<div dir="ltr">Looks great to me! Thanks for navigating, Brett<div><br clear="all"><div><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div>Brett Solomon<br>Executive Director <br>Access Now | <a href="https://accessnow.org" target="_blank">accessnow.org</a> <br><br></div>@solomonbrett<br><div>Key ID:  0x4EDC17EB<br>Fingerprint: C02C A886 B0FC 3A25 FF9F ECE8 FCDF BA23 4EDC 17EB</div><div><br></div><div><div style="font-size:12.8px"><span style="font-size:small">*</span><b style="font-size:small">Subscribe</b><span style="font-size:small"> to the </span><a href="https://www.accessnow.org/campaign/#sign-up" style="font-size:small;color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank">Access Now Express</a><span style="font-size:small">, our weekly newsletter on digital rights</span><br></div></div><div><div style="font-size:small">*<b>Protect digital rights</b> around the world - <a href="https://act.accessnow.org/page/13742/donate/1" style="color:rgb(17,85,204)" target="_blank">support Access Now</a> with a donation today</div><span style="color:rgb(80,0,80);font-size:12.8px"><div style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-size:small"></div></span></div><div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Dec 13, 2019 at 10:54 AM Ayden Férdeline <<a href="mailto:ayden@ferdeline.com">ayden@ferdeline.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div>Thanks for this edit, Ian, and thanks to everyone who had shared their input on this statement. I've pasted below what we have at present. I apologise if I have missed any edits or failed to address any concerns - if so, please can you advise. Thanks again and enjoy your weekend!</div><div><br></div><div><div><div>Best wishes, Ayden Férdeline <br></div><div>====</div><div><br></div></div></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">To:    Gonzalo Camarillo, Chair of the Board of Trustees, Internet Society</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">As members of a network which encompasses many non-commercial organizations and individuals, we are concerned by the announcement that Ethos Capital intends to acquire the assets of the Public Interest Registry (PIR) from the Internet Society (ISOC), including the .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG Registry Agreements. We ask that this sale be called off. </span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">Principally, we are concerned that the sale of PIR to a private entity investment firm would significantly alter the Domain Name System and weaken ISOC. PIR played an important role, as the only remaining non-commercial top-level domain registry operator, in serving as a counterbalance against commercial exploitation. PIR ran .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG for the benefit of its users, whereas other top-level domains are run by private companies with purely financial objectives. While the interests of companies and users do at times overlap, they can also conflict, and when this occurs there are significant human rights implications. PIR, as a subsidiary of ISOC, could be relied upon to do what was best for domain name registrants, and has a proud history of doing just that. However, PIR also gave ISOC greater legitimacy and wider influence. It allowed ISOC to take an even more active role in shaping Internet infrastructure. In relinquishing its control over PIR, ISOC would lose some of its ability to directly impact how millions of people around the world positively experience the Internet every day, and we think that is a great pity.</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">We understand that Ethos Capital approached ISOC with an offer in September 2019 and that an agreement had been reached to sell PIR by November 2019. This secret process caught us, and everyone, unaware, not just of the transaction but of the urgency to divest of PIR. </span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">We join ICANN in its 9 December 2019 letter calling for ISOC to be more transparent about the proposed sale of PIR. We ask that ISOC commit to publishing on its website all correspondence and documents exchanged with ICANN in relation to the proposed change in control of PIR. In addition, we ask that ISOC commit to publishing on its website any filings (including motions and petitions) in the Pennsylvania Orphans' Court relating to the change in status of the PIR.</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">We expect an organization that operates in the public interest, and who promotes the values of openness, trust, and transparency, to be coherent with those values when making major decisions. </span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">This is a major decision that would result in a significant change, for ISOC and for the Internet community, and it has been proposed a) without a human rights impact assessment being conducted, b) without consultation with impacted stakeholders, and c) without appropriate safeguards in place to protect the interests of .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG registrants and the people who visit their websites every day. </span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">ISOC has successfully stewarded .ORG via PIR for 17 years, gaining a reputation as a careful manager of a resource that truly is the global home for nonprofits and the noncommercial community. Given this background, and ISOC’s stated commitments to transparency and openness, we are unable to reconcile the path that ISOC has taken with the values we thought ISOC espoused. Accordingly, we call upon ISOC to withdraw from its negotiations with Ethos Capital, and to withdraw from selling PIR, so to honor its charter.