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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 19/07/19 5:48 PM, Salanieta T.
Tamanikaiwaimaro wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAJwbTiCxo2swhfy0wk-0AZzE8HKjxfasP11SbBbhkKoWbrmMHA@mail.gmail.com">
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
<div dir="auto">
<div>Comments are inline:<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, 19 Jul 2019, 12:10
pm Akinremi Peter Taiwo, <<a
href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net"
moz-do-not-send="true">governance@lists.riseup.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">I can't agree more with Parminder points
that IGC is not measured by website presence but of
substance. Making IGC to have substance should be our
main priority. Currently, we have <b><font size="4">665</font></b>
subscribers on the riseup mailing list, but not up to 10
names shows up frequently on the list. Safe me the
question of "how", migrated members please. </div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
<div dir="auto"><br>
</div>
<div dir="auto">It is the right of members to not comment or
lurk. Only those that voted in the last elections can vote on
amendments to the charter. In other words the distinction is
who can vote. People can lurk but vote.</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>Just to add in case the readers are not clear from the above;</p>
<p>Only those who voted last time can vote for charter amendments.</p>
<p>All members who have been members for more than 2 months can vote
for co-coordinator election.</p>
<p>parminder <br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAJwbTiCxo2swhfy0wk-0AZzE8HKjxfasP11SbBbhkKoWbrmMHA@mail.gmail.com">
<div dir="auto">
<div dir="auto">
<div class="gmail_quote">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Maybe, we need to start asking ourselves valid
questions as to whether others are not participating.
To get us to speed, I'll suggest, if visible, that the
coordinators reach out to the subscribers to confirm
their interest and active participation. Or a kind of
roll call that confirm members' presence. And BB
member, if willing to be added to build a functioning
and active list before any election. With that, the
substance as mentioned by Parminder can be seen and
restored. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>Regards.</div>
<div>Peter</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Fri, Jul 19, 2019
at 5:04 AM parminder <<a
href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">parminder@itforchange.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<p><font face="Verdana">There is going to be no
fancy 'leadership group'</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">No one has mentioned its
need, justification, etc.</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">I dont mind Arsene and Bruno
to continue till elections, and they should. <br>
</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">Sala, you were the greatest
proponent for early even intimidate elections.
Now, you agree with Ian below that no "immediate
coco election" "seems to be he most supported
option"? Anyway...</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">If elections are due, they
should take place. <br>
</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">If they are postponed, clear
reasons may be described and action be taken as
per.... Charter amendment is out from such a
list of reasons... Website work is independent
and nothing to do with elections (although
remember IGC was never much about a great
website, it needs to first gets its 'substance'
right which is nearly at about 'zero' right now,
but new things are always welcome, pl go ahead.
But let not the website volunteer list become
anything else meanwhile).</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">Are elections therefore
being postponed bec BB members (that are not
already in the IGC) need to be able to get to
vote (although no one has really explained why
that such a tearing hurry to vote for what
everyone agrees is likely a pretty small number,
but anyway)? Pl be clear and specific in
response -- both, the cocos, and those from BB
who know about this matter. election
postponement is a big thing. Thanks. <br>
</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">Let us clearly be told why
elections are being postponed... If the above BB
issue, then we want clarity on; is BB closure
and folding into the IGC decided, when would the
non IGC members enrol in the IGC, any time lines
etc for that..</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">That alone is the clear
issue in front of us, related to coco elections.
