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    <font face="Verdana">Rafik<br>
      <br>
      I did argue the potential benefits at length. At the same time,
      logic of cautious wait may also appears as sound. Finally, it is
      ones politics - and the extent of ones disenchantment with the
      status quo of power in global IG. As for those who are rather
      disenchanted, this is a major potential opening for a disruptive
      impact, something that has come after a long time, due to certain
      historical matching of political configurations - a prime element
      of which is the near universal global outrage following Snowden
      revelations. And such openings dont come everyday. To those, like
      for instance us, for whom there is major issue today about who has
      power and who hasnt in global IG, and is marginalised, it is
      difficult to let go such a prime opportunity without making the
      best attempt to leverage it.  That is the simple fact here.<br>
      <br>
      To others, there may be less threat in status quo and more in the
      possible/ likely new configurations. Well, that is how it is
      then... But we should understand and acknowledge the politics that
      lies behind it.. It is not some simple technical difference of
      appreciating whether entrepreneurial political opportunism is
      better or conservative caution is more well-advised. Well,
      consensus-ism often does get used to safeguard the status quo.  <br>
      <br>
      If anybody is in fact ready to convey the statement to Rousseff,
      our organisation's intention is still to go ahead with it.
      Hopefully IGC would sign it, but if not, those who want to send it
      can do so.<br>
      <br>
      Co-coordinators: Is is time to check rough consensus on the
      shorter version or not yet? <br>
      <br>
      parminder <br>
      <br>
    </font>
    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On Saturday 12 October 2013 10:45 AM,
      Rafik Dammak wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAH5sThkk6iG_Nh5NK41KFp_TmqkmQCQgVxnBGh5Y3z=pt2evSA@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">
      <div dir="ltr">Hello,<br>
        <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
          <div class="gmail_quote"><br>
            <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
              .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
              <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
                <blockquote type="cite">
                  <div dir="ltr">
                    <div class="im"> </div>
                  </div>
                </blockquote>
                <br>
                Firstly, we can take the usual time for seeking
                consensus. Just not postpone to another time...
                Secondly, I have not clearly heard, or any rate
                understood, the concerns.<br>
                <br>
              </div>
            </blockquote>
            <div>well I think that some people  like Anriette , Anja ,
              already expressed scepticism and asked at least to have
              the discuss in Bali and so waiting before sending the
              letter . I also didn't get till now what is the concrete
              outcome of sending the letter </div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
              .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
              <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Lets be clear what
                we are doing at present - Just welcoming an initiative
                that by all means looks like a serious outcome oriented
                or at least outcome seeking one, and saying that we want
                to be there right away driving it along with others....
                What is wrong with it. The potential benefit is clear -
                we try to get a bit tri - lateral about this
                initiative.... Any other time will be too late.... And
                as I said I dont see the downside....</div>
            </blockquote>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div> for me it seems more interpretation or wishes of we
              may want to happen instead of having clear proofs or
              indications or benefits. and  honestly I don't buy those
              arguments that we should hurry and don't miss the
              opportunity .any action we will take we have to bare the
              consequence later. </div>
            <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
              .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
              <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
                <div class="im"> <br>
                  <blockquote type="cite">
                    <div dir="ltr">
                      <div>I want to be sure if I got you message
                        correctly.</div>
                      <div>I am still cautious with hurrying to write
                        letter , I am still not convinced and I want to
                        highlight that any action we take, will have
                        impact soon or later and can backfire.   I don't
                        think that you would disagree with more
                        strategical approach. <br>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </blockquote>
                  <br>
                </div>
                You are just making a general statement that caution and
                foresight is good - and with such a statement who can
                disagree.... But here I havent been told the risk - and
                beyond  a point, just about any political act carries
                risk. <br>
                <br>
              </div>
            </blockquote>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>I saw people talking about being opportunistic and
              pragmatic,well I will take the cynical standpoint and
              remind that we are dealing with politicians(even for the
              ICANN CEO), they will of course welcome any letter support
              and like it. but what what will happen if we found the
              initiative is going in totally different direction? are we
              going to send another letter?</div>
            <div> do you really think they will care about it? probably
              no and maybe they  will keep referring to the first letter
              because it support them and their narrative.</div>
            <div>why not investigating first and getting more details
              about what they have in mind before hurrying?</div>
            <div>should we jump there because one public statement?how
              can we make strategical decision with such few details?</div>
            <div>idem for people talking about benefit and opportunity
              to be part of the initiative but didn't give any
              clarification how that will happen. kind of shot first and
              then wait and see?</div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>anyway, I expressed my concern about sending letter to
              support initiative yet to be defined, that we don't have
              so much details about and without consensus on strategy
              that we have follow.</div>
            <div> <br>
            </div>
            <div>Best,</div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <div>Rafik</div>
            <div><br>
            </div>
            <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
              .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
              <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> Regards, parminder
                <br>
                <div>
                  <div class="h5">
                    <blockquote type="cite">
                      <div dir="ltr">
                        <div><br>
                        </div>
                        <div class="gmail_extra">Best,</div>
                        <div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
                          <div>
                            <div dir="ltr">
                              <div>Rafik</div>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                          <br>
                          <div class="gmail_quote">2013/10/11 parminder
                            <span dir="ltr"><<a
                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net"
                                target="_blank">parminder@itforchange.net</a>></span><br>
                            <blockquote class="gmail_quote"
                              style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px
                              #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                              <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000"> <font
                                  face="Verdana">It is here<br>
                                  <br>
                                  <a moz-do-not-send="true"
                                    href="http://igcaucus.org:9001/p/Brazil2014"
                                    target="_blank">http://igcaucus.org:9001/p/Brazil2014</a><br>
                                  <br>
                                  Just a word of caution - we dont want
                                  to make this an ominbus document of
                                  demands. At this stage we need a
                                  clear, crisp and strong letter, of a
                                  few sentences, that Brazilian
                                  President or some top guy would
                                  actually read, and not get confusing
                                  messages. I am not saying we should
                                  not say whatever we definitively want
                                  to say - but be clear and short, that
                                  is all.<span><font color="#888888"><br>
                                      <br>
                                      parminder<br>
                                      <br>
                                      <br>
                                    </font></span></font>
                                <div>
                                  <div>
                                    <div>On Friday 11 October 2013 11:15
                                      AM, Rafik Dammak wrote:<br>
                                    </div>
                                    <blockquote type="cite">
                                      <div dir="ltr">Hi Parminder,
                                        <div><br>
                                        </div>
                                        <div>sorry I am not really
                                          getting the proposal you are
                                          developing here? can you
                                          please clarify?</div>
                                        <div><br>
                                        </div>
                                        <div class="gmail_extra"><br
                                            clear="all">
                                          <div>
                                            <div dir="ltr">
                                              <div> Rafik </div>
                                            </div>
                                          </div>
                                          <br>
                                          <br>
                                          <div class="gmail_quote">2013/10/11

