 429 >> > Bangalow NSW 2479 >> > Australia >> > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> > www.ianpeter.com >> > >> > >> > >> > > -----Original Message----- >> > > From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] >> > > Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 >> > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > > Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >> > > >> > > Hi everyone, >> > > >> > > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and >> > > before >> > > we know it there is another election waiting. >> > > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start >> > > with >> > > the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new >> > > members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. >> > > >> > > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our >> > > mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of >> > > information about the new members in August! >> > > >> > > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to >> > > start >> > > thinking about candidates. >> > > >> > > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's >> > > August >> > > 22 mail): >> > > >> > > Valeria Betancourt >> > > Graciela Selaimen >> > > Y. J. Park >> > > Natasha Primo >> > > >> > > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. >> > > >> > > Robin Gross >> > > Jeanette Hofmann >> > > Ken Lohento >> > > Qusai Al Shatti >> > > >> > > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the >> > > renewed >> > > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more >> > > complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. >> > > >> > > All the best, jeanette >> > > >> > > >> > > ____________________________________________________________ >> > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > > >> > > For all list information and functions, see: >> > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > >> > ____________________________________________________________ >> > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > >> > For all list information and functions, see: >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > -- > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy > http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy > http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ > http://twitter.com/isocchennai > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dcogburn at syr.edu Mon Dec 22 05:34:00 2008 From: dcogburn at syr.edu (Derrick L. Cogburn) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 05:34:00 -0500 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results Message-ID: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> Dear Colleagues, It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 votes cast, we have the following result: Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new co- coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election (n=100). I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal deadline, and then delete it. Kindest regards, Derrick Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn School of Information Studies and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs Syracuse University 346 Hinds Hall Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 Phone: +1.315.443.5441 Fax: +1.315.443.6886 http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn http://cogburn.blogspot.com http://cotelco.syr.edu ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Mon Dec 22 06:51:59 2008 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:51:59 +0900 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> Message-ID: Derrick, thanks for running the election process. Ginger, congratulations! Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. Best, Adam At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: >Dear Colleagues, > >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 >votes cast, we have the following result: > >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election >(n=100). > >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal >deadline, and then delete it. > >Kindest regards, >Derrick > >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn >School of Information Studies >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs >Syracuse University >346 Hinds Hall >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn >http://cogburn.blogspot.com >http://cotelco.syr.edu > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Mon Dec 22 07:06:11 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 07:36:11 -0430 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> Message-ID: <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Hello everyone, Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy for the IG Caucus work. Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and direction, as usual! Best winter holiday wishes to all, Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results Derrick, thanks for running the election process. Ginger, congratulations! Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. Best, Adam At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: >Dear Colleagues, > >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 >votes cast, we have the following result: > >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election >(n=100). > >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal >deadline, and then delete it. > >Kindest regards, >Derrick > >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn >School of Information Studies >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs >Syracuse University >346 Hinds Hall >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn >http://cogburn.blogspot.com >http://cotelco.syr.edu > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Mon Dec 22 07:11:53 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:41:53 +0530 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality In-Reply-To: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> Message-ID: <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> Michael, Thanks for sharing this, which is one of the most interesting and insightful discussions on Network Neutrality (NN) I have been heard. I have always had a problem with network neutrality principle to the extent that it seems to attempt a technical solution to a social problem. Nobody wants neutrality - whatever it means - for neutrality's sake. We want it for serving the public interest. And, largely, the public interest is served by an Internet which treats all the traffic on it equally and indiscriminately. We need to develop and anchor such basic principles that maximize the possibilities of the Internet as a new revolutionary network - whose central characteristics (mentioned in social rather than technical terms) should be that 1. In terms of ownership - it is public 2. and in terms of its key purpose, and orientation - it is egalitarian (definition of 'egalitarian' from The American Heritage Dictionary - "Affirming, promoting, or characterized by belief in equal political, economic, social, and civil rights for all people") Once we agree to these highest level principles as those most essential to what we call as the Internet - their contextual elaborations can always be done, in different circumstances and as related to different issues and aspects. No doubts, such elaboration will itself be a political process, subject to political trade-offs. The question is, are we as a world community - and to start with as a group of progressive civil society - able to agree to these (or any other) social and political principles to be the highest constitutive principles for the Internet. An Internet architecture which is neutral to the content it carries strongly follows from the above principles, which can be justified, inter alia, by the history of, and problems associated with, media monopolies. While the Internet was touted as a solution to such problems, a non network-neutral can actually make the problem much worse, in many ways (happy to enter into further discussion on this). But the issue of public-ness and egalitarian nature of the Internet goes much further. Subversion of such nature of the Internet is not done only by telecom operators - the butt of criticism in NN discussions. It is equally possible, and likely, to be done, for instance, by Google's (a hero in NN debates) unimaginable domination of the content and application space on the Internet. The way NN is mostly discussed today (and this issue is highlighted by the email exchange below) one in not sure what does it really mean - and what social and political purposes does it really stand for. However, if NN discussions were more rooted in existing social, political and development discourses (1) we will have an easier resolution of the kind of very significant issues being contested in the email exchange below (2) We would know that - just to take an example to show the enormous and multifarious nature of the challenge and corresponding public policy imperatives in this area - the monopoly towards which Google is headed is at least as dangerous as the excesses of the telecoms in contravening NN, for the same purpose of preserving the publicness and egalitarian nature of the Internet. The difference between equality and equity is well established in social and development policy discourse. But a technically oriented mindset finds it difficult to see the difference. What we are seeking is greater equity vis a vis the Internet and not just equality, which distinction can usefully highlight the gap between NN debate and a socio-political debate that needs to be anchored around the Internet. Parminder PS: I do strongly support NN advocacy, and it is currently still the best platform for arguing and pursuing key public interest issues vis a vis the Internet. Everything should be done to strengthen it. In fact if it is nuanced sufficiently with appropriate socio-political (and developmental) elements, it may still serve as the main rallying point for struggles for preserving and promoting the Internet as what many of us dream it can and should be, which incidentally is also in line with the opening paragraphs of the Declaration of Principles of the WSIS. > -----Original Message----- > From: Michael Gurstein [mailto:gurstein at gmail.com] > Sent: Sunday, December 21, 2008 7:55 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Cc: 'Brian Beaton'; steveinfos at gmail.com > Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net > Neutrality > > I think this discussion may be of interest in presenting a very grounded > and > divergent perspective on Net Neutrality (K-Net is a leading (indigenous > controlled) provider of Internet and Telecom services to Canadian > indigenous > peoples and Steve Anderson is a leading Canadian NN advocate... > > MBG > > -----Original Message----- > From: Brian Beaton [mailto:brian.beaton at knet.ca] > Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 6:03 AM > To: 'Steve Anderson' > Cc: 'lshade at alcor.concordia.ca'; 'Adi Linden' > Subject: RE: [Fwd: FW: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to > the public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet] > > Steve ... Let's hope there are people out there who will listen to you and > that you remain safe during your NN struggle [smiles]. I can accept and > support your position in this complicated debate. > > The reason I challenge people who make reference to NN during > presentations > and discussions is because too often we are left with the simplistic > perspective that all things are equal and a NN policy is required that > will > protect their existing comfortable existence. > > Our work at K-Net is only one step in a very complicated and complex > effort > to level the playing field. It is taking a long time to move things > forward > but I believe we are helping to get online services into places where they > are most needed. > > I do look forward to seeing how the NN efforts work out with the CRTC. > > I am wondering if I might share your message with a few selected people > who > are on the discussion thread with me with this other fellow. BTW, he seems > to have stopped writing back to me so I guess he is agreeing to disagree > [smiles]. Your presentation is probably the most rational and appropriate > presentation that I have seen throughout this entire debate. > > Thank you for taking the time to write this one. > > Best wishes for you and those around you during this special time of year. > > Brian Beaton, K-Net Coordinator > Keewaytinook Okimakanak > Box 1439, 115 King Street > Sioux Lookout, ON, P8T 1B9 > T: 807-737-1135 x1251 > F: 807-737-1720 > IP and ISDN video conferencing > E: brianbeaton at knet.ca > W: http://knet.ca > > > -----Original Message----- > From: steveinfos at gmail.com [mailto:steveinfos at gmail.com] On Behalf Of > Steve > Anderson > Sent: Monday, December 15, 2008 2:07 AM > To: brian.beaton at knet.ca > Cc: lshade at alcor.concordia.ca; Adi Linden > Subject: Re: [Fwd: FW: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to > the public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet] > > Hi Brain, Adi etc... thanks for passing on your perspective and that > exchange. > > I am definitely less of a hardliner than the person you had an exchange > with. I think he might come from a more libertarian perspective, whereas > mine would be more political-economic. I also think NN advocates have > learned that the situation is a bit more complicated than initially > thought. > > First off I completely agree with this: > > > If I may, I would like to suggest that communities should be given the > > opportunity to determine for themselves what their priorities and > > needs > are, > > the same way institutions such as hospitals, colleges, universities, > > etc > are > > provided with the resources to determine how they manage their > > networks." > > One of the arguments I have been making to the CRTC is that community and > municipal Internet provision should be supported and increased as much as > possible. I think ultimately this what we need. > > However, right now we do have a few big telecoms controlling much of the > net > access, so we need to make sure they do not take control of the medium. So > my work is targeted at these telecom carriers, and I do try to make this > clear. And for sure I'm am flexible in my definition in that NN is about > not > letting telecom carriers tilt the nets level playing field by > discriminating > against competitors (creating a slow lane), and giving priority access to > those who have deep pockets (creating a fast line). Also in the mix is > that > big telecom should not be throttling Independent and community ISPs > services. If anyone should be shapping traffic, it should be the ISPs, not > the carriers. I'm fine with prioritizing/shaping for health, VOIP, etc.. > as > long as it's protocal agnostic, and not anti-competitive. For health and > education I'm even more flexible - this is about public service, which is > fine. NN is about preventing big telecom from selling preferential service > for their commercial corporate interest. The two are very different. > > In terms of community net service, I actually agree that when communities > control their own infrastructure, they can determine themselves how the > net > should work. Really there is no commercial or anti-competitive issue here, > and I think most of what your talking about fits into my definition of net > neutrality anyway - if a rural community wants to provide priority service > for a health or educational service, that is not anti-competitive - you > are > not discriminating between competing services, you are just prioritizing > services in the public interest. > > If you look at the SaveOurNet.ca principles you'll see they are more than > open enough to include the kinds of activities you wish to engage in. It's > about protecting the open Internet, and supporting community controlled > infrastructure is part of that in my view. Community controlled > infrastructure and NN are not mutually exclusive in my view > - far from it, I'd say they mutually reinforcing. I do think we should be > pushing for more control by local communities, and I certainly support > more > infrastructure investment for K-Net. -and I have and will continue to have > this point of view in my submissions and conversations with the CRTC. > > I could be wrong, but I think the biggest threat right now is that big > telcom will be allowed to become the gatekeepers of the Internet. I don't > think it is likely at all that the CRTC will over regulate Net Neutrality, > especially as it pertains to projects like K-Net. If they do enforce NN > and/or add new NN rules, I'm very confident they will be flexible, > probably > too flexible for my liking. > > I do appreciate that I am a privileged urban dweller, who likely cannot > fully appreciate the resource limitations of many rural/remote communities > in Canada. I do try, but acknowledge, there are limitations in terms of me > not experiencing directly the conditions on the ground in these > communities > etc.. > > I do respect that you may have some different opinions based on the > realities you have to deal with. With that said, I hope we can find common > ground in terms of NN policies that benefit both rural/remote communities > and everyone else in Canada. > > Ultimately I think we both want to limit the control big telcom has over > the > Internet, while finding ways to advance community/public control over the > Internet. To me the key is 1) getting good and but reasonably flexible NN > rules in place with enforcement 2) creating some kind of national > broadband > plan that will help close the digital divide and make broadband as > ubiquitous as possible. To me this last part requires good public interest > regulation, major public investment > - preferably directed at community and municipal net > provision/infrastructure rather than big telecoms who have shown that > they > cannot be trusted > > nice to be in touch with you, > Steve > > > On Sun, Dec 14, 2008 at 10:15 PM, Brian Beaton > wrote: > > Steve ... Thanks for your comments about K-Net and our work. I am > including > > Adi Linden who works with K-Net to help make online services available > > in remote and rural First Nations across Canada. > > > > I appreciate your perspective that "Net Neutrality is a principle that > > can be interpreted differently in differing situations". I really do > > hope that the people involved in policy development understand the > > complexities related to how this debate is so complex. Unfortunately, > > I have very > little > > faith in most policy makers along with the majority of people who live > > and work in urban environments where bandwidth and fibre > > infrastructure exists for their use. I too would be a BIG advocate of > > NN IF AND ONLY IF all > things > > are equal in terms of bandwidth availability AND fibre infrastructure. > > Unfortunately this requirement is FAR from a reality in the distance > future > > so until then I think the debate for NN needs to be VERY CAREFULLY > developed > > so the work we are doing in remote and rural communities is not > > affected > by > > developed policies. > > > > I recently got into quite the discussion / debate about the merits of > > NN > and > > its challenges for those communities and regions with limited access > > to bandwidth. The fellow writing about NN works at an urban college > > with few problems concerning bandwidth and infrastructure ... I am > > going to share > our > > exchange with you so you can understand the issues that I am trying to > make > > sure are part of the discussions. > > > > ++++++++++ > > > > Thanks for taking the time to write this lengthy message. I believe we > share > > a similar distrust of "network managers / technicians" who > > unilaterally determine what is right for the rest of us. > > > > I believe (I hope) we are coming towards a better understanding of our > > different positions concerning how this "net neutrality" issue is > affecting > > people and communities who unfortunately are not being included in > > this debate. > > > > It seems to me that people, in general, are becoming very complacent > > when > it > > comes to technology and tend to be accepting whatever the corporations > > are selling them, believing that they are being "taken care of" by > > these institutions and corporate agents who seem to me to be only > > interested in their own bottom line. If someone is not happy with > > their service, it > seems > > to me that they simply move to another service provider or level of > service > > that meets their needs. Unfortunately this just leaves a lot of people > > off line or dealing with inadequate service. > > > > So who is this NN debate really for and what is it really all about. > > If it about trying to do what is right for the people, then I guess it > > will all come down to who will own the infrastructure. In Canada, this > responsibility > > is clearly in the hands of the private sector and it seems to me that > > it will remain that way. So the only people who can influence this > > debate are the regulatory bodies, ie. the CRTC and the government. But > > from what I > see > > and read, the private sector seems to be continuing to be determining > > and influencing the rules of the game so ... good luck the this NN > > struggle > the > > way it is presently being delivered by "intellectuals" who care. > > > > As far as what the NN debate is all about ... your presentation seems > > to > be > > make it a matter of who should be determining how these private > > networks > and > > infrastructure should be managed and by whom. So unless you are > > willing to pay for the infrastructure and then putting the management > > of these > networks > > into the hands of people who you think will protect your definition of > > NN, then I think there is a problem with all this discussion. > > > > If I may, I would like to suggest that communities should be given the > > opportunity to determine for themselves what their priorities and > > needs > are, > > the same way institutions such as hospitals, colleges, universities, > > etc > are > > provided with the resources to determine how they manage their > > networks. With this type of financial support, communities will be > > able to determine the provider who can address these issues as best as > > possible. > > > > There are several reasons I am suggesting this approach but maybe the > > comments I am imbedding in your message might help to clarify some of > > this ... > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > Executive summary of my more lengthy reply (below) to Brian Beaton: > > > > - network management policies only apply when bandwidth is scarce > > > > OKAY ... this makes sense to me ... so every provider of bandwidth is > > now able to demonstrate that the bandwidth they have available is > > scarce and therefore must be managed in some way ... at least I would > > assume that > this > > will be the position of those providers who are trying to support a > variety > > of applications on their networks. > > > > - scarce bandwidth must not be metered out according to the type, > > origin, or destination of network packets > > > > NICE objective but then how is scarce bandwidth going to be managed? > > In my mind and in the delivery model I am suggesting, the community > > needs to determine their priorities and needs. > > > > - the content of the public Internet is determined by its end-users, > > not by its network managers > > > > ANOTHER NICE objective but I am not too sure how practical this one is > given > > what we have seen the priorities and needs of end-users who seem to > > like being sold sex, gambling and whatever other vice they can find to > > escape their realities. If you are lobbying that these priorities need > > to be protected then I would suggest you should be lobbying your local > > drug > store, > > casino and other actual vice providers so everyone is able to do > > whatever they wish. > > > > - central network management that limits an Internet network to > > "approved" uses or "authorized" users stifles innovation and is > > contrary to how the Internet evolved to where it is today > > > > MAYBE ... I guess this might be how universities, colleges, hospitals > > and other public supported institutions protect their environments by > > determining who is "approved" to use and participate in their > > environments and "authorized" to make decisions affecting everyone > > else. It seems to me that this principle, if applied to NN, then it > > should be applied equally across all sectors. > > > > - if you need central control over the content on or who can use a > > network, you aren't talking about a public Internet network > > > > GREAT ... so ... let's get talking about building and sustaining a > "public" > > Internet network because I am not aware of any such entity anywhere or > > at least what I would define as such. > > > > On Fri, Nov 21, 2008 at 07:40:54AM -0600, Brian Beaton wrote: > >> in an ideal world where all things are equal and where there is > >> unlimited bandwidth (another myth) then NN would be GREAT. > > > > No, a net neutrality policy isn't needed if unlimited bandwidth is > > available. With unlimited bandwidth, everyone gets the full net > > access > that > > they want and no policies are needed at all. It's only when things > > get tight, and you have to start denying access, that you need a > > policy to decide what (and who) gets denied. > > > > If you don't enforce net neutrality, then what gets dropped isn't up > > to > the > > end user, it's up to every network manager, and that kind of central > control > > has serious problems. Without NN, every network manager will > > determine > who > > can use the Internet, and for what purpose. Some managers will say > > "pay > me > > if you want access", and all the small guys get shut out. Some will > > say > "no > > unauthorized uses", and all the network innovation will stop. This > > would > be > > a disaster for community nets. > > > > The core Internet today doesn't give priority to people who pay more, > > and changing to a money-talks model or authorized-uses-only model has > > serious drawbacks for community networks and citizen participation. > > Crowded roads > in > > rush hour don't give priority to those who can pay more or who earn > > more; everyone is equal. That principle should extend to our core > > networks, too. > > > > The Wikipedia article gives examples of the neutrality concept, dating > back > > all the way to the use of telegraph lines. They consciously chose not > > to create a tiered system. > > > >> Everyone does the best they can but the reality is all summed in your > >> concluding statement that "I doubt rural communities would be able to > >> compete with concentrated urban centres in paying high prices for > >> better network access." This is exactly what is happening today and > >> why we have the challenges we have with getting the required > >> infrastructure and bandwidth in remote and rural communities and > >> regions. > > > > Then you should support net neutrality, not fight it. If the network > > managers who run The Internet get to drop packets unless you pay them > > the big bucks for access, individuals and rural communities just won't > > be able to afford to get their packets online. We need rules that say > > all (or at least most) traffic is treated equally, no matter what it > > is or where it comes from. > > > > BB - Sorry if it seems that I am fighting NN but I think I am arguing > > with the people who are suggesting that NN is just a simple matter of > > claiming that all IP traffic needs to be treated equally. I believe we > > have gotten past that point in this exchange. > > > > I am also thinking that this is not just about "network managers" but > > it > is > > something much bigger that can and should involve communities who are > trying > > to develop and access equitable services and applications that the > > folks > in > > the cities take for granted. > > > >> So people fighting for NN are only going to make it more difficult > >> for the rest of us to move forward as they work their systems to give > >> them more and more ... it is all about greed not about equality. > > > > I don't understand why you think NN people are against equality. Net > > neutrality works against greed, at least the kind of greed that says > > individual network managers get to decide who in a country gets > > network access. NN wants a level playing field so that mom's packets > > and AT&T's packets get equal treatment. > > > > BB - Again I am sorry if you read what I write as "NN people are > > against equality" because I hope that is what they are trying to > > achieve but again people need to understand the bigger picture so > > everyone can avoid the "us and them" divide that continues to grow in > > this country. The simplistic presentations about NN and how these > > corporate "network managers" are the monsters really is getting old > > IMHO ... > > > > What we need is adequate and equitable resources so communities can > develop > > and support the applications and priorities they deem to be important > > to them. > > > >> The analogy of the public roads is an interesting one. To claim that > >> they are not being carefully managed seems to me to be totally wrong. > >> They > have > >> fast lanes, slow lanes, the rules require people to move over for > >> certain vehicles, there are paved roads, there are dirt roads > > > > All of these roads are usable by everyone. The roads don't give > > priority > to > > citizens depending on their salary or what they are carrying in their > cars. > > Everyone has the same speed limit; everyone has the same lane width to > drive > > in. The roads, all the different lanes and surfaces, are neutral. > > > > BB- Again, only those who have access to the resources to be able to > > use these "neutral roads" are able to use them. And yet, the people > > who use > the > > roads are able to lobby government to ensure they have access to the > > type > of > > roads that they believe they need and want through the use of > > everyone's taxes. Even the roads analogy can be picked a part to show > > that even those regions with the larger voting population are getting > > the paved roads and the rest of us are forced to use dirt road because > > of greed and certain management decisions that determine who is > > getting what level of service. > > > >> there are toll roads > > > > Yes, toll roads go against "road neutrality"; only people with extra > > money get to use them. But there aren't many toll roads; most of the > > roads are neutral and will take any car you want to drive on them, > > without giving priority to any type of car or any type of content. > > > > Of course there are no free roads on The Internet; everything requires > > a minimal fee. But once you've paid that fee, NN says your packets > > should > be > > treated the same as everyone else's packets. Even on a toll road, > > once you've paid the fee, your car is treated the same as every other > > car; you can't pay more to drive faster than anyone else or have more > > space. > > > > Imagine if you could buy a special expensive car permit that had > > priority > on > > the roads, such that all cars with cheaper permits had to yield to > > your > car > > with its expensive permit, even to the point of them driving off the > > road > if > > your car needed to drive there. At rush hour, only the rich people > > who > paid > > the premiums could ever drive to work. This kind of per-car permit > > isn't practical on the public roads; but, it is easily done on the > > Internet if > you > > don't enforce NN. Community networks need NN. I want mom's packets > treated > > the same as AT&T packets. > > > >> Your definition of the internet is inadequate and tries to make IP > traffic > >> all the same by oversimplifying the reality. That is probably fine > >> for > you > >> in your environment but it sure does not work in our environment. > > > > It isn't my definition; it's the common definition, and my Internet is > > the same as yours. All IP traffic *is* the same; that's the way the > > Internet works, currently; it's a feature. It's what has made the > > Internet so > useful > > - money doesn't buy your packets priority, and there are no > > "unauthorized" or "priority" uses. (Your expensive car won't get you > > to work any faster than a cheap car on the public roads, and there no > > differential treatment for what you carry in your car - everyone has > > equal access.) > > > > BB - Okay the "common definition" that you wish to use is fine for you > > and everyone who takes this type of position but it sure is not my > > definition > of > > the internet which I have tried to present to you and everyone else. > > In my world, all IP traffic is NOT the same ... just as some people > > would argue that a more expensive car might be more dependable to get > > them work > instead > > of the cheap car ... it is all about perception ... I agree that you > > have yours and I hope you can try to understand that I have a > > different understanding and definition of what the Internet is about. > > > >> There are different protocols for videoconferencing and VOIP that > >> make it possible to identify these packets. We are operating a > >> private, managed networks with POPs in over 100 communities and we > >> have to manage the traffic so patients are able to see a doctor > >> during a consult. So NN will not help us in our remote and rural > >> communities ... it will only make it impossible for us to continue to > >> deliver the applications that the communities need and want ... > > > > If you want doctors or videoconferencing to have priority on your > > network, you can't use the neutral, public Internet network for that. > > On the > public > > Internet, you don't get to choose centrally who gets priority, or what > gets > > priority. Everyone is treated equally, and should continue to be > > treated equally. You need to run your own private network if you want > > to dictate who uses it and for what. > > > > BB - RIGHT ON ... thank you for understanding this reality but do > understand > > that it is this application that is also supporting these remote and > > rural communities to have access to what you might consider a limited > > "public internet" service. Like I said before ... everyone is doing > > the best they can with the limited resources that are presently being > > made available to these remote and rural communities. > > > > The equality of the current public Internet doesn't work for some > > types of things, and it may not work if you aren't really looking for > > everyone to > be > > treated equally. If you want to control what's on your network and > > over-ride or prioritize what its users want to use it for, you aren't > > providing a public Internet service. > > > > BB - again, everyone does the best they can to access services ... > > reading between the lines in your message, it seems that you are also > > suggesting this "public internet service" is something that everyone > > has available somewhere ... maybe in your world but this is not the > > world where I live > and > > work ... > > > > If you want to be able to drive your own car to work and never get > > stuck > in > > traffic, you can't use public roads. On public roads, you have the > > same priority as everyone else, no matter whether you're carrying beer > > or > babies. > > Moreover, you cannot ask that all public roads be managed to > > accommodate your particular private needs. The roads are neutral. > > > > BB - again, this definition is yours and belongs in your world from > > what I see and read ... > > > > We must not replace the neutral, public Internet with a private, > > managed network that centrally limits or prioritizes what packets get > > delivered based on content, source, or destination. Network managers > > should not be dictating who gets to use the public Internet and for > > what purposes. > > > >> I thank you for your message because I believe it clearly highlights > >> the effort that people are making to protect their interests. It also > >> highlights, for me, just how "managed" the networks are and why they > >> need to be carefully cared for by those people who are able to > >> protect the public interests. > > > > Your "careful care" doesn't protect the public interest if it goes > > against what the public is choosing to use the network for. We don't > > tell people they can't drive their cars on the public roads during > > rush hour unless > they > > are doctors or bankers; everyone is treated equally. > > > > The neutral, public Internet carries the traffic of the people who use > > it. By definition, it delivers the applications that people, the > > public, its end-users, want, not what its network managers want. If > > you want to > choose > > "carefully" how certain traffic from your communities should have > > priority over other traffic, or over what the rest of the Internet > > wants, you can't use the neutral, public Internet for that. > > > > Central management is not how the Internet got to be where it is > > today. > The > > only "careful" care that should apply on the public Internet is care > > to enforce network neutrality, not care that tries to pick who or what > > gets priority. Any central network management that tries to pick what > > kinds of traffic get priority on the Internet will get it wrong. > > Things that will > be > > important on the Internet years from now haven't even been invented > > yet. They have to be able to start and grow using the same Internet as > everything > > else. > > > > Central management stifles innovation, slows progress, and inhibits > > individual citizen participation when it tries to decide on "approved" > uses > > and "authorized" users of the Internet. We don't allow this kind of > > discrimination on the public roads; we must not allow it on the public > > Internet. > > > > BB - hopefully you understand when I write that I respectfully > > disagree > with > > your presentation and the use of the road analogy ... it seem obvious > > to > me > > that we are living and working in two different worlds that hopefully > > will result in some useful policies that will support these different > realities. > > > > Thanks again for taking the time to write all this. But I must add > > that I > am > > afraid of people who are taking these entrenched positions and > > defending limited definitions that only try to demonstrate that their > > way is the > right > > way. What I am seeing and reading about is a lot of different > > realities > and > > opportunities. > > > > +++++++ > > > > Brian Beaton, K-Net Coordinator > > Keewaytinook Okimakanak > > Box 1439, 115 King Street > > Sioux Lookout, ON, P8T 1B9 > > T: 807-737-1135 x1251 > > F: 807-737-1720 > > IP and ISDN video conferencing > > E: brianbeaton at knet.ca > > W: http://knet.ca > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: steveinfos at gmail.com [mailto:steveinfos at gmail.com] On Behalf Of > Steve > > Anderson > > Sent: Monday, December 01, 2008 10:51 AM > > To: lshade at alcor.concordia.ca; brian.beaton at knet.ca > > Subject: Re: [Fwd: FW: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat > > to the public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet] > > > > HI Brian, my name is Steve Anderson. I'm the coordinator of the > > SaveOurNet.ca coalition. I'm a big fan of K-Net so would love if you > > could elaborate on this note Leslie forwarded to me. > > > > How would stopping protocol/content specific throttling hurt K-Net? > > > > How would Net Neutrality make it so K-Net could not exist? > > > > My understanding is the Net Neutrality is a principle that can be > > interrpreted differently in differing situations. The ultimate idea in > > my mind is that the principle put into action would act to maintain > > the level playing field for online services and applications, and > > prevent a fast lane/slow lane version of the Internet, prevent > > anti-competitive activity. Traffic shaping for other purposes like > > giving priority to traffic needed for telehealth services, VOIP, video > > conferencing, etc.. would be fine as long as it is not > > anti-competitive - meaning source agnostic. > > > > Let me know your thoughts, > > Steve > > > > > > On Mon, Dec 1, 2008 at 11:41 AM, wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ---------------------------- Original Message > ---------------------------- > >> Subject: FW: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to the > >> public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet > >> From: "Brian Beaton" > >> Date: Mon, December 1, 2008 11:35 am > >> To: "Leslie Regan Shade" > >> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> Good morning Leslie ... to follow up on this morning question, I am > > sharing > >> a message that Michael posted the other day that comes out of India. > >> > >> I struggle with the whole concept of Net Neutrality as it is being > debated > >> in Canada and the US for many reasons but mainly because in its > >> present > > form > >> it would mean that K-Net could not exist and the remote and rural > >> communities we serve would not have the access that they have today. > >> > >> Brian Beaton, K-Net Coordinator > >> Keewaytinook Okimakanak > >> Box 1439, 115 King Street > >> Sioux Lookout, ON, P8T 1B9 > >> T: 807-737-1135 x1251 > >> F: 807-737-1720 > >> IP and ISDN video conferencing > >> E: brianbeaton at knet.ca > >> W: http://knet.ca > >> > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: advisors-admin at tc.ca [mailto:advisors-admin at tc.ca] On Behalf Of > >> Michael Gurstein > >> Sent: Thursday, November 27, 2008 4:00 AM > >> To: 'TC Advisors' > >> Subject: [Advisors] FW: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to the > > public-ness > >> and the egalitarian nature of the Internet > >> > >> > >> TC may wish to sign on to this note... > >> > >> MG > >> > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: apc.forum-bounces at lists.apc.org > >> [mailto:apc.forum-bounces at lists.apc.org] On Behalf Of Roshni > >> Nuggehalli > >> Sent: November-26-08 6:14 PM > >> To: apc.forum at lists.apc.org > >> Subject: [APC Forum] Defending the threat to the public-ness and the > >> egalitarian nature of the Internet > >> > >> > >> > >> Dear All, > >> > >> Apologies for cross-posting. > >> > >> Most of us tend to take the commons and the public nature of the > >> Internet for granted. However, increasing corporatisation and control > >> of the Internet are strongly threatening these fundamental > >> characteristics of the Internet as we know it. Therefore, six civil > >> society organisations in India have proposed an open letter to the UN > >> Internet Governance Forum which meets for its third annual meeting > >> between 3rd and 6th December in Hyderabad. The letter exhorts urgent > >> global action to ensure that the public-ness and the egalitarian > >> nature of the Internet are preserved as its essential features. The > >> possibilities of democracy, equity and social justice in our > >> societies will be significantly impacted by the extent to which we > >> can achieve this objective. > >> > >> The proposed letter is pasted below. If you and/or your organization > >> wish to endorse this letter, please indicate so in response to this > >> email by the midnight of 1st December(India time). Please respond > >> offline and not to the entire mailing list. > >> > >> The proposed open letter can also be accessed at > >> > > > http://www.itforchange.net/component/content/article/195-igf-open- > letter.htm > >> l > >> > >> Thanks and Regards, > >> Roshni. > >> > >> ------------------------------------------------------------ > >> > >> * An Open Letter to the UN Internet Governance Forum (IGF) for its > >> 3rd Annual Meeting at Hyderabad, India, from 3rd to 6th December, > >> 2008 > >> * > >> > >> *The IGF must ACT NOW against the threat to the > >> public-ness and the egalitarian nature of the Internet > >> * > >> > >> > >> The undersigned wish to express their deep concern that the UN > >> Internet Governance Forum (IGF), created by the World Summit on the > >> Information Society in 2005 as an Internet 'policy dialogue' forum, > >> is largely > failing > >> to address key public interest and policy issues in global Internet > >> governance - including that of democratic deficit. > >> > >> *Who shapes the Internet, as the Internet shapes our new social > >> context? > >> > >> The Internet represents the single most important technical advance > >> of our society in a long time, so much so that it defines a new > >> emerging > > social > >> paradigm. The basic characteristics of the Internet determine the > contours > >> of the emerging social order in many important ways. The Internet was > >> conceived as, and still largely is, an extensive communication system > > which > >> is democratizing, and has little respect for established social > > hierarchies. > >> Interactions and associations built over this new 'techno-social' > >> system have, therefore, held the promise of a more egalitarian > >> society. The era > > of > >> innocence of the Internet however appears to be fast approaching its > >> end. Today, the Internet of the future - the very near future - is > >> being > shaped > >> insidiously by dominant forces to further their interests. (See the > >> fact-sheet on the following page for some illustrations of this.) > >> Unfortunately, global policy forums have largely failed to > >> articulate, > > much > >> less act on, crucial Internet policy issues, which concern the > >> democratic possibilities for our societies. > >> > >> *The IGF needs to act now!* > >> > >> As the Internet Governance Forum convenes for its third annual > >> meeting, between 3rd and 6th December, 2008, in Hyderabad, India, it > >> must take immediate steps to anchor and discuss important global > >> public interest > and > >> policy issues involved in Internet governance. If it does not act > >> now, it may get seen as a space that only provides an illusion of a > >> public policy dialogue, and, consequently, as being co-opted in > >> furthering the agenda > of > >> dominant forces that are shaping the Internet as per their narrow > > interests. > >> > >> > >> *We therefore strongly urge the IGF to directly address the following > >> key global public interest and policy issues: > >> > >> 1. Increasing corporatisation of the Internet > >> 2. Increasing proprietisation of standards and code that go into > >> building the Internet 3. Increasing points of control being embedded > >> into the Internet in the > > name > >> of security and intellectual property violations 4. Huge democratic > > deficit > >> in global Internet governance > >> > >> *We exhort the IGF to adopt clear directions for engaging with these > >> crucial public policy issues. The IGF should come out with a clear > >> work > > plan > >> at its forthcoming meeting in Hyderabad to address the four key areas > > listed > >> above. The global community - comprising not only people who > >> currently > > have > >> access to the Internet, but also the un-connected billions who are > >> being impacted by it nevertheless - will judge the meaningfulness and > legitimacy > >> of the IGF in terms of what progress it is able to make on these > >> issues. > >> > >> *Alternative Law Forum, Bangalore Centre for Internet and Society, > > Bangalore > >> Delhi Science Forum, New Delhi > >> Free Software Foundation - India > >> IT for Change, Bangalore > >> Knowledge Commons, New Delhi > >> > >> *For endorsements and/or more information, please contact Anja Kovacs > >> email: anja (at) itforchange.net, tel: +91 80 266554134, mobile: +91 > >> 9611747212 > >> > >> ------------------------------------------------------------ > >> * Information Sheet > >> > >> How the Public-ness and Egalitarian Nature of the Internet is > >> Threatened > - > >> Some Examples > >> > >> Corporatisation of the Internet* > >> > >> Largely unsuspected by most of its users, the Internet is rapidly > changing > >> from being a vast 'public sphere', with a fully public ownership and > >> a non-proprietary nature, to a set of corporatised privately-owned > networks. > >> On the one hand, telecom companies are carving out the Internet into > >> privately-owned networks - controlling the nature of transactions > >> over > > these > >> networks. They seek to differentially charge content providers, while > also > >> building wholly private networks offering exclusive content relay > > services. > >> Developments like video/TV over Internet Protocol and the provision > >> of controlled and selective Internet services over mobiles are > >> contributing > > to > >> increasing network-operators' control over the Internet, with a > >> corresponding erosion of its public-ness. > >> > >> On the other hand, the commons of the Internet is also being > >> overwhelmed > > and > >> squeezed out by a complete domination of a few privately owned > >> mega-applications such as Google, Facebook, Youtube etc. > >> > >> *Proprietarisation of standards and code that build the Internet* > >> > >> One of the main ways of appropriating the commons of the Internet is > >> through the increasing use of proprietary and closed standards and > >> code > in > >> building the Internet system. Such appropriation allows the extortion > >> of illegitimate rent out of the many new forms of commons-based > >> activities > > that > >> are being made possible through the Internet. > >> > >> *Embedding control points in the Internet* > >> A growing confluence of corporatist and statist interests has led to > >> the embedding of more and more means of control into the Internet in > >> a manner that greatly compromises citizens' rights and freedoms. > >> Whether it is the pressure on Internet Service Providers to examine > >> Internet traffic for 'intellectual property' violations; or > >> imposition of cultural and > > political > >> controls on the Internet by states within their boundaries; or ITU's > >> work > > on > >> IP trace-back mechanisms; or the tightening of US control over the > >> global Internet infrastructure in the name of securing the root zone > >> file and > the > >> domain name system, these new forms of controlling the Internet are > >> being negotiated among dominant interests away from public scrutiny > >> and wider public interest-based engagements. > >> > >> *Democratic deficit in global Internet governance* > >> The current global Internet governance regime - a new-age privatized > >> governance system professing allegiance mostly to a single country, > >> the > US > > - > >> has proven to be an active instrument of perpetuation of dominant > > commercial > >> and geo-political interests. Lately, OECD countries have begun some > >> work > > on > >> developing public policy principles that, due to the inherently > >> global nature of the Internet, can be expected to become globally > >> applicable. It > > is > >> quite unacceptable that OECD countries shirk from discussing the same > > public > >> policy issues at global public policy forums like the IGF that they > > discuss > >> among themselves at OECD meetings. Apparently, developing countries > >> are expected to focus on finding ways to reach connectivity to their > >> people, and not burden themselves with higher-level Internet > >> governance issues! People's and communities' right to > >> self-determination and participation in governance of issues that > >> impact their lives should underpin global Internet governance. > >> > >> ____________________________________________ > >> Roshni Nuggehalli > >> > >> IT for Change > >> Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities > >> Tel: (00-91-80) 2665 4134, 2653 6890 > >> Fax: (00-91-80) 4146 1055 > >> > >> www.ITforChange.net > >> www.IS-Watch.net > >> http://India.IS-Watch.net > >> > >> > >> > >> ======================================= > >> APC Forum is a meeting place for the APC community - people and > >> institutions who are or have been involved in collaboration with APC, > >> and share the APC vision - a world in which all people have easy, > > equal > >> and affordable access to the creative potential of information and > >> communication technologies (ICTs) to improve their lives and create > >> more democratic and egalitarian societies. > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> apc.forum mailing list > >> apc.forum at lists.apc.org > >> http://lists.apc.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/apc.forum > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Advisors mailing list > >> Advisors at tc.ca http://victoria.tc.ca/mailman/listinfo/advisors > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > Find me on Facebook: > > http://FacebookSteve.com > > > > Find me on Twitter: > > http://SteveOnTwitter.com > > > > See my Democratic Media Blog: > > http://democraticmedia.ca/blog/steve-anderson > > > > Canadian Media News: > > http://democraticmedia.ca/news > > > > > > > > > > -- > Find me on Facebook: > http://FacebookSteve.com > > Find me on Twitter: > http://SteveOnTwitter.com > > See my Democratic Media Blog: > http://medialinkscolumn.com > > Canadian Media News: > http://democraticmedia.ca/news > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jam at jacquelinemorris.com Mon Dec 22 07:13:01 2008 From: jam at jacquelinemorris.com (Jacqueline A. Morris) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 08:13:01 -0400 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> Message-ID: <494F844D.6090307@jacquelinemorris.com> Thanks Derrick and congratulations Ginger! Merry Christmas to all! Jacqueline Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 Election > of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 votes cast, > we have the following result: > > Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new > co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. > In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and > slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election > (n=100). > > I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal > deadline, and then delete it. > > Kindest regards, > Derrick > > Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > School of Information Studies > and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > Syracuse University > 346 Hinds Hall > Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > http://cogburn.blogspot.com > http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Mon Dec 22 07:16:59 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:46:59 +0530 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <20081222121707.4666C67829@smtp1.electricembers.net> Congrats Ginger. We look forward to work under your leadership and guidance. And thanks to Shiva and Asif for participating in this important civic exercise, and expressing willingness to volunteer time and extra commitment for the IGC. We do look forward to your continued engagements with the IGC. And I thank everyone who has said nice words for me in the last few days, and will respond individually. Parminder > -----Original Message----- > From: Ginger Paque [mailto:ginger at paque.net] > Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 5:36 PM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Parminder' > Subject: RE: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > > Hello everyone, > > Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work > with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective > advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. > > Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates > for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy > for the IG Caucus work. > > Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I > remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom > days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex > world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and > direction, as usual! > > Best winter holiday wishes to all, > Ginger > > > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > > Derrick, thanks for running the election process. > > Ginger, congratulations! > > Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you > sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank > you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. > > Best, > > Adam > > > > > At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > >Dear Colleagues, > > > >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 > >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 > >votes cast, we have the following result: > > > >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > > >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new > >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. > >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and > >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election > >(n=100). > > > >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal > >deadline, and then delete it. > > > >Kindest regards, > >Derrick > > > >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > >School of Information Studies > >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > >Syracuse University > >346 Hinds Hall > >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > >http://cogburn.blogspot.com > >http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > > > >____________________________________________________________ > >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > >For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Mon Dec 22 07:21:49 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 12:21:49 +0000 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> Message-ID: <494F865D.4010009@wzb.eu> Thank you, Derrick and warm congratulations to Ginger. I wish you patience, a thick skin and lots of optimism :-) jeanette Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 Election of > the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 votes cast, we > have the following result: > > Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new > co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. In > terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and slightly > less overall voter participation than in the last election (n=100). > > I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal deadline, > and then delete it. > > Kindest regards, > Derrick > > Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > School of Information Studies > and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > Syracuse University > 346 Hinds Hall > Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > http://cogburn.blogspot.com > http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn Mon Dec 22 07:40:26 2008 From: tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn (Tijani BEN JEMAA) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 13:40:26 +0100 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> Message-ID: <008101c96432$788b5770$ee12a8c0@acerb8600603ec> Thank you Derrick for accomplishing the election process. Congratulation to Ginger for the list members confidence. Thank you so much Parminder. You were hard worker, with convincing arguments and fair positions. I hope you will still contribute and help. Best -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tijani BEN JEMAA Member of the Tunisian Engineers' Order Vice Chairman of CIC World Federation of Engineering Organizations Phone : + 216 98 330 114 Fax : + 216 70 860 861 -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Derrick L. Cogburn" To: Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 11:34 AM Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > Dear Colleagues, > > It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 Election of > the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 votes cast, we > have the following result: > > Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new co- coordinator, > and to all those that participated in the election. In terms of voting > participation, we had a 22% response rate and slightly less overall voter > participation than in the last election (n=100). > > I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal deadline, > and then delete it. > > Kindest regards, > Derrick > > Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > School of Information Studies > and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > Syracuse University > 346 Hinds Hall > Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > http://cogburn.blogspot.com > http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From guru at itforchange.net Mon Dec 22 07:53:09 2008 From: guru at itforchange.net (Guru) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 18:23:09 +0530 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <494F8DB5.4070907@itforchange.net> Congrats Ginger .... and all the very best ... thanks also to Shiva and Asif for volunteering their time and energies .... regards Guru Ginger Paque wrote: > Hello everyone, > > Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work > with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective > advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. > > Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates > for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy > for the IG Caucus work. > > Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I > remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom > days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex > world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and > direction, as usual! > > Best winter holiday wishes to all, > Ginger > > > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > > Derrick, thanks for running the election process. > > Ginger, congratulations! > > Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you > sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank > you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. > > Best, > > Adam > > > > > At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 >> Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 >> votes cast, we have the following result: >> >> Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) >> Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) >> None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) >> Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) >> >> My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new >> co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. >> In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and >> slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election >> (n=100). >> >> I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal >> deadline, and then delete it. >> >> Kindest regards, >> Derrick >> >> Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn >> School of Information Studies >> and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs >> Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs >> Syracuse University >> 346 Hinds Hall >> Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 >> Phone: +1.315.443.5441 >> Fax: +1.315.443.6886 >> http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn >> http://cogburn.blogspot.com >> http://cotelco.syr.edu >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Gurumurthy Kasinathan IT for Change www.ITforChange.net Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities Tel:98454 37730 http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 08:43:21 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 19:13:21 +0530 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <494F8DB5.4070907@itforchange.net> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <494F8DB5.4070907@itforchange.net> Message-ID: Hello Virginia Ginger Pacque, I know from my interactions with you as a participant at the Diplo Internet Governance program that you know a lot more as a person who has been involved in the Internet Governance process right from the WSIS days and that you are a capable organizer with a lot of energy. I am certain that the Caucus has made the right choice. Congratulations and Wishes. Sivasubramanian muthusamy On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 6:23 PM, Guru wrote: > Congrats Ginger .... and all the very best ... > > thanks also to Shiva and Asif for volunteering their time and energies .... > > regards > Guru > > Ginger Paque wrote: > > Hello everyone, > > Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work > with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective > advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. > > Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates > for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy > for the IG Caucus work. > > Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I > remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom > days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex > world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and > direction, as usual! > > Best winter holiday wishes to all, > Ginger > > > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp ] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > > Derrick, thanks for running the election process. > > Ginger, congratulations! > > Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you > sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank > you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. > > Best, > > Adam > > > > > At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > > > Dear Colleagues, > > It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 > Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 > votes cast, we have the following result: > > Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new > co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. > In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and > slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election > (n=100). > > I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal > deadline, and then delete it. > > Kindest regards, > Derrick > > Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > School of Information Studies > and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > Syracuse University > 346 Hinds Hall > Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > Fax: +1.315.443.6886http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn http://cogburn.blogspot.comhttp://cotelco.syr.edu > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > -- > Gurumurthy Kasinathan > IT for Changewww.ITforChange.net > Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities > Tel:98454 37730http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net > *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 08:46:29 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 19:16:29 +0530 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <494F8DB5.4070907@itforchange.net> Message-ID: And thanks for the good opinion of the nineteen participants who have voted for me in the elections. I have hardly met a total of nine participants of this Caucus ! Thanks again for your trust and good wishes. On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 7:13 PM, Sivasubramanian Muthusamy < isolatedn at gmail.com> wrote: > Hello Virginia Ginger Pacque, > > I know from my interactions with you as a participant at the Diplo Internet > Governance program that you know a lot more as a person who has been > involved in the Internet Governance process right from the WSIS days and > that you are a capable organizer with a lot of energy. I am certain that the > Caucus has made the right choice. > > Congratulations and Wishes. > Sivasubramanian muthusamy > > > > > On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 6:23 PM, Guru wrote: > >> Congrats Ginger .... and all the very best ... >> >> thanks also to Shiva and Asif for volunteering their time and energies >> .... >> >> regards >> Guru >> >> Ginger Paque wrote: >> >> Hello everyone, >> >> Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work >> with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective >> advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. >> >> Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates >> for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy >> for the IG Caucus work. >> >> Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I >> remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom >> days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex >> world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and >> direction, as usual! >> >> Best winter holiday wishes to all, >> Ginger >> >> >> >> -----Mensaje original----- >> De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp ] >> Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. >> Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results >> >> Derrick, thanks for running the election process. >> >> Ginger, congratulations! >> >> Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you >> sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank >> you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. >> >> Best, >> >> Adam >> >> >> >> >> At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: >> >> >> Dear Colleagues, >> >> It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 >> Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 >> votes cast, we have the following result: >> >> Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) >> Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) >> None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) >> Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) >> >> My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new >> co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. >> In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and >> slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election >> (n=100). >> >> I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal >> deadline, and then delete it. >> >> Kindest regards, >> Derrick >> >> Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn >> School of Information Studies >> and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs >> Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs >> Syracuse University >> 346 Hinds Hall >> Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 >> Phone: +1.315.443.5441 >> Fax: +1.315.443.6886http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn http://cogburn.blogspot.comhttp://cotelco.syr.edu >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> >> -- >> Gurumurthy Kasinathan >> IT for Changewww.ITforChange.net >> Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities >> Tel:98454 37730http://ITforChange.net http://India.IS-Watch.net http://IS-Watch.net >> *IT for Change is an NGO in Special Consultative Status with United Nations' Economic and Social Council* >> >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> > > > -- > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy > http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy > http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ > http://twitter.com/isocchennai > > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Mon Dec 22 13:17:00 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 05:17:00 +1100 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <8017791e0812220019g21293292gd06bfe0d2af3b5f6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <3A1259B6D5B647FE9ADDECD52D752095@IAN> Thank you everyone for your excellent comments and suggestions here. What is clear from everyone's comments is that we must find a way to nominate a group of candidates to MAG, even if this means revising the processes somewhat on this occasion. I'll talk with Ginger over the next 24 hours and we will come up with the best process possible given the time constraints. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de Mon Dec 22 13:20:39 2008 From: wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=22Kleinw=E4chter=2C_Wolfgang=22?=) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 19:20:39 +0100 Subject: AW: [governance] Thank you to Parminder References: <494A5A1A.2050304@apc.org> <494A82C2.6020103@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A84265E2@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Being back from the hospital after a knee surgery and crawling through my e-mails I can only join Jeanettes comment in thanking Parminder for his energy and creativity. As Jeanette has pointed out, the simple fact that CIR is now a fully accepted subject of discussion for the IGF, goes also back to Parminders never ending critical questions with regard to EC & CIR. When I saw Parminder next to Richard Baeird from the US State Department at the IGF Hyderabad Plenary I was asking myself whether we could have imagined in PrepCom1 in 2002 - when we were knocking at closed doors in the GICC - that governmental officials and CS reps will sit as equals on a high level podium of the world largest and most representative Internet Governance meeting? Certainly - Parminder himself would argue - this is not yet real politics, this is also a little bit "just for the show". Real politics is made - like in 2002 - behind closed doors. This is true. But we have now an additional layer to raise our voice and we have much more supporters - also among governments - than in 2002. I also remember when Sammssekou promised in September 2003 that CS input will have impact. When we confronted him during PrepCom3+ with the draft declaration, where non of our 96 proposals were reflected and called this "governmental ignorance" we pushed the summit into a hectic phase which led to the elovbarqation of the CS Geneva Declaration. CS input had only little impact in the governmental documents of 2003. It was more in 2005 (after WGIG). Today it is still too less, but more than 2003 and 2005. Thank you Parminder for your input which had impact indeed. Wolfgang ________________________________ Von: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] Gesendet: Do 18.12.2008 18:05 An: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Willie Currie Betreff: Re: [governance] Thank you to Parminder Hi everyone, thank you, Willi, for this detailed and fair appraisal of Parminder's role as coordinator, particularly during the time when is was acting practically on his own. I also agree with what you say about Parminder's role in pushing 'enhanced cooperation' onto the agenda. I heard several people saying that they are not longer suspicious about addressing this topic in the context of the IGF. It is unlikely that we would have achieved this without Parminder's persistence. Being one of those who frequently disagree with Parminder, I am still grateful that he devoted so much time to the Caucus and I hope he won't give up on it. jeanette Willie Currie wrote: > I'd also like to thank Parminder for his commitment and hard work as IGC > coordinator. > > Parminder has played an important role for the IGC during a difficult > period of adjustment to a post-WSIS global policy space in internet > governance, when a sustained attempt to deflect attention from the need > for global public policy principles for managing critical internet > resources was underway as a backlash to the gains made in the WSIS. It > is largely to Parminder's credit that the issue of 'enhanced > cooperation' could be discussed in Hyderabad without the sky falling > down. Indeed a little more attention to public policy principles at an > earlier stage may have helped the IPv4/6 transition as the IGF open > policy dialogue on the matter demonstrated. Like the banking system, I > think we have been witnessing the limits of the claims for technical > expertise in the absence of suitable policy and regulation in the public > interest in this area. And no one had an adequate answer to Jeanette's > question as to who is in charge? Parminder suffered unjustifable attack > while coordinator of the IGC when he did raise questions of public > policy. And I think the shambles around the IPv4/6 transition vindicates > his concerns for public policy frameworks in internet governance. > > There was a long stretch in which Parminder was virtually carrying the > IGC coordination alone. I would like to commend his work for the IGC as > beyond the call of duty and while many may have disgreed with his > arguments, Parminder nevertheless ensured that there was considerable > engagement on the list during his watch. > > All the best, Parminder! > > Willie > > > Peter wrote: >> >> Everyone, >> >> >> >> In a few days we will have a new Co-coordinator to congratulate. >> Please don't forget to vote! >> >> >> >> All of which means that this is the last few days of Parminder's term >> as Co-coordinator. >> >> >> >> I have had the please of working with Parminder in this role over the >> last six months, and in working closely with him over this period got >> to appreciate what a splendid job he has done for our Caucus. >> >> >> >> Parminder has had a huge commitment to openness and transparency. He >> had worked very hard to help the Caucus to adopt consensual positions >> on policy matters. He has shown a great policy mind, a firm commitment >> to civil society and its advancement, and a lot of strength in dealing >> with difficult issues. >> >> >> >> I said a few words along these lines in Hyderabad for those who were >> present, but I do want to mark this milestone by thanking Parminder >> for his commitment to IGC. I am glad he is remaining involved and look >> forward to working with him in the future. >> >> >> >> All the best, Parminder, and thank you very much! >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Ian Peter >> >> PO Box 429 >> >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> >> Australia >> >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Mon Dec 22 13:25:31 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 05:25:31 +1100 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <54AE4B0DFA2046679E3D9DDA64647A45@IAN> The tribe has spoken! Congratulations Ginger, I look forward to working with you. And thanks to Shiva and Asif Kabani for your willingness to serve - it stands us in good stead when we have a field of candidates willing to stand and an election conducted in such good co-operative spirits. Thanks also to Derrick for his efforts, and to everyone who voted. This all gives me great confidence that we can do some good work together in 2009! Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Ginger Paque [mailto:ginger at paque.net] > Sent: 22 December 2008 23:06 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Parminder' > Subject: RE: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > > Hello everyone, > > Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work > with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective > advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. > > Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates > for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy > for the IG Caucus work. > > Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I > remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom > days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex > world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and > direction, as usual! > > Best winter holiday wishes to all, > Ginger > > > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > > Derrick, thanks for running the election process. > > Ginger, congratulations! > > Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you > sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank > you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. > > Best, > > Adam > > > > > At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > >Dear Colleagues, > > > >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 > >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 > >votes cast, we have the following result: > > > >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > > >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new > >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. > >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and > >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election > >(n=100). > > > >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal > >deadline, and then delete it. > > > >Kindest regards, > >Derrick > > > >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > >School of Information Studies > >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > >Syracuse University > >346 Hinds Hall > >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > >http://cogburn.blogspot.com > >http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > > > >____________________________________________________________ > >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > >For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From shailam at yahoo.com Mon Dec 22 13:55:14 2008 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 10:55:14 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <631011.34412.qm@web54306.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Dear Ginger My heartiest     congratulations to     you.    I thank      you     for     stepping    forward to     take on    this    responsibility. We    need    people like you.Thanks     also    to Shiva      and    to      Asif.    without    whom an    election    would    lose meaning. Shaila     Rao   Mistry California   be as a well......sure and limitless.... but as time befits.....assume other forms ....     ________________________________ From: Ginger Paque To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Parminder Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 4:06:11 AM Subject: RE: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results Hello everyone, Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy for the IG Caucus work. Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and direction, as usual! Best winter holiday wishes to all, Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results Derrick, thanks for running the election process. Ginger, congratulations! Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. Best, Adam At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: >Dear Colleagues, > >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus.  With 89 >votes cast, we have the following result: > >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election >(n=100). > >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal >deadline, and then delete it. > >Kindest regards, >Derrick > >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn >School of Information Studies >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs >Syracuse University >346 Hinds Hall >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn >http://cogburn.blogspot.com >http://cotelco.syr.edu > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >    governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: >    governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: >    http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:     governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:     governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From maxsenges at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 14:15:49 2008 From: maxsenges at gmail.com (Max Senges) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:15:49 +0100 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <631011.34412.qm@web54306.mail.re2.yahoo.com> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <631011.34412.qm@web54306.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <4d976d8e0812221115p699af7en85f5fabad563757f@mail.gmail.com> Ginger YOU ROCK - looking forward to working with you! To a productive 2009! Max On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 7:55 PM, shaila mistry wrote: > Dear Ginger > My heartiest congratulations to you. I thank you > for stepping forward to take on this responsibility. We > need people like you.Thanks also to Shiva and to > Asif. without whom an election would lose meaning. > > Shaila Rao Mistry > California > > *be as a well......sure and limitless.... > but as time befits.....assume other forms .... ** > > * > > > > > ------------------------------ > *From:* Ginger Paque > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org; Parminder > *Sent:* Monday, December 22, 2008 4:06:11 AM > *Subject:* RE: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > > Hello everyone, > > Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work > with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective > advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. > > Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates > for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy > for the IG Caucus work. > > Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I > remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom > days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex > world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and > direction, as usual! > > Best winter holiday wishes to all, > Ginger > > > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > > Derrick, thanks for running the election process. > > Ginger, congratulations! > > Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you > sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank > you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. > > Best, > > Adam > > > > > At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > >Dear Colleagues, > > > >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 > >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 > >votes cast, we have the following result: > > > >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > > >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new > >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. > >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and > >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election > >(n=100). > > > >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal > >deadline, and then delete it. > > > >Kindest regards, > >Derrick > > > >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > >School of Information Studies > >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > >Syracuse University > >346 Hinds Hall > >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > >http://cogburn.blogspot.com > >http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > > > >____________________________________________________________ > >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > >For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- ------------------------------------------------- "The world of the senses is just the base camp: we are meant to be as much at home in consciousness as in the world of physical reality. [...] We are not cabin-dwellers, born to a life cramped and confined; we are meant to explore, to seek, to push the limits of our potential as human beings" (Easwaran, Bhagavad Gita, p. 10) ------------------------------------------------- Dr. Max Senges www.maxsenges.com www.knowledgeentrepreneur.com ------------------------------------------------------------ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Mon Dec 22 15:32:55 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 07:32:55 +1100 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for MAG selection process Message-ID: So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by personal email. (to the list is preferable) The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But briefly, The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the volunteer pool for this task So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers not chosen are able to stand. Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours total to this task over a month. Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeanette at wzb.eu Mon Dec 22 15:46:59 2008 From: jeanette at wzb.eu (Jeanette Hofmann) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 20:46:59 +0000 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> Hi Ian and Ginger, good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. jeanette Ian Peter wrote: > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by > personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > > > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But > briefly, > > > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > volunteer pool for this task > > > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round – other volunteers > not chosen are able to stand. > > > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. > > > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours > total to this task over a month. > > > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Mon Dec 22 17:06:13 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:36:13 -0430 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> Message-ID: <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Great, Jeanette, thanks! This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to consider the real issue. Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Hi Ian and Ginger, good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. jeanette Ian Peter wrote: > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by > personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > > > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But > briefly, > > > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > volunteer pool for this task > > > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers > not chosen are able to stand. > > > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. > > > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours > total to this task over a month. > > > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From maja.andjelkovic at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 17:09:52 2008 From: maja.andjelkovic at gmail.com (Maja Andjelkovic) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:09:52 -0500 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <6a19eea00812221409q7fa323cahbe6bdc811ad2aea0@mail.gmail.com> Please count me in too. All the best, Maja 2008/12/22 Ginger Paque > Great, Jeanette, thanks! > > This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this > preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to > consider the real issue. > > Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! > Ginger > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter > Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for > > Hi Ian and Ginger, > > good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. > jeanette > > Ian Peter wrote: > > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi > > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom > > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > > > > > > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by > > personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > > > > > > > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But > > briefly, > > > > > > > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups > > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > > volunteer pool for this task > > > > > > > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people > > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as > > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non > > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not > > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers > > not chosen are able to stand. > > > > > > > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers > > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. > > > > > > > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as > > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours > > total to this task over a month. > > > > > > > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > > > PO Box 429 > > > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > > > Australia > > > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From hananeb at diplomacy.edu Mon Dec 22 18:18:51 2008 From: hananeb at diplomacy.edu (Hanane Boujemi) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 00:18:51 +0100 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: <6a19eea00812221409q7fa323cahbe6bdc811ad2aea0@mail.gmail.com> References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <6a19eea00812221409q7fa323cahbe6bdc811ad2aea0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I am in too. Merry Christmas everybody and congrats for Ginger . Hanane ----- Original Message ----- From: Maja Andjelkovic To: governance at lists.cpsr.org ; Ginger Paque Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Please count me in too. All the best, Maja 2008/12/22 Ginger Paque Great, Jeanette, thanks! This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to consider the real issue. Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Hi Ian and Ginger, good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. jeanette Ian Peter wrote: > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by > personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > > > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But > briefly, > > > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > volunteer pool for this task > > > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers > not chosen are able to stand. > > > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. > > > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours > total to this task over a month. > > > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From rafik.dammak at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 19:54:32 2008 From: rafik.dammak at gmail.com (rafik dammak) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 01:54:32 +0100 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <6a19eea00812221409q7fa323cahbe6bdc811ad2aea0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hello Everybody, I volunteer for the nomcom too! Rafik On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 12:18 AM, Hanane Boujemi wrote: > I am in too. > > Merry Christmas everybody and congrats for Ginger . > > Hanane > > > ----- Original Message ----- > *From:* Maja Andjelkovic > *To:* governance at lists.cpsr.org ; Ginger Paque > *Sent:* Monday, December 22, 2008 11:09 PM > *Subject:* Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool > for > > Please count me in too. > > All the best, > Maja > > > 2008/12/22 Ginger Paque > >> Great, Jeanette, thanks! >> >> This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this >> preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to >> consider the real issue. >> >> Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! >> Ginger >> >> -----Mensaje original----- >> De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] >> Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. >> Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter >> Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for >> >> Hi Ian and Ginger, >> >> good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. >> jeanette >> >> Ian Peter wrote: >> > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi >> > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom >> > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. >> > >> > >> > >> > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we >> > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. >> > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by >> > personal email. (to the list is preferable) >> > >> > >> > >> > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But >> > briefly, >> > >> > >> > >> > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups >> > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group >> > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a >> > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the >> > volunteer pool for this task >> > >> > >> > >> > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the >> > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people >> > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as >> > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non >> > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not >> > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers >> > not chosen are able to stand. >> > >> > >> > >> > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by >> > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers >> > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task >> underway. >> > >> > >> > >> > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January >> > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as >> > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours >> > total to this task over a month. >> > >> > >> > >> > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work >> > >> > >> > >> > Ian Peter >> > >> > PO Box 429 >> > >> > Bangalow NSW 2479 >> > >> > Australia >> > >> > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> > >> > www.ianpeter.com >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > > ------------------------------ > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From shailam at yahoo.com Mon Dec 22 20:47:29 2008 From: shailam at yahoo.com (shaila mistry) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 17:47:29 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for MAG selection process References: Message-ID: <589915.93494.qm@web54304.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Hi All I volunteer for MAG Nom Com Shaila Rao Mistry be as a well......sure and limitless.... but as time befits.....assume other forms .... ________________________________ From: Ian Peter To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 12:32:55 PM Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for MAG selection process So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by personal email. (to the list is preferable) The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But briefly, The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the volunteer pool for this task So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not be able to stand for MAG selection this time round – other volunteers not chosen are able to stand. Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours total to this task over a month. Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From klohento at panos-ao.org Mon Dec 22 21:53:03 2008 From: klohento at panos-ao.org (Ken Lohento) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 03:53:03 +0100 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <4950528F.5030007@panos-ao.org> I volunteer for the nomcom..(but I will not have time to work in, just to help the process) Congrats Ginger Ken L Ginger Paque a écrit : > Great, Jeanette, thanks! > > This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this > preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to > consider the real issue. > > Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! > Ginger > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter > Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for > > Hi Ian and Ginger, > > good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. > jeanette > > Ian Peter wrote: > >> So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi >> Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom >> the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. >> >> >> >> To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we >> must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. >> Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by >> personal email. (to the list is preferable) >> >> >> >> The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But >> briefly, >> >> >> >> The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups >> for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group >> (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a >> Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the >> volunteer pool for this task >> >> >> >> So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the >> NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people >> from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as >> the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non >> voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not >> be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers >> not chosen are able to stand. >> >> >> >> Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by >> submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers >> urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. >> >> >> >> Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January >> until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as >> a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours >> total to this task over a month. >> >> >> >> Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work >> >> >> >> Ian Peter >> >> PO Box 429 >> >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> >> Australia >> >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >> >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ajp at glocom.ac.jp Mon Dec 22 22:22:03 2008 From: ajp at glocom.ac.jp (Adam Peake) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 12:22:03 +0900 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: <4950528F.5030007@panos-ao.org> References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <4950528F.5030007@panos-ao.org> Message-ID: include me in the nomcom list. Adam ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From hongxueipr at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 23:37:57 2008 From: hongxueipr at gmail.com (Hong Xue) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 12:37:57 +0800 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <54535d540812222037s481a3aadx8258ed28a80b953f@mail.gmail.com> Congratulations! I always have confidence in you. Hong On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 8:06 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > Hello everyone, > > Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work > with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective > advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. > > Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates > for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy > for the IG Caucus work. > > Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I > remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom > days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex > world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and > direction, as usual! > > Best winter holiday wishes to all, > Ginger > > > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > > Derrick, thanks for running the election process. > > Ginger, congratulations! > > Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you > sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank > you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. > > Best, > > Adam > > > > > At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > >Dear Colleagues, > > > >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 > >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 > >votes cast, we have the following result: > > > >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > > >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new > >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. > >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and > >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election > >(n=100). > > > >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal > >deadline, and then delete it. > > > >Kindest regards, > >Derrick > > > >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > >School of Information Studies > >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > >Syracuse University > >346 Hinds Hall > >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > >http://cogburn.blogspot.com > >http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > > > >____________________________________________________________ > >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > >For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From hempalshrestha at gmail.com Mon Dec 22 23:47:23 2008 From: hempalshrestha at gmail.com (Hempal Shrestha) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 10:32:23 +0545 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <4950528F.5030007@panos-ao.org> Message-ID: Hi Ian, Please count me in for noncom Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to all Hempal Shrestha On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 9:07 AM, Adam Peake wrote: > include me in the nomcom list. > > Adam > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Tue Dec 23 00:35:58 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 22:35:58 -0700 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for MAG Message-ID: <20081222223558.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.4cede4cadb.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From hempalshrestha at gmail.com Tue Dec 23 00:54:28 2008 From: hempalshrestha at gmail.com (Hempal Shrestha) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 11:39:28 +0545 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <54535d540812222037s481a3aadx8258ed28a80b953f@mail.gmail.com> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <54535d540812222037s481a3aadx8258ed28a80b953f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Congratulation Ginger for your term as co-coordinator, and thanks to Parminder for leading the Caucus, I look forward for more energy and guidance. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year. Hempal Shrestha On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 10:22 AM, Hong Xue wrote: > > Congratulations! I always have confidence in you. > > Hong > > > > > > > On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 8:06 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > >> Hello everyone, >> >> Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work >> with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective >> advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. >> >> Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates >> for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy >> for the IG Caucus work. >> >> Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I >> remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom >> days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex >> world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and >> direction, as usual! >> >> Best winter holiday wishes to all, >> Ginger >> >> >> >> -----Mensaje original----- >> De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] >> Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. >> Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results >> >> Derrick, thanks for running the election process. >> >> Ginger, congratulations! >> >> Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you >> sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank >> you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. >> >> Best, >> >> Adam >> >> >> >> >> At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: >> >Dear Colleagues, >> > >> >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 >> >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 >> >votes cast, we have the following result: >> > >> >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) >> >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) >> >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) >> >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) >> > >> >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new >> >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. >> >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and >> >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election >> >(n=100). >> > >> >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal >> >deadline, and then delete it. >> > >> >Kindest regards, >> >Derrick >> > >> >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn >> >School of Information Studies >> >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs >> >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs >> >Syracuse University >> >346 Hinds Hall >> >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 >> >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 >> >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 >> >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn >> >http://cogburn.blogspot.com >> >http://cotelco.syr.edu >> > >> > >> >____________________________________________________________ >> >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> >To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > >> >For all list information and functions, see: >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From puna_gb at yahoo.com Tue Dec 23 01:07:20 2008 From: puna_gb at yahoo.com (Gao Mosweu) Date: Mon, 22 Dec 2008 22:07:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <641073.8132.qm@web31501.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Congratulations Ginger!   I have faith that you will do your very best and beyond.   We look forward to having you as Coordinator!   Cheers,   Gao --- On Tue, 12/23/08, Hempal Shrestha wrote: From: Hempal Shrestha Subject: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results To: governance at lists.cpsr.org Cc: "Ginger Paque" , parminder at itforchange.net Date: Tuesday, December 23, 2008, 7:54 AM Congratulation Ginger for your term as co-coordinator, and thanks to Parminder for leading the Caucus, I look forward for more energy and guidance. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year. Hempal Shrestha On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 10:22 AM, Hong Xue wrote: Congratulations! I always have confidence in you. Hong On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 8:06 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: Hello everyone, Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy for the IG Caucus work. Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and direction, as usual! Best winter holiday wishes to all, Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results Derrick, thanks for running the election process. Ginger, congratulations! Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. Best, Adam At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: >Dear Colleagues, > >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus.  With 89 >votes cast, we have the following result: > >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election >(n=100). > >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal >deadline, and then delete it. > >Kindest regards, >Derrick > >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn >School of Information Studies >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs >Syracuse University >346 Hinds Hall >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn >http://cogburn.blogspot.com >http://cotelco.syr.edu > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >     governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: >     governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: >     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:     governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:     governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list:     governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to:     governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see:     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From fouadbajwa at gmail.com Tue Dec 23 01:17:13 2008 From: fouadbajwa at gmail.com (Fouad Bajwa) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 11:17:13 +0500 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> Message-ID: <701af9f70812222217w2e81368dqf0403ae9af840fe9@mail.gmail.com> Congratulations Ginger and welcome as our new co-coordinator. Your experience and enthusiasm will definitely help the CS IGC and we have a lot to do! Thank you once again to Parminder for his immense contribution to the IGC. Good Luck! On 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 Election of > the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 votes cast, we have > the following result: > > Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new co-coordinator, > and to all those that participated in the election. In terms of voting > participation, we had a 22% response rate and slightly less overall voter > participation than in the last election (n=100). > > I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal deadline, and > then delete it. > > Kindest regards, > Derrick > > Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > School of Information Studies > and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > Syracuse University > 346 Hinds Hall > Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > http://cogburn.blogspot.com > http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Regards. -------------------------- Fouad Bajwa ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From anja at itforchange.net Tue Dec 23 02:13:59 2008 From: anja at itforchange.net (Anja Kovacs) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 12:43:59 +0530 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49508FB7.6000502@itforchange.net> Hi all, I volunteer for the NomCom as well. Anja Kovacs Ian Peter wrote: > > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from > whom the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me > by personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. > But briefly, > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > volunteer pool for this task > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve > as the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent > non voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen > will not be able to stand for MAG selection this time round – other > volunteers not chosen are able to stand. > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections > as a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 > hours total to this task over a month. > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > -- Dr. Anja Kovacs Senior Research Associate IT for Change Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities Tel: (00-91-80) 2665 4134, 2653 6890 www.ITforChange.net www.IS-Watch.net http://India.IS-Watch.net ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de Tue Dec 23 03:32:33 2008 From: wolfgang.kleinwaechter at medienkomm.uni-halle.de (=?iso-8859-1?Q?=22Kleinw=E4chter=2C_Wolfgang=22?=) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 09:32:33 +0100 Subject: AW: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <54535d540812222037s481a3aadx8258ed28a80b953f@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2DA93620FC07494C926D60C8E3C2F1A84265E5@server1.medienkomm.uni-halle.de> Welcome and congratulations Ginger. As Jeanette has said, patience, iron skin and 1000 Volt are needed. You can count on my support. Wolfgang ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Tue Dec 23 07:16:47 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 07:46:47 -0430 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for--Almost halfway there In-Reply-To: References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <6a19eea00812221409q7fa323cahbe6bdc811ad2aea0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <002801c964f8$62489240$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> We have the following volunteers (12) so far for the Noncom pool-Thank you very much. Please consider joining them (us) as soon as possible. a great Christmas or Winter Holiday gift to the IGC members! This is an important undertaking, but a fairly easy task time-wise, so it is a good way to be actively involved on a short-term commitment. We still need as many volunteers as possible, minimum 13 more. Jeanette Hofmann Maja Andjelkovic Philippe Dam Hanane Boujemi Raquel Gatto Rafik Dammak Shaila Mistry Tricia Wang Anja Kovacs Hempal Shrestha Adam Peake Ken Lohento Thanks to everyone for your good wishes and support. I am looking forward to this new experience, and expect to learn from all of you in the process (that's the payback :-)) Ginger _____ De: Hanane Boujemi [mailto:hananeb at diplomacy.edu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 06:49 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Maja Andjelkovic; Ginger Paque Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for I am in too. Merry Christmas everybody and congrats for Ginger . Hanane ----- Original Message ----- From: Maja Andjelkovic To: governance at lists.cpsr.org ; Ginger Paque Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Please count me in too. All the best, Maja 2008/12/22 Ginger Paque Great, Jeanette, thanks! This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to consider the real issue. Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Hi Ian and Ginger, good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. jeanette Ian Peter wrote: > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by > personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > > > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But > briefly, > > > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > volunteer pool for this task > > > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers > not chosen are able to stand. > > > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. > > > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours > total to this task over a month. > > > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance _____ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From edmanix at gmail.com Tue Dec 23 07:32:24 2008 From: edmanix at gmail.com (Emmanuel Edet) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 13:32:24 +0100 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for--Almost halfway there In-Reply-To: <002801c964f8$62489240$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <6a19eea00812221409q7fa323cahbe6bdc811ad2aea0@mail.gmail.com> <002801c964f8$62489240$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: If I am qualified to volunteer then I am in too. Thanks On Tue, Dec 23, 2008 at 1:16 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > We have the following volunteers (12) so far for the Noncom pool—Thank you > very much. Please consider joining them (us) as soon as possible… a great > Christmas or Winter Holiday gift to the IGC members! This is an important > undertaking, but a fairly easy task time-wise, so it is a good way to be > actively involved on a short-term commitment. We still need as many > volunteers as possible, minimum 13 more. > > > > Jeanette Hofmann > > Maja Andjelkovic > > Philippe Dam > > Hanane Boujemi > > Raquel Gatto > > Rafik Dammak > > Shaila Mistry > > Tricia Wang > > Anja Kovacs > > Hempal Shrestha > > Adam Peake > > Ken Lohento > > > > Thanks to everyone for your good wishes and support. I am looking forward to > this new experience, and expect to learn from all of you in the process > (that's the payback J) > > > > Ginger > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > De: Hanane Boujemi [mailto:hananeb at diplomacy.edu] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 06:49 p.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Maja Andjelkovic; Ginger Paque > Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for > > > > I am in too. > > > > Merry Christmas everybody and congrats for Ginger . > > > > Hanane > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: Maja Andjelkovic > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org ; Ginger Paque > > Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 11:09 PM > > Subject: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for > > > > Please count me in too. > > All the best, > Maja > > 2008/12/22 Ginger Paque > > Great, Jeanette, thanks! > > This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this > preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to > consider the real issue. > > Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! > Ginger > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. > Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter > Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for > > Hi Ian and Ginger, > > good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. > jeanette > > Ian Peter wrote: >> So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi >> Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom >> the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. >> >> >> >> To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we >> must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. >> Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by >> personal email. (to the list is preferable) >> >> >> >> The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But >> briefly, >> >> >> >> The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups >> for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group >> (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a >> Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the >> volunteer pool for this task >> >> >> >> So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the >> NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people >> from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as >> the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non >> voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not >> be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers >> not chosen are able to stand. >> >> >> >> Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by >> submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers >> urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. >> >> >> >> Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January >> until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as >> a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours >> total to this task over a month. >> >> >> >> Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work >> >> >> >> Ian Peter >> >> PO Box 429 >> >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> >> Australia >> >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >> >> > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > ________________________________ > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- emmanuel Happiness is good health and a bad memory." - Ingrid Bergman (1917-1982) ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From renate.bloem at gmail.com Tue Dec 23 08:22:31 2008 From: renate.bloem at gmail.com (Renate Bloem (Gmail)) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 14:22:31 +0100 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for--Almost halfway there In-Reply-To: <002801c964f8$62489240$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <4950e61c.0c92100a.5cd2.76d9@mx.google.com> Hallo Ginger and Ian, First my congrats to Ginger for the election results and all the best in co-steering the Caucus forward to ever better CS contributions for real impact! Thanks also to your co-runners. You can build on Parminder’s in fatigable efforts in carving the way, and you have, of course, in Ian Peter the best of all co-chairs. I hope we can bring in many more CS actors, in particular from relevant global development CSOs. You can take me into the volunteer pool to move things ahead. Not having been in Hyderabad, I missed many of you, but hope to join in again in 2009! Happy holidays to all! Renate Renate Bloem Past President of CONGO Civicus UN Geneva Tel:/Fax +33450 850815/16 Mobile : +41763462310 renate.bloem at civicus.org renate.bloem at gmail.com CIVICUS: World Alliance for Citizen Participation PO BOX 933, 2135, Johannesburg, South Africa www.civicus.org P Please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to. Thank you. _____ From: Ginger Paque [mailto:ginger at paque.net] Sent: mardi, 23. décembre 2008 13:17 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Ian Peter' Subject: RE: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for--Almost halfway there We have the following volunteers (12) so far for the Noncom pool—Thank you very much. Please consider joining them (us) as soon as possible a great Christmas or Winter Holiday gift to the IGC members! This is an important undertaking, but a fairly easy task time-wise, so it is a good way to be actively involved on a short-term commitment. We still need as many volunteers as possible, minimum 13 more. Jeanette Hofmann Maja Andjelkovic Philippe Dam Hanane Boujemi Raquel Gatto Rafik Dammak Shaila Mistry Tricia Wang Anja Kovacs Hempal Shrestha Adam Peake Ken Lohento Thanks to everyone for your good wishes and support. I am looking forward to this new experience, and expect to learn from all of you in the process (that’s the payback :-)) Ginger _____ De: Hanane Boujemi [mailto:hananeb at diplomacy.edu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 06:49 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Maja Andjelkovic; Ginger Paque Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for I am in too. Merry Christmas everybody and congrats for Ginger . Hanane ----- Original Message ----- From: Maja Andjelkovic To: governance at lists.cpsr.org ; Ginger Paque Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Please count me in too. All the best, Maja 2008/12/22 Ginger Paque Great, Jeanette, thanks! This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to consider the real issue. Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Hi Ian and Ginger, good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. jeanette Ian Peter wrote: > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by > personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > > > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But > briefly, > > > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > volunteer pool for this task > > > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers > not chosen are able to stand. > > > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. > > > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours > total to this task over a month. > > > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance _____ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From email at hakik.org Tue Dec 23 10:25:18 2008 From: email at hakik.org (Hakikur Rahman) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 15:25:18 +0000 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> References: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> Message-ID: <20081223152546.437AFA6CDA@smtp2.electricembers.net> Given the experience of last year, it would be a good decision not to rush with MAG renewal. We may request for an extension of the final date. That would provide some time to discuss among the community participants, and especially the NomCom, which is extremely necessary. Best regards, Hakik At 09:52 AM 12/21/2008, Ian Peter wrote: >I've just noticed from the IGC website that the final date for nominations >for MAG renewal has just been set as February 15. I do not believe it is >possible for us to carry out the procedure outlined in our charter in that >time frame, ie > >1. get 25 names for nomcom pool - from past experience and with a holiday >season that would take us till at least January 12 >2. select nomcom - till January 19 >3. set criteria - till January 26 (very minimal) >4. call for nominations - close February 10 >5. choose candidates - requires at least 2 weeks to do effectively. So we >are out of time. > >And that is assuming we start today, no delays. > >However I believe we should come up with a quicker process and put in some >nominations rather than miss out altogether. So I am interested in >suggestions as to how we might proceed in a fair and reasonable manner with >a shortened process. > >Please make suggestions. Within 48 hours there will be a new Co-cordinator >announced, I would like to discuss with them our best path forward given the >time and holiday season constraints, and your suggestions will be very >welcome. > > >Ian Peter >PO Box 429 >Bangalow NSW 2479 >Australia >Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >www.ianpeter.com > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] > > Sent: 21 December 2008 06:16 > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Jeanette Hofmann' > > Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > > > > Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite a bit > > of > > lead time to go through this. > > > > Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 candidates > > from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for candidates > > and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on this > > early in January. > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] > > > Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 > > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming > > > > > > Hi everyone, > > > > > > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and before > > > we know it there is another election waiting. > > > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start with > > > the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new > > > members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. > > > > > > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our > > > mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of > > > information about the new members in August! > > > > > > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to start > > > thinking about candidates. > > > > > > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's August > > > 22 mail): > > > > > > Valeria Betancourt > > > Graciela Selaimen > > > Y. J. Park > > > Natasha Primo > > > > > > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. > > > > > > Robin Gross > > > Jeanette Hofmann > > > Ken Lohento > > > Qusai Al Shatti > > > > > > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the renewed > > > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more > > > complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. > > > > > > All the best, jeanette > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From qshatti at gmail.com Tue Dec 23 10:37:20 2008 From: qshatti at gmail.com (Qusai AlShatti) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 17:37:20 +0200 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> Message-ID: <609019df0812230737h98cc18di3d627e165f55b6a@mail.gmail.com> Congratulation Ginger and wish you all the best in your task as an IGC coordinator. Regards, Qusai Al-Shatti On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 12:34 PM, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 Election of > the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 votes cast, we have > the following result: > > Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new co-coordinator, > and to all those that participated in the election. In terms of voting > participation, we had a 22% response rate and slightly less overall voter > participation than in the last election (n=100). > > I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal deadline, and > then delete it. > > Kindest regards, > Derrick > > Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > School of Information Studies > and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > Syracuse University > 346 Hinds Hall > Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > http://cogburn.blogspot.com > http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeremy.shtern at umontreal.ca Tue Dec 23 11:05:12 2008 From: jeremy.shtern at umontreal.ca (Jeremy Shtern) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 11:05:12 -0500 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for--Almost In-Reply-To: <002801c964f8$62489240$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <6a19eea00812221409q7fa323cahbe6bdc811ad2aea0@mail.gmail.com> <002801c964f8$62489240$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <49510C38.3040609@umontreal.ca> Let me echo everyone else in congratulating Ginger and thanking Parminder as well as Derrick for their time and service. Please put me down for the NomCom. Regards, Jeremy Shtern Ginger Paque wrote: > > We have the following volunteers (12) so far for the Noncom pool—Thank > you very much. Please consider joining them (us) as soon as possible… > a great Christmas or Winter Holiday gift to the IGC members! This is > an important undertaking, but a fairly easy task time-wise, so it is a > good way to be actively involved on a short-term commitment. We still > need as many volunteers as possible, minimum 13 more. > > Jeanette Hofmann > > Maja Andjelkovic > > Philippe Dam > > Hanane Boujemi > > Raquel Gatto > > Rafik Dammak > > Shaila Mistry > > Tricia Wang > > Anja Kovacs > > Hempal Shrestha > > Adam Peake > > Ken Lohento > > Thanks to everyone for your good wishes and support. I am looking > forward to this new experience, and expect to learn from all of you in > the process (that’s the payback J ) > > Ginger > > * De: * Hanane Boujemi [mailto:hananeb at diplomacy.edu] > *Enviado el:* Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 06:49 p.m. > *Para:* governance at lists.cpsr.org ; Maja Andjelkovic; Ginger Paque > *Asunto:* Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom > pool for > > I am in too. > > Merry Christmas everybody and congrats for Ginger . > > Hanane > > ----- Original Message ----- > > * From: * Maja Andjelkovic > > * To: * governance at lists.cpsr.org > ; Ginger Paque > > > * Sent: * Monday, December 22, 2008 11:09 PM > > * Subject: * Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for > Nomcom pool for > > Please count me in too. > > All the best, > Maja > > 2008/12/22 Ginger Paque > > > Great, Jeanette, thanks! > > This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get > this > preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to > consider the real issue. > > Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! > Ginger > > -----Mensaje original----- > De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu ] > Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. > Para : governance at lists.cpsr.org > ; Ian Peter > Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom > pool for > > > Hi Ian and Ginger, > > good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. > jeanette > > Ian Peter wrote: > > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the > Multi > > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers > from whom > > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > > > > > > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to > me by > > personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > > > > > > > The process is described in full at > http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But > > briefly, > > > > > > > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder > groups > > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > > volunteer pool for this task > > > > > > > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 > people > > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to > serve as > > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non > > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen > will not > > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers > > not chosen are able to stand. > > > > > > > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 > volunteers > > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task > underway. > > > > > > > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > > until early February to review candidate profiles and make > selections as > > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about > 6 hours > > total to this task over a month. > > > > > > > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > > > > > > > Ian Peter > > > > PO Box 429 > > > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > > > Australia > > > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Tue Dec 23 11:42:52 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 12:12:52 -0430 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for In-Reply-To: References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <4950528F.5030007@panos-ao.org> Message-ID: <002101c9651d$81738ba0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Thanks, Adam! You're in. Happy, healthy winter holidays, Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 10:52 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for include me in the nomcom list. Adam ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Tue Dec 23 11:47:37 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 12:17:37 -0430 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <008101c96432$788b5770$ee12a8c0@acerb8600603ec> References: <416928B3-E8B1-4D6A-9952-5040E6D8A69F@syr.edu> <008101c96432$788b5770$ee12a8c0@acerb8600603ec> Message-ID: <002201c9651e$2c8619e0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Hi Tijani, Thanks so much for your good wishes. I look forward to this exciting challenge, and hope to do a good job, especially with your help and support. Have a happy and healthy winter holiday! Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Tijani BEN JEMAA [mailto:tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 08:10 a.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Derrick L. Cogburn Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results Thank you Derrick for accomplishing the election process. Congratulation to Ginger for the list members confidence. Thank you so much Parminder. You were hard worker, with convincing arguments and fair positions. I hope you will still contribute and help. Best -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tijani BEN JEMAA Member of the Tunisian Engineers' Order Vice Chairman of CIC World Federation of Engineering Organizations Phone : + 216 98 330 114 Fax : + 216 70 860 861 -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Derrick L. Cogburn" To: Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 11:34 AM Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results > Dear Colleagues, > > It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 Election of > the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 votes cast, we > have the following result: > > Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) > Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) > None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) > Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) > > My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new co- coordinator, > and to all those that participated in the election. In terms of voting > participation, we had a 22% response rate and slightly less overall voter > participation than in the last election (n=100). > > I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal deadline, > and then delete it. > > Kindest regards, > Derrick > > Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn > School of Information Studies > and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs > Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs > Syracuse University > 346 Hinds Hall > Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 > Phone: +1.315.443.5441 > Fax: +1.315.443.6886 > http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn > http://cogburn.blogspot.com > http://cotelco.syr.edu > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ca at rits.org.br Tue Dec 23 13:32:04 2008 From: ca at rits.org.br (Carlos Afonso) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 16:32:04 -0200 Subject: [governance] message from rits In-Reply-To: <002101c9651d$81738ba0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <4950528F.5030007@panos-ao.org> <002101c9651d$81738ba0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <49512EA4.3020007@rits.org.br> == português - english - español == A Rede de Informações para o Terceiro Setor (Rits) deseja a todas e todos um ano novo com muita paz, justiça, liberdade, solidariedade, igualdade, diversidade e participação! The Information Network for the Third Sector (Rits, Brazil) wishes everyone a new year with peace, justice, freedom, solidarity, equality, diversity and participation! La Red de Informaciones para el Tercer Sector (Rits, Brasil) desea a todas y todos un nuevo año con mucha paz, justicia, libertad, solidaridad, igualdad, diversidad y participación! A equipe Rits The Rits team El equipo Rits www.rits.org.br www.rets.org.br www.nupef.org.br www.ritsnet.org.br www.politics.org.br ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Tue Dec 23 14:03:07 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 14:33:07 -0430 Subject: RV: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool 16 Current List Message-ID: <003f01c96531$18b15ed0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Jeanette Hofmann Maja Andjelkovic Philippe Dam Hanane Boujemi Raquel Gatto Rafik Dammak Shaila Mistry Tricia Wang Anja Kovacs Hempal Shrestha Adam Peake Ken Lohento Emmanuel Edet Renate Bloem Jeremy Shtern Schombe Baudoin _____ De: Hanane Boujemi [mailto:hananeb at diplomacy.edu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 06:49 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Maja Andjelkovic; Ginger Paque Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for I am in too. Merry Christmas everybody and congrats for Ginger . Hanane ----- Original Message ----- From: Maja Andjelkovic To: governance at lists.cpsr.org ; Ginger Paque Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Please count me in too. All the best, Maja 2008/12/22 Ginger Paque Great, Jeanette, thanks! This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to consider the real issue. Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Hi Ian and Ginger, good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. jeanette Ian Peter wrote: > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by > personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > > > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But > briefly, > > > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > volunteer pool for this task > > > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers > not chosen are able to stand. > > > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. > > > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours > total to this task over a month. > > > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance _____ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dogwallah at gmail.com Tue Dec 23 20:22:21 2008 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 20:22:21 -0500 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality In-Reply-To: <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> References: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 7:11 AM, Parminder wrote: > > > > 1. In terms of ownership – it is public > Asserting this ignores the basic reality that most of the components of the Internet are owned by private individuals and organisations. How would you assert public ownership in light of this? -- Cheers, McTim http://stateoftheinternetin.ug ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dogwallah at gmail.com Tue Dec 23 20:33:02 2008 From: dogwallah at gmail.com (McTim) Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2008 20:33:02 -0500 Subject: hyperbole and hypocrisy (was Re: [governance] Thank you to Parminder) Message-ID: Willie, On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:11 AM, Willie Currie wrote: > I'd also like to thank Parminder for his commitment and hard work as IGC > coordinator. > > Parminder has played an important role for the IGC during a difficult period > of adjustment to a post-WSIS global policy space in internet governance, > when a sustained attempt to deflect attention from the need for global > public policy principles for managing critical internet resources There already ARE global public policy principles in place for this.....do you not recall seeing my BUTOCS (posting) earlier this year?? was > underway as a backlash to the gains made in the WSIS. It is largely to > Parminder's credit that the issue of 'enhanced cooperation' could be > discussed in Hyderabad without the sky falling down. While Parminder should be acknowledged and thanked for his efforts and enthusiasm brought to the role, I would hardly equate him to Atlas ;-) Indeed a little more > attention to public policy principles at an earlier stage may have helped > the IPv4/6 transition as the IGF open policy dialogue on the matter > demonstrated. which principles would those have been? Like the banking system, I think we have been witnessing the > limits of the claims for technical expertise in the absence of suitable > policy and regulation in the public interest in this area. And no one had > an adequate answer to Jeanette's question as to who is in charge? The answer is that no ONE person or body is or should be in charge. You all ought to know that. Parminder > suffered unjustifable attack while coordinator of the IGC when he did raise > questions of public policy. And I think the shambles around the IPv4/6 > transition vindicates his concerns for public policy frameworks in internet > governance. The "shambles" as you put it is caused by network operators not implementing IPv6. How would a "public policy framework" increase IPv6 uptake? The question I'd like answered from folk who think they could have done a better job than the output of the IETF NG WG is "why weren't you more involved?" The old canard that the IETF is an unwelcoming group of white American engineers is not allowed as a valid answer. -- Cheers, McTim http://stateoftheinternetin.ug ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From tapani.tarvainen at effi.org Tue Dec 23 23:49:33 2008 From: tapani.tarvainen at effi.org (Tapani Tarvainen) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 06:49:33 +0200 Subject: RV: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool In-Reply-To: <003f01c96531$18b15ed0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <003f01c96531$18b15ed0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <20081224044933.GB20888@hamsu.tarvainen.info> I'll volunteer for the nomcom. -- Tapani Tarvainen ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeremy at ciroap.org Wed Dec 24 00:51:45 2008 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 13:51:45 +0800 Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also needed! Message-ID: <02895C37-5705-4E96-99DD-FE1FC1AE8BDD@ciroap.org> It is great that so many people have nominated for the NomCom for the election of representatives to the MAG, but please remember that we are also seeking nominees for the Appeals Team! The Appeals Team is an important part of the checks and balances that make our coordinators accountable to IGC members. Although it is rarely if ever called upon, it is important that a willing and capable Appeals Team exists. So far we have only one nominee, and we would like at least ten! Please don't hesitate to nominate yourself or (with their agreement) someone else whom you believe could take on this job. Thanks in advance! -- JEREMY MALCOLM Project Coordinator CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE for Asia Pacific and the Middle East Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ian.peter at ianpeter.com Wed Dec 24 01:02:45 2008 From: ian.peter at ianpeter.com (Ian Peter) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 17:02:45 +1100 Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also needed! In-Reply-To: <02895C37-5705-4E96-99DD-FE1FC1AE8BDD@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <85E4D10ED2B742359934BF0765FCC084@IAN> Yes please ! It's very important we fill the Appeals Team positions, so please do nominate asper Jeremy's message below. You can be on MAG and the Appeals Team at the same time, the only people who cant be on Appeals Team are the Co-ordinators. Ian Peter PO Box 429 Bangalow NSW 2479 Australia Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 www.ianpeter.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Jeremy Malcolm [mailto:jeremy at ciroap.org] > Sent: 24 December 2008 16:52 > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org > Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also needed! > > It is great that so many people have nominated for the NomCom for the > election of representatives to the MAG, but please remember that we > are also seeking nominees for the Appeals Team! > > The Appeals Team is an important part of the checks and balances that > make our coordinators accountable to IGC members. Although it is > rarely if ever called upon, it is important that a willing and capable > Appeals Team exists. > > So far we have only one nominee, and we would like at least ten! > Please don't hesitate to nominate yourself or (with their agreement) > someone else whom you believe could take on this job. Thanks in > advance! > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global > campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in > 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer > movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more > information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From asif at kabani.co.uk Wed Dec 24 02:10:43 2008 From: asif at kabani.co.uk (Kabani) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 12:10:43 +0500 Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming In-Reply-To: <20081223152546.437AFA6CDA@smtp2.electricembers.net> References: <5EBA181862104166AEF61D8940E4FB29@IAN> <20081223152546.437AFA6CDA@smtp2.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <8017791e0812232310h65ee35fdm6023d8ecf581cbac@mail.gmail.com> Hakik, Thank for suppoting my input, With Best Regards Sincerely Asif Kabani 2008/12/23 Hakikur Rahman : > Given the experience of last year, it would be a good decision not to rush > with MAG renewal. We may request for an extension of the final date. That > would provide some time to discuss among the community participants, and > especially the NomCom, which is extremely necessary. > > Best regards, > Hakik > > > At 09:52 AM 12/21/2008, Ian Peter wrote: >> >> I've just noticed from the IGC website that the final date for nominations >> for MAG renewal has just been set as February 15. I do not believe it is >> possible for us to carry out the procedure outlined in our charter in that >> time frame, ie >> >> 1. get 25 names for nomcom pool - from past experience and with a holiday >> season that would take us till at least January 12 >> 2. select nomcom - till January 19 >> 3. set criteria - till January 26 (very minimal) >> 4. call for nominations - close February 10 >> 5. choose candidates - requires at least 2 weeks to do effectively. So we >> are out of time. >> >> And that is assuming we start today, no delays. >> >> However I believe we should come up with a quicker process and put in some >> nominations rather than miss out altogether. So I am interested in >> suggestions as to how we might proceed in a fair and reasonable manner >> with >> a shortened process. >> >> Please make suggestions. Within 48 hours there will be a new Co-cordinator >> announced, I would like to discuss with them our best path forward given >> the >> time and holiday season constraints, and your suggestions will be very >> welcome. >> >> >> Ian Peter >> PO Box 429 >> Bangalow NSW 2479 >> Australia >> Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> www.ianpeter.com >> >> >> >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: Ian Peter [mailto:ian.peter at ianpeter.com] >> > Sent: 21 December 2008 06:16 >> > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Jeanette Hofmann' >> > Subject: RE: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >> > >> > Thanks for posting that Jeanette. With our processes, we need quite a >> > bit >> > of >> > lead time to go through this. >> > >> > Firstly we need an independent chair. Then a nomcom pool of 25 >> > candidates >> > from whom our nomcom will be randomly selected, then a call for >> > candidates >> > and selection of nominated names. So we should make sure we move on this >> > early in January. >> > >> > >> > >> > Ian Peter >> > PO Box 429 >> > Bangalow NSW 2479 >> > Australia >> > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 >> > www.ianpeter.com >> > >> > >> > >> > > -----Original Message----- >> > > From: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] >> > > Sent: 21 December 2008 02:06 >> > > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > > Subject: [governance] yet another election forthcoming >> > > >> > > Hi everyone, >> > > >> > > we have hardly completed the election of the new coordinator and >> > > before >> > > we know it there is another election waiting. >> > > The IGF secretariat got the go-ahead from UN headquarters to start >> > > with >> > > the MAG renewal process. The secretariat hopes to announce the new >> > > members in time for the meeting in May 2009 in Geneva. >> > > >> > > This is fairly early compared to last years. I just went through our >> > > mail archive. This year we started protesting about the lack of >> > > information about the new members in August! >> > > >> > > We havn't got a deadline yet for nominations but it can't hurt to >> > > start >> > > thinking about candidates. >> > > >> > > These are the CS members from this year (copied from Parminder's >> > > August >> > > 22 mail): >> > > >> > > Valeria Betancourt >> > > Graciela Selaimen >> > > Y. J. Park >> > > Natasha Primo >> > > >> > > And a few of IGC members whose membership has been renewed. >> > > >> > > Robin Gross >> > > Jeanette Hofmann >> > > Ken Lohento >> > > Qusai Al Shatti >> > > >> > > About a third of the members should rotate each year. All of the >> > > renewed >> > > members have now completed their 3. And to make it a bit more >> > > complicated, we are just one of the groups who nominate CS members. >> > > >> > > All the best, jeanette >> > > >> > > >> > > ____________________________________________________________ >> > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > > >> > > For all list information and functions, see: >> > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> > >> > ____________________________________________________________ >> > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> > To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > >> > For all list information and functions, see: >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From asif at kabani.co.uk Wed Dec 24 02:22:53 2008 From: asif at kabani.co.uk (Kabani) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 12:22:53 +0500 Subject: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results In-Reply-To: <20081222121707.4666C67829@smtp1.electricembers.net> References: <001d01c9642d$bec112c0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <20081222121707.4666C67829@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <8017791e0812232322l53fef543m2d15a71612bad6f5@mail.gmail.com> Greetings All, Thank you all for voting and making this election a success, I would like to congrate Ginger here, We are here to support the team. Please feel free to contact us. I Wish Season Greetings to all of you and family. With Best Regards Sincerely Asif Kabani 2008/12/22 Parminder : > > Congrats Ginger. > > We look forward to work under your leadership and guidance. > > And thanks to Shiva and Asif for participating in this important civic > exercise, and expressing willingness to volunteer time and extra commitment > for the IGC. We do look forward to your continued engagements with the IGC. > > And I thank everyone who has said nice words for me in the last few days, > and will respond individually. Parminder > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Ginger Paque [mailto:ginger at paque.net] >> Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 5:36 PM >> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Parminder' >> Subject: RE: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results >> >> Hello everyone, >> >> Thanks to all of you for your confidence in me. I will do my best to work >> with Ian and all of you so that we can be productive, taking effective >> advantage of the IGC's foundation, built by everyone on the list. >> >> Shiva and Asif Kabani, thank you for your energy and offers as candidates >> for co-coordinator. We count on your full participation, ideas and energy >> for the IG Caucus work. >> >> Many thanks to Parminder for his wonderful work as co-coordinator. I >> remember Parminder (and others on this list) from my first WSIS PrepCom >> days, as willing to share and teach me as a newcomer to this very complex >> world. We all still count on you (Parminder) for active support and >> direction, as usual! >> >> Best winter holiday wishes to all, >> Ginger >> >> >> >> -----Mensaje