[governance] Rwanda and media

Thu Oct 4 22:04:11 EDT 2007

Well, there is plenty of evidence to suggest that Chavez isn't using tyranny. I've been having discussions with a Venezuelan bloke here in Sydney who was vehemently opposed to Chavez when we first discussed him. But the more he reads etc the more unsure he becomes, and the more. In our last email he wrote, "I'm confronted with the paradox, of the more I know the more I realise that I don't know... It was easy to be completely anti Chavez..."

There is also plenty of evidence to suggest he is righting wrongs from previous governments where deals have been done to favour the establishment. And this has caused outrage against from the establishment.

There is much more to Chavez than his outspoken words against the US, including education policies ensuring people (at least some) who would have never received an education under previous governments are now receiving one.

David
----- Original Message ----
From: Milton L Mueller <mueller at syr.edu>
To: governance at lists.cpsr.org; Rui Correia <correia.rui at gmail.com>; Carlos Afonso <ca at rits.org.br>
Sent: Friday, 5 October, 2007 11:22:10 AM
Subject: RE: [governance] Rwanda and media

<!--
 _filtered {font-family:Tahoma;panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;}
/* Style Definitions */
 p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal
	{margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman";}
a:link, span.MsoHyperlink
	{color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}
a:visited, span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed
	{color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}
p
	{margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman";}
span.EmailStyle19
	{font-family:Arial;color:navy;}
 _filtered {margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;}
div.Section1
	{}
-->

No time now to get into the details of
 Venezuela , but my opposition to
 US coercion is
consistent over time, I do not need to be lectured about it. I do hope that
dialogue about freedom of expression does not fall into the trap of justifying
tyranny on the basis of who the tyranny is used against. Thats what the
 US does (we must intervene to stop
communism/terrorism/etc) and thats what Hugop does (I must have absolute
power because Im the savior against the
 US ). False dichotomy. Thought these
kinds of debates died with the Cold War but I guess not. 

From: Rui Correia
[mailto:correia.rui at gmail.com] 

Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2007
10:25 AM

To: governance at lists.cpsr.org ;
Carlos Afonso

Subject: Re: [governance]
 Rwanda and
media

I would urge that those
who get their worldview from the likes of CNN look deeper before pointing
fingers at "third world countries" when clarion calls of trampled
democracy start blaring. People would better serve democracy (and in this case,
media freedom, freedom of information) if they paid more attention at what the
FCC in the US 
is allowing the networks to get away with. Because like it or not (barring now
a EU with muscle to set its own course) whatever gets done in the
 US tends to
ripple out across the world. The problem is that it hapens in small doses, but
continuously, never enough to cause the alarm bells to go off. At any rate,
civil society's stake is being chiselled away at, and the arbiter is not doing
its job.

The real dangers to democracy is whether or not Venezuela renews a TV licence,
but when the government that claims to be the superpower and world policeman
tramples on Geneva conventions and tortues men and women in Guantanamo, miles
away from the government they have for decades called a tyranny, while in Iraq
they outdid Saddam's brutality at Abu Graib.

[]s

Rui

*PS lack of time a while back prevented me form finishing a log piece I was
penning together on CNN as nothing but an extension of the
 US vision of
the world. It no longer has the same agenda as the CNN that we saw reporting
from the Baghdad Hotel when the first Bush went after Saddam. But there are
people on this list far better informed then me on the issue, so who know they
might want to post something on it. Otherwise, subscibe to the likes of Kevin
Tagland's BENTON'S COMMUNICATIONS-RELATED HEADLINES, http://www.benton.org and
Timothy Karr's FreePress.org (I think Timothy has hust left, but www.FreePress.org is still there.
Alternatively, you might want to amuse yourself with google looking up things
like "CIA interference in Latin Ameria"/ Brazil /
 Venezuela /
you name it. "Council on Foreign Relations" etc etc. 

On 04/10/2007, Carlos
Afonso <
ca at rits.org.br > wrote:

Dr Müller's remark misses the point regarding Chavez on two counts: the

first is rightly pointed out by David -- the elites (with the near

exclusive privilege of disseminating their views through the big media)

do not like that others keep telling them they are in power for

centuries and have been making sure that there continues to be just a 

few well-off and a smashing majority of very poor in Latin
 America . If

there is a success story of the elites in LA, this is it.

The second is that Chavez did not take away the licence. It expired and

the government has the prerrogative to renew it or not. Terms of the 

contract say explicitly the incumbent network will not engage in

demoralizing a constitutionally elected government (this and similar

restrictions were not created by Chavez, they are part of nearly all

radio and TV concessions in democratic countries). The renewal referred 

to the open air TV licence only, but the same conservative media group

continues to operate through cable TV (which is fine for them, the ones

who have cable TV in Venezuela are the ones who generally support the 

opposition, the upper classes who are mostly opposed to Chavez, so they

are happily talking to each other). If Chavez were really bound to do

what the Murdoch gang keeps telling us, he would just block the group's 

access to cable TV as well.

We are here right now in a similar process in
 Brazil , but the outcome

will quite probably be different. The Globo/Slim media group has several

radio and TV channel licences expiring or expired (as do most of the 

other big private networks), and civil society organizations are

mobilized to open up discussion regarding renewal of hundreds of these

public concessions. Frequency spectrum is an asset of the commons and

the State is its guardian on behalf of the people, so there is a need to 

discuss whether the current incumbents deserve renewal -- strictly

speaking, most do not, as they have violated on many counts the terms of

their concession contracts for proper use of an asset of the commons. A 

lot similar with the private appropriation for profit of the Internet

critical resources we will be discussing in Rio .

