[governance] Finalizing the IG Section of the CS Statement onTunis

Michael Froomkin - U.Miami School of Law froomkin at law.miami.edu
Sat Dec 3 14:19:26 EST 2005


Without wading into the public good issue, may I wordsmith (B) a tiny bit?


On Sun, 4 Dec 2005, Izumi AIZU wrote:

> Let me try:
> 
> (A)
> With regards to para 63, Civil Society believes that a country code Top Level Domain (ccTLD)
> is a public good of both people of the concerned country/economy and of global citizens who
> have various interests to the country/economy. As such, we recognize the importance of role
> of the respective governments to protect the ccTLD under their jurisdiction, it should be
> exercised in a manner that respects human rights as expressed in existing international
> treaties through a democratic, transparent and inclusive process with full involvement of all
> stakeholders at the national level."
> 
> If we have problem with the first sentence, that could be the case,
> 
> (B)
> With regards to para 63, Civil Society recognizes the importance of role of the governments
> to protect the ccTLD under their jurisdiction, it should be exercised in a manner that

add after comma: but emphasize that it must
instead of "it should"


> respects human rights as expressed in existing international treaties through a democratic,
> transparent and inclusive process with full involvement of all stakeholders, inter alia, the
> Civil Society, at the national level."
> 
> Just a try...
> 
> izumi sitting in Vancouver ICANN meeting
> 
> 
> At 10:41 05/12/03 -0800, Avri Doria wrote:
>       Hi,
> 
>       I am not totally comfortable with the paragraph.  As I have pointed out often on
>       this list and other is that I beleive we make a mistake when we accept the notion
>       of Governments having sovereignty over ccTLD.  Yes, I believe they need to be
>       operated in the countries' interests, but do not beleive that should be
>       automatically construed as translating to sovereignty.
> 
>       It is certainly their right to assert such a claim, but I see no reason for us to
>       acquiesce to it, for in doing so, we help to make it so.
> 
>       I would prefer that we use language that indicates a county's responsibilities as
>       steward of a ccTLd to protect human rights, privacy rights and equality of
>       access.
> 
> 
>       a.
> 
> 
>       On 3 dec 2005, at 10.14, Parminder wrote:
> 
>              
> 
>              
> 
>             Bill, thanks for rounding up the outcomes from the discussions.
> 
>              
> 
>             One last point. I think, the ccTLD point is important and the global
>             CS needs to take a position on how the enhanced role of governments
>             recognized in the point 63 should be exercised.
> 
>              
> 
>             The words contributed by Wolfgang, and the additions provided by me
>             almost constitutes clear language on this issue, and unless anyone on
>             this list objects to it, I will request Ralf to consider its
>             inclusion - exercising his judgment about its placement in the text
>             on IG.
> 
>              
> 
>             I quote from Bill's mail below the discussions on this issue for
>             others people's comments, if any.
> 
>              
> 
>             >>>Wolfgang raised a concern about the Tunis Agenda's para 63 on
>             ccTLDs,
> 
>             stating, "We should say very clear, that the recognition of the
> 
>             sovereignty of countries / governments over their ccTD space is
>             embedded
> 
>             into a framework of general principles which includes all human
>             rights,
> 
>             non-discrimination, equal access etc. "  He did not suggest language.
> 
>             Parminder agreed, stating that national sovereignty over ccTLDs
>             "should be
> 
>             exercised in a manner that respects human rights as expressed in
>             various
> 
>             international treaties, and through a process that takes in diverse
>             inputs
> 
>             from the civil society at the national level."  Personally, I would
>             favor
> 
>             expressing these concerns, but as nobody has suggested language or
>             said
> 
>             where it should go in the IG section. As time is running out, I doubt
>             we'd
> 
>             manage to reach a determination even if someone proposed text now,
>             but if
> 
>             someone wants to try, great.  Otherwise,  I guess it'll have to be
>             your
> 
>             editorial judgment call as to the addition of a sentence or two on
>             this.>>>
> 
>              
> 
>             parminder
> 
>              
> 
>              
> 
>             ________________________________________________
> 
>             Parminder Jeet Singh
> 
>             IT for Change
> 
>             Bridging Development Realities and Technological Possibilities
> 
>             91-80-26654134
> 
>             www.ITforChange.net
> 
>              
> 
>             -----Original Message-----
>             From: governance-bounces at lists.cpsr.org [
>             mailto:governance-bounces at lists.cpsr.org] On Behalf Of William Drake
>             Sent: Saturday, December 03, 2005 3:20 PM
>             To: bendrath at zedat.fu-berlin.de
>             Cc: Governance
>             Subject: [governance] Finalizing the IG Section of the CS Statement
>             on Tunis
> 
>              
> 
>             Hi Ralf, (and all)
> 
>              
> 
>             I guess time is running out to make changes to the IG section of the
>             CS
> 
>             statement.  The last I heard you wanted to finalize Sunday afternoon
>             and
> 
>             were urging the caucus to urgently get it together on inputs.  So, in
> 
>             accordance with my instructions from Lee, let's see if we can track
>             the
> 
>             debate and move toward closure for you.
> 
>              
> 
>             The last version of IG stuff I saw that you had incorporated into the
> 
