<div dir="ltr">Mawaki<div><br></div><div>I think it time for the class to have a recess</div><div><br></div><div>Best</div><div><br></div><div>A.N</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Feb 4, 2017 at 7:10 AM, Mawaki Chango <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:kichango@gmail.com" target="_blank">kichango@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="auto">Dear Janvier, <div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">I promise this will be my last word on this topic. First, kudos to Arsène who just spoke like a wise man, albeit a young one. As a Co-coordinator he plays very well his role by seeking to moderate here. I'm just talking as an individual member, in no role endorsed or assigned by this community (except of course, the drafting of a half page statement, a 2 day assignment completed a couple of days ago.) So allow me to break it down to you squarely, in my personal capacity. </div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">1) This audience is full of people who are accustomed to reading and analysing written materials, even complex ones requiring contexts, including from people for whom English is not first language. We don't get stuck on some linguistic incorrections here or there, which do happen to all of us by the way, including English speaking people as first or only language. In most cases, readers here would assume the best or most plausible option for the intended meaning, taking into account the context (including our past experience with the speaker, if available.) So I am of the opinion that grammar does not explain anything here and no one (from the people who reacted against it) actually misunderstood your first email in this series. What does happen, though, is that our communications sometimes carry with them our blind spots or biases (these may be personal or cultural). The best among us try to acknowledge it when called out, but it's hard and that's human. </div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">2) If you develop 5 points in a communication, and 4 of them positive or rather merely confirming what your audience would expect from you, while your 5th point causes them serious concern, well, their first order of business will be to let you know about their concern. Are you really surprised here? Well, you shouldn't be. </div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">3) Arsène said this very clearly in that paragraph from his previous email where he referred to how you sounded in your first email. BTW, the subject line of that email reads: "Please Cameroon did not shut down the Internet !!!" (I cannot tell I have all the digital evidence to claim you personally wrote that subject line but your mail is the only one I've seen in the thread that explains such line.) So yes, your message was conveying a sense of acceptability of the shutdown because it is partial, because it targets "only" 2 regions out 8. This does not depend on a word that is misplaced in a sentence, or misspelled. (I'd even go as far as to say rather than your audience isolating and pouncing on one or two words from your message, which you claim we've done here, this is more like a holistic reading of your message. Please note that I myself have already given you some benefit of doubt by saying in a previous message that in that first email of yours you may have been carried away while feeling the urge to say something in order to make your country - your government actually - look less bad. But misinterpretation, there was not.) <span style="font-family:sans-serif">And that sense of acceptability you conveyed was the only thing needed to provoke the chain of reactions you've seen here about this.</span></div><div dir="auto"><span style="font-family:sans-serif"><br></span></div><div dir="auto">4) And last, as the saying goes, when you're in a hole (and you'd presumably want to get out of it), stop digging. The IGC only made a short and rather mild statement, addressed to the whole Chapter of Cameroon. For that modest statement to bother you so much that you'd write multiple emails trying to claim it is baseless or not warranted may be, just may be, telling something different from, and yet louder than, what you would want us to believe. Fortunately, your direct response to the statement (email with subject line: "Statement and clarifications of ISOC Cameroon on the Internet shutdowns in Cameroon") is on point and reassuring, and that's also the last word I'll take away from you, pointing toward positive prospects for ISOC Cameroon. </div><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Thank you and best of luck, </div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><div dir="auto"><br></div><div dir="auto">Mawaki </div></font></span><div><div class="h5"><br><div class="gmail_extra" dir="auto"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Feb 3, 2017 11:22 AM, "Arsène Tungali" <<a href="mailto:arsenebaguma@gmail.com" target="_blank">arsenebaguma@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="m_90528643507865412m_4051439533291934840m_-5484616689599700742m_894485062683441830quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div>Dear