<div dir="ltr"><div style><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">What about taking Adam's suggestion but changing the second sentence:</span></div><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">We believe that the inclusion of digital rights management in HTML5 has the potential to stifle innovation and we object to the inclusion of digital rights management (DRM) in HTML5.</span><br>

<div style><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">to this:</span></div><div style><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">We believe that the inclusion of digital rights management in HTML5 seriously compromises the rights of end users; for this reason particularly </span><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">we object to the inclusion of digital rights management (DRM) in HTML5</span></div>

<div style><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">Deirdre</span></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 8 June 2013 13:18, Catherine Roy <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ecrire@catherine-roy.net" target="_blank">ecrire@catherine-roy.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>

<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
  
    
  
  <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
    <div>Hi all,<br>
      <br>
      To be clear, I believe that as one W3C staffer put it recently,
      EFF has decided to take the fight against DRM in HTML5 inside the
      W3C to be more effective by becoming a member and following the
      W3C process. Sending petitions and writing indignated articles and
      press releases, while having their place in the landscape, will go
      only so far in terms of turning this issue around. Also, since
      there are plenty of people arguing the technical drawbacks in the
      several mailing lists related to HTML, restricted media, etc., and
      that a technical formal objection has also been filed (to which I
      have lent my support), EFF probably found that, in the short term,
      the best way to have a grasp on the issue of DRM in HTML5 was to
      argue that this work is out of scope for the working group. But
      this remains an issue of saying no to DRM in HTML5 and the EFF
      formal objection is very clear as to why it has filed this FO.<br>
      <br>
      As for the IGC, I found it encourageing that there was finally a
      semblance of agreement to make a public show of support for the
      EFF's FO by releasing a short statement to that effect. My problem
      here was with the statement itself. I believe it would be a good
      idea to explain *why* we support the objection. I understand that
      it needs to be short and sweet to ensure consensus among this
      group. But simply saying that we support it because DRM "stifles
      innovation" is rather lacking IMHO. At the heart of this issue is
      users rights and the EFF FO is quite eloquent and thurough on this
      aspect. I am kind of newish here so perhaps I have misunderstood
      the IGC interests but I thought users rights was a major one for
      the group and had hoped a small snippet of a sentence regarding
      our concerns on this particular aspect would be good idea. Perhaps
      I was mistaken.<br>
      <br>
      Finally, as I explained to someone off-list, I believe the W3C is
      under enormous pressure at the moment regarding this issue and
      every action counts. So much pressure in fact that, as discussed
      by a W3C employee in a recent guardian article[1], the W3C
      Advisory Committee will be trying to reach consensus on the
      decision to include or not DRM compatibility in HTML this coming
      Monday in Japan.
      So yes, time is of the essence but I think it is still not too
      late to weigh in on this issue.<br>
      <br>
      Best regards,
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      Catherine
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      [1] <a href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2013/jun/06/html5-drm-w3c-open-web" target="_blank">http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2013/jun/06/html5-drm-w3c-open-web</a>
      <br><div><div class="h5">
      <br>
      <br>
      <br>
      On 08/06/2013 7:41 AM, Adam Peake wrote:<br>
    </div></div></div><div><div class="h5">
    <blockquote type="cite">Thanks Catherine, Deirdre.
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>I think, or hope, we are pretty much in agreement.  I tried
        to make the proposed IGC comment pretty simple, cutting the
        paragraphs that had attracted the most disagreement.  That left
        an opening sentence saying IGC supports the EFF statement.  2nd
        sentence saying IGC thinks DRM in HTML5 harmful, trying to
        capture the overall sense of the other paragraphs discussed on
        the list.  3rd sentence IGC supports the EFF statement.  I know
        1st and 3rd rather the same, but that was the point.  After a
        lot of to&fro where we seemed not to be getting anywhere,
        just tried to make something simple. </div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>I suspect we won't get consensus on more. </div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>And either we say something simple or end up, again, with a
        blathering and generally meaningless set of contradictions and
        compromise (for example see the IGC's February comment to the
        IGF open consultation).</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Best,</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Adam</div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div><br>
        <div>
          <div>On Jun 8, 2013, at 8:41 AM, Deirdre Williams wrote:</div>
          <br>
          <blockquote type="cite">
            <div dir="ltr"><span style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">Thank
                you Catherine - that's what I thought. </span>
              <div style="font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:13px">But
                if EFF has gone to such lengths to object to the working
                group charter rather than to DRM in HTML5 directly then
                I'm wondering why we are not simply supporting the EFF
                objection to the Charter?</div>
            </div>
            <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
              <br>
              <div class="gmail_quote">On 7 June 2013 13:10, Catherine
                Roy <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ecrire@catherine-roy.net" target="_blank">ecrire@catherine-roy.net</a>></span>
                wrote:<br>
                <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                  <div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
                    <div>Hi Deirdre.<br>
                      <br>
                      I am sure someone from EFF on this list could
                      explain it better than I so please correct me as
                      needed but my understanding is that EFF's formal
                      objection concerns an element of the HTML Working
                      Group charter that enables the Working Group to
                      propose the Encrypted Media Extensions (EME)
                      specification which effectively represents a
                      technology  that, in combination with Content
                      Decryption Modules (CDMs), allows "the remote
                      determination of end-user usage of content". EME
                      is used with CDMs, which is a software component
                      that permits access to encrypted resources (so
                      basically DRM).<br>
                      <br>
                      EFF has made a formal objection on the Working
                      Group charter to basically argue that such work,
                      which is formulated in the charter as "supporting
                      playback of protected content", is out of scope
                      for the Working Group deliverables. So in effect,
                      EFF is objecting to the fact that W3C, through its
                      HTML Working Group, propose a specification that
                      will enable the use of Digital Rights Management
                      (via CDMs) in HTML5.<br>
                      <br>
                      It is my understanding that by supporting the EFF
                      formal objection, IGC is effectively saying no to
                      DRM in HTML5.
                      <div><br>
                        <br>
                        Best regards,<br>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                        Catherine<br>
                        <pre cols="72">-- 
Catherine Roy
<a href="http://www.catherine-roy.net/" target="_blank">http://www.catherine-roy.net</a></pre>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <div> On 07/06/2013 10:02 AM, Deirdre
                          Williams wrote:<br>
                        </div>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                    <div>
                      <div>
                        <blockquote type="cite">
                          <div dir="ltr">Could someone please help to
                            clarify things for me?
                            <div>I hadn't responded before about the
                              Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF)
                              statement because I had no time to read
                              the documents until this morning.</div>
                            <div>My understanding is that the IGC was
                              asked if it would support the recent EFF
                              statement.</div>
                            <div>The EFF statement is a "Formal
                              Objection to the HTML WG Draft Charter",
                              indicating that the Charter "<span>represents


