<p dir="ltr">Hi Parminder,</p>
<p dir="ltr">I don't remember taking a position in favor of or against a UN CIRP and my neutrality on the control or regulation issue remains because my country appears to remain outside the IGF, takes OIC positions in the HRC and is highly pro-surveillance, pro-content filtering, pro-blocking and our internet rights groups are either Internet Giants funded or live off donor agendas that fund only false war torn and gender abuse and separatist peace security propaganda. </p>
<p dir="ltr">It is a false accusation that Pakistan has its own say in such matters as its part of a larger bloc called the OIC, see what OIC is saying in the context of the Syrian crisis.</p>
<p dir="ltr">I try to balance things in view of facts, figures and context but it is an irony that in the US, people want an open and network neutral Internet but their companies seem to be playing around anything but that and their citizens are harassed and jailed in the name of Copyrights and IP and their companies are seemingly living off technologies patent wars with sometimes stuff they didn't even create but own patents to!</p>
<p dir="ltr">The kind of people that i can foresee will end up discussing Internet policy in such a proposed UNCIRP setting is very dangerous with the usual topi-drama by private sector led business and information cartels, civil society funded by Internet Giants and dominant governments stepping on developing countries will be the norm.</p>
<p dir="ltr">Attempting to create a new IGF with more concrete UN or multilateral funding isn't going to take the Internet anywhere, make what you have effective and prove that it will work! </p>
<p dir="ltr">The world tends to remain ignorant on internet public policy issues trying to pump life into the IGF as well as other policy settings displaying the dilemma you shared and many opportunistic people that know anything about it are busy milking cows. Where's the love my friend!</p>
<p dir="ltr">Fouad Bajwa</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Aug 19, 2012 11:33 AM, "parminder" <<a href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net">parminder@itforchange.net</a>> wrote:<br type="attribution"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
<font face="Verdana">Sala (and Fouad)<br>
<br>
I am a bit surprised at your emails discussing in such a positive
manner the need for developing countries to assert themselves in
global regulation of the Internet, which regulation we all know
does in any case happen by default by powerful countries. For if
indeed this is your political position or even inclination, why,
when a UN CIRP kind of proposal is brought up even just as a
dialogue opener, does everyone join the bandwagon of a shrill
'down, down' , even without giving it an opportunity of a reasoned
discussion.<br>
<br>
To discuss just one global Internet policy related issue that you
have touched upon, fair distribution of taxes accruing, or that
should accrue, from commercial transactions on the Internet,
europe has an inter-country agreement on it.... Why shouldnt
developing country also be party to such agreements, so that they
dont lose revenue. However, when any real institutional proposal
to move in such directions comes up, as CIRP is, how easily we all
- and I address this specially to civil society from developing
countries - merrily follow the pied pipper's tune of 'threat to
the Internet', 'theat to FoE' and the such, towards our continued
collective bondage and domination by the North ....<br>
<br>
Any political position, I would say. is only as good as the
willingness to work on the corresponding real political
possibilities. If you dont like a CIRP like possibility, sure, do
suggest others. But what is the point in vain musings, without
putting your political currency where your mouth is. <br>
<br>
parminder<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</font>
<div>On Saturday 18 August 2012 11:19 PM,
Salanieta T. Tamanikaiwaimaro wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">I don't see why they could be exempt from taxes and
why they should not be regulated. Ordinarily just as any person
travelling to another country is subject to the laws of that
country and this is true from the moment you step into their
airspace or water or cyber space. What made the US take down
Rojadirecta? See: <a href="http://www.rojadirecta.com/" target="_blank">http://www.rojadirecta.com/</a>
where you will see evidence of a domain name take down by ICE
Homeland Security Investigations?
<div><br>
</div>
<div>The only material difference really is that developing
countries have been dormant and sleeping. If you look at the
regulatory trends around the world, the developed world has been
efficiently keeping companies hosting content on the Internet in
check and making sure they act responsibly. All of a sudden when
the "sleeping giant" awakens, ie. the developing world wanting
to do the same thing there are all kinds of marketing strategies
designed to take the focus away from the core issues. The
reality is that this is a new day, markets are being levelled,
knowledge is free and the developing world has been empowered.
[<i>Slight bunny trail: If you think about how some of these
countries were formerly under the dominion of others, where
much of their wealth and natural resources were sized to build
empires whilst their own countries lie in ruins. Countries are
now awakening to build their nations, their infrastructures,
their economies etc</i>]</div>
<div><br>
<div>Why should'nt the developing world regulate two-sided
market economies? At the end of the day, the objections to
"Taxation" are about the "bottom line" and if that is
countries' only mechanism available for making these
corporates act responsibly.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>In my view the crux of the complex debates revolving around
Regulations stems from the notion of "borders". Countries have
the responsibility of looking out for their respective
interests.</div>
<div><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Aug 19, 2012 at 1:45 AM,
Fouad Bajwa <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:fouadbajwa@gmail.com" target="_blank">fouadbajwa@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<p dir="ltr">I was asked an interesting question today by
a colleague on the discussion about Google's
interference in national electronic commerce/e-payment,
privacy and ITU-ITRs positions in developing countries
in Asia. </p>
<p dir="ltr">She asked whether developing countries should
regulate two-sided market economies where the platforms
were US based content and services providers and tax
them and design laws to prevent their interference
within a sovereign country's policies?</p>
<span><font color="#888888">
<p dir="ltr">Fouad Bajwa</p>
</font></span><br>
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