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<p>I mean, isnt it extraordinary that when someone points out,
quoting real statistics, that Internet traffic today is largely
under a few Big Tech corporations' control, there are many very
intelligent people ( a whole train of postings on the ISOC list)
who would keep insisting that the telco are the real problem, lets
focus on them! <br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 05/06/22 10:56, parminder via
Governance wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:91ff4b3d-c425-560c-614f-459af62c60b4@itforchange.net">
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<div class="moz-forward-container">I though this group may also be
interested in this .. <br>
</div>
<div class="moz-forward-container"><br>
</div>
<div class="moz-forward-container">(Lest it becomes just a
noticeboard to hang our dear Joly MacFie's ISOC annoiuncements
:) ) <br>
</div>
<div class="moz-forward-container"><br>
</div>
<div class="moz-forward-container">-------- Forwarded Message
--------
<table class="moz-email-headers-table" cellspacing="0"
cellpadding="0" border="0">
<tbody>
<tr>
<th valign="BASELINE" nowrap="nowrap" align="RIGHT">Subject:
</th>
<td>Re: [Internet Policy] Telcos Looking For Handouts.</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th valign="BASELINE" nowrap="nowrap" align="RIGHT">Date:
</th>
<td>Sun, 5 Jun 2022 10:31:26 +0530</td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th valign="BASELINE" nowrap="nowrap" align="RIGHT">From:
</th>
<td>parminder <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:parminder.js@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true"><parminder.js@gmail.com></a></td>
</tr>
<tr>
<th valign="BASELINE" nowrap="nowrap" align="RIGHT">To: </th>
<td>David Lloyd-Jones <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:david.lloydjones@gmail.com"
moz-do-not-send="true"><david.lloydjones@gmail.com></a>,
ISOC INTERNETPOLICY <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E"
href="mailto:internetpolicy@elists.isoc.org"
moz-do-not-send="true"><internetpolicy@elists.isoc.org></a></td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
<br>
<br>
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<p><br>
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 31/05/22 22:43, David
Lloyd-Jones via InternetPolicy wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAG-id0b2YBOsF_P3sJUpGa56Gx=+tOFmy2ar_a_vT4xaxX3CBQ@mail.gmail.com">
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<div dir="ltr">Parminder writes, with his usual degree of
acuity and discrimination, " Big Tech now accounts for 57
percent of global internet traffic"<br>
<br>
<a
href="https://techmonitor.ai/technology/networks/big-tech-accounts-for-over-half-of-global-internet-traffic,"
rel="noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"
class="moz-txt-link-freetext">https://techmonitor.ai/technology/networks/big-tech-accounts-for-over-half-of-global-internet-traffic,</a>,"
<div> </div>
<div>This is nothing but telephone companies looking for
handouts.<br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>David, Since you name me, and with apparent sarcasm, I must
say that I am not quite sure what you are alluding to... Now
if net neutrality (NN) violations is *telcos looking for
handouts* (as the successor title to the thread that was
originated by me as "Big tech now accounts for 57% of global
Internet traffic"), let me share it with you that we (me/ my
organization/ our networks) have been strongly fighting for
enforcement of NN since the 2000s. This is documented history.
We have been at it even when many organizations like the EFF
were still not sure if there should be regulation to nforce
NN. Perhaps even ISOC. We have held numerous advocacy events,
including at the IGF , <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://itforchange.net/sites/default/files/367/Internet_mall-EPW_0.pdf">this
is an article for enforcing NN </a>that appeared in India's
top academic journal in 2010, and there have been numerous
op-eds after that. We played a considerably important role in
the eventual NN rules in India....</p>
<p>I had forwarded this above article about big tech's control
over more than half the global internet traffic NOT to press
for telco's rights to seek rents from big tech or others -
-that is anathema for me. It was to highlight the kind of
control big tech increasingly has, not just over the Internet,
but thereby also over more and more aspects and elements of
our lives and our socio-economic systems. (Have you ever
thought about it!)<br>
</p>
<p>Now with this behind us ..</p>
<p>While people have a right to their views, and emphasizing
issues they wish to, I remain highly amused with how the
debate turned completely to be about the excesses of telcos --
who are a fast retreating and increasingly inconsequential
power, apart from being highly regulated in public interest.
