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    <div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 29/10/18 5:01 PM, farzaneh badii
      wrote:<br>
    </div>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAN1qJvA-x8urbOyJxeq4Vv+nN-qbDCMrUfHv8ARLO1nM+nw2cQ@mail.gmail.com">
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        <div dir="auto">Very much agree Nigel. </div>
        <div dir="auto"><br>
        </div>
        <div dir="auto">And using the political environment and this
          election which has made people suffer just to repeat the old
          baseless argument that it was the neoliberals fault is
          absolutely wrong in my opinion. <br>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <p>Interesting, very few people actually defend neo-liberalism, esp
      in global civil society groups. But sure, you well may... <br>
    </p>
    <p> Evidently, from Trump to Brexit to Bolsorno, and I am not
      mentioning a few other names, very similar things are happening
      across the world.... Obviously that kind of seemingly unconnected
      very similar events need a theory to explain. You dont agree with
      mine, so may I ask what is yours... What do you think is
      happening? I do not think that a politically active and mature CS
      group should just comment on such important events without any
      analysis, much less 'what to do', at all. <br>
    </p>
    <p>And to Nigel's comment below. "<span>The spirit of the people of
        Brazil cannot be eradicated by one man.". You really think
        Bolsorno is one man?</span></p>
    <p><span>parminder <br>
      </span> </p>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <p><br>
    </p>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAN1qJvA-x8urbOyJxeq4Vv+nN-qbDCMrUfHv8ARLO1nM+nw2cQ@mail.gmail.com">
      <div><br>
        <div class="gmail_quote">
          <div dir="ltr">On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 12:28 AM Nigel Hickson
            <<a href="mailto:nigel.hickson@icann.org"
              moz-do-not-send="true">nigel.hickson@icann.org</a>>
            wrote:<br>
          </div>
          <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
            .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
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                <p class="MsoNormal"><span>Good morning </span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span>The spirit of the people of
                    Brazil cannot be eradicated by one man.  Bad leaders
                    come and (hopefully) go; </span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span>Best</span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span>Nigel </span></p>
                <p class="MsoNormal"><span> </span></p>
                <div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df
                  1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
                  <p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
                        style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From: </span></b><span
                      style="font-size:12.0pt;color:black"><<a
                        href="mailto:bestbits-request@lists.bestbits.net"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">bestbits-request@lists.bestbits.net</a>>
                      on behalf of Carolina Rossini <<a
                        href="mailto:carolina.rossini@gmail.com"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">carolina.rossini@gmail.com</a>><br>
                      <b>Reply-To: </b>Carolina Rossini <<a
                        href="mailto:carolina.rossini@gmail.com"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">carolina.rossini@gmail.com</a>><br>
                      <b>Date: </b>Monday, 29 October 2018 at 06:15<br>
                      <b>To: </b>parminder <<a
                        href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">parminder@itforchange.net</a>><br>
                      <b>Cc: </b>"<a
                        href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</a>"
                      <<a href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net"
                        target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</a>><br>
                      <b>Subject: </b>[Ext] Re: [bestbits] OFF-TOPIC -
                      Brazil: Return to Terror</span></p>
                </div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                </div>
                <div>
                  <div>
                    <p class="MsoNormal">Wow! I agree with Parminder!
                      Ah!</p>
                  </div>
                </div>
                <div>
                  <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                  <div>
                    <div>
                      <p class="MsoNormal">On Sun, Oct 28, 2018 at 10:13
                        PM parminder <<a
                          href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net"
                          target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">parminder@itforchange.net</a>>
                        wrote:</p>
                    </div>
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                      <div>
                        <p> </p>
                        <div>
                          <p class="MsoNormal">On 29/10/18 3:47 AM, <a
                              href="mailto:ian.peter@ianpeter.com"
                              target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">ian.peter@ianpeter.com</a>
                            wrote:</p>
                        </div>
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                          style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">Very sad that this has
                              happened, Carlos. Lurches to the right
                              seem commonplace these days. </p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">Brazil was a great
                              leader as regards multistakeholder
                              internet governance initiatives, and I do
                              hope that all is not lost with this
                              change. Certainly what has been achieved
                              in the past sets a great example and part
                              of history which I hope is not forgotten.</p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">Ian</p>
                          </div>
                        </blockquote>
                        <p> </p>
                        <p>I dont want to make capital out of
                          unfortunate times, but truth is as important
                          to speak out at such times, if we are not just
                          to make pro forma regrets but to look ahead
                          with vision and purpose, and thus any real
                          hope....</p>
                        <p>Dear Ian, do you really think that a
                          multistakeholder model which culminated in
                          trying to install a World Economic Forum based
                          global Internet Governance regime instead of a
                          UN based one was itself not a lurch to right?