So please convey clarity to the IGC membership
asap on this matter, and I request cocos special
attention to this</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">Thanks and regards</font></p>
<p><font face="Verdana">parminder</font></p>
<p><br>
</p>
<div
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501moz-cite-prefix">On
19/07/19 4:37 AM, "Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro"
(via governance Mailing List) wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="auto">Ditto everything that Ian said.</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, 18 Jul
2019, 11:49 pm <a
href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a>,
<<a href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com"
target="_blank" rel="noreferrer"
moz-do-not-send="true">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div>Well its good to see so many people who
care about the future of a credible voice
for civil society in the internet
governance field, even if there are big
differences as regards how to revive
things in this space!</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>If I may summarise:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>1. IGC Charter revisions are not
urgent. They should be discussed down the
track after a credible web presence and
leadership structure have been restored.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>2. We have offers of assistance
(including Farzeneh and Jeremy) regards
website restoration. There is no reason
why this cannot take place now with a
small group reporting back here. (see
separate topic)</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>3. Regarding leadership. Many strong
voices argue for coco election now, others
suggest a delay of a couple of months
until other matters are in place. I am not
convinced either way - do we have a
membership list, for instance, which is
necessary for elections? If not, there
seems to be no choice but to delay. And if
there is one election now, there will also
be another one in less than six months
when Bruna's term expires. So an argument
to do both together in a few months is
reasonable perhaps. I will be happy for
whatever outcome the call suggests for
this, BUT::::::</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>If there is not an immediate coco
election, which seems to be the most
supported option, I believe it is
essential; we agree to an interim
leadership group until it is practical to
hold such elections. Apart from Bruna,
capable names like Sheeta and Farzeneh
have been mentioned. Such an interim group
is absolutely necessary, I believe, if the
group decides on the call not to proceed
immediately with coco elections.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>So I am happy whichever way the call
determines on this one: but I am not happy
for there to be no action at all to
resolve this issue. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Ian Peter</div>
<div> -</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>------ Original Message ------</div>
<div>From: "Sheetal Kumar" <<a
href="mailto:sheetal@gp-digital.org"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">sheetal@gp-digital.org</a>></div>
<div>To: "parminder" <<a
href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">parminder@itforchange.net</a>></div>
<div>Cc: "Mueller, Milton L" <<a
href="mailto:milton@gatech.edu"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">milton@gatech.edu</a>>;
"Nnenna Nwakanma" <<a
href="mailto:nnenna75@gmail.com"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">nnenna75@gmail.com</a>>;
"governance" <<a
href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">governance@lists.riseup.net</a>></div>
<div>Sent: 18/07/2019 7:43:41 PM</div>
<div>Subject: Re: [governance] Reviving IGC:
Merging Bestbits in, IGF Day zero event
and other subjects</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
id="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335xd87615d367764f6">
<blockquote
cite="http://CAK78muQeWtYVFxB8z74BnYkM91w8Q0=fq4=Zv-ZaqMZ7j4QKDg@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite"
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335cite2">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Dear Parminder, all, <br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>As you and others have pointed
out, the conversation about closing
Bestbits and requesting any members
there who are not already on IGC to
join IGC (aka 'merger' to some) has
been ongoing for months. The
information has been continually
shared on both this list/among this
community and on the Bestbits list.
Anyway, we could have done more to
reach out to key people and
communicated things more clearly
perhaps. That's something I've
learned. We did try but we can
always do more to communicate
better. <br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>There are just a few things which
Parminder you've asked clarity on,
and what follows is my reading of
things as someone who has been part
of the relevant discussions from the
beginning so I do hope I'm not
misrepresenting anything. As
Farzaneh was doing earlier, I think
it's worth identifying what we agree
on and then work through what we
disagree on.<br>
</div>
<div>
<p><i> If there is anything more? If
so, everyone involved, please
state it out here, explicitly,
on the IGC's primary working
space. Why are we going in so
many circles about it?</i></p>
<p><i> </i></p>
<p><i>What process is being
disregarded, the one about
which yesterday Arsene reported
that it was decided that
elections will be held after (1)
the IGC charter is amended (and
I have been asking what is this,
who triggered this demand, with
what objectives, what
justifications, and so on, and
people simply refuse to answer),
and (2) when their is a combined
list (sorry, IGC is not a list,
one has to individually take its
membership with an explicit
individual-based process, there
is no merging or combining lists
here) .</i></p>
<p>All that has been discussed, on
both IGC and Bestbits lists,
including by active, long-standing
and even founding members of both,
has been how to reinvigorate civil
society coordination. It was
agreed by those taking part in
these discussions which have been
open to everyone from the start
(there is a whole archive of the
discussions that have been
continually shared on here and on
Bestbits, including <a
href="https://etherpad.wikimedia.org/p/Bestbitscallfuture"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">in the
etherpad here</a>), that the
existence of both Bestbits and IGC
wasn't helping so Bestbits should
close. As we are all sticklers for
process (a good thing, in my
opinion), this could not simply be
a matter of closing the list and
telling everyone to move off onto
another (IGC) if they weren't
already members. As I mentioned
before, Bestbits was more than a
list too. Instead, we had
conversations about it, that
lasted months. Some people even
wanted to create a new group. We
decided not to. Among some
suggestions that came out of these
conversations was the opportunity
to revise the IGC charter.