>             draft statement was from Wednesday the 30th.  It reflected
>             suggestions I
> 
>             made on the 28th and subsequent discussions and modifications by the
>             group
> 
>             in which multiple people weighed in and nobody said, no I can't
>             accept
> 
>             this. In the absence of other, more effective procedures it seemed
> 
>             reasonable to treat that text as agreed.  Since that time, to my
>             knowledge
> 
>             there have been a couple of additional suggestions that have been
> 
>             variously (hi Avri;-) supported, so presumably the same 'nobody
>             objected'
> 
>             principle would apply.  Some other points are still very much in the
>             air.
> 
>              
> 
>             1.  I suggested on Wed. 30th that IG be included in your first page
> 
>             listing of CS objectives going into the Tunis phase, since affecting
>             the
> 
>             IG process and decisions were in fact main objectives, certainly
>             equal to
> 
>             the others listed, to which a lot of people devoted a lot of energy,
>             with
> 
>             some success.  The language I suggested was:
> 
>              
> 
>             "*Agreement on a substantively broad and procedurally inclusive
>             approach to
> 
>             Internet governance, the reform of existing governance mechanisms in
> 
>             accordance with the Geneva principles, and the creation of a new
>             mechanism
> 
>             or forum to promote multistakeholder dialogue, analysis, trend
>             monitoring,
> 
>             and capacity building in the field of Internet governance."
> 
>              
> 
>             According to the list archives, replies were received from Jeanette,
>             Avri,
> 
>             Vittorio, Adam, Izumi, Wolfgang, Jacky, Parminder, and Lee.  Nobody
> 
>             objected to this suggestion, although Jeanette expressed concern that
> 
>             other caucuses might want to add additional objectives, which in my
>             view
> 
>             anyway is a separate matter and wouldn't be a function of one
>             sentence on
> 
>             IG.  In any event, since the argument for including this is clear,
>             the
> 
>             arguments against would be counterfactual, and a number of folks
>             haven't
> 
>             objected on its inclusion or substance, can we please treat this as
> 
>             agreed?  I think it would be utterly bizarre not to mention IG in key
> 
>             objectives, and that other stakeholders and press would be perplexed.
> 
>              
> 
>              
> 
>             2.  I also suggested a change on the IG piece for the going forward
> 
>             section on page 10:
> 
>              
> 
>             "Element two: Involvement in the Internet Governance Forum
> 
>             The CS Internet Governance Caucus will actively participate in and
>             support
> 
>             the work of the IGF, and is exploring ways to enhance its working
>             methods
> 
>             and engagement with relevant stakeholders, especially the research
> 
>             community, to these ends.  In addition, discussions are under way to
> 
>             create a new working group that will make recommendations on the
> 
>             modalities of the IGF."
> 
>              
> 
>             Here things are more messy.  The folks mentioned above didn't
>             disagree
> 
>             with the desirability of tweaking this passage or with the first
>             sentence,
> 
>             but on the second pertaining to the WG concept, various ideas were
> 
>             expressed without reaching a clear conclusion. Jeanette thought we
>             should
> 
>             not limit the WG sentence to modalities, and should hence just say
>             that
> 
>             the caucus will "create a working group that will make
>             recommendations on
> 
>             relevant aspects concerning the IGF."  Avri said she's fine with
>             either
> 
>             formulation. Vittorio said "we have to be very clear on whether we
>             expect
> 
>             this to be the only or at least the recommended place for CS groups
>             that
> 
>             want to discuss about the forum," but did not suggest language that
>             would
> 
>             bring this clarity.  Jeanette replied, "Since we never speak for
>             civil
> 
>             society as such but only for a specific working group or caucus, I 
>             don't
> 
>             understand what exactly it is you try to prevent or achieve." Adam
>             said
> 
>             "Of course other caucuses and working groups will be interested in
>             the
> 
>             forum. And the Internet governance caucus may continue as is, it
>             might
> 
>             evolve into a new working group, or a new working group might emerge
> 
>             separately. So why not refer to civil society and not mention the
>             caucus
> 
>             or any new working group?,"  but did not suggest text.  Lee said
>             "yay" for
> 
>             the original suggestion, Wolfgang said of course the WG is open to
>             all and
> 
>             should cover both modalities and substance, Izumi agreed it is open
>             to
> 
>             all, and Jacky asked whether "modalities and substance could be
>             separated
> 
>             into two groups?"
> 
>              
> 
>             That is where we left it. It's not a clear picture on the WG
>             sentence, but
> 
>             the first seems unproblematic. Here are two options Ralf, and in the
>             event
> 
>             you don't get more input, I guess you could just use your judgment?
> 
>              
> 
>             A.  "Element two: Involvement in the Internet Governance Forum
> 
>             The CS Internet Governance Caucus will actively participate in and
>             support
> 
