Andrea, thanks for your input. I the strong response to this invitation can be seen as giving importance to this exchange. I understood the meeting to be a 'sampling' for idea exchange, not a 'representation'. Possibly this kind of invitation could be made more informally (not on the list) to avoid misunderstanding and overwhelming requests to attend. If anything, I think tension has been fostered by good intentions to be inclusive in what is meant to be a small, diverse brainstorming session.<br>
<br>Perhaps we should pick up on Andrea's suggestion to request a larger meeting for brainstorming? Positive energy for communication is important.<br><br>Safe travels,<br>Ginger<br><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
Ginger (Virginia) Paque<br><br><div><a href="mailto:VirginiaP@diplomacy.edu" target="_blank">VirginiaP@diplomacy.edu</a><br><span style="font-family:arial;font-size:small">Diplo Foundation<br>Internet Governance Capacity Building Programme<br>
<a href="http://www.diplomacy.edu/ig" target="_blank">www.diplomacy.edu/ig</a><span style="padding-right:16px;width:16px;height:16px"></span><br><span style="padding-right:16px;width:16px;height:16px"></span><span style="padding-right:16px;width:16px;height:16px"></span><span style="padding-right:16px;width:16px;height:16px"></span><div>
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<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 2 November 2012 02:30, Suresh Ramasubramanian <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:suresh@hserus.net" target="_blank">suresh@hserus.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="auto"><div>Sauces for the goose, and for the gander :)</div><div><br></div><div>Very well put - and I share your skepticism about "civil society consensus", informed consensus at any rate, for an audience that is larger than the typical igov involved civ soc organization crowd<br>
<br>--srs (iPad)</div><div><br>On 02-Nov-2012, at 12:02, Andrea Glorioso <<a href="mailto:andrea@digitalpolicy.it" target="_blank">andrea@digitalpolicy.it</a>> wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>(Speaking with the "European Commission official" hat here).<br>
<br>Let's not blow things out of proportion. There is no attempt at "imposing false notions of representations" for the simple reason that in the dark corridors of Mordor, I mean Brussels, we are perfectly aware "civil society" is a rather fluid concept and it is difficult to identify "spokesperson" or "representatives" (which, incidentally, also means that when any of the various persons or organisations in the "civil society" galaxy claims to "represent" anything, our usual reaction is one of skepticism. You can't have it both ways I guess).<br>
<br>Frankly,anyway, I do not quite understand why it is ok for the IGC to have "co-coordinators" which <i>de facto</i> speak on behalf of the IGC in several occasions, and for members of this list to choose a speaker that will <i>de facto</i> represent them at the opening session (if I understood well); but when other parties ask whether there are NGOs et al that would like to have an <u>informal</u> chat with people from the European Commission and the European Parliament, all hell breaks loose.<br>
<br>But I guess that since the EU's final plan is to take over the Internet and impose automatic translation of all websites in 22 languages, we can't possibly be trusted.<br><br>More practically, if you can find a venue large enough for an open meeting (we couldn't) why not propose a larger set-up?<br>
<br>Best,<br><br>Andrea<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 11:04 PM, Milton L Mueller <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:mueller@syr.edu" target="_blank">mueller@syr.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:rgb(31,73,125)">5 or 6 people, max? Ridiculous. This is an inherently bad, undemocratic method.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:rgb(31,73,125)">Governments such as the EC try to impose false notions of “representation” on civil society, by seeking a few “spokespersons” or “representatives.” Their only real object
is to make their job easier. We should decline to cooperate with this political version of artificial scarcity, and just insist on an open meeting. I am serious. If you are so flattered that they asked for your opinion, but go along with their attempt to reduce
civil society to a few privileged voices, you are completely missing the point. <u></u>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 2:05 PM, Izumi AIZU <<a href="mailto:iza@anr.org" target="_blank">iza@anr.org</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal">Following the one in Nairobi last year, European commission and European Parliament <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">people want to hold an informal meeting with civil society members and <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">asked Wolfgang to coordinate.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Since this is an informal meeting with limited space, we need to find and decide who will<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">be there. Around 5 or 6 people, max.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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