Founding IGC members were part of
this discussion, nothing, and I
repeat, nothing was decided or
agreed in that regard. Indeed it
would be bizarre for that to
happen. Any such process would
have to respect the IGC charter
and involve all members. Of
course. Anything that has been
shared which says otherwise are
simply unfortunate
misunderstandings, and we should
move on. There are no reverse
takeovers taking place, no desire
to rip apart the Charter. Respect
for process is key. There is no
self-appointed leadership from
what I can see, just people trying
to steer things towards more unity
and less fracture. <br>
</p>
<p><i> Any newcomer needs just 2
months of membership to vote..
No one really is insisting that
we hold elections like today .
But this certainly cannot be the
reason for a process that you /
Sheetal are saying has been on
for more than 6 months now.
That would be so very
illogical, no..... Is just the
issue of eligibility for voting
stopping the process, but why
labour it over 7 months when it
needs just 2 months cooling
period? -- Although it does make
me wonder, and I repeat, why
such a strong focus on the
coordinator election!! IGC is
much more than that... Why such
insistence!!? What does one read
into it. <br>
</i></p>
<p>It may seem bizarre, but
honestly, it just took ages for
those in the discussions which
have been open to everyone since
the beginning to decide to close
Bestbits as a 'solution' to a lack
of civil society coordination.
There were other proposals like I
said, including setting up a new
group. So here we are. 7 months
later, with agreement to close
Bestbits and not create a new list
or do something else. IGC is more
than a list, sure, but because
leadership is I guess key to
reinvigorating things, elections
are seen as a way to start.<br>
</p>
<p>Also, others have asked 'how many
people are on Bestbits' that are
not on IGC? Honestly, I don't
know. Maybe its 2, maybe its 20.
My reasoning is that even if one
or two of those people join and
have the energy and commitment to
run for elections and coordinate
going forward, we should wait for
them to join. Do we have much to
lose? David and Jeanette have
pointed out that we could wait for
an indefinite period of time and
it would just be a for a handful
of people to join. That is true,
so we could undertake an exercise
comparing who is not on both lists
and reach out to them directly.
Alternatively, we are planning to
have a call in w/c August 05 (I
will send the details soon) and we
can collectively set a date then
for the closure of Bestbits,
requesting those not already on
IGC to join. And then we'll be all
having this conversation on this
list, including new members. Once
new BB members have joined (even
if its just 2-3 people) we can
then decide whether to hold
elections right away or wait 2
months. Maybe everyone will want
to just hold elections right away,
including the handful of new
members. Or maybe they'll want to
wait. Also, we can discuss the day
0 event together. If we don't do
the closure properly then we risk
relevant and interested people
losing out on the opportunity to
discuss these things. <br>
</p>
<p>So, can we agree that we set a
date and time by which members of
Bestbits who are not members of
IGC join IGC and then we set an
agenda, and have a conversation
about when to hold elections etc
etc?<br>
</p>
<p>Also, btw the day 0 event is from
16h00-18h00 in Room X. </p>
<p>Best</p>
<p>Sheetal<br>
</p>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On
Thu, 18 Jul 2019 at 09:35, parminder
<<a
href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">parminder@itforchange.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0px 0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<p><br>
</p>
<div
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335gmail-m_-1839724901850448854moz-cite-prefix">On
17/07/19 11:02 PM, Mueller,
Milton L wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335cite">
What Sheetal says below is
correct in my opinion. We are in
fact trying to merge BB and IGC.
</blockquote>
<p>Only loosely speaking, formally
from IGC point of view, there is
no merging happening... Some new
people want to join IGC, and if
conditions are fulfilled they
are indeed welcome.</p>
<p> If there is anything more? If
so, everyone involved, please
state it out here, explicitly,
on the IGC's primary working
space. Why are we going in so
many circles about it?</p>
<p>Lately, two specific, and what
I consider minor, issues have
been stated. <br>
</p>
<p>1. Can enough time be given to
elections so that the new
members can go through their 2
month cooling period.... I said
that can be done, and there has
been no major opposition to it
(Although, frankly, if you ask
me, I really do not understand
why this hurry and absolute
insistence on voting right away
. That should not be such a big
thing. Cooling periods are there
for a reason. People who havent
ever been on the IGC need to
observe, see and know and mingle
before insisting on some
absolute rights to vote for
their choice of coordinator. So,
why, really this insistence ?