                                            parminder <span dir="ltr"><<a
                                                moz-do-not-send="true"
                                                href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net"
                                                target="_blank">parminder@itforchange.net</a>></span><br>
                                            <blockquote
                                              class="gmail_quote"
                                              style="margin:0 0 0
                                              .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
                                              solid;padding-left:1ex">
                                              <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"
                                                text="#000000"> <br>
                                                <font face="Verdana">Since

                                                  as argued below, in
                                                  our judgement, time is
                                                  strategically of
                                                  essense, some of us
                                                  would keep working on
                                                  a posible text over
                                                  today and try to
                                                  present something to
                                                  IGC and BB by the end
                                                  of the day.... We do
                                                  very much hope IGC and
                                                  BB can sign on it by
                                                  consensus, but it
                                                  doesnt happen we would
                                                  open it to
                                                  organisations and
                                                  people who want to
                                                  sign it (sorry, this
                                                  is a practice I
                                                  normally do not like
                                                  so much, but I dont
                                                  think it is ok that we
                                                  can produce a
                                                  statement to critique
                                                  a UN process is just
                                                  no time, with all kind
                                                  of ambiguous
                                                  languages, and on such
                                                  an important -
                                                  potential game changer
                                                  - initiative  from a
                                                  developing country, a
                                                  paralysis seems to be
                                                  setting in)...<span><font
                                                      color="#888888"><br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      parminder <br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      <br>
                                                    </font></span></font>
                                                <div>
                                                  <div>
                                                    <div>On Friday 11
                                                      October 2013 11:02
                                                      AM, parminder
                                                      wrote:<br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <blockquote
                                                      type="cite"> Well
                                                      let then that be
                                                      as it has to be...
                                                      "<span>There is <em>a
                                                          tide</em> in
                                                        the <em>affairs
                                                          of men</em>.
                                                        Which, taken at
                                                        the flood, leads
                                                        on to
                                                        fortune"... </span><br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      Leadership doesnt
                                                      come searching for
                                                      you, you have to
                                                      seize it....
                                                      President Rousseff
                                                      was made, what
                                                      would have perhaps
                                                      been, somewhat a
                                                      regular kind of
                                                      offer. She seized
                                                      it with both her
                                                      hands, even
                                                      announced the like
                                                      month etc.. That
                                                      is what gave it
                                                      such a sudden high
                                                      prominence, and
                                                      people are
                                                      celebrating
                                                      Rousseff, and
                                                      somewhere, if it
                                                      plays its cards
                                                      well, Brazil have
                                                      now got an
                                                      edge.... which it
                                                      can use to further
                                                      its interest...<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      Civil society also
                                                      is supposed to be
                                                      representing some
                                                      interests - real
                                                      interests of real
                                                      people, who are
                                                      most marginalised,
                                                      and we have to
                                                      take our own
                                                      responsibility
                                                      seriously . We
                                                      cannot be
                                                      eternally
                                                      paralysed, which
                                                      hurts these
                                                      interests. If
                                                      there are real
                                                      differences of
                                                      views, well, that
                                                      counts.... But a
                                                      permanent simple
                                                      wait-and-watch
                                                      attitude would do
                                                      us no good...<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      Lets analyse what
                                                      we have here....
                                                      Or what risks we
                                                      run and what gains
                                                      we can make... 
                                                      And others must
                                                      also contribute
                                                      what they think
                                                      are risks or
                                                      advantages....
                                                      merely saying we
                                                      are not sure yet,
                                                      tells talk more,
                                                      do face to face
                                                      and all,,,, Such
                                                      stuff I think,
                                                      just my own view,
                                                      is not the
                                                      appropriate
                                                      response. <br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      ICANN, either on
                                                      its own or tech
                                                      community's behalf
                                                      tries to cosy up
                                                      to the Brazilians
                                                      (perhaps in
                                                      anticipation of
                                                      the new proposal
                                                      for democratising
                                                      global IG that
                                                      Rousseff said
                                                      Brazil will soon
                                                      present - BTW, the
                                                      day of the annual
                                                      discussion on WSIS
                                                      and IG issues in
                                                      the UN GA is 22nd
                                                      Oct, but
                                                      whatever...) . It
                                                      proposes a real
                                                      dialogue to see
                                                      what needs to be
                                                      changed about the
                                                      global governance
                                                      of the Internet.