                                a significant broadening of scope for
                                the HTML WG (and the W3C as a whole) to
                                include the remote determination of
                                end-user usage of content." </span><a href="https://www.eff.org/pages/drm/w3c-formal-objection-html-wg" target="_blank">https://www.eff.org/pages/drm/w3c-formal-objection-html-wg</a> The


                              objection is NOT to DRM in HTML5 as such,
                              although the text contains a detailed
                              discussion of that issue as justification
                              fotr the objection.</div>
                            <div>Particularly within the working group
                              Charter, the objection is to this
                              reference in 2 -</div>
                            <div>
                              <p style="clear:left;font-size:medium;font-family:sans-serif">"Some


                                examples of features that would be in
                                scope for the updated HTML
                                specification:</p>
                              <ul>
                                <li><font color="#000000" face="sans-serif" size="3">additions
                                    to the HTMLMediaElement element
                                    interface, to support use cases such
                                    as live events or premium content;
                                    for example, additions for:</font>
                                  <ul style="font-size:medium;font-family:sans-serif">
                                    <li>facilitating adaptive streaming
                                      (<a href="http://www.w3.org/TR/html-media-source/" style="color:rgb(85,34,153);background-color:transparent" target="_blank">Media Source
                                        Extensions</a>)</li>
                                    <li>supporting playback of protected
                                      content"  <a href="http://www.w3.org/html/wg/charter/2012/" target="_blank">http://www.w3.org/html/wg/charter/2012/</a> </li>
                                  </ul>
                                </li>
                              </ul>
                              So please - are we discussing offering
                              support to EFF's Objection to the Charter,
                              or are we creating an IGC statement on DRM
                              in HTML5?</div>
                            <div>And if the latter, are we doing
                              anything about EFF's Objection, which was
                              what we were asked about in the first
                              place?</div>
                            <div>Thank you</div>
                            <div>Deirdre</div>
                            <div><br>
                            </div>
                          </div>
                          <div class="gmail_extra"><br>
                            <br>
                            <div class="gmail_quote">On 7 June 2013
                              01:54, Adam Peake <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ajp@glocom.ac.jp" target="_blank">ajp@glocom.ac.jp</a>></span>
                              wrote:<br>
                              <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
                                <div style="word-wrap:break-word">Hi Catherine,

