[bestbits] Reform surveillance

[Kevin Bankston]

Indeed.  Now *this* is a hook of talking about ad-motivated tracking in relation to NSA!  As the story says...

The National Security Agency is secretly piggybacking on the tools that enable Internet advertisers to track consumers, using "cookies" and location data to pinpoint targets for government hacking and to bolster surveillance.

...

For years, privacy advocates have raised concerns about the use of commercial tracking tools to identify and target consumers with advertisements. The online ad industry has said its practices are innocuous and benefit consumers by serving them ads that are more likely to be of interest to them.

The revelation that the NSA is piggybacking on these commercial technologies could shift that debate, handing privacy advocates a new argument for reining in commercial surveillance.

On Dec 10, 2013, at 9:58 PM, "James S. Tyre" <jstyre at jstyre.com> wrote:

> Interesting timing for this new article:
>  
> NSA uses Google cookies to pinpoint targets for hacking
>  
> BY ASHKAN SOLTANI, ANDREA PETERSON, AND BARTON GELLMAN
>  
> December 10 at 8:50 pm
>  
> http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/?p=11378
>  
> --
> James S. Tyre
> Law Offices of James S. Tyre
> 10736 Jefferson Blvd., #512
> Culver City, CA 90230-4969
> 310-839-4114/310-839-4602(fax)
> jstyre at jstyre.com
> Special Counsel, Electronic Frontier Foundation
> https://www.eff.org
>  
> From: bestbits-request at lists.bestbits.net [mailto:bestbits-request at lists.bestbits.net] On Behalf Of genekimmelman at gmail.com
> Sent: Tuesday, December 10, 2013 6:46 PM
> To: mgodwin at INTERNEWS.ORG; bankston at opentechinstitute.org; gurstein at gmail.com
> Cc: mishi at softwarefreedom.org; bestbits at lists.bestbits.net
> Subject: Re: [bestbits] Reform surveillance
>  
> Let's just not forget that this isn't just a question of whether governments can get personal information,  it is a question of how much it costs to get that data. Governments could always invest heavily in surveillance if they wanted to. The relevant question in the digital age is whether commercial practices are making it too easy and cheap for governments. And whether those commercial interests can pursue profit without unduly jeopardizing their customers' privacy. 
> 
> 
> -------- Original message --------
> From: "Mike Godwin (mgodwin at INTERNEWS.ORG)" <mgodwin at INTERNEWS.ORG> 
> Date: 12/10/2013 5:19 PM (GMT-05:00) 
> To: Kevin Bankston <bankston at opentechinstitute.org>,michael gurstein <gurstein at gmail.com> 
> Cc: genekimmelman at gmail.com,mishi at softwarefreedom.org,bestbits at lists.bestbits.net 
> Subject: Re: [bestbits] Reform surveillance 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 12/10/13, 4:32 PM, "Kevin Bankston" <bankston at opentechinstitute.org>
> wrote:
> 
> 
> >To clarify my point: Although I agree with Mike's prioritization, I also
> >agree with the general impulse to leverage the NSA scandal to advance a
> >broader consumer privacy agenda.  And I definitely share the general
> >concern that creating large honeypots of behavioral tracking data creates
> >a tempting target for the government.  But I've seen a lot of vague
> >overstatements in the press lately on this point, basically saying "this
> >is all the fault of the Internet companies' advertising-driven
> >data-hoarding practices", so I just felt the need to point out that as
> >best I can tell, the types of data and communications content that we
> >know the NSA is seeking would exist and be stored and be available even
> >if there was no such thing as targeted advertising or behavioral tracking.
> 
> I absolutely agree with all of this.
> 
> I think building an international consensus on consumer-privacy best
> practices is very important. But I worry that it distracts us ‹ at this
> critical historical moment ‹ from the fact that bulk data
> collection/surveillance is the crack cocaine of governments. We could have
> the best international consumer privacy regime possible, and every country
> and company in the world could subscribe to it, and governments would
> still be sucking up the same data. They¹d just get at it a different way,
> probably through regulated industries like telcos, banks, and credit-card
> services.
> 
> Again, speaking only for myself here.
> 
> 
> ‹Mike
> 
> 
> 

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