<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8"></head><body >+1<br><br><div>-------- Original message --------</div><div>From: Anriette Esterhuysen <anriette@apc.org> </div><div>Date:10/25/2014 10:56 AM (GMT-05:00) </div><div>To: governance@lists.igcaucus.org, michael gurstein <gurstein@gmail.com>, 'Jeremy Malcolm' <jmalcolm@eff.org> </div><div>Subject: Re: [governance] Tweedledum and Tweedledee WAS Re: [bestbits] Time-sensitive: 24 hour sign on period for ITU Plenipot joint recommendations </div><div><br></div>
<font size="+1">I also like Jeremy's framing very much.<br>
<br>
Anriette<br>
<br>
<br>
Copying here for sake of clarity:<br>
<br>
</font><br>
<font size="+1">Further, it's not as if these "great majority of
people" have a choice. The Internet (and the world) is <i>already</i>
being governed by diverse institutions many of which have no
connection with their elected representatives. So the choice is
not between sticking with a well-established system or
representative democracy or switching to an alternative called
multi-stakeholderism, as you seem to be characterising it. On the
contrary, it's a choice between continuing to submit to diverse
mechanisms of ordering many of which are not state-based or
democratic, or constructing new forms of representation that allow
people, independently of their citizenship, to participate in
global governance in ways that would otherwise be reserved to more
powerful actors. Meanwhile the nation state will continue to play
its role, but in global Internet governance it is not not an
exclusive role.<br>
<br>
<br>
</font>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 25/10/2014 14:51, michael gurstein
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:068f01cff052$783816c0$68a84440$@gmail.com" type="cite">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Well
said.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">M<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org">governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org</a>
[<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="mailto:governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org">mailto:governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org</a>] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>Jeremy Malcolm<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, October 24, 2014 5:59 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:governance@lists.igcaucus.org">governance@lists.igcaucus.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [governance] Tweedledum and
Tweedledee WAS Re: [bestbits] Time-sensitive: 24 hour
sign on period for ITU Plenipot joint recommendations<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><o:p> </o:p></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 24/10/2014 5:38 pm, Jeremy Malcolm
wrote:<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I am asking informational questions in
an earnest attempt to get a handle on who it is that has
authorized or is pushing for what appears to be a clear
rejection of values and principles that the great majority
of people in the world would be very unlikely to give up
(at least not easily), and what political system is being
recommended to replace it. <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br>
Further, it's not as if these "great majority of people" have
a choice. The Internet (and the world) is <i>already</i>
being governed by diverse institutions many of which have no
connection with their elected representatives. So the choice
is not between sticking with a well-established system or
representative democracy or switching to an alternative called
multi-stakeholderism, as you seem to be characterising it. On
the contrary, it's a choice between continuing to submit to
diverse mechanisms of ordering many of which are not
state-based or democratic, or constructing new forms of
representation that allow people, independently of their
citizenship, to participate in global governance in ways that
would otherwise be reserved to more powerful actors.
Meanwhile the nation state will continue to play its role, but
in global Internet governance it is not not an exclusive role.<br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<pre>-- <o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Jeremy Malcolm<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Senior Global Policy Analyst<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Electronic Frontier Foundation<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="https://eff.org">https://eff.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:jmalcolm@eff.org">jmalcolm@eff.org</a><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p> </o:p></pre>
<pre>Tel: 415.436.9333 ext 161<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p> </o:p></pre>
<pre>:: Defending Your Rights in the Digital World ::<o:p></o:p></pre>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
`````````````````````````````````
anriette esterhuysen
executive director
association for progressive communications
po box 29755, melville, 2109, south africa
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:anriette@apc.org">anriette@apc.org</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.apc.org">www.apc.org</a></pre>
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