                                  <div><br>
                                  </div>
                                  <div>Does the EFF statement cover your
                                    concerns?  </div>
                                  <div> <br>
                                  </div>
                                  <div>Best,</div>
                                  <div><br>
                                  </div>
                                  <div>Adam</div>
                                  <div>
                                    <div>
                                      <div><br>
                                        <div><br>
                                          <div>
                                            <div>On Jun 7, 2013, at 2:14
                                              AM, Catherine Roy wrote:</div>
                                            <br>
                                            <blockquote type="cite">
                                              <div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
                                                <div>Hi,<br>
                                                  <br>
                                                  While I support this
                                                  latest formulation by
                                                  Adam as it is simple,
                                                  to the point and
                                                  avoids ambiguous and
                                                  perhaps (for the
                                                  moment) unprovable
                                                  facts, I feel it is
                                                  lacking with regards
                                                  to users' rights,
                                                  which is also one of
                                                  the key issues at the
                                                  heart of this whole
                                                  matter. That is, as
                                                  someone on the W3C
                                                  restricted media
                                                  mailing list
                                                  mentioned, standards
                                                  should be at the
                                                  margin of debates, and
                                                  if required to take
                                                  part, should always,
                                                  in the end, be on the
                                                  side of the user. Much
                                                  like optimizing sites
                                                  for particular
                                                  browsers that shut out
                                                  certain users, there
                                                  is a real problem here
                                                  with shutting out
                                                  users who do  not have
                                                  the right
                                                  software/hardware from
                                                  content (in this case,
                                                  much of the
                                                  discussions revolve
                                                  around premium
                                                  content  but it could
                                                  extend to any content
                                                  that applies DRM). So,
                                                  while I am not a
                                                  wordsmith and
                                                  therefore apologize
                                                  for not proposing
                                                  exact wording, I would
                                                  like to see something
                                                  more clear in the
                                                  statement regarding
                                                  users rights and
                                                  sovereignty over their
                                                  euh, "equipment".<br>
                                                  <br>
                                                  Best regards,<br>
                                                  <br>
                                                  <br>
                                                  Catherine<br>
                                                  <br>
                                                  <pre cols="72">-- 
Catherine Roy
<a href="http://www.catherine-roy.net/" target="_blank">http://www.catherine-roy.net</a></pre>
                                                  <br>
                                                  <br>
                                                  On 2013-06-06 04:52,
                                                  Adam Peake wrote:<br>
                                                </div>
                                                <blockquote type="cite">
                                                  <div>
                                                    <div>Hi Sala, </div>
                                                    <div><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>To be honest,
                                                      having to remember
                                                      a url and jump off
                                                      to a separate site
                                                      for such a small
                                                      statement is a
                                                      pain.  In my
                                                      opinion, anyway.
                                                       Perhaps you can
                                                      see the stats on
                                                      the <a href="http://www.igcaucus.org/" target="_blank">http://www.igcaucus.org/</a> page,



                                                      how many people
                                                      bother to visit vs
                                                      the very large
                                                      number who read
                                                      the list?</div>
                                                    <div><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>A cleaned up
                                                      version of a short
                                                      statement:</div>
                                                    <div><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>The Civil
                                                      Society Internet
                                                      Governance Caucus
                                                      (IGC) endorses and
                                                      supports the
                                                      formal objection
                                                      lodged by the
                                                      Electronic
                                                      Frontier
                                                      Foundation (EFF)
                                                      <<a href="https://www.eff.org/pages/drm/w3c-formal-objection-html-wg" target="_blank">https://www.eff.org/pages/drm/w3c-formal-objection-html-wg</a>></div>
                                                    <div><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>We believe that
                                                      the inclusion of
                                                      digital rights
                                                      management in
                                                      HTML5 has the
                                                      potential to
                                                      stifle innovation
                                                      and we object to
                                                      the inclusion of
                                                      digital rights
                                                      management (DRM)
                                                      in HTML5.</div>
                                                    <div><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>We fully
                                                      endorse the
                                                      arguments raised
                                                      by the EFF in
                                                      their statement
                                                      "EFF's Formal
                                                      Objection to the
                                                      HTML WG Draft
                                                      Charter" <<a href="https://www.eff.org/pages/drm/w3c-formal-objection-html-wg" target="_blank">https://www.eff.org/pages/drm/w3c-formal-objection-html-wg</a>></div>