Janvier,<br><br></div>Thanks for your third email, trying to clarify the two previous ones. Actually, you don't need to justify yourself because when words are out, there is no way to take them back, especially in this context where they were written words which are kept in our archives. And trust me, i understand the language challenges you are facing, myself being a native French speaker. Sometimes, we are not able to fully express our minds in a different language :)<br><br></div>I do salute the amazing work ISOC Cameroon is doing under your leadesrhip since 2011 and most importantly the fact that you are in line with the vision and mission of ISOC global under which (i believe) the Chapter is operating (even if you are a registered not for profit in Cameroon). Especially the actions you are planning to implement in this particular situation with regards to the shutdown. And please do not forget to include (i know you have done these already) capacity building programs on issues such as digital rights targetting all stakeholders, as suggested on this list.<br><br></div>The over all discussion was based, in my humble opinion, on the fact that in your 1st email you sounded like someone who is trying by all means to tell this community that what's happening in Cameroon is not a terrible situation, only because it is just two regions out of 10 which are offline and that should not be considered as a disaster. And we should not speak up about that. Worse thing you signed your email as "ISOC Cameroon President", meaning you are speaking with that hat and in response to a call for support from another ISOC Cameroon member (i believe).<br><br>And everyone (most of us here) was in agreement that this was a terrible declaration because universal principles, especially in the context of civil society in the Internet governance sphere, state that even one person should not be left behind. And when it is just two regions, if we don't speak up, next might be 3 or the whole country being turned offline, which is what happened in so many other countries including the DRC (where i come from). That's why we, as a group, decided to make an official statement on this and I am glad, as a result, you came back and explained that we misunderstood you.<br><br></div>As a Cameroonian and an activist of open Internet (with a lot of experience), you should, in fact, consider this debate as a plus because now so many people are aware about what's going on in the country and how vulnerable the people affacted are. And whenever there is such a global awareness, we can expect good results in the future.<br><br></div>And finally, you didn't have to say that we (Mawaki, Norbert and myself) are not more human rights activists than you are. This is simply rude and was out of context. We all fight the same battle and there is no need to say this to anyone who is only trying to help your country fellows and your country to benefit from an open Internet.<br><br></div>I hope this debate will end here because it is no longer about you personally, dear Janvier, but about what we all fight for. I personally do wish the best to you and the people of Cameroon (where we have a lot of friends and colleagues) especially these regions which are facing social tensions and instability.<br><br></div>Best regards,<br></div>Arsene, IGC Coordinator<br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div class="m_90528643507865412m_4051439533291934840m_-5484616689599700742m_894485062683441830m_-2295174071238189386gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div>------------------------<br>*<b>Arsène Tungali</b>*<br></div>Co-Founder & Executive Director, <span><i><a href="http://www.rudiinternational.org" target="_blank">Rudi international</a></i>,</span><br>CEO,<i> <a href="http://www.smart-serv.info" target="_blank">Smart Services Sarl</a></i>, <i><a href="http://www.mabingwa-forum.com" target="_blank">Mabingwa Forum</a></i> <br>Tel: <a href="tel:+243%20993%20810%20967" value="+243993810967" target="_blank">+243 993810967</a><i><br></i></div><div>GPG: 523644A0<i><br></i></div><div><u>Goma, Democratic Republic of Congo</u><i><br><br></i></div><div><a href="http://tungali.blogspot.com/2015/06/selected-for-2015-mandela-washington.html" target="_blank">2015 Mandela Washington Felllow</a> (YALI) - ISOC Ambassador (IGF <a href="http://www.internetsociety.org/what-we-do/education-and-leadership-programmes/next-generation-leaders/igf-ambassadors-programme/Past-Ambassadors" target="_blank">Brazil</a> & <a href="http://www.internetsociety.org/what-we-do/education-and-leadership-programmes/next-generation-leaders/Current-Ambassadors" target="_blank">Mexico</a>) <font face="monospace,monospace">- <a href="http://afrisig.org/afrisig-2016/class-of-2016/" target="_blank">AFRISIG 2016</a> - </font><a href="http://tungali.blogspot.com" target="_blank">Blogger</a> - ICANN Fellow (<a href="https://www.icann.org/news/announcement-2014-07-18-en" target="_blank">Los Angeles</a> & <a href="https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/marrakech55-attendees-2016-03-14-en" target="_blank">Marrakech</a>).