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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Milton<<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org [mailto:governance-request@lists.igcaucus.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Milton L Mueller<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, January 22, 2013 12:50 PM<br><b>To:</b> governance@lists.igcaucus.org<br><b>Subject:</b> RE: [governance] France Proposes an Internet Tax<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Milton, is it that you don't like this particular tax or that you don't like taxes in general.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>[Milton L Mueller] My message makes it abundantly clear what I don’t like about it: the rationale is phony (work without pay);</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] I would very much like to see the underlying argument here before I made any judgement… the 200 page document that accompanied the announcement was unforunately only in French and I won't have the time to look through it in any detail until the earliest next week… I think the argument itself is possibly a very interesting and novel one and is attempting to get at the underlying structure of new social media--whether they've got it right or not is another question on which I personally will hold off judgement (i.e. I won't react to headlines on what I think is a complex discussion<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'> it’s a political attempt to capitalize on anti-Google/FB sentiment (tax them because we don’t like them);</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] I don't see that at all… if they are looking to find a way of taxing a category of activity and that activity is dominated (effectively monopolized) by one or another corporation that doesn't mean that they are "capitaliz(ing) on anti-Google/FB sentiment (tax them because we don’t like them) it simply means that those subject to that particular tax are those companies in that monopoly position…<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'> it looks suspiciously like an attempt at discrimination based on national origin;</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] see above<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'> it is stupidly conceived (it taxes advertisers, the customers of Google/FB, which does not help users who allegedly work without pay.)<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] see above… taxes are levied in one place and ultimately change cost/revenue structures somewhere else, that's how the system works isn't it…<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>what you would replace it with to obtain revenues from this emerging sector assuming that you think folks like Google and their Internet compatriots should pay their fair share as very many are now insisting. <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>If it is the latter I would be curious to know how you see responsible states being able to meet the challenge of reponding to the collective challenges/responsibilities of the modern state so ably articulated last evening by your President.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>[Milton L Mueller] A corporate income tax, a personal income tax and a VAT – all of which Europe already has – capture growth in any “emerging sector.” Or are you advocating taxing things just for the sake of taxing them?</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] see above… however, it seems that for whatever reason the French (and a whole posse of other governments) are finding it very difficult under current legislation/regulation to get a fair share of taxation from the Internet giants and are trying to figure out how to do that… I'm guessing that the French proposal is one experiment in that direction and if it succeeds it will be copied by that posse and others <o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'> Frankly, that wouldn’t surprise me.<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] this is ad hominen<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:10.5pt'><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:5.25pt'><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>[Milton L Mueller] Besides, no case has been made that the French government really needs more money,</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] I'm not sure that that is for you to decide…<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:5.25pt'><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'> or that social media impose costs on it that need to be recovered.</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] The position that taxes are somehow only to be levied as a means to cover related costs is a political stance promoted by mostly fringe libertarian ideologists and is not one that appears consistent with most current perspectives on public finance.<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'> <o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:5.25pt'><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'> But if it does need additional revenues for legitimate purposes, then they can increase the rate of neutral taxes and not target them on specific types of businesses based on misconceptions about the underlying bargain behind social media. </span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] see above<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:5.25pt'><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'>Unless, of course, you think social media, like alcohol and tobacco, are inherently bad and need to be taxed to discourage their use. (Do you? Then come out and say it.)<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>[MG>] that's just silly<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>M<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-left:5.25pt'><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p><p class=MsoNormal><b><i><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></i></b></p></div></div></body></html>