                                                    <div><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>The EFF
                                                      statement we're
                                                      considering to
                                                      support is itself
                                                      long and speaks
                                                      for itself.  See
                                                      no need to add
                                                      more than above.</div>
                                                    <div><br>
                                                    </div>
                                                    <div>Adam</div>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <div><br>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <div><br>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <div><br>
                                                  </div>
                                                  <div>On Jun 6, 2013,
                                                    at 4:30 AM,
                                                    Salanieta T.
                                                    Tamanikaiwaimaro
                                                    wrote:</div>
                                                  <div><br>
                                                    <blockquote type="cite">In
                                                      case, people
                                                      missed it. The
                                                      revised Statement
                                                      is live at:<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      <a href="http://www.igcaucus.org/digressit/archives/112" target="_blank">http://www.igcaucus.org/digressit/archives/112</a>
                                                      where you can add
                                                      your comments and
                                                      suggest text.<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      Kind Regards,<br>
                                                      Sala<br>
                                                      <br>
                                                      <div class="gmail_quote">On
                                                        Thu, Jun 6, 2013
                                                        at 2:50 AM,
                                                        Salanieta T.
                                                        Tamanikaiwaimaro
                                                        <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com" target="_blank">salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com</a>></span>
                                                        wrote:<br>
                                                        <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Dear
                                                          All,<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Further to the
                                                          discussions on
                                                          the mailing
                                                          list, I have
                                                          revised the
                                                          first version
                                                          to the one
                                                          below. I have
                                                          highlighted
                                                          the sentence
                                                          still in
                                                          contention and
                                                          also note that
                                                          there are
                                                          mixed
                                                          reactions to
                                                          the balance of
                                                          the protection
                                                          of
                                                          intellectual
                                                          property
                                                          rights through
                                                          mediums like
                                                          the DRM to
                                                          protect
                                                          innovation and
                                                          challenges to
                                                          threats of
                                                          impeded
                                                          "Access". This
                                                          is a very
                                                          interesting
                                                          debate and one
                                                          I believe
                                                          should be
                                                          thoroughly
                                                          explored by
                                                          the IGC where
                                                          we can come to
                                                          some common
                                                          ground (if we
                                                          are able to).
                                                          I have not had
                                                          the time to
                                                          read Frank La
                                                          Rue's new
                                                          report but it
                                                          would be
                                                          interesting to
                                                          see his report
                                                          of what the
                                                          world is
                                                          saying in
                                                          relation to
                                                          this conflict.
                                                          I am of course
                                                          interested in
                                                          what the IGC
                                                          has to say.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          Roland and
                                                          Avri raised
                                                          some very
                                                          interesting
                                                          points that
                                                          deserve
                                                          discussion. As
                                                          we speak, the
                                                          Statement will
                                                          be hosted on
                                                          the Statement
                                                          Workspace on
                                                          the IGC
                                                          website. I
                                                          have tried to
                                                          capture every
                                                          comment in the
                                                          attached
                                                          document. I
                                                          find that
                                                          Statement
                                                          Workspaces are
                                                          far more
                                                          effective in
                                                          neatly
                                                          allowing
                                                          people to
                                                          comment on
                                                          each sentence
                                                          etc, so my
                                                          apologies if
                                                          the attached
                                                          document is
                                                          inherently
                                                          messy.<br>
                                                          <br>
                                                          What are your
                                                          collective
                                                          thoughts on
                                                          what Roland
                                                          suggested that
                                                          whilst there
                                                          are many
                                                          battles, this
                                                          is not one we
                                                          should spend
                                                          time on? The
                                                          key issues for
                                                          your
                                                          deliberation
                                                          would be:-<br>
                                                          <ul>
                                                          <li>What is
                                                          the IGC's
                                                          position on
                                                          Digital Rights
                                                          Management?</li>
                                                          <li>What is
                                                          the IGC's
                                                          position on
                                                          Digital Rights
                                                          Management in
                                                          HTML 5?</li>
                                                          </ul>
                                                          <p>Thank you
                                                          to all those
                                                          for suggesting
                                                          text and new
                                                          wordings and
                                                          phrases. I
                                                          have tried to
                                                          capture your
                                                          views below.
                                                          All the
                                                          mistakes are
                                                          of course
                                                          mine. Let us
                                                          have your
                                                          thoughts. As
                                                          soon as the
                                                          Statement is
                                                          on the
                                                          Workspace,
                                                          Norbert will
                                                          inform us and
                                                          this will
                                                          allow us to
                                                          track comments
                                                          on the
                                                          revised 
                                                          statement.<br>
                                                          </p>
                                                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><b><u><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Revised

