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<div class="moz-forward-container">I though this group may also be
interested in this .. <br>
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<div class="moz-forward-container"><br>
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<div class="moz-forward-container">(Lest it becomes just a
noticeboard to hang our dear Joly MacFie's ISOC annoiuncements :)
) <br>
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<div class="moz-forward-container">-------- Forwarded Message
--------
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<th valign="BASELINE" nowrap="nowrap" align="RIGHT">Subject:
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<td>Re: [Internet Policy] Telcos Looking For Handouts.</td>
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<th valign="BASELINE" nowrap="nowrap" align="RIGHT">Date: </th>
<td>Sun, 5 Jun 2022 10:31:26 +0530</td>
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<th valign="BASELINE" nowrap="nowrap" align="RIGHT">From: </th>
<td>parminder <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:parminder.js@gmail.com"><parminder.js@gmail.com></a></td>
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<th valign="BASELINE" nowrap="nowrap" align="RIGHT">To: </th>
<td>David Lloyd-Jones <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:david.lloydjones@gmail.com"><david.lloydjones@gmail.com></a>,
ISOC INTERNETPOLICY <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:internetpolicy@elists.isoc.org"><internetpolicy@elists.isoc.org></a></td>
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 31/05/22 22:43, David Lloyd-Jones
via InternetPolicy wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAG-id0b2YBOsF_P3sJUpGa56Gx=+tOFmy2ar_a_vT4xaxX3CBQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="ltr">Parminder writes, with his usual degree of acuity
and discrimination, " Big Tech now accounts for 57 percent of
global internet traffic"<br>
<br>
<a
href="https://techmonitor.ai/technology/networks/big-tech-accounts-for-over-half-of-global-internet-traffic,"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://techmonitor.ai/technology/networks/big-tech-accounts-for-over-half-of-global-internet-traffic,</a>,"
<div> </div>
<div>This is nothing but telephone companies looking for
handouts.<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>David, Since you name me, and with apparent sarcasm, I must say
that I am not quite sure what you are alluding to... Now if net
neutrality (NN) violations is *telcos looking for handouts* (as
the successor title to the thread that was originated by me as
"Big tech now accounts for 57% of global Internet traffic"), let
me share it with you that we (me/ my organization/ our networks)
have been strongly fighting for enforcement of NN since the
2000s. This is documented history. We have been at it even when
many organizations like the EFF were still not sure if there
should be regulation to nforce NN. Perhaps even ISOC. We have
held numerous advocacy events, including at the IGF , <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://itforchange.net/sites/default/files/367/Internet_mall-EPW_0.pdf">this
is an article for enforcing NN </a>that appeared in India's
top academic journal in 2010, and there have been numerous
op-eds after that. We played a considerably important role in
the eventual NN rules in India....</p>
<p>I had forwarded this above article about big tech's control
over more than half the global internet traffic NOT to press for
telco's rights to seek rents from big tech or others - -that is
anathema for me. It was to highlight the kind of control big
tech increasingly has, not just over the Internet, but thereby
also over more and more aspects and elements of our lives and
our socio-economic systems. (Have you ever thought about it!)<br>
</p>
<p>Now with this behind us ..</p>
<p>While people have a right to their views, and emphasizing
issues they wish to, I remain highly amused with how the debate
turned completely to be about the excesses of telcos -- who are
a fast retreating and increasingly inconsequential power, apart
from being highly regulated in public interest. (That in fact is
the main reason that poor telcos' get such falk, they are
associated with governments, which is the Interenty libertarian'
real enemy.) Which, excuse me to say so, put all together looks
like a desperate collective effort not to look at and talk about
the real elephant in the room - the Big Tech. If the statistics
of 57 % internet flows being in the hands of 5 US corporations
does not shock people into their senses, and they still want to
focus on telcos, who whatever they may wish arent getting
anywhere with demands for more rents, there must be *something
fundamentally amiss and askew*.</p>
<p>People here -- and one wonders why -- still want to tilt at the
windmills of the telcos, when right behind them the Big Tech