What is the plan? But anyway, I
really said I am fine either
way.)<br>
</p>
<p>2. What to do with BB's web
archives, and again there is not
much problem with it. Whenever
we have a working IGC website,
we can put them somewhere on it,
no problem.</p>
<p>What else? Is there anything
more? Why dont people tell us
clearly, rather than going in
circles and creating so much
confusion. <br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335cite">We
are trying to create a more
unified civil society presence.
We don’t do that by throwing up
procedural walls around this
group.</blockquote>
<p>Can you be explicit? what
procedural walls are blocking BB
people -- other than those who
already are there-- from joining
IGC, ?<br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335cite">
Face facts, IGC needs the people
from BB just as much as they
need us. It is destructive, as
Sheetal says, to disregard the
process we have been going
through to bring things back
together. </blockquote>
<p>What process is being
disregarded, the one about
which yesterday Arsene reported
that it was decided that
elections will be held after (1)
the IGC charter is amended (and
I have been asking what is this,
who triggered this demand, with
what objectives, what
justifications, and so on, and
people simply refuse to answer),
and (2) when their is a combined
list (sorry, IGC is not a list,
one has to individually take its
membership with an explicit
individual-based process, there
is no merging or combining lists
here) .</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335cite"> I
hope I don’t need to remind
people why a significant chunk
of civil society broke off from
IGC to begin with - but it looks
like certain actors are doing
the reminding for me. </blockquote>
<p>Sure, Milton, since you are now
going towards a confrontational
abyss, please do remind us.
(Btw, I was among the founding
members of BB, and I remember
you werent around that much in
those discussions). In fact any
coming back of BB member to IGC
-- if you really think so
--should perhaps be helped by
visiting the original conditions
of why they went away and so
on... We are capable of an adult
conversation here, and should
not be afraid. Important public
facts are always good to know
and discuss. And then one may
also discuss what happened with
BB, whether they were able to
achieve the objectives they set
themselves for, if not, why, and
what are the reasons of BB's
dissolution and coming back to
an IGC, which admittedly is far
weaker and lost now than when
they left it. <br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335cite">
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It is exclusionary to
hold elections now, before
the newcomers can vote. Can
someone tell me what
positive goal is achieved by
doing that? Can someone tell
me what is lost if we don’t
hold elections? </div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>Any newcomer needs just 2
months of membership to vote..
No one really is insisting that
we hold elections like today .
But this certainly cannot be the
reason for a process that you /
Sheetal are saying has been on
for more than 6 months now.
That would be so very
illogical, no..... Is just the
issue of eligibility for voting
stopping the process, but why
labour it over 7 months when it
needs just 2 months cooling
period? -- Although it does make
me wonder, and I repeat, why
such a strong focus on the
coordinator election!! IGC is
much more than that... Why such
insistence!!? What does one read
into it. <br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335cite">
<div>
<div>Do some people like for
IGC to be a small and
hostile place where they can
be a big fish in a small
pond? I hope not. <br>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>(Just to match) Or are some
people planning to make IGC
their private pond. I hope not.
<br>
</p>
<p><br>
</p>
<p>parminder <br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite"
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335cite">
<div>
<div><br>
<div
id="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335gmail-m_-1839724901850448854AppleMailSignature"
dir="ltr">Milton L Mueller
<div>Professor, School of
Public Policy</div>
<div>Georgia Institute of
Technology</div>
</div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
On Jul 17, 2019, at 14:07,
Sheetal Kumar <<a
href="mailto:sheetal@gp-digital.org"
rel="noreferrer
noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">sheetal@gp-digital.org</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>Dear all, <br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I agree that it
is easy to join IGC
if you sign up to
the Charter. It's
indeed pretty
straightforward.
However, what I
don't understand is
the disregard for a
process that has
been ongoing for
months, about a
large and until
recently active
splinter group of
IGC (namely,
Bestbits) which has
since agreed to
close and its
members who are not
already part of IGC
'join IGC'. Bestbits
was not just a
mailing list, it had
an active
membership, it had a
functioning website,
it had a steering
group, it used to
coordinate, and
more. It also had
its own membership
of the CSCG and used
to convene an event
before the global
IGF. And now it is
closing. Who knows
how many people who
have been part of
that discussion or
at least following
on Bestbits who are
not on IGC would
like to be part of
the IGC elections?
