<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=windows-1252"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Hi<div><br><div><div>On Oct 15, 2013, at 4:35 PM, michael gurstein <<a href="mailto:gurstein@gmail.com">gurstein@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="font-family: Palatino; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1; "><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">Hi Bill and Avri,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "> </span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">Interesting arguments based on an assumption of significant USG Internet policy incoherence*, </span></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div>Well, Avri's statement that "NSA's goals are not NTIA's goals" doesn't necessarily translate into significant USG Internet policy incoherence. Different agencies, different missions, heretofore compatible from their standpoints. NTIA is dealing with root, IANA, ICANN contract. NSA is dealing with snooping, not really a names and numbers thing so much. The latter has made the former's work much more difficult and pushed it to accelerate efforts to figure out a way forward that would play (or at least be functionally sound and cause the least political opposition) both domestically and internationally. There's no way to know ex ante what path this will follow and whether a solution will be found or the thing crashes and burns, there are too many moving parts and cross-cutting pressures at work. Not an easy position to be in.</div><div><br></div><div>Bill</div><div><br><blockquote type="cite"><div lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple" style="font-family: Palatino; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div class="WordSection1" style="page: WordSection1; "><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">and of course you may have a deeper insight into the behaviour of the USG than others but I'm seeing the following from this quite recent policy statement from the Obama Whitehouse:<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "> </span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">MAY 2011, Prosperity, Security, and Openness in a Networked World: INTERNATIONAL STR ATEGY FOR CYBERSPACE<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><a href="http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/international_strategy_for_cyberspace.pdf" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline; ">http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/international_strategy_for_cyberspace.pdf</a><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "> </span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><b><i><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">Strength at Home<o:p></o:p></span></i></b></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><i><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "> </span></i></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><i><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">Ensuring the resilience of our networks and information systems requires collective and concerted national action that spans the whole of government, in collaboration with the private sector and individual citizens.<o:p></o:p></span></i></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "> </span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">The report goes on to outline the principles/strategy being promoted by the USG including matters of governance, internal and external security, infrastructure etc.etc.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "> </span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">A quick read of this statement is interesting background to the discussions we are about to have in Bali.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "> </span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">M<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "> </span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">*A bit surprising I would have thought given the recognition at least in the Executive Office of the long term significance of the Internet--<i>"This world—cyberspace—is a world that we depend on every single day…</i><span style="color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Barack Obama<o:p></o:p></span></span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "> </span></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125); "> </span></div><div><div style="border-style: solid none none; border-top-width: 1pt; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); padding: 3pt 0in 0in; "><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; ">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif; "><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:bestbits-request@lists.bestbits.net">bestbits-request@lists.bestbits.net</a> [mailto:bestbits-<a href="mailto:request@lists.bestbits.net">request@lists.bestbits.net</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b>On Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>William Drake<br><b>Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Tuesday, October 15, 2013 3:38 AM<br><b>To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:bestbits@lists.bestbits.net">bestbits@lists.bestbits.net</a> Bits<br><b>Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [bestbits] Do we really want to shoot in Dilma's foot?<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div><div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">Hi<br><br>On Oct 14, 2013, at 3:25 PM, Avri Doria <<a href="mailto:avri@ACM.ORG" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline; ">avri@ACM.ORG</a>> wrote:<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">Hi,<br><br>I think understanding this relies on your view of NTIA intentions.<br><br>None of us can know those, but we all guess at them based on all sorts of evidence, theories and assorted perspectives.<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>And conversations with the folks involved.<br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>If you tend to think that NTIA wants to hold or even increase its influence, you assume one thing - that this had to be done against their will or advice and that it is a slap in the face to US goals.<br><br>If you assume that NTIA really wants to divest control in a sane and safe manner to multistakeholder modeled governance, while seeing the Internet remain open, you assume another.<br><br>I assume the latter.<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>I don't think it's just an assumption. But there are of course internal debates and countervailing pressures, so this has to be done very carefully and in a somewhat evolutionary manner, recognizing the substantial domestic political constraints. It's not like the administration could be relishing the prospect of a campaign on Fox News etc. with the Tea Party screaming "Obama hands over the Internet", much less all the real power centers that will be nervous about a headlong dive into the unknown. So there's a lot that would have to be done to keep this on course, and alas NTIA staff cannot even legally respond to their email at the moment, much less engage in global discussion.<br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>The NTIA is not the NSA, like most governments, outside of dictatorships, there is no agreement in the goals of the various departments. NSA's goals are not NTIA's goals.<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>Fair to say, and worth remembering when making sweeping statements about this or any other government (see Wolfgang's recent note on endemic intra-ministerial fragmentation).<br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>I tend to believe in NTIA's commitment and support for the wider multi stakeholder model of Internet governance. So yeah, them being somehow "in the mix" seems about right to me.<br><br>In other words, and to join in the prevailing marriage metaphor, I think the US and ICANN have an open marriage.<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>And one side seems increasingly inclined to understand the TOR a bit flexibly.<br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>And speaking of metaphors, and of shooting people in the foot, I think we should encourage the new directions and their initiators especially when they are multi stakeholder in intent, taking into account that they are new directions and still largely aspirational. I think this is the case for Civil Society both inside of Brazil and inside of ICANN, as well as the fragments of International Civil Society that gather in BestBits.<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>Yes.<br><br>Best,<br><br>Bill<br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br><br><br><br>On 14 Oct 2013, at 01:37, William Drake wrote:<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">Hi <br><br>On Oct 13, 2013, at 7:17 PM, João Carlos R. Caribé <<a href="mailto:joao.caribe@me.com" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline; ">joao.caribe@me.com</a>> wrote:<br><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; ">I really can't understand how NTIA could be behind Fadi's meeting in Brasilia.<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><br>Not behind, but in the mix. <br><br>Bill<o:p></o:p></div><div style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "><o:p> </o:p></div></div><p class="MsoNormal" style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; "></p></div></div></blockquote></div><br><div apple-content-edited="true">
<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Palatino; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Palatino; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Palatino; font-size: medium; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">**********************************************************<br>William J. Drake<br>International Fellow & Lecturer<br> Media Change & Innovation Division, IPMZ<br> University of Zurich, Switzerland<br>Chair, Noncommercial Users Constituency, <br> ICANN, <a href="http://www.ncuc.org">www.ncuc.org</a><br><a href="mailto:william.drake@uzh.ch">william.drake@uzh.ch</a> (w), <a href="mailto:wjdrake@gmail.com">wjdrake@gmail.com</a> (h),<br> <a href="http://www.williamdrake.org">www.williamdrake.org</a><br>***********************************************************</div></div></div>
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