<html><head><meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto"><div>Just to clarify, using marxist rhetoric based ephitets that originally described slumlords and absentee rackrenters to describe your opponents is something that does tend to invite a strong (or stronger than intended) reaction when someone understands the reference and its context. </div><div><br></div><div>I would experience much the same reaction, for example, if I referred to someone from a racial or ethnic group by a name that they find offensive. And yes, words change in meaning over time, but I can't see that the original intent of that ephitet has changed much, judging by whatever discourse I can find online about rentier capitalism.<br><br>The difference - which I do regret with myself - has been that I tend to resent these enough to be vocal about these, and in the process, expose myself to much the same kind of criticism [not to mention complaints to the list admin that I am using such words, which takes me right back to the days of kindergarten and "teacher! he called me a bad name!"]</div><div><br></div><div>--srs (iPad)</div><div><br>On 04-Mar-2013, at 9:33, Suresh Ramasubramanian <<a href="mailto:suresh@hserus.net">suresh@hserus.net</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>
<p>What goes around sometimes comes right back around. Regrettable to
be sure. <br>
<br>
--srs (htc one x)<br>
</p>
<br><p>
</p><p>On 4 March 2013 9:27:11 AM Lee W McKnight <lmcknigh@syr.edu> wrote:</lmcknigh@syr.edu></p>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="direction: ltr;font-family: Tahoma;color: #000000;font-size: 10pt;">So...practitioners
demonizing theorists is ok, but not vice versa?
<br>
<br>
Got it.<br>
<div style="font-family: Times New Roman; color: #000000; font-size: 16px">
<hr tabindex="-1">
<div style="direction: ltr;" id="divRpF422556"><font color="#000000" face="Tahoma" size="2"><b>From:</b>
<a href="mailto:governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org">governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org</a>
[<a href="mailto:governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org">governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org</a>] on behalf of Suresh
Ramasubramanian [<a href="mailto:suresh@hserus.net">suresh@hserus.net</a>]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Sunday, March 03, 2013 10:43 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Diego Rafael Canabarro<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href="mailto:governance@lists.igcaucus.org">governance@lists.igcaucus.org</a>; Salanieta Tamanikaiwaimaro;
<a href="mailto:riaz.tayob@gmail.com">riaz.tayob@gmail.com</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [governance] Fwd: Why do US and EU trade
negotiators hate the Berne Copyright Limitations and Exceptions? |
Knowledge Ecology International<br>
</font><br>
</div>
<div></div>
<div>
<div>There are people who bridge the gap effectively. Which involves
not using pejorative terms (rentier for instance) to describe those you
disagree with. That, and working to find common ground where you
can agree to some extent to those whose views differ
from yours. So, not demonizing the opposition is
definitely a good place to start.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The other thing I have found is that people who implement anything
in practice and have their opinions tempered by that experience are
much more reliable sources of knowledge, and more inclined to avoid
blindly ideological positions, than theorists, especially
those with a political bent.<br>
<br>
--srs (iPad)</div>
<div><br>
On 04-Mar-2013, at 8:50, Diego Rafael Canabarro <<a href="mailto:diegocanabarro@gmail.com" target="_blank">diegocanabarro@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>How to disentangle both?<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 1:55 AM, Suresh
Ramasubramanian <span dir="ltr">
<<a href="mailto:suresh@hserus.net" target="_blank">suresh@hserus.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex; border-left:1px #ccc solid; padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#ffffff">
<p>A big difference between the two. Ideology is driven by a relatively
blind belief system. Philosophy takes more facts into account, even if
they conflict with ideology.