Whether its semantic
or not to call it a
'merger', the point
remains that this
has been a
discussion for a few
months that should,
IMHO, have an impact
on when to hold the
IGC elections. They
don't have to, but I
think it makes sense
for them to
considering the
history of IGC and
Bestbits (as a
splinter group of
IGC). Also, I'm not
saying this because
I want to run for
any elections
necessarily, I've
only ever been
interested a
discussion towards a
more impactful and
coordinated civil
society in this
space. It just seems
to make sense not to
disregard that
Bestbits discussion
and to take
decisions with the
Bestbits discussion
in mind (again,
because of the
history of the
connection between
Bestbits and IGC).<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I've looked at
the IGC Charter and
it says "Voting
process: Each person
who is subscribed to
the list at least
two (2) months
before the election
will be given a
voter account". <br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>So, even if
Bestbits members who
are not part of IGC
joined then they
couldn't vote right
away. Shouldn't we
wait for 2-3 months?
If there is a time
sensitive reason not
to, that would be
good to discuss.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>For clarity,
revising the IGC
charter was only
ever an idea, its
not been agreed to
anywhere by anyone.
It's just something
to discuss, further
down the line.
Perhaps.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Best</div>
<div>Sheetal<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr"
class="gmail_attr">On
Wed, 17 Jul 2019 at
12:40, Nnenna
Nwakanma <<a
href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net"
rel="noreferrer
noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">governance@lists.riseup.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0px
0px 0px
0.8ex;border-left:1px
solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>I think we
can pull off an
IGC elections
by Berlin IGF.<br>
</div>
Joining the IGC
from BB should
not be "a
process".<br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Once an
individual
decides that it
is worth it.. it
only takes a
click to accept
the charter and
be added to the
mailing list.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div>My 2 cents</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Nnenna<br>
</div>
</div>
<br>
<div
class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr"
class="gmail_attr">On
Wed, Jul 17,
2019 at 11:36 AM
Suresh
Ramasubramanian
<<a
href="mailto:suresh@hserus.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">suresh@hserus.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
class="gmail_quote"
style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid
rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div
lang="EN-IN">
<div
class="m_-411736984220130063gmail-m_-4966840308758334501m_6990595258997513335gmail-m_-1839724901850448854gmail-m_3561223288472794221gmail-m_-1884700876395715120WordSection1">
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span>Much
to my surprise
I agree with
Parminder. If
Bestbits is to
be wound up,
so be it.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span>After
which, those
from Bestbits
who wish to
caucus in the
IGC please
subscribe to
the list and
do so.</span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<p
class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
<div
style="border-color:rgb(181,196,223)
currentcolor
currentcolor;border-style:solid
none
none;border-width:1pt
medium
medium;padding:3pt
0cm 0cm">
<p
class="MsoNormal"><b>From:
</b><<a
href="mailto:governance-request@lists.riseup.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">governance-request@lists.riseup.net</a>>
on behalf of
parminder <<a
href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net" rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">parminder@itforchange.net</a>><br>
<b>Reply to: </b>parminder
<<a
href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">parminder@itforchange.net</a>><br>
<b>Date: </b>Wednesday,
17 July 2019
at 4:50 pm<br>
<b>To: </b>Arsène
Tungali <<a
href="mailto:arsenebaguma@gmail.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">arsenebaguma@gmail.com</a>>, Sheetal Kumar
<<a
href="mailto:sheetal@gp-digital.org"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">sheetal@gp-digital.org</a>><br>
<b>Cc: </b>"<a
href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer"
target="_blank"
moz-do-not-send="true">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a>" <<a
href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a>>,
"Salanieta T.
Tamanikaiwaimaro" <<a
href="mailto:salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com</a>>,
governance
<<a
href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net"
rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">governance@lists.riseup.net</a>><br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re:
[governance]
Reviving IGC:
Merging
Bestbits in,
IGF Day zero
event and
other subjects</p>
</div>
<div>
<p
class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p
class="MsoNormal">On
17/07/19 3:25
PM, Arsène
Tungali wrote:<br>
<br>
</p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<pre>Good point, Sheetal and I agree with you.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>I had briefly discussed the election issue with Bruna during the last</pre>
<pre>ICANN meeting and we agreed that the best time to conduct co-co</pre>
<pre>elections is right after the merger step is completed, the new charter</pre>
<pre>has been adopted and we have a unified list. I am sure Bruna was</pre>
<pre>planning to report this to the list at some point, but here you are.</pre>
</blockquote>
<p><span
style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">Arsene</span></p>
<p><span
style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">I
am not sure
what you mean
about a
unified
list...</span></p>
<p><span
style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">There
is a clear,
and rather
easy, way to
join the IGC,
and it is up
to to those in
Bestbits and
not already in
IGC to take
that route if
they want to.
Meanwhile we
do welcome all
civil society
members
adhering to
iGC's charter
(rather than
insisting for,
unclear and
unstated
reasons, to
modify it). </span></p>
<p><span
style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">And
there is
really no
merger
involved here,
even if people
loosely use
that language
.</span></p>
<p><span
style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">I
remain
astonished
about the
repeated talk
about a new
IGC charter,
especially as
an already
decided thing!
What exactly
are you
talking about.
</span></p>
<p><span
style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">And
I am further
pained for
you, being
still perhaps
an IGC
co-coordinator,
not at all
responding to
my clear email
about how this
elist is the
primary work
place for the
IGC, and also
an
ex-coordinator's
assent tp the
sentiment.</span></p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<pre> </pre>
<pre>I would suggest we all plan to attend the call and agree on next steps.</pre>
</blockquote>
<p><span
style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">You
can make
whatever calls
and agree on
whatever steps
you have you
may wish to --
that is no
part of IGC's
procedure, and
would have no
meaning or
consequence
for it.</span></p>
<p><span
style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">regards</span></p>
<p><span
style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif">parminder
</span></p>
<p> </p>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Regards,</pre>
<pre>Arsene</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>2019-07-17 11:44 UTC+02:00, Sheetal Kumar <a href="mailto:sheetal@gp-digital.org" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><sheetal@gp-digital.org></a>:</pre>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<pre>Dear all,</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>While the closure of Bestbits is an internal matter for Bestbits, we have</pre>
<pre>agreed for it to be closed and so I'd say any IGC conversations need to</pre>
<pre>take that into account. We're at that point where the closure has been</pre>
<pre>agreed but there are still people on Bestbits who are not on IGC but likely</pre>
<pre>will sign up to be part of the discussions soon.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>As such, shouldn't we wait for those from Bestbits who want to join to join</pre>
<pre>and we can then get the IGC coordinator elections going? The call to agree</pre>
<pre>next steps and make sure everyone is on the same page is going to be w/c</pre>
<pre>August 5.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Best</pre>
<pre>Sheetal</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>On Wed, 17 Jul 2019 at 06:29, <a href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a></pre>
<pre><a href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><ian.peter@ianpeter.com></a></pre>
<pre>wrote:</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<pre>Bruna,</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>On a more substantive matter -</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Can you also advise us on how progress is going as regards getting the</pre>
<pre>IGC</pre>
<pre>Coordinator elections (which were due last January) underway? On June 26</pre>
<pre>you advised the list that you. would be talking to Arsene and would get</pre>
<pre>back to the list ASAP. Do you have an update?</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Ian Peter</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>------ Original Message ------</pre>
<pre>From: "Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro" <a href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><governance@lists.riseup.net></a></pre>
<pre>To: "Parminder" <a href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><parminder@itforchange.net></a></pre>
<pre>Cc: "governance" <a href="mailto:governance@lists.riseup.net" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><governance@lists.riseup.net></a></pre>
<pre>Sent: 17/07/2019 2:14:13 PM</pre>
<pre>Subject: Re: [governance] Reviving IGC: Merging Bestbits in, IGF Day zero</pre>
<pre>event and other subjects</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Agree with Parminder.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>On Wed, 17 Jul 2019, 5:11 am parminder, <a href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net" rel="noreferrer noreferrer" target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true"><parminder@itforchange.net></a></pre>
<pre>wrote:</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<blockquote
style="margin-top:5pt;margin-bottom:5pt">
<pre>HI Bruna/ All</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Good morning to all!</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>Bestbits' merging into the IGC is their internal matter.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>As for a day zero event at the IGF for the IGC, when do you plan it...</pre>
<pre>Just Net Coalition has an event post lunch on day zero, and please</pre>
<pre>ensure</pre>
<pre>that these do not clash. Thanks.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>While as a secondary or adjunct method call based discussions can be</pre>
<pre>done</pre>
<pre>among however wishes to do so, the charter clearly says that the main</pre>
<pre>and</pre>
<pre>authoritative space of IGC's work will be this e-list, which I request</pre>
<pre>everyone's attention to.</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>thanks and best regards</pre>
<pre> </pre>
<pre>parminder</pre>
<pre>On 17/07/19 7:32 AM, Bruna Martins dos Santos (via </pre>
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