Another point is that Chavez did not do a coup d'état, American style

(meaning Somozas, Pinochets and the sort) -- to the contrary, the
 USA 

stimulated a coup d'état against him which failed miserably in a few

days. He did all he did (with imperfections, mistakes and whatever,

please point us to a regime anywhere in the developing world which is 

perfect...) within the legal political system of the country. Sorry for

the elitist opposition if he won, but he won through elections and

plebiscites. The rest is the anti-Chavez political campaigning through

Murdoch's networks and their kin. BTW, a similar process is now going on 

in Ecuador ,
with the economist Correa at the head, legally elected in a

constitutional democracy. I wonder what the big international media

corporations will be telling us all about him? Very soon there will be 

no Correa's government, but "Correa's regime" etc etc...

[]s fraternos

--c.a.

David Goldstein wrote:

> Milton said "Look at how Hugo Chavez
is using media licensing rules 

> in Venezuela 
."

>

> I find this a bit rich. The media in
 Venezuela has oppressed the poor

> for decades, and when someone stands up to the media, who represent

> the upper classes, they are branded as being censorious. Obviously it 

> would be better if Chavez did not take away the licence for the TV

> station it would be better. But then,
 Venezuela has been a tool of

> the rich to exploit the poor for a long time.

>

> I agree with the rest of his points though. 

>

> David

>

>

> ----- Original Message ---- From: Milton L
 Mueller <mueller at syr.edu
>

> To: governance at lists.cpsr.org
; KovenRonald at aol.com
Cc:

> Embench at aol.com Sent:
Thursday, 4 October, 2007 5:35:04 AM Subject:

> [governance] Rwanda 
and media 

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> <!-- _filtered {font-family:Tahoma;panose-1:2 11 6 4 3 5 4 4 2 4;} /*

> Style Definitions */ p.MsoNormal, li.MsoNormal, div.MsoNormal

> {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times

> New Roman";} a:link, span.MsoHyperlink

> {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;} a:visited, 

> span.MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;} p

>

> {margin-right:0in;margin-left:0in;font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times

> New Roman";} span.EmailStyle18 {font-family:Arial;color:navy;} 

> _filtered {margin:1.0in 1.25in 1.0in 1.25in;} div.Section1 {} -->

>

>

>

>

>

>

> I agree with Rony. And I would ask advocates of media restrictions

> whether they believe that the existence of government rules 

> regulating the media in Rwanda 
would have prevented the genocide. Who

> would have promulgated, monitored and enforced those rules in
 Rwanda

> ? Which ethnic faction? Which independent judges? When the state is 

> nothing but an armed gang, and all disputes are settled by force, the

> idea that the media can be regulated to enforce civility is

> self-evidently nonsensical. In those cases, media regulations simply 

> become another tool for the dominant party to oppress the others.

> Look at how Hugo Chavez is using media licensing rules in
 Venezuela .

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> 

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> From: KovenRonald at aol.com
[mailto:KovenRonald at aol.com
]

>

>

>

>

>

>

> RMC was in fact a weapon in a civil war, and it would have been

> justified to bomb it out of existence if it could have been found.

>

>

> 

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> No virus found in this outgoing message.

>

> Checked by AVG Free Edition.

>

> Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.39/1044 - Release Date:

> 10/2/2007 11:10 AM

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> Sick of deleting your inbox? Yahoo!7 Mail has free unlimited storage. 

>  http://au.docs.yahoo.com/mail/unlimitedstorage.html

>

>

> 

> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ 

>

>

> No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition.

>  Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.14.0/1049 - Release
Date:

> 4/10/2007 08:59

--

Carlos A. Afonso 

Rio       Brasil

***************************************************************

Projeto Sacix - Apoio técnico a iniciativas de inclusão digital

com software livre, mantido pela Rits em colaboração com o

Coletivo Digital. Para mais informações: 

www.sacix.org.br  
www.rits.org.br  
www.coletivodigital.org.br

*************************************************************** 

____________________________________________________________

You received this message as a subscriber on the list:

     governance at lists.cpsr.org

To be removed from the list, send any message to: 

     governance-unsubscribe at lists.cpsr.org

For all list information and functions, see: 

     http://lists.cpsr.org/lists/info/governance 

-- 

________________________________________________

Rui Correia

Advocacy, Human Rights, Media and Language Consultant

2 Cutten St

 Horison 

  Roodepoort-Johannesburg , 

 South Africa

Tel/ Fax (+27-11) 766-4336

Cell (+27) (0) 84-498-6838 

No virus
found in this incoming message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.39/1044 - Release Date: 10/2/2007
11:10 AM

No virus found in this outgoing message.

Checked by AVG Free Edition.

Version: 7.5.488 / Virus Database: 269.13.39/1044 - Release Date: 10/2/2007 11:10 AM

      Sick of deleting your inbox? Yahoo!7 Mail has free unlimited storage.
http://au.docs.yahoo.com/mail/unlimitedstorage.html
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.igcaucus.org/pipermail/governance/attachments/20071004/cffb57a8/attachment.htm>
-------------- next part --------------
An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed...
Name: message-footer.txt
URL: <http://lists.igcaucus.org/pipermail/governance/attachments/20071004/cffb57a8/attachment.txt>