<i> </i>AFRINIC Fellow<i> </i>(<a href="http://www.afrinic.net/en/library/news/1907-afrinic-25-fellowship-winners" target="_blank">Mauritius</a>)<i> - </i><a href="http://www.igfsa.org/" target="_blank">IGFSA Member</a> -<i> </i><a href="http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/liza-bel/drc_b_8958150.html" target="_blank">The HuffingtonPost UK</a></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="m_90528643507865412m_4051439533291934840m_-5484616689599700742m_894485062683441830elided-text">2017-02-03 12:49 GMT+02:00 Janvier NGNOULAYE <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jnoulaye@gmail.com" target="_blank">jnoulaye@gmail.com</a>></span>:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class="m_90528643507865412m_4051439533291934840m_-5484616689599700742m_894485062683441830elided-text"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default"><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">Hi to All,</font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">I just note that many people have deliberately chosen some words from my last 2 mails and focused their arguments on its, and finally come out with their declaration.</font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">But, It would have been fair to analyse the full content of the 2 mails, and not to be focused on some single words taken out of their context. </font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">Thank to Coko Tracy who pointed out a mistake of language I made when I said "You are no more human rights activist than we are ......" reather than to say : "You are not more human rights activist than we are...." Next time I'll write everything in French. </font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4"><br></font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">I request every one to put on the table these two mails I sent and make a fair analyse sentence by sentence.</font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">My 1st mail was trying to describe what was happening on the ground,and at the end I suggested that the Chapter will work with the two partis to find out a better solution.</font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">The 2nd mail is in response to Arsène, Norbert and Mawaki where I come with the statement that they were not more human rights activist, or not more open internet activist than we are in ISOC Cameroon Chapter, for meaning that the Chapter is in line with the vision and mission of Internet Society on the ground. I found a partiality in their analysis and it is deplorable. For instance into my 2nd mail, I talked about sensitized and educated, for the better use of the Internet technologies and policies with the governement, and the local population. No one on this list points out this solution we raise and on which we are working now, to encourage or to advice us.</font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">Anyway, anyone is free to support or not any action we can make.</font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4"><br></font></div><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">Warm regards</font></div><span class="m_90528643507865412m_4051439533291934840m_-5484616689599700742m_894485062683441830m_-2295174071238189386HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><div class="gmail_default"><font size="4">Janvier Ngnoulaye</font></div></font></span></div><div><div class="m_90528643507865412m_4051439533291934840m_-5484616689599700742m_894485062683441830m_-2295174071238189386h5"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large"><br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote"><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div><div class="m_90528643507865412m_4051439533291934840m_-5484616689599700742m_894485062683441830m_-2295174071238189386m_6576365151077348481gmail-h5">
<br></div></div>
-------- Forwarded Message --------<br>
Subject: Re: [governance] Internet Shutdown: An IGC Statement to the ISOC Cameroon Chapter?<br>
Date: Wed, 1 Feb 2017 02:29:02 +0100<br>
From: Janvier NGNOULAYE <<a href="mailto:jnoulaye@gmail.com" target="_blank">jnoulaye@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: Internet Governance <<a href="mailto:governance@lists.igcaucus.org" target="_blank">governance@lists.igcaucus.org</a><wbr>>, Norbert Bollow <<a href="mailto:nb@bollow.ch" target="_blank">nb@bollow.ch</a>>, Arsène Tungali <<a href="mailto:arsenebaguma@gmail.com" target="_blank">arsenebaguma@gmail.com</a>><br>
CC: Dawit Bekele <<a href="mailto:bekele@isoc.org" target="_blank">bekele@isoc.org</a>>, <a href="mailto:dawit@isoc.org" target="_blank">dawit@isoc.org</a>, Joyce Dogniez <<a href="mailto:dogniez@isoc.org" target="_blank">dogniez@isoc.org</a>>, Dawit Bekele via Internet Society <<a href="mailto:mail@connectedcommunity.org" target="_blank">mail@connectedcommunity.org</a>>, chapter-d >> Chapter Delegates <<a href="mailto:Chapter-delegates@elists.isoc.org" target="_blank">Chapter-delegates@elists.isoc<wbr>.org</a>><br>
<br>
Dear <div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;display:inline"></div>Arsène, Norbert, Mawaki<br>
