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<font face="Arial">Dear all<br>
<br>
Just a clarification here on the APC Internet Rights Charter and
the use of 'multilateral'.<br>
<br>
</font>The full text in Theme 6.1 is:<br>
<br>
"Internet governance should be multilateral and democratic, with the
full involvement of governments, the private sector, civil society
and international organisations. No single government should have a
pre-eminent role in relation to international internet governance."<br>
<br>
When we drafted this text we used 'multilateral' in its dictionary
sense as meaning the involvement of multiple parties and multiple
countries. We did not mean it in the 'intergovernmental' sense.<br>
<br>
In fact.. the text that follows multilateral and democratic defines
how we understood the term: "with the full involvement of
governments, the private sector, civil society and international
organisations. No single government should have a pre-eminent role
in relation to international internet governance."<br>
<br>
Since then (remember we first drafted the charter in 2001) the term
multilateral has become loaded and is often underestood as meaning
"among governments". It was not our intention to suggest that. But
we certainly did mean that governments should be involved, and that
no one government should dominate - but in the context of the
involvement of other stakeholders too.<br>
<br>
Best<br>
<br>
Anriette<br>
<br>
<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 05/03/2014 14:29, parminder wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:531718AC.3040402@itforchange.net" type="cite">
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<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On Wednesday 05 March 2014 05:19 PM,
parminder wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:53170F61.60305@itforchange.net" type="cite">
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<br>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On Wednesday 05 March 2014 05:09
PM, Jeremy Malcolm wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:2E3D5FD7-A108-4A16-977A-2650F624CA82@Malcolm.id.au"
type="cite">
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On 5 Mar 2014, at 7:21 pm, parminder <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:parminder@itforchange.net">parminder@itforchange.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
<div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000" style="font-family:
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans:
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto;
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;">And
of course, the proposed view to be submitted on 1Net's
behalf has this all important principle, "Decisions made
with respect to Internet governance should only be made
by bodies that allow free and equitable access to all
stakeholders at all points in the decision-making
process." Well of course. Two hoots to democracy!<br>
<br>
Now I shall come to the point, of my comments on the
proposed submission to NetMundial submitted by Jeremy.<br>
<br>
I of course support and commend both APC Principles and
IRP Principles - which seem the main burden of the
submission.... BUT...<br>
<i><b><br>
</b></i><i><b>Can someone explain me the meaning of
"equitable multistakeholder participation"</b></i><span
class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>and whether it
is different from what is meant in the above statement
from 1Net's survey. If so, how.... More precisely, are
you seeking that all stakeholders, including business
reps, have equal part and role (as gov reps) in making
decisions about public policies. Please address this
point specifically.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Yes, you picked up on a key point. There was a
discussion of this on the pad where the text was
workshopped, which you can read for yourself: <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://pad.riseup.net/p/IG_principles">https://pad.riseup.net/p/IG_principles</a>.