(That in fact is the main reason that poor telcos' get such
falk, they are associated with governments, which is the
Interenty libertarian' real enemy.) Which, excuse me to say
so, put all together looks like a desperate collective effort
not to look at and talk about the real elephant in the room -
the Big Tech. If the statistics of 57 % internet flows being
in the hands of 5 US corporations does not shock people into
their senses, and they still want to focus on telcos, who
whatever they may wish arent getting anywhere with demands for
more rents, there must be *something fundamentally amiss and
askew*.</p>
<p>People here -- and one wonders why -- still want to tilt at
the windmills of the telcos, when right behind them the Big
Tech devil is fast devouring the world, or, using a different
way to make the point, chaining it to be under its command.
People in the streets, almost all media, and most politicians,
are worried like hell about this. Opeds upon opeds and
legislative proposals upon proposals are pouring out. And here
we sit among a smug community, which earned its much-vaunted
spurs valiantly fighting 'for the Internet' in the 1990s and
part of 2000s, and now even got powerful and resourceful
institutions like the ISOC, and very-valauble representation
in policy making as 'technical community', but which now wants
to entirely rest on its laurels. For that, if they have to
re-imagine to completely distort the reality around them, and
blatantly refuse obvious facts, they will fully and
energetically do so. As we see done so woefully and
regrettably in this exchange, and mostly on this list, and as
a staple by ISOC, and so on. <br>
</p>
<p>Were it just some harmless oldies having a good time with
good memories of their own golden times, that would be fine.
But what has unfortunately happened is that their 'historical
good acts' of contributing to and politically fighting for an
epochal level decentralization of 'network power' -- in a
shift from the telco centric communications to Internet based
interactions, resulting in continuing basic re-organisations
in our socioeconomic systems, has now been solidly, and in an
extraordinarily successful manner, captured and co-opted in
defense of exactly what it was organized to oppose. By this i
mean *an unacceptable concentration of network power* (which
consequently, in a digital context, has then led to creation
and then concentration of 'data/ AI power'). Many have simply
walked innocently into the Pied Piper like trap, which trap is
of course highly resourced -- politically, by the US
establishment, and economically by Big Tech. Some are just
innocent about the *cheese having been moved*, or too weak to
deal with more complex realities. That is the kinder
interpretation of what is happening, Because, the fact also
is, many others have found deeply rewarding roles and benefits
in the process, and this part is less than innocent or mere
weakeness. I speak here of both persons and organizations like
the ISOC. They simply need to keep investing in what 'they
are', and what sustains them.<br>
</p>
<p>But since every sin -- especially collective, public ones --
need whatever veneers of self justification that can be
conjured up, this has resulted in some remarkably funny and
even hilarious discussions, arguments, and positions. It it
were just funny, I am not averse to deriving some light-minded
enjoyment out if it, but the fact is that it is all extremely
extremely dangerous to the world, especially for the coming
generations -- who would ask, *what were the people who knew
doing when Big Tech took over and screwed-up our hard earned
civilization*. It indeed completely passes me how so many
such intelligent, and good, people refuse to see their role
and responsibility in this background, and are happy to do
nothing but keep talking about and extolling the virtues of
some vintage Internet they allegedly helped create and defend,
to the determent of so much, of the present, and the future.
Have you guys ever tried to talk with a more contemporary,
and/ or disinterested, person on the streets! Would be
insightful, and useful, i say.<br>
</p>
<p> </p>
<p>No, this is not about telco versus internet -- it is about
concentrated versus distributed network-power. At some
historical point, long passed, this duality expressed
primarily as being about telco versus the Internet. Today it
is about Big Tech versus a distributed digital ecology, which,
like NN was enforced by hard law, *can only be ensured by new
kinds of hard laws* (EU is making some feeble and unconvincing
efforts, with its Digital Markets Act, Data Act, GAIA
projects, some others are too). That my friends, is where the
cheese has now be moved to. Lets not fool ourselves. <br>
</p>
<p>So please wake up, and see *where actual network-power
currently is* (today even more dangerous as it further yields
data/ AI power), and WHAT IS NEEDED TO BE DONE ABOUT IT ..
Please give rest to Quixotic imageries and battles. <br>
</p>
<p>David, since you so are so affected by my acuity and
discrimination, just thought I'd indulge you more :) .No
offense.</p>
<p>parminder <br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAG-id0b2YBOsF_P3sJUpGa56Gx=+tOFmy2ar_a_vT4xaxX3CBQ@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
The fact is all of internet traffic, not any 67%, is
carried by "Big Tech": the telephone companies. All of
this is paid by us, the recipients, in our telephone
bills.<br>
<br>
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