</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">About the Internet Governance Caucus</span></span></i></b></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">The members of the Internet Governance Caucus (IGC) are individuals, acting in their personal capacity, who subscribe to IGC's charter. The IGC is guided by its vision and mission, included below.</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><u>Vision</u></span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">The policies that shape the Internet impact not only the development of the technologies themselves, but also the realization of internationally agreed human rights, social equity and interdependence, cultural concerns, and both social and economic development. Our vision is that Internet governance should be inclusive, people centered and development oriented. Our contributions to the various forums relevant to Internet governance, will strive to ensure an information society which better enables equal opportunity and freedom for all.</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><u>Mission</u></span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">The mission of the Internet Governance Caucus (IGC) is to provide a forum for discussion, advocacy, action, and for representation of civil society contributions in Internet governance processes. The caucus intends to provide an open and effective forum for civil society to share opinion, policy options and expertise on Internet governance issues, and to provide a mechanism for coordination of advocacy to enhance the utilization and influence of Civil Society (CS) and the IGC in relevant policy processes.</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><br></div></div><div><br></div><div>‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐<br></div><div> On Wednesday, December 11, 2019 8:11 PM, Ian Peter <<a href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com" target="_blank">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><div> <br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>small tweak suggested for last paragraph<br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div style="zoom:0.9"><p dir="ltr" style="line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">Given this background, and ISOC’s stated commitments to transparency and openness, we are unable to reconcile the path that [<b>you have] ISOC has</b> taken with the values we thought ISOC espoused. Accordingly, we call upon ISOC to withdraw from its negotiations with Ethos Capital, and to withdraw from selling PIR, so to honor its charter.</span></span></i></span><br></p></div></div></div><div><br></div><div>------ Original Message ------<br></div><div>From: "Ayden Férdeline" <<a href="mailto:ayden@ferdeline.com" target="_blank">ayden@ferdeline.com</a>><br></div><div>To: "Sheetal Kumar" <<a href="mailto:sheetal@gp-digital.org" target="_blank">sheetal@gp-digital.org</a>><br></div><div>Cc: "parminder" <<a href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net" target="_blank">parminder@itforchange.net</a>>; "Imran Ahmed Shah" <<a href="mailto:ias_pk@yahoo.com" target="_blank">ias_pk@yahoo.com</a>>; "<a href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net" target="_blank">governance@lists.riseup.net</a>" <<a href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net" target="_blank">governance@lists.riseup.net</a>><br></div><div>Sent: 12/12/2019 5:15:38 AM<br></div><div>Subject: Re: [governance] Proposed statement on .ORG sale<br></div><div><br></div><div><blockquote cite="http://ag-prvUD7UOvPQfcj2rSspLCwwVrcAprTCtclO7Z96b6s6DZjE-U9zZG6MujZkOKf_XDvZrF97QdG4QrUZLd8HydT_gcILX7tbI2fnFJ4JY=@ferdeline.com" type="cite"><div>Hi all,<br></div><div><br></div><div>Thanks for all the friendly amendments.<br></div><div><br></div><div>I want to make sure that I have captured all of them.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Please find below attached an updated version of our proposed statement to send to the ISOC Board.<br></div><div><br></div><div>I would also suggest that we affix a short paragraph, to the very end, explaining who the Internet Governance Caucus is and what we represent. I will send some proposed language under separate cover so we can wordsmith this separately. This, I hope, will address the comment asking who 'we' is in the context of this letter.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Thank you again.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Best wishes,<br></div><div>Ayden Férdeline<br></div><div><br></div><div>==========<br></div><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">To:    Gonzalo Camarillo, Chair of the Board of Trustees, Internet Society</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">As members of a network which encompasses many non-commercial organizations and individuals, we are concerned by the announcement that Ethos Capital intends to acquire the assets of the Public Interest Registry (PIR) from the Internet Society (ISOC), including the .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG Registry Agreements. We ask that this sale be called off. </span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">Principally, we are concerned that the sale of PIR to a private entity investment firm would significantly alter the Domain Name System and weaken ISOC. PIR played an important role, as the only remaining non-commercial top-level domain registry operator, in serving as a counterbalance against commercial exploitation. PIR ran .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG for the benefit of its users, whereas other top-level domains are run by private companies with purely financial objectives. While the interests of companies and users do at times overlap, they can also conflict, and when this occurs there are significant human rights implications. PIR, as a subsidiary of ISOC, could be relied upon to do what was best for domain name registrants, and has a proud history of doing just that. However, PIR also gave ISOC greater legitimacy and wider influence. It allowed ISOC to take an even more active role in shaping Internet infrastructure. In relinquishing its control over PIR, ISOC would lose some of its ability to directly impact how millions of people around the world positively experience the Internet every day, and we think that is a great pity.