                          That is also history that must not be
                          forgotten, and released from its
                          responsibilities.</p>
                        <p>The current Trumpian phenomenon is precisely
                          the product of a trans-national elite seeking
                          their common economic advantages often using
                          the cover of social liberalism without
                          economic egalitarianism -- where market
                          without political governance was to be the
                          defender of rights! This is a direct result of
                          promotion of an one-sided talk of human rights
                          -- only civil and political ones and not
                          social and economic ones, which have openly
                          been flouted even ridiculed on , yes, IG civil
                          society lists.... Dot ask me for real
                          examples, bec I have followed this and I know
                          many.... Ok, take two, the very concept and
                          not just the real implementation of 'public
                          interest' has been ridiculed on the NCUC (of
                          ICANN's)website, to which many CS stalwarts of
                          IG belong. A key leader of CS community has
                          said 'social justice' is a meaningless
                          concept, another that the term 'democracy
                          carries baggage', and when appeals (like at
                          UNESCO's key Paris meeting on IG) were
                          circulated to simply ensure that social and
                          economic rights get mentioned along with civil
                          and public rights in the conf document there
                          wasnt much sympathy on these lists.. And yes,
                          also when all progressive civil society is
                          fighting for a binding treaty on human rights
                          abuses by corporations, key leaders write here
                          why any such thing is a bad idea .... .I can
                          go on  and on ...</p>
                        <p>And so lets not assume innocence about this
                          creeping death of progressive and democratic
                          ideals that the global trans-national elite
                          has brought on us in blind pursuit of their
                          global economic interests (Zizek's 'Clinton
                          not Trump is the problem' precisely captures
                          it). </p>
                        <p>This is the dispossessed reacting against the
                          global neoliberal excesses in the only ways
                          they could think of, or were made available to
                          them, however deleterious the results are
                          finally going to be for them. But lets not
                          look away from what or who is responsible
                          here.....</p>
                        <p>When we seethe  market, the embodiment of
                          un-restrained self-interest, as the
                          institution that will govern us in all areas
                          (which is the definition of neoliberalism)
                          including of rights, welfare, etc, then one
                          can very well expect a Trump and a Bolsanaro
                          to come along and say, well self-interest,
                          fine, this is what it politically is, everyone
                          fending for oneself and one's narrow
                          interests, and avowedly and unabashedly so
                          ...  Trump and Bolsorno are the other side of
                          the same trans-national neo-liberalism of
                          which Internet governance space has been a
                          key, often pioneering arena. It is a local,
                          political response of the justifiably angry
                          and dispossessed, even if a suicidal one... T
                          and B are simply neoliberalism's narrow
                          profession of unbridled self-interest without
                          the spin and false sophisticated sheen that is
                          just there to reflect away deserved criticism
                          -- it is the proverbial chickens coming home
                          to roost. </p>
                        <p>With hope and solidarity</p>
                      </div>
                      <div>
                        <p>parminder </p>
                        <p> </p>
                        <blockquote
                          style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">------ Original Message
                              ------</p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">From: "Carlos Afonso"
                              <<a href="mailto:ca@cafonso.ca"
                                target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">ca@cafonso.ca</a>></p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">To: "BestBits List"
                              <<a
                                href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net"
                                target="_blank" moz-do-not-send="true">bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</a>></p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">Sent: 28/10/2018
                              1:29:02 AM</p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal">Subject: [bestbits]
                              OFF-TOPIC - Brazil: Return to Terror</p>
                          </div>
                          <div>
                            <p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
                          </div>
                          <div
                            id="m_19142132447316494m_5884133044364644117xb71ef0e52fa84e5">
                            <blockquote
                              style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">Dear colleagues,
                                    this article may give you an idea of
                                    what might happen</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">in Brazil with the
                                    presidential elections tomorrow.</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"> </span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">Sorry for this, but
                                    the situation may be terrifying for
                                    anyone who</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">opposes the
                                    ultra-right-wing candidate. The
                                    article by Pablo Villaça (in</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">English) is an
                                    accurate review:</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"> </span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"><a
href="https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.rogerebert.com_far-2Dflung-2Dcorrespondents_brazilian-2Delection-2D2018-2Dbolsonaro&d=DwMFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=RrrXyaBfa00GH1liTedM3FwobVakuhJ-qs1N8-Ji8VE&m=cqhruVEaSZ2dxhFez02DlPN_zLCuNED-Ue1ZK4F0bZQ&s=_sE7gIYMTB6OB6pp0JT6cAgKUXDv4MOPKILUBlNWJy8&e="
                                      target="_blank"
                                      moz-do-not-send="true">https://www.rogerebert.com/far-flung-correspondents/brazilian-election-2018-bolsonaro
                                      [rogerebert.com]</a></span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"> </span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">The article is also
                                    attached in PDF.</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"> </span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">Bolsonaro threatens
                                    to liquidate all NGOs and social
                                    movements -- who</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">can choose between
                                    prison and exile. Fundamental
                                    achievements like our</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">multistakeholder
                                    Internet governance system, our
                                    Internet Bill of</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">Rights, and many
                                    other human rights-related laws are
                                    at risk.</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"> </span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">fraternal regards</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"> </span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">--c.a.</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"> </span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">--</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"> </span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">Carlos A. Afonso</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">[emails são
                                    pessoais exceto quando
                                    explicitamente indicado em
                                    contrário]</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">[emails are
                                    personal unless explicitly indicated
                                    otherwise]</span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif"> </span></p>
                              </div>
                              <div>
                                <p class="MsoNormal"><span
                                    style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier
                                    New",serif">Instituto Nupef - <a
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                                      target="_blank"
                                      moz-do-not-send="true">https://nupef.org.br
                                      [nupef.org.br]</a></span></p>
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      <pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">____________________________________________________________
You received this message as a subscriber on the list:
     <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net">bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</a>.
To unsubscribe or change your settings, visit:
     <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="http://lists.bestbits.net/wws/info/bestbits">http://lists.bestbits.net/wws/info/bestbits</a></pre>
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