At various times it was "parity" and "power sharing"
before it became "equitable participation", which is
somewhat flexible, to accommodate the different viewpoints
that we all have about how equal the stakeholder roles
should be.</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
<br>
I dont greatly like flexibility between democracy and
non-democracy. <br>
<br>
So, request a clear response - do you mean <i><b>parity</b></i>
in <i><b>decision making</b></i> about <i><b>public policies </b></i>between
gov and non gov actors.... </blockquote>
<br>
<br>
It is important to note that the two main Principles docs that
this CS contribution refers to speak of democracy but not
multistakeholder governance, much less 'equitable MSism'..<br>
<br>
In fact the APC Principles doc speaks of "<font face="sans-serif"><font
style="font-size: 11pt" size="3">The right to multilateral
democratic oversight of the Internet. Internet governance</font></font><font
face="sans-serif"><font style="font-size: 11pt" size="3"> should
be multilateral and democratic.</font></font>
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</style>"<br>
<br>
Obviously, what is the main, unique, and new element in this
present submission - equitable multistakeholder participation -
does not come from the 2 key docs which are claimed to be the
principle inspirations.<br>
<br>
Ok, lets next check the 3 other principles docs that are also
quoted as somewhat secondary inspirations - CGI.Br Principles, CoE
principles, and G 8 principles....<br>
<br>
In these principles docs, while all f them orepeatedly and
emphatically speak of democracy, the MS (multistakeholder) term
either does not figure (CGI.Br doc) or comes in a much much
subsidiary fashion wrt to democracy (the other two docs)<br>
<br>
Now, lets see what does your contribution - developed by civil
society actors in IG space - come up with .....<br>
<br>
There is not a single mention of 'democracy' or 'democratic' in
this doc.... Even when you guys came up with "key governance
characteristics" you could think only of " openness, transparency,
inclusivity, accountability, and <i><b>equitable multistakeholder
participation </b></i>" (emphasis added)<br>
<br>
In all your f2f meetings, and long online deliberations, did the
word 'democracy' not occur to any one at all... Or did it occur
to someone and was contributed but did not find favour in the
group.... Dont know which is worse. But both are bad enough for me
to stay away from this doc. <br>
<br>
And I appeal also to others who really believe in democracy not to
get caught in this trap that is laid for them.... This is the thin
end of the wedge, which will soon usher you into a brave new post
democratic world, that one which the neo liberals dream of.... It
is a pity that a good part of civil society has agreed to be the
Trojan Horse for the powerful warriors of the neolib order. <br>
<br>
See, how the term democracy is rejected, and phrases like
equitable multistakeholder participation (further explained in the
emerging contribution from 1 Net - principle 11 in the survey) are
getting introduced as basis of our governance. And see how exactly
it matches what some of us predicted is the prime objective at
present of the US supported status quoists to get into the text of
the outcomes from NetMundial...... All of piece.<br>
<br>
parminder<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid:53170F61.60305@itforchange.net" type="cite">And
this is not a petty point... Half of the time of the WGEC got
taken on this kind of discussion. This is the single most
important point today, if we can clarify nd possibly agree on
this point - rest is not too difficult... Lets accept what is
the key point, and not skirt it...<br>
<br>
BTW, the German government has the following to say in its
submission to NetMundial<br>
<br>
"Democratically elected governments, as the representative of
the people, possess public authority including internet-related
public policy issues and are supposed to be the main source for
legitimacy and democratic legitimation. Hence they have to
respect and protect human rights, ensure that the rule of law is
respected and that relevant national legislation complies with
their obligations under international law. Moreover, they need
to ensure that the appropriate basic conditions both in terms of
cyber-security and technical provisions are in place. Civil
society serves, and should continue to do so, as a facilitator
and notably as a source of empowerment and credibility,
especially at community level. The private sector and
particularly the technical community significantly influence and
encourage the development, distribution and accessibility of the
internet, and should continue to do so. In order to fully live
up to the potentials for economic growth, innovation, freedom of
expression, access to information and ideas and democratic
participation in a knowledge society, all stakeholders involved
need to work together."<br>
<br>
Do you for instance agree to the above formulation, or NOT...<br>
<br>
parminder <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<blockquote
cite="mid:2E3D5FD7-A108-4A16-977A-2650F624CA82@Malcolm.id.au"
type="cite">
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<div>--</div>
<div>Jeremy Malcolm PhD LLB (Hons) B Com</div>
<div>Internet lawyer, ICT policy advocate,
geek</div>
<div>host -t NAPTR 5.9.8.5.2.8.2.2.1.0.6.<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://e164.org">e164.org</a>|awk
-F! '{print $3}'</div>
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WARNING: This email has not been encrypted. You
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<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">--
------------------------------------------------------
anriette esterhuysen <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:anriette@apc.org">anriette@apc.org</a>
executive director, association for progressive communications
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="http://www.apc.org">www.apc.org</a>
po box 29755, melville 2109
south africa
tel/fax +27 11 726 1692</pre>
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