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<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Suresh<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=msolistparagraph style='margin-left:0in'><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>></span></font><font
size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:
Calibri;color:#1F497D'> There’s no meaningful consensus likely to be
achieved, especially with politically charged proposals<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>But before we explore what CAN happen, the
issue is what are OUR political views on this matter. Which way WE want it to
go. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=msolistparagraph style='margin-left:0in'><font size=2 color=navy
face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>> </span></font><font
size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:
Calibri;color:#1F497D'>DoC isn’t going to give up oversight, no matter
what kind of pipe dream proposals emanate from IGF, IGP etc<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>The prior issue still remains whether you/
we are a part of that ‘pipe-dream’ or not. Are you happy with DoC’s
oversight ? Lets state our political priorities upfront rather than put up the
smokescreen of what may or may not ‘practically’ happen. (That’s
often the obvious viewpoint/ strategy of those happy with the status quo.) And if
we don’t have any political views on this matter at all let that be stated
too…<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Civil society advocacy is having political
views and fighting for them… do you think developed countries are going
to increase development aid to close to 1 percent of their GDP, are they going
to agree to development-friendly trade policy, will they allow public domain to
proliferate in face of IP-fueled economic growth plans, would they accept disproportionate
(fairly so) emission control norms for themselves………………..<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>So, why is civil society ever even
bothering with these issue or pipe dreams…. You are an Indian, what would
you have thought of all efforts of freedom fighters in early decades of the
last century… pipe dreams?<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>So before we speak about what may happen
lets know what do you/ we want…. And if we just don’t bother say
that as well.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>When you speak of ‘</span></font><font
size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:
Calibri;color:#1F497D'>extraordinarily vocal sections of civ soc’ </span></font><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>I do not know</span></font><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'> </span></font><font
size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;
color:navy'>whom do you speak of and why would you want them to be less vocal. I
thought IGC tries to provide space and possibilities for a greater voice for
civil society. Or do you mean ONLY some sections of CS are ‘extra-ordinarily’
vocal, in that case which are these sections of the CS whose voice you think gets
suppressed in the process, and which you may want to promote. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>So, in the context of the present thread
of discussion, it is isn’t enough to make the observation ‘there isn’t
any IGF’. We need also to state if we really want any IGF as such, and if
so what IGF. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Parminder <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
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face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'>
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<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> Suresh
Ramasubramanian [mailto:suresh@hserus.net] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, February 06, 2008
4:39 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> governance@lists.cpsr.org;
'Parminder'; 'Milton L Mueller'; 'Jeremy Malcolm'<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [governance] Re: [IGP-ANNOUNCE]
IGP Alert: Reforming ICANN Oversight: A Historic Opportunity</span></font><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>There isn’t
any “IGF” as such – only some extraordinarily vocal sections
of civ soc, some sections of government (which may be a bit different, in some
cases, from the GAC regulars), some industry etc. Yes there’d be a
substantial cross section of these that are active in ICANN, but ..<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=msolistparagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:
Calibri;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>1.<font size=1
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>There’s
no meaningful consensus likely to be achieved, especially with politically
charged proposals<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=msolistparagraph style='text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:
Calibri;color:#1F497D'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>2.<font size=1
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font size=2 color="#1f497d"
face=Calibri><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'>DoC
isn’t going to give up oversight, no matter what kind of pipe dream
proposals emanate from IGF, IGP etc<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color="#1f497d" face=Calibri><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:Calibri;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2
face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> Parminder
[mailto:parminder@itforchange.net] <br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, February 06, 2008
12:03 PM<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> governance@lists.cpsr.org;
'Milton L Mueller'; 'Jeremy Malcolm'<br>
<b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> RE: [governance] Re:
[IGP-ANNOUNCE] IGP Alert: Reforming ICANN Oversight: A Historic Opportunity<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:
12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3
face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'>So
which is this IGF that wont like an ICANN accountable to it.... and why ?????<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'>This is a set of probing
questions. And if Jeremy's observation be true, would it not signify a captured
institution. I am not jumping to any conclusions (as yet) but drawing
implications from some elements of this discussion, which probably will provoke
more debate in this important area.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span
style='font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'>Parminder <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=MsoPlainText><font size=2 face="Courier New"><span style='font-size:
10.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
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