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<FONT FACE="Calibri, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:11pt'>Hi Don, you wrote<BR>
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></SPAN></FONT><FONT SIZE="2"><FONT FACE="Verdana, Helvetica, Arial"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:10pt'>There would appear to be a loan (sic) voice on this forum promoting both a need for a membership database as well as a need for the Charter to be changed.<BR>
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Most of us past co ordinators at least would see a membership database as a positive step forward and an easing of administrative work. Jeremy is not alone here and the debate is probably more about the form of a database rather than the need for one.<BR>
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As well, many if not most of the lists subscribers would by now realise that there is a need for the Charter to be revised in several respects. But that’s an undertaking that is going to need a group to take action. (I am not volunteering!)<BR>
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So I dont think Jeremy is acting alone. The silence of the majority of people on this list with the current discussions might have more to do with having discussed these issues before, or perhaps being disinterested in matters of administrative process and more interested in internet governance issues. I don’t think you can take relative silence to mean that everyone agrees with the points you make.<BR>
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Ian Peter<BR>
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<HR ALIGN=CENTER SIZE="3" WIDTH="95%"><B>From: </B>Don Cameron <<a href="dg_cameron@bigpond.com">dg_cameron@bigpond.com</a>><BR>
<B>Reply-To: </B><<a href="governance@lists.cpsr.org">governance@lists.cpsr.org</a>>, Don Cameron <<a href="dg_cameron@bigpond.com">dg_cameron@bigpond.com</a>><BR>
<B>Date: </B>Mon, 10 Jan 2011 06:35:22 +1100<BR>
<B>To: </B><<a href="governance@lists.cpsr.org">governance@lists.cpsr.org</a>>, David Goldstein <<a href="goldstein_david@yahoo.com.au">goldstein_david@yahoo.com.au</a>><BR>
<B>Subject: </B>RE: [governance] Phase 2 of improvements to the IGC Web site<BR>
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</SPAN></FONT><FONT SIZE="2"><FONT FACE="Verdana, Helvetica, Arial"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:10pt'>> Additionally, if "the current membership list is on the basis of those who voted in the last election," what happens to those who did not vote for whatever reason?<BR>
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David this point is exactly my concern and the reason I entered this conversation – We cannot claim professionalism unless we follow open and proper process.<BR>
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In several unfortunate personalisation’s I and others have loosely been described as ‘lurkers’; ‘internet old timers’, and now in defining the right to abstain from voting, as someone who ‘doesn’t want to vote’ – yet none of these negative descriptors address the very real issue of one persons interpretation of an organisational Charter being used to discriminate against membership. That’s what this discussion is all about.<BR>
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Power building – yes. Democratic – no. <BR>
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There would appear to be a loan voice on this forum promoting both a need for a membership database as well as a need for the Charter to be changed. A majority would appear to be against such change; yet change is happening regardless.<BR>
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The right of members for lazy consensus before the implementation of any change is discarded for the sake of one person’s interpretation of systems expediency.<BR>
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Is this a right and proper process?<BR>
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Don <BR>
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</SPAN></FONT><FONT SIZE="2"><FONT FACE="Tahoma, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:10pt'><B>From:</B> <a href="governance-request@lists.cpsr.org">governance-request@lists.cpsr.org</a> [<a href="mailto:governance-request@lists.cpsr.org">mailto:governance-request@lists.cpsr.org</a>] <B>On Behalf Of </B>David Goldstein<BR>
<B>Sent:</B> Sunday, 9 January 2011 11:52 PM<BR>
<B>To:</B> <a href="governance@lists.cpsr.org">governance@lists.cpsr.org</a>; Jeremy Malcolm; Don Cameron<BR>
<B>Subject:</B> Re: [governance] Phase 2 of improvements to the IGC Web site<BR>
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</SPAN></FONT><FONT SIZE="2"><FONT FACE="Verdana, Helvetica, Arial"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:10pt'>This process is absurd Jeremy and makes a mockery any sort of a democracy.<BR>
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It seems like empire building for the sake of empire building. Ten year old kids couldn't make more of a mess of this in organising a school play club. Actually, they'd do a much better job.<BR>
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Additionally, if "the current membership list is on the basis of those who voted in the last election," what happens to those who did not vote for whatever reason?<BR>
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David<BR>
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<FONT SIZE="2"><FONT FACE="Tahoma, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:10pt'><B>From:</B> Jeremy Malcolm <<a href="jeremy@ciroap.org">jeremy@ciroap.org</a>><BR>
<B>To:</B> Don Cameron <<a href="dg_cameron@bigpond.com">dg_cameron@bigpond.com</a>>; <a href="governance@lists.cpsr.org">governance@lists.cpsr.org</a><BR>
<B>Sent:</B> Sun, 9 January, 2011 10:39:56 PM<BR>
<B>Subject:</B> Re: [governance] Phase 2 of improvements to the IGC Web site<BR>
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</SPAN></FONT><FONT FACE="Times New Roman"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:12pt'>On 09/01/2011, at 7:09 PM, Don Cameron wrote:<BR>
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</SPAN></FONT><FONT FACE="Calibri, Verdana, Helvetica, Arial"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:11pt'>The charter further defines self modification (moves to change the charter) as follows: “In amending the charter, everyone who voted in the previous election will be deemed a member for amending the charter”.<BR>
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This certainly impacts on the right to vote for charter modifications, however it otherwise has no impact on membership.<BR>
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</SPAN></FONT><FONT FACE="Times New Roman"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:12pt'>Well, so some say, but others (including myself) interpret it otherwise. The current membership list is on the basis of those who voted in the last election. If we want to clarify this, we need to amend the charter.<BR>
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</SPAN></FONT><FONT FACE="Times New Roman"><SPAN STYLE='font-size:12pt'>In other news, I have properly fixed the LDAP errors that were preventing people from editing their profiles to add extra optional profile information (such as addresses and phone numbers), after they had registered. Sorry about that.<BR>
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