                                                      Rousseff
                                                      immediately seizes
                                                      the initiative,
                                                      and even declares
                                                      a possible
                                                      timeline, just
                                                      like that,
                                                      off-hand.... That
                                                      is leadership
                                                      material. That is
                                                      all that has
                                                      happened, and that
                                                      is all anyone
                                                      knows has
                                                      happened. There is
                                                      nothing hidden
                                                      that civil society
                                                      may suddenly
                                                      become complicit
                                                      to if they support
                                                      this proposal.<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      In supporting it,
                                                      we would only be
                                                      saying - <br>
                                                      (1) yes, we agree
                                                      that 'a real
                                                      dialogue' on what
                                                      needs to change in
                                                      global governance
                                                      of the Internet
                                                      should take place
                                                      with some urgency,
                                                      <br>
                                                      (2) such a
                                                      dialogue should
                                                      take place in an
                                                      open and not  a
                                                      hidden manner, <br>
                                                      (3) it is
                                                      certainly
                                                      encouraging that
                                                      the initiative
                                                      comes from one of
                                                      the key developing
                                                      nations - the main
                                                      votaries of a
                                                      'real change' -
                                                      and ICANN or the
                                                      technical
                                                      community - seen
                                                      as the main symbol
                                                      and defender of
                                                      status quo,and
                                                      that <br>
                                                      (4) we want civil
                                                      society to be
                                                      equally there in
                                                      the middle of all
                                                      action, as the
                                                      dialogue shapes
                                                      and takes place...<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      Nothing more and
                                                      nothing less. (If
                                                      anything sinister
                                                      about the proposed
                                                      meeting surfaces
                                                      at any later time
                                                      we can as publicly
                                                      withdraw our
                                                      support, saying
                                                      this is  not at
                                                      all what we
                                                      bargained for)<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      So either people
                                                      here agree to the
                                                      above, and we can
                                                      write a statement,
                                                      or they dont...
                                                      This is the time
                                                      to do the
                                                      statement, when
                                                      people are still
                                                      wondering what
                                                      kind of initiative
                                                      it really is, and
                                                      with what
                                                      implications.
                                                      Throw in our hat -
                                                      and well, kind of
                                                      make this thing
                                                      somewhat
                                                      trilateral from
                                                      its current
                                                      bi-lateral status
                                                      (Brazil - ICANN
                                                      tech community) We
                                                      may not succeed,
                                                      but we must try.
                                                      .... In a few
                                                      weeks, the
                                                      initiative would
                                                      already be too
                                                      solidified in
                                                      fact, or in
                                                      people's mind for
                                                      civil society
                                                      support to have
                                                      this kind of
                                                      impact....<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      Parminder <br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      <div>On Friday 11
                                                        October 2013
                                                        05:56 AM, Ian
                                                        Peter wrote:<br>
                                                      </div>
                                                      <blockquote
                                                        type="cite">
                                                        <div dir="ltr">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="font-size:12pt;font-family:'Calibri'">
                                                          <div>I agree
                                                          with Deborah –
                                                          lets wait till
                                                          a bit more
                                                          information
                                                          emerges. We
                                                          can draft a
                                                          letter which
                                                          is more
                                                          meaningful
                                                          when we have a
                                                          better idea of
                                                          the scope,
                                                          objectives,
                                                          possible
                                                          outcomes,
                                                          likely
                                                          attendees, and
                                                          possible
                                                          processes for
                                                          the
                                                          conference.
                                                          It’s quite
                                                          likely more
                                                          information
                                                          will emerge in
                                                          the next week
                                                          or so,
                                                          therefore I
                                                          think we
                                                          should discuss
                                                          at Bali and
                                                          before then
                                                          try to find
                                                          out a little
                                                          more.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>Ian Peter</div>
                                                          <div
style="font-style:normal;font-size:small;display:inline;text-decoration:none;font-family:'Calibri';font-weight:normal">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="FONT:10pt
                                                          tahoma">
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="BACKGROUND:#f5f5f5">
                                                          <div><b>From:</b>
                                                          <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
title="deborah@accessnow.org" href="mailto:deborah@accessnow.org"
                                                          target="_blank">Deborah