</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">We understand that Ethos Capital approached ISOC with an offer in September 2019 and that an agreement had been reached to sell PIR by November 2019. This secret process caught us, and everyone, unaware, not just of the transaction but of the urgency to divest of PIR. </span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">We join ICANN in its 9 December 2019 letter calling for ISOC to be more transparent about the proposed sale of PIR. We ask that ISOC commit to publishing on its website all correspondence and documents exchanged with ICANN in relation to the proposed change in control of PIR. In addition, we ask that ISOC commit to publishing on its website any filings (including motions and petitions) in the Pennsylvania Orphans' Court relating to the change in status of the PIR.</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">We expect an organization that operates in the public interest, and who promotes the values of openness, trust, and transparency, to be coherent with those values when making major decisions. </span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">This is a major decision that would result in a significant change, for ISOC and for the Internet community, and it has been proposed a) without a human rights impact assessment being conducted, b) without consultation with impacted stakeholders, and c) without appropriate safeguards in place to protect the interests of .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG registrants and the people who visit their websites every day. </span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">ISOC has successfully stewarded .ORG via PIR for 17 years, gaining a reputation as a careful manager of a resource that truly is the global home for nonprofits and the noncommercial community. Given this background, and ISOC’s stated commitments to transparency and openness, we are unable to reconcile the path that you have taken with the values we thought ISOC espoused. Accordingly, we call upon ISOC to withdraw from its negotiations with Ethos Capital, and to withdraw from selling PIR, so to honor its charter.</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><b><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">About the Internet Governance Caucus</span></span></i></b></span></span></span><br></p><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt">[Description to go here]</span></span></i></span></span></span><br></div><div><div><br></div></div><div><br></div><div>‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐<br></div><div>On Wednesday, December 11, 2019 4:04 PM, Sheetal Kumar <<a href="mailto:sheetal@gp-digital.org" target="_blank">sheetal@gp-digital.org</a>> wrote:<br></div><div><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div>Dear all, <br></div><div><br></div><div>The public outcry against the sale is clearly picking up momentum, and having results. With thanks to Ayden for proposing the following text, this is a timely moment for us to add our voices and increase pressure!<br></div><div><br></div><div>Please provide your views on the following text by <b><span style="color:rgb(0,0,255)"><u>COP tomorrow, 12 December</u></span></b>. I suggest we try and send the letter on Friday, 13 December. <br></div><div><br></div><div>In particular, you may want to consider the following questions<br></div><div><br></div><div>1) Is there anything you think you should be added to the text? If so, can you provide a rationale and some suggested text? <br></div><div>2) Is there anything you think should be removed? If so, can you provide a rationale? <br></div><div><br></div><div>Thank you!<br></div><div><br></div><div>Best<br></div><div>Sheetal.<br></div><div><br></div><div><span><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i>To:    Gonzalo Camarillo, Chair of the Board of Trustees, Internet Society</i></span></span></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div></span><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">As
 members of a network which encompasses many non-commercial
organizations and individuals, we are concerned by the announcement that
 Ethos Capital </span></span><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">intends to acquire</span><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"> the assets of the Public Interest Registry (PIR) from the Internet
Society (ISOC), including the .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG Registry Agreements.
We ask that this sale be called off. </span></span></i></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><span><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i>Principally,
 we are concerned that the sale of PIR to a private entity investment
firm will significantly alter the Domain Name System and weaken ISOC.
PIR played an important role, as the only remaining non-commercial
top-level domain registry operator, in serving as a counterbalance
against commercial exploitation. PIR ran .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG for the
benefit of its users, whereas other top-level domains are run by private
 companies with purely financial objectives. While the interests of
companies and users do at times overlap, they can also conflict, and
when this occurs there are significant human rights implications. PIR,
as a subsidiary of ISOC, could be relied upon to do what was best for
domain name registrants, and has a proud history of doing just that.
However, PIR also gave ISOC legitimacy and influence. It allowed ISOC to
 take an active role in shaping Internet infrastructure. In
relinquishing its control over PIR, ISOC would lose its ability to
directly impact how millions of people around the world positively
experience the Internet every day, and we think that is a great pity.</i></span></span></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i>We
 understand that Ethos Capital approached ISOC with an offer in
September 2019 and that an agreement had been reached to sell PIR by
November 2019. This secret process caught us, and everyone, unaware, not
 just of the transaction but of the urgency to divest of PIR. </i></span></span></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div></span><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">We
 join ICANN in its 9 December 2019 letter calling for ISOC to be more
transparent about the proposed sale of PIR. We ask that ISOC commit to
publishing on its website all correspondence and documents exchanged
with ICANN in relation to the proposed change in control of PIR. In
addition, we ask that ISOC commit to publishing on its website any
filings (including motions and petitions) in the Pennsylvania Orphans'
Court relating to the change in status of the PIR.</span></i></span></span></span><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)"></span></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">We
 expect an organization that operates in the public interest, and who
promotes the values of openness, trust, and transparency, to be open and
 transparent about major decisions. </span></i></span></span></span><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)"></span></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">This is a major decision </span><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">that
 will result in a significant change, for ISOC and for the Internet
community, and it has been proposed a) without a human rights impact
assessment being conducted, b) without consultation with impacted
stakeholders, and c) without appropriate safeguards in place to protect
the interests of .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG registrants and the people who
visit their websites every day. </span></span></i></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-variant-caps:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">ISOC
 has successfully stewarded .ORG via PIR for 17 years, gaining a
reputation as a careful manager of a resource that truly is the global
home for nonprofits and the noncommercial community. Given this
background, and ISOC’s stated commitments to transparency and openness,
we are unable to reconcile the path that you have taken with the values
we thought ISOC espoused. </span></span><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">Accordingly,
 we call upon ISOC to withdraw from its negotiations with Ethos Capital,
 to withdraw from selling PIR, and to honor its charter.</span></i></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><br></div><div><div><br></div></div></div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div><div><br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr">On Wed, 11 Dec 2019 at 07:01, parminder <<a href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net" target="_blank">parminder@itforchange.net</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><p><span style="font-family:Verdana">agree, parminder </span><br></p><div>On 10/12/19 9:10 PM, Imran Ahmed Shah
      wrote:<br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div style="font-family:"Helvetica Neue",Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><div>Thanks Ayden, I support the additional lines, these are
          important and necessary... <br></div><div><br></div><div>Regards <br></div><div><br></div><div>Imran <br></div><div><br></div><div><div style="font-family:"Helvetica Neue",Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:rgb(38,40,42)"><div>On Tuesday, 10 December 2019, 19:59:47 GMT+5, Ayden
              Férdeline <a href="mailto:ayden@ferdeline.com" target="_blank"><ayden@ferdeline.com></a> wrote:<br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div><div>Dear all,<br></div><div><br></div><div>In response to comments in this thread and new
                    developments today, I have proposed some further
                    edits to the statement that we could potentially
                    send to the ISOC Board. Please find below. Note that
                    key changes are in red. Thanks!<br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div>Ayden Férdeline <br></div><div>--<br></div><div><br></div></div></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i>To:    Gonzalo
                                Camarillo, Chair of the Board of
                                Trustees, Internet Society</i></span></span></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">As members
                                of a network which encompasses many
                                non-commercial organizations and
                                individuals, we are concerned by the
                                announcement that Ethos Capital </span></span><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">intends to
                              acquire</span><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"> the assets of the Public Interest
                                Registry (PIR) from the Internet Society
                                (ISOC), including the .ORG, .NGO, and
                                .ONG Registry Agreements. We ask that
                                this sale be called off. </span></span></i></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i>Principally, we
                                are concerned that the sale of PIR to a
                                private entity investment firm will
                                significantly alter the Domain Name
                                System and weaken ISOC. PIR played an
                                important role, as the only remaining
                                non-commercial top-level domain registry
                                operator, in serving as a counterbalance
                                against commercial exploitation. PIR ran
                                .ORG, .NGO, and .ONG for the benefit of
                                its users, whereas other top-level
                                domains are run by private companies
                                with purely financial objectives. While
                                the interests of companies and users do
                                at times overlap, they can also
                                conflict, and when this occurs there are
                                significant human rights implications.
                                PIR, as a subsidiary of ISOC, could be
                                relied upon to do what was best for
                                domain name registrants, and has a proud
                                history of doing just that. However, PIR
                                also gave ISOC legitimacy and influence.
