[bestbits] Best Bits MAG nominations for your approval - URGENT

Tue Dec 3 10:19:02 EST 2013

Hi Carolina

Finally, Rafik, is there any news from your conversations at ICANN that you
> may have accessed and could share with us due to current mandate?
>
> I am not sure about this request, what news are you asking about?

Rafik


> C
>
>
> On Mon, Dec 2, 2013 at 10:19 PM, genekimmelman at gmail.com <
> genekimmelman at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Rafik, sorry if my message came across as aggressive,  it was not meant
>> that way. I won't debate further either, you raise important points that
>> deserve consideration.  I believe there have been some interesting process
>> proposals put on the table to work out.  My tone was only meant to express
>> my sense that we need to reach a point of resolution so we can focus
>> adequate attention to substantive policy concerns.  And I must also admit
>> that as a 30 year veteran of policy strategy,  I have never placed
>> transparency as a goal equal to social equity, economic justice,  or the
>> protection of fundamental human rights. Maybe  others in CS have a
>> different hierarchy of concerns and therefore are more focused on how
>> internal process rules are consistent with external demands of
>> policymakers.  I'm just explaining that I personally think internal
>> legitimacy of our group among those who opt in requires a sense of trust
>> that may be quite different from transparency rules. And I look forward to
>> working out how we can generate and maintain that trust as we actively
>> engage in our work.
>>
>>
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: Rafik Dammak <rafik.dammak at gmail.com>
>> Date: 12/02/2013 9:49 PM (GMT-05:00)
>> To: genekimmelman at gmail.com
>> Cc: William Drake <william.drake at uzh.ch>,Parminder <
>> parminder at itforchange.net>,bestbits at lists.bestbits.net
>> Subject: Re: [bestbits] Best Bits MAG nominations for your approval -
>> URGENT
>>
>>
>> Hi Gene,
>>
>> thanks for the reply. I feel some aggressive tone there with kind of mix
>> of "shut-up" , "take it or leave it" and "if you don't like, you can quit",
>> at least that is my interpretation . For sure that is not the best way to
>> engage and convince people .
>>
>> If I recall correctly the interim steering committee started this summer
>> (july) and that is before the brazil meeting announcement in October. I
>> guess that any interim steering committee has a first goal to propose a
>> long-term setting or process and moving from the transitional phase. we can
>> every time postpone that arguing we have new challenges and issues to
>> handle, but till when? it looks like technical debt in the software
>> development world.
>>
>> There are concerns and I don't share all of them, but dismissing is not
>> the answer .Why? because for every decision, move , they will pop-up again
>> over again, why not to respond them now ?
>>
>> I can live with Anriette proposal and find it acceptable while I found
>> that term is long and can be shorten.
>>
>> I feel that people are in defensive mode and react to critics. this
>> discussion is not about individuals at all.
>>
>> We as individuals involved in CS world in different manners and fora, we
>> tend to lecture others about accountability, transparency, sometimes in the
>> borderline of patronizing, shouldn't we live to those principles first?
>>
>> I am not going further in this discussion since I think I expressed what
>> I have to say already and not willing to disturb the social peace.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Rafik
>>
>> 2013/12/2 genekimmelman at gmail.com <genekimmelman at gmail.com>
>>
>>> To be more specific,  maybe those with lingering concerns need to decide
>>> whether they want to participate on the best bits platform or not. You
>>> decide.  If you think you can make it work better,  please offer ideas like
>>> Anriette, Michael and others have done. I believe we decided in Bali on an
>>> approach and I endorse Anriette's path toward formalizing this. And I
>>> suggest we wrap up this conversation for now and move on to substance.
>>>  Otherwise we delegitimze the broad support people worked towards over two
>>> days in Bali and make it more difficult to prepare for Brazil.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Rafik Dammak <rafik.dammak at gmail.com>
>>> Date: 12/02/2013 8:22 AM (GMT-05:00)
>>> To: genekimmelman at gmail.com
>>> Cc: William Drake <william.drake at uzh.ch>,Parminder <
>>> parminder at itforchange.net>,bestbits at lists.bestbits.net
>>> Subject: Re: [bestbits] Best Bits MAG nominations for your approval -
>>> URGENT
>>>
>>>
>>> every response with such reluctance and  such kind of arguments raise
>>> more questions than giving answers or appeasing those with concerns.
>>> as reminder BestBits initiative started in august 2012 when people were
>>> talking about WCIT and prepared first meeting IGF Baku, we will be in 2014
>>> in few weeks and we are still with temporary settings.
>>>
>>> Rafik
>>>
>>> 2013/12/2 genekimmelman at gmail.com <genekimmelman at gmail.com>
>>>
>>>> Internal accountability to a group with shared goals may differ from
>>>> societal/global policy goals that the group will agree to if all others
>>>> with power agree as well.  Best not to confuse these.  We should be
>>>> accountable but not create internal processes that make it impossible to
>>>> coordinate policy actions.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -------- Original message --------
>>>> From: William Drake <william.drake at uzh.ch>
>>>> Date: 12/02/2013 3:52 AM (GMT-05:00)
>>>> To: Parminder Singh <parminder at itforchange.net>
>>>> Cc: "bestbits at lists.bestbits.net> Best Bits" <
>>>> bestbits at lists.bestbits.net>
>>>> Subject: Re: [bestbits] Best Bits MAG nominations for your approval -
>>>> URGENT
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> +1!
>>>>
>>>> On Dec 2, 2013, at 9:23 AM, parminder <parminder at itforchange.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Civil society must always remain very vary of thinking of themselves as
>>>> somehow so morally superior that they are exempt from normal accountability
>>>> and transparency requirements
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ____________________________________________________________
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> ____________________________________________________________
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>
>
>
> --
>  *Carolina Rossini*
> *Project Director, Latin America Resource Center*
> Open Technology Institute
> *New America Foundation*
> //
> http://carolinarossini.net/
> + 1 6176979389
> *carolina.rossini at gmail.com*
> skype: carolrossini
> @carolinarossini
>
>
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