                                                          Brown</a> </div>
                                                          <div><b>Sent:</b>
                                                          Friday,
                                                          October 11,
                                                          2013 10:35 AM</div>
                                                          <div><b>To:</b>
                                                          <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
title="nnenna75@gmail.com" href="mailto:nnenna75@gmail.com"
                                                          target="_blank">Nnenna


                                                          Nwakanma</a> </div>
                                                          <div><b>Cc:</b>
                                                          <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
title="bestbits@lists.bestbits.net"
                                                          href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net"
target="_blank">mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</a> </div>
                                                          <div><b>Subject:</b>
                                                          Re:
                                                          [governance]
                                                          RE: [bestbits]
                                                          Rousseff &
                                                          Chehade:
                                                          Brazil will
                                                          host world
                                                          event on
                                                          Internet
                                                          governance in
                                                          2014</div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div
style="font-style:normal;font-size:small;display:inline;text-decoration:none;font-family:'Calibri';font-weight:normal">
                                                          <div dir="ltr">Dear

                                                          all, 
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>I see the
                                                          advantage of
                                                          engaging early
                                                          on this, but
                                                          I'm a bit
                                                          concerned that
                                                          we are rushing
                                                          unnecessarily
                                                          to finalize a
                                                          letter before
                                                          many of us
                                                          travel and are
                                                          otherwise
                                                          overstretched.
                                                          I wonder if it
                                                          might make
                                                          more sense to
                                                          continue this
                                                          discussion
                                                          online and
                                                          take advantage
                                                          of the
                                                          in-person
                                                          meetings in
                                                          Bali, for
                                                          those of us
                                                          attending, to
                                                          develop a CS
                                                          agenda. Also,
                                                          as others have
                                                          pointed out,
                                                          we know so
                                                          little about
                                                          the initiative
                                                          at this point.</div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>The draft
                                                          text
                                                          (available
                                                          here: <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://igcaucus.org:9001/p/Brazil2014" target="_blank">http://igcaucus.org:9001/p/Brazil2014</a>)
                                                          does not seem
                                                          to capture the
                                                          cautious
                                                          optimism that
                                                          a number of
                                                          people have
                                                          expressed. I
                                                          also have
                                                          concerns about
                                                          providing our
                                                          "strongest
                                                          endorsement"
                                                          of the Marco
                                                          Civil process,
                                                          when that
                                                          process is not
                                                          yet complete.
                                                          Of course the
                                                          text of the
                                                          letter could
                                                          change
                                                          dramatically
                                                          in just a few
                                                          hours ;)<br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>I find
                                                          Nnenna's
                                                          approach to be
                                                          sound, but it
                                                          does imply a
                                                          follow on
                                                          communication
                                                          with more
                                                          concrete
                                                          proposals. I
                                                          wonder if it
                                                          might be more
                                                          effective to
                                                          streamline our
                                                          communication
                                                          to the
                                                          Brazilian
                                                          president and
                                                          head of ICANN.
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>To sum
                                                          up, I see
                                                          clear
                                                          advantages to
                                                          both "striking
                                                          while the iron
                                                          is hot" and a
                                                          more cautious
                                                          approach. But
                                                          given the
                                                          factors I
                                                          mentioned
                                                          above, I would
                                                          support taking
                                                          some extra
                                                          time if we
                                                          need it. In
                                                          any case, I'm
                                                          looking
                                                          forward to
                                                          hearing
                                                          others' ideas
                                                          and continuing
                                                          the discussion
                                                          around this
                                                          important
                                                          development. </div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>Best
                                                          regards, <br>
                                                          Deborah </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div
                                                          class="gmail_extra"><br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <div
                                                          class="gmail_quote">On


                                                          Thu, Oct 10,
                                                          2013 at 3:41
                                                          PM, Nnenna
                                                          Nwakanma <span
                                                          dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:nnenna75@gmail.com" target="_blank">nnenna75@gmail.com</a>></span>
                                                          wrote:<br>
                                                          <blockquote
                                                          class="gmail_quote"
                                                          style="PADDING-LEFT:1ex;MARGIN:0px

                                                          0px 0px
                                                          0.8ex;BORDER-LEFT:#ccc
                                                          1px solid">
                                                          <div dir="ltr">
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>Dear all<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <ol>
                                                          <li>I do
                                                          believe that
                                                          if any support
                                                          there is, from
                                                          the civil
                                                          society, it is
                                                          support for an
                                                          IDEA that
                                                          "appears" more
                                                          open and
                                                          inclusive that
                                                          the current
                                                          IGF </li>
                                                          <li>So I am
                                                          cautious about
                                                          writing a
                                                          letter that
                                                          may be in any
                                                          way understood
                                                          as  "Civil
                                                          Society lauds
                                                          Dilma and
                                                          ICANN's push".
                                                          </li>
                                                          <li>A short
                                                          letter
                                                          informing that
                                                          global Civil
                                                          Society that
                                                          are working
                                                          on, concerned
                                                          about and/or
                                                          interested in
                                                          IG and
                                                          Internet
                                                          issues  intend
                                                          to play key
                                                          roles in the
                                                          summit. </li>
                                                          <li>I believe
                                                          we should
                                                          communicate
                                                          key values we
                                                          plan to pursue
                                                          in the summit
                                                          </li>
                                                          <li>Underline
                                                          the central
                                                          idea of
                                                          multistakeholder
                                                          participation
                                                          </li>
                                                          <li>Say that
                                                          we are
                                                          beginnning
                                                          discussions
                                                          about the
                                                          diverse roles
                                                          that CS can
                                                          play and that
                                                          some time in
                                                          Bali will be
                                                          dedicated to
                                                          the issue
                                                          during the BB
                                                          meeting in
                                                          Bali.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </li>
                                                          </ol>
                                                          </div>
                                                          If we recall,
                                                          workshop 127
                                                          in Bali will
                                                          be discussing
                                                          the MS
                                                          Selection
                                                          processes, and
                                                          I do hope,
                                                          personally
                                                          that we can
                                                          use that
                                                          opportunity to
                                                          sharpen the
                                                          focus.  A
                                                          reminder of
                                                          the WS is on <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/wks2013/workshop_2013_status_list_view.php?xpsltipq_je=127"
target="_blank">http://www.intgovforum.org/cms/wks2013/workshop_2013_status_list_view.php?xpsltipq_je=127</a><br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          I am traveling
                                                          in unconnected
                                                          rural areas
                                                          but will be
                                                          back online
                                                          and I'm happy
                                                          to contribute
                                                          language if
                                                          any text
                                                          begins to
                                                          surface.  In
                                                          case I do not,
                                                          here are my
                                                          ideas:<br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <ol>
                                                          <li>Say what
                                                          exactly it is
                                                          the global CS
                                                          is supporting,
                                                          which is the
                                                          idea, and not
                                                          the
                                                          institutions </li>
                                                          <li>Make a
                                                          clear
                                                          statement on
                                                          our
                                                          willingness to
                                                          engage </li>
                                                          <li>Recall
                                                          that our
                                                          engagement is
                                                          based on the
                                                          Multistakeholder
                                                          principle </li>
                                                          <li>Inform
                                                          that
                                                          discussions
                                                          have started
                                                          and are
                                                          ongoing </li>
                                                          <li>Say we
                                                          will be coming
                                                          up with ore
                                                          concrete
                                                          engagement
                                                          proposals </li>
                                                          <li>Requesto
                                                          have
                                                          fundamental
                                                          info, if
                                                          available, to
                                                          help us scope
                                                          the idea
                                                          itself.</li>
                                                          </ol>
                                                          <p>Best</p>
                                                          <span><font
                                                          color="#888888">
                                                          <p> </p>
                                                          <p>Nnenna<br>
                                                          </p>
                                                          </font></span>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div
                                                          class="gmail_extra"><br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <div
                                                          class="gmail_quote">On



                                                          Thu, Oct 10,
                                                          2013 at 7:01
                                                          PM, Joana
                                                          Varon <span
                                                          dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:joana@varonferraz.com"
                                                          target="_blank">joana@varonferraz.com</a>></span>
                                                          wrote:<br>
                                                          <blockquote
                                                          class="gmail_quote"
                                                          style="PADDING-LEFT:1ex;MARGIN:0px

                                                          0px 0px
                                                          0.8ex;BORDER-LEFT:rgb(204,204,204)
                                                          1px solid">
                                                          <div dir="ltr">
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>Dear
                                                          people, <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          For the level
                                                          of information
                                                          I have (which
                                                          is basically:
                                                          Brazil and
                                                          ICANN have
                                                          proposed to
                                                          host a Summit
                                                          on Internet
                                                          after April -
                                                          coincidentally
                                                          or right after
                                                          the meeting on
                                                          Sharm el Sheik
                                                          and before the
                                                          presidential
                                                          elections
                                                          period), I
                                                          don't feel
                                                          comfortable
                                                          about writing
                                                          a letter
                                                          congratulating
                                                          for something
                                                          I dont really
                                                          know what it
                                                          is. <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          But I do truly
                                                          support Anja's
                                                          suggestion to
                                                          start working
                                                          on our agenda
                                                          online and,
                                                          with a
                                                          potential to
                                                          be much
                                                          richer, during
                                                          our several
                                                          meetings in
                                                          Bali. (what do
                                                          we want from
                                                          all this
                                                          besides
                                                          participating
                                                          in the
                                                          Summit??) <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          In the
                                                          meanwhile, I
                                                          rather take
                                                          breath to
                                                          understand and
                                                          discuss this
                                                          with the
                                                          Brazilian
                                                          government and
                                                          Brazilian
                                                          colleagues
                                                          from civil
                                                          society or
                                                          other sectors.
                                                          And see what
                                                          is the final
                                                          draft of Marco
                                                          Civil that the
                                                          government
                                                          will bring to
                                                          our table very
                                                          soon (if it
                                                          truly endorses
                                                          all the
                                                          principles she
                                                          has mentioned
                                                          at the UNGA).
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          I'm sorry if
                                                          it's a bit of
                                                          a skeptic or
                                                          over cautious
                                                          position, but
                                                          I really need
                                                          more inputs to
                                                          see the big
                                                          picture.  <br>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          <div>All the
                                                          best<span><font
color="#888888"><br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          joana<br>
                                                          </font></span></div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div
                                                          class="gmail_extra">
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div><br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <div
                                                          class="gmail_quote">On




                                                          Thu, Oct 10,
                                                          2013 at 2:59
                                                          PM, michael
                                                          gurstein <span
                                                          dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:gurstein@gmail.com" target="_blank">gurstein@gmail.com</a>></span>
                                                          wrote:<br>
                                                          <blockquote
                                                          class="gmail_quote"
                                                          style="PADDING-LEFT:1ex;MARGIN:0px

                                                          0px 0px
                                                          0.8ex;BORDER-LEFT:rgb(204,204,204)
                                                          1px solid">+1<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          M<br>
                                                          <div><br>
                                                          -----Original
                                                          Message-----<br>
                                                          From: <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:bestbits-request@lists.bestbits.net" target="_blank">bestbits-request@lists.bestbits.net</a><br>
                                                          [mailto:<a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:bestbits-request@lists.bestbits.net" target="_blank">bestbits-request@lists.bestbits.net</a>]
                                                          On Behalf Of
                                                          Carlos A.
                                                          Afonso<br>
                                                          Sent:
                                                          Thursday,
                                                          October 10,
                                                          2013 10:12 AM<br>
                                                          To: McTim<br>
                                                          Cc: <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:governance@lists.igcaucus.org" target="_blank">governance@lists.igcaucus.org</a>;
                                                          michael
                                                          gurstein; Lee
                                                          W McKnight;
                                                          Rafik<br>
                                                          Dammak; Joana
                                                          Varon;
                                                          &lt,<a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net" target="_blank">bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</a>&gt,;






                                                          NCSG List<br>
                                                          Subject: Re:
                                                          [governance]
                                                          RE: [bestbits]
                                                          Rousseff &
                                                          Chehade:
                                                          Brazil will<br>
                                                          host world
                                                          event on
                                                          Internet
                                                          governance in
                                                          2014<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>Dear
                                                          compa McT,<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          You being a
                                                          rigorous
                                                          techie, maybe
                                                          you will not
                                                          change your
                                                          logical
                                                          view...<br>
                                                          :) And I
                                                          understand
                                                          there is a lot
                                                          of people in
                                                          all sectors
                                                          who feel<br>
                                                          disturbed by
                                                          the emerging
                                                          presence of
                                                          Brazil and its
                                                          concrete
                                                          proposals to<br>
                                                          finally move
                                                          on.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          At the very
                                                          beginning Fadi
                                                          describes the
                                                          motivation --
                                                          Rousseff's
                                                          statement<br>
                                                          at the UN, her
                                                          clear
                                                          adherence to
                                                          the basic
                                                          principles
                                                          most of civil
                                                          society<br>
                                                          defends (which
                                                          she has
                                                          repeated
                                                          several times
                                                          in her radio
                                                          program and
                                                          her<br>
                                                          twitter
                                                          @dilmabr), and
                                                          her proposal
                                                          to build a
                                                          planetary
                                                          framework of<br>
                                                          rights. This
                                                          did not come
                                                          out of the
                                                          blue, from a
                                                          meeting of IP
                                                          addressers<br>
                                                          in a wonderful
                                                          city called
                                                          Montevideo. Do
                                                          you think Fadi
                                                          just dropped
                                                          by the<br>
                                                          presidential
                                                          door in
                                                          Brasilia,
                                                          knocked and
                                                          entered to
                                                          sell that
                                                          proposal? :)<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Anyway, it is
                                                          relevant to
                                                          understand
                                                          that this is
                                                          not a proposal
                                                          for yet<br>
                                                          another Icann
                                                          meeting, or a
                                                          reedition of
                                                          the UN
                                                          chatting space
                                                          called IGF,<br>
                                                          as both Dilma
                                                          and Fadi made
                                                          it very clear.
                                                          It is a major
                                                          achievement
                                                          that<br>
                                                          that
                                                          motivation
                                                          brought Icann
                                                          to colead this
                                                          effort jointly
                                                          with BR.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          All the more
                                                          so because, as
                                                          you know,
                                                          there are
                                                          strong sectors
                                                          within the<br>
                                                          government who
                                                          would love to
                                                          bring the
                                                          root-zone to
                                                          the purview of
                                                          the ITU,<br>
                                                          who hate
                                                          Icann, who do
                                                          not like the
                                                          pluriparticipative
                                                          model of
                                                          governance<br>
                                                          we defend, and
                                                          who are
                                                          basically
                                                          associated
                                                          with the
                                                          transnational
                                                          telecom<br>
                                                          oligopoly
                                                          which controls
                                                          the main
                                                          networks in
                                                          BR.<br>
                                                          Dilma is
                                                          courageously
                                                          up against a
                                                          huge wall
                                                          here, to
                                                          defend those<br>
                                                          principles,
                                                          and receiving
                                                          Fadi and
                                                          emerging from
                                                          the meeting
                                                          with thar<br>
                                                          proposal was a
                                                          major
                                                          political
                                                          milestone for
                                                          her in those
                                                          internal
                                                          disputes<br>
                                                          as well.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          [] fraterno<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          --c.a.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          On 10/10/2013
                                                          10:14 AM,
                                                          McTim wrote:<br>
                                                          > At 55
                                                          seconds in,
                                                          Fadi says:<br>
                                                          > "Her
                                                          Excellency
                                                          President
                                                          Rousseff has
                                                          accepted our
                                                          invitation
                                                          that we<br>
                                                          > hold next
                                                          year a Global
                                                          Summit"<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > Seem
                                                          fairly clear
                                                          to me.<br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          > On Thu,
                                                          Oct 10, 2013
                                                          at 9:10 AM,
                                                          Carlos A.
                                                          Afonso <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:ca@cafonso.ca" target="_blank">ca@cafonso.ca</a>>




