I think it all depends on what you are trying to accomplish. From my perspective - I'm not sure how devilish - the whole process is about encouraging people to think about different things and possibly in different ways. To make different connections (of ideas and also with people) than the ones they were making before.<div>
So I would argue that the IGF has accomplished, and that the national and regional IGFs are evidence of that accomplishment. If it had accomplished nothing then there would be no regional and national imitators.</div><div>
<font class="Apple-style-span" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">I would also suggest that the regional and national IGFs often create different combinations of people than are present in the "existing national institutions", and that in itself is an achievement.</font></div>
<div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">The "devil's advocate" argument seems to lead inexorably to "let's not bother at all" which is, I suppose, another way of looking at things.</font></div>
<div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">Deirdre</font></div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 13 November 2010 11:36, Milton L Mueller <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:mueller@syr.edu">mueller@syr.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple"><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D">Dierdre,</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D">Let’s play devil’s advocate: Why are regional and national IGFs a “huge outcome?” </span></p><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D">If a global IGF doesn’t accomplish anything, multiplication of the model at lower levels doesn’t accomplish anything, either, right? </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D">In particular, what do national IGF’s accomplish that are not possible within the framework of existing national institutions? </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:#1F497D"> </span></p><div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt"><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt"> Deirdre Williams [mailto:<a href="mailto:williams.deirdre@gmail.com" target="_blank">williams.deirdre@gmail.com</a>] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, November 13, 2010 8:22 AM<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:governance@lists.cpsr.org" target="_blank">governance@lists.cpsr.org</a>; Ginger Paque<br><b>Cc:</b> McTim; Izumi AIZU; <a href="mailto:cstd@igf-online.net" target="_blank">cstd@igf-online.net</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [governance] DRAFT IGC Response to Questionnaire on improvements</span></p></div></div><div><div></div><div class="h5"><p class="MsoNormal"> </p><p class="MsoNormal">I have a problem anyway about "tangible outcomes" - I can feel Rui breathing down my neck :-)</p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal">I feel that the proliferation of national and regional IGFs is a HUGE outcome which can certainly be demonstrated and documented if not actually touched.</p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Also, as Ginger suggests, remote participation and the access it affords to the previously excluded.</p>
</div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Galvanising a huge chunk of the whole world into some type of action - holding national and regional meetings - in just 5 years, is something like finding Archimedes lever, and I think we should look at it like that.</p>
</div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Under #2 I wonder whether it would be possible to produce brief summary reports, in layman's language, WITHOUT ANY ACRONYMS, for dissemination to those who are currently "outsiders".</p>
</div><div><p class="MsoNormal">Also I wish we could think of a "sexy" approach to involve the print and broadcast media in spreading the word. A comic strip? A soap opera?</p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div><div><p class="MsoNormal">#3 I am from a developing country. Recently an NGO here had a problem for which it hired consultants. It then transpired that the same problem had been addressed by consultants 10 years ago, and the report, the recommendations, had sat on the shelf, unused, essentially "lost", for 10 years. Recommendations may be tangible but they are frequently seen as an end in themselves rather than being a plan for a "way forward". I am rather "anti" about recommendations, unless they are accompanied by some type of actual "implementation".</p>
</div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal">#4 para 2 there is an important "not" missing I think - <span><span style="font-size:10.0pt"> "have NOT yet gained sufficient level of work at IGF" </span></span></p>
</div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span><span>I like #6b and I LOVE #6e :-)</span></span></p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><span><span>Thank you for making the draft</span></span></p>
</div><div><p class="MsoNormal"> </p></div><div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span><span>Deirdre</span></span></p><div><p class="MsoNormal">On 13 November 2010 08:33, Ginger Paque <<a href="mailto:gpaque@gmail.com" target="_blank">gpaque@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</p>
<div><p class="MsoNormal"><span>I agree with McTim strongly on this...<br>There is no reason to emphasize a 'negative' position on achieving the assigned outcome.<br><br>In fact, I think it makes more sense to note that there have been many have been tangible and intangible positive outcomes directly/indirectly from the IGF process, beyond awareness-raising and bringing IG issues to regional IGF meetings--what about the emergence and development of the multistakeholder model? How about the advances in remote participation, permitting greater inclusion in global policy processes? What about the diffusion and replication of best practices? <br>
<br>The question doesn't ask about our frustration, it asks what we consider the most important achievement. If we must point out the frustration, should it not at least be balanced by appreciation for \ the positive effects? At least we should answer the question!<br>
<br>Thanks for doing this work. Much appreciated. I am in the middle of a workshop in Tobago, and have not reviewed carefully. I think others should voice their positions as well.</span></p><div><p style="margin-bottom:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt">
<b><span><br><span style="color:#333333">Ginger (Virginia) Paque<br></span></span></b><span style="color:#333333">IGCBP Online Coordinator<br>DiploFoundation</span><span><br><a href="http://www.diplomacy.edu/ig" target="_blank">www.diplomacy.edu/ig</a> </span></p>
<p style="margin-bottom:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt"><b><span style="color:black">The latest from Diplo...</span></b><span style="color:black"><br><a href="http://igbook.diplomacy.edu/" target="_blank">http://igbook.diplomacy.edu </a>is the online companion to <i>An Introduction to Internet Governance, </i>Diplo's publication on IG. Download the book, read the blogs and post your comments. </span></p>
</div><div><p class="MsoNormal"><br>On 11/12/2010 10:58 PM, McTim wrote: </p><pre>Pretty good reply overall.</pre><pre> </pre><pre>I would strike "Yet we still have not seen real tangible outcome</pre><pre>directly out of IGF process."</pre>
<pre> </pre><pre>As there are not supposed to be real tangible outcomes, are there??</pre><pre> </pre></div></div><p class="MsoNormal"><br>____________________________________________________________<br>You received this message as a subscriber on the list:<br>
<a href="mailto:governance@lists.cpsr.org" target="_blank">governance@lists.cpsr.org</a><br>To be removed from the list, send any message to:<br> <a href="mailto:governance-unsubscribe@lists.cpsr.org" target="_blank">governance-unsubscribe@lists.cpsr.org</a><br>
<br>For all list information and functions, see:<br> <a href="http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance" target="_blank">http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance</a><br><br>Translate this email: <a href="http://translate.google.com/translate_t" target="_blank">http://translate.google.com/translate_t</a></p>
</div><p class="MsoNormal"><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>“The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979</p></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote>
</div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>“The fundamental cure for poverty is not money but knowledge" Sir William Arthur Lewis, Nobel Prize Economics, 1979<br>