                                                          Draft
                                                          Statement on
                                                          Support for
                                                          EFF’s
                                                          Objection</span></u></b></p>
                                                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">The
                                                          Civil Society
                                                          Internet
                                                          Governance
                                                          Caucus (IGC)
                                                          objects to the
                                                          inclusion of
                                                          digital rights
                                                          management
                                                          (DRM) in
                                                          HTML5. We
                                                          endorse and
                                                          support the
                                                          formal
                                                          objection
                                                          lodged by the
                                                          Electronic
                                                          Frontier
                                                          Foundation
                                                          (EFF) and that
                                                          the draft
                                                          proposal from
                                                          the World Wide
                                                          Web Consortium
                                                          (W3C) could
                                                          stifle Web
                                                          innovation and
                                                          block access
                                                          to content for
                                                          people across
                                                          the planet.</span></p>
                                                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><br>
                                                          </span></p>
                                                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">We
                                                          believe that
                                                          the proposed
                                                          standard by
                                                          W3C is a
                                                          serious threat
                                                          to an open and
                                                          free internet.
                                                          <span style="background:yellow">The



                                                          inherent
                                                          danger of the
                                                          proposal would
                                                          be to shut out
                                                          open source
                                                          developers and
                                                          competition,
                                                          destroy
                                                          interoperability
                                                          and lock in
                                                          legacy
                                                          business
                                                          models.</span></span></p>
                                                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif""><span style="background:yellow"><br>
                                                          </span></span></p>
                                                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-top:0in;text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">Much
                                                          of the
                                                          developing
                                                          world relies
                                                          on open source
                                                          developers to
                                                          enable OR
                                                          CREATE mechanisms
                                                          that allow for
                                                          an open
                                                          environment of
                                                          sharing
                                                          resources
                                                          related to
                                                          agricultural
                                                          practices,
                                                          education,
                                                          health and
                                                          diverse
                                                          content. In
                                                          such regions,
                                                          access to
                                                          information is
                                                          a challenge
                                                          and with
                                                          serious
                                                          resource
                                                          constraints,
                                                          but it is an
                                                          open and free
                                                          internet (and
                                                          the resultant
                                                          ease of
                                                          collaboration/sharing
                                                          information)
                                                          that empowers
                                                          communities.</span></p>
                                                          <p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align:justify"><span style="font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"">For
                                                          the foregoing
                                                          reasons we
                                                          reiterate our
                                                          strong
                                                          objection to
                                                          the support
                                                          for DRM
                                                          technologies
                                                          in HTML5, and
                                                          our agreement
                                                          with the EFF's
                                                          arguments in
                                                          this regard.</span></p>
                                                          <br>
                                                        </blockquote>
                                                      </div>
                                                      <br>
                                                      <br clear="all">
                                                      <br>
                                                      -- <br>
                                                      <div>Salanieta
                                                        Tamanikaiwaimaro
                                                        aka Sala</div>
                                                      <div>P.O. Box
                                                        17862</div>
                                                      <div>Suva</div>
                                                      <div>Fiji</div>
                                                      <div><br>
                                                      </div>
                                                      <div>Twitter:
                                                        @SalanietaT</div>
                                                      <div><a>Skype:Salanieta.Tamanikaiwaimaro</a></div>
                                                      <div>Tel: <a href="tel:%2B679%203544828" value="+6793544828" target="_blank">+679
                                                          3544828</a></div>
                                                      <div>Fiji Cell: <a href="tel:%2B679%20998%202851" value="+6799982851" target="_blank">+679 998 2851</a></div>
                                                      <div>Blog: <a href="http://salanieta.blogspot.com/" target="_blank">salanieta.blogspot.com</a><br>
                                                      </div>
                                                      <div> </div>
                                                      <div><font color="#222222" face="arial,
                                                          sans-serif"><span style="line-height:16px"><br>
                                                          </span></font></div>
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                            </div>
                            <br>
                            <br clear="all">
                            <div><br>
                            </div>
                            -- <br>
                            “The fundamental cure for poverty is not
                            money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur
                            Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979 </div>
                        </blockquote>
                        <br>
                        <br>
                      </div>
                    </div>
                  </div>
                </blockquote>
              </div>
              <br>
              <br clear="all">
              <div><br>
              </div>
              -- <br>
              “The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but
              knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize
              Economics, 1979
            </div>
          </blockquote>
        </div>
        <br>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    <br>
    <pre cols="72">-- 
Catherine Roy
<a href="http://www.catherine-roy.net" target="_blank">http://www.catherine-roy.net</a></pre>
  </div></div></div>

</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br>“The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979
</div>