original----- >> De: Adam Peake [mailto:ajp at glocom.ac.jp] >> Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 07:22 a.m. >> Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org >> Asunto: Re: [governance] December 2008 IGC Election Results >> >> Derrick, thanks for running the election process. >> >> Ginger, congratulations! >> >> Parminder, also thanks for all your work. Nice to disagree with you >> sometimes, and to admit I was wrong about enhanced cooperation, thank >> you for persuading everyone it should be on the Hyderabad agenda. >> >> Best, >> >> Adam >> >> >> >> >> At 5:34 AM -0500 12/22/08, Derrick L. Cogburn wrote: >> >Dear Colleagues, >> > >> >It is my pleasure to report the results of the December 2008 >> >Election of the Civil Society Internet Governance Caucus. With 89 >> >votes cast, we have the following result: >> > >> >Ginger Paque (55.06%, n=49) >> >Sivasubramanian Muthusamy (19.10%, n=17) >> >None of the Above (16.85%, n=15) >> >Asif Kabani (8.99%, n=8) >> > >> >My hearty congratulations go out to Ginger Paque, our new >> >co-coordinator, and to all those that participated in the election. >> >In terms of voting participation, we had a 22% response rate and >> >slightly less overall voter participation than in the last election >> >(n=100). >> > >> >I will maintain all data in confidence until after the appeal >> >deadline, and then delete it. >> > >> >Kindest regards, >> >Derrick >> > >> >Prof. Derrick L. Cogburn >> >School of Information Studies >> >and Moynihan Institute of Global Affairs >> >Maxwell School of Citizenship & Public Affairs >> >Syracuse University >> >346 Hinds Hall >> >Syracuse, NY 13244-4100 >> >Phone: +1.315.443.5441 >> >Fax: +1.315.443.6886 >> >http://www.cotelco.net/~dcogburn >> >http://cogburn.blogspot.com >> >http://cotelco.syr.edu >> > >> > >> >____________________________________________________________ >> >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> > governance at lists.cpsr.org >> >To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> > >> >For all list information and functions, see: >> > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From klohento at panos-ao.org Wed Dec 24 02:16:45 2008 From: klohento at panos-ao.org (Ken Lohento) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 08:16:45 +0100 Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also needed! In-Reply-To: <02895C37-5705-4E96-99DD-FE1FC1AE8BDD@ciroap.org> References: <02895C37-5705-4E96-99DD-FE1FC1AE8BDD@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <4951E1DD.7020709@panos-ao.org> I'm volunteer for the Appeals Team KL Jeremy Malcolm a écrit : > It is great that so many people have nominated for the NomCom for the > election of representatives to the MAG, but please remember that we > are also seeking nominees for the Appeals Team! > > The Appeals Team is an important part of the checks and balances that > make our coordinators accountable to IGC members. Although it is > rarely if ever called upon, it is important that a willing and capable > Appeals Team exists. > > So far we have only one nominee, and we would like at least ten! > Please don't hesitate to nominate yourself or (with their agreement) > someone else whom you believe could take on this job. Thanks in advance! > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ocl at gih.com Wed Dec 24 05:13:51 2008 From: ocl at gih.com (Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 11:13:51 +0100 Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also needed! References: <02895C37-5705-4E96-99DD-FE1FC1AE8BDD@ciroap.org> Message-ID: Hello Jeremy, I'm happy to serve in the Appeals Team. I've been listening a lot from the sidelines and not speaking much here, but if I can help with the process, I can lend some time pro-bono. Best Wishes, Olivier -- Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD http://www.gih.com/ocl.html ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeremy Malcolm" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 6:51 AM Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also needed! > It is great that so many people have nominated for the NomCom for the > election of representatives to the MAG, but please remember that we are > also seeking nominees for the Appeals Team! > > The Appeals Team is an important part of the checks and balances that > make our coordinators accountable to IGC members. Although it is rarely > if ever called upon, it is important that a willing and capable Appeals > Team exists. > > So far we have only one nominee, and we would like at least ten! Please > don't hesitate to nominate yourself or (with their agreement) someone > else whom you believe could take on this job. Thanks in advance! > > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning > voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, > we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help > protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit > www.consumersinternational.org. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn Wed Dec 24 08:28:28 2008 From: tijani.benjemaa at planet.tn (Tijani BEN JEMAA) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 14:28:28 +0100 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for--Almost halfway there References: <494FFCC3.7030601@wzb.eu> <012d01c96481$8a3ecca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <6a19eea00812221409q7fa323cahbe6bdc811ad2aea0@mail.gmail.com> <002801c964f8$62489240$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <007801c965cb$b6e22450$ee12a8c0@acerb8600603ec> I also volunteer. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Tijani BEN JEMAA Member of the Tunisian Engineers' Order Vice Chairman of CIC World Federation of Engineering Organizations Phone : + 216 98 330 114 Fax : + 216 70 860 861 -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: Ginger Paque To: governance at lists.cpsr.org ; 'Ian Peter' Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 1:16 PM Subject: RE: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for--Almost halfway there We have the following volunteers (12) so far for the Noncom pool-Thank you very much. Please consider joining them (us) as soon as possible. a great Christmas or Winter Holiday gift to the IGC members! This is an important undertaking, but a fairly easy task time-wise, so it is a good way to be actively involved on a short-term commitment. We still need as many volunteers as possible, minimum 13 more. Jeanette Hofmann Maja Andjelkovic Philippe Dam Hanane Boujemi Raquel Gatto Rafik Dammak Shaila Mistry Tricia Wang Anja Kovacs Hempal Shrestha Adam Peake Ken Lohento Thanks to everyone for your good wishes and support. I am looking forward to this new experience, and expect to learn from all of you in the process (that's the payback J) Ginger ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ De: Hanane Boujemi [mailto:hananeb at diplomacy.edu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 06:49 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Maja Andjelkovic; Ginger Paque Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for I am in too. Merry Christmas everybody and congrats for Ginger . Hanane ----- Original Message ----- From: Maja Andjelkovic To: governance at lists.cpsr.org ; Ginger Paque Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 11:09 PM Subject: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Please count me in too. All the best, Maja 2008/12/22 Ginger Paque Great, Jeanette, thanks! This is exactly what we need--please just jump in, and help us get this preliminary process moving right away, so the noncom has some time to consider the real issue. Happy winter holidays. Keep warm! Ginger -----Mensaje original----- De: Jeanette Hofmann [mailto:jeanette at wzb.eu] Enviado el: Lunes, 22 de Diciembre de 2008 04:17 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Ian Peter Asunto: Re: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Hi Ian and Ginger, good you get started so quickly! I volunteer for the nomcom. jeanette Ian Peter wrote: > So that we can begin a process to select IGC nominations for the Multi > Stakeholder Advisory Group, we first need a pool of volunteers from whom > the IGC Selection Committee (or Nomcom) will be chosen. > > > > To get this started, we need 25 volunteers if at all possible. But we > must close off the pool on or about January 7 to meet our deadlines. > Either send your name to this list in reply to this message or to me by > personal email. (to the list is preferable) > > > > The process is described in full at http://www.igcaucus.org/node/2. But > briefly, > > > > The IGF Secretariat has called for nominations from stakeholder groups > for potential new members of their Multi Stakeholder Advisory Group > (MAG) .The suggested candidates from this caucus will be made by a > Nominating Committee (nomcom) of five randomly chosen members of the > volunteer pool for this task > > > > So we need to have a selection committee ( a nomcom) To choose the > NomCom, we ideally need a pool of a minimum of 25 volunteers. 5 people > from the pool will be chosen via a pre-determined algorithm to serve as > the NomCom and make the appointments, working with an independent non > voting Chair whose name will be announced shortly. Those chosen will not > be able to stand for MAG selection this time round - other volunteers > not chosen are able to stand. > > > > Everyone is urged to volunteer. So please consider volunteering by > submitting your name now in reply to this topic. We need 25 volunteers > urgently. Your participation here will help us to get this task underway. > > > > Those selected will need to make some time available from mid January > until early February to review candidate profiles and make selections as > a group. Past experience suggests you might need to devote about 6 hours > total to this task over a month. > > > > Please volunteer. We need your help to make this process work > > > > Ian Peter > > PO Box 429 > > Bangalow NSW 2479 > > Australia > > Tel (+614) 1966 7772 or (+612) 6687 0773 > > www.ianpeter.com > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch Wed Dec 24 11:10:31 2008 From: william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch (William Drake) Date: Wed, 24 Dec 2008 10:10:31 -0600 Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also needed! In-Reply-To: References: <02895C37-5705-4E96-99DD-FE1FC1AE8BDD@ciroap.org> Message-ID: Hi, Me too, Bill On Dec 24, 2008, at 4:13 AM, Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond wrote: > Hello Jeremy, > > I'm happy to serve in the Appeals Team. I've been listening a lot > from the sidelines and not speaking much here, but if I can help > with the process, I can lend some time pro-bono. > > Best Wishes, > > Olivier > > -- > Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD > http://www.gih.com/ocl.html > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeremy Malcolm" > > To: > Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 6:51 AM > Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also > needed! > > >> It is great that so many people have nominated for the NomCom for >> the election of representatives to the MAG, but please remember >> that we are also seeking nominees for the Appeals Team! >> >> The Appeals Team is an important part of the checks and balances >> that make our coordinators accountable to IGC members. Although >> it is rarely if ever called upon, it is important that a willing >> and capable Appeals Team exists. >> >> So far we have only one nominee, and we would like at least ten! >> Please don't hesitate to nominate yourself or (with their >> agreement) someone else whom you believe could take on this job. >> Thanks in advance! >> >> -- >> JEREMY MALCOLM >> Project Coordinator >> CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE >> for Asia Pacific and the Middle East >> Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global >> campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member >> organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful >> international consumer movement to help protect and empower >> consumers everywhere. For more information, visit >> www.consumersinternational.org. >> >> ____________________________________________________________ >> You received this message as a subscriber on the list: >> governance at lists.cpsr.org >> To be removed from the list, send any message to: >> governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org >> >> For all list information and functions, see: >> http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance *********************************************************** William J. Drake Senior Associate Centre for International Governance Graduate Institute of International and Development Studies Geneva, Switzerland william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch New book: Governing Global Electronic Networks, http://tinyurl.com/5mh9jj *********************************************************** -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Fri Dec 26 10:15:35 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (JFC Morfin) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 16:15:35 +0100 Subject: hyperbole and hypocrisy (was Re: [governance] Thank you to In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20081226171213.96E1BE1665@smtp3.electricembers.net> Dear McTim, I have some difficulty fully understanding your position. May be could you help. At 02:33 24/12/2008, McTim wrote: >The "shambles" as you put it is caused by network operators not >implementing IPv6. Question: why dont they? What could incitate them to implement v6? >How would a "public policy framework" increase IPv6 uptake? Since I have nothing against people having a try to help IPv6 whatever the idea they may have. My question to you would be; how would it not increase it? Or am I reading you wrong somewhere? >The question I'd like answered from folk who think they could have >done a better job than the output of the IETF NG WG is "why weren't >you more involved?" From this I understand you were a member of that WG? I am not familiar with it. Also, sorry for reading the threat in the middle, which document are you refering to? Is that the RFC on an IPv6 deployment calendar? >The old canard that the IETF is an unwelcoming group of white >American engineers is not allowed as a valid answer. This is still very new. Not fully finalised yet. The issues are "engineers" and "American" (not as citizens but as training schools. You now are very welcome to join the iucg at ietf.org mailing list https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iucg. It is dedicated to users, so they may contribute to the IETF work in their own non-technical and even non-english language to be translated futher in regular IETF language. jfc ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kichango at gmail.com Fri Dec 26 15:45:49 2008 From: kichango at gmail.com (Mawaki Chango) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 15:45:49 -0500 Subject: [governance] msnbc.com: Uproar in Australia over plan to block Web sites Message-ID: <6d6172890812261245rca6c65fq8bd8e21c7babcd4f@mail.gmail.com> Peace and much inspiration to you all in these days and for another cycle of life. Mawaki -- FYI Uproar in Australia over plan to block Web sites A proposed Internet filter dubbed the "Great Aussie Firewall" is promising to make Australia one of the strictest Internet regulators among democratic countries. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28391933/from/ET/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From javier at funredes.org Fri Dec 26 17:04:56 2008 From: javier at funredes.org (Javier =?iso-8859-1?Q?Pinz=F3n?=) Date: Fri, 26 Dec 2008 18:04:56 -0400 (AST) Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool for Message-ID: <2685.190.84.64.86.1230329096.squirrel@funredes.org> I volunteer as well. Regards, Javier -- http://funredes.org/javier At 07:28 a.m. 24/12/2008, Tijani Ben Jemaa wrote: > >I also volunteer. >-------------------------------------------------------------------------- >Tijani BEN JEMAA -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>----- Original Message ----- >>From: Ginger Paque >>To: governance at lists.cpsr.org ; 'Ian Peter' >>Sent: Tuesday, December 23, 2008 1:16 PM >>Subject: RE: [governance] URGENT - Call for >>volunteers for Nomcom pool for--Almost halfway there >> >> >>We have the following volunteers (12) so far for >>the Noncom pool—Thank you very much. Please >>consider joining them (us) as soon as possible ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From mueller at syr.edu Sat Dec 27 01:21:56 2008 From: mueller at syr.edu (Milton L Mueller) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 01:21:56 -0500 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality In-Reply-To: <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> References: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2CD5@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Parminder: Happy holidays, all. Sorry for the slow response. It seems that we have had this conversation before, and you always have to agree that I am right but it never seems to make an impression on your political rhetoric. So I will try again (because I am just as persistent as you, and will not allow policies or principles that are incorrect to be established simply because someone keeps repeating them. We need to develop and anchor such basic principles that maximize the possibilities of the Internet as a new revolutionary network - whose central characteristics (mentioned in social rather than technical terms) should be that 1. In terms of ownership - it is public As I have explained numerous times, the essential characteristic of the internet is NOT that it is public; the networks and most of the investment are private. The STANDARDS are open and nonproprietary, but they are useful only because they allow any and all private networks and privately owned equipment to be interconnected. It is, in other words, the correct mixture of private and public elements, in their respective roles (to quote the TA) that makes it a success. The open protocols allow private initiative to flourish, and enable people to offer content and services without asking the public for permission. So the critical feature of the internet is in many ways precisely the opposite of what you are asserting. I know that this does not conform to your ideology, but it's a fact. 2. and in terms of its key purpose, and orientation - it is egalitarian (definition of 'egalitarian' from The American Heritage Dictionary - "Affirming, promoting, or characterized by belief in equal political, economic, social, and civil rights for all people") Again I think you've got it wrong. Strictly speaking, the internet protocols do not have a "purpose" other than to establish compatible data communications among any and all networks. However, because the TCP/IP protocol suite's ability to connect networks initially outstripped the understanding and capacity of governments to regulate, one could say that its effect was more libertarian than egalitarian. But its uniform, open nature did indeed level the playing field and afford those interested in communicating more equal rights than they have ever had before. Once we agree to these highest level principles as those most essential to what we call as the Internet - their contextual elaborations can always be done, in different circumstances and as related to different issues and aspects. No doubts, such elaboration will itself be a political process, subject to political trade-offs. The question is, are we as a world community - and to start with as a group of progressive civil society - able to agree to these (or any other) social and political principles to be the highest constitutive principles for the Internet. I can agree on principles when they are articulated with a full, exacting respect for the technical and historical facts. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From isolatedn at gmail.com Sat Dec 27 03:21:39 2008 From: isolatedn at gmail.com (Sivasubramanian Muthusamy) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 13:51:39 +0530 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality In-Reply-To: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2CD5@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> References: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2CD5@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: Hello Milton, On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 11:51 AM, Milton L Mueller wrote: > Parminder: > > Happy holidays, all. Sorry for the slow response. > > > > It seems that we have had this conversation before, and you always have to > agree that I am right but it never seems to make an impression on your > political rhetoric. So I will try again (because > I am just as persistent as you, and will not allow policies or principles > that are incorrect to be established simply because someone keeps repeating > them. > > > > We need to develop and anchor such basic principles that maximize the > possibilities of the Internet as a new revolutionary network – whose central > characteristics (mentioned in social rather than technical terms) should be > that > > > > 1. In terms of ownership – it is public > > > > As I have explained numerous times, the essential characteristic of the > internet is NOT that it is public; the networks and most of the investment > are private. The STANDARDS are open and nonproprietary, but they are useful > only because they allow any and all private networks and privately owned > equipment to be interconnected. It is, in other words, the correct mixture > of private and public elements, in their respective roles (to quote the TA) > that makes it a success. The open protocols allow private initiative to > flourish, and enable people to offer content and services without asking the > public for permission. So the critical feature of the internet is in many > ways precisely the opposite of what you are asserting. > > I know that this does not conform to your ideology, but it's a fact. > Parminder's point about ownership is exactly the kind of expression that sends out wrong signals from Civil Society to other stakeholders. Business as a stakeholder would misinterpret such expressions as a suggestion for a public take over of all the infrastructure that have been built mostly with private investments, which is unfair. Barring a few extreme exceptions, the Civil Society is always fair in acknowledging that the Internet Infrastrure took shape mostly with private investments. Perhaps Parminder also does not imply 'Public Ownership' of the equipment, wires and cables ? Or does he? There is also a danger. When someone says 'public' and 'ownership' on the same line, there is a danger of this being interpreted not as a suggestion for "shared ownership" but rather as "ownership by governments", like how it was in the former Soviet Union and in India until the mid 80s. The line between public ownership and govenment 'ownership' is very thin, in that sense. *The Internet has evolved from a fusion of private enterprise and public participation, in a laissez faire climate. It needs to evolve further on the same model. * What is often missed is that there is public participation in business, though at an indirect level. Investments come from private enterprise which are originally funded by the public through the Stock Exchange ! Should I go back to the previous paragraph and edit it to say that Parminder is right? And there is a possibility that further investments could come more from enterprises that embrace the "social enterprise" business models that would balance the Civil Society and Business positions??? > I can agree on principles when they are articulated with a full, exacting > respect for the technical and historical facts. > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Sat Dec 27 06:54:00 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 17:24:00 +0530 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20081227115410.671D9A6C20@smtp2.electricembers.net> > > 1. In terms of ownership - it is public > > > > Asserting this ignores the basic reality that most of the components > of the Internet are owned by private individuals and organisations. > > How would you assert public ownership in light of this? McTim, As you would seen from my email from where you extract this quote, the purpose was to seek out what could be called as the very essential and defining characteristics of the Internet, which will help us build the essential public policy principles for it. It is in this regard that the publicness of the Internet was originally mentioned. One must understand that public is not necessarily, and certainly not in this context, public authorities. 'Public' is as opposed to 'private', as used in the term 'public interest', for instance. You may remember that the WSIS defined the Internet as a global public facility. We are talking about the 'essential nature' of the Internet. It is a public network, as opposed to private networks. I think this much is elementary and universally understood and accepted. It may connect many private networks, but it itself, in its essential nature, is public. It is like public roads joining private territories, or perhaps more aptly, the public environment enveloping the private enclosures. The environment is in its essence public, and of public ownership. Since Internet is a whole new space and reality, the environment analogy is perhaps more appropriate. All of these however are obviously inexact approximations. To try to keep it simple, we can try to understand the meaning of public as against private in a different and direct way. When you think of 'the Internet' do you instinctively feel you have as much right to it as anyone else? I suspect you, like every one of us, do think so. Well, then Internet is public. It is like when you go to a public park or library. You strongly feel you have an equal right to it as anyone else. That defines something as public. On the other hand, if you were standing in front of, say, the building of Microsoft's head office you may still feel you can go in, but inside you'd really not feel you have every and equal right to be there, as much as anyone else. This place is private. It is known who has greater rights to the place than you have. That's true of IT for Change's office too. It Internet were not public, it has to be private. Are you saying the Internet is private? If it is private, someone has to own it more than others. Who is it? Well, it is beginning to happen in the way corporates have started to skew the basic equal characteristic of the Internet, whereby we did this campaign for protecting the 'public-ness and the egalitarian' character of the Internet. However, the Internet is still largely public. That's the point being made. To say it is not public, is not merely a semantic haggling. It is playing in the hands of those who are bent on destroying this equal (egalitarian) and public nature of the Internet. These distinctions are important, because they can determine what governance regimes are suitable for the Internet, and which direction will the development of the Internet take. Parminder > -----Original Message----- > From: McTim [mailto:dogwallah at gmail.com] > Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 6:52 AM > To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Parminder > Subject: Re: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net > Neutrality > > On Mon, Dec 22, 2008 at 7:11 AM, Parminder > wrote: > > > > > > > > > 1. In terms of ownership - it is public > > > > Asserting this ignores the basic reality that most of the components > of the Internet are owned by private individuals and organisations. > > How would you assert public ownership in light of this? > > -- > Cheers, > > McTim > http://stateoftheinternetin.ug > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From avri at acm.org Sat Dec 27 07:59:14 2008 From: avri at acm.org (Avri Doria) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 07:59:14 -0500 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality In-Reply-To: References: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <3AE16276-1729-49A0-9AF3-A6CB596AFB18@acm.org> On 23 Dec 2008, at 20:22, McTim wrote: > >> >> >> >> 1. In terms of ownership – it is public >> > > Asserting this ignores the basic reality that most of the components > of the Internet are owned by private individuals and organisations. > > How would you assert public ownership in light of this? I think it is more complicated then either public or private The various component networks may indeed be private, though of course this is not necessary, just as you say a fact of life for most of the component networks But the Internet itself can still be public. In joining a private network to the Internet, the owners of that private network agree to certain things including the use of the open standards and addressing methods. And to some extent they agree to some public governance over the use of their private network, though they do maintain certain private governance rights - and the balance between these is still a matter of much discussion. So in some sense i think it fair to say the Internet can be a public while the component networks are private. a. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From parminder at itforchange.net Sat Dec 27 08:07:21 2008 From: parminder at itforchange.net (Parminder) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 18:37:21 +0530 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net In-Reply-To: <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2CD5@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> References: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2CD5@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <49562889.6070905@itforchange.net> > >We need to develop and anchor such basic principles that maximize the possibilities of the Internet as a new revolutionary network -- whose central >> characteristics (mentioned in social rather than technical terms) should be that > >1. In terms of ownership -- it is public >As I have explained numerous times, the essential characteristic of the internet is NOT that it is public; the networks and most of the investment are private........ >So >the critical feature of the internet is in many ways precisely the opposite of what you are asserting. Milton First of all, it is clear from my usage above, and the background of this issue in the 'publicness of the Internet' concept, that I speak of Internet being public not in strict legal ownership terms, but in socio-political terms. So you think the essential characteristic of the Internet is that it is private ?? I do suspect so from your views on network neutrality, but I will come to that in a seperate email. Your counter-arguments to my propositions are a bit slippery, and shifting. When confronting the 'ownership' issue (not legalistic-ally, but as everyone having in principle full and equal right to) you speak of the Internet as the physical networks. And when I speak of the 'purpose' of the Internet, you switch to speaking of the Internet as its essential protocols. Thats a bit, shall I say, disingenuous :-). Because if we speak of Internet as its essential protocols it is easy to agree about the publicness of the Internet. On the other hand, if we speak of it as physical networks built with private investments it is easier to speak of its purpose - which is private gain, with no guarantee of public interest and gains. This brings us to the essential issue which my email dealt with - trying to figure out the essential nature of the Internet, as we would like to have, and from their possibly derive the basic public policy principles for it. Would you not agree that this will be the logical way to go about it. I know you too are quite interested in developing the basic public policy principles for the Internet. Would you then state what you think are the essential characteristics of the Internet, and then we can debate it. >The STANDARDS are open and nonproprietary, but they are useful only because they allow any and all private networks and privately owned equipment to be >interconnected. Any public system - roads, infrastructure of the market, laws, etc - are useful only because they facilitate private individuals. Everyone knows that. This does not obliterate the difference between the public and the private, does it! >However, because the TCP/IP protocol suite's ability to connect networks initially outstripped the understanding and capacity of governments to regulate.... and the understanding and the capacity of the corporates to appropriate. > one could say that its effect was more libertarian than egalitarian. But its uniform, open nature did indeed level the playing field and afford those interested in >communicating more equal rights than they have ever had before. This is interesting. You say that the socio-political impact of the Internet was incidental. Fine, I may accept that, but you also seem to be non-committal about how it should be, hereon. Don't you want the Internet to have any (socio-political) directions and purpose. If you do want to it to have any, would you please state it. The whole debate is about that. That is what we all are where about. >more libertarian than egalitarian. Now, this is fair turf. This is really what we are discussing, the above was mostly avoidable red-herring. (Though the term 'libertarian' is used by so many different types, that it often confuses me. I understand you are professing views more of what may be called as right-libertarian kind. Please correct me if I am wrong, in India we are still not very used to these terms). Since we want to keep our discussion practical, and purposeful, I think a very good instantiation of the above political difference is in our views on network neutrality. Will discuss in another email. parminder Milton L Mueller wrote: > > Parminder: > > Happy holidays, all. Sorry for the slow response. > > > > It seems that we have had this conversation before, and you always > have to agree that I am right but it never seems to make an impression > on your political rhetoric. So I will try again (because > I am just as persistent as you, and will not allow policies or > principles that are incorrect to be established simply because someone > keeps repeating them. > > > > We need to develop and anchor such basic principles that maximize the > possibilities of the Internet as a new revolutionary network -- whose > central characteristics (mentioned in social rather than technical > terms) should be that > > > > 1. In terms of ownership -- it is public > > > > As I have explained numerous times, the essential characteristic of > the internet is NOT that it is public; the networks and most of the > investment are private. The STANDARDS are open and nonproprietary, but > they are useful only because they allow any and all private networks > and privately owned equipment to be interconnected. It is, in other > words, the correct mixture of private and public elements, in their > respective roles (to quote the TA) that makes it a success. The open > protocols allow private initiative to flourish, and enable people to > offer content and services without asking the public for permission. > So the critical feature of the internet is in many ways precisely the > opposite of what you are asserting. > > > > I know that this does not conform to your ideology, but it's a fact. > > > > 2. and in terms of its key purpose, and orientation -- it is > egalitarian (definition of 'egalitarian' from The American Heritage > Dictionary -- "Affirming, promoting, or characterized by belief in > equal political, economic, social, and civil rights for all people") > > > > Again I think you've got it wrong. > > Strictly speaking, the internet protocols do not have a "purpose" > other than to establish compatible data communications among any and > all networks. However, because the TCP/IP protocol suite's ability to > connect networks initially outstripped the understanding and capacity > of governments to regulate, one could say that its effect was more > libertarian than egalitarian. But its uniform, open nature did indeed > level the playing field and afford those interested in communicating > more equal rights than they have ever had before. > > > > Once we agree to these highest level principles as those most > essential to what we call as the Internet -- their contextual > elaborations can always be done, in different circumstances and as > related to different issues and aspects. No doubts, such elaboration > will itself be a political process, subject to political trade-offs. > The question is, are we as a world community -- and to start with as a > group of progressive civil society -- able to agree to these (or any > other) social and political principles to be the highest constitutive > principles for the Internet. > > > > I can agree on principles when they are articulated with a full, > exacting respect for the technical and historical facts. > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Sat Dec 27 08:41:49 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 09:11:49 -0430 Subject: [governance] URGENT - Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool 19 Current List Message-ID: <001d01c96828$e2a3dca0$6501a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Hi everyone, I hope you are having happy and healthy winter holidays. So far, 19 members have volunteered for the Noncom list. Please consider joining the pool so we can keep the process moving. We appreciate your collaboration, particularly during what are holidays for many of you. Feel free to volunteer in a private email to me if you prefer. Please review the list, and advise me if there are any errors. Thanks! Best regards, Ginger Jeanette Hofmann Maja Andjelkovic Philippe Dam Hanane Boujemi Raquel Gatto Rafik Dammak Shaila Mistry Tricia Wang Anja Kovacs Hempal Shrestha Adam Peake Ken Lohento Emmanuel Edet Renate Bloem Jeremy Shtern Schombe Baudoin Thomas Lowenhaupt Javier Pinzón Tapani Tarvainen Tijani Ben Jemaa -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From lmcknigh at syr.edu Sat Dec 27 19:56:07 2008 From: lmcknigh at syr.edu (Lee W McKnight) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 19:56:07 -0500 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net References: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2CD5@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> <49562889.6070905@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <63EEA1034C8EF14ABF56503CDC9A646E740D4C@SUEXCL-03.ad.syr.edu> Hi & best wishes to all for a Happy New Year. I must agree with Avri & Parminder: TCP/IP as a public/non-proprietary protocol i.e. owned by noone and hence everyone is the defining feature of the Internet. That noone owns the Internet, and it is maintained by a volunteer group of protocol gardeners, makes it similar to a rose garden in a public park near campus here in Syracuse. The garden is more scenic in summer, while the Internet can bloom year round, so I guess the analogy doesn;t quite hold. But I'll dig a bit deeper anyway. That this thin public layer, maintained by many private individuals, enables private (as well as public including governmental) innovations above in applications and services and below in physical network technologies is what makes it valuable and useful. There I agree with Milton. So yes the 'Internet' exists across many private, and some public networks and that is a most beneficial feature - but the thin line is all of ours. Even if we stay out of the protocol dirt. And we can tip our caps to the IETFers who have maintained and extended the Internet over the years through excellent protocol gardening, without automaticaly agreeing with McTim that that is all that is needed for the Internet to grow in 2009 and beyond. Lee ________________________________ From: Parminder [mailto:parminder at itforchange.net] Sent: Sat 12/27/2008 8:07 AM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Milton L Mueller Cc: Michael Gurstein; Brian Beaton; steveinfos at gmail.com Subject: Re: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net >>We need to develop and anchor such basic principles that maximize the possibilities of the Internet as a new revolutionary network - whose central >> characteristics (mentioned in social rather than technical terms) should be that >>1. In terms of ownership - it is public >As I have explained numerous times, the essential characteristic of the internet is NOT that it is public; the networks and most of the investment are private........ >So >the critical feature of the internet is in many ways precisely the opposite of what you are asserting. Milton First of all, it is clear from my usage above, and the background of this issue in the 'publicness of the Internet' concept, that I speak of Internet being public not in strict legal ownership terms, but in socio-political terms. So you think the essential characteristic of the Internet is that it is private ?? I do suspect so from your views on network neutrality, but I will come to that in a seperate email. Your counter-arguments to my propositions are a bit slippery, and shifting. When confronting the 'ownership' issue (not legalistic-ally, but as everyone having in principle full and equal right to) you speak of the Internet as the physical networks. And when I speak of the 'purpose' of the Internet, you switch to speaking of the Internet as its essential protocols. Thats a bit, shall I say, disingenuous :-). Because if we speak of Internet as its essential protocols it is easy to agree about the publicness of the Internet. On the other hand, if we speak of it as physical networks built with private investments it is easier to speak of its purpose - which is private gain, with no guarantee of public interest and gains. This brings us to the essential issue which my email dealt with - trying to figure out the essential nature of the Internet, as we would like to have, and from their possibly derive the basic public policy principles for it. Would you not agree that this will be the logical way to go about it. I know you too are quite interested in developing the basic public policy principles for the Internet. Would you then state what you think are the essential characteristics of the Internet, and then we can debate it. >The STANDARDS are open and nonproprietary, but they are useful only because they allow any and all private networks and privately owned equipment to be >interconnected. Any public system - roads, infrastructure of the market, laws, etc - are useful only because they facilitate private individuals. Everyone knows that. This does not obliterate the difference between the public and the private, does it! >However, because the TCP/IP protocol suite's ability to connect networks initially outstripped the understanding and capacity of governments to regulate.... and the understanding and the capacity of the corporates to appropriate. > one could say that its effect was more libertarian than egalitarian. But its uniform, open nature did indeed level the playing field and afford those interested in >communicating more equal rights than they have ever had before. This is interesting. You say that the socio-political impact of the Internet was incidental. Fine, I may accept that, but you also seem to be non-committal about how it should be, hereon. Don't you want the Internet to have any (socio-political) directions and purpose. If you do want to it to have any, would you please state it. The whole debate is about that. That is what we all are where about. >more libertarian than egalitarian. Now, this is fair turf. This is really what we are discussing, the above was mostly avoidable red-herring. (Though the term 'libertarian' is used by so many different types, that it often confuses me. I understand you are professing views more of what may be called as right-libertarian kind. Please correct me if I am wrong, in India we are still not very used to these terms). Since we want to keep our discussion practical, and purposeful, I think a very good instantiation of the above political difference is in our views on network neutrality. Will discuss in another email. parminder Milton L Mueller wrote: Parminder: Happy holidays, all. Sorry for the slow response. It seems that we have had this conversation before, and you always have to agree that I am right but it never seems to make an impression on your political rhetoric. So I will try again (because I am just as persistent as you, and will not allow policies or principles that are incorrect to be established simply because someone keeps repeating them. We need to develop and anchor such basic principles that maximize the possibilities of the Internet as a new revolutionary network - whose central characteristics (mentioned in social rather than technical terms) should be that 1. In terms of ownership - it is public As I have explained numerous times, the essential characteristic of the internet is NOT that it is public; the networks and most of the investment are private. The STANDARDS are open and nonproprietary, but they are useful only because they allow any and all private networks and privately owned equipment to be interconnected. It is, in other words, the correct mixture of private and public elements, in their respective roles (to quote the TA) that makes it a success. The open protocols allow private initiative to flourish, and enable people to offer content and services without asking the public for permission. So the critical feature of the internet is in many ways precisely the opposite of what you are asserting. I know that this does not conform to your ideology, but it's a fact. 2. and in terms of its key purpose, and orientation - it is egalitarian (definition of 'egalitarian' from The American Heritage Dictionary - "Affirming, promoting, or characterized by belief in equal political, economic, social, and civil rights for all people") Again I think you've got it wrong. Strictly speaking, the internet protocols do not have a "purpose" other than to establish compatible data communications among any and all networks. However, because the TCP/IP protocol suite's ability to connect networks initially outstripped the understanding and capacity of governments to regulate, one could say that its effect was more libertarian than egalitarian. But its uniform, open nature did indeed level the playing field and afford those interested in communicating more equal rights than they have ever had before. Once we agree to these highest level principles as those most essential to what we call as the Internet - their contextual elaborations can always be done, in different circumstances and as related to different issues and aspects. No doubts, such elaboration will itself be a political process, subject to political trade-offs. The question is, are we as a world community - and to start with as a group of progressive civil society - able to agree to these (or any other) social and political principles to be the highest constitutive principles for the Internet. I can agree on principles when they are articulated with a full, exacting respect for the technical and historical facts. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From kpeters at tldainc.org Sat Dec 27 22:51:53 2008 From: kpeters at tldainc.org (Karl E. Peters) Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:51:53 -0700 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Message-ID: <20081227205153.437683a8bc8cbf65b58fd4b40ea76a1e.0469467947.wbe@email.secureserver.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Sat Dec 27 22:53:53 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (JFC Morfin) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 04:53:53 +0100 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on In-Reply-To: <49562889.6070905@itforchange.net> References: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2CD5@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> <49562889.6070905@itforchange.net> Message-ID: <20081228035449.9722E6782F@smtp1.electricembers.net> Dear Parminder, Milton, The confusion about "public" is with us for even longer (mid-70s) than about "free" and FLOSS. At that time we had in addition the general State monopoloy situation. This is why we always used the technical words (1) "public" (like "public domain") for something of equal public legally protected access, (2) monopoly when it belongs to a State or de facto private market monopoly, and (3) "regalian" when it belongs to State or other Common Interest Adminstration. These terms are those being listed by the Internet Polynym Glossary project. The following terms are also used for the seven poles of governance : (1) regalian domain, (2) civil society, (3) private sector, (4) international institutions, (5) standardisation and documentation organisations [SDOs], (6) consumers associations, and (7) cultural, research and accademics.spheres. At 14:07 27/12/2008, Parminder wrote: > >The STANDARDS are open and nonproprietary, but they are useful > only because they allow any and all private networks and privately > owned equipment to be interconnected. > >Any public system - roads, infrastructure of the market, laws, etc - >are useful only because they facilitate private individuals. >Everyone knows that. This does not obliterate the difference between >the public and the private, does it! I call your attention here. To be open and freely usable (what does not mean not-proprietary) is a good thing for a standard; but the first qualities are to be efficient and non-biased. > >However, because the TCP/IP protocol suite's ability to connect > networks initially outstripped the understanding and capacity of > governments to regulate.... and the understanding and the capacity > of the corporates to appropriate one could say that its effect was > more libertarian than egalitarian. But its uniform, open nature did > indeed level the playing field and afford those interested in > communicating more equal rights than they have ever had before. I authorised TCP/IP on the public international monopoly network in 1984 (technical support was agreed with DoD end of 1983). It was regulated/protected as any other protocols. One should not confuse the general technical development of datacommunications with any political change. Exotic protocols where more a problem than anything else. From my involved experience political changes in bandwidth usage resulted from three things: better political understanding of transborder dataflows issues, OSI model analysis (with the still remaining problems of the three TCP/IP missing layers), and an adequate and consensual UIT collegium tarif response to the web needs. I observed and still observe a constant decrease in the right to comunicate. It started with less capacity due to a much smaller bandwidth, itself due to a much smaller demand, itself due to an only emergent proposition. Actually constraints such as the DNS root limitations and address allocation limitations do not belong to the International public data networks, but to the US attempt to control the management of its TCP/IP portion and to extend it. If we want to be serious about discussing the real Internet (the International public Network) and, more importantly, the Intersem (as the International Semantic and Multilingual relation and services [such as RFIDs] facilitation continuity) we must clearly identify what we talk about: which technology [IPv4/IPv6 for example], which strata [flow, content, meaning], etc. and which barriers and constraints to remove. The first ones, IMHO, are the Technical Barrier to Trade, Relations and Minds imposed by the lack of evolution of the IETF architecture and the delay in organising structural and operational Enhanced Cooperations (keeping us with the Legacy Internet). >This is interesting. You say that the socio-political impact of the >Internet was incidental. Fine, I may accept that, but you also seem >to be non-committal about how it should be, hereon. Don't you want >the Internet to have any (socio-political) directions and purpose. >If you do want to it to have any, would you please state it. The >whole debate is about that. That is what we all are where about. > > >more libertarian than egalitarian. > >Now, this is fair turf. This is really what we are discussing, the >above was mostly avoidable red-herring. (Though the term >'libertarian' is used by so many different types, that it often >confuses me. I understand you are professing views more of what may >be called as right-libertarian kind. Please correct me if I am >wrong, in India we are still not very used to these terms). Since we >want to keep our discussion practical, and purposeful, I think a >very good instantiation of the above political difference is in our >views on network neutrality. Will discuss in another email. IMHO the question is to be concurrently addressed at least at network topology, governance and usage layers. I can have totally libertarian topology, censoring politcy, and limited usage due to access costs. I must say, I am always embarassed about ideological comments on artefacts which have not been produced along any ethitechnic, i.e. with an ethical teleology. For example: PGP has been designed with an ethical purpose in mind (to permit civil right people to freely communicate). - This is why all I expect from my mobile is not to be democratic but to work better. jfc -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From apisan at servidor.unam.mx Sat Dec 27 23:17:12 2008 From: apisan at servidor.unam.mx (Alejandro Pisanty) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 04:17:12 +0000 Subject: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on NetNeutrality In-Reply-To: References: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2CD5@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu> Message-ID: <640174500-1230437915-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-21257513-@bxe296.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> S, Don't be too concerned. Sit back and watch the ongoing discussion as a form of intellectual porn, akin to mud-wrestling. Alx Sent via BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Sivasubramanian Muthusamy" Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 13:51:39 To: ; Milton L Mueller Cc: Parminder; Michael Gurstein; Brian Beaton; Subject: Re: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality Hello Milton, On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 11:51 AM, Milton L Mueller wrote: > Parminder: > > Happy holidays, all. Sorry for the slow response. > > > > It seems that we have had this conversation before, and you always have to > agree that I am right but it never seems to make an impression on your > political rhetoric. So I will try again (because > I am just as persistent as you, and will not allow policies or principles > that are incorrect to be established simply because someone keeps repeating > them. > > > > We need to develop and anchor such basic principles that maximize the > possibilities of the Internet as a new revolutionary network – whose central > characteristics (mentioned in social rather than technical terms) should be > that > > > > 1. In terms of ownership – it is public > > > > As I have explained numerous times, the essential characteristic of the > internet is NOT that it is public; the networks and most of the investment > are private. The STANDARDS are open and nonproprietary, but they are useful > only because they allow any and all private networks and privately owned > equipment to be interconnected. It is, in other words, the correct mixture > of private and public elements, in their respective roles (to quote the TA) > that makes it a success. The open protocols allow private initiative to > flourish, and enable people to offer content and services without asking the > public for permission. So the critical feature of the internet is in many > ways precisely the opposite of what you are asserting. > > I know that this does not conform to your ideology, but it's a fact. > Parminder's point about ownership is exactly the kind of expression that sends out wrong signals from Civil Society to other stakeholders. Business as a stakeholder would misinterpret such expressions as a suggestion for a public take over of all the infrastructure that have been built mostly with private investments, which is unfair. Barring a few extreme exceptions, the Civil Society is always fair in acknowledging that the Internet Infrastrure took shape mostly with private investments. Perhaps Parminder also does not imply 'Public Ownership' of the equipment, wires and cables ? Or does he? There is also a danger. When someone says 'public' and 'ownership' on the same line, there is a danger of this being interpreted not as a suggestion for "shared ownership" but rather as "ownership by governments", like how it was in the former Soviet Union and in India until the mid 80s. The line between public ownership and govenment 'ownership' is very thin, in that sense. *The Internet has evolved from a fusion of private enterprise and public participation, in a laissez faire climate. It needs to evolve further on the same model. * What is often missed is that there is public participation in business, though at an indirect level. Investments come from private enterprise which are originally funded by the public through the Stock Exchange ! Should I go back to the previous paragraph and edit it to say that Parminder is right? And there is a possibility that further investments could come more from enterprises that embrace the "social enterprise" business models that would balance the Civil Society and Business positions??? > I can agree on principles when they are articulated with a full, exacting > respect for the technical and historical facts. > >____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From apisan at servidor.unam.mx Sun Dec 28 00:51:21 2008 From: apisan at servidor.unam.mx (Alejandro Pisanty) Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 05:51:21 +0000 Subject: [governance] Apology In-Reply-To: <640174500-1230437915-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-21257513-@bxe296.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> References: <4D16340AABB343B1A1246AF65035CC83@userPC> <20081222121216.34F4E67877@smtp1.electricembers.net> <7663C7E01D8E094989CA62F0B0D21CD9028B2CD5@SUEXCL-02.ad.syr.edu><640174500-1230437915-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-21257513-@bxe296.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Message-ID: <1805700499-1230443562-cardhu_decombobulator_blackberry.rim.net-92815615-@bxe296.bisx.prod.on.blackberry> Hi, full, unqualified apology for too harsh statment not meant generally. The offence produced is beyond excuse without further particulars. Alejandro Pisanty Alejandro Pisantu Sent via BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Alejandro Pisanty" Date: Sun, 28 Dec 2008 04:17:12 To: ; Sivasubramanian Muthusamy Subject: Re: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on NetNeutrality S, Don't be too concerned. Sit back and watch the ongoing discussion as a form of intellectual porn, akin to mud-wrestling. Alx Sent via BlackBerry -----Original Message----- From: "Sivasubramanian Muthusamy" Date: Sat, 27 Dec 2008 13:51:39 To: ; Milton L Mueller Cc: Parminder; Michael Gurstein; Brian Beaton; Subject: Re: [governance] a very grounded and divergent perspective on Net Neutrality Hello Milton, On Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 11:51 AM, Milton L Mueller wrote: > Parminder: > > Happy holidays, all. Sorry for the slow response. > > > > It seems that we have had this conversation before, and you always have to > agree that I am right but it never seems to make an impression on your > political rhetoric. So I will try again (because > I am just as persistent as you, and will not allow policies or principles > that are incorrect to be established simply because someone keeps repeating > them. > > > > We need to develop and anchor such basic principles that maximize the > possibilities of the Internet as a new revolutionary network – whose central > characteristics (mentioned in social rather than technical terms) should be > that > > > > 1. In terms of ownership – it is public > > > > As I have explained numerous times, the essential characteristic of the > internet is NOT that it is public; the networks and most of the investment > are private. The STANDARDS are open and nonproprietary, but they are useful > only because they allow any and all private networks and privately owned > equipment to be interconnected. It is, in other words, the correct mixture > of private and public elements, in their respective roles (to quote the TA) > that makes it a success. The open protocols allow private initiative to > flourish, and enable people to offer content and services without asking the > public for permission. So the critical feature of the internet is in many > ways precisely the opposite of what you are asserting. > > I know that this does not conform to your ideology, but it's a fact. > Parminder's point about ownership is exactly the kind of expression that sends out wrong signals from Civil Society to other stakeholders. Business as a stakeholder would misinterpret such expressions as a suggestion for a public take over of all the infrastructure that have been built mostly with private investments, which is unfair. Barring a few extreme exceptions, the Civil Society is always fair in acknowledging that the Internet Infrastrure took shape mostly with private investments. Perhaps Parminder also does not imply 'Public Ownership' of the equipment, wires and cables ? Or does he? There is also a danger. When someone says 'public' and 'ownership' on the same line, there is a danger of this being interpreted not as a suggestion for "shared ownership" but rather as "ownership by governments", like how it was in the former Soviet Union and in India until the mid 80s. The line between public ownership and govenment 'ownership' is very thin, in that sense. *The Internet has evolved from a fusion of private enterprise and public participation, in a laissez faire climate. It needs to evolve further on the same model. * What is often missed is that there is public participation in business, though at an indirect level. Investments come from private enterprise which are originally funded by the public through the Stock Exchange ! Should I go back to the previous paragraph and edit it to say that Parminder is right? And there is a possibility that further investments could come more from enterprises that embrace the "social enterprise" business models that would balance the Civil Society and Business positions??? > I can agree on principles when they are articulated with a full, exacting > respect for the technical and historical facts. > >____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Sivasubramanian Muthusamy http://www.linkedin.com/in/sivasubramanianmuthusamy http://www.circleid.com/members/3601/ http://twitter.com/isocchennai -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From nyangkweagien at gmail.com Mon Dec 29 09:27:56 2008 From: nyangkweagien at gmail.com (Nyangkwe Agien Aaron) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:27:56 +0100 Subject: hyperbole and hypocrisy (was Re: [governance] Thank you to Parminder) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: McTim You got it right! Just sounds like McAnthony in Shakespeare's Play Julius Ceasar. We overheard McAnthony saying in that play: "*We have come to burry Julius Ceasar and not to praise him... The evil that men do live after them*" It is just such MaAnthonyism that I decifer in Willie's piece. Happy New year to all Aaron On 12/24/08, McTim wrote: > > Willie, > > On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:11 AM, Willie Currie wrote: > > I'd also like to thank Parminder for his commitment and hard work as IGC > > coordinator. > > > > Parminder has played an important role for the IGC during a difficult > period > > of adjustment to a post-WSIS global policy space in internet governance, > > when a sustained attempt to deflect attention from the need for global > > public policy principles for managing critical internet resources > > There already ARE global public policy principles in place for this.....do > you not recall seeing my BUTOCS (posting) earlier this year?? > > was > > underway as a backlash to the gains made in the WSIS. It is largely to > > Parminder's credit that the issue of 'enhanced cooperation' could be > > discussed in Hyderabad without the sky falling down. > > While Parminder should be acknowledged and thanked for his efforts > and enthusiasm brought to the role, I would hardly equate him to Atlas ;-) > > Indeed a little more > > attention to public policy principles at an earlier stage may have helped > > the IPv4/6 transition as the IGF open policy dialogue on the matter > > demonstrated. > > which principles would those have been? > > Like the banking system, I think we have been witnessing the > > limits of the claims for technical expertise in the absence of suitable > > policy and regulation in the public interest in this area. And no one > had > > an adequate answer to Jeanette's question as to who is in charge? > > The answer is that no ONE person or body is or should be in charge. > You all ought to know that. > > Parminder > > suffered unjustifable attack while coordinator of the IGC when he did > raise > > questions of public policy. And I think the shambles around the IPv4/6 > > transition vindicates his concerns for public policy frameworks in > internet > > governance. > > The "shambles" as you put it is caused by network operators not > implementing IPv6. How would a "public policy framework" increase IPv6 > uptake? > > The question I'd like answered from folk who think they could have > done a better > job than the output of the IETF NG WG is "why weren't you more involved?" > > The old canard that the IETF is an unwelcoming group of white American > engineers > is not allowed as a valid answer. > > -- > Cheers, > > McTim > http://stateoftheinternetin.ug > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -- Hey， how are you doing recently? I would like to introduce you a very good company and its website is www.ele-motors.com. It can offer you all kinds of electronic products that you may be in need,such as laptops ,gps ,TV LCD,cell phones,ps3,MP3/4,motorcycles and etc........ You can take some time to have a check ,there must be something interesting you 'd like to purchase . The contact email: ele_motors at 188.com. MSN: ele-motors at hotmail.com TEL: 0086+15132688563 Hope you can enjoy yourself in shopping from that company ! Regards -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From correia.rui at gmail.com Mon Dec 29 09:54:15 2008 From: correia.rui at gmail.com (Rui Correia) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 16:54:15 +0200 Subject: hyperbole and hypocrisy (was Re: [governance] Thank you to Parminder) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: McAnthony? mmmmmm ..... I always suspected the Scots were involved in poor Julius's murder! must have fed him haggis before they voted him out during the Idols of Marsh Tribal Council. ;-) A great 2009 to all, full of life's great energy. Rui On 29/12/2008, Nyangkwe Agien Aaron wrote: > McTim > > You got it right! > Just sounds like McAnthony in Shakespeare's Play Julius Ceasar. > > We overheard McAnthony saying in that play: > "We have come to burry Julius Ceasar and not to praise him... The evil that > men do live after them" > It is just such MaAnthonyism that I decifer in Willie's piece. > > Happy New year to all > > Aaron > > On 12/24/08, McTim wrote: > > Willie, > > > > On Thu, Dec 18, 2008 at 9:11 AM, Willie Currie wrote: > > > I'd also like to thank Parminder for his commitment and hard work as IGC > > > coordinator. > > > > > > Parminder has played an important role for the IGC during a difficult > period > > > of adjustment to a post-WSIS global policy space in internet governance, > > > when a sustained attempt to deflect attention from the need for global > > > public policy principles for managing critical internet resources > > > > There already ARE global public policy principles in place for this.....do > > you not recall seeing my BUTOCS (posting) earlier this year?? > > > > was > > > underway as a backlash to the gains made in the WSIS. It is largely to > > > Parminder's credit that the issue of 'enhanced cooperation' could be > > > discussed in Hyderabad without the sky falling down. > > > > While Parminder should be acknowledged and thanked for his efforts > > and enthusiasm brought to the role, I would hardly equate him to Atlas ;-) > > > > Indeed a little more > > > attention to public policy principles at an earlier stage may have > helped > > > the IPv4/6 transition as the IGF open policy dialogue on the matter > > > demonstrated. > > > > which principles would those have been? > > > > Like the banking system, I think we have been witnessing the > > > limits of the claims for technical expertise in the absence of suitable > > > policy and regulation in the public interest in this area. And no one > had > > > an adequate answer to Jeanette's question as to who is in charge? > > > > The answer is that no ONE person or body is or should be in charge. > > You all ought to know that. > > > > Parminder > > > suffered unjustifable attack while coordinator of the IGC when he did > raise > > > questions of public policy. And I think the shambles around the IPv4/6 > > > transition vindicates his concerns for public policy frameworks in > internet > > > governance. > > > > The "shambles" as you put it is caused by network operators not > > implementing IPv6. How would a "public policy framework" increase IPv6 > uptake? > > > > The question I'd like answered from folk who think they could have > > done a better > > job than the output of the IETF NG WG is "why weren't you more involved?" > > > > The old canard that the IETF is an unwelcoming group of white American > > engineers > > is not allowed as a valid answer. > > > > -- > > Cheers, > > > > McTim > > http://stateoftheinternetin.ug > > > ____________________________________________________________ > > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > > governance at lists.cpsr.org > > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > > > For all list information and functions, see: > > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > > > > -- > Hey， > how are you doing recently? > I would like to introduce you a very good company and its website is > www.ele-motors.com. It can offer you all kinds of electronic products that > you may be in need,such as laptops ,gps ,TV LCD,cell > phones,ps3,MP3/4,motorcycles and etc........ > You can take some time to have a check ,there must be something interesting > you 'd like to purchase . > The contact email: ele_motors at 188.com. MSN: ele-motors at hotmail.com > > TEL: 0086+15132688563 > Hope you can enjoy yourself in shopping from that company ! > > Regards > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > > -- ________________________________________________ Rui Correia Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant 2 Cutten St Horison Roodepoort-Johannesburg, South Africa Tel/ Fax (+27-11) 766-4336 Mobile (+27) (0) 84-498-6838 _______________ áâãçéêíóôõúç ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jamelatude at yahoo.fr Mon Dec 29 13:36:04 2008 From: jamelatude at yahoo.fr (khemakhem jamel) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 18:36:04 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [governance] Message-ID: <949592.69074.qm@web26905.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Happy New Year to all I’m also volunteer Jameleddine Khemakhem ATUDE -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Mon Dec 29 21:44:50 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 22:14:50 -0430 Subject: [governance] In-Reply-To: <949592.69074.qm@web26905.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <949592.69074.qm@web26905.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <004501c96a28$9fb2a190$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Thank you! I have added you to the Noncom Pool list. Regards, Ginger _____ De: khemakhem jamel [mailto:jamelatude at yahoo.fr] Enviado el: Lunes, 29 de Diciembre de 2008 02:06 p.m. Para: governance at lists.cpsr.org Asunto: [governance] Happy New Year to all I'm also volunteer Jameleddine Khemakhem ATUDE -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Mon Dec 29 21:46:59 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Mon, 29 Dec 2008 22:16:59 -0430 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 Current List - Closing January 6th Message-ID: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Hi everybody! We are slowly closing in on our goal of at least 25 members for the Noncom pool by January 6th. Please consider collaborating with the group by offering your name to the pool of candidates for the MAG Nominating Committee. This is an interesting and important opportunity to help, and to share in the duties of the IGC. Please review the list to see if there are any errors. 1. Jeanette Hofmann 2. Maja Andjelkovic 3. Philippe Dam 4. Hanane Boujemi 5. Raquel Gatto 6. Rafik Dammak 7. Shaila Mistry 8. Tricia Wang 9. Anja Kovacs 10. Hempal Shrestha 11. Adam Peake 12. Ken Lohento 13. Emmanuel Edet 14. Renate Bloem 15. Jeremy Shtern 16. Schombe Baudoin 17. Thomas Lowenhaupt 18. Javier Pinzón 19. Tapani Tarvainen 20. Tijani Ben Jemaa 21. Katitza Rodriguez 22. Jameleddine Khemakhem Thanks, and happy holidays, Ginger -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From nhklein at gmx.net Mon Dec 29 22:27:24 2008 From: nhklein at gmx.net (Norbert Klein) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 10:27:24 +0700 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 Current List - Closing January 6th In-Reply-To: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <200812301027.24735.nhklein@gmx.net> On Tuesday, 30 December 2008 09:46:59 Ginger Paque wrote: > Hi everybody! > > > > We are slowly closing in on our goal of at least 25 members for the Noncom > pool by January 6th. Please consider collaborating with the group by > offering your name to the pool of candidates for the MAG Nominating > Committee. This is an interesting and important opportunity to help, and > to share in the duties of the IGC. > > OK - you may add my name. At present, I am also a member of the ICANN Nominations Committee... Norbert Klein -- Phnom Penh/Cambodia PGP key-id 0x0016D0A9 If you want to know what is going on in Cambodia, please visit us regularly - you can find something new every day: http://cambodiamirror.wordpress.com (English) http://kanhchoksangkum.wordpress.com (Khmer) ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From rudi.vansnick at isoc.be Tue Dec 30 07:54:27 2008 From: rudi.vansnick at isoc.be (Rudi Vansnick) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 13:54:27 +0100 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 Current In-Reply-To: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <495A1A03.2060402@isoc.be> Hi all, Happy holidays to all of you. Make 2009 an unforgettable year, the year of the Internet individual user ... You may add my name to the list, so I hope we're 25 now... Best regards, Rudi Vansnick President - CEO Internet Society Belgium vzw Vice-chair ISOC European Chapters Coordinating Council Board member EURALO (ALAC-ICANN) /Dendermondesteenweg 143 B-9070 Destelbergen Belgium GSM: +32 (0)475 28 16 32 - Tel: +32 (0)70 77 39 39/ www.isoc.be - www.isoc.eu - www.euralo.org Ginger Paque schreef: > > Hi everybody! > > > > We are slowly closing in on our goal of at least 25 members for the > Noncom pool by January 6^th . Please consider collaborating with the > group by offering your name to the pool of candidates for the MAG > Nominating Committee. This is an interesting and important > opportunity to help, and to share in the duties of the IGC. > > > > Please review the list to see if there are any errors. > > > > 1. Jeanette Hofmann > > 2. Maja Andjelkovic > > 3. Philippe Dam > > 4. Hanane Boujemi > > 5. Raquel Gatto > > 6. Rafik Dammak > > 7. Shaila Mistry__ > > 8. Tricia Wang > > 9. Anja Kovacs > > 10. Hempal Shrestha__ > > 11. Adam Peake > > 12. Ken Lohento > > 13. Emmanuel Edet > > 14. Renate Bloem > > 15. Jeremy Shtern > > 16. Schombe Baudoin > > 17. Thomas Lowenhaupt > > 18. Javier Pinzón > > 19. Tapani Tarvainen > > 20. Tijani Ben Jemaa > > 21. Katitza Rodriguez > > 22. Jameleddine Khemakhem > > > > Thanks, and happy holidays, > > Ginger > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.1/1868 - Release Date: 29/12/2008 10:48 > > ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From omar at kaminski.adv.br Tue Dec 30 13:53:50 2008 From: omar at kaminski.adv.br (Omar Kaminski) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 15:53:50 -0300 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 Current In-Reply-To: <495A1A03.2060402@isoc.be> References: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <495A1A03.2060402@isoc.be> Message-ID: <1d54ad730812301053n30ffcd44k8ad25e1787144080@mail.gmail.com> If a name still needed you could count with me. Regards, and have a great new year. Omar Kaminski, from Brazil. On Tue, Dec 30, 2008 at 9:54 AM, Rudi Vansnick wrote: > Hi all, > > Happy holidays to all of you. Make 2009 an unforgettable year, the year > of the Internet individual user ... > > You may add my name to the list, so I hope we're 25 now... > > Best regards, > > Rudi Vansnick > President - CEO Internet Society Belgium vzw > Vice-chair ISOC European Chapters Coordinating Council > Board member EURALO (ALAC-ICANN) > > /Dendermondesteenweg 143 > B-9070 Destelbergen > Belgium > GSM: +32 (0)475 28 16 32 - Tel: +32 (0)70 77 39 39/ > www.isoc.be - www.isoc.eu - > www.euralo.org > > > > Ginger Paque schreef: > > > > Hi everybody! > > > > > > > > We are slowly closing in on our goal of at least 25 members for the > > Noncom pool by January 6^th . Please consider collaborating with the > > group by offering your name to the pool of candidates for the MAG > > Nominating Committee. This is an interesting and important > > opportunity to help, and to share in the duties of the IGC. > > > > > > > > Please review the list to see if there are any errors. > > > > > > > > 1. Jeanette Hofmann > > > > 2. Maja Andjelkovic > > > > 3. Philippe Dam > > > > 4. Hanane Boujemi > > > > 5. Raquel Gatto > > > > 6. Rafik Dammak > > > > 7. Shaila Mistry__ > > > > 8. Tricia Wang > > > > 9. Anja Kovacs > > > > 10. Hempal Shrestha__ > > > > 11. Adam Peake > > > > 12. Ken Lohento > > > > 13. Emmanuel Edet > > > > 14. Renate Bloem > > > > 15. Jeremy Shtern > > > > 16. Schombe Baudoin > > > > 17. Thomas Lowenhaupt > > > > 18. Javier Pinzón > > > > 19. Tapani Tarvainen > > > > 20. Tijani Ben Jemaa > > > > 21. Katitza Rodriguez > > > > 22. Jameleddine Khemakhem > > > > > > > > Thanks, and happy holidays, > > > > Ginger > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > > Version: 8.0.176 / Virus Database: 270.10.1/1868 - Release Date: > 29/12/2008 10:48 > > > > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From plzak at arin.net Tue Dec 30 15:51:39 2008 From: plzak at arin.net (Ray Plzak) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 15:51:39 -0500 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 Current In-Reply-To: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: Ginger, If you still need someone, include me in the pile. Ray From: Ginger Paque [mailto:ginger at paque.net] Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 9:47 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Ian Peter'; 'Avri Doria' Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 Current List - Closing January 6th Hi everybody! We are slowly closing in on our goal of at least 25 members for the Noncom pool by January 6th. Please consider collaborating with the group by offering your name to the pool of candidates for the MAG Nominating Committee. This is an interesting and important opportunity to help, and to share in the duties of the IGC. Please review the list to see if there are any errors. 1. Jeanette Hofmann 2. Maja Andjelkovic 3. Philippe Dam 4. Hanane Boujemi 5. Raquel Gatto 6. Rafik Dammak 7. Shaila Mistry 8. Tricia Wang 9. Anja Kovacs 10. Hempal Shrestha 11. Adam Peake 12. Ken Lohento 13. Emmanuel Edet 14. Renate Bloem 15. Jeremy Shtern 16. Schombe Baudoin 17. Thomas Lowenhaupt 18. Javier Pinzón 19. Tapani Tarvainen 20. Tijani Ben Jemaa 21. Katitza Rodriguez 22. Jameleddine Khemakhem Thanks, and happy holidays, Ginger -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jefsey at jefsey.com Tue Dec 30 19:56:47 2008 From: jefsey at jefsey.com (JFC Morfin) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 01:56:47 +0100 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 In-Reply-To: References: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: <20081231010527.9EB3FE16E9@smtp3.electricembers.net> I you still need one you can count me in too. Best. jfc morfin >From: Ginger Paque [mailto:ginger at paque.net] >Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 9:47 PM >To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Ian Peter'; 'Avri Doria' >Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 >Current List - Closing January 6th > >Hi everybody! > >We are slowly closing in on our goal of at least 25 members for the >Noncom pool by January 6th. Please consider collaborating with the >group by offering your name to the pool of candidates for the MAG >Nominating Committee. This is an interesting and important >opportunity to help, and to share in the duties of the IGC. > >Please review the list to see if there are any errors. > >1. Jeanette Hofmann >2. Maja Andjelkovic >3. Philippe Dam >4. Hanane Boujemi >5. Raquel Gatto >6. Rafik Dammak >7. Shaila Mistry >8. Tricia Wang >9. Anja Kovacs >10. Hempal Shrestha >11. Adam Peake >12. Ken Lohento >13. Emmanuel Edet >14. Renate Bloem >15. Jeremy Shtern >16. Schombe Baudoin >17. Thomas Lowenhaupt >18. Javier Pinzón >19. Tapani Tarvainen >20. Tijani Ben Jemaa >21. Katitza Rodriguez >22. Jameleddine Khemakhem > >Thanks, and happy holidays, >Ginger > > > > > > >____________________________________________________________ >You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org >To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > >For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From avri at acm.org Tue Dec 30 23:02:41 2008 From: avri at acm.org (Avri Doria) Date: Tue, 30 Dec 2008 23:02:41 -0500 Subject: [governance] nomcom and if you still need one Message-ID: <5BE9514A-EDAE-4FB7-B084-42ED7B48D000@acm.org> hi, i just wanted to point out that in forming the noncom, 25 was set as a minimum threshold so that there would be at least a 1:5 ratio between being picked and volunteering. the greater the ratio the better, so the more people who volunteer the better - even if the pool goes over 25 - at 30 it is 1:6 and at 50 1:10. oh yeah, i am not volunteering, but i promise to volunteer for one once i am no longer on the appeals team. anyway, happy active 2009 to you all. a. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From siranush_vardanyan at hotmail.com Wed Dec 31 03:27:09 2008 From: siranush_vardanyan at hotmail.com (Siranush Vardanyan) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 08:27:09 +0000 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 In-Reply-To: <20081231010527.9EB3FE16E9@smtp3.electricembers.net> References: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <20081231010527.9EB3FE16E9@smtp3.electricembers.net> Message-ID: I you still need one you can count me in too. Happy holidays to all of you! Best. Siranush Siranush Vardanyan Armenia Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 01:56:47 +0100To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; plzak at arin.net; governance at lists.cpsr.org; ginger at paque.netFrom: jefsey at jefsey.comSubject: RE: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22I you still need one you can count me in too.Best.jfc morfin From: Ginger Paque [ mailto:ginger at paque.net] Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 9:47 PMTo: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Ian Peter'; 'Avri Doria'Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 Current List - Closing January 6th Hi everybody! We are slowly closing in on our goal of at least 25 members for the Noncom pool by January 6th. Please consider collaborating with the group by offering your name to the pool of candidates for the MAG Nominating Committee. This is an interesting and important opportunity to help, and to share in the duties of the IGC. Please review the list to see if there are any errors. 1. Jeanette Hofmann2. Maja Andjelkovic3. Philippe Dam4. Hanane Boujemi5. Raquel Gatto6. Rafik Dammak7. Shaila Mistry8. Tricia Wang9. Anja Kovacs10. Hempal Shrestha11. Adam Peake12. Ken Lohento13. Emmanuel Edet14. Renate Bloem15. Jeremy Shtern16. Schombe Baudoin17. Thomas Lowenhaupt18. Javier Pinzón19. Tapani Tarvainen20. Tijani Ben Jemaa21. Katitza Rodriguez22. Jameleddine Khemakhem Thanks, and happy holidays,Ginger ____________________________________________________________You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.orgTo be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.orgFor all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance _________________________________________________________________ Drag n’ drop—Get easy photo sharing with Windows Live™ Photos. http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowslive/photos.aspx -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From asif at kabani.co.uk Wed Dec 31 07:57:43 2008 From: asif at kabani.co.uk (Kabani) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 17:57:43 +0500 Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also needed! In-Reply-To: References: <02895C37-5705-4E96-99DD-FE1FC1AE8BDD@ciroap.org> Message-ID: <8017791e0812310457y167094e6ve627b54ef49a37ea@mail.gmail.com> Greetings, Also include me as well Asif Kabani 2008/12/24 William Drake : > Hi, > Me too, > Bill > On Dec 24, 2008, at 4:13 AM, Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond wrote: > > Hello Jeremy, > I'm happy to serve in the Appeals Team. I've been listening a lot from the > sidelines and not speaking much here, but if I can help with the process, I > can lend some time pro-bono. > Best Wishes, > Olivier > -- > Olivier MJ Crépin-Leblond, PhD > http://www.gih.com/ocl.html > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeremy Malcolm" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 6:51 AM > Subject: [governance] Reminder: nominations for Appeals Team also needed! > > It is great that so many people have nominated for the NomCom for the > election of representatives to the MAG, but please remember that we are > also seeking nominees for the Appeals Team! > The Appeals Team is an important part of the checks and balances that make > our coordinators accountable to IGC members. Although it is rarely if ever > called upon, it is important that a willing and capable Appeals Team > exists. > So far we have only one nominee, and we would like at least ten! Please > don't hesitate to nominate yourself or (with their agreement) someone else > whom you believe could take on this job. Thanks in advance! > -- > JEREMY MALCOLM > Project Coordinator > CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE > for Asia Pacific and the Middle East > Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning > voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, > we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect > and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit > www.consumersinternational.org. > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > *********************************************************** > William J. Drake > Senior Associate > Centre for International Governance > Graduate Institute of International and > Development Studies > Geneva, Switzerland > william.drake at graduateinstitute.ch > New book: Governing Global Electronic Networks, > http://tinyurl.com/5mh9jj > *********************************************************** > > ____________________________________________________________ > You received this message as a subscriber on the list: > governance at lists.cpsr.org > To be removed from the list, send any message to: > governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org > > For all list information and functions, see: > http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance > > -- Visit: www.kabani.co.uk ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From ginger at paque.net Wed Dec 31 09:08:15 2008 From: ginger at paque.net (Ginger Paque) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 09:38:15 -0430 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 28 Current List - Closing January 6th Message-ID: <004501c96b51$3a861ac0$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> We have reached the necessary minimum of 25 volunteers for the Noncom pool. But as Avri has pointed out, more is still better, so please feel free to volunteer until January 6th. We are also still looking for volunteers for the Appeals Noncom. All of the below volunteers and everyone else is invited to help with that very important task as well. Please let Jeremy Malcom know if you are willing to help with the Appeals Noncom. Please review the list to see if there are any errors. 1. Jeanette Hofmann 2. Maja Andjelkovic 3. Philippe Dam 4. Hanane Boujemi 5. Raquel Gatto 6. Rafik Dammak 7. Shaila Mistry 8. Tricia Wang 9. Anja Kovacs 10. Hempal Shrestha 11. Adam Peake 12. Ken Lohento 13. Emmanuel Edet 14. Renate Bloem 15. Jeremy Shtern 16. Schombe Baudoin 17. Thomas Lowenhaupt 18. Javier Pinzón 19. Tapani Tarvainen 20. Tijani Ben Jemaa 21. Katitza Rodriguez 22. Jameleddine Khemakhem 23. Norbert Klein 24. Rudi Vansnick 25. Omar Kaminski 26. Ray Plzak 27. Siranush Vardanyan 28. JFC Morfin (Note: joined 16 November 2008) Thanks, and happy holidays, Ginger -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From jeremy at ciroap.org Wed Dec 31 09:14:32 2008 From: jeremy at ciroap.org (Jeremy Malcolm) Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 22:14:32 +0800 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 28 Current List - Closing January 6th In-Reply-To: <004501c96b51$3a861ac0$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> References: <004501c96b51$3a861ac0$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> Message-ID: On 31/12/2008, at 10:08 PM, Ginger Paque wrote: > Please let Jeremy Malcom know if you are willing to help with the > Appeals Noncom. On that, we now have the ten nominees we were after - and nominations close today. So thanks to those who have been nominated; we will now deliberate and get back to the list as soon as we can. Thanks. -- JEREMY MALCOLM Project Coordinator CONSUMERS INTERNATIONAL-KL OFFICE for Asia Pacific and the Middle East Consumers International (CI) is the only independent global campaigning voice for consumers. With over 220 member organisations in 115 countries, we are building a powerful international consumer movement to help protect and empower consumers everywhere. For more information, visit www.consumersinternational.org. ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance From dave at isoc-mu.org Wed Dec 31 16:06:22 2008 From: dave at isoc-mu.org (Dave Kissoondoyal) Date: Thu, 1 Jan 2009 02:06:22 +0500 Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 In-Reply-To: References: <004a01c96a28$e3f8a890$6401a8c0@GINGERLAPTOP> <20081231010527.9EB3FE16E9@smtp3.electricembers.net> Message-ID: <5B9F2BA1718B4D82B24521BD91F7A191@DirectorIT> You can count on me too Happy Holidays Dave Kissoondoyal _____ From: governance-owner+dave=isoc-mu.org at lists.cpsr.org [mailto:governance-owner+dave=isoc-mu.org at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of Siranush Vardanyan Sent: 31 December 2008 13:27 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; ginger at paque.net Subject: RE: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 I you still need one you can count me in too. Happy holidays to all of you! Best. Siranush Siranush Vardanyan Armenia _____ Date: Wed, 31 Dec 2008 01:56:47 +0100 To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; plzak at arin.net; governance at lists.cpsr.org; ginger at paque.net From: jefsey at jefsey.com Subject: RE: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 I you still need one you can count me in too. Best. jfc morfin From: Ginger Paque [ mailto:ginger at paque.net ] Sent: Monday, December 29, 2008 9:47 PM To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; 'Ian Peter'; 'Avri Doria' Subject: [governance] Call for volunteers for Nomcom pool - 22 Current List - Closing January 6th Hi everybody! We are slowly closing in on our goal of at least 25 members for the Noncom pool by January 6th. Please consider collaborating with the group by offering your name to the pool of candidates for the MAG Nominating Committee. This is an interesting and important opportunity to help, and to share in the duties of the IGC. Please review the list to see if there are any errors. 1. Jeanette Hofmann 2. Maja Andjelkovic 3. Philippe Dam 4. Hanane Boujemi 5. Raquel Gatto 6. Rafik Dammak 7. Shaila Mistry 8. Tricia Wang 9. Anja Kovacs 10. Hempal Shrestha 11. Adam Peake 12. Ken Lohento 13. Emmanuel Edet 14. Renate Bloem 15. Jeremy Shtern 16. Schombe Baudoin 17. Thomas Lowenhaupt 18. Javier Pinzón 19. Tapani Tarvainen 20. Tijani Ben Jemaa 21. Katitza Rodriguez 22. Jameleddine Khemakhem Thanks, and happy holidays, Ginger ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance _____ Get easy photo sharing with Windows Live™ Photos. Drag n’ drop -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- ____________________________________________________________ You received this message as a subscriber on the list: governance at lists.cpsr.org To be removed from the list, send any message to: governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org For all list information and functions, see: http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance