<div><div dir="auto">E-citizenship doesnt give you a passport to travel. The only solution is to get rid of the concept of nation states and treat people as people and not clans. </div></div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sat, Sep 7, 2019 at 2:23 PM Bill Woodcock <<a href="mailto:woody@pch.net">woody@pch.net</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto">Estonian E-citizenships, perhaps?<div><br></div><div>Doesn’t solve the problem, but it’s a work-around. </div></div><div dir="auto"><div><br><div id="m_8599093414473599908AppleMailSignature" dir="ltr"> <div> -Bill</div><div><br></div></div><div dir="ltr"><br>On Sep 6, 2019, at 01:52, Michael J. Oghia (via governance Mailing List) <<a href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net" target="_blank">governance@lists.riseup.net</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr">Hi Ian,<div><br></div><div>Thanks so much for this thoughtful response, and indeed, I sent it in frustration. I realise, however, that this issue goes way beyond the IGF. Moreover, since a member of the Chinese government is a member of the MAG, I seriously doubt the MAG would even be open to discussing it. </div><div><br></div><div>The point you raise about stateless individuals is an interesting one, though, as I don't know what the protocol is for that. Taiwan nationals clearly aren't stateless, though, so those are two separate points (regardless, I still recommend the IGF develop a procedure for including stateless individuals/groups). </div><div><br></div><div>It seems this is an injustice that will have to pursue, and she can attend remotely if interested. </div><div><br clear="all"><div><div dir="ltr" class="m_8599093414473599908gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Best,<br>-Michael</font><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 10:46 AM <a href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com" target="_blank">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a> <<a href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com" target="_blank">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><div>I wish there was an easy answer to this Michael.</div><div><br></div><div>But as I understand it, we are dealing with a whole-of-UN problem, not just an IGF one. For whatever historic reasons, and they are to do with recognition of the Peoples Republic of China, Taiwan is not recognised by the UN as a nation state - although they would like to be and have a few allies pushing their cause.</div><div><br></div><div>I believe it goes back to 1971. China's attitude has been "<span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">The </span><b style="font-size:12pt;color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">United Nations</b><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> is an international organization composed of sovereign states.</span><b style="font-size:12pt;color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">Taiwan</b><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> as a province of China is completely </span><b style="font-size:12pt;color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">not</b><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> qualified and </span><b style="font-size:12pt;color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">has no</b><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> right to participate in it. Due to the well-known reasons, the </span><b style="font-size:12pt;color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">Taiwan</b><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> authorities illegally usurped China's </span><b style="font-size:12pt;color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)">UN</b><span style="color:rgb(34,34,34);font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-variant-ligatures:normal;background-color:rgb(255,255,255)"> seat for as long as 22 years" (</span><a href="http://ae.china-embassy.org/eng/zt/twwt/t150866.htm" style="font-size:12pt" target="_blank">http://ae.china-embassy.org/eng/zt/twwt/t150866.htm</a>)</div><div><br></div><div>But having said that - others might be able to provide more background - since IGF is not a meeting of nation states, but also includes civil society and other stakeholders, one would think there might be a way around it. Yes, to register one needs a passport - maybe an ally of Taiwan would be prepared to issue passports or acceptab;e documents for Taiwanese citizens? </div><div><br></div><div>I don't know how we could get around this, just brainstorming. In an ideal IGF, stateless people would have a voice and be able to attend, subject of course to standard security clearances. Maybe MAG could explore this?</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Ian Peter</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div>
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<div>------ Original Message ------</div>
<div>From: "Michael J. Oghia" <<a href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net" target="_blank">governance@lists.riseup.net</a>></div>
<div>To: "IGC" <<a href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net" target="_blank">governance@lists.riseup.net</a>></div>
<div>Sent: 6/09/2019 5:49:07 PM</div>
<div>Subject: [governance] Taiwanese nationals and the IGF</div><div><br></div>
<div id="m_8599093414473599908gmail-m_-254481492970552158x96a8f389e137400"><blockquote cite="http://CAMCMt7rZd1SAz+Cf7dCbx0-e5gXjhrQLPB+WNANsnVxFNby9bA@mail.gmail.com" type="cite" class="m_8599093414473599908gmail-m_-254481492970552158cite2">
<div dir="ltr">Hi everyone,<div><br></div><div>I'd like to raise a serious concern I have regarding the IGF. A contact of mine in Taiwan is having trouble registering for the IGF. She solely has a Taiwanese passport, but the IGF, as a UN event, can only register individuals who have a passport from a UN member state (of which Taiwan is not a member). I checked with the IGF Secretariat, and unfortunately, there's not much they can do about it.</div><div><br></div><div><div>I know that the politics surrounding China and Taiwan are contentious, however, this essentially means that she (and anyone else) from Taiwan – more than 23.5 million people – are essentially barred from attending the IGF if they don't have another passport. </div><div><br></div><div>I find this <u><b>deeply problematic</b></u> and in violation of the fundamental principles of the multi-stakeholder model, namely the fact that it's meant to be inclusive and open to all.</div><div><br></div><div>Has anyone encountered this problem in the past, either in the IG sector or another development sector? Does anyone have ideas for how it can be resolved? I'm well aware this is not the first instance of a Taiwanese national being excluded from participation in a global event, so perhaps this is a moot point and no one can help. Still, it still strikes me as incredibly unjust and unfair that regional politics would prevent individuals from attending the IGF. </div><div><br></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Best,</span><br></div></div><div><div><div dir="ltr" class="m_8599093414473599908gmail-m_-254481492970552158gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">-Michael</font><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">__________________</font></div><div dir="ltr"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br></font></div><div dir="ltr"><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Michael J. Oghia | </font><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Advocacy & Engagement Manager </span></div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Global Forum for Media Development (</span><a href="https://gfmd.info" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" target="_blank">GFMD</a><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">)</span><br></div></div><div dir="ltr"><div><font size="2" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Belgrade, Serbia | </font><font color="#0000ff" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><a href="https://www.twitter.com/MikeOghia" target="_blank">Twitter</a></font><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> </span><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">|</span><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> </span><font color="#0000ff" style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><a href="https://www.linkedin.com/in/mikeoghia" target="_blank">LinkedIn</a></font><br></div></div></div></div>
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</blockquote></div></div>-- <br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><font face="verdana, sans-serif">Farzaneh </font></div></div></div>