<br>
<br>
--srs (htc one x)<br>
</p>
<div>
<div class="h5"><br>
<p></p>
<p>On 21 February 2013 12:04:10 PM Salanieta Tamanikaiwaimaro <u></u>wrote:</p>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>On the contrary, policy is driven by philosophy or ideology.<br>
<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPad</div>
<div><br>
On Feb 21, 2013, at 5:54 PM, Suresh Ramasubramanian <<a href="mailto:suresh@hserus.net" target="_blank">suresh@hserus.net</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div>A perception of what different groups or individuals feel is the
global public interest, more like?</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Ideology and policy, especially on the Internet, are a very bad
mix. And I doubt you will get consensus on what constitutes global
public interest.<br>
<br>
--srs (iPad)</div>
<div><br>
On 21-Feb-2013, at 11:15, Salanieta Tamanikaiwaimaro <<a href="mailto:salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com" target="_blank">salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div>It is interesting when advocacy in relation to global public
interest is labelled as left/South.</div>
<div>Civil society is seen as a watchdog and where it is told to stop
speaking or expressing its views because they are "left" then
there is a danger of being innoculated from subtle threats that affect
what we hold dear, an open and free Internet.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<br>
Sent from my iPad</div>
<div><br>
On Feb 21, 2013, at 1:14 PM, Suresh Ramasubramanian <<a href="mailto:suresh@hserus.net" target="_blank">suresh@hserus.net</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div>I dont dispute that. My sole point is that there's little or
no connection from these to internet governance, and there are plenty
of other fora where the rest of it gets extensively discussed - quite a
few exclusively from a "south" / "left" etc perspective
as well, if that's a criterion that some seek.<br>
<br>
--srs (iPad)</div>
<div><br>
On 21-Feb-2013, at 4:04, Salanieta Tamanikaiwaimaro <<a href="mailto:salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com" target="_blank">salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div>In essence, we live in a vast interconnected world and with
something like the Internet, there are a plethora of issues that stem
from the way that Internet is structured and the various regulatory
mechanisms, diverse jurisdictional treatment etc.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>From a global public interest, it is in the interest of civil
society to she informed of how various shifts in policies, laws, market
behaviour, Internet architecture can affect the ordinary user.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
Sent from my iPad</div>
<div><br>
On Feb 21, 2013, at 8:59 AM, Suresh Ramasubramanian <<a href="mailto:suresh@hserus.net" target="_blank">suresh@hserus.net</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div>The "application to cyberspace" part seems to be missing
in that the frameworks being discussed are not specific to online
copyright theft. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Even there, the wgig report does seem to over stretch the igov
definition to a considerable extent.<br>
<br>
--srs (iPad)</div>
<div><br>
On 21-Feb-2013, at 0:42, "Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro"
<<a href="mailto:salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com" target="_blank">salanieta.tamanikaiwaimaro@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div><br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Feb 21, 2013 at 2:09 AM, Suresh
Ramasubramanian <span dir="ltr">
<<a href="mailto:suresh@hserus.net" target="_blank">suresh@hserus.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex; border-left:1px #ccc solid; padding-left:1ex">
Hi, is there an internet governance angle to this that I somehow missed?<br>
<br>
--srs (iPad)<br>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
Th WGIG 2005 Report identified Intellectual Property as an Internet
Governance thematic area. See page 7:<br>
<br>
<span style="background-color:rgb(255,255,0)">"<b>23. Intellectual
property rights (IPR)</b><br>
<b>Application of intellectual property rights to cyberspace.</b><br>
• While there is agreement on the need for balance between the rights
of holders and the rights of users, there are different views on the
precise nature of the balance that will be most beneficial to all
stakeholders, and whether the current IPR system is
adequate to address the new issues posed by cyberspace. On the one
hand, intellectual property rights holders are concerned about the high
number of infringements, such as digital piracy, and the technologies
developed to circumvent protective measures to
prevent such infringements; on the other hand, users are concerned
about market oligopolies, the impediments to access and use of digital
content and the perceived unbalanced."</span><br>
<br>
Intellectual Property touches virtually every layer of the
Information Infrastructure and layer of Internet Architecture, consider
Verisign's Patent Application for Domain Name Transfers and other
issues stemming from Digital Rights Management Systems and
the use of Piracy Filters.<br>
<br>
For human rights advocates, the use of piracy filters can just as
easily be used to filter content arbitrarily and where do you draw the
line. The criminalization of things like breaking digital locks on
software etc.<br>
<br>
The threats with the TPP is that there is a massive transition from
being mere Traffic providers to policing the internet. The Berne
Convention of course is one of the long standing international legal
instruments that are widely accepted globally so by extension
it is relevant.<br>
<br>
There are many links that you can go to see the link between IP and the
Internet and here are just three:<br>
<br>
<a href="http://www.cisco.com/web/about/gov/issues/ip_rights.html" target="_blank">http://www.cisco.com/web/about/gov/issues/ip_rights.html</a>
<br>
<a href="https://www.eff.org/search/site/Trans%20Pacific%20partnership" target="_blank">https://www.eff.org/search/site/Trans%20Pacific%20partnership</a><br>
<a href="http://www.circleid.com/posts/20121011_perspective_on_verisign_patent_application_on_domain_transfers/" target="_blank">http://www.circleid.com/posts/20121011_perspective_on_verisign_patent_application_on_domain_transfers/</a><br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex; border-left:1px #ccc solid; padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div><br>
On 20-Feb-2013, at 18:57, <a href="mailto:riaz.tayob@gmail.com" target="_blank">riaz.tayob@gmail.com</a> wrote:<br>
<br>
> Using a treaty for the blind to push 3 strikes..<br>
><br>
>> <a href="http://keionline.org/node/1655" target="_blank">http://keionline.org/node/1655</a><br>
<br>
</div>
</div>
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</blockquote>
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-- <br>
Diego R. Canabarro
<div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><span style="vertical-align:top; text-align:left"><a href="http://lattes.cnpq.br/4980585945314597" target="_blank">http://lattes.cnpq.br/4980585945314597</a></span> </font><br>
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MSN: diegocanabarro [at] <a href="http://gmail.com" target="_blank">gmail.com</a><br>
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</blockquote>
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