                                                          wrote:<br>
                                                          >> McT,
                                                          maybe you
                                                          should watch
                                                          the video a
                                                          few times
                                                          more... :)<br>
                                                          >><br>
                                                          >>
                                                          --c.a.<br>
                                                          >><br>
                                                          >> On
                                                          10/10/2013
                                                          09:57 AM,
                                                          McTim wrote:<br>
                                                          >>>
                                                          On Wed, Oct 9,
                                                          2013 at 11:50
                                                          PM, michael
                                                          gurstein <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:gurstein@gmail.com" target="_blank">gurstein@gmail.com</a>><br>
                                                          wrote:<br>
                                                          >>>>



                                                          Why so
                                                          pessimistic
                                                          and cynical
                                                          everyone.. I
                                                          may be wrong
                                                          but this<br>
                                                          >>>>



                                                          isn't just
                                                          about ICANN,
                                                          although hats
                                                          off to Fadi
                                                          for getting
                                                          this<br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          >>>>



                                                          going and
                                                          putting that
                                                          into play.<br>
                                                          <div>>>><br>
                                                          >>><br>
                                                          >>>
                                                          I'm not
                                                          pessimistic or
                                                          cynical.<br>
                                                          >>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
>>>><br>
                                                          >>>>



                                                          But I would be
                                                          extremely
                                                          surprised if
                                                          the Pres. of
                                                          Brazil is
                                                          going<br>
                                                          >>>>



                                                          to invite the
                                                          world to Rio
                                                          in April next
                                                          year to
                                                          discuss names
                                                          and<br>
                                                          >>>>




                                                          numbers.
                                                          Rather my
                                                          reading is
                                                          that she is
                                                          by-passing the
                                                          quite<br>
                                                          >>>>



                                                          evident
                                                          log-jam at the
                                                          ITU, the
                                                          frivolities of
                                                          the IGF, the
                                                          now<br>
                                                          >>>>




                                                          discredited
                                                          "Internet
                                                          Freedom"
                                                          crusade and
                                                          the status quo
                                                          which it<br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          >>>>



                                                          was intended
                                                          to cast into
                                                          concrete errr.
                                                          (non) rules
                                                          and regs.<br>
                                                          <div>
                                                          <div>>>><br>
                                                          >>><br>
                                                          >>><br>
                                                          >>>
                                                          It appears to
                                                          me, after
                                                          watching the
                                                          video again
                                                          several times
                                                          that<br>
                                                          >>>
                                                          it is ICANN
                                                          (and I assume
                                                          the rest of
                                                          the
                                                          Montevideoans)
                                                          that are<br>
                                                          >>>
                                                          spearheading
                                                          this.  In
                                                          other words
                                                          the idea of
                                                          the Summit
                                                          comes from<br>
                                                          >>>
                                                          the T&A
                                                          folks, not
                                                          Brasilia.<br>
                                                          >>><br>
                                                          >>><br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          ><br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </blockquote>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="all">
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div>-- <br>
                                                          -- <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Joana Varon
                                                          Ferraz<br>
                                                          @joana_varon<br>
                                                          PGP 0x016B8E73<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </blockquote>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </blockquote>
                                                          </div>
                                                          <br>
                                                          <br
                                                          clear="all">
                                                          <div> </div>
                                                          -- <br>
                                                          <div dir="ltr">
                                                          <div
                                                          style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-size:13px"><font
                                                          face="garamond,


                                                          serif">Deborah
                                                          Brown</font></div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-size:13px"><font
                                                          face="garamond,


                                                          serif">Senior
                                                          Policy Analyst</font></div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-size:13px"><font
                                                          face="garamond,


                                                          serif">Access
                                                          | <a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://accessnow.org" target="_blank">accessnow.org</a></font></div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-size:13px"><font
                                                          face="garamond,


                                                          serif"><a
                                                          moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rightscon.org" target="_blank">rightscon.org</a></font></div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-size:13px"><font
                                                          face="garamond,


                                                          serif"><br>
                                                          </font></div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-size:13px"><font
                                                          face="garamond,


                                                          serif">@deblebrown</font></div>
                                                          <div
                                                          style="color:rgb(136,136,136);font-size:13px"><font
                                                          face="garamond,


                                                          serif">PGP
                                                          0x5EB4727D</font></div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                          </div>
                                                        </div>
                                                      </blockquote>
                                                      <br>
                                                    </blockquote>
                                                    <br>
                                                  </div>
                                                </div>
                                              </div>
                                            </blockquote>
                                          </div>
                                          <br>
                                        </div>
                                      </div>
                                    </blockquote>
                                    <br>
                                  </div>
                                </div>
                              </div>
                            </blockquote>
                          </div>
                          <br>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                    </blockquote>
                    <br>
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