<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">No it is not a complex issue.<div> Your own data base as long it is for personal use with no  making available data to the public  is a matter of exercising private life which is guarantied under HR. No control on that...</div><div>If you disclose to the public here comes the balance between privacy (of others)  and freedom of expression (your)....classical matter<div><br></div><div>The real problem is that today this balance is not done the same way around the world. The freedom of expression limits are not the same. </div><div><br></div><div>See,the private life of a public person is better protected in some countries than in others.. up to the point that in those countries where privacy is less protected you may  kill politically a man when publishing an extra marital love affair, not in other countries</div><div><br></div><div>Example in an other field of limits to freedom of expression  :  the nazis stuffs are forbidden to be sold in Europe (=nazi propaganda which is forbidden.....) which is not the case in USA.  Yahoo ! had been condemned in France for letting a group of nazi sailing online those stuffs on its service. Yahoo ! asked the US Court if that  French Court decision was applicable in USA. The US court said NO . Yahoo changed its rules regarding its status with regard to sailing on its online service so no longer such stuffs could appear on its service...I guess  Yahoo! did not want to be prevented  to make business on the european market (over 500 millions of people), knowing that after a French court it will be a German court which would condemned it= bad propaganda for its service</div><div><br></div><div>Marie</div><div><br></div><div><div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div>Le 15 mai 2014 à 12:25, Daniel Kalchev a écrit :</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">
  
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    This is rather complex issue.<br>
    <br>
    Imagine, I am compiling a database about my neighbors. Doesn't
    matter why or for what purpose. It is *my* database. There are even
    laws to protect my rights over it.<br>
    Now, one of my neighbors says they don't want their "personal
    information" such as their name in my database. Or, another piece of
    personal information, his telephone number.<br>
    <br>
    Now imagine, not only me, but few other neighbors compile databases
    for their neighbors... <br>
    <br>
    Get the idea?<br>
    <br>
    This is what we are trying to define here.<br>
    <br>
    Daniel<br>
    <br>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 15.05.14 13:14, avri wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote cite="mid:qm4ym29e7020homwg97mbg0u.1400148887036@email.android.com" type="cite">
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      <div>How much permanent information will need to be kept on order
        to guarantee a person is 'forgotten'. Will it be just their name
        and the result of the request. Will it require other identifying
        info to make sure that all of their info from all of their
        identities is also forgotten. Will the evidence they provide for
        the request need to be retained for some reason or time
        interval?  So many questions.</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div style="font-size:75%">avri</div>
      <div style="font-size:75%"><br>
      </div>
      <div style="font-size:75%">Sent from a T-Mobile 4G LTE Device</div>
      <br>
      <br>
      -------- Original message --------<br>
      From: Mwendwa Kivuva <kivuva@transworldafrica.com> <br>
        Date:05/15/2014 04:48 (GMT-05:00) <br>
        To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:governance@lists.igcaucus.org">governance@lists.igcaucus.org</a>,"Kleinwächter, Wolfgang" <wolfgang.kleinwaechter@medienkomm.uni-halle.de>
          <br>
          Cc: Lorena Jaume-Palasi <lorena@collaboratory.de>,Marie
            GEORGES <marie.georges@noos.fr>,Adam Peake <ajp@glocom.ac.jp>,Olivier
                MJ Crepin-Leblond <ocl@gih.com> <br>
                  Subject: Re: [governance] Removal <br>
                  <br>
                  <div dir="ltr">Wolfgang great question and
                    observation.
                    <div><br>
                    </div>
                    <div>This is time for innovation. We might need a
                      "search engine clearing house"<br>
                      <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
                        <div>______________________<br>
                          Mwendwa Kivuva, Nairobi, Kenya<br>
                          <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://twitter.com/lordmwesh">twitter.com/lordmwesh</a><br>
                          <br>
                        </div>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                        <div class="gmail_quote">On 15 May 2014 10:56,
                          "Kleinwächter, Wolfgang" <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:wolfgang.kleinwaechter@medienkomm.uni-halle.de" target="_blank">wolfgang.kleinwaechter@medienkomm.uni-halle.de</a>></span>
                          wrote:<br>
                          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px
                            #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            Hi,<br>
                            <br>
                            I have one question: My understanding of the
                            ruling is that an individual has to make a
                            request to a search engine to remove the
                            data/links to the orginal data to the
                            operator of a search engine, in this case
                            Google.<br>
                            <br>
                            But what about the other search engines:
                            Yandex, Bing, Baidu etc. If there are 100
                            search engines, does she/he has to make 100
                            requests?<br>
                            <br>
                            Wolfgang<br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            . IDies she/he have t.  -----Ursprüngliche
                            Nachricht-----<br>
                            Von: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org">governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org</a>
                            im Auftrag von Lorena Jaume-Palasi<br>
                            Gesendet: Do 15.05.2014 02:50<br>
                            An: <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:governance@lists.igcaucus.org">governance@lists.igcaucus.org</a>;
                            Marie GEORGES<br>
                            Cc: Adam Peake; Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond<br>
                            Betreff: Re: [governance] Information of
                            general interest: arret cour européenne
                            Luxembourg, Spanish DPA against Google<br>
                            <br>
                            the court's opinion is pretty clear: it
                            states that art. 7 & 8 (privacy and<br>
                            data protection) are higher ranked than art.
