<p style="margin-bottom:0cm">Dear David and Jovan,</p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm">It seems to me
that so often bad things happen because ‘we’ the ‘masses’
abdicate our responsibility to look after ourselves. ‘We’ are, or
should be, the ‘checks and balances’ that create balance in the
system. Instead of that we allow ourselves to be distracted by smoke
and mirrors and dust in the air. The jury is still out over whether
the smoke mirrors and dust in the air are deliberate distractions or
an accidental product of the current state of the world – a
by-product of information overload.</p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0cm">Mantras can be dangerous. Mantras are
supposed to “create transformation” but mantras are sometimes the
place where the ideas get stuck, as a type of self-defining infinite
loop. Things that seem valuable to me are not to stop questioning,
never to forget the need for balance, and to think comparitively, to
try as much as possible to look at things from more than one
perspective. In the end both a network and a hierarchy are probably
necessary for success.</p><p style="margin-bottom:0cm">Deirdre</p><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 15 May 2012 04:56, Jovan Kurbalija <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jovank@diplomacy.edu" target="_blank">jovank@diplomacy.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
It is a good point questioning some of the IG mantras. I wonder if
one could argue that the online world is more hierarchical and
territorial than the 'normal' world. A few points...<br>
<br>
The term 'hierarchy' is used so loosely, mainly in a negative
context. It is a part of a government-bashing trend. But, hierarchy
was not invented by bureaucrats as I heard at one recent conference
in Geneva. It is a natural (or even mathematical) principle of
making order. In human society, the main question is what the nature
of the hierarchy is. Is it fixed and blocked by political, family,
or economic reasons or open to newcomers? In the online world, you
have hierarchy everywhere. How many followers do you have on
Twitter or Facebook? How does your website rank on Google? The
possibility that you may start your online business anywhere does
not work easily in practice. Zuckerberg had to go to Silicon Valley
and identify various hierarchies (venture capital, engineers,
marketing) that helped him to make Facebook a great success. In many
cases hierarchy is not explicit, but this does not mean that it does
not exist. Paradoxically, in a way, governments are honest by making
their hierarchies explicit (military, diplomatic and diplomatic
ranks)?<br>
<br>
Another modern mantra is the 'end of territoriality'. You know the
usual arguments that you can hear in IG parlance... the Internet is
free from territorial bonds, etc. Is it true? Not necessarily. Our
location can be easily identified via geo-location, GPS, and other
devices. The fact that we can be ANYwhere (virtuality) does not mean
that we can be NOwhere. And, when we are SOMEwhere we are more
territorial in our online worlds than in our traditional worlds.<br>
<br>
Should we revisit these - and other - mantras?<div><div class="h5"><br>
<br>
<br>
On 5/15/12 12:28 AM, David Allen wrote:
<blockquote type="cite">This question - of what might be some new form of
governance - is a perennial for IGC. We have circled around it,
by now several times.
<br>
<br>
To note some of points of discussion:
<br>
<br>
From Wolfgang
<br>
May 13, 2012 4:59:24 AM EDT
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">a body which is able to produce rough
consensus
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
Consensus implies legitimacy. In the case of civil society, that
encompasses several billion folks.
<br>
<br>
A handful of individuals, debating on a listserve, just are not -
in the end - able to proclaim, with any credibility, that
consensus.
<br>
<br>
Very much more to the point - aggregating all the many, many views
is one crux of the question. As below.
<br>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">hierarchical thinking of the 20th century.
What we need is a network thinking for the 21st century
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
Hierarchy is gone, network is in?
<br>
<br>
Humans have been operating with social networks for thousands of
years, at the least. Most decidedly there is nothing new
underlying, certainly not on account of a calendar system that by
happenstance turned a triple zero number, 2000 ... Nor have the
hierarchical inclinations, also hard-wired into the genome,
suddenly gone into hibernation. Evolution does not work that way.
<br>
<br>
What could be new is some thinking that artfully understood,
better, how these weave together. To address, notably, the
aggregation of views question.
<br>
<br>
As indeed Parminder asks
<br>
May 13, 2012 5:53:44 AM EDT
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">tell us clearly what would be the
structure of this new mechanism, what functions will it perform,
and how, what would be its outcomes and how will they be
implemented.
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Then again from Wolfgang
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">CS was invited to WSIS, now we are here
and we want to participate in Realpolitik. To give us a seat on
the table
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
On the one side, Realpolitik alerts that power is the underlying
issue. Those who have it - governments, particularly of the North;
increasingly BRIC countries et al,; several large private actors;
among others - will not be ceding that power without good reason.
As the interminable discussion of EC illustrates.
<br>
<br>
At the same time on the other side, the prospect for some new,
more suitable arrangements - as Wolfgang brings up - do turn it
seems on an appeal to “more democracy.” A shibboleth that may,
because its claims are sound, be more than a rallying cry for
change. Power may actually shift.
<br>
<br>
A robust democracy, built from understanding the mix of hierarchy
and network, one that actually achieves legitimate aggregation of
views - in other words, this could be a democracy that actually
moves toward lofty goals.
<br>
<br>
<br>
As Paul Lehto has said more than once, but once again here
<br>
May 8, 2012 2:28:06 PM EDT
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">the "stakeholder" stuff can at most only
be seen as an intermediate and transition-state to real
democracy.
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
<br>
WSIS Forum week, MAG, IGF consultations, EC the end of the week -
these will all take our time. In the meantime these large
questions will not go away.
<br>
<br>
David
<br>
<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-autospace:none"><b><span>Jovan <span>Kurbalija</span>, PhD<u></u><u></u></span></b></p>
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<br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br>“The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979<br>