devil is fast devouring the world, or, using a different way to
make the point, chaining it to be under its command. People in
the streets, almost all media, and most politicians, are worried
like hell about this. Opeds upon opeds and legislative proposals
upon proposals are pouring out. And here we sit among a smug
community, which earned its much-vaunted spurs valiantly
fighting 'for the Internet' in the 1990s and part of 2000s, and
now even got powerful and resourceful institutions like the
ISOC, and very-valauble representation in policy making as
'technical community', but which now wants to entirely rest on
its laurels. For that, if they have to re-imagine to completely
distort the reality around them, and blatantly refuse obvious
facts, they will fully and energetically do so. As we see done
so woefully and regrettably in this exchange, and mostly on this
list, and as a staple by ISOC, and so on. <br>
</p>
<p>Were it just some harmless oldies having a good time with good
memories of their own golden times, that would be fine. But what
has unfortunately happened is that their 'historical good acts'
of contributing to and politically fighting for an epochal level
decentralization of 'network power' -- in a shift from the telco
centric communications to Internet based interactions, resulting
in continuing basic re-organisations in our socioeconomic
systems, has now been solidly, and in an extraordinarily
successful manner, captured and co-opted in defense of exactly
what it was organized to oppose. By this i mean *an
unacceptable concentration of network power* (which
consequently, in a digital context, has then led to creation and
then concentration of 'data/ AI power'). Many have simply
walked innocently into the Pied Piper like trap, which trap is
of course highly resourced -- politically, by the US
establishment, and economically by Big Tech. Some are just
innocent about the *cheese having been moved*, or too weak to
deal with more complex realities. That is the kinder
interpretation of what is happening, Because, the fact also is,
many others have found deeply rewarding roles and benefits in
the process, and this part is less than innocent or mere
weakeness. I speak here of both persons and organizations like
the ISOC. They simply need to keep investing in what 'they are',
and what sustains them.<br>
</p>
<p>But since every sin -- especially collective, public ones --
need whatever veneers of self justification that can be conjured
up, this has resulted in some remarkably funny and even
hilarious discussions, arguments, and positions. It it were just
funny, I am not averse to deriving some light-minded enjoyment
out if it, but the fact is that it is all extremely extremely
dangerous to the world, especially for the coming generations --
who would ask, *what were the people who knew doing when Big
Tech took over and screwed-up our hard earned civilization*. It
indeed completely passes me how so many such intelligent, and
good, people refuse to see their role and responsibility in this
background, and are happy to do nothing but keep talking about
and extolling the virtues of some vintage Internet they
allegedly helped create and defend, to the determent of so much,
of the present, and the future. Have you guys ever tried to talk
with a more contemporary, and/ or disinterested, person on the
streets! Would be insightful, and useful, i say.<br>
</p>
<p> </p>
<p>No, this is not about telco versus internet -- it is about
concentrated versus distributed network-power. At some
historical point, long passed, this duality expressed primarily
as being about telco versus the Internet. Today it is about Big
Tech versus a distributed digital ecology, which, like NN was
enforced by hard law, *can only be ensured by new kinds of hard
laws* (EU is making some feeble and unconvincing efforts, with
its Digital Markets Act, Data Act, GAIA projects, some others
are too). That my friends, is where the cheese has now be moved
to. Lets not fool ourselves. <br>
</p>
<p>So please wake up, and see *where actual network-power
currently is* (today even more dangerous as it further yields
data/ AI power), and WHAT IS NEEDED TO BE DONE ABOUT IT ..
Please give rest to Quixotic imageries and battles. <br>
</p>
<p>David, since you so are so affected by my acuity and
discrimination, just thought I'd indulge you more :) .No
offense.</p>
<p>parminder <br>
</p>
<p><br>
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<p><br>
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<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAG-id0b2YBOsF_P3sJUpGa56Gx=+tOFmy2ar_a_vT4xaxX3CBQ@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
The fact is all of internet traffic, not any 67%, is carried
by "Big Tech": the telephone companies. All of this is paid
by us, the recipients, in our telephone bills.<br>
<br>
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