                            11 (freedom of expression). In<br>
                            democracies no right is absolute: they all
                            have to be balanced as peers<br>
                            -and not within a hierachy. So yes, Oliver
                            is right and has read it pretty<br>
                            much in deep (as many other law-experts on
                            data protection have done:<br>
                            <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://mashable.com/2014/05/13/right-to-be-forgotten-europe-google/" target="_blank">http://mashable.com/2014/05/13/right-to-be-forgotten-europe-google/</a>
                            or<br>
                            <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://europeanlawblog.eu/?p=2351" target="_blank">http://europeanlawblog.eu/?p=2351</a>
                             or<br>
                            <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.cr-online.de/blog/2014/05/14/can-a-search-engine-be-private-by-default/and" target="_blank">http://www.cr-online.de/blog/2014/05/14/can-a-search-engine-be-private-by-default/and</a><br>
                            many more.<br>
                            This is heavy undemocratic stuff, once we
                            begin to rank some human rights<br>
                            higher than others...<br>
                            Kind regards,<br>
                            Lorena<br>
                            <br>
                            <br>
                            2014-05-14 23:16 GMT+02:00 Marie GEORGES
                            <<a moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:marie.georges@noos.fr">marie.georges@noos.fr</a>>:<br>
                            <br>
                            > Yes Adam..quite interesting Viktor
                            Mayer-Schönberger 's article<br>
                            ><br>
                            > The judgement is not at all in favor of
                            censorship at all !!!!  Olivier,<br>
                            > read it in deep, balance of interest is
                            made between privacy and Interest<br>
                            > of people to know...<br>
                            ><br>
                            > In Europe( large meaning) if another
                             end is looked for  it will be at the<br>
                            > ECtHR...<br>
                            ><br>
                            > Best regards<br>
                            > Marie<br>
                            ><br>
                            > Le 14 mai 2014 à 12:55, Adam Peake a
                            écrit :<br>
                            ><br>
                            > ><br>
                            > > On May 14, 2014, at 4:58 PM,
                            Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond wrote:<br>
                            > ><br>
                            > >> This ruling spells the start
                            of mass censorship in Europe.<br>
                            > >><br>
                            > >> It basically means anyone
                            could ask Google to take down a link on the<br>
                            > >> premise that the information
                            is obsolete. I am sure this is very welcome<br>
                            > >> to crooks, fraudsters and
                            other criminals. Well done!<br>
                            > >><br>
                            > ><br>
                            > > writing in the UK Guardian, Viktor
                            Mayer-Schönberger suggests otherwise<br>
                            > -- this is not the end<br>
                            > ><br>
                            > > <<br>
                            > <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/may/13/omission-of-search-results-no-right-to-be-forgotten" target="_blank">http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/may/13/omission-of-search-results-no-right-to-be-forgotten</a><br>
                            > ><br>
                            > ><br>
                            > > Adam<br>
                            > ><br>
                            > ><br>
                            > >> Olivier<br>
                            > >><br>
                            > >> On 13/05/2014 13:23, Marie
                            GEORGES wrote:<br>
                            > >>> Bonjour,<br>
                            > >>>     Hi<br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > >>> Cet arrêt est très
                            important,<br>
                            > >>>     This judgement is very
                            important<br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > >>> Et en  première page du
                            New York Times<br>
                            > >>>      And In first page of
                            the New York Times<br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > <a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/14/technology/google-should-erase-web-links-to-some-personal-data-europes-highest-court-says.html?hp" target="_blank">http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/14/technology/google-should-erase-web-links-to-some-personal-data-europes-highest-court-says.html?hp</a><br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > >>> Texte complet de l'arrêt ,
                            ci attaché, en français et en anglais<br>
                            > >>>     Full judgement here
                            attached in french and in english<br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > >>> Il reconnait Google search
                            comme un responsable de traitement au sens<br>
                            > de la directive de 1995 sur la
                            protection des données personnelles qui donc<br>
                            > est applicable<br>
                            > >>>     It recognizes Google
                            (search) as controller in the meaning of<br>
                            > Directive of 95 on data protection,that
                            is therefore completely applicable<br>
                            > to the search engine<br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > >>> Google  doit retirer les
                            informations sur une personne qui lui porte<br>
                            > préjudice ( y inclus sur base de la
                            liberté d'information/vie privée) lors<br>
                            > de la réponse à qu'une requête sur le
                            nom de cette personne alors que<br>
                            > l'information sur le site d'origine est
                            légale<br>
                            > >>>     Google have to take of
                             the referenced documents related to a<br>
                            > person when  that information, lawful
                            on the original web site, appears in<br>
                            > the answers to a query on  her/his
                            name, where such information causes<br>
                            > undue private life on the basis of the
                             balance of interest criteria<br>
                            > (including related to freedom of
                            information versus privacy....)<br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > >>> Ce résumé est trop
                            succinct...donc arrêt à lire entièrement..<br>
                            > >>>     This resumé is too
                            short, so text to be  fully taken in<br>
                            > consideration<br>
                            > >>> Bravo aux collègues
                            espagnols<br>
                            > >>>     Great our spanish
                            colleagues<br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > >>> Bonne journée,<br>
                            > >>>     Have a nice day,<br>
                            > >>><br>
                            > >>> Marie GEORGES<br>
                            > >><br>
                            > >><br>
                            > >>
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                                <br>
                                --<br>
                                Lorena Jaume-Palasí, M.A. ? Coordinator
                                of the Global Internet Governance<br>
                                (GIG) Ohu<br>
                                 Internet & Gesellschaft
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