                                It allowed ISOC to take an active role
                                in shaping Internet infrastructure. In
                                relinquishing its control over PIR, ISOC
                                would lose its ability to directly
                                impact how millions of people around the
                                world positively experience the Internet
                                every day, and we think that is a great
                                pity.</i></span></span></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i>We understand
                                that Ethos Capital approached ISOC with
                                an offer in September 2019 and that an
                                agreement had been reached to sell PIR
                                by November 2019. This secret process
                                caught us, and everyone, unaware, not
                                just of the transaction but of the
                                urgency to divest of PIR. </i></span></span></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">We join
                              ICANN in its 9 December 2019 letter
                              calling for ISOC to be more transparent
                              about the proposed sale of PIR. We ask
                              that ISOC commit to publishing on its
                              website all correspondence and documents
                              exchanged with ICANN in relation to the
                              proposed change in control of PIR. In
                              addition, we ask that ISOC commit to
                              publishing on its website any filings
                              (including motions and petitions) in the
                              Pennsylvania Orphans' Court relating to
                              the change in status of the PIR.</span></i></span></span></span><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)"></span></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">We expect
                              an organization that operates in the
                              public interest, and who promotes the
                              values of openness, trust, and
                              transparency, to be open and transparent
                              about major decisions. </span></i></span></span></span><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)"></span></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">This is a
                              major decision </span><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">that will
                                result in a significant change, for ISOC
                                and for the Internet community, and it
                                has been proposed a) without a human
                                rights impact assessment being
                                conducted, b) without consultation with
                                impacted stakeholders, and c) without
                                appropriate safeguards in place to
                                protect the interests of .ORG, .NGO, and
                                .ONG registrants and the people who
                                visit their websites every day. </span></span></i></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><i></i><br></div><p dir="ltr" style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none;line-height:1.38;margin-top:0pt;margin-bottom:0pt"><span style="background-color:transparent"><span style="font-family:Arial"><span style="font-size:11pt"><i><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)">ISOC has
                                successfully stewarded .ORG via PIR for
                                17 years, gaining a reputation as a
                                careful manager of a resource that truly
                                is the global home for nonprofits and
                                the noncommercial community. Given this
                                background, and ISOC’s stated
                                commitments to transparency and
                                openness, we are unable to reconcile the
                                path that you have taken with the values
                                we thought ISOC espoused. </span></span><span style="color:rgb(237,65,57)">Accordingly,
                              we call upon ISOC to withdraw from its
                              negotiations with Ethos Capital, to
                              withdraw from selling PIR, and to honor
                              its charter.</span></i></span></span></span><i></i><br></p><div><br></div><div><div><br></div></div><div><br></div><div>‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐<br></div><div><div>On Monday, December 9, 2019 2:29 PM, parminder <a href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net" target="_blank"><parminder@itforchange.net></a> wrote:<br></div><div><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><p><span style="font-family:Verdana">Thanks
                          Imran, very useful..</span><br></p><p><span style="font-family:Verdana">So a
                          community asset given to ISOC for free, nay
                          with a $ 5 million subsidy, for safe keeping
                          and management on behalf of the community is
                          suddenly declared by ISOC to just be a sterile
                          financial asset -- with no community
                          implications whatsoever -- that it is selling
                          off to a newly formed for profit entity in
                          order to maintain and augment its funding. And
                          we are supposed to stay quiet or just applaud
                          ISOC's financial astuteness.... </span><br></p><p><span style="font-family:Verdana">It cannot
                          get more absurd that this..</span><br></p><p><span style="font-family:Verdana">parminder </span><br></p><div>On
                        09/12/19 12:19 PM, Imran Ahmed Shah wrote:<br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div style="font-family:"Helvetica Neue",Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px"><div dir="ltr">Hi Parminder,<br></div><div dir="ltr">There were 11 bidders. ICANN
                            evaluated 11 proposals when VeriSign was
                            leaving in 2002.<br></div><div dir="ltr">At that time, the bidding
                            criteria was different, the bidders were
                            quoting their quality of services, as there
                            was objections on VeriSign Support.