<br>
I appreciate your enthusiasm in your role. <div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;display:inline"></div>You are no more human rights<br>
activist than we are, or even <div class="gmail_default" style="font-size:large;display:inline"></div>more open internet activist than we are in ISOC Cameroon Chapter.<br>
<br>
We volunteer each day to work to make the Internet as open and accessible as possible to our local population. I do not need to show out here on this platform the actions and projects achieved so far. So you must understand that, we can not endorse a privation of the Internet to our population for whom we promote the open access of the Internet. I regret that you have misunderstand some words of my first mail on the matter.<br>
<br>
I would like to thank you for your concern on the case of Cameroon and also thank you for the declarative solution approach you are currently<br>
proposing. However, note that:<br>
<br>
1) Cameroon is in a situation of war against Boko Haram,<br>
2) Cameroon is in a situation of war against the secessionists, who have at one time erected their flag inside one part of the territory, no one knows by who they are supported and financed.<br>
3) the current socio-political context is complex, and adding to that,<br>
there is still a lack of knowledge for using Internet tools by a big part of the population.<br>
4) facing all of that, the government has taken security measures in its<br>
own way, some may be considered unfair, but it is wise for us to try to<br>
seat with them, discuss and work for the better solution, because we think that they need to be sensitized and educated about the better used of the Internet technologies and policies.<br>
5) In a situation of conflict and crisis in a given country, there will be no an universal solution as you tend to suggest from your respective<br>
offices.<br>
6) I chaired the ISOC Cameroon General Annual Assembly on Saturday 28<br>
January 2017, this issue was addressed. Not need to expose its minutes to you here.<br>
<br>
So If you really want to help, please check back your proposal.<br>
<br>
I wanted to appeal the Internet Community, those who made a phone call to us to encourage us, and all the others of the community, to keep trusting ISOC Cameroon Chapter, who is working hard on the field to solve the issue.<br>
<br>
Best regards.<br>
<br>
Janvier Ngnoulaye, Ph.D<br>
ICT Teacher at the University<br>
President of the ISOC Cameroon Chapter.<br>
Activist of "The Internet is for everyone"<br>
<a href="http://www.internetsociety.cm/" rel="noreferrer" target="_blank">http://www.internetsociety.cm/</a><br>
<br>
<br>
-------- Forwarded Message --------<br>
Subject: Re: [governance] [bestbits] Please Cameroon did not shut down the Internet !!!<br>
Date: Thu, 26 Jan 2017 16:58:48 +0100<br>
From: Janvier NGNOULAYE <<a href="mailto:jnoulaye@gmail.com" target="_blank">jnoulaye@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: Internet Governance <<a href="mailto:governance@lists.igcaucus.org" target="_blank">governance@lists.igcaucus.org</a><wbr>>, Renata Aquino Ribeiro <<a href="mailto:raquino@gmail.com" target="_blank">raquino@gmail.com</a>><br>
CC: Deji Bryce Olukotun <<a href="mailto:deji@accessnow.org" target="_blank">deji@accessnow.org</a>>, Arsène Tungali <<a href="mailto:arsenebaguma@gmail.com" target="_blank">arsenebaguma@gmail.com</a>>, Judith Hellerstein <<a href="mailto:judith@jhellerstein.com" target="_blank">judith@jhellerstein.com</a>>, <<a href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net" target="_blank">bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</a>> <<a href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net" target="_blank">bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</a>><br>
<br>
Hi to all,<br>
<br>
It seems to me that the problem of access to Internet in Cameroon is very much amplified here on the Net. There are 10 regions in Cameroon, the problem of access to the Internet is only concerning 2 Regions.<br>
<br>
These 2 regions actually has some political or social crisis. The government and other stakeholders in these 2 areas are looking for suitable solutions.<br>
<br>
Meanwhile, the government has seen fit to cut these two regions of Internet access and Western Union money transfer services, for the sake of the entire population of these 2 regions.<br>
<br>
Internet works well everywhere else in the other 8 regions. I'm sending<br>
this mail from Yaounde in Cameroon. So the situation is not a disaster as some seem to publish on the Net. The ISOC Chapter can only encourage the government and the other stakeholders to seek lasting peace solutions, even if it involves a temporary suspension of Internet and Western Union services.<br>
<br>
ISOC Cameroon Chapter<br>
President<br></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div>
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<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Aaron Agien NYANGKWE<br>P.O.Box 5213<br>Douala-Cameroon<br>Tel. 237 673 42 71 27<br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br></div>
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