>             the work of the IGF, and is exploring ways to enhance its working
>             methods
> 
>             and engagement with relevant stakeholders, especially the research
> 
>             community, to these ends."  Full stop.  Don't say anything about a WG
> 
>             since its form and function are not agreed yet, and any subsequent
> 
>             decision to create one would not be inconsistent with the statement.
> 
>              
> 
>             B.  "Element two: Involvement in the Internet Governance Forum
> 
>             The CS Internet Governance Caucus will actively participate in and
>             support
> 
>             the work of the IGF, and is exploring ways to enhance its working
>             methods
> 
>             and engagement with relevant stakeholders, especially the research
> 
>             community, to these ends.  In addition, the caucus is considering the
> 
>             creation of a new working group that will make recommendations on the
>             IGF,
> 
>             and other civil society caucuses and working groups will develop
>             ideas for
> 
>             and participate in the IGF as well."  This second sentence would seem
>             to
> 
>             capture the various views expressed without committing us to any
> 
>             particular configuration, more or less, or you could tweak, whatever.
> 
>              
> 
>              
> 
>             3.  Izumi suggested that the first sentence of the section should
>             read,
> 
>             "Civil society is pleased with the decision to create an Internet
> 
>             Governance Forum (IGF) for multistakeholder dialogue, which it has
> 
>             advocated since 2003."  The multistakeholder clause would be new. 
>             Nobody
> 
>             has objected, the case it straightforward, hopefully you can insert
>             this.
> 
>              
> 
>              
> 
>             4.  Wolfgang raised a concern about the Tunis Agenda's para 63 on
>             ccTLDs,
> 
>             stating, "We should say very clear, that the recognition of the
> 
>             sovereignty of countries / governments over their ccTD space is
>             embedded
> 
>             into a framework of general principles which includes all human
>             rights,
> 
>             non-discrimination, equal access etc. "  He did not suggest language.
> 
>             Parminder agreed, stating that national sovereignty over ccTLDs
>             "should be
> 
>             exercised in a manner that respects human rights as expressed in
>             various
> 
>             international treaties, and through a process that takes in diverse
>             inputs
> 
>             from the civil society at the national level."  Personally, I would
>             favor
> 
>             expressing these concerns, but as nobody has suggested language or
>             said
> 
>             where it should go in the IG section. As time is running out, I doubt
>             we'd
> 
>             manage to reach a determination even if someone proposed text now,
>             but if
> 
>             someone wants to try, great.  Otherwise,  I guess it'll have to be
>             your
> 
>             editorial judgment call as to the addition of a sentence or two on
>             this.
> 
>              
> 
>              
> 
>             5.  A number of people have expressed various concerns about the
>             wording
> 
>             of the last paragraph on public education.  While the general idea is
>             easy
> 
>             to support, there were some critical comments on the formulation too.
> 
>             There was not enough back and forth on language to see a resolution,
>             and
> 
>             the situation is complicated by the fact that Divina is not on the
>             caucus
> 
>             list.  Here I would repeat my Dec. 1 suggestion which seems like a
>             path of
> 
>             least resistance, but do what seems right.
> 
>              
> 
>             > Lastly, in light of things said in the thread concerning the public
> 
>             > awareness paragraph, I would suggest that this should be moved to
>             the four
> 
>             > para section on Education and Research, which I presume Divina
>             played a
> 
>             > role in shaping.  Clustering like points and having thematic
>             sections that
> 
>             > come from people involved in the respective caucuses would in no
>             way
> 
>             > constitute a downgrading of this important concern.
> 
>              
> 
>             Finally, on the global public goods thread, there's been some lengthy
>             list
> 
>             and private dialogue, strong views on both sides, no agreement, so
> 
>             whatever.
> 
>              
> 
>             Basta.  Hope this helps you finalization process, and that some other
> 
>             folks will weigh in on the above points in a manner that facilitates
>             your
> 
>             task.  Thanks again for coordinating all this.
> 
>              
> 
>             Best,
> 
>              
> 
>             Bill
> 
>              
> 
>             *******************************************************
> 
>             William J. Drake  wdrake at ictsd.ch
> 
>             President, Computer Professionals for
> 
>                Social Responsibility www.cpsr.org
> 
>                Geneva, Switzerland
> 
>             http://mitpress.mit.edu/IRGP-series
> 
>             http://www.cpsr.org/board/drake
> 
>             Morality is the best of all devices for leading
> 
>             mankind by the nose.---Nietzsche
> 
>             *******************************************************
> 
>              
> 
>              
> 
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-- 
http://www.icannwatch.org   Personal Blog: http://www.discourse.net
A. Michael Froomkin   |    Professor of Law    |   froomkin at law.tm
U. Miami School of Law, P.O. Box 248087, Coral Gables, FL 33124 USA
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