                            Secondly, bidders were offering the cost of
                            their fee for services per domain
                            (registration and/or renewal). ISOC was not
                            the lowest bidder.<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">No, ISOC/PIR did not have to
                            pay anything. In compensation from ICANN,
                            VeriSign given seed money (<span>Endowment</span>)
                            to ISOC/PIR for capacity building and
                            Registry handling and support <span> 2.6
                              million domain names</span>. <br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">Regards<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div><div dir="ltr">Imran Ahmed Shah<br></div><div dir="ltr"><br></div></div><div><div style="font-family:"Helvetica Neue",Helvetica,Arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px;color:rgb(38,40,42)"><div>On Monday, 9 December 2019, 09:44:57
                              GMT+5, parminder <a shape="rect" href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><parminder@itforchange.net></a> wrote:<br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div><p><span style="font-family:Verdana">From
                                      those who know I request response
                                      to this question:</span><br></p><p><span style="font-family:Verdana">Was
                                      ISOC given the .org registry as a
                                      result of an auction (apart from
                                      other evaluation criteria) or not,
                                      meaning did ISOC pay anything, and
                                      if so how much?</span><br></p><p><span style="font-family:Verdana">Thanks</span><br></p><p><span style="font-family:Verdana">parminder </span><br></p><div><div>On 09/12/19 3:27 AM, Ayden
                                      Férdeline wrote:<br></div><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote></div></div><div><div><div>Indeed John, this criteria is
                                      interesting, particularly number
                                      6, which I have pasted below. I do
                                      not believe Ethos Capital has a
                                      "level of support for the proposal
                                      from .ORG registrants," but the
                                      Internet Society did, and that is
                                      why .ORG was assigned to them over
                                      other bidders.<br></div><div><br></div><p style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none solid currentcolor"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><b><i>6.
                                              Level of support for the
                                              proposal from .org
                                              registrants.</i></b></span></span><br></p><p style="font-style:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;text-decoration:none solid currentcolor"><span style="color:rgb(0,0,0)"><span style="font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><i>Demonstrated
                                            support among registrants in
                                            the .org TLD, particularly
                                            those actually using .org
                                            domain names for
                                            noncommercial purposes, will
                                            be a factor in evaluation of
                                            the proposals. Noncommercial
                                            registrants do not have
                                            uniform views about policy
                                            and management, and no
                                            single organization can
                                            fully encompass the
                                            diversity of global civil
                                            society. There will likely
                                            be significant difficulties
                                            in ascertaining the level of
                                            support for particular .org
                                            proposals from throughout
                                            the .org registrants and
                                            noncommercial community.
                                            Nevertheless, proposals to
                                            operate the .org TLD should
                                            provide available evidence
                                            of support from across the
                                            global Internet community.</i></span></span><br></p><div><br></div><div>Best wishes,<br></div><div><br></div><div><div><div>Ayden Férdeline <br></div></div><div><br></div></div><div><br></div><div>‐‐‐‐‐‐‐ Original Message
                                      ‐‐‐‐‐‐‐<br></div><div>On Sunday, December 8, 2019
                                      10:49 PM, Sylvain Baya <a shape="rect" href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"><governance@lists.riseup.net></a> wrote:<br></div><div><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div><div>Hi all,<br></div><div><br></div><div><div dir="ltr">Le dim. 8
                                              déc. 2019 9:19 PM, John
                                              Levine <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:icggov@johnlevine.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">icggov@johnlevine.com</a>>
                                              a écrit :<br></div><blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div>In article <<a shape="rect" href="mailto:CAJjTEvFXJ%2BZLsdLwYF2vMkChKizoZ9RKN7p%2BO_Bj52yiAn858g@mail.gmail.com" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">CAJjTEvFXJ+ZLsdLwYF2vMkChKizoZ9RKN7p+O_Bj52yiAn858g@mail.gmail.com</a>>
                                                you write:<br></div><div><br></div><div>><hxxps://<a shape="rect" href="http://www.icann.org/news/icann-pr-2001-03-01-en" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">www.icann.org/news/icann-pr-2001-03-01-en</a>><br></div><div><br></div><div>It might be more
                                                useful to refer to the
                                                criteria used to
                                                evaluate<br></div><div>the .org proposals
                                                and decide who got the
                                                registry:<br></div></blockquote></div></div><div><br></div><div>Dear John,<br></div><div>...have you used it
                                          yourselves ?<br></div><div><br></div><div><div><blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><a shape="rect" href="https://archive.icann.org/en/tlds/org/criteria.htm" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">https://archive.icann.org/en/tlds/org/criteria.htm</a><br></blockquote></div></div><div><br></div><div>...for sure, these criteria
                                          are interesting ; but let me
                                          know if there is a specific
                                          criterion which contains,
                                          explicitely, the key words : *<i><b><u>By</u></b> and <u><b>For</b></u></i>*
                                          ?<br></div><div><br></div><div>Thanks.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Shalom,<br></div><div>--sb.<br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div><blockquote style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div>R's,<br></div><div>John<br></div></blockquote></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div><br></div><pre>---
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